 Yes, a very, very good Monday morning to you. My name is Hilda Wazidi and as you know, you're watching Why in the Morning on your Y254 channel. It is about time we delve into youth and politics to do this every Monday. And today we have a very special topic because in light of all the drama we've seen on social media when it comes to some of our leaders, we want to talk about reputation management. Here in Kenya, it appears the badder you are, the more popular you are. So before we delve into that conversation, I'd like my guests with me in studio to introduce themselves and then we can start this off. And if you do want to participate in the conversation, it's at Y254 channel on Twitter. Hashtag Why in the Morning, hashtag youth and politics if you'd like to be more specific. On Instagram at Y254 underscore channel, on Facebook Y254. So, 20. Kazi. Good morning everybody. My name is Matoke Patrikosebe, Elias Mbazada, youth governor in Mira County. Who is the CEO, compassionate part of Manti Kenya? He is humble to be around. Good morning. My name is Udi Mokwa, an undergraduate student and also an accountant. I'm glad to be in the show to talk about the youth and politics and then we talk about the reputation of our leaders. All right. Okay. Good morning. My name is Ruvinsen Tonyango, a student, also a member of Youth Appeal, I'm a CIO County Coordinator. Thanks to be here. CIO County Coordinator. Okay. Good morning guys. My name is Esther Moudoni-Irongo from Murangaa County. I'm the Vice Chair of Youth Governance in Kenya, Murangaa County, a student at Afro-Nazarene University and also doing work in Milaleh Femme. Milaleh Femme, I'm glad to see the media here. Good morning. I'm Kavi Nodiamboswago, I'm a National Coordinator in National Youth and Governance. And I also represent the Youth Republic that is in Kibra. And it's a combination of Kibra and Langata. So I'm a National Coordinator and in general I've been in politics and I've been passed in Sonu and politics is my thing and I would like to discuss more about the youth in Governance especially. Thank you. Thank you. Good morning Kenyans. I'm Kerri Mwegei, I'm a student at Kenyatta University and I come from Nakuru County. Good morning Kenya. My name is Sally Mimoni, I'm the Director Youth in Governance Initiative, Toukana Chapter. I'm a student leader and also I represent the Toukana University Student Association in the northern part of Kenya. Thank you. Good morning viewers. My name is Bonfesh Alexander Loom. I'm a former JQAT student leader as the chairman, current campus. I'm an undergraduate as well. I happen to be a former MC Aspera and I'm a Mideward and I'm glad to be here to share the issues to do with youth and Governance. Thank you. All right, Santeni Sana. So we want to ask the question, as a leader should your reputation be your top priority especially in our country? We've seen a lot of drama. We've seen people crying, people being slapped. We'd like to understand, should it be a top priority? I can comfortably say it must be because as a leader you must give the positive image. You should show people who are you, what are you able to do before anything else. So as much as my reputation is concerned, it must be the top priority as a politician. Okay. Thank you. When you talk about reputation, reputation forms part of our social virtues that you're supposed to stick with. So when you're a leader, you have to lead by example. You have to ensure that your reputation is not questionable because when you're a leader, most of these people, most of the young people, the society, they usually look up to you. They imitate what you do. They really want to be what you are. Most of them, there are so many people who, the leaders that we have, particularly the politicians, are their role models. So your reputation should be a very good one and it should not be of a questionable character. Questionable character. If politics in Canada does that apply? Thank you. I mean just to add on that reputation, we need to go back to the constitution about chapter six of the constitution. It's very clear about leadership and integrity and integrity is, you cannot run away from that. You must behave in a manner that does not demean the office, the public office you are holding. So in this case, if your reputation is quite questionable, then you're creating a very bad scenario, a very bad precedent to the coming generation. So you have to contain all the constitution about the national values and principles of governance. They are very clear that you must be in a position that you're able to display integrity of the highest order and to be able to provide dignity to the office you are holding. So if a public officer gets into that office and then tries to behave in a manner that it's quite demeaning, then it destroys the image of the entire country. And even those in the leadership position of that rank, they tend to be meaningless. In that case, we are given the leaders who are getting into these public offices. They say mostly the politicians. We've gone ahead trying to display in public the manner that is not displaying the role they were given. A member of parliament is given very key roles to undertake, clearly stated in the constitution about representation, legislation and oversight. Clearly, you have to behave in a manner that you are a legislator. You don't have to get into the office and then try to bring out your manners from the outside into the public office. That one is not qualified. Well, but in politics, vendettas are very common. I know the Kenyan society we're living in is so unique that our leaders of today, the question is, are we able to safeguard our