 Eluyah, we are still energized, inspired, and waiting for the next session. Okay, I would like to acknowledge a very special group of guests we have here. In the morning when we acknowledged them, the pastor was not here to shake their hand, so we're just welcoming those who we had, in the morning we had three guests who are non-adventists and they had come with us. Pastor would like to welcome you to Nairobi Central in a special way. So if you could just lift up your hand one more time, or they left at lunchtime, oh yes, another hand, thank you, and welcome to Nairobi Central, visitors, join us, get in touch so you know the next events we have for AYP that can be a blessing to you because we are blessed by your presence. I'd like to invite you to this afternoon's session, Faithful Public Service, and we have our panelists already. I will introduce the moderator of the session, and then he's going to introduce these giant professionals who've served the public service, the mentored, they've done everything, and they are going strong. I was very humbled that they all arrived well well well in good time before their time was here, so they're still going strong, and we want to learn the secrets of serving for many many years and still going strong. So allow me to invite to introduce Brother Steve Ngolo. Brother Steve is an accomplished tax professional, he works as a revenue officer working as a systems administrator in the commissioners office, customs and border control department at the Kenya Revenue Authority. He's responsible for tax law regulations and enforcement specifically within the ESC. His area of specialization is the World Trade Organization Agreements and World Customs Organization Guidelines. Steve is an accomplished speaker in both public and private forums. He is a speaker and a coach. He works with teens mentoring teens, a program on development of skills, of life skills. Steve holds a bachelor's degree from the University of Nairobi. He's a postgraduate diploma in tax and customs administration from the Kenya School of Revenue Administration, and he also holds an MSc in finance from JKU Art. Currently he's finalizing on his MBA. He is married to Belangolo and they have two children, Hawi and Mo. He is a member in good standing of Nairobi Central SDA Church. So I'd like to welcome Steve. Steve, please introduce this giant professionals and take it up from there. Enjoy the session. So much. Great. Thank you so much the chair and the convener of this great meeting that you're having today. Ladies and gentlemen, allow me to greet you all. Good afternoon. Good afternoon. Welcome to this session. It's a session that I want to believe we are going to gain much just like we've gained in other sessions. If you look at the panelists seated here with me are seasoned public servants who have got great experiences and they are so much willing to share with us today. And so allow me to welcome you in a big way and a great way to this afternoon session where we are looking at faithful public service. That is going to be our main main area of concentration. And when you're talking about public service, we are looking at service that is rendered in the public interest, intended to address specific needs pertaining to the aggregate members of a community. Mostly we when we talk of public service, we are looking at a governmental employment body, several service and how we offer it. And so we are going to delve much into it and just find more. How can we honor God in such? And so our focus today is going to be honoring God with our professions. Excellent in public service and as a mission ground and parenting or mentoring faithful professionals. So yes, up here I have a team of mentors who are going to do us great justice. Allow me to reflect us into the verse that we are looking at today. Colossians chapter 3 verse number 23 to 24, the word of God says, whatever you do, whatever you do, whatever kind of work you are doing, work heartily with all your heart and all the different ways that plays out in scripture with Christ. And not just with Christ, but with Christ like character, with honesty, with diligence, with integrity, with humility. And so work heartily as for the Lord and not for men. And so whatever we are, all admonishes us from the book of Colossians that whatever we find to do, do it like you are doing it and to God and not unto men. Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the Young Professionals Convention. I will be your host. My name is Steven Golo. I'm a member of this church. I'm married. I have two children like it has been mentioned. And we thank God that we can have this convention going on today. I know there are so many people that maybe knows me and I know and there are those that we invited. My sister Linda is here who is HR professional and of course myriads of friends that are also here with me and with us today. So allow me in a special way to introduce our panelists that we are having this afternoon. Now from Calvary Church, the conveners brought us a very powerful speaker and a professional who is a professor of genetics, PhD from the University of Edinburgh in Scotland, way back in 1993. She's dynamic scholar, trainer, manager who is widely published in our area of medical genetics and more recently, bioethics. Her current focus, ladies and gentlemen, is application of research findings and advances in science for the promotion and protection of human rights. Our panelists today to my right has worked in various public and private research institutions and universities and is currently a commissioner with the Kenya National Commission on Human Rights. She previously served as the vice chancellor of Ambreff International University. Prior to that she was the deputy vice chancellor in charge of planning, research and development at the University of Kabyanga or Kabyanga University. Having been the director, Institute of Tropical Medicine and Infectious Diseases at the Jomo Kenyatta University of Agriculture and Technology, in addition she has been involved in many international and national government activities in various agencies, institutions and committees and of course task forces. In 2001, the president of the Republic of Kenya awarded this mother of two, other children with the elder of the owner of the burning spear, what we call EBS, in recognition for her service to the nation. She has a personal motto, what's worth doing is worth doing well. Ladies and gentlemen, put your hands together for Professor Marion Wanjiku Nutugi as Santé Sanna. Before I introduce my next panelist, Prof, there's a book you've co-authored with Justice Lenaola that is the judge of the Supreme Court addressing ethical issues in law and medicine. That is looking at legal issues in the medical industry and how some of them raise ethical questions. Would you mind telling us a little about this book before I introduce my next panelist? Thank you very much. The kind introduction. Yes, this is one of the books that I have been involved in writing. Ethics is what is right, what is acceptable, what is in a particular community. Ethics is dynamic. It differs from one place to the other. For example, the LGBTQ issue that we are dealing with is an ethical issue. FGM is an ethical issue. From one community to another, it differs what is right or wrong. The law is simply what is stated and is written. And there is a convergence, especially in medicine, in practice of medicine, for example, issues where doctors ask you, can we take your patient to ICU? It's a terminally ill patient. If we keep them in ICU, we'll buy maybe another two weeks. If we leave them on the ward bed, it will be probably tomorrow. That's an ethical question. There is also the law. It also deals with medical research where we keep on hearing that Africans in low-income countries, people there are vulnerable. That is where drugs are tested. That is where the drugs that are not accepted elsewhere are sold. That's an ethical question. So that's what we wrote about. Thank you. Thank you. That's a book, a copy of the book up there and you can get it at Textbook Center. Great. The book is available on the shelves. And it's not science. It's easily written, you'll understand. Great. Great. Thank you so much. Actually, I've been wondering where law and medicine comes in, but I think as we delve into the discussion more, we'll find much. Thank you so much, Professor Marion. Please, a round of applause one more time. Santesana. To my left is one face that I know is quite familiar with most of you. Members of this church is a member of this church, of course, an elder here. And I know those who are not members, you may have or you must have seen him even in the media and everywhere else. From Gesusu Primary School, deep down Kisi, right? You call it Gesusu Ward in Kisi County to the world. That is my guest to my left. His education background