 Welcome to Dare to Dream. I'm your host Debbie Dashinger. Pleasure to be here with you and This show this show has been nominated for two People's Choice podcast awards and a webby award Very grateful for all of you who listen and who write in and follow the show and recommend it to your friends Remember always pleased to subscribe. So this comes right into your inbox any time a new show comes out Which is basically once a week as you can go to youtube.com slash Debbie Dashinger And you know, we are also an Apple podcast and all the main radio. I heart Spotify BBS, etc sites So what I do out in the world is media visibility shaman. I help people write a page turner book I take authors books to a guaranteed international bestseller status and And I show spiritual entrepreneurs how to be interviewed on radio and podcast and get results I myself have been interviewed in over 15 that 1500 media outlets and I use everything that I teach my students are really successful and it gives me a lot of joy to see spiritual Entrepreneurs who are truly the lightworkers of today fly at a time when we really need their voice and their gifts So that said our show today is going to be as yummy as always Because I've got a guess that I have been very much looking forward to having on the show for a while Heather Ashimara and I Also want to preface by saying thank you. Thank you to dr. Dean here and access consciousness for sponsoring this show Dr. Dane here and access consciousness do beautiful energy work out into the world and anywhere in the world So if you'd like to go to a class in person When that opens back up again, you certainly can there are also programs online There are books and products online You can find them at access consciousness calm as well as dr. Dane Da I am here H ee are calm highly recommended So the question is how would you like to transform? confusion into clarity and pain into peace my guest Heather Ashimara is the founder of Tokai the Toltec Center of Creative Intent and the author of several books including the Warriors Goddess Training Series she brings an open-hearted inclusive worldview to her writings of teachings which are a rich blend of Toltec wisdom European shamanism Buddhism and Native American Ceremony she lives in Austin, Texas and travels Extensively if you like to learn more go to her website, which is Heather Ashimara am a dot com and learn more there and Heather Heather Ash I welcome you to the Dare to Dream show. Thanks so much Debbie. It's so good to be here with you And I know the book I just got through reading right here with some dog ears in it very great read and so We have a lot to cover. I'm looking forward to it and everything from you know Who you be and what you offer to what your latest book is? Giving people gifting people You know one of the things in reading your book, especially in the beginning You talk about the fact that as you grew up you were traveling as a young child and then into your adult years Continuing to travel How many countries have you been in? What does travel mean to you? Oh? my gosh a Lot I can don't even know what the number is. I think we counted one day. It was like 41 countries And yeah, I grew up traveling. I was born in Hong Kong We lived in Southeast Asia when I was young Until I actually went to college. So it came back to the States to go to college and then kept traveling So it's it's in my blood and I'm really grateful for the opportunities I've had to visit so many different places and people in ways of being around the world And how is this time for you when everything's a bit of a screeching hauls? How are you navigating this? You know, it's actually lovely. I don't mind at all I'm this interesting blend of I'm a super homebody when I'm home and so it's just allowed me to have a deep dive into Saddling and working on some writing projects and being up on my land I just bought 180 acres of land outside of Santa Fe. So just started learning how to make adobe bricks and Trim trees so it's been it's phenomenal. Yeah Very nice. What are you gonna do with the adobe bricks? We're working on a building So it'll be kitchen downstairs and then bedroom upstairs and there's an old foundation where the old adobe house was and So we get to use the mud from the old adobes and some of the old adobes that we we pulled down last year So it's just such a neat recycle project Yeah, yeah major DIY on the home front there I So I guess I was most You know, I get a lot of pitches for the show But the thing that caught my eye with you in particular is the fact that it said shaman and I myself late last year received a calling out of the blue from the divine but very clear Informing me that I was to open myself to being the shaman within me You know initially, I thought oh, I need to get further education. I need COVID put an end to all that but Then it became abundantly clear Maybe this is not about further education. Maybe this already is maybe this is many lifetimes of having been this and this is a Reactivation in a way and so right now, you know things shaman are very deep for me and really of interest What was your journey to acquiring that name? If you will, how did you come by a being called or being given the title shaman? you know, it's really been a journey around me reconnecting with the That foundation of being in relationship to the earth to my own intuition to guides and so there wasn't like I Went to school and then I got this title at all and I don't even consider myself a shaman in a way I consider myself a shamanic practitioner because for me a shaman is like someone that sits within a community and the community bestows that name and All of us have roots and shamanism all of us do because all pre-religion our Ancestors were in deep relationship to the earth and there were always medicine people There were always the wisdom keepers and so for me It's been a journey of following my heart learning different tools Exploring different practices, but really learning how to get out of Western linear thinking and to come back home to cyclical being in relationship to