character? There is a difference between character and reputation. When you are that kind of a leader who safeguards your reputation and then your character is questionable, then you are wrong. That is why the society is looking up to those guys or people, leaders who are now making a lot of noise in the parliament in the name of building their reputation when they are destroying their character. We need to safeguard their values. That is what you are looking to. As young people, we look at that person. Beside you protecting your reputation, are you a man of character? Do you have that integrity? Do you have that honesty in you that you can display for that young person who is there in the society to emulate you? That is what we need to look at. Thank you. All right. In Kenya, I might say that it's true, it's a unique society, but reputation being the key to any leader as the main character, I would say, I'm sorry to say that Kenyans forget so easily that our leaders, they get to the headlines because of the bad stories that they have, and that is what they are popular about. We don't look at what good are they doing, what did we elect them to do, as in those are the few things that we should check on. But in Kenya, I would say we are heading the wrong direction in terms of politics. Thank you. I'm glad that you talked about that because we also want to talk about a risk exposure with the rise of technology, the use of technology, WhatsApp, social media. It becomes very easy for you to be exposed, as you have seen women's rap, audios, ballet, people, and what do you do when something like that happens? I'd like to understand, is this thing causing much more risk to our reputations and for those who want to pursue leadership? Are you discouraged? Are you scared? Yeah. Okay. To me, I define or I look at reputation as a cloth that you're putting it on. Once you remove it, you've dented your image, so it governs you, it's what you are. And social media escalates it, actually, because nowadays the world has been turned into a village. Remember once you've done something that is awful in the public eye, it can be viewed even with someone outside the country, beyond the borders. So even though our politicians, they prosper behind these, these what escalates, these what makes them prosper, because we've always been known, our leaders have always been known by these bad remarks and bad figures. So for example, you've seen the case of Sonko and... Pasaris. Pasaris. It's not encouraging, but you'll find it, that they thrive behind these, these the source of their pride now. They find pride when doing these, because once you are known, remember, they want something to trend. You see views and whatever, it also counts. But this spelling erode in our society, actually, when you look at it in ethical perspective, it's actually showing erode that we are having. And our leadership is actually taking another different town, where you thrive on wicked things or immoral, actually. The ground in which you strike immorality and immoral has been eliminated. So it's a playing field, and that's what now what we see, people are prospering behind that. Okay. You can't deny. Thank you. What say you? One, social media, everybody wants to have more viewers, everybody wants to have more followers. And for you to attain that, there are things that you will do to place your followers. What do they like, what do they want? And as a politician, most of them, what they do is not the right things. Like now, I don't mention names, but I want to be realistic. You are of somebody D-minus, you are of somebody NOS scandals, you are of somebody Mouizi. At the end of it, everybody is like, oh, they are NOS, whatever, he's a D-minus, but at the end of it, he's elevated somewhere. So these followers, they are like, when you do something bad or your reputation is bad, that is when they impress you, are you seeing? And most politicians, others, they even stage mark, are you seeing? They stage manage their standards. They stage manage their other things. Most of them, they stage manage, like somebody somewhere I know, a student leader former, but now he's somewhere. Most of these things, he used to stage manage for him to become popular. Now he's somewhere else. So our reputation, as much as it's concerned with social media, whatever that we do, we stage mark some things negatively so that we can have, our names can. Because how many people do we have outside here who do good things? But have you ever seen them on social media, being praised? Whenever you try to give out of, to praise yourself, everybody's against you. Who told you, God says, do it in silence. But when bad things happen, that is when they are there. My talk, hey, are you seeing? Yeah, that is the problem we have. I guess it's for me. Currently, we don't look at the reputation. It's about the money. We see the money, the amount of money you have, like some of the leaders use money, they pay the normal citizens so that they can work someone. We saw the case of some kind of passers-by. You see, they said of Sonko, there's so many people that they started shouting at passers-by. So that was, some people don't have money to praise. That's the microphone. So you see people's money for power or for not, even as the common citizens, we don't look at the reputation, the money, like someone give a hundred, fifty bob, two hundred. Then they forget about the bad thing that he or she has done. If I pick from there some, so we are talking about leaders and particularly politicians. So most of these politicians, to them in their minds, they usually have it that there is no negative publicity and there is no positive