 Welcome everybody. My name is Murray Hebert. I work on Southeast Asia program here at CSIS. It's on behalf of CSIS We're delighted you all come We're also delighted To for to host our guest today Ms. Kanda Badjah by Who is the chairperson of the UN Commission on the status of women? Before she had this role she worked as the deputy permanent secretary of Thailand's ministry of social development and human security Where she played a crucial role in supervising the office of women's affairs and family development in addition to her UN role She is also the Thai representative on women's rights in the ASEAN Commission on their promotion and protection of the rights of women and children So Kanda welcome So what Kanda will make a few will speak for 10 or 15 minutes introducing What happened in the UN in the last Three weeks or so and then we'll open it up to questions Good afternoon everybody First of all it is my honor and great pleasure For me to join you in these sessions And I would like to extend my appreciation to CSIS In granting me an opportunity to be a part of this panel discussion I just ended my duty As chair of the 59th session of the commission on the status of women at the United United Nations in New York It's interesting to know that the commission undertook a review and the pressure of the implementation of the landmark documents called Beijing Decoration and Platform for Action I think the acronym is B D P A you know for after this I would say B D P A And the outcomes of the 20 search special session of the general assembly Including current challenges that affect the implementation of the platform for actions and the achievement of gender equality and the empowerment of women as well as opportunities for strengthening gender equality and the empowerment of women in the post 2015 development agenda through the integration of the gender perspective As I said that This year we are reaching the 20 year mark since the adoption of the B D P A in 1995 And we have witnessed the progress in accelerating the implementation on Beijing declarations at international regional and national levels increasing awareness and commitments on women's empowerment and gender equality promotion have been made At international level one of the remarkable examples is the integration of a gender perspective in security council The security council resolutions 1325 and other related resolutions have introduced a gender perspective into high politics regime At regional level for example the ASEAN has an effort in mainstreaming agenda perspective into its three pillars at national levels advancement of women can be illustrated by number of laws policies and strategies to advance women's right and and gender equality in in many countries remarkably in worldwide collective actions in fighting against violence against women we call it vows zero tolerance on vows and advocate for women's rights and gender equality such as he for she campaign have been conducted worldwide as you know within all the positive changes we have recognized as indicated in the political declaration adopted at the 59 sessions of the CSWU that progress on women's empowerment and gender equality promotion has been slow and uneven that major gaps remain and that obstacles for instance the barriers structural barriers persist in the implementation of the Beijing declarations significant levels of inequality between women and men girls and boys persists globally and that many women and girls experience multiple and intersecting forms of discriminations the vulnerability and marginalization throughout their life cycle as well as a gap between that's a very important de-dure and de-facto the phenomena regarding the the topic of women's empowerment and gender equality these two issues are interrelated we must have the firm concept that women's rights human rights and the human rights women's rights that is that is for sure the thing that we have to to think about to empower women's I would like to highlight the main four key strategies for a successful women's empowerment namely knowledge opportunity women's friendly environment and innovation I also would like to take this opportunity to to to share with you some examples of the implementation of Thailand where I come from regarding the empowerment of women the first key that is knowledge and education are one of the main tools for women's empowerment in Thailand we provided universal access to formal educations for all in addition lifelong learning through the informal and non-formal education is provided to enhance women's potential and skill development for instance the community ICT center have been launched aimed at empowering people with informal information technology skills as well as access to information for self-learning and self-development in addition capacity building and skill training are provided to guarantee that women are continuously equipped with knowledge to respond to the diverse of the economy and labor market secondly when women and girls are equipped with knowledge and a competitive ability in the market the second key to empower is to create an opportunity for women creating opportunity means that women must have opportunities in accessing all resources from the capital to information to access capital Thailand has taken measures to ensure equal access to loans and credits many loans and credits such as the people's credit from the the government savings bank and the micro credit for women entrepreneurs are granted to increase the access of women to capital also some funds enhance and ability of women in fund management for example the national development fund for women provides not only an opportunity for women to access to capital such as a revolving fund for vocational development and an income creation but the fund also provides and opportunity for women's organization to conduct projects to promote gender equality as well in terms of access to information the e-training system and and decent learning centers in the community have been initiated to promote women's competitive capacity especially access to information on income generations community knowledge exchange as well as their rights that is very important the third key is to establish women's friendly environment women's friendly environment should be implemented both at the uh macro and micro levels at the macro level women's empowerment should could start at home in this regard