 January 16th, we're on the select board meeting to order. With us tonight are Justin Lawrence, Macarod left, Kloes Smith, my right, Jeremy Hansen, and Angelina Capron is on the phone with us. Also with us is Nina Hadley and Diane Isabel, the town treasurer. Additions or changes to the agenda, Dan? Yes, I have three additions I'd like to make. I'd like to discuss the project for down street housing. I need to give you the ordinance that you approved at the last meeting for signatures. This is the wastewater ordinance. And I also would like to add the budget approval on this agenda. Okay, public comment. Hearing none, treasurer's report. Okay. I have given December trial balance budget status report and delinquent tax report to the select board, so I should have that. Also, I have a few parcels that are under $5 that I would like to write out the balance at eight parcels for a total of $6.86. If I can get approved, I could get this. What was the amount? $6.86, right? Most of them are like $0.30. These are ones that people just, either they transposed their number or they might have crossed in the mail as far as when they paid the late fee and I sent out the new one. These are, like I said, very small amounts. So you're looking for a motion. So I move that we write up the balance for those tax bills in the total amount of $6.36. And I second the motion. Any further discussion? All those in favor? Aye. Aye. Those opposed? Motion carries. That's all I've got for now. I know there's something else we can discuss later with the fire department. Yep. Since we haven't reviewed the financials yet, Dennis Chambers, dog issue, Dana? Yes. Dennis, that's you. No, no, no. It's not you. This is the pecs? Okay. All right. We've had Mr. Chambers ask to come to the board to discuss the ordinance for the dog, the animal ordinance. And since he's not here, I really can't speak for him, but there's been some instances down there with his complaining about barking dogs, dogs running in his yard. And I guess that's it. There was a couple earlier about defogating. Okay. So, since he's not here, I don't know. You know, what to do. I guess... Well, Chad, what's the overall complaint? I believe it was pretty much daily. And he's complaining now mainly about the constant barking of the dogs inside of the pecs residence. And that it's disturbing his well-being and driving himself and his girlfriend to have emotional problems. So, that's after about a year or so, that's what's coming down to it. Refresh my memory of the dog ordinance? There is, in the dog ordinance, there is a phrase about, basically, it refers to it as a public nuisance. Oracle number five. Yeah. Here comes Mr. Chambers now. Okay, all right. Now, did you issue a ticket? I did issue the pecs ticket last week, big before. Okay. Was that for barking dogs? That was for the barking dogs. Did you hear it? He has everything recorded and that provided the pound admin with the USB drive with all the recordings. Is that resolved now? No, he still keeps calling. I mean, is the dog still barked off? No, the dog's, he said our dog's... The dogs bark at strangers. The dogs bark at deer across the river. The dogs do not bark over five minutes. We bring them right back inside. They are in a pen in our yard and we have asked the landlord repeatedly, can we please put a privacy fence between us and Dennis? It still has not been resolved. I have pictures of my backyard and you can see that the houses, the trailers are very close. I also have a letter from our other close neighbor. Another question for Chad. So this is a citation for violation of this municipal ordinance, right? It's a municipal ticket. A municipal ticket? It's now with Vermont judiciary. It's handled through that process? Yes. Okay. Well, if they want to make a, they want to fight it. I believe the ordinance in the back that says that this is the step that they have to go through. Okay, that was what I was asking. So you guys will decide whatever you seem to pick. Yeah, the procedures of the appeal are on the last. They issued a ticket. He said our dogs were out there at four o'clock in the morning, barking at four o'clock for a long period of time. Our being him out of bed at four o'clock in the morning, our dogs were hanging outside. If my dog is in his kennel and the other one is in his kennel. Do you have timestamps on those recordings? I believe they're pretty much our timestamp, yes. And they also have pictures of dogs on the property. So long story short, we were contracted with Berry City for a while. So we were just letting Berry City deal with it. And unfortunately, they weren't dealing with it. So I guess Berry City subcontracted the random rescue and she can't issue tickets. But she did a home visit and talked to both, I believe. And nothing got resolved that way. So we went to put the couple of other officers, put the situation through the