touches on the University of Nairobi, Royal College of Physicians in UK, Edinburgh University. I think that's where they met with the prof here. University of London, University of Bombay, University of New Delhi, Bugema Missionary College and amongst many other. And that qualifies him to be a great scholar in the Republic of Kenya. He's a medical doctor of health, a lecturer professor at the University of Nairobi. In 1992 to 1997, he was appointed permanent representative, Kenya Mission to the United Nations Environmental Program, where he defended the establishment, where he defended the permanent location of UNEP in Nairobi. At the national level, he ensured the establishment of National Environmental Management Authority, what we call NEMA, to help coordinate, supervise the implementations of limited environmental laws in the country to avoid taking conflicting actions on various environmental matters. Our guest today, ladies and gentlemen, is also a seasoned politician. He's a four-time elected member, not nominated, elected member of parliament, a three-time MP for Nyariba Rimasaba, constituency and Kisi County as a senator from the year 2017 to 2022. He got many ministerial appointments. He has served as the Minister of Foreign Affairs in March 2012 to 2013, where he supervised the implementation of the Kenya Foreign Police in general and strengthened and promoted bilateral, multilateral and international political, economic and other relations. He served as a Minister for Education 2008 to 2012, where he spearheaded, listen to this, the introduction of free secondary school education system. He also served as the Minister for Health in the year 2001 to 2002, and here he developed the level five hospitals in the country. In the year 1997 to 2001, he served as the Minister for Local Government. And in that portfolio, he reorganized the local government operations. When, before most of us or some of you were born, he also served as the Minister for Technical Training and Applied Technology, and that's where he did set up the ministry from this crutch. His love for God is immeasurable. He is married and I've seen Mrs. Professor in the Congregation. Now, ladies and gentlemen, allow me, and mommy's at the back. Yes, she's at the back. And I'm just wave now that you're there. Thank you so much. That is Mrs. Ongeri. Please give a round of applause. Thank you so much. Ladies and gentlemen, put your hands together for our guest today, Honorable Ambassador Professor Samson Kegengu Ongeri. Prof, you have so many titles, so many, and you have so many honors, some of which includes member of the Royal College of Physicians. You have a medical pin from the IAF, that is International Association of Athletics Federation. You are given the order of the elder of the Golden Heart, EGH. You have the elder of the order of the burning spear, EBS, dating back to 1984. You are member of the Serena Peace Talk, that is in 2008 to date. And again, you are the Chairman of Ongeri Foundation. These honors, Prof, which one is most significant and still gives you great the quite a million? Well, I think the most important aspect of it, thank you for the introduction. I think what is behind all these achievements is the spirit to work and the spirit to achieve and achieve beyond all means, beyond the means. And behind it lies the humility, the integrity, the sense of purpose and direction and what you want to achieve and how you want that to take direction for the common good of society. I think I can simply summarize all those areas into one element, service to humanity and service to God as a penultimate price that all of us must pay. Thank you. Wow, please a round of applause for Prof. Thank you. Thank you so much, Prof. And Professor Ongeri and Professor Mutugi, we are so much humble to have you here. We just want to delve straight into our panel discussion. And I want to promise you it's going to be an interesting one, because like I told you, I have grey-haired people full of wisdom up here. Let me start with you, Prof. Ongeri. History has it that you are noticed by the second president of the public of Kenya, President Daniel Moy, when you are part of the organizing committee for the 1987 All African Games. Let me ask you, I have three questions on this. How did you put yourself or place yourself to be noticed by the president? Let me put it this way simply that the first recognition by President Moy came in 1960 when he was the parliamentary secretary for education. And I was then at the University of Delhi and I was a student leader and I came to Kenya leading the Kenya delegation because I was the president of Kenya Students Association. I was also the president of the Secretary General of the All African Students Association in India. And we were in that inaugural flight and we went to see him. One of the things we demanded from him was that we wanted to see him say Jomo Kenyatta at Kapenguria and argue for his release. That's the first time you notice me. The second time you notice me is 1966 after I qualified as a Doctor of Medicine and Doctor of Bachelor of Surgery and Bachelor of Medicine from Bombay University and had come to Nairobi and I was an intern and I was on call at the casualty in Kenyatta National Hospital. His driver had an accident and he brought him to casualty and he came and he found me in attendance and I attended to him and he was very pleased. Later on he asked me, you are a young African doctor. Can you be gracious enough to also look after my family? A request which I graciously accepted and I did that for quite a number of years. So 1987 was the culmination of that recognition because then I had served as the chairman of Kenya Athletics Association in Kenya who were instrumental to developing the talent of all young athletes and professionals, the likes of Charles Sassati, Nhamau, Ben Chippcho, all this group and Henry who had conquered the world and one of the things I did was to be able to build the current Nyao stadium was built by Curtis of Kenya three years under my chairmanship and then we went with him to China in 1982, 83, 84. We managed to be able to get Kasarani stadium. So 1987 was a culmination of many things that are served in athletics. I was one of his members in the family and I was already a very distinguished Kenyan doctor in the profession and therefore I was the natural choice for organizing the All African Games in 1987 which was the fourth edition here in Nairobi. I love the beats being a natural choice. You know Prof has brought us back when he was an intern so it's very important as a young professional to get yourself at a position where you become a natural choice. Okay I want you to get that on Professor Mutugi. Let me just bring you in. One life functions of the Kenya National Human Rights and Equality Commission where you serve is to promote the protection and the observance of human rights especially in public and private institutions. As a young lady bring in your early years in public service when you're making debut at public service what were some of the challenges and should we take it natural to face challenges especially the young ladies here the young professionals. Thank you very much. I'll start where my good professor he's my father. Yes. Mrs. Ongeri went to school with my mother she's my mom. Okay. So I am privileged to be sitting with my parents here. I'll start where he left. You must be the natural choice. You ought to put your cards on the table so that you are well known and well known means that it is clear what you can and what you cannot do. I repeat it must be clear what you can and cannot do. So when you look at being a young woman what comes to your mind a sexual harassment sexual advances my take is that every girl wants to be admired. It is actually abnormal if nobody looks at you and turns your head you wonder what is wrong with me but when it goes beyond there maybe it can go into sexual harassment. Yes I have faced sexual harassment my very first sexual harassment was when I applied for my first job and I got the job fair and square I got a call come for your letter so I went in and I met this man who sat on the panel and he said you know I was on the panel I really really push for you now I want you he's straight straight now I want you and me to go and celebrate. So I looked at him I was a young girl I think I was 20 something I looked at him at first he didn't click what he was saying he says yes I want us to go to a nice hotel and with a glass of wine celebrate I looked at him and I said you know I want to I want this job but I want to get it knowing that I deserve it not because you talked on my behalf I took the letter I put it on his desk I walked out I did not take that job I did not go back the Lord gave me another better job the second case of sexual harassment is when I was doing my PhD in the University of Edinburgh and my supervisor kept