 This episode of the anxious truth is brought to you by me because I'm not just a podcaster I'm also an author. I've written several useful books and anxiety and anxiety recovery And I know you're gonna find them helpful. You could find them on my website at the anxious truth calm Hey, what up everybody welcome back to the anxious truth. This is episode number 182 welcome back to the program welcome back to the show I am Drew lince a lot a creator and host of this fine podcast or what I Excuse me what I hope you will think is a fine podcast Today we are gonna tackle a subject that I know many of you are interested in now This is not necessarily directly related to anxiety and anxiety recovery But sometimes in this journey We just need to hear an inspiring story an uplifting story an encouraging story from a superior human being and I Absolutely have that person waiting in the green room. We have a green room. We're very fancy here Waiting in the green room right now. I'm gonna bring out my new friend Jessica Seidner Jessica is a perfect example of somebody who was forced to navigate when when you guys ask me all the time But what happens when there's a real medical issue or what happens when there's a real life problem? What happens when there's grief what happens when they're lost? Jessica was forced by life this ridiculous thing we call life to navigate through two Tremendous real challenges at the same time. So we're gonna talk about how she was able to navigate through Real grief real loss real depression real fear real uncertainty Medical issues all of this stuff all at the same time and come out at the other end not only okay But at least from where I'm sitting thriving. So let us bring Jessica Seidner on now from the famous green room. Hey, Jess What I love the green room. It was great How is it the how are the our derbs? I haven't tested the fantastic just sparkling water next time Okay, fair enough a green M&M is only Jess is like very hard to play Anyway, Jessica Seidner Jess has been through Jessica Jess. Do you have a preference whatever you want? I have some people who call me Jessica Jesse and Jess whatever I'll answer just about anything. Don't call me late for dinner so Jessica as I mentioned in the intro Just an inspiring human being and thank you for taking the time to come and share your story So we're talking to an audience full of people who are navigating their problems as it is with anxiety and anxiety recovery And then all times life throws additional monkey wrenches as if agoraphobia or panic disorder OCD aren't enough other things happen There's loss medical problems as health problems Tell us what you had to navigate through in the very short amount of time Well, I will tell you that your introduction was great It was very thorough and I would say just in two words hot mess like that was me for quite some time And you know, it's funny because you think gosh I'm going through this and this and this surely there's a list somewhere and I've like maxed out and then another wrench Gets thrown in and I know that many of your listeners and viewers have felt that Long story short. I had the dream marriage Married to the dream guy his name was Tyler and he was just he was the life of the party Everyone wanted to be around him. He was so wise and spiritual He was just he was just a light and little did I know that he was battling with depression and I didn't realize the extent of it until one day he left for work And he never came home He never came home and So here I am at that point 36 years old And you know Now when I see I don't know signs on the highways and missing person or on the news missing person Before I just you know that that's a shame, but I couldn't relate to it Now I know what it feels like to have experience When your partner when your spouse with the when the love of your life Is missing literally missing so he was missing for 24 hours and Through a lot of research and Rummaging through things and trying to figure out what the heck happened working with detectives all of that good stuff we finally did find the suicide note and I'll never forget when it happened because it was truly an out of body Experience, I mean I could it was like I was watching a movie And it was all in slow motion and And that was the moment where my life Completely changed at the age of 36. I became a widow to someone who had battled such internal demons and just and what's so interesting is he had a heart to serve He loved serving people. He loved taking care of people, but he was living in a way that he just couldn't live anymore and Feeling isolated and and that was that that was the beginning of I would say if I look back in my life I would say I've had bouts of depression and anxiety and all of all of that stuff You know threw throughout my life, but that was the first time that I mean my life was changed and really I was kind of out of body For months after his his death. Yeah, so yeah, it was just in a snapshot, right? Like it just was that quick Everything changed. So you are instantaneously immersed in this pit of loss and grief and so many different emotions I cannot even imagine how many you know, we have the capability of experiencing such a tremendous broad range of emotion I gotta believe an event like that