 Welcome. Thank you for being here. I believe we have the technology ready to launch. Thank you for the staff who've been helping us. This is the session that we think we're attending. Hopefully this is the session that you think you're attending. Adapting openly licensed materials to meet the needs of diverse learners advice from the field. I'm Steel Wagstaff from Pressbooks. We wanted to begin with territorial acknowledgement. All of us are on the panel here are visitors to this beautiful place here in Edmonton. Oops. I have to advance this. No. Well, anyway, the slides that I'm presenting from here are different. We're going to see how this goes, but there was a photograph I took this morning of the Saskatchewan River Valley just walking through and seeing I'm a visitor to this place and we're being welcomed here by very gracious hosts and part of the acknowledgement we wanted to give is that Edmonton, the city that we're in is located within Treaty 6 territory and within the Métis homelands and the Métis Nation of Alberta Region 4. We want to acknowledge this land as the traditional territories of many First Nations, including the Nechia, the Dene, the Nakoda Sioux, the Anishinaabe, and the Nitsitapi, as well as a diverse and abundant more than human community. This is a place that's been a gathering place for many, many, many, many years, and there's active work of reconciliation that's going on here in this place that we're being invited to learn from and then to take lessons from to draw back and take to our home places. One of the things I learned about in preparing to come to Edmonton was the story of the bison. The bison have recently been reintroduced to Alberta. That was part of a really important foodway and a connection to life for the indigenous people who lived here and just in July, the first two bison calves were born in Alberta after reintroduction. That was moving to me. I thought about that and I thought, this is part of a story of reconciliation. I hope that we can attend to the kinds of births and the kinds of return of life to this place and the places that we live and consider our place in a larger community. So I will go to introduce our panelists next. I'm really pleased to be here. As I said, I'm Steel Wagstaff. I am the Product Manager for Pressbooks. We make open-source publishing software and we're headquartered in Montreal. I'm joined for the panel today by immediately to my left, this is a privilege shock. She's the Executive Director of the Rebus Foundation and we'll be speaking to the topic later today. To her immediate left is Marilyn Billings. She's a many of you know, if you've been to open education conferences at all in the last 20 years, you probably know Marilyn Billings. She is now a consultant who's working for a group called Rotel and they're remixing open texts through an equity lens and to the far, my far left on your far right in the panel. This is Josie Gray, my friend and Manager of Production and Publishing from BC Campus and that is Amanda Cool. It's the Executive Director of BC Campus. Letting you know BC Campus is in the house. All right. I just wanted to say a few things about the panel. Like when you put together a panel, it's kind of like you're in a, you see yourself a little bit like a chef or something, you're assembling ingredients and putting things together and trying to decide who do you want to speak? Who do you want to represent this topic? And I feel really grateful to be in the presence of these women who I admire a lot. I was going to share a poem and embarrass everybody, but in the interest of time I won't do that. But there's a great poem, there's not enough poetry at this event yet, but if you want to look it up, there's a poem by Marge Percy called To Be of Use. And she describes the kinds of people that dig into the work and what work is. And for me, I was thinking about what would make a really nice meal for this panel and these three women are the women that I admire that I think are doing the work. And that poem, Marge Percy's poem, To Be of Use is why I picked them for the panel. So read it, think about it, and I appreciate you being here. And I hope I've embarrassed you sufficiently to move to the next slide. Here's what to expect. We just did the welcome and intros. I'd like to invite each of the panels to come and we're going to talk about framing for the topic and they'll give brief presentations about adaptation. And then we'll have time for a Q and A. I have some facilitated questions and we'd love to hear from you in the room for questions that you have. We have 45 minutes, so we'll try to be mindful of the time. The first thing that I wanted to share is not also on the presentation slides, but let me just tell a story. Okay. Thinking about widespread adoption, we have a resource that's called the Press Books Directory and it's an open, freely available directory of open access books published with our platform. If you go to pressbooks.directory, you could see it or you could see a screenshot. Imagine you're seeing a screenshot of this beautiful looking directory here. And it has around 6,000 books that have been published now from around 160 different institutions who are sharing this work and sharing this knowledge freely. I went in on last Friday and I said, well, what percentage of these are original works and what percentage are already adaptations? And I didn't know the answer when I went in. And about 1,500, about one quarter of the books that are listed on the Press Books Directory right now are adaptations, books that have been cloned or based on something else in the community. And so when you're thinking about, as you're supporting open creation on your campus, a lot of the work is going to be adoption or adaptation of people changing the text and making it