publicity. To them, publicity is just publicity. So particularly, if I quote one Nicola Machiavelli, the writer of The Prince, he says that politics know no morals. So there are no morals in politics. They are not the same. So when you see a leader thriving on something that you perceive as negative, there are some people who perceive that as victory. So for example, let me give an example of the Nairobi case that you mentioned. So here we have the governor. The governor talks about the women representative in a certain way. So the women representative in return, she responds also in the same way. She doesn't try to show that she's a little bit different. So they just do the same one and the same thing. So because because we have people who are exactly a conquer with her, that there are some people who are paid to move because not normal Kenyan who can wake up from the house and go and stand behind a leader who is giving a press conference to condemn another leader or to insult another leader. So these people mostly you'll find that they are given something so that they can be behind and even defend things that themselves they don't agree with outside the media. So what does that say about the electorate? As is the electorate. And what does that say when it comes to the future? You said there's no morals in politics from what I'm hearing. But here we have our national values. So is all that just paperwork? OK, maybe at my point, I think issue pertaining moral values. I think on my side, there is moral values. But with the electorate where the people what times give these people a chance to diminish everything and the moral values. And like, for instance, as we see, we are here, we are youths. And a number of youths are the people who are being used to also to to kill the moral values whereby a number of others are not having any jobs. We have no money. And a politician, once he has been elected to for any public office, now he uses the money to the money has gotten from the from the government to give it to the youths who have no job. Instead of giving, they use something to empower themselves. So the empowerment that they give back to the youth is the money that they have maybe we have stolen from the government or from elsewhere to use it in a wrong way to maybe to close the eyes to give us to give us that clogging our eyes so that we can be following them now and then, because once I have money and I know there are some people in particular, maybe in my country representative somewhere. And I know my people have no money. I use them, I bring them in board. I give them that something small to keep it all go. Two hundred shillings so that I may be if I if I say something, maybe if I quote a story of one of the pastor whom is well known, he says something that if I as I call, you're supposed to be there. Yeah, so this somebody also you see he has money, but he's now using the powers that has been given in a wrong manner. So we as electorate, it is up to us and as young people, we need to stand firm with the moral values that we have that we have been ever been taught since we were born. Because I think if we stand in unity, we can we can always conquer these people and let's stand that as you let's always say that there is more of values. Let's tell these people if they can't give that moral value, then we can take that moral value that they want to to to tarnish from them. So that's my take. OK. Moral values cannot be equated to anything. Even if we philosophers come and bring whatever sort of narration. I call it the moral value that we can never be changed in a in a country where we have a constitutional document that we all have to follow. You just have to do that. And that one is even in the Bible that you go to respect the authority and even there we have the constitution which we have to follow. What am I saying this that someone said if you want to say that you've succeeded in let's say in governance, then let your success succeed in that case that our society has been eroded in such a way that even the electorate themselves they are put in a position they are not in a they are not in a way to defend themselves. They are being impoverished. So when a politician comes with with with the with the money that you cannot he cannot even himself account for. The electorate will come will come running actually and then without questioning and we've seen these cases and most of the people that are used in this case are youth simply because they have not put structures in place to be able to ensure that these youth are empowered so they will ensure they are they are driving on structures that will continue impoverishing youth in this country. So you'll find that these youth are following and electing this kind of mediocre kind of politician or leaders. So we've impressed that mediocrity in leadership structures and we going forward I'm telling you the as routine so set as it is right now we are going to have even very serious politicians getting into the international assemblies, counter assemblies. And right now that's why when I started with the Constitution competence is quite key. We're here and the youth around the very much computer. They're supposed to be in these elected offices, but it's quite unfortunate you cannot be elected in that office simply because you don't have this this money. You don't you don't have that character that will will make you make you to have several followers. So they are trying to tell you that you have to try to distort your morals to be in the position that this electorate the impoverished electorate electorate electorates to follow you. What I'm saying is this it's a high time