Thailand attaches its importance to promote gender equality starting at home to the series of knowledge workshop and materials on the issues of gender equality and also on the issues of the unity of the family in addition educational institutions taking measures to eliminate gender bias and stereotype in textbooks and curricula it sounds very strange to to people that are not used to these issues but it did have effect on the equality between the boys and girls from the very start when we have the gender stereotype in the way that you know men and women are not treated equally Thailand set up the sub commission on gender curriculum to conduct a review on dimensions of gender inequality that exists in all levels of education of textbooks teaching tools and materials the study significantly leads to suggesting that on on policies and measures to promote gender equality in education in workplace in fact the states should guarantee equal weight fair and non-discriminatory treat for examples the amendment of the labor protection act should ensures that the better protection of women and children such as you know designing the maximum working working hours and protection for subcontract workers to receive fair remunerations and welfare alongside with the legislation this is the case of Thailand we realize that double burden hinder women's women's to access the market before therefore specific policy guidance has been launched to establish women's friendly environment in workplaces for example promoting the establishment of daycare centers in workplaces and industrial estates to lessen child care responsibility also the cabinet's resolution and all the regulation on parental leave for male government officials were approved well well uh unfortunately it it happened just only in the in the public sector but not the private one uh that to have the parental leaves for males uh for males uh government officials so this is this is the reality i think that uh somehow in the in the futures uh the private companies will take the same uh looking at the you know the to lessen the the burden of women's uh you know to to raise the child in my capacity of um Thailand's representative to ASEAN commission on the promotion and protection of the rights of women and child and and children in what we call ACWC i work closely with the ministry of social development and human security to raise awareness in ASEAN regarding the elimination of violence against women and girls the annual public uh campaign to stop violence against women led by Thailand has has been going on for several years with the different themes each year in 2012 the campaign started to raise public awareness to end violence against women in uh 2013 the campaign he highlighted domestic violence that affected women and children and in uh 2014 we focused on the violence against the elderly women in the society in in ASEAN so the campaign materials and website have continually developed for this purpose now the last key in empowering women is innovation and innovation will accelerate the achievement in women's empowerment realizing this um Thailand has continually launched new projects to respond challenges on the empower empowerment of women for instance on the issue of women's peace and security agenda the series of workshops to build a capacity of women in peace processes have been launched parallel with the empowerment of women's the protection of gender equality by all sectors should be done as states adopted at the the opening session of the 59th session of the SWU through i would like to read outlines all together six one is to strengthen implementation of laws policies strategies by closing a gap between written documents and real practices two strengthen and increase support for institutional mechanisms for gender equality at international regional and and national levels three the transformation of discriminatory norms and gender stereotypes four significantly increase investment for gender equality to close the resource gaps five strengthens accountability for the implementation of existing commitments and six enhance capacity building data collection monitoring and evaluations so to conclude women's empowerment and gender equality promotion is well everybody know that it's the unfinished business that it it will be go on forever we must look ahead to the post 2015 and beyond at international levels various organizations ranging from the CSW UN women's UNICEF to the treaty bodies like CEDOR that is the convention on the the elimination of discrimination against women in all forms some of us here might might might hear it i have heard it for the for the first time but it's it's the conventions the UN conventions whereby the member states will have to to look at the you know the the structures of practices in having you know with women and men in the equal status and looking at the elements with the concluding observations from the committee every time that they that member states will will will produce the report and also to defend the the the report with the committees the verbal verbally so that that is something that the member states will have to do it's the legal binding in fact it's the legal binding as i said that you know all the at international levels various agencies ranging from CSW UN women UNICEF and also the some other treaty bodies such like CEDOR should work towards contributing to achievement of gender equality and empowerment of all women and girls synergies among and between these agencies within the UN system should be further strengthened so that we can fully reap benefits of our shared goals at regional level mechanism in each region should strengthen their collaboration and cooperation in working on women's rights and gender equality agenda at national level a government with stakeholders should work closely to create positive change in the in the lives of women and girls so ladies and gentlemen look ahead looking ahead of the post 2015 development agenda i hope that all of our common goals will be met someday someday sooner or later that is to ensure women and girls drivers actors and beneficiaries of sustainable development and not one of them is left behind that is to make sure that the post 2015 development agenda is a truly inclusive agenda with gender equality as it at its core and that is to ensure that all stakeholders step up their efforts towards the realization of gender equality empowerment