Montpelier community justice. And after a couple of months, they turned it down. But I believe they did call Mr. Chambers and talk to him. I don't know if they called us. We got a letter in the mail from a meeting and we were not sure if both parties would go to the meeting. We talked really, we told them that. So long story short, all these instances still kept on going and nothing was going on. So I contacted the landlord and after contacting the community justice program, I think everything was through in probably late December. And nobody did anything about anything. So Mr. Chambers provided all the audio recordings and the pictures. And therefore I issued the ticket based on a statement that Mr. Chambers issued and the recordings. This is going through the new ordinance? This is, no, this is an existing ordinance that we've had on the books. I mean, through the judicial bureau. Judicial bureau for the ticket, yes. Oh, yeah. But this is a different procedure because our ordinance has a different procedure, right? One of those things that we probably, that's something is on the, we may amend to go to the more, we need to amend on many of our own instances, actually. And you could prevail on this matter too. You can say, you can void the complaint or you can uphold it. This is what this is for. May I speak? Sure. I work for them. So I'm at the house quite a bit during the day taking care of Tina's handicapped child I work for Washington County Mental Health. And this has been going on for about two years. And first of all, I know disrespect to Mr. Chambers but his girlfriend doesn't even live there. She comes down once in a while. I'm there every day. And I let the dogs out. They go out, they're out maybe 15, 20 minutes. They come in and yes, they do bark once in a while in their house. And if someone comes to their house, they're going to bark. I think it was Thursday, Mr. Chambers is out banging by the trailer. They're gonna start barking. Someone's by their home. She goes out to do a bus run. They have to put one dog in the kennel because the other one likes to instigate me. And he's saying they can hear it through their home to their home with the windows closed and everything. And he's got cameras pointing at the house. Now there were two other dogs in the park from the part loads that run around loose and defecate on his property. And it's not just him. But they go after this person. I've never seen a person get phone calls on them so much in my whole, when the whole park was full and we had cops down there all the time. These guys are getting a call on them at least two or three times a week if not four or five times or more a month for these, for her dogs. It's getting to where you're afraid to even let them out to go to the bathroom because you're gonna get a call on them. And when they call, and he's supposed to go to the landlord by the lease. He's supposed to go to them for mediation. And instead, he's not going to the landlord. He's calling the cops all the time. And now we're standing in front of you. He had another incident. Another incident is her disabled son rides the lawnmower. The one thing he does in the summertime is rise a tractor lawnmower around. He calls the cops on them. The cops come out. We're talking dogs. Right, but this is ongoing and it's called the rest. May I have your name, please? Stacey Frazier. Thank you. What you have to understand is we can hear the dogs inside his home with the TV on. The trailers are extremely close together. So number one, that is a problem. But when you also have three dogs in a trailer that is so close to someone else, it sounds like the dogs are literally in the living room with us. When the TV is on, you can hear it over the TV. When you do it, you do it at the end of the park. I actually was respectful to you when you spoke. That's true, I'm sorry. Thank you. How come my neighbor up the road is not, it says to say that their neighbor is off the road? That's your comments to the board. Your neighbor is off the road and I'm right next door and where you let the dogs out is also on the side that's closest to him. The Chad, were the dogs able to be heard on the audio? Yes. And do you know where they were recorded? Well, I wasn't there when it was recorded. Top of the hen is in this house. But he did end up getting a camera because we spoke about needing proof of which dog was in Ines' property because other owners have been issued warnings as the first step and provided the ordinance. And he did get a camera. It's not pointing at the house, it's just pointing at his driveway. And he provided, and that is date stamp, he provided pictures of the dash on being on his property in the beetle, beagle, beagle being on the property. When they probably run out of the house and someone comes. Mr. Chambers. Yes. Have you gone to your landlord? I can't even give you a number. Many, many times, whether