 Good morning Mr. Pandey. Welcome to an exchange for media conversation on the business of media, business of news, life post COVID and how the economy will come back and how the media industry will be a catalyst, how news channels will be a catalyst in helping the country deal with COVID. Let me introduce Mr. Avinash Pandey to our viewers and our leaders. Mr. Avinash Pandey is the CEO of the ABB News Network and has been an accomplished media professional for 25 years. He's been with ABB news from the day of inception. He's like a founding member of the ABB News Network team. In his 26 years he's worked with three news organizations. He started his career in 1995 with Indian Express, went on to Ashtak when Ashtak was launched, worked for less than 5 years for Ashtak and this is his 16th year at ABB News. So Mr. Pandey is a news television veteran. The news television industry is 20 years old in this country and Mr. Pandey has worked last 20 years in the news, TV, domain, broadcasting, so he understands news television and news broadcasting like nobody does. Welcome Mr. Pandey to this exchange for media. Mr. Pandey in the last 40 days the viewership of news channel has gone up by 200, 300 percent, more than 200 percent across. I'm not just talking of your channel but broadly your channel has also done very well and continued to maintain its leadership. But tell us why is this surge in news? Why are people, everyone criticizes news for being negative, news is so negative, why are people watching it? You know I always tell this to my team internally that more and more news consumption happens when you raise a family, when you get married start raising the family because that's the time that you start getting worried about simple things of life. Your job, your investments, your social security, your children's education and etc. COVID is such a time that everybody is concerned as to what's going on right now in the environment. And obviously the authentic source of the news is not the numerous forward and the PhDs that comes on the WhatsApp. It's about the authentic source which are the news television because you see it it is getting reported by the award-winning reporters. You have graphics which explains you as to what's going on and it's kind of reassurance that helps you believe in a better future that even while what is going on is what is going on but there is a future which can be brighter than what we are today. And that obvious curiosity leads to people to to watch news television and that's what we have seen. Our network has grown about 300% from pre-COVID to post-COVID and we are seeing a double trend continuing more than 200% trend continuing even now while things are a little bit settling down. So yeah it's a it's a reason of uncertainty that led to such high viewership. Mr. Pandey you said that it's not the credible source of information. It's to bona fide journalists who are watching what's happened on the screen. You are you're in the line of fire. You are in somewhere first responders, the journalists that go out and actually do real stories about real issues and I believe that the credibility of established media brands like ABP and ABT News would definitely be a source. Tell me Mr. Pandey while the viewership has grown the advertising logically should have grown. If the viewership has grown more and more advertisers should have locked to news channels to everything news that the rates should have gone up I believe double but tell me what's happened on the business side just to tell our viewers and industry professionals on how advertising has done in these holidays and how do you see news to be advertising in the next 60 to 90 days. Okay so first thing is that that the news is such a business that when the viewership is high either there are no ads or not many advertisers. For example I'll start with because you mentioned about my career since the time we started television when when 9-11 happened for 72 hours there was hardly any ad on television when 26-11 happened for four or five days there was hardly any ad on television but the viewership was at its highest. During the covid time it is it would be very difficult to assume that when everything all economic activities are stopped the consumption will happen because finally the advertising is for the consumption and hence despite such high viewership there are not many advertisers who choose right not to advertise. Having said that there are advertisers who think that advertising is not only for today but to build a viewership to build a build an audience which is which is going to consume your product much later than than what is happening right now and hence people invest in brands people invest in communication during the difficult time and those who do it I can tell you they come out stronger when when they see the other end you know and and that's why a lot of advertisers are still advertising despite the fact that their their establishments factories and shops are not open but yes it has gone down drastically and because there are very few advertisers and there are many news channels they are all negotiating a bargain in the marketplace and hence the rates has not gone up the way we expected it to be. For the news channel the cost of us doing the business has also gone up please remember none of our cost has gone down whether it is sending the reporters in the field cost of up linking down linking broadcast your obis your tv use your studio in fact our risk our cost has gone up because we have to make sure that our employees are much safer and because they are putting their life online when they are going out and reporting and they're coming to office to produce programs. You know at this point I want to ask you two questions I've already started getting questions but you know news apart from being