 great news today. Every human is one decision away from receiving Jesus into their life. And we're so honored to be here today to share him with you. I'm Amy Schaefer. I'm here with Tom and Anna, and we are on Hope Today, Anna. We're bringing Hope. That's right. That's right. And we have a wonderful guest with us today. Her name is Shauna Pilgrim, and she wrote this book. It's called Translating Jesus. So we're going to be talking about the language of culture and the language of Christians. And you know, if you've been around for very long, you kind of get the sense that our languages can be a little bit different. Sometimes they can clash and be misunderstood. And so she's going to help us understand how to share our faith with non-believers in a way that does not turn them away, but draws them towards the heart of God. I love what's the teaching she did where she can really speak teenager really well. I mean, I don't know. Do you guys have teenagers right now? Do you really speak teenager well? This is going to be the lit. This show is lit. It's hype. It's all the rage. It's trending right now. This program is so like relevant and we're so authentic. And yes, we know the whole language of teenagers because we have teenagers. But here's the deal. We're Christians. We're believers and we actually want to be relevant and to the world. I mean, we can't be the weird people in our own hallelujah. Praise the Lord. They're like, what are you? Which God? Who are you praising? What are you talking about? You know, we've got to be relevant because Jesus wants us to be the salt and the light. He wants us to draw people closer to him. So I think we're going to learn a lot today. I'm excited. I know. I think so too. The one thing that Shana talked about was how kindness just kindness towards people gets their attention and it can open doors to open a conversation. Yeah, absolutely. There's so many different ways and we just want to always remind you that we have prayer partners. Maybe you need to make a connection today. Maybe you need someone to pray with you. We believe in prayer. We believe that God wants to make that connection with you and we have prayer partners standing by that if you want to pray with someone today, they'll be glad to pray with you. You can give them a call there and get someone who that's their ministry. That's why they're here. That's why they want to pray with you. Well, right now, we're going to need prayer as we go into stump the host. Okay, so you know how it goes, right? Stump the host. The the the producers, the main producers here try to embarrass us on TV with questions that we may not know the answer to. And we need your help too. So we want you to play along. We have not seen these questions and we hope we know the answer. Here's the first one. What profit was sent as a missionary to the Ninevites? Jonah. Jonah. Yeah, there we go. Okay. Easy peasy with the first one. They started us off easy. Alright, yep. It is Jonah. It's a great story and it's also sound sight and sounds theater sometimes is where I saw it. Alright, second question. The belt and the armor of God represents what? Truth. Truth. Hey, you guys are good. The belt of truth, right? Which holds everything together. Yes. You know, I was struggling with that. You know, I don't know. I'm glad that you guys know. You were not. I was. I was I was starting to go through the the all the armor, you know, and it's like, yeah, it didn't just come right out. Yeah. Well, I just know that because it holds the whole armor together when it's the belt of truth, the word of God. Yeah, very good. Okay, here's the last one. What Athenian judge was converted under Paul's preaching? Here's another book of Acts one, which I think I have the book of Acts memorized and then they get every time you give me a book of Acts question, I can't convert it. I don't know that one. Oh, do we call our lifeline our guest? Oh, do we dare? Let's let's call it our guest. What Athenian judge? We're giving you the heart under Paul's preaching. Why is was Felix the judge? Who was he and Paul story? Felix was he was he was a Roman pro counsel or something. Roman, you know, like head of the Romans. I don't think it was Felix. We don't have any other guesses here. Can we have a hint? Can you give us the first letter? We're appealing to the producers now. First letter producers first letter. D. D. It's not helping us. Dumb and dumber. I think we're we're drawn to black. Dionysius. Oh, okay. Okay, that's easy to remember. Hide my face in shame. Anyway, thank you for playing along. We all right. Well, I do want to mention to you that you can go to hope today or our page at ctvn.org and go to our hope today page and see the answers, especially the one we didn't get. Yes, correct. All right. Well, our guest today, Shauna Pilgrim wrote a book called Translating Jesus. She joins us to share how we can share our faith in a language that our culture can understand. So Shauna along with her husband, Colleen Epic Church, a multi ethnic congregation in the heart of San Francisco. Shauna, welcome to today. Good morning. Today. Welcome to hope today. We do know the name of our show too. We may not know Dionysius, but we do know that I think I need that extra cup of coffee. But Shauna, I would love if you would start off by sharing with us a bit about the two different languages. You say there is the language of Christians and then there's the language of culture. Absolutely. Well, I think I just was proof there are all four of us were proof there as we were trying to figure out who was that judge and the in the book of Acts like there is a language of Christianity. It's rooted in scripture. That's where we get our knowledge. That's how we speak the language of Christ. But there's another language. And I think so often as Christians, we get so fixated on learning how to speak Christianity and how to connect with God and the people of God that we forget how to connect and relate to our culture. And just like you said, Anna, it's