of all women and girls so thank you for your attention thank you very much very interesting and insightful and i i made a mistake at the introduction i was going to mention that unfortunately kunkanda was going to have a partner miss stephanie foster who's a senior advisor from secretary carries office on global women's issues at the department of state unfortunately she became ill and let us know just around noon that she would not be able to make it so unfortunately i guess kunkanda is on the podium by herself but you're you're gonna do fine could i maybe just to start the conversation uh you several times uh referred to the post 2015 millennium development goals agenda can you uh based on the discussions you had in new york uh the last few weeks can you have a sense of what the the uh the goals will be with specific regard to women and uh and girls oh okay uh i i would like to say that in the post 2015 is something that uh well i put it in a bit of a simple way like this you know the the the historic uh Beijing declaration is there the platform for action is there you know it it's it's not going to to be you know uh away uh but what we would like to see is that as we can see from the 20 years that because the pace of development is not that uh satisfactory and uneven so uh on the the post 2015 uh at least from the from the the policies of the csw that uh we need to have the tighten the measures a little bit you know to to look at the the the elements that will help women to uh you know to be uh um to go forward for example one we have the political uh declarations you know at the at the beginning of the csw 59 sessions the political declarations is a kind of commitment from the from the political uh people that is so-called ministers from the the member states to make sure that after post 2015 uh we will have uh the the measures to help for example to have the one to look at the monitoring uh systems that is uh the mechanisms will have to be put in place even even though the csw is is not uh and a kind of legal uh binding mechanisms but we need to have the the follow up the monitoring and also evaluation mechanisms to to look at you know what is the gaps uh uh that still appears and what kind of remedial action actions that we should have uh secondly i think that uh i think the the emphasis is also on the the increased participation the urge to increase participation from the nto's to help just not only the the the function of the mandates of the member states or the government of that member states to look at the way and how to accelerate it by by itself but it needs some kind of uh cooperation collaborations more from the nto's the participation you know the it's the things that uh we have uh discussed a lot uh and also the element of you know to make sure that the resource has been provided for the member states to make sure that they have earmark you know the resource to to boost you know or to um to help accelerate the the implementation of the Beijing uh we have had the a lot of uh examples the incidents that why we have the mechanism available in in countries but all those mechanisms didn't have the earmarked resource for themselves so they just you know have the mechanism without we just like you know that the night without without the sauce something like that so it's something that we need to to look at it uh seriously from from post 2015 so open the floor to questions uh if you would like to ask a question raise your hand there's somebody of the microphone back there and please identify yourself and um and try to ask a question please good afternoon thank you very much for speaking to us today my name is jocelyn roberts i'm the lower micong initiative coordinator for the department of state um and i'm curious if you can share with us uh maybe some lessons or best practices i have two questions one is how do you manage to increase the access to resources to capital or information as you mentioned in rural areas um and the second one is that at the on the sidelines of the commission on the status of women we had a small meeting with the lmi representatives and the side the side event yeah just a small informal side event and the lao uh vice president of the commission for the advancement of women mentioned that their approach is that education is the single most important factor in advancing women but uh again uh how do we break through some of the southeast asian countries have very good education primary education enrollment of girls etc but when we get to secondary or tertiary levels the enrollment and the graduation levels drop off significantly so what can we do to try to maintain or sustain and improve the education of girls in secondary school and then also in higher education thank you very much can i can i just i i'm i'm not quite sure whether i i would be able to answer you know or to help you on on that or not but but from the from the experience of of tai from thailand we do have the the evidence that um we have very very few dropouts you know of of students at secondary levels we have more girls more women in the universities right right now um even from the from the uh departments of engineering we now have something like 50 50 men and women uh medical science 50 50 yeah let alone your liberal arts that we have a lot of women's already or educations um well i think i think that it has something to do with the with with the you know the the long-term plans of the of of whether it's the minister of education the government or the university uh uh management to look at the the uh the elements why is it why is it that um what kind of problems that that the girls have in in secondary educations particularly in the rural areas i i think that we have we have quite a number of uh best practices so to speak that's in apart from having our our own students uh in school we also have quite generous to have you know the the boys boys and girls you know uh uh who followed a company their mothers as the migrant workers to to be you know to be accepted and then to be uh educated in school so i i i feel that uh uh we we don't have much problem on that but um i cannot say about the the law pdr because because the situation is not the same uh and i think that uh the tai government is quite generous right now you know to have to have all to accommodate all the boys and girls you know you know to accompany their their parents as the migrant workers you know to be