 I'd like to thank the non-profit and public management center and their directors Marina Whitman and Megan Tompkins-Stang for cosponsoring our event today and I'd also like to thank St. Mary's Parish for helping us to host today's very special guest. While policy talks at the Ford School aims to create a very full picture of the policymaking process. Throughout the year we have heard from presidential cabinet members, from state and local politicians and activists, from ambassadors, political scientists and more. Today I'm really delighted to include a highly respected voice from the heart of non-profit, religious and social justice persuasion on the US legislative process Sister Simone Campbell. Sister Simone belongs to the Catholic Sisters of Social Service. She is also a lawyer, lobbyist and activist and since 2000 she has led Network, a national Catholic social justice lobby focused on economic justice, immigration reform, health care, peacemaking and ecology. Network's nun's letter to Congress was instrumental in the reform of national health care in 2010 and despite provoking a very harsh critique from the Vatican, the nun's efforts prevailed. The Affordable Care Act as we well know was signed into law and Sister Simone stood right next to President Obama at the signing ceremony. This experience inspired Sister Simone to create nuns on the bus which on the one hand is exactly what it sounds like. Nuns tour the country on a bus in service of the Catholic Church's commitment to social justice. Beyond that though it's really a brilliant strategy for connecting with thousands of Americans around the country and pressuring politicians for change in social policy. Since 2013 they've tackled a number of critical policy issues including immigration reform, voter turnout and wealth inequality and many of these are issues on which Sister Simone will elaborate in her lecture today. While following Sister Simone's remarks we will take questions from the audience. So at around 4.30 or so we will have staff members in the aisles to collect questions. Please write them on cards that you should have received as you came in. They'll also have other cards to distribute if anyone needs one. And we will also welcome questions for those of us watching online via Twitter. Please use the hashtag policy talks. Professor Ann Lynn to gather with two Ford School students Carson Smith and Brenda Diverse will facilitate the question and answer period when we get there. So now please join me in a very warm Ford School welcome to Sister Simone Campbell. Thank you. What a treat to be here. I was thinking as I was coming that the utter richness of being able to spend some time reflecting on policy in a time where the practice of public policy is so challenging. And I know you all survived your primary yesterday. So I just want to acknowledge that the up close reality of politics is quite near and dear to my heart and to all of us at this point as we're struggling through the presidential cycle. But I want to talk more about the policies that are what we say in DC are more about how our people live and the flourishing of our nation than I want to talk about the partisan divides that are going on. Part of me feels like I just want to put my head under the covers some days. I don't know if any of you share that pain but there's got to be a better way than this. But let's focus on the needs of our people and I think that can make the difference. So the theme is Pope Francis' challenge to policymakers mend the gap. I had the opportunity to be in the congressional chambers when Pope Francis addressed Congress. I was in the front row. It was really cool of the gallery. It was this amazing thing of somewhat of a harmonious Congress and the parties had agreed that no one party would, that they would all applaud. They didn't want to make partisan campaigning around Pope Francis' talk. And so the first few things that Pope Francis said was about the economy, a critique of the economy and the Democrats jumped up and applauded and you could see the Republicans get up slowly and applauded and then the, you know, that happened a couple of times and then Pope Francis said the code words. That's why we're for the dignity of all life and the Republicans jumped up and applauded and the Democrats got up slowly. But then Pope Francis said, and that's why I've made my papacy about the global abolition of the death penalty. And it was like a wind in the room because everybody went and that collective reality created this vacuum. I mean it was amazing. Well what I realized was that Pope Francis' focus on the needs of real people and the needs of the common good create a politics that is not divisive and is not partisan. He creates a space where his focus is on the needs of those who are left out. And so in the recent, well I guess it's about almost a year now, the encyclical Laudato Si, there's a lot of conversation about how it's about the environment, it's about economics, but the amazing thing is it's also about politics because there are 32 paragraphs out of 200 and some where he discusses the political responsibility. And at paragraph 57 he says that politics must pay greater attention to foresee new conflicts and addressing the causes which can lead to them. But powerful financial interests prove most resistant to this effort and political planning tends to lack breadth of vision. And then he goes on to say, what would induce anyone at this stage to hold on to power only to be remembered for their inability to take action when it was urgent and necessary to do so? I believe that's the Speaker Boehner clause that explains a fair amount of what happened when Speaker Boehner resigned the next day after, or said he was resigning the next day after Pope Francis was in addressing Congress. So for me what that challenges us to be is to be a nation where politics has a broader view, where we see the consequences of policy not just in terms of me and mine, but in terms of we and the common good, where we reclaim our constitution to be we the people. Now in the Great Depression there appears to have been a commonality, a sense of coming together where the extreme wealth of the 20s, the roaring 20s, got balanced out and people came together and my mother used to tell this story about her dad who ran a newspaper, a weekly newspaper in Colorado and the Aurora Democrat and he received in barter payment for ads. Now my mother to her dying day detested movies because my grandfather was paid for the ads for the movies by tickets to go see the movie. And my grandmother said of course we have to go be an audience for the person who ran the theater, we're going to the movies. So they used every single theater to the movies ticket that they got and my mother detested it because every day according to her memory of her youth they went to the movies. She hated it. But what it taught me was that my grandmother wasn't so much concerned about the quality of payment and what that was good. She knew that by being paid with tickets that the owner of the theater needed an audience and she knew her responsibility was to help make an audience so he the owner felt like he was doing something for the community. It's a level of the common