 Sing in Spanish class the ace of spades, but change the words to D. A. C. C. D. A. C. C. Tontis 16 D. A. C. C. All right, so a quick insta pole in our our discord and chat which means I need to make sure I can see discord Which hat for hat Friday? the Atomic's hat from Albuquerque, New Mexico the classic Seattle pilots hat with the scrambled eggs or the Antique CNET networks hat. Oh that one right there which of the three so so lens vote is in For the CNET networks hat just shout it out IRC or discord and We'll take an eyeball of the results So far CNET winning in How could it not? Oh the isotopes. Sorry Fred. I said atomics, which is not even the name of the team Thank you Fred a couple for the isotopes mostly for CNET Couple more for the isotopes. Nobody wants to see the Seattle pilots hat apparently. He is silverblade Between isotopes and CNET now isotopes It's Christmas I think the CNET networks that's winning I think it's gonna win You can't by the way in this time Zoe Thank you MLB for putting the Cleveland Houston series. Yeah, right now. You don't want to watch that game today There you come No, because everybody only cares about Boston, New York. That's why Ah Patrick Norton welcome back again. Yeah, I just typed out a really nasty email to common So I think they're rebooting doing stuff on the network and then rebooting between one and two Can you be honest about it because this is the fourth time I've been dropped in the middle of a podcast Which is how I make my living. Could you guys could you do you mind do you mind? You're a startup Yeah, I I will make you famous for being a pain in my ass Yeah, all right It's killing me when they do this Killing me killing you with not kind of killing me without 30 seconds 30 seconds to air everybody get ready Let's go people. Let's go places everyone Sorry Smiles everyone smiles everyone. Okay. Yeah 15 seconds 15 seconds. Everybody good. Everybody ready. Do you need a drink need a breath? Getting what oh no, it happened again. All right nevermind. We're not starting in 15 seconds We'll be starting later than that And yeah video folks if you just joined us Sarah Lane it has the day off She and Otis are Traveling the world together the trim Like will buries traveling So Tom real quickly. Are you are you rooting for the NL this year or the AL this year? Oh, no, I'm kind of all over the place. I do like the Rockies Despite the fact that they kept my cardinals out of the wild card. I've always had a soft spot for the Rockies I do like that the Rockies beat the Cubs. So that that endears them quite a bit to me. That's I'll be cheering for the Dodgers because they're local and they're my wife's team sure But on the AL side, what do we got? I'll cheer for Cleveland because of you honestly. Yeah, that's the only AL team I have the slightest bit of care about I want to see the Astros are fine I just I still not comfortable with them being in the American League Yeah, all right. All right, Patrick's back. All right. Yeah, I have switched to my Phone network. Yeah, okay. You might want to drop the hangout band with usage down Preventatively so far it's it's okay. I got like 35 or 50 gigabytes a month. Yeah, you're a little near your videos a little jerky But your audio sounds fine. Oh Okay, jerky audio So basically if you lower the bandwidth your video gets a little smoother Even though it's not as as defined. Yeah, we know what you look like It's right next to the camera off if you hover up to the top of the video screen Oh, it's a just bandage. I always wonder what that was. Yeah, I'll just do it to 50% low limit bandwidth. Yeah That that's probably just a sound preventative measure. Okay back to 30 seconds 30 seconds to air and we mean it this time So I just need to calculate Yeah, yeah, you're gonna be a couple minutes off. All right 15 seconds and We're not even kidding But Patrick will have things to say about his ISP after the show I'm sure here we go. All right five four three two one Thanks to everyone who supports daily tech news show directly to find out more head to daily tech news show comm slash support This is the daily tech news for Friday October 5th 2018 in Los Angeles, I'm Tom Merritt in Cleveland representing the currently trailing Indians. I'm Len Peralta Alameda, California, I am Patrick Norton And from somewhere in LA County, I don't know where I am the show's producer Roger chain It's our lane has a day off today. She's is traveling the lands with her dog Otis I'm sure it's gonna be full of stories when she returns next week, but let's start with a few tech things you should know Microsoft announced its surface Pro 6 starting at $899 and its surface laptop to starting at $999, but When they first went up for order You could only get those prices if you bought a bundle which ended up costing more than that Then Thursday versions of both products were offered at that starting price with no bundled involve But only if you got the color platinum if you wanted other colors, you could only get more expensive versions I'll be it with higher specs like 256 gigabytes of storage instead of 128. So the complaining has begun Samsung issued its Q3 forecast expecting record operating profits of around 17 and a half trillion won That's up 20.4% from a year ago beating analyst estimates demand for Samsung's memory chips makes up the largest part of that growth Chips account for 80% of Samsung's operating profit. Alright, let's talk a little bit more about this China hardware hack The denials have not stopped Amazon Apple Super Micro and China all issued more detailed denials of the Bloomberg story that if you missed yesterday's episode Claimed that motherboards from Super Micro were found to contain chips that created backdoor access now Amazon Issued a full-page statement denies finding malicious chips or working with the FBI and says its third party only found Software issues with super microchips the Bloomberg story said the third party is the one that found the hardware Apple denied finding malicious chips or having contact with the FBI and disputed the number of super micro motherboards It ever owned saying it was only 2000 not 7000 Super micro denied any investigation happened or that it was contacted by any government agency regarding any kind of issue like this and China continued its call for cooperation on supply chain security in addition the National Cyber Security Center, which is part of the UK's GCHQ spy agency told Reuters it has no reason to doubt Apple and Amazon on these denials and it added That confidentially it quote urges anybody with credible intelligence about these reports to contact us and The Washington Post is quoting multiple