it has been through phone call, messages left, several, several emails sent. And I have gotten one call from him. And I wouldn't even necessarily say that it was necessarily just solely for the dogs. It was a couple of other things it was also talked about. But the one phone call. He also tried to get them evicted two years ago. In that case was dropped for the same thing. I'm trying to get anybody evicted. Sir, he's not trying to get anybody evicted. He's trying to have peace and quiet in his own home so he can rest and relax. I disagree with that, sir. I don't mean to be rude, but there's only two trailers at the end of the project. And it's theirs and his. Otherwise, everybody else has this huge space of land because there's only like 12 trailers left. So when you get down to where they are, it's her and him and then there's like no trailers at all. Well, he wants that corner all to himself. So he's got to get rid of them. We're doing speculation, not in fact here. So Chad, you said that you could hear the dogs barking from his audio. From his audio, yes. Well, I don't know how the board feels, but I feel like we should just let this go through the system. I just have a question. Is the dog a? Yes. Does your doctor have a letter establishing your dog is a supporting? He does, and I haven't picked it up yet. I was on the phone with my accountant. I'm looking at the law right now, and I believe you're protected. They are protected. But there's three dogs, right? Yes. Okay. Well, they'll have a chance to go in front of the judge on this one, hearing officer. Yes. Hearing officer. So again, I'm more inclined. I don't know how the rest of the board feels, but I'm more inclined to just let it go. Do they automatically go to mediation? Well, community justice program turned it down. So he would have to check out tonight and then back his ticket, mail it in within 20 days. Already mail it in? To get it at court hearing. And then a court hearing would be set forth, and usually the town lawyer or somebody comes with us for municipal ordinances. Again, I'd say there's something. A similar process will play out at the court hearing. The pecs will have the chance to present their sign to chambers, will have his chance, and the hearing officer will ultimately make a decision. And they'll also hear from the town, but with basically, if the hearing officer has a copy of the animal control order, certified copy of the animal control order, that's what he's gonna rely on, probably to make this decision. Yeah. Well, again, I'm more inclined to let it go, and I mean, I don't feel right, second guessing Chad's. Right. I concur with that. I mean, he was there. Right. Right. That decision. So I guess we'll have to roll on. We should probably have a motion. Okay. If there are statutes online, you can go ahead and look up the laws yourself, and this might be helpful for you. What's the section, Angelina, that you're looking at? I'm looking at this section. But this is something that presumably that the hearing officer is going to be able to reconcile with. And I don't, I know that. This is number 166, volume 32, number two. Title? So can you tell me, so what VSA? Title 32? 32 VSA, and what was the? 166. Volume 32, number two. 166. 166, and then volume 32, number two. I'm offline. Oh. New computer not set up enough, okay. And the rest of the hearing officer will decide if a violation occurred on that day, if he agreed with Mr. Chambers or Mr. Peck, but they're not gonna stop different planes from coming in and more tickets being issued. So I think that's more of what they're here for and Mr. Chambers is here for is to get a resolution to how to come to grasp with the barking dogs. Does that make sense? The hearing officer is just gonna say yes, he violated section five of the ordinance, but that's that and you'll have to pay the $5 ticket or not pay it, but that's not gonna stop or resolve the issue that's going on down there with the barking dogs. I think it's, frankly, if I'm wrong, that's more likely why you're up here. Absolutely. But I'm not sure that we have a role or responsibility to remove animals. You have the authority, however, that's a long way down the, kicking the can down the road. I mean, I think you have limited scope in what you can do. What you can encourage the two parties to do is maybe I would suggest getting the landlord more involved because it appears that he's not being involved. And I mean, it's a difficult situation because the houses, the home service is in such close proximity. And the packs are pet owners and they're entitled to have a pet, but the problem is the pets can't violate the animal control ordinance. And I mean, even if it's a service dog, service dogs are permitted pretty much anywhere, but I still think they're not really permitted to violate an animal control ordinance with the noise. I think going through