makes you experience almost all of them Oh, absolutely. Yeah all of them at once including I mean you go to you know, I think when they describe the grief cycle It's like this like really nice circular thing You know like it's like you start here and then you go here and then you go here They don't necessarily say it goes like this and then this and then up and down I mean it is nuts to the degree of I I'm gonna share a story of how I mean obviously I went through all the stages of grief over and over again I still do that right, but I I was trying to get a hold this was like 24 hours or 48 hours after he died Maybe been a week. I was trying to get a hold of my family who were kind of all on call So I called, you know, I called my mom. She didn't answer her phone I called my sisters. They didn't answer their phone. I called my dad. They didn't answer their phone I called I'm now called everyone and they just didn't answer And I literally had it in my head And I don't know why that something horrific had happened to my father And they were going to they were not answering because they did not know how to tell me So your brain just your brain just does so many Tricky things and yet it does beautiful things to protect you and to get you through Through those times. I mean for years. I would wake up every morning and I would think That was the worst nightmare of my life And then I would realize It wasn't it wasn't a nightmare. It it's my life and how do I keep going? Yeah So so much of this and you know, it's interesting how you say you had that thought that something and I'm sure I felt very real Something happened to your dad and they weren't going to tell you because they felt they couldn't you couldn't handle it And when we are under duress, you know, we've become a little less resilient and those sort of thoughts are more likely to pop up And be sticky and be really powerful. So I'm sure you moved through a lot of that stuff Did you find as you're confronting this this tidal wave an unrelenting churning like you're You're basically in a food processor of emotions at that point. I like how you say It's not the nice little diagram the grief cycle. It's literally like it's it's a food processor You're just it is a food processor. It makes like mush As you were so now you're navigating through some of the heaviest emotions that a human being can can experience Of course, and they're coming at you in rapid succession and so much of my audience Is so many people in the audience are concerned with big emotions. They are afraid of them They can't they think they're going to be too much When did you ever find that you're you felt like that's it? It's too much. You must have had those moments and what you got you through those moments Gosh, good question. You know, I've had I've had so Many of those moments The biggest one being and we'll talk about it in a few minutes But my breast cancer diagnosis that came six months later like literally I thought I was going to Like pound my head against like something like brain matter was going to fly because I just could not believe What shitty luck I had I just couldn't believe it. And yeah, so those moments They come in waves. They're not predictable But what I also would say is People are stronger than they realize That they are right so you you may not think right now that you're strong enough to deal with x y and z And when things happen because unfortunately like you said life just happens to all of us It just it just is the way it is Um, it's interesting because you realize in those moments like I can do this You've got that like internal grit that determination that comes out right and I would say first of all It's really about taking the baby steps. It's all about moving forward Honoring the past honoring where you are but taking baby steps forward. So, you know, um, I I would I found this to be helpful. Of course, I love therapy and I have gone since The day after essentially tyler died and one of the things that I've learned that's really helpful even today because I think First of all, I would say grief Takes all shapes and form. So you could have grief related to a loss Um, a loved one that you've lost who you've lost you could have grief because you've had And now maybe you have some like residual effects You could be grieving because you're an empty nester you could be grieving because Your your mental and your physical and or your physical health is not the same and it's not as stable grief takes tons In tons of forms and it lasts a long time It just evolves differently and in many ways it can be hard But it can also feel good if you let it feel good like give you a passion to do good Um, but one of the things that I still do because I'm still grieving And I still have triggers and I still have weird things that You know, I know come from that trauma is do kind of a morning self assessment Right, whether it's while you're drinking your coffee or if you're doing meditation like how am I today? emotionally physically mentally Spiritually and if you're feeling like a shit show adjust your calendar to reflect. I'm not in the mood I need to do some self-care today. That's my priority and I've got people in my life who either understand it Or who don't understand it if they don't understand it