 Then I won't Focus on you all the time, but no no problem. I mean, do you think I mean is it your view? I mean obviously you're speaking for yourself Is it your view that Kim would ever give up? Nuclear weapons after all partly they're meant as a deterrent against Beijing as well one presumes I I Don't think so. I guess North Korea set very high condition for them to give up if us meet them requirements They may give up, but of course the condition they set very high Yes, and not necessarily us will accept it even they may ask a not necessary Agreements between two governments. They want to legislation passed by Congress That's something maybe very hard for us to do that. That's something they learn lesson from other countries Mr. Kim, do you want to talk talk to that question? I mean has mr. Trump made things Better by bringing mr. Kim in from the cold or a made it worse. Yes I think the approach present Trump took to have a direct deal with the North Korean leader was not bad at all because In previous negotiation for the last 30 years We dealt with North Korea for denuclearization process and there was working-level Negotiation and once there's agreement on the working level it goes up to the minister level and then it goes to the leadership and It never succeeded. So present Trump's approach so-called Top-down approach. It's not bad at all, but I think the timing was very wrong In in 2016 and 2017 there was unprecedented provocation on the part of North Korea in nuclear explosion and the bursting missile launch And there was strong sanctions regime was being built by international community by the end of 2017 So if the sanctions could work for another year without Winning you know too early then I think the US Must have been in a better position to have a good deal good negotiation with North Korea But what I'm saying is that the timing was too early and that's why the There was no progress in the negotiation and we lost sanctions region Which means we lost our leverage on North Korea President Trump is not known for his patience and his long-term thinking But miss are we do does does Japan looking at these developments? Does it feel? That the US is is there for Japan in the same way or Does Japan begin to feel a bit nervous? Am I yes, I think Japan has historically had a dilemma of being Getting too much drawn into US views and US relations in global Affairs and also getting abundance. So I think the basic trend kind of continues But I think the fear for getting abundance is a product. I think getting pronounced Is I mean is is Japan making outreaches in the region because of this? I do know Thank you. I Just it should work if you just told it It's on it's on I Just impact that but I don't think that's a starting point Japan has pursued values driven Effort to reach out the broader group of partners. It's not, you know Outright allies, but that high I think has been a constant policy In the last decade and a half. So I don't think I don't I don't think I would trace everything back to Policies to present Trump or the of course he has had a large impact on certain aspects And then just just to ask others to I mean I mean, it's not brand-new, but there is a kind of new Japanese nationalism under Mr.. Abe There's been more money spent on the self-defense forces Just I think it's a word that I guess it's in the Constitution So so that's what we have to call them But in the Japanese military and in the Japanese Navy Do you think I mean is is is that making others in the region nervous given the past? I mean, I remember this terrible phrase of Lee Kuan Yew When when Japan wanted to do did do peacekeeping in Cambodia and Lee said It's like giving liqueur chocolates to an alcoholic. It's not very nice, but was at the time very funny That's very kind. I think that might be a question. That's probably better answered by my colleagues, okay But from my perspective, I don't think Japan has really gone over the board to When it's revised the constitutional interpretation and I would say it upgraded some of the activities that Japan Japanese forces could do in peace and stability contingencies those are I Would say very limited change and I think there is a legitimate academic debate among experts Whether this is something that puts a stamp on something that's already going on or whether they'll do is actually represent the fundamental break In our culture and actual policy, right, right? Others anyone Doug On the question is Japan an unwelcome guest in the region I think for all practical and practical purposes Japan has passed that of being an unwelcome But in Korea, it's a different case as we've discussed just a moment ago and the Coincidence of mr. Abe being an office and Trump taking a strong anti-China policy has prop probably bought Tokyo and Washington more closely together than in a long time and where Trump sets a Tone that the Japanese take comfort from because someone is standing up to their big rival in Asia At the same time Abe has been hyperactive in Generating Japanese diplomacy so that there's Japanese competition for railway building in Indonesia and Thailand and India With China there's a sense that Japan really is willing to put its money where its mouth is under mr. Abe So it's been a pretty good coordination, right Mr. Kim it is alarming to Korean people Especially if prime minister Abe would like to revise the Constitution to to fight a war Then it would be quite alarming to to South Korean people and coupled with other historical disputes these Gives good excuse For the people who'd like to bring about some anti-Japanese sentiment in Korea to use them For the domestic purpose, so I guess that's what what it happens now between Korea and Japan Yeah, and it's true It's gotten quite ugly, but we see this in Europe too. I have to say the same sort of same sort of politics Mr. Chow, how does China look at Japan? I mean, do you do you see Japan as in as in the way I don't think so China feel, you know Because couple years ago the first time China GDP took over Japan That's maybe five six years ago now is almost double for a number of GDP so For some Chinese they live over Confident in term of dealing with Japan, but now I guess they keep a little cool down they know Their weakness I mean Chinese weakness although they have a large GDP because so many Chinese are very to Japan know they are Manufacturer is they have a good quality then better than in China They they're not most Chinese understand that so now they have a more balanced attitude to Japan particularly in past two Maybe two years the relation