 Hi, everyone. Welcome to another episode of DMTV. This is a faces of DM episode series is blowing the people making up or our movement, DM 25, where we discuss their inspirational stories, why and how they took the step from citizen to activism and politics. And this time around, I will bring two people into the room. Here are Alexandru and Michai. Welcome to the little show that we have here on YouTube. It's nice to have you. Hello. Thank you for having us. Thank you. The two of them that you see here now are actually from Romania and working to build DM 25 in Romania. And that's also what we will be focusing on. I would start with asking maybe Michai, how did you know about DM 25 and why did you decide to become a member? Thank you. I was following the news in the economic crisis of 2008 and nine and 10 and whatever. And I was very intrigued about the statesman of the Greek economy minister at that time, which was of course, Varopati. So I was going deep into searching the messages and the decisions that was made. And I didn't have a connection of the feeling at that time. I just keep going to follow the news and the messages from the Varopakis. And I noticed the movement that he wants to start it. And there was a little bit skeptic about this, of course. So I was keep going and going and following the news and the development of what happened in the Greece and in the European Union at that time. So I was just starting to notice more and more about that and getting more informed, let's say, about the informations that came along with that news and with the development that followed. So it was until, I don't know, I think 2019, when I realized that the movement that Varopakis started had some good grounds, let's say, and some good motives and that the arguments that she exposed in the years before I thought were truly valid. So I became more and more interesting and I want to become a member of a movement, first of all, just to get a lot more information about the arguments. It took more than a year to make my critical thinking and to be convinced that the motives were justified and that it truly needed some changes in the way that the decisions and the arguments of the decisions that the decision makers of the European Union need to be more transparent and more justified, let's say. Thanks. I think that is a very similar story to a lot of us and it's very important to remember, especially in that episode where the European Union was in maybe a similar tour more than today with the economic crisis and the banking crisis around 2008. So you, Alexandru, why did you join and what's the situation in Romania? What do we need to change there maybe? Thank you, Anas. Yes. Well, I think maybe I arrived to Diem slightly from a different angle. Like the personality that drew me in, drew me in, was now in Germany and also Assange. I think Diem 25 that is represented by the two of them makes Diem 25 very different than anything else I sold for. For me, now in Germany, like in the last 30 years, at least that's the time period that I watch interviews with him. He always had a very clear, very concrete point of view on the world's situation that I felt was right. It matched my own perspective of what I saw. And I remember very clearly, YouTube with him and also with the youngies, that they were talking about what means to change in order for the global society or like the tendencies that the societies have globally to change their trajectory, because the trajectory that we are on doesn't look very good for us in the near future because of different reasons like war would be one. The other one would be climate changes that on one hand, the earth has gone through warmer periods than we have right now, but our civilization has never done what and right now the civilization that we have, I don't think it will be able to manage the chaos that will probably come. And the nonce point of view that I completely agree with and that actually brought me to the end was that first of all, people need to decide to spend their free time more on their efforts in organizing and trying to tell other people and talk with other people about how they see the world around them, what problems they're having in their daily life and start managing to solve these problems. As long as people don't have the time, the free time, the energy to start having these discussions and trying to organize, there will be no good outcome. There is no space for an alternative to appear. And basically that idea of who dreams to just go on the job page and become a model. What were your activities so far for the N25 in Romania? What can you tell us about this experience? I immediately started researching, seeing what other med numbers are around me. I was living in Bucharest and I met a group, a local collective and I contacted them. It was already the world of Zoom and with most of the people, like also with Nihai, we actually never met in person. We spent quite a lot of time on calls. So I met them like this and we started talking and getting to know each other and discussing on what could our next steps be. I think we're a small group that's very dedicated, that wants to do more things, that needs to grow. I think this would be like our first checkpoint. We need to grow. We need to have more people around us that can help us become more active, more serious in a way, like better organized. Serious is not the right word. Better organized and to manage to do more things. We have ideas, we have a plan to get them rolling, but the time, the resources and the energy that our small group has, it's not enough to make huge steps. But little steps end up taking you a long way. We have a petition that we are launching now. So maybe Michai, would you like to introduce it? Yes, please let us know what the petition is about, Michai. The petition will be that the state will guarantee 150 kilowatts per hour per person for each individual in Romania. This is because in Romania we have a very big energy producing capacity and in the actual context it will be, we think, a good measure to have a guaranteed level of energy for each individual in Romania. This will actually be, we think, a very good measure for the social protection of every citizen in the country. Thanks. I think, yeah, this is for sure, yeah, as I can imagine in Romania, but everywhere else in Europe, question of concern at the moment, you