either personalized for their instructional needs or the needs of their students or just changing things they don't like and making it better or reviving it or bringing it to life. And so the framing context that we wanted to give here was, I just like don't match at all. So who knows what you'll see next. But adapting OAR, the kind of framing assertion is that it is a viable strategy right now for improving student success at the individual, the course, and the program levels. And there's three kind of frames that we'll be talking about and that you'll hear different things. And so this is a framing question to think about. One of the things that it can do is it can really approve affordability. We all know that's one of the reasons that many people are drawn to open, as well as access, being able to access materials through open licenses when things are free and open. The second thing that adaptation often does is it encourages local perspectives. You've heard about indigenization, you'll hear more about it in this panel in other places, but and there's lots of different kinds of local needs that can be met through adapting text that were written for a dominant perspective or a dominant culture that might not be appropriate to the local needs that you work and teach in. And the third thing that we think adaptation can do is you take work that others have done and you build on it by braiding in or incorporating innovative pedagogies or different approaches to teaching and learning. These are the three kind of lenses that I think you'll hear us talking about and thinking about. And that's really all I wanted to say that a kind of motivation for adaptation. I'm gonna pass it to the first panelist who's gonna give a little bit of a talk about her perspective on adaptation for local needs. It'll be a perva. I hope what you see expects it. Altair. I'm short, so I'm gonna move this for a second. Can everyone hear me okay? No, it's lovely. I am speaking to you from a slightly different perspective. As Steele mentioned, I work for the Rebus Foundation and as you can see on the slides here, we are a nonprofit organization. We are a Canadian registered charity that focuses on education, but we look at things from a publishing lens. We offer publisher support. We offer professional development for collaborative open education projects, and our work is entirely mission-driven. We are a charity. We have goals to center student experience, student learning throughout all phases of the publishing and production workflows. So really we're trying to help the open movement grow, but we're also trying to make sure that the field is full of inclusive learners, inclusive educators, and in the past, I would say six years or so, we've really been working with a range of stakeholders in the field. We have worked with colleges, institutions, consortiums. We've worked with boards of education, state systems or compacts. We've also had the opportunity to work with individual educators and individual researchers and scholars. So when I speak to you about OER Adaptation today, OER Creation today, I'm going to try to merge all of these perspectives and share all of the insights and the lessons learned that I have working with projects in different regions, in different disciplines, looking at all of the themes and patterns. So just some context on where I'm talking to you from today. And I think it's helpful to build on the grounding that OER had about adaptation. As we have seen it at Rebus, the adaptation workflow or the process can be very simple. It could be as simple as what you see on the slide there. I find it open textbook. I make changes to it and I use it. And the eye here is a teacher, a faculty member, a subject matter expert. But we found that this is a misconception and many of you know that, that it's only the faculty member who's involved in open adaptation work. We see this misconception, in fact, if you look at open creation grants, how they're structured, these are primarily awarded to faculty and they can be as small as a few hundred dollars and this could range to much larger. But they're really designed and awarded to one faculty member working on a textbook. We have actually been supporting OER adaptation through a program called the Textbook Success Program, which is a year long professional development training course for OER creators and we found through that, that there is collaboration involved. And OER adaptation can be a little more complex. When you start to add more people to the mix, you're more successful. It's as simple as that. And I put on the slide here a very, very simplistic breakdown of the adaptation workflow and how you can add to just the faculty member doing the work. So in the discovery phase, you might be working with librarians to help find the right type of resources to adapt. You might be working with instructional designers during the drafting process. Students might come into the picture as you have them review the materials as you're using them in the classrooms or you might reach out to technologists like we have today to help with the slide deck, to help with the formatting and technological pieces of this work. The photo of the book on the slide is an OER produced by Rebus the Rebus Guide to Publishing. It takes you through this entire workflow in more detail and offers templates and worksheets for you all to use and adapt. So if you're a solo instructor attending the session today or if you're part of a larger unit or department trying to bolster the open education initiative at your institution, the guide might be helpful. But I also want to look at that phrase open textbook and ask a question. What if we looked at the bigger picture? What if we looked at adaptation of OER as a more holistic process rather than just making edits