a business is also a public service you know your tagline is it's about putting the viewer first the citizen first the country first and at ABP news you you've been neutral objective fact based and you're trying to report news as it is in the last two weeks you did face a lot of pressure if I may use and you know government whether the state governments or the central government sometimes for the right reason sometimes the wrong reason would not like certain news to go out or not get reported on areas where they don't look good so tell us how do you see news as a service and how have you dealt with pressure in the last three weeks four weeks and overall in your job see first of all any business that you are in if your sole purpose is to make the profit then you are in a wrong job so if you if the profit comes if your purpose is there to serve somebody somebody's need news channels are not no more different our purpose of existence is to tell people truth to remove the darkness of knowledge that people may have right and inform and educate and entertain them right that's the purpose that we exist because of this purpose audience come and consume our network uh every week every single day and thus advertisers are also looking for those engaged audience they come and advertise on my network so uh it's the the primary purpose of the business is not only to make money obviously any business cannot survive if there is no money but correct but money comes when you have your uh your purpose very sharply defined that you are here to serve the community as to inform educate and entertain them if you're doing that then I think there is a pot of gold that is lying at the other end uh and those people who do it honestly diligently week on week month on month year after year despite all the pressures that you are mentioning about our job is to report our job is not to uh not to comment on not to give my opinion on how you should look at the news our job is to report what is happening and it's for other people to judge what is right or wrong secondly uh no news organization should be treated as a PR department for the government of any any state center means piloting or etc uh our job is to because it is in the interest of those government also that they should know that what's going on in the field in the marketplace in the society and that's what all credible news journalists and news organizations do and that's what we are doing obviously uh uh everybody would like to hear only good news about themselves including you and me but the point is that that uh that if you report honestly and if you know that this is this is what is happening and we should take it take a cognizance of that the entire table moves up uh and you're saying news is a catalyst for positive action it's a catalyst for making sure that the right things happen absolutely and i can give you numerous examples in which uh we have done stories the government has come to know they have taken action you want to example no in fact uh in fact a lot of uh uh you know uh then for example just now the latest news is that when the and there's a pilgrims came to came to Punjab we were the quick one to point out that look this is going to spread infection and there are there are there are all the everyone they will spread infection because they have been sent back home without being tested and based on our report uh when the government came to know uh because it's such a large machinery government can't know everything is going on they send their team back uh took those people out from there sent them to quarantine center the tests were done and now it is coming out that over 200 people are infected so uh we have a responsibility and uh and we have played our role uh i can tell you over uh more than 75 hours of promo to prevent covid we have run on our own fantastic and we must have made over 20 different kind of promos on our network in all this last 40 days which requires again huge investment from from the network side and we are finding and and sacrificing advertising time and i know that sacrificing advertising sometime your ship can go down because and you know it happens as you said that right so yeah so we have a responsibility towards society uh at the end of the day we exist because because there is a society which which which which is looking for something brighter and better so mr bane i want to ask you uh you know we when we personally talk and we pre-covid times we haven't met after march 23rd but we talk about how the media industry has a crap mentality uh the media owners the media leaders don't support each other uh when it comes to picking a view on a story when one media organization reports the story right and comes under fire for reporting it absolutely the right way uh tell us in covid times has this change have media organization come together and understood that they're in this together and post covid how would you like um the media to come together and in some way rally you would support for example uh t r a i just come out with uh recommendations on the bark uh you know uh that's a way for government to in some way control ratings so the iron beam is there has to be clarified that he doesn't intend to uh make sure that nothing this happens without consultation in inari uh and you will talk to t r i and he can in his capacity as the iron beam is still there point i'm trying to ask is how does the media leaders owner see those come across as as one unit for the right reasons uh that is to safeguard the interest of citizen and not take the pressure of the government or any special interest group whether it's a industry lobby whatever it is so okay i can tell you that see uh the news broadcast association which is the mortal body for representing the news industry in india uh has done lots of intervention in past 