know, that people cannot pay their energy bills anymore and I think a very good idea. I think if we do the calculation, like we tried to do in our group from Romania, it seems like it is very feasible to guarantee a minimum quantity of energy for every citizen. What we'll do, we try to do it for every Romanian, but of course we can think about every European citizen and then we should turn the table up and ask the question, what does it take to guarantee a minimum quantity of energy for every European citizen and how can we make a policy that will ensure that and guarantee that every citizen will have the right to live. What does that mean if you cannot guarantee shelter and the minimum quantity of energy and food for every citizen? What we are trying to start now, it's to find a policy that every citizen in Romania will have a minimum quality of energy that we think it's about 150 kilowatts per hour per month per citizen. That sounds very good. And I think it's also good for us. Of course, we are the democracy in Europe movement, so we're working in many countries around Europe, actually, in all of them and trying to change things. But sometimes you need to start somewhere. So it's also good to start on the national level in the national language to speak to people on the ground. So I think it's a it's a very good idea. Alexander, do you want to add something to what Micha was saying about the campaign? What's what's maybe more details about the plan, how to bring people? Yes, well, we're gathering signatures on the DiEM25 page. There is a short link that we can put in the description of this video. I think that would be the easiest one. It will be in Romanian. It's addressed towards the Romanian citizens, because we're still trapped in borders. But I would love if we can get feedback from other places and like talk with other people that are thinking of trying to do the same thing in their countries. I think it would gather momentum if we manage through DiEM to start chain of these kind of ideas that should reach the people in power, who need European countries, at least in the European countries. That would be amazing. What I wanted to add in a way is that making the calculations, it seems that it would be cheaper for the state to offer this energy at the production, like paying for the energy, paying for the production cost of the energy, all the maintenance of the facilities that are producing it and also for headroom and color of repairs and everything that's needed would be cheaper for the state than what it's currently paying by capping the prices of energy at the consumer. But the state is actually intervening and paying the full prices to the intermediaries of energy, these companies that are usually international funds that are really difficult to actually know who they belong to and where does that money go. So it's cheaper for the state. It's healthier for the citizens. I'm still waiting for somebody to offer a good argument that this maybe can be risky. I think the people that we talked to that were saying, yeah, all three energy would be a mistake. We're thinking we're having this idea because nobody could do a good reason for it. They would just say that it's a mistake. You can't have that. I believe that it's something that they don't trust themselves to believe that this could be a reality. But because we are like our culture, our civilization tells us that nothing is for free and that you have to strive in order to have the right to live, which is what Mihai was saying. I strongly believe that once you're born, your life is very valuable, not only to yourself, but to the community. And the community possibly more need the people really next to you. But the whole society, like the whole planet itself, every being on this planet is valuable for the planet itself. And we should all accept this and take the responsibility to actually take care of all those beings. And yeah, I think this energy, especially in today's world, like without energy, when I'm talking a little bit besides the point, the European Union was making calculations, if it can function without the energy that it was getting from eastern front. And they said, well, the amount of energy that we're getting in only represents about 20 percent of our GDP. But the problem with energy is that once you don't have energy, you don't have anything else. You can't make anything else if you don't have the power to move. And in today's world, this energy, we need to have it. And it's sad because we're in a situation regarding the global climate, which we don't have a lot of time with an environment that we know that it's like predictable to us. And we have to use this energy that we still have left with easy energy, easy, accessible energy to prepare ourselves for what we believe will come. It's responsible to prepare for the worst if you can. I think it's very, very right what you're saying. And I think that is what TM25 is working for as a whole, also with our Green New Deal for Europe that we actually ran within the European election 2019 already had all those plans to make massive investments into renewable energies. If we would have made them, we would be in a better situation now. We would be less dependent on gas and oil, which are now, yeah, the parts are going through the moon. Every watcher, please watch this episode that we had on the electricity market on the YouTube channel of TM25. There you can see, yeah, how ridiculous the system actually is this market system that we have that because the prices for gas are rising, also the prices for renewable energy are rising, even though they shouldn't be rising in reality because the costs are the same. The wind and sun are, you know, shining and blowing every day. We will support you with everything you can so you can make it a success first in Romania and then everywhere else as well. Out there, if you want to join these guys, if you are in Romania or anywhere, you know, dm25.org slash join and you can do that to the end of the video. I thought it might be interesting for the viewers and listeners to hear a little bit from you, how actually the political situation in Romania is and what you can change about it there because I think we have a lot of witness from all over Europe and the world who might not be so well informed what's actually happening in your country. So I would hope to get from the