between Japan and China get a improve for example recently 70 anniversary of people's repatriation of people's Republic of China Premier and pay make a contribution also say some Chinese words. They get a very positive response in China probably next year The Xi Jinping will have a state visit to to Japan. So Yes, in some way there's Exist the competition in term of Make investments in Southeast Asia, but at the same time as they started to cooperation They have some agreement to targeting third country Make a joint and make investments in Frustructure I think that's good idea good sign for coordination not only just try to You win you lose such kind of things. Yes Kevin Rudd yesterday talked about how China has 14 neighbors that they have to deal with And none of them wants to be an ally of China China has to deal with them all individually under the Circumstances of high-pressure relations with Washington It's no surprise that Japan and China would start to improve relations it suits Japanese purposes of other major But for China it's to break the break out of isolation to make sure they're not fighting on all fronts at one time So it's a understandable phenomenon. It's a very good point because what I get a little tired of people in you Washington say oh, well, you know, we have allies and China has no allies like somehow China's my friends But that's not really the point China has Countries that depend on China whether they're allies or not. They're not exactly free-floating Actors so before I go to the audience. I have one Maybe odd question provocative question As Doug you said when Presidents say words and don't back them up. It creates uncertainty and problems Xi Jinping has been very outspoken About China 2050 about lots of things So in a way, I just want to ask all of you What do you think China really wants? I mean, what are the limit? Are there limits to what China wants? Or is this still unclear or shall we take Xi's words as a kind of Programmatic statement as opposed to an aspirational one Mr. Kim, do you want to tackle that? No, you don't want to deal with it Just to start the discussion. I expect help to hear from you on this the Xi Jinping's practice has been to set big rhetorical targets and then in subsequent iterations sort of rain them in He went to the conference building conference called SICA the South Korean friends did a lot to save us from a Motion being passed by a lot of countries friendly to the US that would have been highly critical of America China was very ambitious of that at the second iteration of that conference. They reigned their ambitions in a lot Another thing is the famous Belt and Road Initiative a lot of rhetoric Tremendous amount of money went out on the first rush and then people started to think again There was some criticism externally, but a lot of criticism internally and in this latest Summit of the Belt and Road Initiative Xi Jinping says we have to stop painting with big brush strokes and start using a Chinese fine calligraphy and which means rules more control and Things do change and so I think you shouldn't take every big programmatic statement at face value Much as you would not for most politicians in the West Miss I do you want to respond Yes Before I come to the question, I mean may I just take a little about your half a step back I just wanted to Emphasize that I can fully understand historical sensitivities in the region But I think it would be actually wrong to interpret the recent change in constitution interpretation as a sign That Japan will now go fight a war anywhere globally and that goes for collective self-defense and that goes for collective security too Japan is not going to you know fight a war with you in the Middle East tomorrow So, you know not over expectations should be No, no expectations should not be held too high on that round either so without you know, they think China what China wants I think can be Personal view and informed views. They can't change. Yes I mean you can transform as situations conditions change Chinese people look to me as a very pragmatic Mr. Ted, do you want to respond at all? Yeah, I guess the John in the city in the panel this morning he Yesterday to Describe the fact a very interesting fact is also today. I chatted with him he he's a Very interesting only two major countries never happened in rhythm of history never happened system collapse United States and the Britain, but Only in these two countries now popular them prevailed it be 400 years ago is a so-called growing Revolution after that the system almost no fundamental change, but What I tried to say is a so-called national memory. I guess play some low in shaping the Future direction back to the topic you ask the Chinese government or particularly top leaders try use these Memory national memory as they say we we don't we want to take away Humiliation history in past 100 years Want to China to be Revaluate become one large power Respected by a rest of the world. I guess that's probably is is the obvious they go but all I Will say in past two or three years or maybe several years in some way little over rich In in in many ways, but you see at the one hand China claim It is still one largest Developing economy at the same time you spend so much Resource effort overseas you shouldn't make a balance between overseas effort and a domestic Live hope that that's something as a Doll point out because doll is a China expert to know I have to say in past one or two years That's maybe positive side of Donald Trump of a pressure yes the tone of Chinese leader has been soft Lot they never say something China move to the center of a word Arena never say that but that's I think it's good good sign for China to keep The modest in Chinese way. Yes, or you know, I mean to become again as done suggested a little more modest But it's it's I mean what it intrigues me is just it's it's what you say and also China will not be Backward again. I think that's part of it, right? I mean I'm very struck by this. It's also we had you know, one of the great cliches now is decoupling But it is really fascinating to see China developing its own internet its own Amazon its own Facebook its own we chat, I mean and and and you know even with social crime credit just creating a Chinese world where the outside world exists, but it's it's Filtered put it that way. I mean, that's the sort of most neutral way of Putting it and and the result is going I think to be fascinating. I'm very eager to see What's going to happen, but I hope I don't say the wrong thing and get denied a train ticket