anonymous US officials saying they're unsure of the accuracy of the story That doesn't stop Bloomberg though Bloomberg posted a follow-up to the chip hack story alleging super micro was the target of two software Attacks as well. These are are less Groundbreaking than the hardware hack Bloomberg sources say a customer portal was infected That's one that was used for critical software updates was breached in 2015 to deliver some infected firmware That would grant outside access to server communications Facebook apparently was affected by this breach and said in a statement that it had Purchased super micro motherboards for use in a lab, but the hardware was never put into production use Apple also described a firmware issue in its denial of the hardware attack and another source Told Bloomberg Apple found that some cards from super micro came without dated firmware that included a known But patched if it had been updated vulnerability that could have been exploited Patrick this this is beginning to fascinate me not just on the technical aspects, which we talked about yesterday but on these very Specific and out of character denials even when you're you're denying something for real You usually don't go to this length to deny it certainly Apple is out of character issuing a full page statement on this I Mean apples. Okay, so, you know Apple never has security issues and when they have security issues They downplay them or they put them in pate 72 When you click through on the update of something for them to be like we only own 2,000 of those motherboards not 7,000 if this is This is weird and the denials are peculiar I You know, I don't even I it's I'm with you. I don't One it's a huge story from Bloomberg to The level of crazy that's going on around it right now in terms of the responses They're all I mean, you know, I don't use this word often enough Yeah, no the the the extended show that goes out to patrons Which often is is a little sillier and involves food Involved a discussion between Justin and I kind of parsing the original statements that Amazon and Apple gave which were short But man my view on this changed when I saw these very detailed statements because it's not that I immediately say Oh, well, they must be telling the truth in Bloomberg is wrong It creates the kind of thing that I try to do on this show is read the tea leaves Well, I've been doing this long enough to say well when you see this it usually means that I've never seen this before Bloomberg is well-respected has a vetted editorial process There are very good reasons you keep your sources anonymous Because if you don't have them be anonymous sometimes you blow them as sources and you can't use them anymore Or you may ruin their life if they're in the intelligence agency I think one of the best articles on this was written by TechCrunch just about the difficulties of covering Cyber security and the intelligence agencies in general because your sources have to be anonymous So it's not that they're the sources are anonymous That's the problem with Bloomberg. In fact Bloomberg went very far to say we got multiple sources that tell us the same thing We got 17 people corroborating this story in one way or another so they did their due diligence They've got an editorial staff that wouldn't let their reporter put this out if they didn't feel comfortable that these sources were were Accurate and reliable and yet instead of the usual flat denials No, that's not true or the vague denials which might imply a gag order You have Amazon and Apple very detailed saying no no hardware never happened Didn't talk to the FBI and Apple even saying and we're not under a gag order on this in case that's what you thought Yeah, it's You know, look, it's it's the most verbiage. I think of Verbiage I think I've ever seen from an Apple Announcement that wasn't I mean usually when Apple's foaming at the mouth It's because they're telling you how wonderful their new widget is Right, I mean it's super and it's shiny and they had been revolutionaries. Yeah, yeah You know for them to for them to be basically This this is Apple in a corner and I don't know who they're reacting for yeah I mean this this seems like posturing for a third party who is you know, not super micro and not the FBI This is like somebody have Apple has contractual obligations with or something you know I mean, this is this is this smells like Apple posturing Well and the GCH Q Yeah, the GCH Q not having to be badgered into issuing a statement But just coming out with a statement is odd Zach Whittaker at Tech Rancher I just mentioned earlier his best guess at what could explain this is the people who discovered it couldn't tell anyone There are cases in national security situations where you aren't even allowed to tell your boss The CEOs of these companies might not know and there there are other examples of those kind of stories that are now known from the past He's like that could be one scenario that explains this which is the people that discovered these chips were told very quickly Don't you tell a soul that this existed for national security reasons? Yeah Alright, let's move along the US state of California has passed a law requiring net connected devices basically targeting Internet of Things type devices to use unique passwords when they're sold to consumers or Force consumers to choose passwords before the device goes into operation But basically saying you have to take reasonable security measures You can't just have a default one two three four five or admin password on routers and Internet of Things devices Customers also now have a prison provision under this law that allows them to more easily sue for damages if they experience harm as a result of a company Ignoring this law. What do you think Patrick? I mean, it's good practice to say you should in fact put out unique passwords on your devices I Okay so Now every manufacturer is going to have to create a unique password for There each individual product or or just make the setup process require the consumer to set a password themselves I think that's probably the more reasonable route. Yeah Okay, I This I know this is on a long list of peculiar things that have come out of the legislature this year I mean on one hand, you know as someone who deals with a lot of Pathetic security situations not because I am super security guy But just because people are like hey my my thing is acting on it's like oh well You've never updated it. You've got your route it. I mean like your router has all of the social diseases You know, I I think everything should have passwords the problem is is like oh it should have a good password It's not it should