the seasons to the cycles really honoring birth and death really honoring all the aspects of life that I feel is what's landed me in this shamanic wisdom that I'm so Honored to be able to gift the tools and the practices that help us come back home to ourselves You make it really clear in the book that you studied with Don Miguel Ruiz for 15 years And I want to talk a little bit about that and your relationship with him and his work Just to preface it by saying Heather ash that I have had a couple of experiences with him not 15 years by any means And yes on the show but much deeper than that We had a friend in common Don Miguel and I and He's not since moved to Peru and started a whole retreat center there But in while he was here He used to do these workshops, you know really big gatherings and invite people to ballroom So during one of these I was invited to open the program speak on stage And we knew that I don't Miguel was going to be there and don Jose his son and so forth There was you know some pretty prolific people showing up to speak on stage So here's the setting Everybody's there early including all the people handling the back of the room and the people setting up in the crew And so there's a big hubbub But don Miguel is not yet arrived and it's almost like the king is coming the way everybody's acting was very interesting and A door opens and he's there with his people is I don't want to say on to rush because I don't want to give anyone the wrong Impression because that is not who he is to me at all But he did come in but clearly there was a huge response in that room of oh He's here and all these people rushed forward to him and I can never say why I do what I do, but I don't ever have those instincts In fact, it's probably contrary because I feel always so sensitive to that person What that must be like so I just remember going I didn't have a back table But it's something at a back table and at some point after he was surrounded by all these people He made him his way through the crowd and I looked up and there was nobody else in that whole ballroom. He was coming right to me With open arms like he had known me his whole life and He gave me a hug that was It is not like anything I have experienced for most people and I love hugs it was It was very clear to me that he walks with love that he is this embodiment There's something so special and palpable about him and now here he is, you know, maybe not the best speaker of English and you know, I'm not very great otherwise and So there was that incredible Moment that I just felt so honored and so and when that was complete and the program started they went to line us up in the front seats and They told don Miguel. Okay, you're gonna sit here and they were pointing out to everybody and don Miguel said no I'm sitting next to her and he pointed to me and he sat next to me and held my hand and I Just can't even what an impression. I've interviewed him on camera Etc and same he comes into my sphere and this thing happens that is so special and palpable like I've met many transformational people for me. He is the real deal So that is my don Miguel story Which will forevermore be so special in my heart that he gifted that to me that experience and I'm so 15 years you had with him. I'm so curious if you could tell us your story There's so many stories and I love that I mean Miguel is such a manifestation physical form of unconditional love and that was part of what drew me to him. I actually had a dream about him in 92 and The dream was this man is gonna come change your life And we're waking up going right Where am I gonna meet this human because I lived in a really small town in Northern, California at that time and Literally a week later someone came into my office and said, oh my god, you have to meet this man and my whole body went Oh, no, I am not ready for this And it took me a year because I could feel like everything was gonna change. I remember the first time I walked into the place where he was teaching Just feeling the people the community that was there and their dedication and their presence I was like, okay. I found my people And then I got to meet Miguel and it's been such a gift to be part of the family to Have been with Miguel for so long and to be able to pass the teachings on because you know Not only is Miguel this incredible embodiment of love He also his family and his tradition the Toltec tools are so impactful and So deeply healing And so needed in the world and so it's a real gift to get to walk That path and share Yeah, and that's a huge transition for you I just want to say kudos for you 15 years is a long tutelage for you then to somehow know it's my time It's my time to go now create what I came here to do using all of this soup and Bringing it with what I came here with how did you make that move that leap into your own work? He kicked us out And really there was there was a point where he was like, all right everyone I'm disbanding the group and it was an interesting situation because I Like I was always around. I mean I was like always always always I travel with Miguel I like anywhere I think he did I was there and it was an incredible experience because He basically disbanded the group that we had and then he said, okay I'm creating something new the next like two days later and my whole body was like nope. You're done You're done and I was like, but I I need to continue with my people. It's like nope. You're done and it was a huge gift that Miguel gave me and many of us of Allowing me to then go out and find my way and this is what he shared with us over and over again is don't believe me Find your way find your path. Go make it your own and so I was able then in 2000 I started a center in Berkeley, California and Start that was the first Toltec Center and started just teaching full-time and It was an initiation To learn then how to embody everything that I had learned All my own experiences and then to weave that to offer and share with my students. So it was incredible Continued Did you build it and they came? Like I did or was it a