this. Mr. Chambers, if there was a part, like a privacy fence in between there, would you have any objection to that? Between you and your neighbors? I would have no objection to that. I'm not sure that is going to solve the problem, but I mean, that in itself to be enough, I would not have a problem with. But it may, I mean, if it was a wooden fence, it could conceivably dampen the noise of it when it's when they're in the house, if they're barking. Yes, and I've asked the landlord about putting in a privacy fence and he told me he was supposed to come down on a certain day and he never showed up. So I think the select board can certainly take a role and encourage the landlord to become more involved and help resolve this because if the fence can go up and that can quiet things down on your side and doesn't require you to make other arrangements with your dogs, I mean, that could be, who is the landlord? Randy Rulo. No matter what he goes under, which is RLLC, it's still Randy Rulo. Well, the dogs are registered. We'll have to give Randy a call. Okay. Would you? Yes. So I think we should, because this is part of a legitimate hearing, I think we need to have a motion. So I'm going to move that we, that we uphold the ticket that Sergeant Bissette issued. And I second that motion. Any further discussion? Hearing none, those in favor? Aye. Aye. Motion carries. Thank you very much for coming in. Thank you. Thank you all. Have a good evening and drive carefully up there. Thank you. You too. You too. Keith, come on up. I'm interested in you. Yes. Get some sleep. You're welcome. So our visit this time is in regards to the replacement of one of our enders. And this is the one we talked about for requesting the bond vote. So I have some paperwork that I can pass around here. There's two pages. I think everybody knows by now, but congratulations or in order. Thank you. Absolutely. So what we've done since we last met is we met as a apparatus committee and created a, not a full specification, but a punch list for what we'd like to see in the replacement engine. And we sent that out to five apparatus manufacturers. I heard back from four of them. And the results of those estimates are right there on the top of the page. The four back were Toyn, Lakes Region, New England Fire Equipment Apparatus, which is in Connecticut, and Dysarcy Emergency Products, which is in St. Albans. They ranged from a low of 548,000 to up to the top end of 600,000 for the Toyn. We're using the 580 instead of 600 for that top end right there. One of the things I got back from all those apparatus manufacturers, however, was what we're used to is 20 year old technology as far as scene lighting. And they basically told me, hey look, you can do a lot more with LED technology nowadays than what you're used to. The generator that you believe you need on the truck, if you're only using it for scene lighting, you don't really need it. So what else would we use it for? The other use for that generator would be if we need to generate 120 volt power for portable equipment, heavier duty fans, power tools, so on and so forth. Is there a role for emergency management in the event of something bad happening and you need to? We have a backup generator at Fire Department, the power supply department. And we have a generator on our rescue and then we have small generators, portable generators as well. That makes sense. So it's not like it would be the only piece on the equipment on the department. The generator on the truck, is that run off the PTO or is it run off of a separate model? It would have been a hydraulic generator. So one of the trucks right here in good shape. Right, right, but they're basically saying it's a 15 to $20,000 item that you don't need. So we're like, fair enough, we'll drop that off. So that is going to the prices without generator. So you see there's a range of from 530 to $565,000 for a truck. So what we did is we took that top end 565, we estimated that we'll probably run that bill up a little bit more with the small ticket items that we haven't specced yet. So we added $20,000 for that, so it's 585. The department, our truck fund, our capital replacement fund that we have been building up, we figure we can use $50,000 to $60,000 of that fund to kick in to help this. So that'd be about 10%. That drops our request for a bond to $527,000. $527,000 for the replacement of our frontline engine. Oh, it's the same chassis? They are basically the same truck. There's the manufacturer of a motor in the chassis. We didn't specify the motors per se, we said we want 450 horse. What we have is we have, the manufacturers are in parentheses, E1 is the chassis manufacturer for one, Spartan is another, HME is the third and towing, custom builds the back behalf of the bodies, but they do it on a Spartan chassis. And the fifth one that I requested was a engine manufacturer called Pearson. Yep. So