on making sly remarks I was wiser then so I could understand what he was saying and I kept on avoiding until one day he figured out I'm a bit stupid so he needs to put it clearly I was working in a lab and I was working with some delicate things some agarose gel if you know what that is and I was holding it in my hand in a tray he came and says look here Marion if you want your PhD hard enough you are going to talk to me nicely I looked at the gel I wanted to throw it in his face by God's grace I threw it on the floor and I walked out and I told him I don't want that PhD you can keep it I went home and I wondered what did I do the following day I went to work as if nothing had happened to the lab and the boss in the institution called me and he said come let's go and have tea it was an old umseh he says Marion don't worry about that man he's a sexist treat him like a pest that he is throughout my life right now I am 64 I'm widowed you didn't believe people still make passes at me but I'm wiser I'm wiser I don't do such stupid things anymore some of them I look in their face I say what are you sure and they get embarrassed others I laugh in their face and I say ha ha ha you must be joking there must be young girls who you can go out with just leave me alone you know I have different strategies for dealing with it but yes you will find these things and they will happen but to me as Propheter said you must be you must be clear people must be clear from the word go what you can and what you cannot do they will try because men like trying they will try but they must be clear what you can and what you cannot do yeah I think I think I think another thing even ladies keep trying okay so when when you're protected also not in our generation maybe this one so of course it's possible to be aggressive in a potifah's house especially the promotions and all that there are always temptations that come away but like Proph is saying she has grown wiser you also we need to be wiser even as we move on um let me let me get to um professor Ungeri Proph at one point um you serve this republic as a minister for technical training and applied technology that was in 1988 to 1992 and the champion duakali sector is duakali only meant for self employment um or is it there I mean is there a place for the artisans in public service maybe you tie it down with this question is it okay to venture into technical trades once you're once you're a public servant thank you very much Steve a very interesting question and I shall intend to give an interesting answer during 1988 you remember that was immediately after the all africa games when I ventured into politics and I won and I was appointed to a ministry which has had never been created in this country at that time and I remember going to jogohouse being with a desk with the late my permanent secretary hereby and the brief from the president was very clear that we needed to create employment opportunities for our young people for our generation and therefore we need to run away from the vertical type of education from the primary kcp copy at that time kcp now to the secondary to the university and those who fall by the wayside have nowhere to go so our three responsibilities to cut out the first responsibility is first of all to create the structure and the policy of that ministry so I then ventured to bring into parliament a sectional paper number one of 1988 to be able to articulate what the vocational and technical training issue should be that was one and I successfully carried it out to through parliament and became a policy for that country now what did the policy entail that we now were arguing that we must have a curriculum before then they were just getting certificates that you are not a son or you are a certificate or without any certification whatsoever so I brought in the framework of qualification for certification or vocational and technical training which meant literally sitting down and developing the curriculum which would then fit at various levels of educational standards and that started with the youth polytechnics where you will get a simple certification then you go the middle level colleges at that time there were seven technical training institutes that have been established on a runway basis we now formalize them to be run by the government and therefore we develop a second tier level of technical training institutes where you would get a diploma and then of course the national polytechnics that time was only in Nairobi which is now the Polytechnic University of Nairobi we also develop the curriculum to be able to venture into that place and those who qualify from youth polytechnic will also have the opportunity to go vertically to a middle level technical training institutes then finally to a national polytechnic and if need be we need to establish the technical universities that's how Moe LRA came up as part of the technical university Poani Technical University and Nairobi Polytechnic now that we have here at the university the one just next to the railway station so I was able to put into place all those the third element that pushed me into this ministry was that that time the so-called Bretton Wood institutions the World Bank the IMF had frozen aid to Kenya because they wanted us to follow a particular pattern that they had established and President Moe at that time said nothing doing we need to create some opportunities for young people to grow and to nudge at their interests so what was then the Joakali became the highest employer when the Bretton Wood institutions withdrew their aid to Kenya Joakali was able to employ 40 percent and I didn't leave it there I said it's no good being a Joakali an artisan then we must be able to access you to credit so that you can be able to start your own business and therefore later on it was interesting in 1984 before then I was the chairman of Kenyanya US State appointed as a chairman because having been a minister for technical training and this is what it meant that you have to do skill upgrading for the young people those who have a certificate but they don't have the skills that they can be able to venture into private practice or set up their own micro enterprises therefore you needed to give them that skill upgrading so I took then what was called the DIT director of industrial training in Nairobi which was under the ministry of labor it was brought under my ministry of technical training and applied technology and we were able to now give skills to all the artisans the diploma holders and the higher diploma holders and that's how we drove some of these investors from Yashara street from Moy Street to industrial area so they were able before then it was a taboo to say that you're in Uakali it now became fashionable for all civil servants to say after I've retired that I'm going to do my Uakali business so we sanitized Uakali from a relegated profession to a very admirable profession and today I can say every one of us is in Uakali yeah and so we are not as young professionals what prof is trying to bring about is that we are not sitting pretty to wait for a white college job we can always find something to do and if we have siblings who have not made it to the university or where to put them in a place where they can get into a tie and get into an office we can empower them through the technical colleges that were set up I'm proud in the reign of Professor Ongeri thank you so much prof let me let me come to Professor Marion before I ask you this question please you can put your questions down in a paper I'll give you time to belt them out for the panelists to answer the conveners you'll guide me on time because I think we have been robbed a lot of time anyway all right prof Professor Marion Mutugi you're both PhD olders I'm not yet there but now that I'm seated with you I think I'm the third one here and if I may ask how is education up to PhD level an enabler to excellence in public service and with with with the young professionals that you're seeing here the education null qualifications intact and in place how should one prepare for excellence in public service physically mentally and even spiritually thank you very much I have taught in universities for over 20 years and so but having said that a PhD in my view is not about content having done one myself and having supervised more than 30 PhD students I believe that a PhD is about resilience hard work patience perseverance humility those soft skills it's not about content it's about character development because a PhD drives you to the wall until you wonder whether it's worth it and so yes a PhD is important very particularly if you are in particular in areas that they require it for career progression in academia you are not an academic until you have a PhD so it depends what area you are in but just remember that a PhD is about character development where you have