two different languages. And the way we learn culture is by paying attention. We never completely disconnect from the culture that we're actually moving about in every day, but we stay connected. We listen, we pay attention because that's how we get to speak the language of culture. And you call it being bilingual, right? Yes. Okay, you also talk about how the language of Jesus is prayer. So when we're talking about understanding these two languages, where does that language of prayer come in? Absolutely. And I know we're all learning. I don't know. I've never met a Christian that says I have figured prayer out. I'm an expert at this, rather just like prayer, we're constantly learning, we're growing in it as we connect with God. But prayer is not supposed to be something that we just keep to our prayer closets or we just keep at the table. But Jesus is with us, prayer brings Jesus into everything. So as we're moving throughout our day, we bring Jesus into every situation, every conversation with prayer. So the language of culture is paying attention. And the language of Christ is prayer. What happens when we bring these together, we begin to speak two languages. So a famous evangelist and pastor John Stott teaches the art of double listening. So double listening is this, it's me sitting or standing maybe I'm standing in a line at the grocery store. And I'm aware of the Holy Spirit. I'm aware of his voice. I'm connected to God that way. But at the same time, I'm connected and listening to the cashier telling me about our day or telling me about a sore arm. And so we're becoming bilingual as we're listening to both the Holy Spirit, listening to the person that we're engaging with in cultures so that we can better communicate God's love in a language that they understand. Yeah. And so you share a lot of great stories in your book and you break it into three places where Jesus spent time the gate, the cross and the table. So let's start with the gate. What is the gate and what's one of your favorite stories from the gate? Yes, and I love telling stories because stories just what it just brings me to a place where like we were all having these stories every single day. And I tell stories to say that this is contagious. The more you start bringing Jesus into conversations, like we all can do this we are I call it in the book we are every day evangelist every single day we have the opportunity to bring Jesus into conversations and nine times out of 10. I finished that conversation or a walk away from it. I could have done that differently or I feel like I could have done that better or I hope I get another opportunity to connect with that person. But at the gate, the gate represents the marketplace. It's where we're at every day. And we're all in a variety of places. And so and I can't remember if you said like to describe all three, but that's what the gate is. The cross is connecting with our Christian community, our church and people who believe what we believe. And then the table are those moments where we find ourselves. We're both culture and Christianity collide. And then when you're at the gate, you have this great story about Charleston, who you met in marshals of all places, which is one of my favorite stores. Can you tell us about Charleston? Yes, I sometimes I just pray that I'll get an opportunity to meet Charleston again. But he and I both just found ourselves in marshals, but we were there for two very different reasons. And I was between meetings, I had stepped into marshals and, you know, just a little bit of shop therapy going on. And while I'm going through the women's dress rack, Charleston, of course, I didn't know him at the time, but he bumps up to me. And Charleston, I realized is packing some of the store goods into his like several layers of clothes that he had on. And I freeze, because I realized like, well, I might be shopping for something, I'm completely distracted beside the man who is attempting to shop lift at marshals. And but at the same time, I think that God used this to get my attention. Like I believe wholeheartedly hindsight is everything. I was there for one reason, and God had something for me to tell Charleston. So when I say I froze, I mean, my feet would not move. My hands would not move. My brain stopped thinking about the dress that looked lovely on the rack. And I cannot do anything until I did what would felt so pressing on my heart. And it was to tell Charleston how much Jesus loved him. Now, these are not three words that I tell every person that I meet throughout the day. But in that moment, I was convinced that Charleston needed to hear that. And so just loud enough for he and I to hear it, I said, sir, I don't know what you're going through. But I'm supposed to tell you that Jesus loves you. He loves you so much. And up to this point, I've only engaged with the backside of him. And he turned and looked at me and gave me the most sincere thank you I've ever received. And he just said, thank you. I needed to hear that. Thank you so much. And at that moment, I began to be able to move again. And my eye spot this beautiful gray velvet dress. So I take it off the rack. I head to the dressing room. And when I come out of the dressing room, by the way, the dress fit perfectly. But when I come out of the dressing room, he's standing right there. And I don't want you to think scary. I just want you to think that God was up to something. And he begins to tell me that he has not heard how much Jesus loves him for so many years. He remembers his grandmother telling him that as he grew up. And he's just hit he's had a really rough, a really rough life. And I just connected with him. I pointed him to where our church was, which is actually across the street from Marshall's invited him to come. And as I go to pay for the dress, I find myself checking out with a cashier. And this cashier is the one who I knew had talked to Charleston earlier. And she told me what you told him, calls him to take everything that he was shoving