have a good password and you know, they're not Fixing any of the other things that are plenty of other things. I mean that is a fair point Forcing people to adapt firmware updates could could have been a part of this law I'm not saying it should have been but you know that that is another Element that could that causes a security problem. So I'm a little on your side I think this is a good practice cut companies absolutely should require their users to set up a unique password on a device Before it goes into operation. You shouldn't have default passwords out in the wild like that. I Don't love the idea of it being a state law, but I guess if it nudges people down the right road What's what'll be awesome is is you know, this is You know Are they going like is are you know, is neck you're gonna change their practices for this? Is is your links is gonna change their practices for this is ace is gonna change a practice for this They want to sell California. They're gonna need so basically so so Amazon will now have to keep track of all of the vendors Who do or do you and I have secure passwords on all of the internet of crap stuff? That's available You know what I mean like that's a good question Well, Amazon be liable for selling a device that is found this I I haven't read the law closely enough to know I would only the manufacturer would be They're saying each gadget must have its own unique passwords or or or Require a password to be set up by the user, right rather than having to to set it up although the Amazon does a good job of of Having unique information on each device when you order it. So there there are system. Well, I guess if they can keep, you know Various types of spray paint glues and solvents out of California. Well, like when you buy a fire device This is a problem for me whenever I buy a fire device It always comes with my account on it and then I have to switch it to Eileen's because I bought it on my Amazon account, but I'm like that. I don't want my account on there. I want Eileen's again. She owns all the good movies Tech crunch reports screenshots from tipster Jane mansion Wong show that Instagram has prototyped a privacy setting to let you share your location history with Facebook There is a concern here, but there's a lot of overreaction to this If turned on the setting would use your GPA location from Instagram To target ads in Facebook and Instagram as well as populate the Facebook profile activity log Now the prototype Wong saw was opt-in it defaulted to that being off You had to go in and turn it on as a user and Facebook told tech crunch It has not changed Instagram's location settings Instagram does not store any data location data now And it and it is always testing things it says so It's concerning that they're trying to convince you to do this because it's just going to target more ads at you But at least Patrick it's not as bad as some of the headlines would make you think in that It's not going to be turned on automatically or at least it wasn't it's prototype I there's nothing I do about completely going on for 10 or 15 minutes But you have to you have to admit like some people are overreacting to this As if they were forcing you to share your location and and this is maybe you don't want them to do this But if they're going to this is the best practice. No, I that that I get it, but it's also it's it's Facebook does something this week everyone overreacts Instagram does something, you know weird this week Everyone overreacts, but with a much higher quality of photos Beautiful way with such good life London's National Theatre and Accenture's extended reality group have partnered to create augmented reality glasses for patrons with hearing impairments That lets them better enjoy the theatre's production They are using the Epson Moverio BT 350 smart glasses to show you live captioning during the performance They use some voice-following software that listens to the production and then finds where you are in a script and Shows you the proper text including things like lighting and sound cues 90 glasses are available in the theatre for Hades Town and Warhorse right now And we'll roll out to all the productions at the National Theatre later this month It's very cool. Yeah Yeah, we don't hear enough stories like this, right? Well, we were it was funny. We were talking about the Amazon basics microwave with al e x a and you know kind of you know Feeling silly about it and we got a couple emails on tech thing from viewers who are visually impaired One of whom was like you never think about you know, nobody ever thinks about you know people, you know with with with you know Different abilities well, especially most microwaves have those flat buttons where you can't even feel them very well And yeah, well tell which one's which well I found it like an entire website dedicated or entire set of pages on a website dedicated to which microwaves are the most friendly for visually impaired people and Basically one of the guys said is you you pretty much can't use any advanced features. You can memorize buttons There are buttons with Braille on a couple of manufacturers or you know, at least with bumps that function like Braille I'm actually Braille But one of the guys said look yes This is kind of silly, but it would be incredibly useful for me And I hope it's a harbinger of having more and more voice control devices because They are so incredibly useful which also led to be reading a bunch of articles about people who are taking advantage of Google Home and You know echo Equipment to really give them an unprecedented level of kind of freedom within their home I do I do love that the story doesn't involve augmented reality Promises it involves augmented reality reality. It's not, you know, it's not overreaching It's just showing you captioning, you know floating in your field of view. That's what makes it augmented reality And it's not from Google. It's it's not from Microsoft. It's from Epson And Accenture, you know, which is a huge company, but and it's and it's done to promote the arts in the National Theatre and And and so yeah, I think this is a really really cool thing that that's being done. Well done. Good on you National Theatre Golf Club. To get all the tech headlines each day in about five minutes Be sure to subscribe to dailytechheadlines.com now You may be thinking how did you've not talk about the iMac and MacBook problems? We're gonna talk about them right now Mac rumors obtained an internal Apple document that shows that iMac Pro and 2018 MacBook Pro models must pass Apple diagnostics for certain repairs to be completed This has to do with the T2 chip secure enclave