by going back to the engine question, we did spec out the 450, I think a couple of them or at least one came through as a 400. And they're, without pulling them out and looking out among them to say, probably three out of the four of those are Cummings engines. And then I also gave you a page where I found some time to talk to Diane today in regards to what would this look like as far as a bond? What effect would it have for the, with what we have for a grand list in town right now? And she suggested a longer term. So I put annual repayment of the bond, assuming 4% interest, which is what Diane suggested, and came out with some rough numbers here. Annual payment on 20 years would be a $39,000 payment a year. If you do 10 years, it'd be $65,000 a year. And the total, including repayment, including interest is the second line. The effect that would have on a $200,000 property is on the bottom. If you do 10 years, it's $12.74 total per. $200,000. On a $200,000 per year. And if you do 20 years, it's $7.62. That being said, this is the funds we're requesting as far as the repayment terms and so on and so forth. That's not really our wheelhouse. That's, you know, more goes into your side. So this is, and I have some backup information if anybody cares to look at it. I have the bids, or not, they're not bids, but I have the estimates here if people really want to see them and stuff. What are you doing? I might have missed that, but what are you doing with the 93? That you're replacing with this? The 93, well, an engine typically has a 20 year lifespan, typically just, nationally they've gone to a quality standard, like is this truck working still? Or is it not? But typically it's like a 20 year lifespan for a truck. 93, it's 26, 27 years old right now. So we're on that lifespan right now. Our other truck is an 89, it's older. The 93, there is a used market for trucks, but it is flooded with old engines. Could we get anything for it? I should. Maybe $150,000, and of course that could go into reducing the bond, of course. But I wouldn't really hold my breath for much at all. So I'm selling it out of the bank loan. So what would you guys, I'm just curious what you guys would be doing with it. Say again? I'm just curious what you guys would be doing with it. Yeah, we would not be wanting to keep it in our inventory. And the bond, you would have the bond bank and fees and that's above $10,000. In fees. Yeah. Is 20 years the longest you would go on the bond? I would think. I mean, bonds obviously can go 30 or 40 years, but. But is this instance that long? And as I mentioned, the lifespan of our frontline engines 20 to 25 years, we requested stainless steel body on the truck, which according to manufacturers really gives us that 20, 25 year lifespan. An aluminum body would be a little bit less, but you would come into after 15 years or so, you would start to be seeing that maintenance start to jack up to maintain, basically refurb that body. So I don't know, fire trucks or anything like that. I mean, I don't even know what you spent, like what, they must range dramatically in price, right? They do. I talked to one of these manufacturers to start with and said for this, that we're using what's something that's called a custom chassis, which is the fire trucks you're used to seeing that we have. They're that flat nose cab forward design rather than something like a Kenworth tractor trailer. Those are called commercials. A custom engine gives us a shorter wheelbase, better turn radius, a better ability to get to some of these tighter driveways that we have in town. The car, of course it's gonna be higher than the commercial, but the commercial engine, the commercial chassis, cabs and chassis, one of the manufacturers noted, often lasts about 15 years and then it just goes downhill, rather than 20 to 25 years. For a custom, one of the people I spoke to had mentioned he's seeing price ranges bottom end on a custom about 450 right now, top end 700 for an engine right now. Yeah, I don't think they'd give you a bond for a fire truck. You don't think so? No, this is a vehicle. Really? Didn't we bond to the rescue? Yeah. Understanding. Yeah, that was understanding. Our last time we had to bond to the bank loan. I believe it was a bond. When was that? 2003. The last time that we went in front of the select board requesting bonds for a new apparatus was in 2003 for the rescue and it was an eight year, my recollection is it was an eight year repaid bond that the town requested. The 93 engine that we're looking at replacing now was purchased new by our department and Nick, you might be able to inform us better on that. I wasn't around in the back then. That financial endowment, I don't really remember unless we went back to the notes of the books. But it might have been, it was just an article that we came to requesting a certain amount of money for. I think my only