worked so hard but people look at you in the face and tell you this is rubbish and you have to swallow humble pie and go and redo it and write rewrite what you had written the way you had written it before and they had said rubbish before you repeat so that's my view and in terms of enabling in public as an enabler I think that title opens doors it does open doors but as young professionals I think what is important preparation for public or even private service is about knowing where you want to go we have heard about strategic planning do you have a personal strategic plan how many of you have a personal strategic plan so you are just in a float mood because you have worked on organizational strategic plans a strategic plan shows you where you want to go and how to get there so if you do not know in your career where you want to go then any road will take you there for example if you if you record in the previous panel excellent panel that was here they talked about what is your purpose in life what do you want to achieve at the end of the day what would you want to have had in your hand if it's money please don't go to public service unless you want to steal you won't get it there so you can get the money in the private sector you can get the money in business but you will not get it in the public service so you need to know what you want in life for example you need to ask yourself at the end of the day economically where do I want to be assuming the end of day is the 70 years that are set in the bible you may go beyond it's fine but in terms of what do you want do you want a mortgage free house one do you want yours and one for each of your five children what do you really want to get at the end of the day or are you in a rat race where you just keep on getting more and more and more and you don't have an end point in terms of money how much money do you want how much money is enough now I may be talking theoretically but we had this conversation with my late husband very early in life and we figured out how much we would want we would want a house which is ours we decided we maybe want another one where we can get rent from when we grow old and we decided if god gave us children they could get these things but we are not going to work for these children we are not going to work for these children we're going to educate them we are going to give them food we are going to give them clothing but we are not going to work for them please we are not bad people but we decided our focus was not to get property for our children it was to give them and enable them as much as we can but we were not going to break our backs to buy them a house to buy them one this one and that one and our life has been fairly comfortable we don't have much but we have enough and our children have gone to school and they're still going to school as long as you want to study we will pay so have your own strategic plan how much is enough at the end of the day when can you say fine i've accomplished it i am i have accomplished what i said to do what have you said to do if you do not have your own strategic plan and the bible says present your plans before the lord and you bring them to pass so if you have no plan what are you presenting to god so i challenge you to think through your personal strategic plan and in that personal strategic plan one of the most important considerations in my view is a spouse other than god the wife or the husband you have will influence your life most so please in your strategic plan also put qualifications for the wife or the husband you are looking for because they are really really going to influence your life for or against your goals for or against the kingdom of heaven have your personal strategic plan it's yours if you don't like it you can change it it's yours thank you thank you please please let's let's clap for prof you know such a little bit especially the bit of you're not going to work for your children prof have you worked for your children in a minute for children and my wife leaves she's here we agreed that they will educate them and after that they will be on their own yes and that's the right attitude there you are because because because you cannot expect you as a parent to nurture your children up to their adulthood you educate them the university then they come hanging around you looking for more help and that's why god says go and multiply thank you thank you so much pro let's say it's go and multiply wow all right young professionals we are young professionals i hope they are no children expecting their parents to be working for them now here and of importance of course the spouse the wife of your youth the husband of your youth what are the strategic plans that you're having as early as now let me let me come to uh pro thank you so much professor marion let me come to professor on gary in the public service you have served in various ministries quite a lot foreign affairs education health local government and of course the technical training and applied technology that you mentioned what are some of the achievements um that we can point out as young people these people seated here that that one was done by professor on gary who is an adventist what are some of these achievements that we can point at and is there a significant way that you represented your search i mean your church in such high-profile officers in the land let me say this steve yes if i were to enumerate what i was able to achieve i don't think we'll be able to be here until tomorrow morning in three minutes and i don't intend to i don't intend to do that but one thing that sticks out quite clearly in my mind is when president moey was giving out land and then he asked me because now the relationship was quite close i would like to have a a church that can develop a university yes and be able to allow that university to take on the local population even though they are from other churches and it quickly came to my mind and at that time the the division was looking for land for the university that's how baraton university was born some of you might have been beneficiary out of that one secondly when i was the minister for health we had a crisis in this country just like we had a crisis of coveted 19 and there was a hiv pandemic it came and it was very difficult to be able to manage people were perishing but then i was the minister for health and then the drugs were completely out of reach because they were intellectual property they were patented drugs i was able to persuade the president because i realized in the d wto world trade organization uh section six of that uh regulation states that if a country is an in emergency you can be able to order for what you call generic drugs and for us to be that kind of state of emergency i requested the president to convene a session of parliament in mombasa it was going away to jibouti and i told him the nearest place you can come to is mombasa so the whole parliament was summoned to mombasa we passed on that uh regulation that gave me the opportunity to bring in the generic drugs which were a thousand dollars at that time for treatment and i brought them down to below two hundred and fifty dollars so that's one significant area it brought a lot of change and the preference rate of hiv eight which was between uh 20 to 30 percent depending where you are from in kenya i was able to bring it down to below 10 percent today it stands at about five percent that is the program that i did as the minister for local government one of the things i noticed that the one i did i had the privilege and the authority to i say you can be given a land for doing this and that as a minister for local government who are then using what we used to call cap 265 of the local government act and most of the churches in narobi mombasa kisumu uh kisi in el red lift valley and naku who are born they are beneficiary of that position i held it's not only the 70 days this many people i give the roads but i give to other churches as the minister for health when there was an unopportunity during this hiv pandemic i was able to distribute ambulances and therefore kinube became a beneficiary of the the ambulance and kappa swar kappa swar which is a ic church they became beneficiaries as the minister for foreign affairs i was able to know minister for education you know all this e-learning that you are now techno savvy today started i am the one who instituted the e-learning from grade two to grade seven and from form one to form two and set up the e-calculum uh through k i c d that time and we were able to develop those materials and we were able to move because at that time the school learning through kbc was very disjointed and you could not hear it was breaking up so for the first time at the k i c d i was able to set up a digital transmission transmission station where the school learning was being transmitted and