45 days uh since the covid time has come we all talk almost every day uh so for example we have written to the the iron beam minister uh and the government of india that are uh our payment to the prasar bharti should be waived off for three months because we do not have money run right not to run the operations pay people's salary and stay safe uh we have come together and b was the first one to strongly criticize uh the rest of ap marja reporter uh and by the way i must tell you the same report which the government of india the government of marastra said is wrong the same train has started yesterday from the same place that we reported and it is a south eastern railway which on basis which is we gave that report started those trains so we knew what we were doing and that's why as an nba and be a president wrote a very strong letter to the marastra government uh and we were we also informed iron beam ministry that this is something this has happened with us so in a lot of matter we are in the broadcast association also also yes exactly a lot of my colleagues across different channels uh uh journalists editors CEOs they came out on their own and then they they they called me up and they supported me through whatever means that is possible so as far as uh protecting the truth or protecting our right to have a free speech we are all together but please understand that at the end of the day for everyone they have their own problems and their own uh a set of issues priorities and issues which everybody is fair in in that way to deal what to prioritize and what to what to do so as an industry body uh i have been on the board of ibf i'm on the board of nba and we we don't push business agendas for different organizations they say what is important for the industry is to protect the right of free speech and make sure that the adverse environment outside our organizations does not hamper that flow of the free speech this is the limited area in which we all get together and uh uh that's why if you look at the news industry from where we started it in year 2000 to where it is today over 300 news channels uh so many people are directly or indirectly employed in this the conscience of the nation has gone up uh every single thing that you do anywhere gets reported and and overall i think democratic values in this country has become a strong since the time the news channel have have so many news organizations have come so so i'm quite happy with the level of cooperation that we all are having i did not get your second question was uh my second question was how do you deal with let's say you know the you know what is the response to the kri recommendations on bark why bark has done a good job and there may be areas where it needs to improve and there are areas you know that it needs to improve uh there is a new ceo in sunil lula but before that bark was very dare i say very opaque and very you know at the leadership level not open to suggestions but to get the government to control or interfere where the advertisers are happy uh where the stakeholders like yours may not be entirely happy with bark but that's something between you and bark uh should the government interfere in it what's your view see my personal view is this that government should be out of business they should be uh they should be uh freedom of people to exercise their business and freedom of choice uh however at the same time uh we have seen this globally that when the regulator is weak uh the businesses have not improved uh that's a global example i'm telling you through different phase studies however uh as far as bark is concerned uh nobody will have any doubt that we have the most competent guy right now at the top which is absolutely not only competent even in his empathy for individual how he engages in his responsiveness sunil lula is possibly uh outstanding he's outstanding yeah that's why i'm saying that he's the most he is the one of the most person in the television channel both in news and in non news so he has been on site so he under he's he has been a broadcaster he has been in advertising he has he's in a statistic so he understands the person is very responsive so you know he engages so nobody yeah nobody have has any doubt about the person at the top the board uh very accomplished people and it is see it is not easy to run a system like that you are talking about money so if you have to increase the number of people meters you need to increase outlets at the end of the day it's a it's a very difficult business to be in you know so uh india is not not like america where the east coast to west coast people drink same cereals uh people eat same cereals in the morning as a breakfast here your neighbor has a very different choice than so it's not easy to measure in this country uh it is up to the bark board and uh and the industry stakeholder to to look at the detail of uh tier as a recommendation we have not done so so far we are unable to comment on this uh uh and so sooner or later the time will tell what uh the problem is this that we should ask who went to the government and why and what who do you think went to the government? Mr. Pandey we are audio has gone out audio i cannot hear you can you hear me now yes okay so i don't know so i'm saying that you know was it a discontinental broadcaster who was not happy with the ratings of others or a group of discontinental broadcaster i don't think so i don't think so i don't think the government mr pandey the government's line of thinking is when in covid times you store stories you meaning i talk about this and you know some of the stories are very right should be shown some are frivolous and when you ask new broadcasters why because we have to get ratings you know that's that's the currency like in politics how many seats you win in in loxabar determines