educated in country i forget your your first question already please could you decide it or over again please how do you manage to assure access to informational and financial resources for women in rural areas i i think that um on that issues uh there is one one thing that i would like to mention we have the women's development funds uh initiated by the government and it's quite a number a quite a big amount of of budget to be distributed for each you know seven 77 provinces and then to make sure that uh the fund has been allocated to help women's organizations within within the province to to tap you know the uh the resources for their own endeavors business endeavors and also you know to to help uh you know the the groups of of women's a kind of uh the you know that their own endeavors a business or economic endeavors and it's revolving fund you know it's it's going on like this for several years uh apart from that apart from that we also have the before before before the women's development fund we also have the um well i i think about you know my my own term but but i cannot translate it into english it is the it is the funds uh allocated for each um uh sub districts sub districts uh so that we we will have the we will have the you know each district the sub district we will have the members uh of the uh the committees you know to look after the funds to get the loan for for those who will get the loans will have to be have we have to submit the proposals to the the commissions or the the committees and the committees will have the very very neutral we have the equal numbers of men and women you know looking after you know the proposals and then and then uh approved for the loans but this that that is not uh not just only women but men and women equally can be can be can access that that loans but the the women development fund it's purely on women yeah thank you very much for your comments today my name is lian sedowski and i work at an economic development consulting firm called nathan associates and we are doing a lot of work with both apek and azian on support of their women's agenda with and on the apek side with the ppwe and then on the azian side um through the secretariat i have two questions for you number one for azian you mentioned that you're working with azian to integrate women into the three pillars and i was just wondering what uh are the types of activities azian is looking to do in the future i did an assessment of azian um three or four years ago and women are mentioned is nowhere within any of the the pillars i think there's one reference in the social pillar and so i was just wondering what you hope um azian can do in the future in terms of supporting women and particularly women's um and on the economic sector which is my particular interest and then my second question is more personal as an american woman who is a recent new mother i have realized that the united states has doesn't do much to support working women and women's economic participation thailand is well known for how it supports women and i was just wondering how thailand was able to make women part of its policy agenda was there what particular advice would you have for women in the united states to try to make women more of a political um body to force change thank you okay thank you for your for your uh questions the first one is on the the gender mainstreaming in the in the three pillars of azians well to tell you the truth it's only just begun and yes yeah because because it it has been uh discussed for a long long long times you know because because we have you know the first pillar is on the security and political second pillars is on the economics and my pillars is on the social and cultural you know uh communities actually it it it uh most of the time it it condense in the the third pillars but not the second and not the first because they think that um no it's irrelevant irrelevant but uh it's time now it's time now that it should should have the we should have a cross cutting uh gender mainstreaming across the the tree the three pillars in the way that we need to have the first of all we should also have the notions on when we have the the feasibilities that these are looked at the analysis of the projects you know from from the three pillars we need to have you know a set of uh questions ourselves what kind of of uh the the policies or the projects or the activities uh uh that will affect you know the life of of women uh uh we also have to have uh in our mind that when we uh we call what uh I would like to say that for example in in in economics many we need to to ask ourselves that if we have these uh activities uh for the for the implementation who benefits men or women what kind of the you know adverse effects if women will have or if we if we have these kind of projects going on for example on the the climate change you know on the uh the you know the the projects on the economic incubators or something like that the what whether we have the sex these aggregated data uh among ourselves to look at the distributions of those who will be affected you know it's it's quite it's quite difficult to understand and to perceive you know from from those who are not from familiar with with these issues but but I tell you that it will have to be in the policies of asians and and we will try to make it you know uh more evidence so that we can say that you know across the three pillars we have the gender perspective look at things with the gender lenses so that we have the you know the the equal status between men and women okay uh the second questions very difficult to answer you know but but um we put it this way we have the 10 years women development plans integrated into the national development plan of of Thailand and with that there will be will be the parts that will deal with uh you know the the the notion that you know the the situation where women uh with women can can be you know the the the equal income earners as men right but women's also have you know the the the invisible burden at home that um will not be able to to to shed it away very easily for example to look after you know the children's at home to have cook for the families and and sometimes well not sometimes uh you know the working mother if if we have the if they have the you know ability to pay for the the nursery you know to look at the the the infants or something like that it's okay but if if they are