good which is not usually thought of these days and the challenge I believe is to reframe who we are as a nation and on a Californian many of you know that and we exported I'm sorry to say one of our governors to be president in the great campaign of 1980 we exported Ronald Reagan who had this idea of who actually successfully rewrote the founding story of the U.S. by cut in my view by coming to this idea that one lone horseman a man rode off into the West and settled the West all by himself. Now I watched television and I know there were wagon trains West it was more than one person because if you only had one wagon even and somebody hollered circle the wagons you had trouble and I also know that for barn raisings that we had more than one person if only one person showed up well you weren't going to raise much of a barn and I know from personal experience that when it came to quilting I had a quilt I worked on for over five years and I finally decided oh my glory let's finish the damn thing I got my friends together to do it you couldn't quilt alone it required community and the challenge that we're facing in our nation right now is that we've changed the story of our nation from community to an individual to each one of us alone and only in the richest nation on earth could we get away with this arrogance and what we're trying to do is to what I believe Pope Francis is challenging us to do is to mend the gaps to bridge the divides to bring us back together to the truth that we're based in community now what I've discovered in community is that we don't all agree have you noticed that that we have some very different perspectives and the challenge that we face is how do we bring these different perspectives to the table so in this effort Pope Francis in joy of the gospel which was a document he issued in November of 13 I believe in paragraph 54 he does his political his economic analysis and since the Ford School is so engaged in the economics of all of this I thought I should include it he said that Pope Francis says some people continue to defend trickle-down theories which assume that economic growth encouraged by a free market will inevitably succeed in bringing about greater justice and inclusiveness in the world this opinion which has never been confirmed by the facts expresses a crude and naive trust in the goodness of those wielding economic power and in the sacralized workings of the prevailing economic system meanwhile meanwhile the excluded are still waiting this is the problem that we're facing in our society is that trickle-down 30 years of trickle-down 40 years of trickle-down has failed to lift all boats it's lifted the boats of the few and the boats of the few continue to amass more and more money and then we have translated money into speech and so money into speech now controls our political reality to bridge to mend the gaps we have got to bridge the divides that have been created by a failed effort at trickle-down economics what's the alternative move some people like to tell me oh it's socialism that's the only thing now there's a long way between trickle-down and socialism and I think that's some of the challenge of academic institutions is to figure out ways forward so I'd like to raise up a few of the stories that I've heard as we've done these business roundtables around the country I talk about the hundred percent I'm we're trying to be for the hundred percent I have a favorite part of the hundred percent but I want to be for the hundred percent so I realized in 2014 that we didn't know much about business I'm a lawyer I practice law I ran a law office but that's not exactly the you know sort of entrepreneurial but I wanted to understand the entrepreneurial reality more and so we did these 13 business roundtables around the country and learned some very interesting things the one in Chicago which was early on in the process it had just come out before that roundtable that the average salary for a CEO of a publicly traded company was ten million dollars a year and that they were going for 11 million so I had this gaggle of you know entrepreneurs and hedge fund guys and heads of corporations and so I said to them they were all men and I said to him well you know I heard this about the CEO average CEO salary of ten million and that they're going for 11 million I don't quite understand is it that you're not getting by on ten million is that the problem you just need a little extra is that the deal and this guy said really quickly rich said to me oh no sister Simone it's not about the money I go what you could have fooled me and he said no we're very competitive we want to win it just happens that the current measure of winning is money now I tested it out at other roundtables after that and it got affirmed one guy in northern Virginia I'll never forget he heads up a what do you call a hospitality industry corporation and they have over 400 hotels around the world and he's the CEO and he said oh that's absolutely true I'll be damned if I'm paid less than my competitor when I'm doing a better job for my company why would I do that that's wrong who okay I can see it's wrong but the competitive salaries this measure of winning couldn't we find some other measure that's a little less toxic for the people who are doing the cleaning or the janitorial work how do we bridge how do we yet win and here's I am a lawyer so I'm extremely competitive I don't play board games because I'm a sore loser so yeah I get competition but what I don't get is competition with a measure that can be so toxic in our society at another at another round table we were talking and this one guy volunteered we did that riff and he volunteered that he was getting upset he's a 35 year old he built his third corporation was about ready to sell it off because he was going to be a new dad and he wanted to have time with his new baby but he said he was getting upset because he realized that he paid all of his workers a living wage and in paying a living wage he realized his tax dollars were going to fund his competitors so go what his competitors don't pay a living wage to everybody they pay low wages and so his competitors have lower personnel costs lower personnel costs then causes those low paid workers to go use the social safety net which used to be just for folks who fell on hard times and so the low-wage workers were going to use things like food stamps, Medicaid and housing vouchers if they could get them and what they what Jason this entrepreneur said he realized his tax dollars were paying for the social safety net so if tax dollars were funding his competitors who could underbid him but he in principle believed he should pay a living wage well I never thought of it that way I came to realize that our current social safety net has become a business subsidy as much as it is for people who have fallen on hard times in 2014 67% of the people who used any of the social safety net programs 67% had at least those households had at least one adult working full-time we've got trouble so I raised that at other business roundtables and this one guy said to me in Denver this guy says well yeah if you take an edge why wouldn't you get it why wouldn't you take it and where were