who who runs the country similarly so the government said oh if ratings is something that is causing this new uh let's control ratings and control uh the rating system so what is your view on that though the ironman stressed today very categorically and emphatically said that he will he did a meeting with the IVF board members in the stakeholders yesterday and he assured them that no such action would be taken and uh you know proper consultation would be done and you would talk to the tri chief but why do you think it happened i mean see i'm unable to answer that because i don't know why this happened uh i'm not in the backboard and and see see as sunil said in some of the interview that i was saying that uh people who don't get rating there are usually an interview was an exchange for media.com so yeah the only interview was the tri order yeah so people who don't get rating they are unhappy and that's that's very logical to be unhappy but i don't think so that's the reason that uh the government will interfere or anybody i don't think so that's that's the case okay let me ask the question if you have to suggest to park two things to improve what would that be see the investment in rpd is very important the worst path data because on the one hand you have a complete ecosystem which exists right now where you get to see who is watching how how what they are consuming uh what is their viewing pattern and then absolute data comes to you through digital on the other hand you have extrapolation so obviously there is a the technology has reached somewhere while we are still in a in a previous technology obviously it will require investments industry stakeholders are agreeing to it uh so it's but in that direction i think we should do is the reverse part data where you actually data who is consuming water and also no manual intervention in it there will be no tampering or etc that that you will come now let's focus a little bit from technical things in your 15 plus years not 16 here at abt tell us some milestone uh that when you think about them it makes your heart glow you know it makes you smile they've been worthwhile in abt news generally because you pretty much be around from the day to start it so tell us a little bit milestone one or two interesting stories uh that professionals from the industry would love and it would you know be interesting anecdotes you know one thing very good about our organization is that that uh the size of the market is not the only reason we do business so for example when i still remember uh in uh in late 2004 i was having a conversation with then ceo deshanker uh at library bar at tach president and he said let's launch uh when the moment you join let's start doing the work for launch of bangalore channel in calcutta and i said uh is there so much of audience in india that we need to go into regional space that in bangal which is featuring market and etc etc and he said we'll clear the market so and so similarly when we went in maharastra uh there was no uh regional news channel market there so we do not necessarily look at the market size even if you look at any pundit in news industry will tell you that being neutral is never an advantage reporting breaking news is no more than advantage because people are getting breaking news through through their work tab and facebook and facebook but we do all the time that you do all the investigative stories we believe that uh sharing the opinion is fine but it should be limited to a slot where a couple of people can share their opinion who are who could be seen as an opinion picked maker but finally we believe in delivering facts and uh that's what we stand for so we don't necessarily go by uh the standard market logic and which that is why this makes us special and every day when you come to work uh and my staff will tell you i see that you're still working from office they're in office today and every time i stop until you've been in office i haven't gone to office in more than 40 days but i we are doing this conversation you being in office i've been at home and uh so yeah so you know so if you if you ask my staff uh they will tell you more the the biggest smile that you get when they tell you that they're looking for whatever you're wanting to come to work i think then this is the biggest achievement of our organization where every employee feels so involved in the work that it does not require a supervision on day to day from the junior most to the senior most okay i mean i ask you some personal questions what people in the media industry and the news industry that you look up to see uh and why uh some maybe also you may generally look up to them but beyond that i don't see uh you know i always tell you that um you you were as good as your team is uh and you can be as experimental as your boss allows you to do so okay i have been extremely lucky uh working with some of the best people in the industry uh so all my bosses i think i owe it to them that i learned so much from them that today whatever i am i always call it i am uh my education is on the one side formal education but uh you can never become good in what you do unless what tulsidas wrote that narapura you know you cannot have knowledge only from one source so you meet people you you you grab something from them you understand them and then you solve my bosses uh i've learned a lot i look up to everyone including uh mr batra uh for for any intelligent conversation conversation we definitely on a very serious note we definitely laugh a lot for you and we have honest conversation yeah so there are i would not like to name any particular one but yes uh all the people that i worked with i certainly owe it to them uh because i largely know you well and i'm trying to be very formal with you and at the start before we get in like you said don't try