for the MacBook Pro that applies to repairs involving the display the logic board the touch ID and The top case which includes the keyboard battery trackpad and speakers This is all stuff that is in one way or another with the with the top case It's because the touch ID is in the the MacBook. I mean this is essentially Everything works with the secure enclave and everything looks with the secure enclave But iMac Pro it means repairs to the logic board in the flash storage now on the good side Apple stores and Authorized service providers can use Apple diagnostic suite. So it's not just Apple stores However repair shops out there and there are many one not too far from me without Apple certification Would not be able to complete the repairs so this immediately Patrick goes right into the right to repair Right Apple's gonna say hey if somebody's not certified they might not do a very good job In fact, it might not be safe to let those uncertified people fix stuff But the arguments against this are that well if you only allow certified people to fix it That drives the price up because you can limit that market Apple could counter that they've increased the number of authorized service providers worldwide to 5,000 recently and you could counter the 5,000 worldwide does not sound like that large of a number per capita, but You know, we've talked about this just not too long ago on DTNS September 19th in regards to farm equipment with the the John Deere Settlement with the Farm Bureau in California. That's sort of a lot of people criticize is giving away too much to big Manufacturing, how do you feel this fits into that whole conversation? It's funny you should mention that because I like dumped a whole bunch of links into the show notes my goodness, okay, so I Do on some level come from farm culture and I am a geek and actually a lot of farmers are geeks, especially today This is not new for Apple that's the first thing I want to say I mean one of my favorites I fix their articles of all time and I'm a huge I fix it fan I'm a huge Kyle Wiens fan. I'm a huge repair.org fan So let me let me just state my biases up front. I sure it should be easy to fix things But you know, I mean 2011 You know Apple's diabolical plan to screw your phone, which is such a wonderful title And that's when they started talking about the pentalobe screws that Apple put on iPhones because people were fixing their iPhones gosh darn it and You know, I mean it was just like last year where Apple was basically like iPhones are too complicated. You can't fix these Your consumers your role is to consume Consume more of our products. This is Patrick's Artistic impression of Apple's attitude not an exact quote. Yeah, this is yeah If you if Apple decides to attack anyone attack me leave the rest of This is not what Apple would say and in fact, I don't even think I my personal opinion is Apple is an anti repair Apple is pro Apple Apple's like we don't care about your right to repair We just want to make devices that we think work for us So the pentalobe screws could have been meant to prevent repairs But more likely someone was like hey These are really pretty and they work better in this in that case and someone said yeah But they'll be harder to repair and they said we don't care about that. Let's use. Yeah, let me let me let me quote on our Lisa Jackson apples vice president of policy and social initiatives in that motherboard article quote I don't think you can say repair ability equals longevity I often say if you're in the repair business repair seems like the answer But actually you need to design for the life cycle and Apple has designed for some time around durability Around the idea we can release the latest and greatest product your old product still works and has value Yeah, and it's like on one hand, you know, that's a very kind of like well. Yes If you're a manufacturer manufacturing is the answer But as you know, you know when I bought my last iPhone It bent and destroyed the screen in the first six days, you know Their idea of durability in my idea of durability may not actually mesh in any meaningful way Well, and their idea or their claim of durability in in a press spin. Let's be fair Let's be honest here. That's what that was is different than durability in reality and Where where I come down on this is listen, man If apple feels like pentalobe screws and and and glued on cases Fit their design aesthetic better Fine, you know what that's their right to make their product the way they want Don't mess with my right to melt that glue and buy a pentalobe screwdriver Or hire someone who isn't approved by apple to take a crack at it I I I think I think that there there needs to be a balance between that and whether you're designing for durability or not Doesn't matter. I I should be able if I own a piece of equipment to treat it however I want Well, yeah, and that's and that's where things get started getting really complicated. Um, you know, I mean There was a time when basically all the electronics you bought Or or a striking amount of the electronics you bought actually had The schematics for the entire circuit board layout. Now, obviously, you know, things are much more complicated Than they were back in the day Um, you know, but when you look at something before that when they didn't too That was that was kind of a wave of a right to repair of its own that that caused that sort of behavior Yeah, but I mean it was interesting. I actually got to go into Uh, phil sedau's warehouse in berkeley the guy who's reversed engineers all of the tools he needed to be able to You know control and reset things inside of the tesla control basically the tesla operating system um because he was he he got into salvaging teslas and he reverse engineered everything he needed to do to do that because tesla doesn't want you To salvage teslas teslas wants, you know tesla wants them to disappear And uh, you know, it's it's been interesting when you start, you know, listening to some of it like, you know, elan musk was was, you know, basically like, okay, you know We have to take and obviously elan musk at this particular stage of his career says a lot of things in a lot of ways It's getting harder and harder to wonder. Yeah, exactly. But go ahead Yeah, I mean, you know musk was like, you know teslas bringing collision repairs in houses outside firms take weeks To months to repairs driving tesla owners and us crazy. Uh, and then he also was kind of like, you know Oh, yeah. Well, it also could be part of the problem is is we're not actually making parts, uh available Listen, I I think you can go too far one way or the other on these things I think you