 with SiliconANGLE, co-host of theCUBE. I'm here on the ground in San Francisco with Gus Robertson, CEO of NGINX, chatting about the industry trends. Gus, I want to get your take on what's happening in the landscape out there right now. Obviously DevOps is the hottest movement in the planet. You're seeing the DockerCon conference. You're seeing big numbers from Oracle, Amazon. It's just game on. It's big time. It's mainstream. The big stage, the curtains lifted. Companies now in the enterprise are going DevOps. What are some of the things that you're seeing in terms out there in the landscape? What is the big trends? Top three trends are driving all this. Yeah, well, definitely the DevOps movement is critical. We're seeing a lot of decision making and control being moved into the DevOps team. More so than you're seeing what was traditionally in the infrastructure group primarily. You're seeing obviously different architectures and applications around microservices and distributed web application architectures. You're seeing APIs becoming the core way that applications are communicating against and with each other. Obviously containers is hot right now. Everyone's talking about Docker and CoreOS and containers. And that's definitely, I think, really given more freedom and accountability to the developers as they build their applications and lifecycle management of the applications moving across. So if you put all those things together, I mean, we're really seeing, I think, a new world of application development moving away from heavyweight, middleware, sewer-based to really lightweight, rest, API, high performance web-delivered applications. I'm seeing two main things I want to chat with you about getting your perspective. One is the CXO or CIO, CEO of a large enterprise who has challenges. And the other one is the developers themselves. They're two different kind of stakeholders or ecosystems and the CXOs have to make decisions and they're getting sold to by all the big companies hey, buy my platform, buy my products. And developers just want to code and build great stuff and they don't want to get locked in, they want choice, but they also want to have a community via open source. So first one, CXO is big companies. They have to make all these decisions out there. What would you advise them? And what are some of the challenges? Because they have to essentially put out, top-line results, not just cost-effectiveness or DevOps gives them a nice leverage kind of architecture. So they got to hire developers. They have to build teams out. Now they had this something that's new to them. Maybe the big banks, maybe, but enterprise truly investing in the application development is all going to come from open source. What does that CXO do to invest in a 10 to 20 year investment for building a developer ecosystem inside their company and outside? Yeah, I think the point that you raise there is what I'm seeing in, let's say, the innovators at the front of the curve, and I think that's now flowing into any CXO's environment if you're in an enterprise, is that you have to attract the right developers to develop the right apps, right? And those developers want to use open source tools primarily. So trying to force fit them into a certain infrastructure or a certain development environment isn't going to work. You really have to find a way to enable them to be able to use open source tools and tools that they want to use on a daily basis. And then you'll get the right sort of applications. The other thing I'd say is that you don't want to have bottlenecks in your delivery process. So while containers and everything are great, if you then have a developer that releases a new application and it sits on the fence waiting to go into production because you're waiting for, let's say, a network engineer to put configurations into a hardware box at the front of the data center that's not very practical. So how do you improve the lifecycle management and the delivery of your applications to not just have the application itself and it's in production to be high performance, but be able to do true continuous integration and delivery, to be able to deliver that app and have it go functional and live within seconds rather than days and weeks, which is what we've traditionally seen in enterprises. So the two things is give them the tools they need to be able to do it and make sure the process is streamlined so that you can actually have true integration and delivery. Now developers, the developer angle. Because now developers, you know, they want to be with their friends, they want to be coding on the fashion that they want to wear in terms of languages, whether their interests are. And they want to get hired and or sell their products to companies. Yet the vendors are pounding them, oh, use my platform. So the developers are being bombarded with, our ways the best way. So they're kind of got their shield up. So what's your take on that trend? Because developers also want to do the right thing, but how do they figure out what to do and what's the general trend in the developer community? So I think the tools that they want to use, so I'm not sure what you mean by the question, right, what developers, what's. You know, they're getting pounded by all the vendors. Buy this, buy this. They don't want to make a one model of the choice. They want to have freedom. Right. So what should they be looking at? How should they be evaluating the marketplace? I mean, from what I see, the developers typically have confidence in certain languages, certain architectures that they're using. I don't think they should definitely be, what I see developers aren't necessarily influenced by what a vendor is pushing on them. I don't see that ever being successful. You know, what I do think is. I agree with that. Right. Developers have tools in their toolkit. You know, my advice to be developers would be to not use the right tool for the right type of application, trying to force fit a specific infrastructure or a specific language into the wrong application would be one thing. I think the other thing is that we're seeing that more and more of let's say networking and what would be traditionally put into infrastructure in the data center is now becoming part of the application. So I think developers are now