period of time before you really had a well nurtured tribe and audience because you've got a pretty considerable following Yeah, it's really happened in stages like when I first started teaching I did I was so shy when I was young I started teaching when I was 21 and I just feel like I got drafted. It was like you teach this and I'm like, but I'm But people just kept coming to me and saying we want this wisdom and I really wanted to share and so You know, I had I've been teaching weekly and then I had that had grown to teaching three classes a week Traveling to different places in California So when I opened the center, we had a really small group But it grew very quickly because people felt the tools and what I would do is I would travel with Miguel and Go someplace and and talk Usually he'd bring me up on stage at some point and then afterwards people would come to me and say alright Where do you teach? How can we do this? And I realize I can't duplicate myself. There's too many people that want these teachings so that's what led me to Start training facilitators and sending them out across the country So it's grown He's grown. Yeah And so the so for instance in this particular book that we're referring to in this interview You talk about the four chambers and the exercise the practicing to create a warrior heart Is is there much more To what you offer people is there a whole system or different programs? How does that work? Yeah, there's a lot of different systems. So the warrior heart practice is the newest one But I You know really what shifted my reach we could say or the amount of people that I was able to be in service to Was the warrior goddess training so where goddess training was the book that was written I guess it's been seven years now and it was It was so powerful because it was one of those things where it went into the world and just did this it just exploded because people knew Especially women You know it's designed for women and I had so many women come to me and go I don't even know what a warrior goddess is but I need that I wanted I wanted Yes, exactly. And so that teaching was really around learning to commit to yourself learning to align with life It was it's a blend of the toll tech in the european shamanic traditions that I'd learned And then warrior heart practice came out of working with students that were really struggling and what I saw was really stuck in their stories And didn't know how to step out of them and how easy it is for us to go into spin cycle And so that book is a very specific practice Of learning how to separate out our feelings from the story So that we're actually feeling our feelings without telling ourselves a story about the feelings And then to be able to explore. What's the story? What am I telling myself in my head? And it's Amazing what stories we make up without even realizing what we're doing to ourselves And then teaching people the difference between story and truth How do you know if something's a story versus if it's actually true? So that's the third chamber is the truth chamber and learning how to differentiate story from truth and then the fourth chamber is Intent what do you want in this particular situation? And then I teach people how to take their intent Merge it with their truth and then come back to the story to see the story from a completely different perspective And then finally close in the feeling chamber. So we're learning to become more somatically based rather than Constantly in our head. So super efficient practice for getting out of stuck places and untangling The many knots that so many of us create between our emotional body and our stories The places that we keep ourselves stuck When you talk about story versus truth, it sounds somewhat like the Byron Katie work Do you resonate with that? I do it's it's an inquiry practice So Byron Katie's the work is a really beautiful inquiry practice also to get to truth And all inquiry practices are to help us get out of our stories and into our truth And so this is one method that I found to be really effective because it brings us first to the feelings A lot of people if you were really careful with spiritual traditions because sometimes spiritual traditions cause us to bypass our emotional body Or bypass the the stories we don't like And to try and make it like I'm just going to make it better and my work is so much about let's go Through it to actually clean it up So that it doesn't re-arise And that takes time and learning to have this incredible courage to face and be in relationship to our emotional body So that it's not dry. So many of us our lives are driven by avoiding our emotions Yeah, when I hear people say Well, you're feeling what change your mind change your state Just, you know, it's that easy. Wow That's not my experience on this planet personally Emotions are energy and I have always found the most profound change relief Capacity all of that is when I release something And I figure on some level You know if Source energy is perfect And created us like this. We would not be created with feelings if we were not meant to feel them Exactly There's better these don't truth in that There is and it's so true It's energy and for many of us our energy stuck Because we're holding all of this energy from the past all these emotions. We haven't processed and I think about it like a backpack You can imagine having a backpack that's weighed down with all the Emotions or all the stories that you never processed or didn't know what to do with and our bodies are really wise We just store stuff But then we're carrying all this weight around being dragged into the past and so These practices are so important to help us empty the backpack Get current with our emotional body. So we're not reacting to the world from the past We're responding with a clear clean emotional body And when we have that the emotions move quickly As you mentioned story versus truth So what is the difference and how do you even break it down when you're working with somebody? Yeah, that's why I love having the four chambers and they're You