can go too far in the conspiracy theory of of designed obsolescence I don't think that makes sense for most manufacturers. I'm not going to design obsolescence. I'm just saying I know you're not I'm just I'm just saying I think some people will tilt that way And I I don't think I don't think they're designing even necessarily to make it hard to repair But I also think you can go too far the other way in defense of the companies and say like Oh, oh, they're doing it for your best interest. No, they're not they're doing it for their best interest Whatever those interests are so I think there needs to be a balance and I think the digital millennium copyright act But I've been talking with you about since 1999 practically Uh, it is is is causing is it once again having an unattended side effect because While the argument from john deere and apple and others is yeah, but if you have just anybody repair these it's unsafe They could damage your device That's not what the digital millennium copyright act is meant to do and yet the dmca is what these companies use to defend Against your right to repair by saying well if you reengineer that software or you take that hardware design You're violating our copyright the dmca is not meant to keep you safe From things also that's it's kind of a silly argument. It's it's up to you If you want to fix something you should have the right to fix it if you damage it. Well, that's your your problem Yeah, and it's I mean one of the I don't know it's it's It's frustrating because you know when you look at the the john deere stuff's been really fascinating because One it's been amusing to watch people right be like farmers use gps. Yes. They use Vanduons and yeah In all sorts of amazing stuff. Um, these are big money operations Um, you know and it's and they're incredibly sophisticated and you know when you think about You know when you get over in the central valley over here some of the bigger operations They start um, you know, they run like the one of the things I saw a video of once I think it was basically eight tractors planting seeds running simultaneously because you know when they're when they're chief Basically the guy was in charge of the agricultural side of this business when he pulled the trigger They were going to lay down like I think it was 40 000 acres of whatever it was cotton, let's say As fast as they could do it like like the the conditions were optimal And the starting gun went off and they literally had eight or ten of these tractors running 24 seven like three shifts of drivers go go go go go and You know if one of those goes down You know, then you've got to like okay It's well, it's three in the morning and I've got to wait until john deere opens No, they have something else scheduled and you know, it sounds silly But it's alarming when you start to realize how difficult it can be to do even minimal maintenance Um, or how frustrating it can be. I mean the the massachusetts, uh, you know the acts the independent It's when you start looking at some of those like You know in massachusetts act to make um It easier for independence to get the information they need to repair cars The parts need to repair cars is one of the reasons why we have sort of federal laws about that because people got upset because You know with all due respect like some of the worst You know some of the worst service i've ever gotten is actually from a ford dealer Um, you know, I had a ford vehicle I kept I would take the vehicle to get fixed and the vehicle would come back and something new would be broken Because the repair guys were trying to jam through so much stuff. They weren't paying attention like you know Well, two things when when you have a captive market and or your money comes from sales of new things Again, i'm not saying there's a conspiracy theory where they break cars, but they don't prioritize things For service and repair in that situation. Well, it's and it's so You know when you when you start I I find it frustrating One, I mean personally You know, I find it frustrating that the way a lot of stuff is designed today is you can't upgrade it Or there's a minimal upgrade ability or there's minimal repair ability or the repair is basically like Spend an extra three hundred dollars for the service and then spend seventy nine dollars every time you break your phone That is a fantastic business model for apple. Yeah, yeah And they did lower some prices on that recently, but they did but I mean Yeah, you know, you still though have an entire you know, there's just there's too much design around Disposal I think and not enough design around repair I think a lot of companies and you know, it may in some cases. It's the lawyers, right? You know tesla is is you know any tesla that is in an accident They basically don't want to go back on the street because they're afraid something's going to happen And that's going to negatively impact the image of tesla and electric cars and you know the value of their stock Yeah, yeah, it's it's big and it's messy and it's complicated But I think right to repair is important because I think Most of us would actually like things to be able to be fixed Is that too much to ask? No, it seems seems right Let us know what you think on our subreddit. Do you agree? dailytechnewshow.reddit.com submit some stories there for us as well and This one was submitted today. You can also discuss this sort of thing at facebook.com slash group slash daily tech news show Real quickly email from dave from soon to be snowing michigan says for the chinese hack I participate in quite a few organizations within the automotive cyber security field Including an advisory board and a standards committee when we speak to mostly u.s. government representatives frequently Just last week. There was quite the passionate maybe even inflammatory presentation from a member of the cia Talking about the offensive cyber capabilities of russia china north korea and iran Some of my european colleagues were if not dismissive of the opinion That this was partisan rhetoric I'll be very interested if their opinions have changed with this news then again supply chain security is a very concerning topic with us So really this isn't particularly surprising other than someone evidently got caught Anyway, keep up the great work I already gave you guys a raise last year and you maybe do one this year as well. Thank you dave appreciate that And thank you len peralta for illustrating today's show. What have you done with us? Well, you know, I usually don't take a political stance necessarily on things Uh, but you know This this about his politicals. I'll get on the show. It's the right to repair