therefore the e-learning or e-materials were being developed there that's why you have the curriculum today and and i think that went very far away when at the minister of education you i took over this was the nine 2008 and 2000 and uh and uh and and and 11 i took over when we had post-election violence our schools were in chaos you remember students were banning dormitories were banning all the buildings and everything everywhere and it's the first time i introduced what we call peace education in the curriculum and you remember when that was introduced there was some relative calmness in the schools and people settled down i was also able to introduce in the curriculum and also as a policy the nomadic education the marginalized groups we are seeing these problems today here and at that time as as as a ambassador for unip united nation's environmental program in 1992 to 1997 i negotiated all the conventions and i'm glad your your conference is a convention let me tell you what the convention means that where people come together and they must agree on a set of rules and things that must happen in a civilized society therefore i was able to negotiate the framework on climate change the one which is giving us headache now and i was also the president of the multilateral fund which was then looking at the ozone layer and the effects of ozone layer on the on the land and on the climate i also i was able to negotiate the biodiversity convention on all the biodiversity and the richness in that biodiversity i negotiated the convention on this certification and with particularity with africa and also on prior informed consent in habitat as an ambassador for un habitat the new urban agenda the one which we are now using here for spatial planning and development the one which gives prosperity and leave no one behind the one which brings in a new paradigm shift in how to handle the urban congregation that you don't set up slums instead of setting up slums you set up centers that are both economically active with all the services that are available within that zone and the value of land is so enhanced so as i said if i continue enumerating but the best thing i must say the best of all of it all when i was appointed to be a member of the panel of fish peace talks in serena this experience i think i've told pastor roti they know about it pastor nyaga and many others we went to county hall the first meeting with kofi anon the international media was there everybody was there eminent persons president kikwete president from towns and any the other one would pass on who are there and we wanted to start the meetings under normal rules un meetings they never started prayers and so they started the meeting the microphones failed they went for the second round wanted to start the meeting the microphone failed then i got that courage i said let's on let's pray they said okay you come and pray i stepped forward and i took the microphone and prayed and the miracle here i don't know where the verse came from second chronicles seven verse 14 if my people who are called by my name humble themselves seek my face and repent i recited the whole verse and the microphones were free they brought they brought in a muslim he had a free microphone and the microphones were on and the meeting started from then on all those sessions we had in serena here they were preceded by a prayer you know one thing um my take home here is that if you are in a position of influence please represent jesus there yes and that is honestly that is what prof is saying here when he's given an opportunity for land he thinks of an adventist university when he's and and there is a confession that was given by president kibaki sometimes back yes that he knows sda because of professor samungeri who would not attend cabinet meetings on a saturday that's that's correct yeah and that was it and so in every area of influence please represent jesus to the highest please let's give a round of applause again thank you i'm running short of time but i want us to take the next two questions uh proof unless advised otherwise by the conveners or should we say until the audience starts looking at us badly all right i'll take the last two questions our elder jeff is communicating i'm soon getting the signal now to professor marion a few of your research projects uh that was going through your document by the way you can google the cv for these two amazing people even summarizing it is a problem but very deep and wealthy and a few of the research projects you've done include support for young women affected by gender based violence care and support scaling up art use of adherence you have also done a research project on capacity building for forensics in respect to sexual violence genetic profiling of sex offenders the k u at that one you also did now tell us something about gender violence in public service what form or what forms do gender violence take is it only sexual harassment or are there other forms of gender violence please thank you very much um some of the work that you have quoted in 1999 we lost a very close family member from HIV and AIDS and i saw how that loss devastated our family because there was a lot of stigma associated with it we could not even say what happened or what she died of and uh as the good professor has told us ARVs were not available then so being positive was a death sentence unfortunately the church also stigmatized those who are positive and so i set up a community-based organization in my village and it was women led and among the things it did was all it did was community education we got a little money from some donors here and there but we went and talked about HIV and AIDS in the village interestingly you know how it is easy to talk especially i'm a biologist i'm a geneticist so i have no problem of calling genitals by their right name in english but when it came to my mother tongue it was a bit tight so having to run those programs and people understanding that you did not get HIV from being a prostitute you got HIV from having sex with somebody who had it even if that person was your husband or your wife and that it wasn't a death sentence and that you could if you were both positive you could also have a negative child a HIV negative child so among other things that we did in that CBO was at the time that coffee and tea in my area the prices had gone down and so poverty real poverty was coming in real poverty was coming in and we introduced tissue culture bananas which were available and new varieties from Jomo Kenyatta University where i was working then the most satisfying work that i have done is application of science to the end user domesticating science to the woman in the village the man in the village so that it can benefit them on a day-to-day basis in genetics genetics is a very high profile profession many many new things happen there but the question is do they actually apply to the local population one of the other things that i have been involved in is DNA forensics i can talk about this for many hours because this is my work but suffice it to say that your DNA is unique to you none of the other seven billion people in this world have the DNA like yours it's unique to you and this technology is available in criminal work for example in sexual violence in rape for example rape is usually a personal crime it's only two people involved so i say you did it you say i did not you did it i did not there are many people who are today incarcerated they are in jail because they are convicted of rape and yet they did not do it we know there are people who are there because some people agreed to frame them so that they can get their land or they can get even and yet here is a tool there are many rapists who are walking these streets serial rapists but there is this tool that can be used to say without fear or favor definitively it is you or it is not you so we have worked on this and kenyans forensic club at the dci has gone through different phases and some years ago i worked to the dci and said i want to talk to you who are you i say my name is professor motugi i want to talk to you about DNA come in i talked i explained to him it didn't happen we've got a new dci again i walked in i said i would like to see the dci do you have an appointment no but i must talk to him what about the security of this country walking and i explained to him this new dci i sat with him i remember i got to his office they said wait it was about three says wait i didn't get into his office until seven p.m i always carry my laptop or a book so i was no no hurry i got caught into his office at seven and i did not get out until 10 p.m i explained to him step by step on how DNA can be used to make his work easy he said what you have told me he was writing notes tell me me is it easy for me to take my police officers and make them geneticists or to take geneticists and