or changes to a textbook? What if you sort of step back? What if you start to think about course outcomes? What if you start to think about ways to deepen partnerships? To support students not only in the course through the rest of their degree pathway, but also beyond? So when we think about OER adaptation, I would say we're actually getting a chance to pause and challenge the status quo that we've accepted for so long with the materials and courses that we've been using. And instead we can start thinking about making the ripple effect with edits and changes to our work. We will be talking about the making ripples guide on Wednesday if you want to learn more but if you don't want to, you can also access that OER for free when you look at the slide deck afterwards. This perspective of sort of looking at the bigger picture, looking at the holistic approach is infused into all of Rebus' programs but also into our practices. And I will just say starting with this vision of thinking about the bigger picture of your work, thinking about the why, why are you trying to do it? What are you trying to do? Can make the adaptation process clearer and easier for all of us? So you might say as an instructor, I want to empower students, I want to see how statistics affects our daily lives, I want them to see how statistics plays a role in healthcare, in inflation, in climate change. So when I'm teaching or adapting a statistics textbook or course, I will introduce real world concepts first. I will sprinkle in interactive elements to help students move past maybe an initial fear of math to help them understand how statistics shows up in real life in all of these different places. So thinking about adaptation in the context of broader goals, in the context of student demographics, in context of your regional needs, your students' needs can I think lead to some very surprising results. And on this slide here, I have examples of adapted OER that I would have loved to show you if I had the capacity to do so, but I will talk about them. And if you're curious about any of these, all of the images you can click on with links to the courses and the books that I'm mentioning. So these four books here are all published by Textbook Success Program alumni. Write What Matters is created out of Idaho and it offers a lot of flexibility. It's a modular writing and comprehension textbook that helps instructors basically create their own learning journey. So they, I think if you click on the PDF of this textbook or go to the URL, it is lengthy. It is several hundred pages long and the intention is not for instructors to just plug and play with this book, but rather to pick and choose chapters and sections that they think will help their students write What Matters, quite literally. So it includes new sections on teaching and artificial intelligence that the instructors added this year. The idea is very much use it as you need it rather than use it the way it's been presented. The medical terminology and the public speaking books that you see in the center are projects out of Louisiana. They include a lot of interactive content using H5P, YouTube videos, a lot of other multimedia for students to engage with and the instructors in this case not only put out a textbook but they also created a corresponding Moodle course with the syllabus and the learning objectives and prompts for instructors to think about assessments and to design newer assessments for students to really engage with public speaking or medical terminology in this case in really fun ways. So it was also about creating play and fun as much as it was teaching students that I terminology in healthcare. I don't know much about that. I have an English degree and a publishing degree but I trust the authors behind these books. And the last one here is one you might have heard about this morning in several sessions, the Pulling Together Guides. This is actually adapted. This is the Manitoba and Brandon edition of a series that came out of British Columbia produced by BC Campus Books who you will see around here and a lot of other community members. This I really wanted to bring up as an example of OER that can be adapted for spaces outside of a typical student course. So this is a book that you could use to engage readers with reconciliation journeys, with decolonization journeys. It's a chance to use OER to respond to the current moment. And as all of us are grappling with our own roles, our professional roles or our institutional roles around equity and how equity fits into education or vice versa, how are they in service of each other. We can rely on OER that's been created and adapted to help answer those questions. So I hope that you can actually click through some of these resources in your own time and draw some inspiration from them. But I also hope that this has been illustrative to show you the breadth of OER adaptation. Doesn't just have to be about changing sets of names or examples or questions in a book, it can be much more broader and holistic than that. And no matter how simple or complex you take it, I think it is especially rewarding. So I hope that you give it a shot sometime. And with that, I might pass it to Josie. Hi, everyone. Am I coming through the mic okay? Awesome, thank you. Okay, what am I here to talk about? Very tricky. So my name is Josie and I work for BC Campus. BC Campus is a provincial organization in British Columbia, which is the westernmost province in Canada. And we are funded by the Ministry of Post-Secondary Education and Future Skills. And we work with the 25 public post-secondary institutions in the province in the areas of open education, teaching and learning and other short-term projects. So to give you a bit of background about kind of the open education work that BC Campus does today