to be so formal with me but i want to say this to our viewers you know i practically know everybody in the media industry that needs to be known and more in the advertising media communication and i can tell you that i'm not saying it because we're talking to mr pande or he's my friend which he is uh is that he's one of the most affable elements i spoke to two people yesterday and i am no qualms i spoke to neha panth yesterday after like a long time because she tweeted an article she wrote on sambalsana for us 16 years back and she was praising me i speak to atul sharma and you know i told you that question he asked me one day why is avinash so successful so i said to him but he works very hard he keeps he helps everyone but most importantly is genuinely affable he's very likable so how are you as a boss tell us how are you as a boss how do you balance being being affable and taking the right decision how do you strike that balance it's 12 o'clock see uh andrag like all good leader and thank you very much for saying such good things first and thank you to colleagues it's colleagues of mine that you mentioned just name i have to work with you at indian express yeah we have good things to say and he asked me in the saying what can i learn from avinash how can i be like so that was the question i see i do you're something yeah you know uh andrag i'm a i'm also a practical person so you know so i'm i'm very uh humbled at their kindness of these words but but finally uh as i told you i'm as good as my as my team and my boss you know so so what is your leadership style what is your leadership style so i'll tell you there are three things that i focus on uh and i work with my team number one is give them a direction the second one is to give them enough support and infrastructure to move in their direction and third one constantly help them achieving those goals i should be seen as enabler to them to achieve those goals rather than one who just takes reviews and says you know you can do it thank you very much i also believe that a good leader has to be empathetic you know towards going around so you do not if you don't have empathy you can never be a good leader so uh looking at bottom line and top line is obviously every every organization heads uh has a task at hand to do so but what is more important is that how you look at your employee uh as somebody who can contribute in a very significant way that you yourself alone cannot do and there is a goodness in everybody and that's what the first principle is to explore that beautiful end of the day at the end of the day they're dead wood everywhere and so in my nation and i can tell you i've politely told several people to to part ways and it's not that i have not done so uh but even after parting ways we remain good friends and and and we still talk uh almost a regular basis so business doing business is very important to understand that as long as you are focusing on giving directions managing those directions and giving infrastructure for people to work people will uh work for you at any given point of time and if they fail they will come and tell you to look i don't think so i fit here i don't think so i can contribute here and let me now move myself away from this so that the organization does not stop i also give an example uh a lot of people about the heart's movement of the elephants look at the elephant uh uh they move in a in a circle the strongest member on the outside circle the the elder ones are in the middle and the children are in between and they all move with a certain speed when one of the member is not able to move with that speed they try to pull that member away they they push them you must have seen those civil videos in national geography but at one point when they realize that this particular member cannot move anymore they leave him and the rest of the heart moves away on their course that's what happens with the organization we will support each other as colleagues to move with the speed that we desire but if someone is not able to move that speed then we'll have to let that go and that's what happens so at the end of the day nobody feels bad because you know at the end of the day they feel that the organization is feeling the company what the comments are most thank you for sharing that i i want to ask two three questions but i'll leave it till the end there are people asking questions there's niraj asking two questions and i'll just try and get if there's some of them live we'll try and get them if any of them can get them niraj is asking how the distribution side of the broadcast business change and the second question is how secure are the jobs in media in the medium term in long-term future first of all let me tell you the pre-covid way of doing business and post-covid way of doing business would be very different and how would it be different see basic basic way of our communication and interaction has changed you cannot have same way of of doing business as it was earlier when things are changing so fast in a world it would be as you rightly said some time back that it's a hookah world you cannot have a permanent solution that this is what i'm going to do three months from now it is a it is a it is a situation where you have to be resilient and i wrote to my employee that resilience is something which is adaptability personified you have to be adaptable to constantly moving time and changes that is happening as far as distribution is concerned i mean i call it organic pivoting organic pivoting that's right so it's done as things change to adapt and i was talking to rajnaik and jai kumar the other day they said the best person is who doesn't have a plan they'll be successful because really they don't have a plan it sounds it sounds like you know oxymoron is that you'll be successful if you're not a