question is my personal opinion, I don't think a bond is the way to go. Why is that? Well, if you have a 20 year bond, I don't, the town is gonna have to pledge something other than a fire product, I'm pretty sure. Again, I'm not. It's gonna cost you automatically $10,000 out of the gate. It's going to be a long process because there's a procedure you have to go to and I can't word it through you right now. Like sell the bonds and then just have to know. And that type of thing. And so I'm just trying to see in the 92 transaction. Yeah. It's a 4% bond and that would the fees would be up to, if you did this, it'd probably be a lower case. I mean, I don't think there's a problem of getting the financing. I'm just saying that the bond is, so it'll make sure that it's fixed. I just want to call debate tomorrow. I have somebody that does that. Right, that's what, I think that's all I'm saying. I'm just gonna stop. 2.05. I believe the article was in the 91 book. Okay, all right, well. In 91? Okay, well that was an eight year loan, I believe. Either an eight or a nine. Something like that. Okay, I'll take a look at that. When do you need the edge on this? If it has to go in front of the town for a vote. We are up against a deadline. Which is? To get in the deadline, we have to have the posting done by the 25th. And unless you put it off, I mean, I know you need this piece of equipment like now, but if it went to the August vote. With the partisan primaries, we have another vote except that this is August. Ryan, I'm just hating to rush into something. I totally understand that. Absolutely, the build. That may not be the best deal for you. The build for a truck, once we sign a contract is typically 12 months. Yep, our process to do the spec and to send out the RFP, we've been through this before, maybe four or five months. A couple months process. Yeah, it's gonna be a couple months for us to work on the spec and then we've got to send out an RFP. So, you know, if that's three, four months right there. You could, I guess the question is, could we put this off another six months? And I think we could. We're hoping not to, that's why we're here tonight. I was thinking if you were to put something in requiring asking the money, and of course in there, you're going to say there will be financing. Do you have to specify exactly what the financing is? That it would be offset, the bond is a whole, yeah, that's a separate, that's a separate vote. So if we just did that like a special appropriation, you mean, or like a special authorization on the town meeting ballot, is that what you mean? So to go forward and with an offset of a loan. It may have been written in such a way should the town appropriate so much funds towards the deferral involved with your firefighter for a truck. Yeah, 92, I do have that actually. By means of a loan or a bond. And it was great because Dorothy used to write it in law here. Yeah, I see that. Such a beautiful handwriting. I didn't mean that one, but did I say 91? You said not, yeah, is there another one? That was a note for the 93 engine. It was a special handwritten note because it was the office meeting. The town appropriated, I don't know. I didn't realize it was going to be 2000. This is 200,000 for a payable within eight years. Yeah, because we had one in the 91, 92 time frame and then we had our 2003 truck, which would have been 2001, 2002 time frame. So to appropriate the money for the Berlin Volunteer Fire Department and further authorize the select board to borrow money and issue notes for payment of such appropriation as long as such notes become due and payable within eight years, the note to be determined by Australian ballot. I don't believe that was the 2003 truck break. That was 92. Was that 92? Yeah. I think that's open enough. I mean, I'm just trying not to paint you in the corner. I mean, the payable within eight years. The 535, are you talking about that one? Well, so we just increased that number, right? That's what I was thinking, increase the number instead of eight years, go just a bit higher given the truck is more expensive now than it was then. So you're looking for a regular loan then? But this leaves us open. I mean, we would still technically have to go and have a vote on a bond, but we would have the option, the select board would have the option of making that choice at some later point. I think that the other thing that we could do, which I don't know if we've done before, we could just put like an item in the budget, right? For what the anticipated annual payments would be and just start paying for it straight out of the budget, or would we have to go through this? You would have to appropriate the entire amount because they're gonna need 500 something thousand to buy this truck. Regardless of what way we go, we're on the floor. Do we take 40,000 for it? Yeah. There is a method out there that I know