where we started. In 2012, BC Campus received government funding to create a collection of open textbooks, aligned with the top 40 highest-enrolled subject areas in the province. And that was the start of what was called the BC Open Textbook Project. So this work started out by searching out existing open textbooks that might meet the needs of BC educators. And at the time, there was little to no open textbooks being created in Canada. That's not the case anymore, but at the time, that was kind of the reality. So BC Campus looked for open textbooks in the United States and found a number of textbooks that looked like they would be well-aligned with BC courses, kind of like intro-level psychology and sociology and biology, et cetera. And contracted a number of BC instructors to review these textbooks to get their take on them. And the main thing that, the main feedback that they were giving us was that the textbooks were mostly good, but they weren't really fitting the context that they were teaching in. They weren't relevant to a Canadian audience. And so some of the very first open textbook development work that BC Campus did was adapting these open textbooks to reflect a Canadian context. So on the screen, I have a few of the books that were some of the first adaptation projects that BC Campus completed, Introduction to Sociology, Introduction to Psychology and Introductory Chemistry. And we called them first Canadian editions to distinguish them from the original American texts of the same names. And these ones were all published in 2014, so nearly 10 years ago. These adaptation projects were very focused, excuse me, they rearranged content to reflect the flow of Canadian classrooms and then replaced American examples and research with Canadian ones. And so based on the lessons learned during this work, my colleague, Laurie Asip, wrote the adaptation guide. And this guide kind of talks about what is an adaptation? Why might you adapt and how to adapt? It was published a number of years ago, but I do think some of the lessons learned and things offered in this guide are still useful. So if you're thinking about an adaptation project, you can check this one out at opentextbc.ca slash adapt open textbook. Another thing we've done quite a bit at BC Campus is adapting for accessibility. Now I don't really think about this work as adaptation. I think of it more as remediation, but it's still, it's still same, same. So when you revise an existing open textbook, you can make it accessible by adding things like image descriptions, fixing up the headings, properly formatting tables, et cetera, all to make sure the content is accessible to students with disabilities. So this is something that is enabled by open licenses because there's no copyright restriction. So it's something that we can do with open textbooks. For those who are unfamiliar with accessibility, another resource I would share is the accessibility toolkit at opentextbc.ca slash accessibility toolkit. And our most recent adaptation project and a project that I'm personally really excited about is adapting an introduction to psychology open textbook through the lens of equity, diversity, and inclusion. This textbook was one of the original adaptations that BC Campus did 10 years ago. So it's almost 10 years old. In addition, there are a number of equity issues in the textbooks that have been identified. And yeah, so it needs some work. But this book still is well adopted in BC, so we wanted to fund a project to update the book and make it better. And so when thinking about what areas of consideration apply when adapting for equity, diversity, and inclusion, we've identified accessibility and usability, student engagement, language, representation, and ways of knowing and sources of authority. So who's being cited? What knowledges are being kind of put forward as legitimate sources of authority, things like that. And I can talk about more of those if people are interested. This project is being completed by a large collaborative team. And having a large team was really important to us for this project because we wanted to ensure it was diverse and had multiple perspectives identified and also adaptations are a lot of work. So we wanted to ensure there was enough resources available to be successful in this project. And so we have people who are coming in from a number of roles. It's not just authors, we also have project managers, librarians, instructional designers, people with accessibility background, and an EDI consultant as well. And so that work is still in progress and we're looking forward to hopefully releasing it in the next year. One thing I'm gonna end my presentation on is one of the big questions that I've had for this project is whether adapting existing OER is an effective way to diversify and improve educational resources or whether it would be better if we started from scratch. Like what's the value in taking a textbook with all the issues I've heard other people identify around working from a textbook and textbook with existing kind of structure and Western ways of knowing is it worthwhile to start from there rather than starting from scratch? So that's one of my big questions. I guess I'm a little taller. Thank you, everyone. I'm here to speak about, oh, sorry. You gotta do both, yeah. Okay, I got it. Good luck. Thank you. Sorry about this, everybody. So I'm here to talk to you about a fairly new project that's been going on in Massachusetts. This is called Rotell, as Steele referred to earlier. It's remixing open textbooks through an equity lens. And it's a collaboration among six Massachusetts public higher education institutions. Three of them are state universities and three of them are community colleges. And it's a U.S. federally funded project through their open textbook