This is something that I think if you believe in the right to repair, which I personally do This is something you can print out hang up in your cubicle or on your wall You bought it. You own it. You have the right to repair it This is the right to repair and uh, I feel that this is this is pretty important guys. This is uh, this is a big deal So that's where I stand and it's like the the uh, the uncle sam wants you of right to repair Absolutely, absolutely. You bought it. You own it. You have the right to repair it Um, listen folks, uh, if you don't want to buy this for yourself at lenperalta store.com Why not buy it for your local repair shop? That's right. I just give it to them to hang up in their shop I think it'd be great. I'm sure they would love it. Yeah, go to lemperalta store.com. It's right there on the front page And um, you know, you can also if you become one of my patrons, you can get this you get every piece of this art Uh as part of your rewards. So go check it out You also have the right to more patrick norton. Where can you exercise that right patrick? Oh my goodness avxl.com is the podcast to host with mr. Robert harem where we talk about home theater and audio And headphones and all the things to make your entertainment experience more awesome We don't care if you're rich or if you have no money and you're stuffed in a dorm room We're going to help you out and of course tech thing to e k th i n g dot com the uh weekly tech show I host with shannon morris We exist 95 percent or more because of your direct support on patreon We thank you with lots of cool stuff. So please please please check out what's available Not only at our store daily tech news show dot com slash store But also at our patreon patreon.com slash d t n s our email address is feedback at daily tech news show dot com We're live monday through friday 4 30 p.m. Eastern 2030 utc. You can find out more about that at daily tech news show dot com slash live No show monday. It's a holiday in the u.s. But back on tuesday with patrick bezia talk to you then This show is part of the frog pants network Get more at frog pants dot com I'm in club hopes you have enjoyed this program You gotta fight For your right To repair I've done that before that's actually something i've done before so this was a tough one. I was yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No, I love that I love that. It's so good It's cool. It's so good and to answer the question in the chat room I'm actually gonna buy one and take it to the computer shop nearby here. Oh, that'd be cool Yeah, this is not patrick by the way people are like is that patrick and it's not not patrick It is not not patrick, right It's just a guy just a guy It is a remarkable a remarkable resemblance to any of the number of phones i've owned in the last 10 years Well, and I have a feeling it resembles a lot of people in the audience like it's a composite drawing Exactly that was my thought Yeah, that was my thought I met that guy. I just don't remember which meetup it was That's pretty funny Oh, man, I'm actually I'm actually gonna log off because I want to see the rest of this game Oh, yes, it's still going on it is all right. Well bottom of the seventh It's bottom of the seventh. All right. Uh late late rally go go cleveland go cleveland All right. See you guys later. Thanks. Bye. Bye. The a's are out Yeah, the a's and the cardinals both are out But eileen's happy the Dodgers are in so Um, how what? I She kept it under wraps for many years living in san francisco But she her her earliest photograph is of her and a Dodgers hat here in LA And when we move back to los angeles those feelings reemerged Do you know about this had you seen the photograph? I I knew I'd seen the photograph. I knew about it But she always downplayed it until we moved down here and then we got down here And she's like are the Dodgers on I'm like, when did you start caring? About she's like, well, I'm in I'm in safe safe zone now. I could I could express. I'm like, wow That's that's amazing safe zone. We're in LA not not in not hostile country up there in san francisco And now all of her anti giants used to build her anti giants feeling is as a's loyalty They make a lot more sense now because I'm like, I'm an a's fan I don't care about the giants that much. It's not that it's not that kind of rivalry Now apparently it's not Something else deeper. There's a Dodger giants rivalry a deeper a deeper rivalry I got to read this in the antique article where they're basically claiming that the A12 chip set is is almost as smart smart almost as fast as Just margins off the best desktop cpus. No kidding Yeah, an attack It usually doesn't make those kinds of claims either I'm curious who wrote that story. Yeah, I'm curious. Is it the end cutrus? Andrei frumasanu Ian is usually the cpu Well, I'm kind of curious. I mean, I'm kind of curious how they just have you know what benchmarks they were using and how they're making this declaration Um Yeah, there's Well, I wanted to declare fight for your right to repair it My only hesitation with it. I'm fairly sure I've used that before Um, how about pro apple not anti repair? That was a good line We can go with that I'm just giggling because like you were you were setting me up to like froth with rage But me no Never But I mean you also it's a it's a valid point you were bringing up because you know on one level They're thinking like apple. They just don't care I think I really and that that part I really do believe like I feel like They it's not that they like the idea of you repairing things that that is also anti apple But it's not high on their list of things to worry about. Yeah, they're more just Like oh, but we want to make it this way. We don't care if that affects your stupid right to repair Well, but it's also I mean the some of the stuff that you I mean I Oh god. Yeah, I mean The whole What they're doing I don't know it would be interesting is it would be interesting, you know, how many like macbook screens are repaired annually Mm-hmm I've had to get a screen repaired on a macbook. So I mean this run the diagnostics software on it I've seen that in action. I mean this fundamentally forces All of their products into being repaired at the you know At a very I don't know Or one of their authorized service providers It would be interesting to see like what the cost is like and it's also I mean one thing is worth pointing at is is you know There's a reason nobody repairs hctvs because it's impossible to get parts You basically have to buy a second television to get the screen to replace the broken screen in the first television, right because there's just not enough