have a plan but for always you said have a plan you know planning is a success and suddenly you're saying live in the day do the best you can do today and take every day as it comes now coming back to distribution business so distribution is the biggest cost for the news broadcaster and we were hoping that the what t r a i recommended in n t or two is a fixing of the price for the distribution and if that gets implemented that will be there for the news organizations because if you look at the balance sheet of any news organization today the largest cost is the distribution it's not about content creation content creation is not a cost and how the business will move from where it is to where it wants to go you're looking at the world-class journalism unless you invest in the content and that nobody's left with any money after paying to distributors so so n t or two has some right recommendation for for the distribution but this this industry will change uh with the with the with the opening of the fiber capacity in the country a cable linear cable would not be the only source for consuming television and i see these changes happening very fast uh within years time people will be consuming more through the five through the through the fiber rather than through the linear cable uh all kind of content including news and that's why i see those auditives who are well placed with the news plus content are are the one who are going to have a larger share of pie than the normal utility which does not have use other other media firms are decreasing their pricing of course your leadership as we said is one of from 200 to 300 percent uh so you you shouldn't decrease your yields because in media once the yield goes up it's very difficult for it in your case the worship increase so you have no reason to bring down the price no we are not we are not we're holding on to our price and we are asking for premium uh so you don't see some stage if the economy doesn't recover in the next three to six months do you still see yourself holding prices see as i said because it's a this this time requires resilience we don't know what's next we are only prepared for what we know as of now that there will be limited economic activity there would be restrictions on movements uh there would be change in the consumption pattern and if these are the changes happening for example in education sector look at the the kind of change that it is going to show look at the consumption of your habits of going watching watching movies and theaters you know going to theater and mall it is going to have a significant change real estate will have significant change maybe you don't require everybody is now looking at the fact that maybe you don't require so much of real estate for office so things will change and the developing situation also saying anything with great degree of certainty would be a would be yeah but we're certainly prepared uh we're certainly prepared with all options on table so thank you and uh i would bring on prenga do we have uh mr tyawari and mr mishra online or we don't have them uh not yet sir i'll just call him and i'll just call them i'm gonna ask you if you have to make three predictions for the future about the media business what would those be that you can see some things you can see some things of course i don't make depends on what i look so for example we know that digital consumption is going to them that's a that's a given you know established media brand has seen lots of viewership so these are given but give us three things that we haven't looked at see the first change that will happen that uh in the near term is that the the heavy set of production will go there you'll have to work with far less you have to do more agile and maybe in our business for example a single person with mojo kit uh is what will all be required to cover the story so you're saying the reporter will be the cameraman the reporter will be the you know by the way this was already happening globally uh uh uh today today we come out with technologies which can which can actually help the person do a two-way interview like we are talking to one mojo kid so so obviously the heaviness of the production will go away which will also lead to reduction of costs that's right people would be a lot of lot of different kind of content people would be looking at then what news channels are used to producing right now which is what is happening on the street is what we we are best at most of us because uh uh we have a worldview which which will not be the same after this covid end so a lot of different quality of content and kind of content will surface in the mainstream media than it was earlier and third one is that the distribution platforms are going to radically change so the and build on that explain that little see the way you consume today television will not be the same again because an uncertain time creates high degree of anxiety a linear cable does not necessarily work in that space so for example if i'm watching abp news on hotstar and i'm watching something and i'm interested in sumita was his facebook life or something i immediately go on hotstar itself press the button and watch something else come back to the main story again that's how that's how people will be consuming television because the cost of the data and the bandwidth has gone down drastically and as the g.o.s fits in india it will reach to the rural india and that's where you'll see the tipping point in this business to open the same change in the distribution platforms thank you for getting deeper into that now i will also only need to ask you to ask your question hypothetical question but if the revenues and news channels don't grow or stay where they are and it leads to a weakening of the news broadcaster's ecosystem what are its you know the