Maybe they don't need to be in your life. So that's like a couple tips Yeah, which are really good tips. The baby step tip is is spectacular. It's really good And it's something we talk about in my community all the time every little step matters, right? So I want to talk about two things there and then I want to move on to the second half of this like horror show Uh, which you've already, you know mentioned and we'll get into that So baby steps so important I want to talk about the lessons that you were able to learn really from day to day Like so we could talk about look back at the macro level at the large level and say, oh This is what I learned and this is I found my strength and I and I turned it loss into this and But day to day one of the things we talked about in the community all the time is You are proof every day So when you wake up on tuesday and it is you feel like you just cannot do this day I cannot do this anymore. It's overwhelming. You can look back at monday and say well I felt that way yesterday too, but I did monday. Did you ever Did that ever Dawn on you the lessons that you took from day to day to day like I made it through a day So I guess I can make it through another one Absolutely, absolutely because you have to be able to look back and reflect on those I'm going to use the word achievements, which usually Coincides with coincides with something large, right? But achievements can be small And you do you do look back the day before and you kind of it's like a building block, right? It's sort of a mixture between I did it once I can do it again I you know, even if it was a small achievement I was able to do it and then the next day It it kind of like I know this sounds really wild But I would be like lying in bed and of course I'd go through this this is a nightmare No, this nightmare is my life and I would think okay Swing my legs around And stand up Okay, you know like I would it would be that It would be that intentional But also Recognizing and being okay. I mean I think with the fact because I'm kind of a go-getter in a busy body that What was most productive? during that time frame Was to Swing my legs over and take the over my bed and take that first step and then maybe do some meditation And maybe make coffee and maybe that's all I could do that But that counts. Okay. It counted. It's funny because you said like, you know, sometimes you'll have to decide well today Self-care is one of those It's a little bit of a hot button in the community that I'm serving because we have to be careful to not Say that self-care is retreating from from some of these years However, but you're you're so dead on with this Sometimes self-care is literally just being able to get up and feed yourself and shower and comb your hair and put something on That's that that counts that day It is it is so true because what I think and I agree. I think self-care can be Kind of obnoxiously used, right? You kind of sometimes think oh, it's like a spa day or a retreat Sometimes what what I have You know my life now five years later so much of it is rooted In serving and caring for others, which I feel like is a great way to honor tyler because that's how he was But that's my form of self-care is actually getting out Starting the conversations talking about suicide talking about depression talking about my own anxiety and my own struggles Talking about breast cancer talking about the things that people don't want to talk talk about for whatever reason can be very Can like warm my heart and warm my soul and it almost gives purpose to what I went through Yeah, excellent. So there you go. It's sometimes it's just day to day and learning the lesson of hey Look, I got up and I can get up again and the small things. Let's let's talk about part two of the horror show So yeah the horror show six months later. Boom. You have another bombshell Bombshell in fact it was the day after I finally felt like oh my gosh. I came out of this fog I was in a fog for six months and I was at an event and I'm like I'm awake. I'm awake. I'm starting to feel things. I'm seeing things again, and it was a really great feeling And that next morning here in Denver They would do a promotion on one of the news stations to remind people to do breast health exams And they called it buddy check nine It was really a great great campaign that went on for years and years and years And I've always ignored it because I was like what I don't need to worry about I'm 36 Like I have no breast cancer in my family. I don't even know what a love feels like I don't know how to do a breast health exam. This does not pertain to me But for some reason that morning I woke up and I saw and I thought Well, no one's been in my business because in my head it was Tyler's job, you know to do to to Let me know if there was something going on with my breasts, right? I mean just to be honest with you The only person who thinks that I'm sure you're not the only person who thought that I mean did I communicate that with him? No, but that's what I thought so, you know He he has died and I'm like well nobody's been up in my business So maybe I better do a breast self-exam and I know I had no idea what I was doing And with three within about three seconds in the shower I found a lump and all of a