of them out there and You know, unless you have something at super common like a del xps or one of the apple laptops The likelihood of you being able to find or you know, lenova or somebody the likelihood of you being able to find repair parts is almost Unmeasurably low This episode should be 33 83. I think you can double check me on that 33 Yes, you're correct 83. Sorry. Thank you. I was writing tuesdays. No problem Carry on you were saying No, I was Go ahead. I was I was saying I noticed that with appliances Like not just home electronics, but like Like washers dryers and stuff like they get the parts Because a lot of them, especially the ones with you know intelligent wash A lot of the stuff that breaks is the electronics, right because it's on a it's on a pcb board on a thing that spins and shakes So eventually they crack But what they want for it is almost as much as the price for a new washer Like, you know, it's not like Yeah, well when you can that's the thing when you can restrict who's certified to repair You can drive up the price to the point where it makes as much sense to buy a new one as to repair it I mean, it was funny. It's also interesting to look at the some of the staggering like the the delta between The cost of parts depending on where the source is is kind of mind blowing for appliances Or at least has been for me because I had to repair You know, we had a like a mobile dishwasher and then we had to repair a our old refrigerator freezer and it was I know you just mean by mobile dishwasher one that that you can roll over in the corner But I really wanted to be like like a cell phone dishwasher My special you just fold it right up. It's amazing We got one of them Yeah, we got one of those sonic cleaners people you take a camping We filled it with florida Let it vibrate for 40 minutes um Yeah, I mean and on one hand I I get like Oh Gosh a friend of mine over at mashable like I hadn't seen the article before it was just like, you know, the right to repair is stupid And i'm like, no, how can you say that? Uh, that sounds like like he wanted clicks on his article Yeah, I think he did want clicks on his article which is good, which maybe I don't know why we're titling the show pro apple Not anti repair I don't know what you're saying top I'm not sure what you're saying Yeah, I mean, it's I don't know it's it's interesting to watch I mean it was interesting like hearing some of the back story and what's going on with tesla and You know, there's there's more value there now, but for a while um, they basically just They basically just scrapped everything they they put a salvage title and everything and You know outside of it was just it's really interesting like I I'm really curious about tesla and where they are in five years. Um You know, I was I was very curious about that before elan started, you know Getting into trouble with the sd. It's getting real weird Yeah, it's just getting real Or maybe just getting real. Yeah, it's a possibility Wow, you know, I mean, I think elan's just being elan, but you know, boy, he really pissed off the sec Oh man Yeah spec, uh spec 2006 numbers is where they got the ios device stuff Now it's it's it's kind of weird because you know for the longest time Computers, especially pcs were just were one of the Few consumer electronics items that were designed to be user accessible Like you were you were able to do that and Yeah, pull out cards and stuff. Yeah Yeah, it's just like laptops closed tightened glued And uh throne wall brings up a good point, you know stocking and making available repair parts is more expensive than than just Having parts in a factory for assembly. It's yeah, you know, it is a it is a more complex and therefore more costly enterprise So it's a balance sheet. A lot of them are like, yeah, we don't really want to you know Sell parts to people It's been interesting. Well, it's like There I want to say there's like a 25 year cutoff now for a lot of dodge parts or it's even shorter now Um Because there's just a lot of stuff you can't buy anymore And it's although I mean the answer to that is let third parties create authorized third party reports, right? Yeah Yeah, but it's also I mean it's it's it kind of goes hand it there's There's this you know, there's this weird combination of you know Going offshore to minimize the cost of parts and the consolidation of suppliers and the consolidation of of uh you know, it's It's it's been I don't know. It's it's it's interesting to watch because I realized You know five or ten years ago when you bought a nap a part you get a very specific kind of Napa built nap a part that you know was distinctively kind of nap up and uh You know, I I recently ended up having to get two master cylinders for the truck and uh To be perfectly honest, I bought one and forgot I bought it bought a second. Ah, yes That I believe Well, actually I it's funny. I actually had to in one case I had this In a vehicle a couple years ago. Uh, I had to go through three master cylinders before I got one that was actually properly Sealed uh refurbished. What could we're not here to talk about the past and accuse patrick of making mistakes No, no, no like I I had I had the same issue I the point is you had two master cylinders and then well and the the auto zone one and the Napa one were the exact same part or at least came out of the exact same It's the different specs, but It's been it's been really interesting to watch, you know What shows up when you order something and whether or not it's actually, you know What it's supposed to be or just kind of like what they got the best deal on But when you start looking at that it means, you know, the quality of parts the availability of parts You know, it becomes harder and harder to find things to repair things Or, you know, even stupid stuff like realizing that, you know Certain fittings parts are getting harder and harder to find. I don't know. It's it's There's certainly as we we lean certain it's there's a lot of disposability And it's really kind of frustrating to realize how many of the supply lines have kind of been cut off or diminished or You know, and I think part of this equation that doesn't get enough attention is There are fewer people who want to take the time to repair Uh, and I don't mean that as a pejorative. I'm not saying ah people are lazy these days Maybe that's true. Maybe it's not but I mean There people are busier these days and you see it in other areas where there are more services that will bring you your food Or or drive you somewhere that are the same thing like we don't want to spend our time doing that We want to spend our time doing other things because