in his jacket, and put it in the basket and walk away. And the cashier ended up being the store manager. And she told me that once he told her what I had said that Jesus loves you, the store manager affirmed that in him because she too is a Christ follower. And so my favorite moment of that day is that the store manager, Maggie, myself and Charleston were all three at the gate, doing three various different things. But God used myself and Maggie to convey one simple truth to Charleston. And I'm just going to believe by faith that it's changed his life, those three simple words, Jesus loves you. Wow. I mean, how simple and how wonderful. I love that story. I I've heard another story of yours about your Lyft driver when you you took a Lyft one time. And could you just share that one? I think his name was Aaron. Yes, that's what I call them in the book. Tom, it was, I mean, I can't think of how many people have ride share stories. Because I don't know of another place that's happening in society right now where two people, two strangers, enter into a ride share for a little bit of time and have an opportunity to talk. But at the same time, this can also happen when you're getting your hair cut, or maybe not so much at the dentist. But these opportunities happen all day long, where you get to chat with strangers, we get to chat with strangers. Well, on this particular day, living in the city, we had one car and my husband and the kids had already taken the car to church. So I call a Lyft and Aaron picks me up in his Camry. And he asked me where I'm headed and I tell him to church. And so we went, we went there both in conversation and in directions. And so on the drive, he begins to tell me that he's a religious person, and that he wants to raise his kids to love humanity and to do good things. And I began to tell him that it's because of my faith. That's how we are raising our kids in the city. And that God is at the center of everything we do. Well, we just continue to share things that we have in common. He's from the Middle East, and we both were just talking about how we've just are very much against anyone that's practicing evil in the name of religion. And immediately the conversation shifted as we passed by an Airbnb billboard in our city. And at the time, the billboard said, help or support Afghan refugees. And he pointed to that sign before we exited off the freeway. And he said, that's where my family's from. And he's doing everything he can with the paperwork to get them out of there. And I could just tell, I could tell he was very heavy hearted. And I said, Hey, Aaron, do you mind if I just pray with you? And he offered for me to do that. And so I just told him the only thing is that he had to keep his eyes open while we continued the drive to the to my church. And I just began to pray to God because I knew he believed in a God. So I prayed to God that he would give Aaron peace, that he would protect his family. And I prayed in the name of Jesus. And as he pulled over to the side to let me out, he told me one, no one had ever prayed for him in the car before. And then two, he said he had an overwhelming sense of peace. Well, Tom, you and I know that that peace only comes from Jesus Christ. But that day in the lift, Aaron got to experience the peace of Jesus Christ. Now I didn't tell him my salvation story. He didn't find a parking spot and get out and come into church. But I do believe that I got to speak his language, a language that he was comfortable with. And all of that came from and this is what's so amazing about who God is all that comes from what happens in our lives as we connect to God through prayer and through his word. It's not intended to stay inside. It's intended to come out. And again, not perfectly, but it's amazing what is inside every believer. And God wants to use that perfectly and perfectly just as we are and with who he puts in our path. Shauna, the one powerful theme to that I see coming out of both of those stories is that as a believer, you took time to see the person that was near you, whether you were in the store, whether you were in a car and with an Uber driver, you took time to see them and listen to them. And the truth is so many people are struggling and going through things and they feel like they're invisible in this world. And when we get to see them, we have that opportunity to hear what God is saying and how to speak into their lives. So can you talk a little bit too about the place of the cross? Why is that important for us? Yeah, and I would just say for all of us, it's so important that just paying attention today, today, just pay attention to who God has in front of you. I just believe that this eye muscle, this attentive muscle grows on the daily. And so it's not that we have to reach everyone in a given day, but I really do believe that the more we pay attention, the more God shows us and more conversations he puts us in. But the place at the cross and what I love so much about who Jesus is for every single one of us, the place at the cross, it's a place that we keep going back and forth to. I know, yes, we came to the cross for salvation, but I believe that repentant people are receptive people that we have to keep coming to the cross on a daily basis. And so it's not that we come to the cross for salvation, we're done, we never have to go back, our sins are forgiven, but rather it's a place that we get to continue to come to God, connect with him. And I believe this speaks so powerfully to someone that is curious, that's skeptic, that's not quite sure that Jesus can love them. I think as Christians, we get to model this to the world that, hey, I continually have to come to God. I continually have to come to God for forgiveness, for repentance. And again, like I said, I think repentant people are receptive people. So it's just coming to the cross daily and it's not this linear path between, okay, I meet people at the gate, I go to the cross and then I go to the table, but it's this back and forth, a