sudden like the flags went flying, you know your gut flags And I thought oh my god. This is not good and I Called my healthcare provider. I made an appointment. I was diagnosed with breast cancer So I detected it incredibly early and I'm so thankful for that I mean, I feel like it's such a miracle But I will tell you as I went through that journey It occurred to me that people who you know are all into wellness and watching their carbs and working out and they You know, they do the right things health wise There's a whole bunch of people just like us just like the viewers and the listeners who Just had no idea What to do when it came to the health of their breasts So they're asking me what what does the mammogram feel like? How did you do it? How do you do a breast self-exam? What did the lump feel like and I'm thinking okay This does not make any sense Like What's where where is there a gap here because we all have these questions and really were of age to be paying attention I mean 40 is nice, but really you should be in your 20s and 30s too So I thought about it a little bit more and honestly all came down to the idea of a paper gown If you really, you know think about it I know um a lot of your viewers can recognize the feeling of a paper gown You're in a paper gown and that's the only time that you're getting a breast self-exam From your doctor's office or your health care provider and usually when you're wearing your paper gown I mean as fashionable as they are. Oh, yeah. Yeah, all right You know, you're right. Exactly. They're really not not fashionable and not comfortable. You're thinking I don't want to learn how to do a breast self-exam. I don't want to ask any questions I just want to get the heck out of this paper gown and get on with my life So that's where I thought about how can we create a space? and an environment that Exudes comfort exudes conversation connection warm everything you think about when you're not thinking about a clinical environment where people can actually learn In a place that's comfortable for them about the ins and outs of early breast cancer detection So that's how I originally started my business called night out with the girls And it's the girls refer to the girls I I have a lot of double entendres I mean don't get me started like, you know, don't even don't even get me started there But really and why I think this is Put your nails up to the camera. Oh, yeah. Well, these ones are better. So I always have Watching on Spotify or YouTube Seriously, little boobs. Yeah So you really do like you are on brand all the time, which I so appreciate Let's get you to that point though. So now you have this diagnosis which comes out of the blue You're not thinking about it in any way and now And I want to end this to make sure we tell people what you turned it into which is easy, right? Now there is a real health concern actual real health concern and just a ton of uncertainty and vulnerability and fear And all of those things the same thing now you have to navigate through those again. How did you manage to not Live so now you just have to live day to day because you don't know what's going to happen You have tests you have assessments to do maybe you have whatever treatment that you went through At some point we will all jump ahead. I'm going to jump ahead a year and a half down the road to my own funeral Did that happen to you and how did you deal with that? How did you how did you not get caught in that? Oh my heavens. Yes It completely I completely Jumped ahead. Um, I mean to the degree. I just I figured this this was it when you hear breast cancer Your mind goes to the worst and I think that's a very very common You know, how many months do I have to live? You see it everywhere and you it is It is horrific and then on top of it still in the middle of the grief process of losing Tyler What I I did was and I don't think that I intentionally did this But I really I got to a point that your brain and your emotions and your heart can only handle so much So I kind of put a pause. I know this sounds really wild, but a pause on the Tyler suicide thing Because I just couldn't I I had to focus now On my own life And how I was going to survive this and get the information and the data that I needed But um, does that answer your question? It does and I I think the smart So in other words instead of you jumping forward and I'm gonna you know You're writing a screenplay in your head about your own funeral and your own hotel And with the worst case and so many people that are listening and listening to us and watching this right now Have that issue where even before there's an actual health concern They're jumping ahead to what if there is and then if there is they're jumping right ahead to the end of the story Which is the catastrophic end of the story So, I mean when you started to establish I don't know how soon it was in that after your diagnosis and during your treatment that you started to turn it into Night out with the girls in the breast education center that you're doing now Was that part of it? How did you stay in today? I have to deal with today I have to today. I have to go to a treatment today. I have a doctor's appointment today I have a meeting today. I have dinner with my mom whatever it is How did