pilot. It's relatively unique, or it was at the time that we received this grant. And it is centering equity as a crucial part of the text that the faculty are either adapting or creating. The inclusivity that is important for all of our students to see themselves reflected in the work that's being shared by the faculty member. And accessibility, as have been referred to earlier. In addition, we put out proposals for the faculty amongst all those six institutions. We award stipends to the faculty after they've finished writing their work. And we have a support team that I'll talk about in a couple of minutes. And a lot of training, and with Rebus, their textbook success program, and an industry advisory council, which will take a look at the books after they've been created and see that they accurately reflect the kinds of needs that are out there in the industries in Massachusetts. The assessment part is just really beginning because we have fairly new materials to assess this semester. There are three phases of this particular project of professional development. As I mentioned with the Rebus textbook success program, a lot of writing, publishing support, and then the assessment team will come in later on. So it was really important that we take a look at what we're doing for improving student outcomes. I think that's really an important piece of this whole thing is where we're going next with the project are the students who are underserved and underrepresented feeling like their voices are heard in these texts. And if not, why not, what can we do to improve the text so that they are reflected in there? So one of the things that we talk to the faculty about is the open pedagogical approach and work with them on all of those pieces. The other parts, just ensuring scalability. We have a Massachusetts OER advisory council that's aware of all of the work that we're doing. We're hoping to eventually have this infused throughout all of the public higher education institutions in Massachusetts. And we're expecting a lot of cost savings as a result of this work. So we have a whole plethora of what we're calling end-to-end publishing expectations that are put forward by the Rotel advisory council and the publishing support team to the faculty. And I'm sorry, that graphic is a little bit small. Main points are the faculty attend this, I got to catch up with myself with my slides. Are you close on talking all of the stuff here? Okay, so the fact, we really are requiring that the faculty attend the textbook support project. We allowed faculty in the first round of those that were accepted with stipends to either choose to attend the TSP or to be self-directed. I will just say that was a mistake. They so love what they're doing and they're so passionate about it, they don't realize what they don't know. And so we've changed our mantra and now really require them to participate now that we're on to round three of these grant things. Takes a little while sometimes. But then as the faculty are writing, there are various local teams that are also assigned to these folks who are checking in with them as well as my team, which I'll talk a little bit more about in a second. And then what the publishing support team will do is work with them with their final products and get them uploaded into Pressbooks, which is the publishing software that we're using currently. And the important piece is to celebrate as each one of these gets done, have the institution, have the whole region, the Department of Higher Education representatives. All these people come to the institutions to celebrate this work that's being done so that we can really further engage with everybody on this work. So the publishing support team is the one that I am kind of coordinating, I guess, for want of a better word. I'm the faculty advisor to the Rotals project and I'm the person responsible for communicating with everybody. And that's a lot to do. And I sometimes will drop the ball and have to apologize, but we're all doing our best foot forward kind of thing as we can, but it's important to make sure that the faculty are aware of what the publishing support team might be doing, that the people who are on the local support team, which can include the librarians, the instructional designers, and the other folks that have been mentioned here already are well aware of what's happening with their faculty projects and where they are in the particular lineup of the publication project. We have two content editors. So for those of you who are into publishing, publishing content editors, you know what I'm talking about. They look for the level of the audience. They look for obvious typos for any kinds of like hyphenation problems that might have happened. I mean, really, as well as, you know, looking at the overall how the voice of the text carries forward and that it's consistent across its entirety. A lot of work. I have three minutes left. Okay, the media specialist goes through and does all the interactive elements, all those kinds of things that have been talked about already. The technical editor are really critical. Goes in, looks for the formatting of the entire thing and doing all of those kind of pieces and is the one who does the final upload up into Pressbooks. Then we go in and have a final review with a faculty member, go back through and make sure that all the little last minute problems have been identified. This is a lot of work. Just so you all know, we've started without having this team. So you can imagine what it was like in the beginning. And now I think we're a little bit more polished and it's working. And so we've created this PST showcase of decisions which I could click on, but I'm not really live, so I can't. But you can when the slides are up. So our books, I'm gonna fly through