two of you or from one of you, a little overview of what's actually going on and how the situation is. I want to add something. I believe me high notes better the Romanian situation than I do. But I want to point out that I believe small Muslims are very valuable because they can bring the discussion to the table. They can ask the questions that people aren't talking about. They can come up with solutions that are out of the box and they don't need in the beginning to think of all the small details that the solutions represent. I'm not saying that we're not thinking about all the small details. We are. But there is a big difference of responsibility when you're in the opposition than when you're actually controlling. And I believe the opposition is needed to be always more creative and bring ideas that are completely outside the null. By doing this, they will start to materialize. And in this process of materializing, all the details will be cleared and the implementations will be thought out and if done correctly, if followed through from beginning to the end, I believe it's impossible to do solutions. No matter how out of the box they are in the beginning, they can become reality. That was my point in this. Mihai, do you want to add something on Romania? I would first like to add something about what Alexandru said about the Earth, the value of life. We are currently in a system where the value of life is just the economic value that it that life can bring out for other people. How much profit can my work, your work, Alexandru's work bring to other people? This is something that I think it needs to be changed. And this is, I think, one of the core reason for our petition for the minimum energy quantity for every citizen in different of what the economic value it brings to the capitalist market. Coming back to the your original question, the political situation, the Romania right now, it's bleak, let's say. I mean, the government right now, it's made up of the coalition between two antagonic forces, which is the socialist movement, which is a party that came from the Communist Party from 40 years ago and which did not change the core ideas of that communist interpretation of the socialism and with the liberal party, which is a liberal name, but I would categorize it like a neoliberal capitalism system, which promotes deregulation and the free market, let's say. The free market concept that as Alexandru said, Noam Chomsky has a great critic and arguments against it. So we are now in that situation. And moreover, in the last election, right extremist party managed to enter the parliament and it was a big fuss about it. But the problem is this extremist right extremist party is gaining and gaining more support because of the bad decision that this strange coalition between a socialist party and a neoliberal party are doing right now. Like in Italy, like in Germany, I think Germany and I think in the north somewhere, I don't know if Finland of Sweden had a similar situation last month's where right party just entered the parliament. I think there are really very, very similar situations all over Europe from the one that you're describing. Yes, and this, I think, is right now the main political problem because we see what is happening with the right-wing party that gained the majority in Poland, in Hungary, and the problems that are arising with their ideas that are extremely nationalist and in no way they're thinking about the European communion. I mean, I think this is politically the main problem in Europe right now. The right things of right-wing parties that are promoting nationalism and isolationism, let's say. Thank you for giving us this small overview. I think it's good to know that you're there and that you're working against this as we are doing, you know, as you said, there's a right on the rise everywhere in Europe and a weak left in most of the countries in Europe. So this is actually also something that we are working on with our Mera25 electoral wings. I think this was a good, small overview. I would like to say good luck with the campaign. And also, thank you for for joining this episode of Faces of the M25, Alexandre and Michai. Thank you, Johannes. Well, I would like to add something inside me at the end. How about us? I think democracy, people understand very different things in this. And for me, democracy means a heavy weight sale in what decisions are made that influence your life. And I advise and I would suggest to people to think of their lives and their wishes about their lives, what they are and to look around in their society and see if those wishes are being inspected. But if not, I encourage them, whatever their wishes are to organize and to start to express their or publicly express their wishes and try to influence the decisions that are being made. I think this is the one of the reasons why I arrived here in the end because I started being a little curious about all these decisions that are being taken, I don't know, above me, behind me, underneath me. And I said, no, I should get involved. I should not be so docile and just go with the flow. I should try to influence it. I think this is a perfect final words from Alexandre here. You are there, get involved, whether it's in the workplace by joining a union, you know, get organized. Also, of course, this movement, you can join it dm25.org slash join and you can help with the energy campaign in Romania and many other things that we are doing as activists on the streets everywhere. Thank you and see you at the next episode. Thank you, Hanis. Thank you to everyone that watched. If I may add something about what Alexandre said, I would like to encourage every people to consider or to think about why do we think now that it's impossible to allow and to ensure what at least our constitution said, the right to live. Why do we consider that it's so impossible to give every living person, let's say, a right to live, which means the basic need to live food, shelter and energy. Why can we not think it over over the top? Let's see what does it take to make sure that things are assured and then think about how we can build an economical system that allows the people who want more to have more, but to ensure that the people that cannot or don't want more just to have the right to live. Nothing to add there. I will end it on this. See you next time. Ciao. See you. Bye.