the low income earners how can they uh you know afford to this kind of nursery you know drop off the kids you know in the morning and then and then pick them up pick them up in the in the the after work and also it's costly it's quite costly yeah so the policy is that it's a kind of um CSR for the private organizations and also the public to initiate to help you know the the child care center within the workplace so that mom will come and look at the at the you know the kids or even the the breast the breast feedings so at the corner so this is something that we can we can empower women you know to be able to work at the same time you know to look after uh the kids the infants at the same time without uh you know the uh too much cost in in the in in their life so so this this is something I would like to share with you we we we are doing uh for quite some times but I cannot say that it's 100 percent it depends on the it depends on the the policies of the the organizations uh particularly the the big the big private companies that will have you know the eyes on the on the lens of the gender lens or not at one time I I I think about uh two months ago there's one company saying that you know it's the announcement that female laborers from for this year you are not you are not supposed to be pregnant and then we we we put it in your in the media you know and then they have to stop then that is women's right right yes we have a bunch of questions we're almost well we can maybe run a bit over maybe we'll take two questions at a time so I'll ask you two to ask questions and we'll do the other two so we'll start here Mindy could you give her the and then then her so I'm sorry I don't know if I I do have a question my name is Mindy Cutler I direct a nonprofit uh called Asia Policy Point that studies Japan and Northeast Asia as you can see the gender perspective in the Bastion the alpha male Bastion isn't hasn't gotten through this is CSIS is where the men are and they don't really understand gender as part of foreign policy um the one of the big issues in the UN and in the women's organizations is the violence against women in warfare and one of the big issues in Washington which I work on and probably the only person that works on is the comfort women issue and that comes up in the in your commission it comes up in in CEDA what is your perspective on that let's take two questions here my name is Emmanuel Sioux I am a human rights lawyer and researcher and democracy from Central European University thank you for doing us the honor of your presence today you mentioned a quite impressive list of policy fields where initiatives have been taken like education, new technology, culture, social development and banking and my question regarding that is how both at the UN level but also the national level the how does work in practice the cooperation between the different offices that takes care of these different fields and for example you mentioned that you work now with the minister of social development and security maybe it is because you held that position before so how does this work in practice and is this um crossfield approach successful and if not what are the next steps to do for that thank you we'll let her answer these two questions and we'll do one more round thanks frankly speaking I I I I cannot I cannot see clearly on the on when you said that the violence against women during the warfare right you said that well and I think that this this is something that we need to to look at it as well that somehow in the past there are a lot of when when do you have the the unrest or or the you know the the situations most of the time it will be the males that will will will look you know at the the issues whether the negotiations or the you know the the the helps to helps all the the women's now we try to have more women's you know to to to work as the as the the helpers and then and to be within within the negotiate you know the negotiations to have the you know the the the gender balance when we have you know the situation so I think that something we need to to ponder as well that you know it just not just only men's that will be able to to you know to look at all the the elements but we need to have you know the the perception or or you know the the the attitudes or the the ideas understanding of of women's you know to be in the process as well as I told you that it's not women is not just only seen as the victims but they should be you know the the the helpers you know the the the one that will will be in on on the on the on the helping side as well so so this is this is we think that in the future we will we will see more of the of gender balance in all the situations I know that it is not going to be 100% but you you will you see more women's in the UN systems well again I'm very absent minded I forgot your your your questions already my question was how does work the corporation at the national and the UN level between the different offices so the one that takes care of the social development new technologies the banking system education okay and if it's not successful enough how can we make it better thank you okay it is not legal biding you know because because member states will come and then report annually on what kind of achievements that they will have and next year the theme will be on the sustainable development for women's sustainable development so that is something very vast areas so it depends on the the member states will look you know you look at the the political declarations the element of the political declarations that what kind of specific measures policies that they have already committed within the declarations the the pledge you know at the at the beginning of the of the 59th sessions that they they will be they will go they will do so and so and so and so so in the following years they will come back with the with the evidence that what they have done on what respect I think that not not many member states will say that you know they will they will report on the vast the wide arrays of activities that that they have done in the past 12 months it's impossible but I think that it will be some kind of you know the the the noticeable or the the things that they have done after going back to the capitals you know what kind of policies what kind of legislations what kind of measures that they put forward for example on the the earmark of the resources for