know we call it the warrior heart practice because you need the courage of a warrior and the compassion of your heart And your heart has four chambers and each of them are incredibly important And so each chamber is incredibly important as well. So your story the truth isn't better than your story It's just what's going to get you free So the difference between the story chamber and the truth chamber is so often our stories are tied together with judgment and victimization and Oh, say that again. That felt really profound. It's tied in our stories are tied in with judgment And victimization. Okay. Yeah the starting point Yeah and fear and it's what I call often disaster mind Our minds are rarely in the present moment In response to what's actually happened our minds are worried about the past or beating ourselves about things that happened that we did wrong Or it's Feeling anxious about the future. Most of us have these incredible disaster minds very well developed disaster minds and we're also incredibly creative so we tie up all these stories And the truth when you cross that line what most of us do when we start to move towards the truth is we write a better story and call it the truth And what I'm really helping support people in doing is understanding that the truth is incredibly simple Like that's one hallmark of the truth one sentence with a period at the end So if you say like da da da da and then you have all of this Everything that's after the period is all story So you get it starts to be really simple. What's actually true? That's the story. This is what I know is true at this moment And the other thing is your body recognizes the truth So when you find that truth you're there's a resonance I've seen this over and over again that when you come to a truth your body will relax your body will open Even if you don't like the truth You know I was navigating a relationship and It's a long story, but just the short part of it was that I realized That he got to choose was a time where he was choosing another woman and I there's a lot of upset around it But I realized I was like he gets to choose who he falls in love with period Everything after that of like I must not be enough I'm getting too old today like all that was story, but the truth was he got to choose period I might not love that in the moment, but it's true and my body when I got that I was like, oh, okay And There's often two you get different truths So for me in that situation, I also hit the truth of I get to choose Period I get to choose what I do next And when we understand what the truth is is in any situation And another great example that I often use is if you have a friend that's constantly late Now the feeling might be frustration or the might feeling might be abandonment And then the story is they don't really love me. Everybody's late. Nobody listens to me. I'm not worthy. Nobody care Like that's all story. What's true My friend was late Period, that's what you know. That's the truth And it also might be true. I feel hurt period But then what makes the magic what makes us be able to transform our lives in really deep ways is that we then Get clear about what's my intent? What do I want in this situation? So and that really directs your choice and what you're going to do next. So let's say that in my life I was really navigating speaking my truth Versus in my life. I'm learning patience So if my intent is patience And I go back to the truth. My friend is late And then I go back to the story and what what we start to see with the story is the story is never about what you think it's about It might look like it's around the late friend but it's probably also about Not being seen as a kid or Self worth issue like all that gets tied in with the story and when we're willing to be brave and look We'll see the layers of the story And so if your word is patience and you know the truth my friend is late You might go back and go You know what it's I'm fine if they're late. I'm just going to bring a book with me or I'm going to meditate in that time Okay versus if your word is speaking my truth And setting boundaries and that's your intent right now in your life. You might have a different Action that you would take in unwinding the story How do you find out what your word is because that seems to be a Starting point that can inform everything about the choices you make based on what you discover Yeah, it's so true When you get when you go through the process of just being with whatever the feelings are Looking at what the story is and what the layers of the story And I think about like when you're in the story chamber, you're an archaeologist You want to dig to see what's beneath the current manifestation of the story And then once you then start to get clear on what your truth is What I've seen is when people go into the intent chamber they now have space and energy To be able to feel into their being To really connect with their big soul is how I would say it To to know ah, this is where I want to put my energy And that might be love that might be compassion that might be presence Can be anything play But that because we're now freed up from the story and we're in more of a place of witness We're then able to be more creative and in touch with our own inner guidance at that point So that we're responding rather than reacting Yeah, responding is a powerful place Reacting is definitely the victimization and a terrible feeling of being out of control So I want to take this through a few Uh examples because I think this is Really desirable for people right now and of course folks who are listening you can get her book The warrior heart practice a simple process to transform confusion into clarity and pain into peace by Heather Ashomara And she'll take us through a little hopefully will intrigue you more to get the book and practice more So for people right now who really want to be centered They really want to be strong in the face of challenge Which many people are experiencing at this point in our history How can they accomplish that using the work you're talking