it's worth more to us In which case not having to repair something or even have it repaired, but just replacing it outright Is a more attractive option to people whether it's a right to repair or not Which puts less pressure on the companies to cooperate with repair. I think All I know is it better not do that with home repair. Oh, you're gonna have to Like I'm gonna have to rebuild the doorway. We have a John Deere apple house You're you're not allowed to repair that doorway. You're gonna have to you're gonna have to throw this one away It authorized service technician to replace that that door handle I've seen so much of inside of home depot and lows. I don't ever want to go back It's just done Where's the plumbing aisle? Where's the masonry aisle? Where do I get the cement patch? I pretty much avoid that place unless I have to go there Oh, yeah, no, that's that's my point. I'm kind of like I need cement patch I need to you don't have anywhere else to get that stuff Not you're right. So this is the thing there are no more into at least in my area that I've noticed there are no Smaller hardware supply stores. There's like no ace. Osh is gone and the process just went out of business But yeah, even it was kind of a big You should stop by one because they're they're doing pretty I thought it was just the one in pedal almost never told me what to say all the other day Oh, no, I really like gosh the problem is the closest Osh to me was 25 miles away The closest lows is three Or uh, no lows home depot. There's two of them the other ones four miles away The the home depots have always been kind of far from me in both places that I've lived in LA county anyway But the other problem is like you say where I live before I had a true value. It was an acer true value I don't remember right down the street. I think it was a true value Now the closest one is a 10 minute drive It's still closer than the home depot for me But there aren't as many as there used to be or you're absolutely right and I mean there's a lot of independent lumber stores up here There's a lot of independent gardening supply stores up here There's probably more than you realize that they're just probably not in the part of LA you're in well, I You know, it's I mean, I've looked at one that's pretty close to you. I don't want to say it because it Yeah, no, I I think I know which one you're talking about but like the stuff I I like I just need like cement patch. I just need to patch up the the portion of the The portion of my driveway that's you know need some spaglin uh, and I need some Uh, I need a trowel to put on the stucco patch because yeah, I mean Part of it's like for me. I had to find alternate places to buy Wood because most of the wood that comes into home depot or low Yeah, I would never buy lumber from either one of those places You know so, you know, it was funny. It was just like, oh, I can buy lumber between nine and five Monday through Friday, and there's two hours on saturday that they're open at me being like This is so 1980s But fortunately for us like economy lumbers like a mile or two away from the house and there's two more lumber yards in oakland and there's a really amazing Uh lumber yard that does uh, they have their own Mill and then they also recycle a lot of stuff There's a ton of of construction contractor level lumber seamen at window is everything you want up in vandijs And and they you know, it's it's probably a a great place if you know where you're going and you know what you need Um, but it's not it's not the friendly ace true value kind of experience Ace is weird because it's that they're it's their independent Stores grouped under the ace. It's like iga. Yeah, so some of them are great. Other ones are kind of not so great Yeah, it depends on they they basically stock from the same catalog But these doors can run themselves largely the way they want. Yeah, some of them. I remember didn't have Anything it was like the hardware store designed for just apartment owners Yeah, that depends on on if that's your clientele. Then yeah, that's what you're gonna Until the uh, there's an amazing ace in richman until the owner decided to retire But part of what made it so fascinating is one it was kind of like It had obviously been running, you know for 40 or 60 years maybe longer And it had all of the treatise Of you know, so there was always like really like new old stock and old parts and stuff and also they had like literally 40 different kinds of machetes in there and I asked the owner one day and I'm like He's like it's just part of the he's like, you know He's like a lot of central american and south american You know people in the community and it's just part of the culture It's like one of their traditional lawn tools and I'm like, okay Because it went like super. Yeah, but it was just but it was like there were more machetes and ideally like In LA a lot of the a lot of the uh Landscapers and groundskeepers when they roll by They have the lawn mowers the leaf blowers the weed wires Occasionally you'll see like a couple of machetes and because that's how they cut the on the bigger places where they either have the trees Or those bushes. Yeah It's effective Oh man, when I was growing up we had three hardware options in in my hometown my hometown was 5000 people We had three hardware. Yeah Lynn's true value was the big hardware store, but it was kind of fancy So they they had a large the largest stock But they also had a lot of like barbecue grills and lawn mowers and you know higher end stuff Coast to coast was the one where it's like every little thing you need is packed in there But it was tiny it was small and then value city was my favorite because you city they stocked They were basically like a railroad salvage of hardware stores So they stocked based on what they could get for cheap So it was always weird stuff in there, but you could get it for a really good price Uh, and they would have non hardware stuff from time to time because when they bought bid on a lot, you know They'd get like a bunch of inflatable pool toys too I liked I liked the ace over by the old revision three Building we ran the one over by the on ramp. Did was it it's a 280 central hardware central They relocated down the street I don't I like that this is one of the few hardware stores actually sold the bulb replacements For a lot flashlights like the led. We're going to relocate the audio only here For for a moment. So audio listeners don't go anywhere stick around If you're watching ryan creative vast arts, uh, it's just going to go black on that video Otherwise video folks. See you on Tuesday Right and we'll reminisce some more on hardware