nonlinear path that we're taking between the gate, the cross and the table on a daily basis. Shauna, what do you think happens to Christians and believers that do not share Jesus? Like ever. They don't care about it, they get in and out of the Uber car, they go in and out of lows, they and they don't think to stop and tell about Jesus. What do you think is happening there? That's a good question and I think it can vary for everyone, but when we are connected, if you have connected with Jesus today, just even thanking him for the air you breathe, for his word that we get to have here in the United States of America that feed our soul, that convict us, that tell us how to live. If we are connected with him, his Holy Spirit in us is going to prompt our hearts to connect with other people. So I don't know if we're connected with him, if we're not seeing others around us through the lens of Christ. So my encouragement to anyone who feels like I don't have this conviction, I don't have this prompting, I don't have this loving care for my neighbor. I would say remember your story, remember what Jesus has done for you and if he's made a way for you, for your sins to be forgiven and for you to have a relationship with him, that alone should compel you and remind you of the love he has for you to tell that to someone else. So I would say to anyone who says like, I don't have that love for someone else, I would say remember what Jesus has done for you and if you've never had that connection with Jesus and what he's done for you on the cross, start there. Shadda, we're just so thankful for the encouragement that you give to us as believers to share our faith in very practical, relevant ways with those that we meet every day. So thank you so much for your book. Again, it is called Translating Jesus, How to Share Your Faith in Language Today's Culture Can Understand. Thanks so much for being with us. Thank you, Anna. It's fantastic. Fantastic. So good. You know, just that, I love that organic kind of nature of just living our lives and walking with Christ and bringing Christ to others. In fact, we have a scripture about that right now. We want to share with you. It's Colossians 4 verses 5 and 6 and it says this, Be wise in the way you act towards outsiders. Make the most of every opportunity. Let your conversation be always full of grace. Season with salt so that you may know how to answer everyone. Amy, how's that verse strike you? Well, I love it, you know, in the amplified translation where it says that you're pleasant and winsome. So there's got to be something about your conversations that is winsome to the person listening. So it's not this aggressive, I know better, you're a loser, get your life in order. It's like there's something likeable about you that people just want to talk to you about whatever. Last night we had church service, okay? And we're teaching, you know, on the Holy Spirit and I didn't know this, but there was a guy in church that somebody had talked to in a Home Depot in the lumber department a year ago and said, you really should go to church. You know, Jesus loves you and he said, I've got a great church you should go to. He said, for one year I've been thinking, I need to show up at that church and he came last night. You just never know when you're in those moments, when you're in marshals, you're doing the every day, you're in the giant eagle, wherever you go. Just say, Lord, give me a divine connection today so that I can share the love of Jesus with people. It's honestly, it's part of our responsibility as Christians. If you, if this is all about you and only for you and you're just, there's an old song called, you know, a fat, fat, fat, fat, little baby. That's what you are in Christ because you're supposed to give it away. It's not just all for you. Yeah, that's right. I think that's a key thing you said to, to ask the Lord for a divine connection while you go out in the day. I love the concept of just seeing people when we are out and about. Let's try to stay off our phones. Let's just be aware of those around us. Let's take time to look into their faces because the truth is so many are searching. So many are struggling and they're trying things that don't fulfill. They don't satisfy. And as believers, we know what fully satisfies. And that is the love of Christ. Our lives are hidden in him. So when we have the opportunity and the privilege to tell somebody that Jesus loves them or to just smile and be friendly and gosh, if we get the opportunity to hear what they're going through and then say, can I pray for you? What an awesome privilege that we have as believers of God. Absolutely. And I would just say that while it isn't always the easiest thing, it is something and you may even say, well, I'm not a minister. I don't know what to say. Well, just saying Jesus loves you. My goodness, that is the easiest thing to say and God will give you ways to enter in and say that in a way that is effective in touching their life. But anything that you can do to show love and show Christ is a good thing. And Shauna in her book said every human is one decision away from receiving Christ. So you just never know. And so I'm going to ask that you get uncomfortable this week that God just shakes you up, gives you like let's love what he loves. Let's be passionate about what he's passionate about. He loves people. He is passionate about people. Jesus loves you and we want you to know that today and then we want you to take it to the streets. We want you to go public with this message so people can find hope today. On tomorrow's Hope Today, encouraging others to be the kind of change they want to see in the world. Author and pastor Greg Atkinson offers help to those who are struggling with unforgiveness and examines how kindness is the key to unlocking change in today's world. That's tomorrow on Hope Today. Cornerstone Television wishes to thank all our faithful viewers whose consistent prayers and financial support have made this program possible.