these. These are some of the earliest ones that we did with an example of an early English writing course that this particular faculty member used overweight bodies as a representation that people can identify with in their writing and the reading, writing, and success text and the children, family, schools, and communities. The most recent ones, and I'm sorry for this because a perva fixed my slide, but we're operating on a different slide deck, clearly. I'll be talking about Wednesday afternoon this introduction to cultural anthropology with a couple of faculty members and what's cool about this project is it's across the institutions. One of the faculty members is from a community college and the other is from a state university. And between, it's just, it's marvelous and they're so passionate about this. Another one that has recently come out but isn't published quite yet is the whole child and then social work and practice that I wanted to highlight because I know there's been lots of questions online lists about that kind of thing, that kind of topic. Lessons learned. Use project management software somehow, somewhere, please, to track your work. Otherwise it's a mess. And critically important, meet the faculty where they truly are. Not where they think they know they are but where you can listen carefully to what they're having to say and adjust accordingly and expect setbacks. Whether it's something happening with a project and the faculty member can't complete it, whether it's some other thing that happens along the way, please be kind and be generous with your time. And working conjunction with all of those stakeholders that we've been talking about, communicate. Please communicate. That's it. Thank you for turning this on. So we have a wealth of experience from our three panelists and I thank them for their time and their presentation. We have about 10 minutes left. I have some pre-prepared questions but I think your questions would be of more interest. Many of the things that they just discussed today, it's an iceberg that you've had the very tip of it and there's lots more to the surface. There will be lots more time this week to talk about them but we have 10 minutes now. We'd like to invite any of you that have a question that'd like to ask the panel to dive in deeper. This is your time. You can come up to this microphone and then I'll take the microphone and bring it up to them to answer. Please remember, we have 10 minutes and questions should end with the question mark, please. Well, before the question, thanks for the directory steal. I found out in it that St. Louis has adapted my World History textbook with H5P questions. So thanks for that. I guess, how the question, I don't know if it's for you, Aperva, but I do remember sort of I ran screaming from the room the first time. I tried to interact with Rivas because of the high bars that were in place already for, that I wasn't aware of being a subject matter expert on writing history stuff about accessibility and about DEI and some of the other things. And so I guess the question is how are we going to kind of get this message? And maybe it's not just for you. Two people who are trying to adapt and adopt and kind of remix stuff in their own little silos in their universities and stuff, that it might be a good idea to talk to an instructional designer. It might be a good idea to talk to an accessibility person. Thank you, Dan. As I've relayed this up, I think I would add that I noted every one of you talked about the value of a team. Dan's saying, hey, I'm a subject matter expert. There's a lot in this. How do I build and manage a team effectively? I've never done that before. Maybe that's a, is that okay? Add on to the question, okay. Thank you for your question. Congratulations on seeing the fruit of your OER being adapted in new ways. I think you said the word silo and I actually wanna start with the key is in always in giving someone a checklist or a number of things for them to be aware of. As we heard in today's keynote as well, it starts with connection. So how do you make sure that faculty members or people who are trying to do these innovative experiments with teaching and learning and using different kinds of materials, how can they connect with others in the institutional space or outside of it who have maybe done more research here, who know more about things like accessibility or trauma-informed pedagogy, equitable pedagogies. So start with the connecting and as I think all three of us have said, this type of work is far too much for us to take on alone. So we need to abandon the idea that we can undertake this as one human and really remember that human element in all of our workflows going forward and leverage the teams. I think the other answer could be in making sure the message is consistently reinforced no matter what part of the institution or other learning spaces they go to. So if they're going to the libraries, they're hearing from the librarians, remember to keep X, Y, Z in mind and these are the resources you have to support your work. If they're going to another person in the institution, hopefully they're hearing that same message and it is really the onus is on all of us, not on just one of us. And I'm gonna pass it to the other panelists. I know for the psychology adaptation project that I've been working on right now, when we first put out the grant, we hosted a webinar just to people to be able to show up here about the grant, what we were looking for. And then at the end we had a Google doc where we were like, if you are interested and you're looking for people to apply to this grant with, put your name in this Google doc, you can stay in the Zoom room and connect with each other. So that was a way that we were able for people that working at different institutions