we and shoot where were we I can see the room but I don't know where we were oh in Richmond Virginia we're there and the end this guy said well you know if you don't make us internalize costs we won't internalize cost becomes code words for paying a living wage I always thought the idea of the market was that the market charged a rate that covered it the fees the cost covered actual costs but we've changed that to the market being about profit and anything you do to create profit is what matters that is eating the heart out of our democracy because it's not like we're in this together okay so what do we do network has this new effort we are trying to mend the gaps and it's kind of fun in a time of paralyzed politics that we create a chance to do something positive so we've got seven policies that we're working on to mend the gaps and I'll just treat them briefly and then you can ask me questions about it but we've realized that we have got to find a way to come together as people as business workers families as nonprofits as advocates everybody we've got to find a way to have conversation about the commons about the contribution to the commons and we're now setting up for a speaker Ryan is setting up for a big effort at tax reform in 2017 and in that conversation we have got to be clear about tax policy for the common good and the common good means that it's good for Jason and rich the entrepreneur but also good for Robin who works full time at a profitable clothing store chain but still tells me that by looking at her I would never know that she still has to live in a homeless shelter because she doesn't make enough at minimum wage to pay rent in the DC area we have got to make sure that everyone's voice is at the table part of the challenge of that is that private industry hires pesky lobbyists since I'm a lobbyist I'm a lobbyist and a lawyer so I can make noise about pesky lobbyists but what we discovered was is that most regulations most proposed laws start off very simple and what happens is is business hires lobbyists and lobbyists are very effective to carve out a little space a little special gift making sure that my industry is considered specially then in that carve out it creates five ten more pages of regulation to create the carve out and if everybody's getting their little carve out by the time you get through with permanent regulations you've had very successful lawyering has created this small little regulation into a massive regulation and then you know what business has the nerve to do rail against the regulation well at the business roundtable we discovered that the complexity of regulation is created by effective lobbying which business hired to create their little separate entity and then they rail against their result in the tax process we have got to find a way for everyone to be at the table we've got to find a way where we see our tax dollars as investment in our future and we have got to see our way that part of our responsibility to the future is that we invest not just for ourselves but for our posterity as it says in the Constitution tax policy is going to be the center the ground zero in a military metaphor of trying to create the common good let's have more conversation about that the second piece that we've got to work on is wages and organizing Michigan's a great a great state for this you all led the way with good wages good jobs labor organizing that got undermined again by the love President Reagan who very effectively put a wedge between the worker and the unions some of what he said was true but the problem was that it wasn't because they were unions that they were bad it was because they were humans they were bad and so as a person of faith I talk about original sin and that seems to be the stumbling block so what we and nobody talks about the well some people do but not terribly effectively the flaws of corporations at that very same time Reagan was lifting up corporations as being a great model you know leaders of corporation leaders of industry captains of industry and putting a wedge between the worker and the union that effectively kept wages flat for the last 40 years we've got to change that reality either through unions through organizing through something that raises wages because for me it's wrong that you work in the richest nation on earth full-time and you still live in poverty that's wrong while the leader of your corporation that you're contributing to collects 10 million dollars and is going for 11 the 10 million dollar a year number works out at 40 hours a week works out to be $5,000 an hour so the CEO makes in three hours what the minimum wage worker makes in a year doesn't seem right to me it's not good for our society and it's creating the huge gaps and the huge anger that's currently being seen in the electorate I believe so we've got to deal with wages and finally we got to create well on the economic side we got to create family-friendly workplaces the fact is if we're going to value our families we cannot just be seen as cogs in the wheels of production work in Catholic social teaching which is what we're rooted in work is supposed to be at the service of humans not humans at the service of work so that means pesky details like hmm perhaps fast food workers ought to have some paid time off for sick days do you know without paid time off desperate low-wage workers in fast food industry have a tendency to come to work so they can have their hours and support their families even if they're sick I don't know about you but I don't think that's a great public health model please keep your germs at home but desperate people will do what they need this is wrong simple wrong so at least paid sick time makes the most sense so those are our economic ones then we've also got access gaps access gaps that are sucking the life out of our democracy the first one is access to voting all of the work that's being done to drive people away from the polls I mean some of us were wonks I mean we're at the Ford School so of course we care about this stuff but the fact is not everybody shares our passion and we were door knocking in the 2014 election when we were on the bus knocked on a lot of doors in a lot of places but I'll never forget knocking on this one door in Colorado Springs a conservative area a tall African-American young man comes to the door opens the door and we get talking and turns out he's a disabled that so it was either Iraq or Afghanistan I don't know and he was getting good support from the VA and then I said to him well I'm out door knocking to see if people are going to vote and so are you going to vote it blew my mind he said no he was not going to vote you put your life on the line for our nation and you're not going to vote and what he said chilled my heart my opinion is not wanted in this neighborhood Colorado Springs a white community and didn't want this African-American to vote even though he had put his life on the line for the nation we have got to stand up for real democracy which means even the people I disagree with have a chance to vote the other thing that we found in the 2014 bus trip was how negative advertising drives away the muddled middle the folks who are not the base negative