commercial weakening the revenue softening up what are the its implications for the ecosystem and for the country and for the society if at all it happens say i tell you so you have to give me two minutes to explain this see the death of the local newspaper is the biggest dent to for a free speech and free market you know the local newspapers were the conscience keeper of of local communities they used to report if there is a violation by a builder the municipality is not building up the roads and etc etc and these mediums were largely supported by advertising largely means what 100 percent supported by advertising and advertising advertisers are not looking at good journalism advertisers are looking at eyeballs and if that eyeball has shifted somewhere else the newspaper started dying but the but in that space the casualty has been the right of our freedom of free market of free society no local news channel scheme to fill up that space in the broadcast sector now if the advertising does not come in that proportions the first thing that broadcaster has to do that that has to go to the pay mode where people actually consume you by paying you so you have to free up some content which is which is for free of cost which you'll not charge for and some content that you'll charge for I think sir if the revenue model does not stay like this people who are in this business in the broadcast business who are not here for a good journalism for only for for looking at this as a as a business I think they are the first one who will be going out because this is not what they came from right if it becomes unsustainable a group like ours or many others in my in my in the members who are only in this business they know the business they will even become bitter because they'll be innovative they will be creating unique contents they may go pay for their certain content so on these two platforms and over a period of time you'll see a sharpening of the of the whole ecosystem where a few players would be there but producing a world-class content for for all all section of this so I don't think so going advertising revenue down will will kill a few of us but it will certainly change the way we manufacture our studios would be smaller our staff would be leaner and we'll be using technology to distribute our content to multiple people so that advertisers can can benefit. Fantastic Mr Pandey, I think that granularity will help doctor. I just want to another Tushar is asking is it not an opportunity for news channels to get smaller advertiser with smaller budgets and and largely advertising? See all the news channels do every day every year the same job okay we go to small towns uh talk to local at local manufacturers and and and service providers we create their ad films we run it on the channel last year alone at ABP news network we we got 400 such uh clients into advertising for the first time right you know so similarly all other news channels must have done it so it because we look at our job as serving the society whether it is for the dissemination of news or allowing them to come into a business ecosystem so we our first focus is always go to a small kalukka's village towns and look at what they are doing and you'll be surprised the level of their business that they were of their uh you know innovations uh curiosity and and they become big brand today a lot of big brands that you see in the marketplace today who are also buying IPL and all that they were first uh you know were brought into the system by the news news news channels fantastic you know in fact i was talking to a big advertiser he's also a big advertiser on your network and he said the only thing we think we rely on is IPL and news now that IPL is not there we rely on news a lot more we've held back the campaign because it was centered around virat and it was virat localites and now we have to make a tweak in the commercial so we'll wait till the festive season comes and we'll hopefully utilize news channels a lot so really uh he echoed some of the sentiments that you shared i want to ask my two last questions and might also wrap up first question is you know is about the job losses in the media sector and second is when do you see the economy bouncing back and both are in some way related see if you look at average growth of any country if let's say it is five percent or six percent or seven percent you work for 12 months you get five six seven percent growth that means it's less than one month of work that you grow for two months you're in the lockdown so forget about any growth the economy is going to decline it's not simple mathematics we'll tell you and definitely there'll be a huge depression in the marketplace but what i'm hopeful about india is that that we are not the contribution in our GDP of exports is varied the huge contribution come from domestic consumption and government expenditure so it's all inward and the day it slightly becomes better in terms of movement of goods and services factory output and people are able to go out and consume our economy will bounce back and i see that bouncing back no later than september no later than september no later than september so september it's very optimistic i'm an optimistic person so i think that you know that's the way it would be but but things would not be the same ever again i can tell you until everybody in this world gets vaccinated or there is a clear cut medicine and because the virus never goes out goes away stays so we all need to know how to protect ourselves and there'll be different way of our conduct in the in the in the business and the society and that's what the change will determine how the economy is going to be it will never be the same again on rock that much i can tell you but we are likely to bounce back faster than many western organizations and