the youth of this country just come to realize that our time has come. They wake up to the realization that we have to embrace competency, people who have ideas and policies in this country. We're not going to follow up politicians who are just preaching hatred and trying to disguise that they are their leaders. I am trying to condemn that. And I'm I'm straight on this. OK, OK, please let us not consume too much time. Maybe just to finalize on the issue for the character and the technology. As somebody text me in the middle in last week, when the incident of that, our dear women represent. Yes, yes, yes, brother, what are you trying to talk? Rashid Kasim was performing the constitutional mandate that we, the people of India, is giving him. You know, that is that is a fan, a supporter of Rashid Kasim. You know, and in the case we intend to support our leaders basing on our ethnicity, basing on which tribe are you coming from, which clan are you coming from on our case in the side of northern eastern and this other region. And that is what is killing us because a system that has been billed by the government and the current government right now is trying to entrench and trying to reduce the value of that young person through the value of the people who are in that on the ground. And that is why you're seeing the issue of you see in our county like Turkana, a lot of money is being brought there. But now the value of that money is not being used because people there are a bill system that is trying to say we will only be the only people to control the economy of this of this county. So nobody really cares about the opinion or about the reputation. Anyway, it's all about the money, the clan and that's it. The only thing is power and money. So what solutions can we have when it comes? OK, for example, let me ask you because you're a lady. If you were to be in Esther Pasari says shoes and the way she responded to to the to the drama that the whole expose that happens find the damage is there. You cannot refuse. It is everywhere. It is circulating. You cannot say it is not you. What do you do when the damage has already happened? One, I would go to the court, at least for for my rights. Then from there, definitely the money will work. But at least I have at least I have tried somewhere. Then I said to some civic education to the people outside there that the girl child has to be respected. But the power money, you have to be respected. OK, we have to be respected. That's being slapped in Wajir. OK, can we please have some of the solutions? I've never had from you today. Please hear what you have to say. Yeah, the cave behind it. OK, personally, I would say to the solution of that, personally here in Kenya, going to court, I wouldn't say it is. It is the best thing to do because even the judiciary itself, it's a routine. So going to court is not really a solution. It's not the solution. The solution lies in the hands of the people because power is in the hands of the people. So like, for example, the lady who went to Horupak to campaign for she was against the corruption story and everything, no one supported her. It is until we, the youth, we go to this to those offices, we campaign against those corrupt leaders and we say they have to get out of those offices is the day we are going to have change in this country. But until then, we are still going to suffer. Well, the change begins with us because we are the source. We are the people who elected these leaders. And adding to that, I would say that youths, especially this time when we are the new currencies coming into the system, we should be very careful because these same leaders who are corrupt are going to use us to get them to wash those dirty cash so that they can still continue being in power. OK, there you can hear. Thank you. OK, the issue about, as a reputation, as I was doing my back international relations, they say that money is power and power is money. So if you ask money, you can fix anything. Yes, in national theorists, it's called the national theory and the national theorists, they say money is power and power is money. And that's why you'll see more successful people are into politics. You've seen the likes of Donald Trump. It's out of what he has that he has gotten the voice. But you can find someone on the ground just like my young fellow here. He is well competent, actually. He has all that it takes to be a leader, but due to the fact that his pocket is not deep enough, he cannot attend the seat. He cannot get what he wants. You've seen my fellow, Vaid, he said he was a contestant. Yes, I see. Do you know the main reason as to why he never succeeded? It's because his pocket was not deep enough, actually, to escalate him to such a position. So we've embraced the kind of wrong politics, per se. And it's becoming a tragedy in the country where because we have young, young people who are coming up are following these. And the likes of social media, as you've said, is the main cause to all these things because everything is in the public. It's in the public domain. And we can't deny that. So thank you. All right, thank you so much. I'd really like to hear your solutions for a damaged reputation. You have not responded to that. What solutions do you have? I can hear money has already come through. If you have money, you can fix that. What else can you do? OK, let me start by saying that a problem doesn't lie in the money. Doesn't lie in the money. A problem lies with a society that has sanitized things that the politicians are doing, not all of them. But the sanitization that we've given what politicians do when a politician gives out money, it doesn't do