advertising causes people to end up saying a pox on both their houses I don't know too complicated way beyond me I'm not voting do you know our bus driver 74 year old Bill Kahn told me on the last bus trip in the fall in September well sister Simone I'm gonna vote for the first time this year you've been driving our bus and you haven't voted nope haven't voted it's kind of complicated and then he said to me want to know who I'm gonna vote for oh Bill he's kind of conservative so I was like oh Bill I'm not sure I want to know do you want to tell me oh yeah one do want to tell you well I'm gonna vote for Donald Trump no bill please well and so holy curiosity I tried to be concerned and not judgmental always inviting everybody to the table so I said well Bill why are you gonna do that well I want somebody who can't be bought the man is richer in God and can't be bought and I thought well that's a good a good reason I wouldn't have learned the reason if I had done what my insides wanted to do which was like God no but what I learned was in complex times simple emotion grabs people and what we have to do those of us that care wonkishly about all this stuff we have to find another way to translate and connect because that emotion doesn't translate well into policy and so how do we make a difference so we need to access to democracy we need access to health care health care is a mess the Affordable Care Act is a significant step forward but states that have not expanded Medicaid their health care systems are in crisis and one of the things that I began to that I heard from half of the business roundtables volunteered I didn't ask this question but lead business leaders said that we've really got to move away from employer provided health care we need to move towards a Medicare for all model which was surprising to me shocking to me because in the 09 2010 fight business was totally opposed to a Medicare for all model but what they're finding is the administration and the cost is still crippling and problematic but I think that evidences that if we listen to each other we can find places of convergence and improvement the third area is on immigration reform we've got to solve the immigration issues of our time the fact is the exploitation of the immigrant worker is undermining wages undermining our society and creating fear in our communities we have a young woman who's a dreamer you know the was brought here as a young child is now has a docket the deferral of deportation and so she works at at network and to hear her passion for fixing immigration reform so that her parents can have the same security that she has and then talking with her they've been here 18 years without going back to Mexico she doesn't know Mexico at all she came when she was three years old and her parents have worked this entire time and then her parents have also experienced wage theft exploitation but because they're undocumented they won't complain that's wrong in the richest nation on earth it's wrong in any nation but especially the richest nation and finally our policies our proactive policy is housing we've got to fix our housing policy housing is at the heart of a bunch of other policies housing is at the heart of our education system because that's how we fund our education is through property tax a nutty system but it's the one we've got housing is at the heart of the fact that we're segregated we're resegregated housing is the heart of the fact that our economic segregation is even almost even worse than our racial segregation we're better than this we can make a change and housing is at the heart of some of our biggest problems around transportation in San Antonio at the business roundtable that I was told San Antonio did a study they need 300,000 units of low and moderate income housing in the next 10 years and they have no plan on how to get there because their state government is fighting so much with the feds they won't ask for any help from housing and urban development so our city that they're San Antonio was said could you get us a little provision in the law so we could negotiate directly with the feds because our people are suffering but this is where the polarization is hurting everyone we have got to find ways to build bridges to bridge the divide to transform the reality that's keeping us separate because it is that division that is sucking the life out of our our economy it's sucking the life out of our democracy it's sucking the life out of our nation so what I believe we see with Donald Trump and to some extent Cruz is the anger at being left behind and what I've realized is as often that the source of that anger are middle class white men or lower middle class white men who've never had a movement and a bunch of you guys here so you could speak up during the comment part but but folks folks who feel they've never been part of a movement we've got the women's movement we have the LGBTQ movement we've got the black lives matter we've got the Hispanic movement we got dreamers we've got a bunch of movements and quite frankly I've always thought as a woman I've always thought the guys were the white guys were in charge but what I've come to realize is the loneliness of that position is they've never known that we're in it together and so what Donald Trump in his crass way is doing is touching that hurt and anger and now many feel like they've got someone who's championing them but it's not a long-term solution because it's dividing us it's not bringing us together and democracy cannot survive divided so here's my policy idea that I'm planting here at the Ford school to see how how you all might be able to pick it up and make it happen and that is rather than focusing on rights which has a tendency to divide us maybe we should focus on civil obligations that everyone in a democracy has an obligation to participate everyone has an obligation to step into the conversation everyone has an obligation to bring their part and to stay open to the parts of others perhaps this is called heaven but I do believe I do believe we need to get closer to it if we're going to save our democracy because right now the jury is still out on whether or not this democracy can be saved in my view the Greeks apparently had a vibrant democracy for about 200 years and then as I understand it mostly through Wikipedia so I probably shouldn't admit that but is that after about 200 years the rich families of Athens started fighting and then it after about another 30 40 years a rich family sold Athens out to the Macedonians now I'm not sure who the Macedonians are in our system but I certainly see wealth fighting against each other I see a division where we don't see the fact that we're in it together a commonality and I worry greatly can we step back into the center can we step into our obligation for each other because that is what's going to mend the gaps is if I hold your concern dearly as I hold my own if I know you have my back and you know I'll have yours but we've got to find a way to agree so my basic urging is that we create a culture of civic obligations where in our obligations we come together and there's room for everyone in that because in a democracy no one can be left out so planting seeds