uh ish in western western countries and that i have to believe timeline i'm not sure but i believe what you say uh i want to end by asking you what are the top three things you'll do moment i mean i know you go to office every day but what are the top three things you do in september uh you know would you travel your job entail traveling to bombay going to wherever the adb event there's an event in the state capital of luck now or event in the cms the constituency in gore for your travel how would it change that so what are the top three things you wish for uh for september see uh first of all as an organization we are committed to our investments so we are waiting for this cycle to subside and we'll move with our investments that we had planned just to tell our viewers abp news is moving into a very world-class brand new large office space at least before the pre-covid and uh mr bandhe will you still move into an office space uh so as of now as i said all options are on the table but uh we have not we have not shall be any plan that we had planned before so far so uh my first objective is to continue with the business plan as we had planned uh before those investments but i can tell you the business what any business house is planned there'll be a massive change in the basic structure of those businesses because it's not the same for example if if i'm a production house and i'm producing a show where i invite 55 audience into the studio or 100 audience into the studio and do a show do you think we'll be able to do those shows may not if it requires 55 people to work at a studio set do you think we can produce maybe not so the way we work will change and as i said that all good strategies work if you know as you move in what oil to make changes in and that's what i mean predictability then predictability is very highly uncertain environments but we are right now as you asked for september we are hoping that by september if things start moving into the right direction we will uh we will go ahead with our those investments so our ambition our ambition is one or other two so you know if you predicted this time on drag one that would be i think of that big d but uh yes i see you wear lots of fingers radio on your finger i saw i think i saw an emirate so you clearly believe in astrology and all i i believe in what my mother says so if my mother says we are this i we are this there are certain things that you don't argue about so that's the way it is so but i'm i'm what i'm telling you is that that look the travel would not be the same again so that would be that would be the major consideration for doing our daily work your office space would not be the same way designed as as it was designed your your number of people working at the workplace would not be the same number so a lot of changes are going to happen we are planning for all of that right now by the as to how we will when when things open up how how we will ask corporate staff to come to office what will they do to require them really in office every day of the week or every day of the month all these considerations are on the table but as far as the business is concerned we'll continue with we are we are very hopeful about india we believe in the strength of india and i think we'll be able to bounce back very soon than most countries and there is an opportunity for organization like ours who is into the business of telling you the truth uh giving you the knowledge giving you information so we'll continue for the time Mr. Pandey I said last week I want to ask the news channel focus a lot on what is not right so that it can be put into right but I want to ask you what do you think as the government and the prime minister done right in the last 40 days because you know it's also good to focus on things that the government gets right and the prime minister gets right so what are the things you feel that the government has done right I think see I'm very candid about it if I think there is a noble price for fighting COVID that goes to any estate head it should go to our prime minister he has done an incredible work without doubt leading a team of 130 billion people each of them thinking differently and making them agree to do something please remember one thing that the country came to stand still not by an order but by his appeal that he stayed at home first which was the day one of not a single person moved out of their house and that kind of appeal I have seen I'm a student of history happened only in case of Mahatma Gandhi where he said that Chauripara has happened from tomorrow there's no agitation and the entire country stopped the power of leader is not by the power enshrined in the constitution not given to you by the board the power of a leader is how people believe in you when you say something and that way I think an amazing job our prime minister has done I would not be agree seriously we seriously need to look at now on economy because the longer we are logged in the worst will the longer time it will take for us to bounce back so there has to be some balance which needs to be done and I'm sure the prime minister and and and the government of India is thinking in this direction I'm hopeful thank you thank you on this positive note we wish you luck we wish the ABP news network luck we wish all your colleagues luck we wish the news in the media industry of which all of us are part of every wish all our countrymen luck and complement the government of India and the prime minister for doing a lot of things right and hope that we are able to come out of the economic impacts of covid I'm sure at some stage again we'd have the opportunity to engage in a conflict in happier better times till then all the best God bless you thank you thank you thank you so much and rock and business world and exchange for media thank you