development projects, but gets another way to sweep us. So we we basically don't see the reason why we should oppose him because at the end of the day, he's going to come, give us money. And then we sing his name out and then we forget. So sanitization is the main problem. So after sanitization, now the society has turned around. Now we we are starting to look as if you're trying to rewrite the book of lamentations because we are lamenting. We are not giving solutions because when you look at what people talk and what people write, they just complain throughout and throughout. So basically, if we are supposed to give a solution, a solution is very simple. Let us as a country implement chapter six of the Constitution, where integrity lies. All right. I want to echo my brother directly. As he said that we must echo integrity. Another solution that I can give us a person, one as the youths, we must rise and fight for our own space as the president states, fight for it. But the problem we have as youths is that we are not united. United. That is the basic problem that we have. And whenever that we want to come together or we want to forums that can bring us together, we start fighting ourselves. That's why last time I said that we are the enemies of ourselves. That's why we cannot drive as youths to rise under those seats or to have morals that can take you into those positions. So one as the youths, we must rise, rising together and fighting those faces that are affecting or that are giving us bad reputations and the politicians also. And then let us not be given something so that we when we are given, you are like today we are condemning tomorrow we are praising because if today we are saying he is certain tomorrow we are saying is God. Who are you? That's true. People need to develop a standard of who you are, what we're fighting for and maintain the status quo and fight for it until the end. Well, there's a theory that I came across that a leader who is a perfectionist or tries to be perfect to make sure that their reputation is clean and all that is not trustworthy and usually comes off as unapproachable. Do you agree with that? The Bible is clear, madam. No man is perfect. No man is perfect. As much as we want as a leader, as much as you want to keep the reputation, as much as you want to be to pay a role model to others, there are things that they must come as normal because all of us we have fallen short of there. The glaring. Yes, how do you know that? Yeah, maybe just to echo what you have said. In leadership, there is no perfection. It's only your actions that will maybe to educate the society that there is some aspect of perfection in you. And that is why we cannot we are not progressing as a society that we're living now. And to the solutions, the issue of this reputation and this other money and whatever, back in Turkana, we are trying to through youth and governance initiative. We are actually mobilizing all the young people to create that society that we need to validate our ideas. We need to come up with the project or the ideas or the initiatives that can elevate our status as young people. Because if you talk of insecurity in Turkana county or maybe other these other northern is that we have the problem of security. But now young people have been have been silent about it. We talk about education. Our people are still there. The education system in northeastern is still pathetic. We still have basic things that we need to offer. But now the question is, are we ready as young people to come up with these initiatives? Because if we are looking for a national government to offer and with the likes of the drama that is going now in the national government, in the county government, then we are we are we are expecting that in the next generation. We don't expect that, but we are trying to strive and come up with solutions and ideas. And that is why we are trying to throw you in governance initiative. I'm glad you're that passionate about Turkana in your county. You can take us back there. But to him, I want I want to thank you one for this topic has just come when I've developed something in Yemera rise for the youth of Yemera. One, we are not empowered, but we are fighting. We don't have, but we are fighting. We are fighting corruption. You yourself, you don't have anything. What are you fighting? Rise for the youth of Yemera. I've come up with that forum so that we can be united as youths first. Use the opportunities we have like the youth fund. The other week, I was at home fighting for the youth to register groups so that they can empower themselves first. When we fight, we fight as a force, not just talking in social media, but in the ground, there's nothing we are doing. So as youths, I'm encouraging you wherever you are. And those who are here rise wherever you are. Embour yourselves first and then condemn. OK, Meshimiwa, empower yourself and condemn. OK, but I still want to hear because now we have digressed. So do you believe that a leader who is perfect or appears to be perfect or tries to be perfect or you don't see any mistakes, you know, on what have you is a bit untrustworthy and unapproachable. I'd like to hear. Yeah, I guess you can approach such a person because you know, someone is giving you money like these corrupt governors. You can easily approach them, but the governor's like, for example, the one that is working and you can't share so many. We can't see scandals from also news. You can't see him on news. And like this governor like Nairobi governor, Lidl Abra, Kambu governor, some people love them because they give you money in return. So you can have the easy approach because we have