hoping they take root so that again once again here at the Ford School we could have something flourish a new time thank you very much now for my favorite part thank you so much for speaking to us today my name is Brenda DuVers and I am a second-year graduate student here at the Ford School master of public policy program my interests lies and social policies and poverty alleviation strategies you spoke a bit about civil well a lot about civic obligation domestically speaking on the Black Lives Matter movement LGBT movement but I was wondering and I guess the audience was also wondering can you comment a little about our international responsibility for the refugee crisis happening in Europe both in refugees coming to Europe to stay in refugees fleeing Syria thank you for that that's an issue really close to my heart I stayed mostly domestic because that's mostly what we advocate on but in 2008 I got to go to Beirut Lebanon and Damascus to see the Iraqi refugee situation and learned a lot in that setting about the fluidity of borders and the fact that in the face of violence and crisis people move that is true the part that is driving me nuts is that the US in our specialness fails to see and accept our role in creating the refugee crisis and that we fail to see that it's been our analysis of our failed analysis of Middle East politics that has generated this reality and so from my perspective we have a responsibility to stand up and welcome the various refugees into our culture into our society into our nation now the challenge is because we feel so special we don't have a very deep analysis of what's going on and the reason I think we are in large measure responsible for the current Middle East crisis is because of it started with the Iraq war the invasion under the misguided idea that we were going to go rescue the Iraqis and just happen to save their oil for us that then it created a huge disequilibrium because whatever you said about Hussein is that he had protected religious minorities and he was not they were not organized around religion they were organized around politics bathas and then our analysis Brenner's analysis was that it was around religion so we imposed in an already complex world our analysis which created a new balance of power that balance of power is never found equilibrium because it was imposed from the outside and so the same thing is happening in Syria and when we were in Syria in 2008 I met the good shepherd sisters that were Syrian and they have the had the first shelter for abused women in the Middle East had the first outline for abused women that Assad had held them up as an example in the Middle East encouraged other Middle Eastern countries to respond to the needs of battered women in their society who knows that we don't know that and so when we were thinking about bombing Syria since we're so effective at the military option that we reached out to the good shepherd sisters and said what do you think what he what because we try to base our policies on from people on the ground and sister Marie Claude wrote back and said Assad can be trouble the insurgents are a problem and they make us nervous but the US terrifies us because you have no idea who we are please don't bomb us so I say let's deal with the humanitarian crisis let's get people food let's bring people in let's get over our specialness but let's get some sanity about our international analysis of what's going on so we stop stomping around the world to get what we want in 25 words or less that's what I think not that I have any feelings of the subject good question thanks go for it hi sister my name is Carson I'm a undergrad here at the Ford School junior year and for the focus on public ethics but also a minor in religion so oh good yeah I also have a question it's a question from the audience but how does your zen or contemplative practice inform the policy work you do and I'll add something else on there which is if there were a spiritual tool or practice you could recommend to policymakers what would it be well you know actually meditation is at the heart of what I do because all of this stuff I say is like a snow globe you know I'm a Californian so I didn't know snow I'm not a Michigander so the only thing I knew about snow as a kid was that in the snow globe is that you shake it up and then all this stuff goes along well meditation is like when you put it down and you let it all sink down and for one brief shining moment there's clarity occasionally doing zen practice there's clarity now and the clarity is often about the pieces left out about the the HLE not the WHLE the pieces missing and that for me has been the really important for trying to move policy in a way so we don't get caught in our certitude where we can see what's missing also I could say you introduced the bus and the bus was a direct response to the Vatican Center that named us as a bad influence on Catholic sisters and but meditation led me to to ask the question how do we use this moment for mission because four days before the Vatican Center we've been asking the question how do we let people know we've been doing this we had our 40th anniversary party how do we let people know we've been doing this for 40 years who knew the Vatican could answer our prayer I mean but but meditation rather than meditation leads you to not push back not to fight against but rather to fight for a vision at least that's my experience of it where all can be included and so what would I recommend to lawmakers no but they do meditation I mean it opens you up to the fact I'm not the measure of everything I'm not in control and if I accept that then I need then I need help I need others politicians don't often think they need others but it's true they do so that that'd be my John the Baptist activity in a Christian metaphor well since we are in the political season we have a question from Twitter and you're addressed to the 2014 Unitarian General Assembly you spoke about walking towards trouble you've written against Trump's policy as an example of walking towards trouble what impact do you hope to have on this election trouble I really think that too often we are tempted in politics to do the calculated the focus group the distilled refined sanded down boring stuff and I think really what's called for in this time is to walk to not withdraw but to engage to walk towards it and the fact is okay my community social workers and what you do with a bully is you confront them and quite frankly it appears to me that Donald Trump is acting as the bully in the schoolyard trying to intimidate people will stop it so that's what Bishop carcaneo whenever carcaneo is a Methodist Bishop and I wrote an op-ed to say stop it now it got some good play he hasn't stopped it yet but if I get a chance I would like to meet with that we've been trying to meet with the Republican candidates because I'd really like to talk to him about this why are you doing this you're better than that our nation is better than that but see what it requires is the willingness to engage and not write them off too easy it's too easy to say fluke I mean that's what's been said for months well it's taking a long time for this fluke to Peter out so we better get serious