having to learn more than just about how to build their product in their application, but more how do they include things like traffic management, security, scalability into their application. So developers have to extend beyond just, hey, I've written some great code into, how does my code work in production? How do I really deliver a scalable application? How does a developer who wants to be DevOps become a DevOps ninja or a DevOps guru? Because now the tools are getting better where you can abstract away some complexity with seeing some things, containers, Kubernetes, microservices. So how does developers navigate these new wars, because there's a lot of advantages. They can break through that and be absolutely DevOps compatible. There's a lot of advantages. You're in that business of microservices. What's your message to developers around how to navigate the new trend? Be aware of the technologies that are coming out that can make your life easy, right? I think containers is a great way of making developers life easier. I think orchestration tools around how to deliver your application, continuous integration tools like Jenkins that can help you deploy your application across the lifecycle management. Looking at the infrastructure underneath your application that's going to help you scale it. Things like looking at service discovery, looking at elasticity of your application. Any of the tools that make your life easier that allow you to bring a microservice application to market quicker is what I'd recommend. My final question, you got a developer conference coming up in the fall. So you guys, obviously, that's your customer and developers work with you guys. What's going on with your view of the developer community, Nginx? And what have you learned over the past two years around this evolving space? Well, number one is give developers the tools they need. Our developers are very vocal, right? So we've been getting a lot of input in terms of feature requirements into our product and so we thank all the developers for being that vocal. We do have our conference coming up in September. I'd obviously recommend them to come there. And not just to learn about Nginx but to share best practices. That's the thing that I think is most powerful about the developer community is that the developers tend to write a lot of content right around what's working in terms of their application, how they're able to connect components together. We found it at things like our Nginx conference in September that having developers come and bring true life experiences, how they've built their app, how they've deployed their app, how they're able to get more out of their application by using other tool sets and sharing that with other developers is really how you improve your own skills and share your best practices with others. So that would be my recommendation. Final question, are we in a bubble and how do you talk to people that say, we're in a bubble, this is gonna burst, everyone's gonna chaos, just like the dot-com bubble, valuations are out of control, 50 billion for Uber, your customer of you guys. So are we in a bubble, are we not? Is it enterprise kind of renaissance coming on? What's happening? What's your take? I definitely think that there's a lot of activity in the market, a lot of venture money coming into the market, a lot of interesting technologies and so from a consumer perspective, it's fantastic. I mean, there's so many cool things coming on the market every single day. I think for a company like us, we're more in the enterprise base and helping customers deploy applications. I think for us, we see less of that bubble, but we're excited about the fact that there's this movement towards developers, there's a movement more towards applications. Really at the end of the day, who cares what's underneath the application, right? Does the application work? Does it deliver? Do I have access to my watch? Do I have access to my phone? Am I getting the information I need? And there's so many great tools and technologies coming out that are helping us build these new applications, but the world's really changing, right? I mean, the fact that I can walk down the street and get into somebody else's car and they take me somewhere and that it gets built on my credit card is fantastic, right? You know, things like Uber, things like Airbnb are really changing the world today and the way that we... So you see the underlying infrastructure as a major driver for a multi-decade year growth. I think this is definitely changing our society. I mean, it's changing the culture in which we operate, right? I never would have gotten into a stranger's car before and be driven somewhere else. I wouldn't go to someone else's house and stay in their spare bedroom before, right? So yeah, I think it's changing the way we operate. And DevOps and cloud, mobile, all this is kind of coming together. I think that's what's driving it, right? The creativity. One of the things from my personal perspective is my background was more, it was a musician. And the thing that really changed the music industry was being able to do home-developed music, right? The advent of things like Pro Tools and Logic that allowed us to record albums at home unleashed a huge range of creativity and taste in music and varieties of different genres. The same is now happening to the developer community and applications. Really unleashing the creativity of developers with the tools they have to build anything. Any idea is possible as long as you've got some software and some time to create it, right? That's... We're doing a teens in tech program coming up. I mean, you've got teenagers writing code. So that's why what I think is driving a lot of this cultural change, right? We're taking the reins off the creative juice of our next generation and they're coming up with crazies, any ideas and some of them are super cool and practical and some aren't, but we get to experience that. So you're saying basically there might be some consolidation, there might be some trimming of the fat on this bubble, but overall growth, enterprises exploding, some infrastructure changes are happening, multi-decade growth. All right, we are here on the ground in San Francisco. I'm John Furrier with Gus Roberts, the CEO of NGINUS. Thanks for watching.