make them police officers i told him in my view it is easy to take graduates who have done biochemistry and genetics and biomedical sciences recruit them as police officers take them to keganjo and from there it started moving we got he called his high ranking officers he says tell these people about this i said please i'll take you slowly it's not complicated we negotiated a partnership with the University of Leicester in the uk where dna forensic was discovered and his officers went there and got to it as we are talking today there is a foreign c club at dci i give that example not to show what i can do that whatever you know you are an expert be confident be brave about it go to the people who need to hear it and be persistent and one day is going to happen thank you thank you so much and of course don't don't forget to pray even for the dci right you prayed before going there by the way the dci was a staunch catholic so he had uh he's uh what do you call it he's rosary and he says wait wait wait i need to pray when he finished i said you know i'm not a catholic but if you allow me i'll pray before i go home because it's 10 p.m he says do you want a policeman to escort you thank you now it it's coming out that we can always have a contribution to the republic in our areas of expertise to sing a gun in other people's areas just there and where you are use it to promote the peace and of course give a high contribution in your area to the republic of kenya maybe the last question before i come to you dear audience for the question uh prof it would be unkind to skip this there is a guy here called mokaya where is mokaya mokaya just tries and mokaya vied for senatorial seat in yamera he was beaten he's a very young man a youth in this church mokaya thank you just sit down just sit no don't give him the mic i'll i'll give him time uh if at all he has questions i was just making him right so that you see how prof you see how some people are looking up and they feel like they want to venture into politics coming to politics you serve nyaribari uh it's um nyaribari masawa yeah um three terms and then of course you are elected senator for kissy um that is in the last term of government how and why did you venture into politics very simple and straightforward yes yes in my profession yes i had reached a level my child specialist i'm a nephrologist i'm an immunologist we share the same professional background with a marion professor marion to get so at my level of research at the universe of narobi i had reached where it instead of looking at the whole kidney and the kidney diseases and how they begin and how they end i was now looking at the cell membrane of the kidney and i was looking at it this way on the outside what we call the epithelial side i was saying how uh the process being made to affect the kidney function at the membrane side i was looking at the membrane itself how it was being affected in the kidney diseases then inside the cell i was looking at the lining of the cell what we call the endothelial cell uh uh uh how it was being affected to cause kidney diseases then i would go and get chromium 51 and tag it along to fluoresce so i'll use special micro microscopes fluorescing microscopes to see the characteristics they fluoresce and you see the characteristics you see in the cell so one day i asked myself from a human being to a cell and you are confined to the cell and you are completely unaware of what's going on outside the cell is this the kind of business i want to continue so i said no i told my wife i want to go to politics i want to serve the whole human being i want to serve society and this is after i'd established all these dialysis machines i was the first one to bring 10 machines to kenyatta national hospital to establish the dialysis who were the first people to do the first kidney transplant you remember that guy called coco in this country i said i've done enough if it's in the research if it's in the sciences i've done enough but this science is now taking me to a cell and to a membrane and let me leave it there let me now go and serve community that's what sparked me to politics so you may reach as young professionals you may reach the zenith of your profession there must be a calling somewhere else yes you're being called to go now i now i understand so that to into politics i don't understand how much you're a politician this small thing you've called membrane cell you've brought the whole biology yes so that that's what brings you to that thing yes the second thing is sometimes you're driven by a purpose to change the mindset of people like we had this morning from my elder cadenda leadership is not about just being one of the numbers you must bring up you must bring change to bear upon what you want to do how do you influence society so when i went to nyaribari masaba as an mp i was able to completely change the dynamics how on how they looked at education for instance nyaribara masaba used to be number the last in performance and and so my wife and i decided that will become mentors for teachers so we took them for an outing in the crew if she can remember teachers teachers yes the entire constitution yeah that place on your and to just tell them what they can do to improve the standards of people prof you took one of the schools you took them on your bill or cdf no no no that that time i want to start that time that time there was no cdf yes on on my bill yeah so we had a great weekend there and you know after that one of the schools moe high school guess who's after that they have never looked back they were able to go forward and we influence all the other schools around to be performing well and we must be a lot of grudges including some of you who must be here we've gone through those schools they are here they are here please give a round of applause to and so in short it's it's not wrong to venture into politics even for the young professionals not at all with a purpose i mean it will be purposely driven yes so that you know why you're going in mocha will tell us why you went in all right allow me to take questions please give a round of applause to my panelists one more time like i told you they are quite rich in content we may not be able to exhaust what they carried for us today all because of the time limit but allow me to get into the audience i have some few minutes i want to pick questions to men and to ladies and i'll close it up so let me pick hand at the back that's for a man there is a lady here okay mokaya president mokaya is here so another lady yes i have another lady there so i'm having two ladies you you let's start with the the gentleman please mention the panelists you're directing your question to uh we will note it down and then we're going to answer them all at once please thank you thank you use yourself first thank you my name is gerardo koth a young profession i run a cleaning company the first question to professor marion a young girl age six seven eight nine ten has gone through fgm and then the the family keeps quiet with that information until this young girl goes into marriage then the effect the negative effects of fgm starts creeping in into the marriage what do you have what do you what are your advices to this family thank you thank you the next question to our professor samongari i wish i could shake your hand but i know i'll do that before i leave the question is um in this and in the in the service how do you protect young professions who are doing uh businesses they don't have much from from uh old men or uh big men in the in the in the same uh in the same industry who has money to give out to get a tender how do you protect young professional thank you okay it's about tender thank you thank you so much my brother i hope you've noted it oh prof dintia is actually talking of how do we protect the young entrepreneurs even in tenderization like from people who have money to spare to give out thank you you're talking about china square okay all right um that's one let me go to uh there was a hand there where yeah there's a hand there that lady there let me pick from uh miss abebe i suppose yes good afternoon afternoon my question is introduce yourself first kindly my name is mona abebe uh it is really nice to be um with you and learning from very seasoned professionals and people who have taken done like had the initiative to really serve um we really appreciate the work that you've done my question is in line with health of nations the book are there is there a way we can be a bit more aware of okay is there a way we can be a lot more aware of the medicine that is in the kenyan market that might not be entirely safe for consumption and how do you think about that yeah she's asking that how do you be aware of unsafe medicine entering the market i hope i've paraphrased it correctly yes safe entering the market how do you be aware thank you let me