some of the numbers. But some of us, like those governors, you can treat them easily because you feel no nonsense. Yeah, they fear them. They say, hey, you know, I don't think you can approach them that easily. OK, so you kind of do agree with the theory. All right. What can we hear from our MCA? At least he looks like he really wants to say something at least. OK, such such leaders there, they create a barrier with the electorate because you also create a personality that is quite interactive. You're quite a you're able to talk to the people. You're able to interact with the people so freely. For example, my governor, Oparanya. A weekly. Yes, weekly for Paranya, they see the chairman of Council for Governors. He has done well so far. And I think that's why he has earned that position of the chairman. And by the interaction and also interaction with the people. I think that's what gave him the second the second term as he goes out. I'm informed that he also wanted to be the president of this republic. I wish him well. OK, please, let us not campaign. To leave us the answer to that. That's OK. That one aside, the truth is that he's a man of the people and I've seen such like people, such like governors, they're there. Mm hmm. You only need to get into the office and get what you want. There's no need for you to fear, especially when you know what you want. So as a person who voted for such a leader, like, let's say, one, it could be an introvert, yes. But again, but again, you know what you want from that, from that, from his leadership. And if there is something that you really need to worry in his country, you just need to get to get there. So I'm encouraging you, any other person. I'd like to have a theory of motives. That's when you'll feel you'll feel some fear. Exactly. OK, OK. Let me hear. Oh, great. Yeah, yeah. So maybe if also I give an example with my governor back in Syria, I think most of the time he has not been in the media. And like also is that kind of person whom you know, you know, easy that you just go get money from him. So you have to have a structure, a criteria. You have to have something, a policy, which if you address to him, he can also address to you in a positive way, not in a negative way. So so we have to look at this kind of governors and kind of people who are in power, who can empower us in a positive way. Also, I have at my constituency level, my MP, Mr. Elisha, is trying to bring more of the development. He found some infrastructure going on is still on with them. As much he has not been, he has never been in that line of politics for long. But you see somebody who is a full of of enthusiastic and is trying his level best at least to bring change in the in the constituency level. So we need also as like young people, we need to stand with these people, we need to identify. And follow the example. Yeah, example. We identify these governors, these politicians, these leaders who are really striving to help, help in development, help empower young people so that maybe, as you say, I know you said there's no politics here or campaigning, but it is good. It is good we echo these people because when some good does something right, it is good to echo them and give them a hand too. Yeah, thank you. I like that, I like that, give them a hand, I appreciate that. OK, so it's about time we conclude this segment. Fortunately, yes, yes, yes, so I just have maybe, maybe a parting shot from you. OK, let me, let me, let me, let me start by saying that we've had a good discussion that is good. But as I've said, the problem with us lies in sanitizing what we are lamenting about. So if we stop sanitizing, we'll have the solutions. And the solution lies with the people and lies in the constitution. Thank you. All right, the solution, the constitution and the people. Turkana, I'm sorry. Much OK. I need to talk about that. Maybe you can find us. Fear not, stand out, fight for your own space as a youth. It's a good repetition. First, before you fight others. Have that integrity that you are telling others to have. Tell them what is supposed to be done. Criticize positively. Then you are a leader to PM rest. I don't say let's, let's not be cheap. Let's focus with what you are getting to get. Let's not be cheap. I like that. I really like that one. As my final conclusion is that let's avoid party politics. It's also bringing is the main route to all these bad reputation. Because once you are affiliated to a certain party, you have a sure deal. However much your reputation is dented. So these really disable to us and the kind of leadership we have. Great. As a final, as I would say, together we stand a party fall. So it's time with the youth we stand and we fight for our rights. My query goes and my message actually goes to all the young people that we need to safeguard the character and not the reputation. You safeguard your character and not the reputation. And my message to the young people across the country of North Eastern or maybe Turkana is that we need to validate our ideas, come up with projects, initiative that can create development in our social, economical aspect of the Turkana people and maybe the Northern Eastern part of Turkana and those are the areas. Thank you. Thank you very much for representing them today. MCA please, we have to give me a break now. So we have to stop and we need to pave the way for Man Talk. So my name is Hilda Wadidi. You've been watching Youth and Politics. Please do not go anywhere. We do this every Monday. Thank you guys so much for coming. I know some of you come from very far. I'm Santia Nisana. Blessings upon you. And all right, have a good day. Thank you. Thank you.