Woodbury Fire Department has actually leased a truck before. Do you know if Paul spec'd that? I really don't know enough about the leasing option. I know that the chief of Woodbury, he could inform me more, but there is a leasing option for vehicles available. You don't know what the term lease would be. I do not. The only trouble with the lease is somebody's making money on somebody else's interest. True. This wouldn't affect this year's rate. The other one for our rescue, I believe it was 2,000. That's wonderful. Yeah, I didn't grab that one. Yeah. I'll look that up. We can set this off till August for the confirmation. We need the confirmation. That's what I had asked, but he says it's a year's lag. Or more than a year's lag. More than a year's lag. Well, it could take them a couple of months to RFP to get the actual solid close, right? Right. And then once they put the order in, then it's going to be another year before it actually received the truck. Mm-hmm. Is that accurate? Yes. We know first we have to wait for the town meeting to vote, but also we have to wait till the July 1st. Right. At the very least, we need to wait for July 1st any way to proceed with anything for ordering something. We would go ahead now and start detail-specking this, so we would be ready. So, in reality, would it only put you about a month on? Because couldn't you send out an RFP if we did the vote in August? We could. We could as long as it's approved. If it's approved in August, it would probably only set us back about four months. It's three, four months, then, I would think, which... Do we have to wait for, after a vote, do we have to wait 30 days or something for somebody to review the vote? Recision of the vote. For a deal? Yeah. Is it also likely these numbers will go up over time based on what you've been quoted? For the year 2020, these are the applicable estimates. If we are into 2021, they're gonna go up again. What was the price difference for Waterbury when they went from last year to... Do you remember the number? There was a $25,000 jump. They bought a truck on December 31st. It was a set price. January 1st, it was $25,000 more. And if we add 12 months for a bill, there's 12 months more for another pricing. Right, but the purchase would be, once we sign it, that's it. It's a done deal. Yeah. But I mean, right now the manufacturers are looking at tariffs and problems with importing materials, and they're anticipating some of that going on. If they're building something, or anticipating building something 12 months from now, they're anticipating some issues with tariffs and that sort of stuff as well. So, Dana, you're still thinking that it'd be better to sit on it until... Well, I just, you know, I don't like to rush into things. And I'm thinking that I would like to sit down with Diana and have us do a little research of what would the best financing option would be. Can you folks get a little firmer price on that? What's the cost? These are pretty firm prices from three of the four people. They went through their bidding software with what we had. Only next firmer price we could do is complete our spec and send it out. The... The... I was gonna say this. Yeah, because a few of them were asking me, you know, are you ready to purchase down? I said, nope, I need an estimate right now. That's kind of what I was wondering is if there was an agreement to make a decision by a certain date, if they might be willing to shut me down. No, I have no agreements with anybody for trucks at this time. So, when we order a town and truck or police crews or those are all spec'd out and we get our pricing right and everything. Yeah, we'll put the RP as a piece of it. I think it would be good for us to have that knowledge. Do you think you would have the information that would make you feel better by next week? Well, I mean, if we, if you had a putting an article on your warning now for the total amount with some wording that the lawyer would bet, however, that looks like the select board will be getting funding of some sort. If you decided that the bond was the best method, it would have to go back to the voters because they would have to vote on the actual bond. And we would have a lot of lag time getting all these requirements filled if, and I feel, this is just me speaking, that the bond bank would be hesitant to loan you money on the truck. Now, I can call the bond bank and find out, but. I can call the bank because they're in fact. But we do have relationships with banks and they do must give loans on fire trucks. Set on 500,000, fair enough. So, but if we could, I mean, if those answers are easy enough to get, could we have a special meeting next Thursday and come back and put that on the agenda and still be. If you're more comfortable with waiting until August to get this stuff nailed down, it's a 27-year-old truck. We were supposed to replace it seven years