about engagement and that means real conversation and so that's my walking towards trouble is you don't when there is challenge and a problem you go you lean into it there was all that leaning in for a while that was weird but but you walk towards it but that's also the product of meditation is that if you're meditating we know that we only do our part I'm just doing my part why should I be afraid I mean really I believe in the Holy Spirit so the Spirit's in charge I'll just do the best I can and some days lightning strikes and it has an effect and then there's other days where you ride an op-ed and nothing happens but but we do our part that's what makes a difference good question so it's next question I'm going to read verbatim from the card it says why does it seem like Catholic leaders are the ones destroying social justice policy yeah why does it Paul Ryan's tax policy Catholic justice is recognition of corporations as people Wisconsin's governor's destruction of collective bargaining has Catholic education gone wrong no seminary education went wrong oh glory yeah we got Pope Francis and then we still have trouble with middle management that's the challenge but the fact is that Catholicism is really a big tent and the Pope Francis has these four characteristics enjoy the gospel four characteristics for peace building which is what I think we really need to do and what Pope Francis is trying to do within the Catholic Church and globally is and the first is he says that dialogue matters dialogues more important than protecting your turf so and that's what you see I mean he goes towards the Archbishop's that are most critical of him it's so cool when he was in Philadelphia Archbishop Chappu is just you know so critical was Pope Francis and all the pictures of Pope Francis smiling and greeting him and Archbishop Chappu and but but it's all about dialogue not protecting your turf the second point is the hunger for unity everybody hungers for unity and Pope Francis is trying to nourish the hunger for unity there's a problem I thought that was beautiful I could hunger for unity but if you do that if you hunger for unity I discovered there's a really challenging corollary to build peace I have to give up my desire to win I want to build peace with everybody agreeing with me and that's not going to happen the third one is realities are more important than theories and that's what goes to our politicians and much of our church leadership is they have no experience of the real stories of real people and so Pope Francis is saying if we want to build peace we've got to build the relationship with real people and then the finally the the whole is greater than the parts we knew that but what Pope Francis says is if you're missing a part you're missing a whole and you can't make peace so we've got to find a way that there's room in this big table for the conversations with the Paul Ryan's which I have to confess I thoroughly enjoy my conversations with Paul Ryan and because it's just so much fun because he's all in his head and so you give him a story and then you give him another story and you give him another story and he exceptionalizes exceptionalizes one of these days I'm chinking away it'll break so I have a new I have a new want to hear my new plot okay cone of silence huge I'm still raising the money for this so I don't have the money for it but we were thinking about doing a new bus trip in the July and I want to start in Paul Ryan's district and get Paul Ryan to come to the opening of the bus trip so that he can meet my people and then we want to wander around a bit and then take the bus to the Republican Convention and then take the bus to the Democratic Convention so it's about bridging the divides transforming our politics doesn't sound cool but I have to raise money so send money or set prayers or whatever that can generate that but I think that I think there's a vision in this but it goes back to walking towards trouble that why would we stay away if we stay away we've we've seated the whole field I did that for a while I in the the 80s when you know all that when faith got high faith and politics got hijacked by the right I didn't want to talk face and politics well I'll talk politics but we'll talk face because I didn't want to be identified as a right we seated a huge ground so now we're making up for it thanks so we're going to take a little shift from politics and politicians and to wages that you know briefly about so given the gender and racial wage gap what are your thoughts on advocating for equitable pay do it damn it I mean that's such a that's such an easy thing that could be done but you know what we've experienced at network we started a new policy is that when we interview for candidates for for jobs is the guys always and the women always accept what we give them so we've started a new policy we don't negotiate wages and we make sure everybody knows in the interview because rather than trying to get women to negotiate I mean that seemed hopeless because I couldn't call up somebody say now I'm gonna call you in a minute and offer you a job and negotiate would you I mean that's not you know I've got enough of an entrepreneurial spirit I told you I was competitive I'm not going to do that with our budget but the that's what happens so we went to this no negotiation of pay and then we'll give merit increases and all this other step increases but we're trying to level the playing field on that the law should be clear equal pay for equal work duh and it's such a throwback to the old cultural reality I don't understand why it's taken us this long and we still haven't succeeded I mean it's it's like the 50s all the little ladies leaving the house isn't that sweet pattern on the head but give her a paycheck for God's sake I just I don't understand why it's so impossible I know the free market in this idea of regulation and mandating wages you should be able to negotiate whatever only the CEOs who think they need 11 million dollars might resist so we've got to find a way forward the other issue that's critical in this is the issue of wealth gap but that's the racial wealth gap is horrifying and we have got to stand up many of the average the average wealth of a white household in 2013 dollars is a hundred and twelve thousand dollars the average wealth of an African-American household in 2013 dollars is six thousand dollars and of a Hispanic household is five thousand dollars that is wrong and that creates the segregation the economic segregation creates racial segregation creates misperceptions creates hostility creates all kinds of problems and that's why black lives matter is to raise those issues up and we've got to do better than that and I as a white woman wandering around in a white body have come to realize that I breathe privilege and I have no clue I have no clue the advantage that I have and we've got to find a way to bring that to consciousness so we can change it as a society not out of guilt but out of making our nation better anyway so we got to get over a white guilt but we've got to deal with our white privilege make sense I hope anyway sermon number one so what would you recommend for steps to design political institutions that can