pick from there was a yeah you yeah praise god my name is selvia yugi uh development practitioner from uh nirobius uh sdh i want to thank our panelists for such a timely discussion and sharing of experience that you've shared my question and comment is directed to professor on gary uh it is really interesting just to listen to your story because i'm a key beneficiary of juwakali it has made me who i am today i didn't know the background that much though we use session paper uh session paper one for 1988 i also participated as a lead marketer in juwakali guvukazi by then the first ever exhibition i had an experience or incident where being the chair i had to manage the money that was going out especially when we went for selection uh in various sites and when it came to accounting i was really shocked and by then i was very naive i was less than 30 years by then uh when i was told that there was an envelope for the director there was also one for the ps and i stood firm i said no this cannot happen they never went to the field and i was taken aside i was so down naive are you this is how the government works and i use my ways i navigated through it worked but for young professionals who are here how could they navigate such scenarios for much better based on your experience because you've been there before thank you thank you so much how could the young professionals navigate um scenarios like corruption within government offices you know she's actually a beneficiary of the juwakali project that you had and she's very much grateful but how do you navigate court battles and all that all right and finally from all right yes thank you so much yes my name is alvin mochaia uh born again and a member of this church i take pride in being a follower of jesus christ that is what is most important but there is that burning desire in me to make change for me i've not been scared of concentrating on a small thing so that i venture into politics i've ventured in politics as early as 2017 uh when i was ready to become the president of the republic of kenya uh because of lack of finances my name did not get to the ballot but i managed to launch a presidential manifesto come 2022 i got i threw my heart in the ring under the usawakua water party i launched my manifesto i did a smart campaign as a aspirant for senate seat in the yamera county and i went all the way to the ballot votes were not enough so god willing i'll try again next time what do you mean votes were not enough in politics look look at in politics as prof will tell you there is no number one number two or number three it is either your number one or you're not there okay so votes were not enough and uh the senior council which whom i respect so much uh kong omogany became the senator so we will allow him to serve and hand over the mantle to us in the right of time so my question is this to professor marion togy and i can attest to your wisdom i have learned a lot from your presentation my question is in your opening remarks you talked about um lgbtq being our ethical question it is a burning issue in our country the supreme court has had a say on it the president has had a say on it parliament is having a say on it we are at a crossroads on this issue and the church has to have a definite say on it so that the country can have a definite direction so what would you what would be your direction as a professional and as a member of the adventist church thank you to my senior professor uh thank you for your kind words of wisdom and i i i would like to know um and i really i'm astounded i i didn't know that that cv of yours is that long i always follow you i always salute you but really hearts off and hearts off so god continue blessing you and giving you more wisdom as you uh mentor us but i i i'm meant to challenge you uh if it's in your uh if if you can find it fit to just spare some time and mentor some of us we really look forward to to becoming uh as you have become so it's like a request it's not even like a question it's like how can you mentor some of us who are willing to be mentored so that we can be able to take that mantle that you you maybe want to hunt the next generation because some people some wise men say that uh the success of your successor determines your success so you've been there we want to know thank you thank you mr alvin thank you so much um i want us to because time is far much spent actually our time is done allow me to give professor marion uh to start thank you thank you thank you very much and and uh if you could summarize in three minutes and then i'll give prof three minutes we'll really appreciate thank you very much don't worry i also reign for palia mentin two zero six zero seven and the votes were not enough no no no no no no organizers you can't put me with politicians so i want to say the question of fgm that's a very good example of something that is illegal but ethical illegal means that the law says it is not correct and actually prescribes what will happen if you do it but among some communities it is ethical meaning they consider it good they consider it acceptable in some communities so let's separate between law and ethics fgm is a very good example now the fgm story is long but the long and the short is that this is a supply and demand kind of thing if you interview the communities who still practice and let us be honest even in this church they are there let's be honest if you interview them it's the women the mothers like me who say no no no no i must take my daughter through fgm so that she can be she can get a good husband she can be accepted so it is a supply and demand kind of thing that we we are supplying for the demand of young men so in our heads we have decided or we have been brought to decide that you and married young men want girls who have gone through fgm and so we are providing so one if a girl has gone through fgm she's a victim if you end up marrying her and you didn't know she had gone through fgm she's a victim so she's not to be blamed she's to be pitted it's like marrying me who had broken my leg i mean it is not my fault but for the young men this fgm thing in my view should be men driven men should come out and say look here we want to marry girls who have not gone through fgm then that we break that supply demand relationship is it clear and it has worked in some countries they have done that kind of approach among the mass size in Tanzania and it pays dividends so please don't harass the victims don't target the mothers we mothers we are just doing what we believe you young men want although illegal putting it in the law helps and it doesn't help because it just takes it under and safe medicine there is good research practice the practice of drug development is well documented internationally accepted and if that process goes through by the time the drug is released to the public it has been shown to be safe in the country of development and as it comes into a country there are mechanisms including calves including labs that ensure that it has happened and that has happened but the truth of the matter is it corrupt societies like ours they are drugs that get into the country which have bypassed those systems they are drugs actually that are in some countries that are corrupt that are not registered in their country of origin but they come to us so but this is a corruption thing but also drug companies are very very clear on this because when drug companies are taken to court over this kind of drugs those countries those companies go bust you can read among other things in that book we have written the case that the professor knows were very well thalidomide the thalidomide story the company went bust so that is what happened lgbtq it's a long story the law simply says that men people are supposed to marry people of the opposite sex there is a law against indecent acts against nature that is the law in terms of human rights my role as a commissioner of the kenyan national commission on human rights and by the way that's not an mgu that is a government institution commission it's called chapter 15 commission and independent offices where we report up to the un we are supposed to monitor and audit that human rights are upheld in this country and that they are not violated and to promote from that point of view we are saying that people of lgbtq are human because we protect human rights we don't protect rights of men women children we protect the rights of please i'm a teacher right off and these people are human so we will protect their rights if they have done something that is wrong let the law take its course let them be taken to court let them be imprisoned they have access to justice let us not go and frog mat them and kill them and stigmatize them because they are human that is from my professional point of view from my christian point of view as a deconest as a deconest the bible says go forth