about either by an example or just you know Generally, how can they take themselves through this to find some kind of Stasis and deepening and anchor if you will Thank you. It's such a great question. Well, I would start with looking at what's the main suffering that's happening and You know in in regards to the pandemic people have anxiety. They have a sense of being out of control They have a sense of not knowing what's going to happen And so let's just pick That feeling sense of being out of control So to work the warrior heart practice what you would do is start by getting quiet sitting And just asking one question What am I feeling? To give yourself permission to feel the sense of being out of control Where is it in your body? And this is what we're doing is we're separating out the feeling from the story So the story is going to come in you're feeling out of control because uh, you know You just go thank you for sharing mind like wait, we'll get to you in a moment How am I feeling and what you might realize as you breathe into your body is wow? I have a lot of tension in my belly Breathe into the tension And then you might notice I feel That's a common thing so the feeling sense of out of control I feel anxiety Or I feel a sense of numbness. Wow. I actually I feel kind of numb in my hands Like I've been grasping at something and so you would just go through and really let yourself Somatically experience what's happening in your body not what you wish was happening But what's actually going on without trying to understand it fix it or intellectualize it And you don't have to spend a ton of time there. This isn't like let's spend two days It's like just sit for five minutes set a timer if you need to be with the discomfort So many of us spend our lives running From our emotions and doing what I think of as exiting our emotional body And so to turn to it and just give yourself permission to feel And look at what else is happening is such a huge gift And then once you let yourself feel Then you step into the story chamber and the question is what am I telling myself? And we'll probably then get to see what your disaster mind is up to You know and so many of us have financial concerns or this time or fear around our health or fear around the health of our beloveds or a family Or confusion around what we're supposed to be doing Confusion around All the the indifferent information and so to then separate from the story the feeling Excuse me to then just go. What am I telling myself right now? And to give yourself permission to look at where you're feeling victimized where you're judging yourself for others What's what your mind is telling you? It's huge and then what it's connected to You know with an archaeologist an archaeologist goes to a dig and just doesn't just pick up the first Shard of Pottery and go I found the information. We don't need to dig You know, you know, that's the beginning. So it's actually the anxiety or the story about covid I can guarantee there's a deeper story happening. It looks like it's the pandemic. It's not I mean, there's definitely pandemic stuff layer for sure. I'm not I don't want to negate that and there's older content And all of us are dealing with this there's a lot of older what I think of as oil that's rising right now to be processed So we have to be willing to look at what's the larger story? What's my mind doing? In a relationship some examples some covid oil rising examples What for some people that you found that you're working within groups or otherwise that's been Yeah So one is around the financial piece Of it's you know, the economy is going to tank completely We're going to go into recession I'm not going to be able to pay my rent now some of these might be based in the truth But some of them are not Okay, so the difference between what the story is. I mean the truth might be I don't have money to pay my rent period That would be truth If it's actually true and if you have that truth you would you then navigate that but what most of us do is oh my god, what if I can't Or what if my mom gets this and I can't be with and then we create the whole story while your mom is fine right so It's this isn't to say things don't happen They do but we create tremendous suffering for ourselves By making up worst-case scenarios and just and then running them over and over and over again Sometimes I even realize and we're doing that to ourselves And we drain all of our energy to be creative Because we're in fear And so it's you know another story that I can think of is around You know the health piece and And also Yeah, I've been watching this with a friend of mine of like i'm going to be stuck in my house forever I'm never going to get to travel again What's the truth? We don't know how long this is going to last We don't period You know, I'm really a big fan of like put the period in Take a breath And then you can be more creative of how to navigate what's true But when you're in the spin cycle of the story It's really hard to see it. It just feels like this incredible drain Well, this is very apropos. I'm going to read something to you Because we had a podcast listener right into you in advance And I will read you this is a story And a question that she's looking for help from her name is jam And she wrote in hi heather ash I saw the promo of your upcoming interview. So I bought your book the warrior heart to read in advance Your book asked me to bring up a trigger and take it through the four chambers I seem to be stuck in navigating success Through or successfully through can you help? I was with my boyfriend for a year and three months We had a breakup in january and it was rough on me He extricated his heart and being from my life in a slow grueling way I went through many feelings of grief and anger. He had met a woman through a party. I took him to and befriended her They did not date or sleep together But during the demise of our relationship and after the breakup They hung out a lot and went to many cool events just like he used to do with me He began hiking with her And her dogs like he