adapt and be responsive to as you said before all persons go to the Ford School and figure it out but seriously I think I think our model of doing these roundtables I think the next evolution of the roundtable with business is trying to do a roundtables with more diverse people at the table there's a bunch of efforts at civility there's a bunch of Sandra Day O'Connor has O'Connor House in Phoenix where they're trying to create groups of civil discourse around Arizona and if they can do it in Arizona you would think they could do it most any place so I think there's some efforts at that I think we may finally be getting tired of polarization and toxicity but you know the real conversation that's going on in this election is about the role of government what is the role of government and we've got to be serious in trying to figure out how does government create a level playing field in every one of the business roundtables they said the role of government was to create a level playing field for business everybody said it but don't get government too involved okay because people want the edge and we've got we the people have got to say okay we'll create a level playing field but that means realistic regulation that doesn't become the volume oh this one we were in Davenport do you know in Davenport at a business roundtable we had the vice president the senior vice president of a bank that's 150 years old Clinton Bank of Iowa their opening in April of 1860 what was it 1865 was overshadowed by the assassination of president Lincoln they said they'd gotten over it over the years but well what happened is they have resisted the takeover from all the other big banks because they're based in a farming communities in relationship but the thing that could be the death knell of them is Dodd-Frank because Dodd-Frank is built for the mega banks and the Clinton Bank of Iowa didn't have any lobbyists at the table to say hey don't forget about us don't forget about us and so they're having to do the very same things that Chase and IBM and not IBM Bank of America and Wells Fargo are having to do doesn't make sense but because Clinton Bank of Iowa didn't have a lobbyist they got rolled into the whole story so we need some way to get everybody at the table more conversation one more this may be a very challenging question oh good unlike the others what policy changes do you believe both conservatives and liberals can't agree upon in the near future I warned you thanks you know I say you know brain transplant they're not in the Affordable Care Act so I don't know that I could you know say what will agree on there is a way where immigration well okay where I really think we're close to something is on criminal justice reform this is this is an intersection where praise God people are waking up that the economics in the social story are coming together to make a bridge in court senator Cory Booker and Rand Paul have created a coalition that are working on this so I think something and Grassley has been holding out for reasons I haven't quite understood but he said the other day they're close to an agreement so that actually could happen in this year I also think there's mostly an agreement about immigration reform there's mostly agreements around some of the the improvement of the earned income tax credit and the child tax credit which are some key issues to support low-wage working families my only problem with them I'm not good I'm advocating for them my problem is is that they're business subsidies and we need to see them that way and challenge businesses to stand up and speak for them but our people need to be able to eat so I'm willing to take it and then we have to talk living wage we've got a long way to go and that one so those are some of the areas ironically do you know what the big time a big controversy right now is the childhood nutrition reauthorization it used to be a bipartisan thing kids should eat what a radical thought now it's polarized but that irony is is many of the Republicans that are opposing it have to deal with the farmers who want it because that's their constituents so they're caught in this political posturing versus really taking care of our kids and Debbie Stabenow has been doing some really good work on this your senator and so any support that she can get from you all are just encouragement to keep at it but it's a huge challenge which should not be a partisan issue something I think we could all agree on is kids should eat but they're worried about waste fraud and abuse their kids are throwing out apples having health standards what a radical thought if any of you have seen Michael Moore's new film yes it's France France is a lovely he does food in France it's wonderful check it out and I'm not a big Michael Moore fan because sometimes these two strident but this movie has humor positiveness enjoyment it's a pleasure to watch as he stomps around the world trying to invade it's pretty funny one more question during the 1930s the Civilian Conservation Corps hired untrained unemployed people to replant the forests why can't the government hire the unemployed to build the housing that we need today what a great idea why don't we hire people to rehab the vacant housing why don't we do something to invest in our society it's because the partisan gridlock won't allow the funding of anything new we have lost the idea that the role of government is to invest in our future I mean the interstate highway program was created by Dwight D Eisenhower in order to ironically got sold as to evacuate our cities in case of a nuclear attack I was interested but that was the politics of the time so let's figure out what the politics of our time of let's invest in our future I was recently in Michigan at not Michigan in Minnesota the other end sorry Minnesota and they have serious infrastructure problems I haven't learned what your infrastructure problems are but the willful refusal of politicians to say let's invest in our future and this one gets me this is where the tax fight is going to be really serious is the idea of business that they should get a free ride in investing in the infrastructure they need to be a good business this is going to be a big fight but if you want to haul your trucks across our highways you better invest in them and you everyone pay their fair share my other favorite one is this is my general electric one if you want to do business with the government you have to pay a basic tax you have to pay your part in because general electric I forget what percentage of their business is done with government contracts but it's a huge percentage and they've paid zero taxes for years because what they do is they buy up financial organizations that are belly up and they use the losses from those corporations to offset their profits so they end up not having a profit so they don't have to pay any tax it's been going on for years if you're going to do business with the government you pay your fair share that's the provision that I'm advocating you can imagine a few might oppose that but everybody should pay their fair share poor people do poor people do can you share any funny jokes or anecdotes no I have a very I'm very serious I have no sense of humor can