that didn't know each other to be able to connect and form a team to be able to apply for this grant. So that was one way that we supported people in making those connections for that project. And in addition, in our proposal file that we put out, we asked them who they plan to partner with and we will embellish that as part of the proposal process. So I do recommend that as a step to take. And then you find out where they are with their knowledge a little bit of open education because we asked them if they've already looked and been going through that discovery process that we talked about. And so it really helps a lot to put a little bit of a teaser in the application process itself. Thanks. Other questions from the room? I saw a hand up earlier. Yeah, great. Hi, my name's Shereen Hassan. I'm from Kwantlen Polytechnic University. We just recently published Intro to Criminology and that was funded by BC Campus in the spring. And now me and two other colleagues are going to work on an adaptation of a research methods in criminology and criminal justice. But I'm a little bit afraid of what you've said about how adaptations can actually be more challenging. So if you could maybe expand a little bit on what the challenges are with respect to adaptation compared to creating something from scratch because that had its own set of challenges as you can imagine. And then my next question is, will BC Campus be providing grants or do you see any grants in the future with respect to research methods in criminology? Thank you. Josie, I think we can start with you. I think so too. I pointed at Clint, my boss, because that would be the person to talk to about that. He wishes he was in a different session. So in terms of why adaptations can be more challenging, it's because you're kind of given this framework for something and maybe it works for what you want and maybe it doesn't. And it can take a lot, like editing takes work. And often that's what adaptation is, is editing and to be able to take someone else's words. Sometimes it's like voice challenges, like you want to say it differently and so you rewrite it anyways. With the introduction to psychology book, for example, there are entire chapters that just don't work for what the authors want it to be. Just the framework it's coming from, the research it's drawing from, the language it uses. When they're coming from an equity perspective, there's nothing there in the original book to work from. So they're kind of choosing chapters to start over or to pull from other books anyways. Often another challenge of adaptation, like sometimes adaptation is you're working with one book and that's the book you're making changes to. Sometimes adaptation is more like pulling from a bunch of different places. And so then you're taking multiple different authors' work and trying to get them to fit together in a unified way and that has its own challenge as well. In that last little piece you mentioned, when your copy editor goes to review that book, they are looking for a unified voice and feel to the whole text, right? Unless you on purpose put something into the introduction that tells the readers, the students, whoever else, why it has different voices and different chapters so that they can understand how that is happening. And there was one other point and I can't remember it, so I'll pass it on. If it comes back to you. I've linked to a worksheet in our slide deck that I'm gonna encourage you to look at because one of the biggest challenges that we've seen as Josie was describing, if you're adapting from multiple resources. Don't worry about it, Steve. You stumble across so many. So for instance, if you're doing an introduction to writing course, you might come across 600 textbooks that you're trying to choose from. So we have actually a set of prompts and primers for folks to look at before they start this search process. So it starts with a little prompt that says, if the ideal resource existed for you, how would you describe it? Based on this, what are some key search terms? And then we point to some databases where you can try to find different kinds of OER, not just text. And building some evaluation prompts. Like the editing prompts that Marilyn mentioned all the way to does it align with your course design? Does it align with your course description? Are there topics that are missing? Are you examining the resource for diversity and cultural relevance? So the discovery piece can be a challenge. I think the challenge can also arise when you're making the edits. Where do you draw the line? Where do I say this is finished and I'm happy with it? And this is that ideal resource that I described at the start. I think we all have the tendency to make it as good as it can be for the people that we're trying to serve and the people that we're trying to teach. So it's also reminding yourself that the horizon, that perfect point is gonna keep moving based on where you're standing. So remember that you can always make changes to this in the future, yeah. And back to me. One of the other things that I found them having trouble with is documenting the alternative images they need to have where they found those alternative images because you have to cite all of those. And also any other pieces of things that they brought in because it does get very complex when they're doing adaptations usually. It's not usually just one text they're adapting. They're finding other images they can use because of the equity issues and what they're trying to do for their own local students. So that's really important to keep track of, for them to keep track of. I wanna thank everybody for coming out. I wish we had more time for questions, we don't. If you'd like to see these slides, the link is very small but it's tinyurl.com slash adapt-o-e-g.