used to do with me. I know we found her attractive although nothing happened romantically between them A few months later. He and I established a friendship And after some time We began a sexual romantic relationship once again, although now it's much better and very healed I am struggling because he is still friends with the woman whom I feel he chose to replace me He and I are pretty much living together at this point, although we have not said the words boyfriend girlfriend And he wants her to come over and visit as friends from time to time I myself have done deep inner work over my lifetime and I am aware and a healer myself But this one has me stuck Every time she texts him. I am triggered and upset I think if I did not come back in his life, he would be with her Or I have thoughts like I want her permanently out of his life and our life. I feel threatened I'm embarrassed to think this way His relationship with her caused me to feel that I was not special That he did not grieve our loss and I was replaceable To be fair, I had a tumultuous childhood without stability and an absent father Also in my previous relationship, which lasted 10 years My ex-boyfriend cheated on me several times Which has left me feeling and acting in ways in this now current relationship that I never have thought Or behaved like before I don't like these thoughts and behaviors and yet I want to control things Control things and drive her away, but there is nothing I can do but let things play out on some level Reading your book. I have felt successful at looking at my feelings the first chamber and extricating myself Talking myself down off each emotional or action driven ledge But the truth is I am triggered over and over and over again Can you please help with your wonderful tokai work? Thanks for all you do jan Wow, yeah powerful story so first just Holding you in my heart around the the challenge because really relationships are the most some of the most difficult journeys that we pass through Because our hearts involve because and then there's also all of our fear of abandonment and the childhood issues. So What I would say to you jan and to anybody who's listening that can resonate because I'm sure many of us can of a past experience or a present experience of feeling not special of fear of being abandoned of Not feeling we can trust Somebody else or that we can't trust ourselves of jealousy and of having these irrational all of us can relate At some level because we're humid and because also we have big stories in the culture In what we call the dream of the planet. There's huge stories around Relationships and especially competition between women. We've been trained as women to fight Against each other for what's perceived as scarce resources, which is love And so to understand you're navigating a lot of different levels So it's not going to work to just go through the practice once and think okay. I've gone through it We should be done now But to understand you are unraveling a very deep wound. That's not just yours This is a deep wound of the of the female of the women Around competition on jealousy around scarcity And if you can keep facing that and being vulnerable around that and no it may take you years to unpack this one And that's okay You know and for all of you that are listening that there's some Wounding that we we have That is going to take time to unpack because it's not just our wounding. It's wounding. We're also caring from our families From other experiences that we've had in the past from past life from our ancestors From the way we've been domesticated And this what you're sharing is partially around the domestication So where I would invite you to go next is to keep doing the work the beautiful work that you're doing of letting yourself Have the feelings and just sit with the jealousy without doing anything else And and to go what as what's made what is jealousy made up of because jealousy is not one feeling Jealousy is insecurity. Jealousy is comparison jealous. There's there's story wrapped in it So to keep looking at what else is part of the story He's going to abandon me story. He's going to pick her story And this isn't to make um again to minimize it. It's painful But what's true? You know, we can go through the story, but let's also step into what's true He's choosing you Period in this moment. He is choosing you And you are choosing him And who knows what's going to happen next none of us know what's going to happen next around anything Is the truth? Right the relationship's not going to last forever Even if you both even if you You know spend the next 40 years together one of you is going to die Period that's just the truth one of you is going to abandon the other in one Way or not and I abandon means the wrong word but leave And there's there's deep work to do here for all of us around facing endings around facing death of being in relationship to the mystery and and the truth is that You don't know what's going to happen And that you're choosing to be in this relationship and use the relationship to heal all the old stories that are getting That are been brought up and so instead of seeing her as your enemy Can you shift it even just a little bit to see her as a gift that's going to help you get more solid and more strong And more in your power Because you're now going to go heal the old story around your fear of Not being special around abandonment so that you learn to not abandon yourself Because that's what we really are afraid of Because we do it to ourselves all the time So I'm so glad you said that boy. That was Almost brought me to tears. Honestly, you're in all of what you shared and the profundity of the woman piece and the ancestor piece and the personal Childhood peace and so forth what I'm curious about is For somebody like jan and others who are listening the one Thing that brings this very like niggly is Suppose this woman does come over You know as a friend and she's in their home even though obviously it's the guy's home, but she's living there now too so How does she presence that because that is