gender equality in the capitals what happened how to what extent they have done that and what is the drawbacks what is the challenges there's something like this so this is the way that the UN and with and with the helps of the UN women's in the regional located in the in each member states or not I don't know but but with the with the mandates of the UN women's and also other UN organizations as they try to have the synergies to work together you know as to help the member states to overcome the the gender inequality in their own countries that is the thing that we we can do so the last two people in the back there please thank you very much thank you thank you very much kunyin thank you so much my name is Rita Herona Adkins I had lived in Thailand I had the fortune to enjoy uh sanook sanook mc mc I speak a little if I may brag a little bit of Thai but that's all the time that I happen to know my question ma'am is human trafficking uh Thailand the Philippines are among the countries in Southeast Asia and that part of the world which are in the list among the top countries impacted or involved in human trafficking and human trafficking of course covers slave labor as well as sex trafficking uh now of course when it comes to uh human trafficking and the sale of women uh for sex okay while it is an income generating kind of of of livelihood or may no maybe that's not the wrong word uh uh of of earning money uh and that's why poor countries and women in poor countries are sort of kind of led or lured into that kind of of industry uh this may not necessarily be part of this central theme of your presentation today but since it is it relates to women or it involves women what kind of comment would you have regarding human trafficking where it involves women in your country thank you so much my name is Luke Wilson I'm a professor at the George Washington University uh my question is about the impact that political instability or governmental instability can have on the advancement or implementation of these gender rights does it at sometimes create opportunities for advancement for quick advancement or do you more often see retrenchment you know a retreat back to sort of uh more stable uh and you know more stable goals things that don't actually need to be changed thank you uh the the first questions uh I think that the human trafficking is is it well because because the the situation but like because the location of Thailand is is we have a lot of borders right too loud too to Myanmar to Malaysia to Cambodia uh we are all Thailand is free is seen as you know the you know the the country of destination a lot but it doesn't mean that we ignore you know the the uh the the situations that you know will um on the human you know the human trafficking situation in in in our countries I think that we have a lot of uh mo use you know with the with the neighbors and also the you know the the the the special task force the intergovernmental uh interminaturals also uh task force that to look at the elements of uh trafficking including you know the police and as well I I think that's um it it it would um well I I I feel that because because of the you know the the the ASEAN communities is going to be you know by the end of uh of uh this year then it will be the free flow of people coming into Thailand out of Thailand a lot you know a lot of uh frequencies a lot of work volumes and what kind of activities both legal and illegal uh you know coming in I will say that the Thai government is is very aware of the of the problems and we try our best to you know to to to decrease you know the the the cases and also to look at the the uh you know the the uh the the service that we will look at the the victims you know human human trafficking uh uh I think it's quite generous you know to look at the we have all the emergency homes in 108 uh emergency homes all together all over the the countries you know to look after the the identified victims of trafficking and then to make sure that they will be reintegrated you know to look at the uh access to justice as well that is that is the the the normal um the the policies and also the the measures that we have otherwise we will not um it it it used to be just only five or six uh emergency homes all together uh all over the countries but now it's 100 yeah on all over the the countries so the it means something that Thai government is not uh close their eyes you know on the on the problem of human trafficking we try definitely we have it we have it uh the the uh rehabilitation programs for the victims if you go to to uh non-tambulie we always you know the name of these emergency homes or not but it's the biggest uh emergency homes for uh women victims for human trafficking and in in that we have all kind of vocational trainings and also we all even have the the uh the lawyers to help them to you know to to access the the justice and also uh the the we have the MOU you know to with the with the the center countries the Sunday's government how to reintegrate them them back home and not to be to be re-victimized again yeah okay yeah uh the second question my personal opinion is that um you know the the change the change of government is not outer you know the the the the probability for women to be uh you know elected as the MPs or even in the in the in the uh local communities uh it doesn't it doesn't change any anything at all but what I would like to say is that instead of looking at whether how many women to be elected you know nationwide or locally uh you know elections uh I care more on how to have the capacity building for women to to prepare themselves to be ready to be elected and not just only to stay home you know and looking after uh the children the kids and then let the men so just to be uh to be the candidates of the of the elections that is the more important I think that that is what we could do is to to uh help women to know themselves that you are the same as women of men you are able you know to be elected the same as men just only to have confidence and to have the preparedness you know to open themselves to the public and to be elected so that's that's my my answer Okay, thank you very much uh for for your insightful and interesting presentation and answering our questions. I'd like to also thank everybody that's come. Please join me in thanking Kunkanda for coming down from New York to talk about what happened there. Thank you. Thank you.