you stay in today and not in what the worst case would have been in a year and a half possibly? Well, I'll say two things about that So first of all, especially the listeners and the viewers who have all gone through so many different battles So many different traumas different maybe different maybe the same as me But you know you you you remember like hey, I've taken these baby steps I've take I've had these achievements. I've made it work day to day to day And so you have to remember that like when you face another trial or situation or challenge like I've had it tough. I can do this I can do this but like the day to day. I would just honestly Um, I would let myself feel what I was feeling. I'd give myself grace I surrounded myself not with people but with the right people. So there's a big difference there and I didn't I I didn't jump so much to the fear of the funeral and the death and all of that because and it was easy to but I felt like That would Just cause a giant spiral. I mean I have I like I have had the moments where I am screaming I'm I've had the moments where I am, you know hysterical. I I mean, I won't go into the situation I'm still afraid to go to my mailbox sometimes which sounds kind of Wild I know I'm speaking of the very safe group here And yeah, I I mean it was messy, but I learned to sit in the mess I learned to invite the right people into the mess And I learned to give myself grace when it felt like I just wasn't moving forward at all It's so interesting and you know, I would not expect you to be a listener of this podcast Thankfully, you don't have to be which is great But you're the words that you're using the terms the phrases you're the way that you handle and navigated these They are 100% anybody listening who's going to say oh, that sounds familiar That sounds familiar and this is coming from somebody who does not necessarily have Oh, maybe you do. I don't know have a diagnosed anxiety disorder. So is it amazing how the same principles apply even in life? So even when there is two giant monkey ranches thrown into to your works You still use the same principles one day at a time allow yourself to feel what you need to feel Let it be there Get the support you need take care of yourself even in baby steps These are all who are the embodiment of everything that my audience is trying to do just without maybe necessarily their particular problem So very inspiring. Well, I love that and it's really, you know in talking engaging in this podcast podcast Engaging with your community. I think bringing the ick to light Bringing the ickiness the nastiness the hot messness of your life to light I think That's just one simple thing that we can all do to feel more connected and less isolated So conversations with friends and family and you know, you know who those people are we in the breast world We call them your breast buddy You are just full of these So the moral of the story here in the end is not only are we able to navigate through the most Difficulto time, right? You've always you've gotten through every challenge You've ever faced if you're listening you have actually gotten through every challenge you've ever faced So but not only can we just be okay in in Jessica's case? You could even I'm going to say from where I sit as a friend of yours like better than okay So let's talk about what you turn this into because it's tremendous. Go ahead. Let's hear it. What did you make? Okay, well, yes, it can be okay. I will just reiterate that and yes It seems like I'm all about breasts because I am I mean they're on my nails I carry a fake one around. Oh, it just I'm yeah all about the rest of me around that But at the end of the day Everything that I do is really centered about around one concept Which I really think that the audience will it will resonate with them is I believe that if we can increase Connection between each other about that stuff that is icky, right if we can in increase connection We are going to decrease those feelings of isolation Which we all know can be debilitating and paralyzing and shaming and guilt-filled Which we don't want so if we can increase the connection between people We decrease the feelings of isolation and at the end of the day We increase the action we need to take whether big or small taking those mental health Baby steps or going as far as getting a a breast mammogram if something doesn't seem right. So conceptually that's what I'm all about so That that's sort of the core of everything that I do, but really Night out with the girls. We're just a we're a virtual wellness company and we offer a virtual wellness Early breast cancer detection program called the breast education Wink wink because it's the best education Just I know People are going to be like don't she's too cheesy. Um, it's all good. It's all good So the breast education and what's so special about that is it is designed for everyone So um anyone who has breast tissue, we always say we are into you Everyone is welcome and what we really do is give people the kind of breast health 101 on how and when to Detect breast cancer early and we do that through Videos that we that that feature are I have a team of health care providers as well as breast cancer survivors So you can hear All from them and if their experiences