like bam, you know in her face to have to deal with that with all of what could come up the comparison and the insecurity and the I don't know he's lying and we don't want I don't want you here and all of that minutiae and Ness, it's a lot to go through. It's a lot to Like show up for herself and also be human. You know and yeah, yeah, it's it's so so true is The first thing I would do is is to have a really deep conversation with her partner And to say I feel really vulnerable and I feel scared And and this is what's going on for me and not you are making me feel scarier. She's making me feel vulnerable I'm feeling vulnerable I'm scared that you're going to pick her I'm afraid I'm going to be abandoned and I It's so I feel so much jealousy and I feel really embarrassed by it to just be able To again not put the emotion on the other person but just to say look, this is what's going on for me This is what's happening for me emotionally. This is what's happening for me mentally And you're not telling the other person so they fix it You're sharing it so you get to be more intimate with them And and then it would be I I'm trying to figure out how to hold space for this and just know it's hard for me And I'm not asking you to do anything different But I may need a little bit more time or I may need to not be here Or I may need to talk with her separately and just have a heart to heart with this woman With my vulnerabilities And that's scary That's scary to do that's part of the the healing process if you want to deepen a relationship and there's that insecurity The way to deepen the relationship is to bring it in between you What we often do in relationships is we dump it on the other person I should not be feeling this way. You should fix it. You should get her out of you know our life so that I feel safe But the truth is you're never going to feel safe because there's other women in the world right No, and I'm speaking You know and again not to make light of this. I have had some really difficult relationship situations That have been incredibly challenging and So I'm looking from the other side of that of like what I wish I could have done differently at the time that I wasn't able to And that what where I also like like grew and stood up and was able to show up and realize Oh, this is my own insecurity How do I love myself through this and so I think that's the biggest thing is the question becomes How do I love myself through this? How do I not beat myself up for being jealous? How do I honor where I'm at? How do I take it slow? How do I ask for My needs without demanding but just say, you know, this would help But then you have to figure out what do you need? You may not get it But to have that again vulnerable, this is self vulnerability of like I really need to feel safe all the time I need to be the only special one Then then it's like, okay. How do you make yourself the special one? How do you stop abandoning yourself and make yourself special like sweetie? I promise I won't abandon you Because so often again, we're We're creating worst-case scenarios that we're abandoning ourselves over And everything changes when we come back into relationship with ourselves and are like, hi beloved. I won't abandon you I won't abandon you I'm here And I this is scary, but we can do this together that will start to change everything but it takes time This is epic. I want to make sure to close the loop on this example In regards to the potential conversation she might have with the the other woman Because you teach goddess things How would that unfold? How would somebody go about doing that? What I would say is that it might be like a text, you know to to check of how to do the conversation But again, it would be in that place of vulnerability of I really want to honor your relationship with You know with fred. Let's make up his name with fred And I'm feeling insecurity. Would you be willing to just sit and talk with me? because what you need to what you want to get to is You know, there's different ways to go about it. It may be it's a deal breaker It may be this and you've got to really delve What's true for you it may be It's not okay for him to have women friends deal breaker and a relationship and that might be your truth And so figure that out now If it's not a deal breaker, but it's scary Then that's what you get to navigate and again It would be about being vulnerable with her and befriending her He obviously wants to be friends with her and if he's willing if he wants to bring over he wants her to be friends with his beloved too He wants to share What he's you know, the gifts that he's found with this friend So that's one way to look at it is how do you then go? Okay? This might be a win rather than a loss I might get another friend Now that's a different story. It's a different story. Exactly. Oh, that's good. Okay So warrior's heart this practice Can you do this with children? Can people teach their kids this practice? Yes, absolutely. It's so good to teach this with kids and you start off really where they are So if you have really young children it's about asking them how they're feeling having pictures that they can point out Giving them permission to have their feelings to express them Playing with them like play acting feelings is a great thing to do And then as they get older you can start asking them questions around. What's your mind telling you? What's the story like to describe what a story is? And to ask questions like well, did that really happen or did that happen inside your head? So they start to start to understand their stories I make up in my head and there's what happened and you can bring it to really specific situations like You know, you think Molly's mad at you But what actually happened and have them describe And then to start to brainstorm. Well, what else could have been going on for Molly at the time? And that gives the kids an understanding of the difference between making assumptions basically and putting stories onto situations And being able to ask good questions of themselves And of other people And