I share any anecdotes I didn't listen oh can you share any funny jokes or anecdotes about the Pope oh about the Pope yeah well I did about his talk let's see oh I've got a good one this is from for the Catholics in the crowd this is from one of our sisters on the West last fall she had been she's a school sister of Notre Dame and she was at their mother house their central house in Rome in August and they had some kind of reception and a security guy from the Pope was there at the reception there were several security guys I don't know why I didn't understand that part but anyway so she's talking to the security guys with a group of her sisters and the guy says to her you know the Pope's impossible to guard he's just impossible to guard because he keeps walking into the crowd and so that he said for example in July they'd been in downtown Rome in the heat of the day the heat of the afternoon and someone thrusts into the Pope's hands a glass of some refreshing drink and the security guy reported that he jumps in and he's wrestling with the Pope to keep him from drinking this glass and the security guy said that Pope Francis looked him in the eye and said in Italian it's not from the Cardinals don't worry so isn't campaign finance reform including overturning this overturning the citizens united decision the key to reducing lobbyist stranglehold on politicians wouldn't politicians create more equitable policies if they weren't indebted to packs probably but the pragmatic story is it ain't happening so we the people can't sit around and wait for a miracle of campaign finance reform I mean let's be real about this it requires a constitutional amendment or more untimely does some the Supreme Court and I'm not going to advocate for that because you see what what mess that creates so the fact is we can't sit by and wait true would be a lot easier if we could overturn sit well I think it we could be a lot easier if we overturn citizens united but I think we have to be careful about that the certainty that it's money's the problem because look at Jeb Bush Jeb Bush had a good billion dollars he had untold funding and it didn't matter there's something deeper than money it's not just money it's whether or not we have the sense that we're in this together do I have your back or and that's the piece where I think we the people make the difference so yeah I'd love to have a campaign finance reform I think it's sort of like women's ordination in the Catholic Church you know it's gonna be a long time so let's let's do what needs doing let's not stop because we can't get the ideal so let's keep at it let's work let's let's do what needs doing so this would be our last set of questions for today all right few of the exams over I feel like my oral but they're both very related as a role model for Catholic activists what advice can you give us when we go to polls vote and the second question is what are your suggestions for balancing religious and political beliefs now that's interesting because that assumes balancing assumes two sides I don't think they're different for me the faith perspective is about how we breathe it's about how we internalize how we take in the fact that we're all in this together and to say that oh my faith is over here and my politics is over here that's schizophrenia that's a mental illness we can't do that and I think some of our leadership the middle management trouble some of that is because what our leaders did was substitute rules for spiritual leadership and if you've just got the idea that faith is about this external set of rules any faith you know the Jewish tradition with the Ten Commandments or the you know the all of the strictures in the Torah or we do with all of our church regulations or whatever that creates an outside peace and what I know is a spiritual truth okay this is risky but what I know is the spiritual truth the contemplative truth is that we're created by God at every moment I have this idea that God hums each one of us at every moment it's not that God is separate out there it's not that God is pulling the strings it's that we're loved into being at every moment and the the challenge becomes how do I then embody that love and show it out and that's where it comes into politics is how do I embody the love that creates me to meet the love that creates you and we find a way forward together it's not separate it's not out there it's not controlled with strings it's hummed with a wonderful symphony as we all create different tones in different ways together that's the chorus that we need that's what we need so can I since it was the last question can I end with poem is that the gym okay because it fits right on this and it's the last poem I've got some of my poems in my book I think of them it's like my children but anyway but this poem is called incarnation it's what we're challenged to do is to do our part and so it has some Middle East references because I wrote it I can't believe I wrote it on the last night in Baghdad in 2002 so after we went to an Italian restaurant but the we came back from the restaurant and in the light from the our hotel's plate glass window was this wedding party and they were dancing because it was in the light of the window and they had an old violin and this accordion and we got drawn in to dance there were 11 of us we got drawn into dance well I'm a poet I'm not a dancer and but this guy dancing next to me trying to show me this this folk dance he leans over and he says how long do my niece and her new husband have to live in peace how long until you start bombing us the global aspect of what we're talking about well anyway so here's here's the poem that was given that night it's called incarnation that's the embodiment of God that's that being the love that we're being created by and it goes like this let gratitude be the beat of our heart pounding Baghdad rhythms circulating memories meaning of the journey let resolve flow in our veins fueled by Basra's destitution risking reflective action in a 15 second world let compassion be our hands reaching to be with each other all others to touch hold heal this fractured world let wisdom be our feet bringing us to the crying need to friends or foe to share this body's blood let love be our eyes that we might see the beauty see the dream lurking in the shadows of despair and dread and let community be our body warmth radiating Arab energy to welcome in the foreign stranger even the ones who wage this war and let us remember on drear distant days we are a promise Christmas joy we live as one this fragile gifted life for we are the body of God thank you very much thank you so much for your remarks and for such a rich wide-ranging conversation I'd also like to thank all of you for joining us here and for all of your questions I hope you will come back on Monday we will have our last policy talks of this academic year and our speaker will be general George Casey junior so I hope that you will also stay and continue this conversation we have a reception and also a book signing just outside of our great hall outside of the doors right here and so please join us for that reception and if you'll join me in a final round of thanks for sister Simone that was wonderful