are so rich. I've got downloadables activities Conversation starters. So it's still very focused on that connection conversation and comfort and we you know Early detection is so important. It needs to be Like we're in breast cancer awareness month. That's great. I appreciate it. It's important But we need to move from awareness to action and breast cancer can happen outside of october So really we focus on a few key things that I actually think would really relate To all the audience listening and tuning in today Follow your gut If something does not seem right Physically with your breaths emotionally mentally Follow your gut and contact a health care provider and the other main thing is Take action when something doesn't seem right. So don't wait as scary as it is Just make that phone call and those are really Two important things that I think pertains to just about Anyone and everyone and the third is you know Bring the right people into your life and I alluded to that and we call those people your breast Buddies, but who are those people who are going to listen without judgment? Who are not going to be like that's great that you're going through that? Let me tell you about my story Who's going to be the the people in your life who hold you to a healthy loving degree of accountability that there's no shame and there's no guilt so overall That's what we focus on and so we do this the breast education is for The workplace so employers Can offer it to their employees, which is really special and what an awesome way to demonstrate your to your employees that you like You care about them You care about their physical health and their mental health because it's not connected, right? And we also offer it for individuals I my goal is to never leave anyone out of having the opportunity to learn how to detect breast cancer early hell of a job It's it's wonderful. And and you know, I love it. I love talking about Press and early detection. I'm not kidding everywhere I go because what we want to do and what you're doing drew and what I'm doing and what the your community is doing is We are normalizing a conversation that needs to be had about very important topics Yeah, I like you've had we've all had things and we're all going to be okay when we're together and we're talking about it Bringing it to light I like how you've taken the the conversation that needs to be had about breast health And taken it out of the paper gown environment and put it into an environment where you can actually have the conversation More comfortably more organically Without a big light shining on you be freezing your ass off. So I Absolutely, yes, and we love our health care providers and our health providers on the team actually get to learn from our Participants like what what can they do to better? serve their patients Tremendous. Jess tremendous. I I I have tremendous amount of admiration and respect for what you've built out of tragedy clearly And and pain and heartache and adversity and you truly are a story of somebody who really made a useful thing out of that So not only can we navigate through the nasties the icky the ick as Jess says But you can be okay and you can even thrive afterwards Which is for anybody who's dealing with the disorders that i'm talking about all the time in the problems Many many people come through the other side of this and they do wind up thriving and positive stuff comes out of it So thank you. Jess. I appreciate you coming by. I have it up on the screen if you're watching night out with the girls It's night out with the girls.com Yep, so Uh, but if you would like to find more about what if I just I will have all of her links Go to the anxious truth.com slash 182 because it's episode number 182. I'll have all of jess's links so you can get in touch with her and That's it. You got questions or whatever. I will pass them along Yes, it would be willing to answer Please and it's been so great being with all of you virtually and just know If you've noticed anything if you've noticed anything that doesn't seem right with your breasts Always tell people this may be the sign if you're tuning into this that it's time for you to To take action because the information is freeing. It is very freeing Knowing is better than not knowing. Yes. Yes, even when it's scary stuff. So good job. Good job All right, folks. I guess we're gonna kind of wrap it up here Um, appreciate you coming by as always You out with afterglow by my buddy ben drake as I usually do you can find ben online at ben drake music dot com And i'm going to ask a favor if you are listening to the podcast on itunes or any platform that lets you rate a review Then leave us a five star rating if you dig it and then take an extra 30 seconds and write a review So other people can find the podcast tell them how great jess was by the way They will want to know that And that's uh, what else can I tell if you're watching on youtube? I think i'm supposed to say like and subscribe I'm the worst influencer ever like i'm never going to get an influencer card Anyway, do it do all the things hit all the buttons. You guys know what to do and find all my stuff at the anxious Truth.com. I appreciate you guys coming by enjoy the music. We'll see you next week and as I always say This is the way