then as they mature you can keep the dialogue going of the difference between a story and truth and how do you ascertain that And continue to help them build their emotional development One of my favorite ways to work with adults and kids Is to print out go just go on the internet and do a google search for List of emotions or faces of emotions or images of emotions. There's tons of different resources Of what kind of emotions we have and if you print that out and stick it on the fridge You can then talk to your kids about oh, I'm feeling disappointed. What does disappointed feel like? Or I'm feeling frustrated or you know, do you feel which which one do you feel? And we're we're so often we don't have good emotional literature literacy So we need to teach ourselves and teach our kids as well Yeah, I remember seeing those charts I agree Surprised surprised It's great. It's great. Yeah, so and what about you Heather ash? Here we are at the end What kind of daily ritual of practice do you engage in that keeps you really centered really grounded? Really widened back mmm Really my deep practice is around creating the sacred and everything So really being aware as I navigate my life and Seeing everything is sacred. So for me, I clean the toilet and speaking in front of you know, 400 people is the same Energy I'm bringing my full self to it. I'm seeing it as a sacred act and that There isn't a separation between this is a good thing And this is a bad thing It's all we're we're so blessed to be in this body and to have all the experiences that we get to have Even the hard ones. So that really is my practice is is coming to everything with love and compassion And this is dare to dream. So what do you next dare to dream? What are your future dreams and goals? I'm so excited about this land that I have the honor of stewarding and the the dream is around being able to bring People together to learn how to build and learn how to be in nature and learn how to be in community And so I just it's been a long time dream for me to have a center a retreat space a hermitage A place that people could be on the land and so that's my dream is that in a couple years That we'll have a really vibrant Place for people to rest into and come home to themselves What an amazing auspicious time to be building something like that like how could you a plan that right? Yes Yeah, it is it's remarkable. It really is all the timing of everything is Quite unbelievable right now. That's so beautiful. What would you like the listeners to know here at the end? What can you impart? Be gentle with yourself There are so many stories that we are unweaving right now around Our ancestors around our culture around our countries Around what we call the dream of the planet and around ourselves as individuals. So if we bring both fierce compassion a love for the truth and gentleness to ourselves Now we need to give ourselves time to integrate especially at these times. There's so much happening More rest more integration go slower And use these times when there's so much Up there's so much material that's up right now to really Befriend your mind That would be the advice very very good very very good That could be on replay. I think that would be a wonderful mantra for people To remember right now to unravel the stories Look at the piece of the story that belongs to them that is coming up to be healed That was absolutely my experience in the beginning of this like Wow I was getting spiritual downloads and at the same time Like grieving and here I am an extrovert and being alone and I mean it was a lot But I mean I would take to the streets and my walks with my my mask and my dog and like tears and Running down my face and just like I had to do what I had to do making videos with friends and Just the enormity coming up out of me that felt ancient But it was there and there was no denying Facing things on a collective level and absolutely on an individual level. So Very profound and I love this suggestion of being kind to yourself going slower more rest more baths more You know, whatever's soft to you to show up for I have a few people in my life. I'm so shocked. They're like, I'm so busy You know, I can't stop like they took this to be this time Where they're making this major deep dive into work, which on some level is awesome Obviously, they're going to come out on the other side and have this, you know, holy I don't know program services, but I don't know what's on the other side for that to be received And and I somehow always have the feeling something's being missed if you're still in that Energy that hamster on a wheel that there's no space and capacity. You're missing Because this is a big picture going on right now And really missing that vital piece of healing for all of us Yeah, I really agree to take the opportunity to slow down right now is is a big gift To ourselves and I think to everyone else so we can access our creativity and our vision and possibilities Deep in relationships with ourselves and others. And so your website is heather ash amara a m a r a dot com And you can check out more about the amazing Heather ash as well as a reminder on her book Which is There we go the warrior heart practice beautiful book And thank you so much for coming on the show today. It's been an honor and a pleasure Thanks so much debbie for having me. It's been such a joy and blessings to everyone that got to be part of this. Thank you Yeah, I hope everybody received a lot. You can subscribe to the dare to dream podcast This is your weekly number one transformation conversation You can go to youtube.com slash debbie dashinger as well as apple podcast Please leave a five star review and subscribe. We love you for it next week. James redfield is coming back James asked to do a four-part series on the show so he can really talk about what's going on And offer some guidance to everybody here for some wisdom during these very auspicious times Thanks everybody for joining us today. And remember don't just dare to dream Dare to make all your dreams into your reality. This truly is your time