and multiply now i am not yet informed of how two men can go forth and multiply or how two women can go forth and multiply i am a geneticist and the basics in genetics is perpetuation of the species i don't know how two men can reproduce and how two women can reproduce but i'm avoiding the question i am avoiding the question because what we have today i believe is a red herring a red herring is a digression something to remove ourselves from the issues at hand lgbtq people have been here will continue to be here because from a scientific point of view we cannot explain it it is not hormonal it is not genetic it is not people say it is psychological nobody can tell you where it comes from we also know even when you look at cows a female cow tries to mount a female cow is it homosexual no oh you're saying i believe that it is a red herring to distract us we are 70 adventists should remember that whether you are male female lgbtq or x y and z you have a soul to be saved number two that jesus did not discriminate even the worst in society at that time who are the lepros he acknowledged them whether they go there are more sins in this church and in the church i go to beyond lgbtq there are people here who are sleeping with people who are not their husbands right here in this church there are people here who are stealing money even from the church or from where they are working so this is a red herring as 70 adventists let us be focused to the real issue and the real issue is preparing ourselves for the coming of jesus and helping others prepare there for that thank you thank you i didn't know i didn't know you are also a preacher a preacher this church separately you almost shouted preach it preach it yes thank you thank you i almost made an altar call thank you thank you so much uh proof a few questions were raised to you i want you to answer them entrepreneurship yeah there was an entrepreneurship how to protect tender and of course the protection from the big man syndrome there was also about nurturing the young politicians yes yes well on question of entrepreneurship and tendering there are no more laws that govern the procurement in all ministries whether in government or in parasito it's known as the procurement act then there is also an act which governs us governs the prof the finances how government or county governments are able to handle their finances it's also known as financial act the pma pma and there is also the audit act when it comes to business every government officer wherever is in the parasito must follow the procurement rules if he does not follow the procurement rules you are at liberty to raise an objection and a panel that will listen to this if you happen to be one of those entrepreneur who has also became become innovative and you have developed innovations then i said as i said earlier you can actually pretend your innovations so they are protected from these unscrupulous people want to feed on other people's sweat so you have an avenue of raising your complaints when the procurement goes sour if you have your own innovations you have an avenue through which you can pretend your own innovations and that's why we encourage and that's why i brought the billion parliament on these patent rights and the reason i brought it when i was then the minister for technology and applied technology we had the kiondo the kikuyu kiondo which was being marketed by women and other people worldwide and when they went to international markets they found this kiondo had been patented in japan in japan and yet this was a product of kenya so we suffered the first casualty where we had the original jurisdiction of the patency we lost it out so today in this country there are enough laws that govern that intellectual property rights patent rights there are many thank you then the question of a corruption first of all it's not a sin to go to politics not at all daniel was in politics joseph was in politics many other people were in politics but it's a sin to edify corruption and let me tell you i can assure you try to be corrupt you lose all that money in the course of time it will not hold it's better to eat what you have be principled don't try and take what is not yours many times and my wife sometimes have wondered after we've given everything out sometimes we've wondered how we want to live next week and god always provides one area i want to encourage you be faithful in your titan it looks small however small it may be you will never want in your pocket you will never want in your pocket you will never feel the pinch the more you give the more you find in your pocket you become stingy the more stingy it becomes all right finally mentorship i'm willing to mentor you all the time so long as you accept one principle in politics there are times you win there are times you lose even when i go out for competition in politics my favorite verse i quote is always uh Psalm 75 verse 6 and 7 particularly verse 7 it's god who wills and brings one up and brings another one down once you accept that principle like when you went and lost i've lost several times also but i was never discouraged i said it's not god's time for me to be in power and when god's time came i was surely in power and he gave me a lot of opportunities so i acknowledge and that verse is always a perfect verse and finally remember whatever you do if you do it diligently and honestly then you can claim isiah 26 verse 3 he will keep you in perfect peace whose mind is stayed on you because he trusts in him amen amen please let's give a round of applause to our panelists today i hope we have gotten all the benefits you wanted i want to say one please i just in a statement uh my panelists so that we close this down professor marion thank you i just wanted to say to reiterate that even in public service they are looking for honest people they are looking for corrupt people and they are looking for honest people i was involved in a national exercise and i went to a person who was up there and says marion i want you to do x y z and here is the money i looked at him i said sorry i cannot do it he looked at me he says i always knew women are stupid but i never thought i would see a kikuyu educated stupid woman and i walked out a year later i was appointed to sit on the selection panel of i ebc it said president kibaki has appointed professor marion but i never met kibaki i didn't know him i ended up there but i wanted to ask how did i get there i was told the president kibaki was sitting with a few people and this man who had said stupid kikuyu woman was one of them president kibaki said i want you to give me the name of one woman who is brave not corruptable give me that name and this man who had called me stupid says i know one so so please be clear on what you can do and what you cannot do the government the public service the private sector is looking for corrupt people to do their corrupt work but there are times that they are looking for honest people who are straight as a die who can be depended on to do what is right and it shall be you thank you thank you please around a lot on mentorship on mentorship i have three mentors one is a relative who is older than me and i tell him everything because i know he will tell me the truth he knows me enough the other one is my age mate who talks to me at my level one is professional he's younger than me a mentor is a person who will knows you enough to be able to tell you the truth without fear or favor or risk of losing your relationship i have mentored and i mentor people but please a mentor is not job hunting there are people who say i want you professor to be my mentor but what they mean is that i want you to get me a job so be clear on what you want when you're seeking a mentor thank you thank you thank you round of applause please thank you so much um professor marion we are so pleased to be associated with you we are happy as a church and as young professionals here in church to have invited you and you're accepting to be here with us i know you had a busy schedule actually uh she flew in at round 11 in the morning just for this conference a santa santa may god bless you so much um my left of course we have our seasoned elder politician and of course a public servant professor samongeri is one guy we look up to you come to church during camp meeting weeks he's always there the first one for devotion and you're like i think he has a lot in his hands but he has spare time to serve god faithfully and to be faithful even in church you hear his projects and what he has done the church is mentioned as kiprof may god bless you so much we really wish you well and we keep praying for you are you vying in 2027 okay all right thank you leaving it to god may god bless you all nice to meet you hope to see you again in the next convention the organizers may god bless you so much and thank you for inviting us over be blessed