ago. What's a few more months for us? I would, if I'm reading it right, if the vote happened in August, we could still order it in 2020, right? If the vote were to happen in August. Since we have to wait, even if the vote goes through in March, we have to wait until July to do anything. It's not really pushing us back huge amounts here. I guess what I didn't know is that the complexity of the questions that Diane and Dana feel that you would need to have answered if we need to do that. I'd be willing to meet next week if it means also being able to move it forward with the current pricing as opposed to going up against higher pricing later. This is using this year's pricing, the higher pricing. Oh, it is. It is using the higher pricing. It's not using 2019's pricing, it's using 2020's. So you're thinking that this price is somewhat close in August, too. I guess my suggestion would be to wait till August rather than, and I don't mean to hold up their truck. That's not what I'm saying. We'd have an opportunity, Diane and I, with what the best financing would be. We may have a chance to get a little bit good. And maybe you can fine-tune what you need to fine-tune. We would be fine-tuning. And know what your add-ons are. I know you've- I hope that goes. So if we don't put it on the town meeting ballot, which would be nice, and I think the amount of turnout for that election is going to be better than in August, do we want to put an advisory item just to get the temperature of the sentiment of the town? That's a great idea. Or is that productive? If you did August, I think that the advisory is a good idea. I think most people are going to vote for fire trucks, but I think it's good to let people know what's coming up and what they can expect and why you need it. Or maybe you want it for the floor meeting or something so there can be a bit of discussion. I was thinking a bit of discussion and some presentation. I think the town would be very receptive to that. We'd be happy to do that. So maybe that would be a good thing for the town meeting as a non-dollar amount presentation. And then with the idea that it's going to be in the August ballot. Correct. For, back in October, we had presented the, basically the status list of how our vehicles are doing. Then back at that time, we've got two main engines. We've got engine one, engine two. One engine's in Riverton, one's up here and then we switch them back and forth. Engine two is the 1989 engine. And you recall back in October, we actually put that one offline non-responding due to its condition. We have not brought it back into responding status right now. And we have been looking for a used truck to replace it. It's, we saw a couple that were good. We went, we visited one in October or so. We visited one down in Pennsylvania. Wasn't right for us and we didn't make an offer on it. We actually, I got notification from one of these people that I've been working with, cause he also deals in used trucks, that there's another truck that's come up that looks really good. And it's about 150 on the list right now for replacing engine two. The year of that truck is a 2008. What that would do is we're looking somewhere in that timeframe, what that would do is that would help stagger the ages of our trucks. So we can be replacing these trucks at a more even timeframe rather than saying, we need to right now by the way, you know. So we don't have to be hitting you hard each time. The funding that we're looking at for that is we have been discussing with, is it USDA? The USDA. We've been talking with the USDA about low interest loans and being able to fund that ourselves. We would basically put that loan into our budget. The capital replacement fund we have at this time is sufficient to carry those payments for a year, year and a half. And then we would work it into our regular budget. And at the same time that note we have for our air pack, our breathing apparatus. I don't know exactly when it's going to be completed, but it's going to be completed relatively saying, I think about two years out. So that'll free up some funds for us to pay off financing a used engine ourselves. So, and that's our goal is to basically replace engine two this year with a used truck at around somewhere around 12, 13 years old and then get a new engine for engine one in this timeframe. Engine one is an engine that the new one will last us 20, 25 years. And that will help stagger our engines. Okay. If, I mean, if the boy thinks, I think August is a good idea. I mean, it's really like he says a month. We remember we're talking about July 1st here, so. Yeah, great. So can we, are we approving the warning tonight? Yes, I hope you are. So maybe we can amend that to add a specific discussion item for the floor meeting. Yes. I may need to not have you approve it tonight, but if you could meet next week and early in the week would be great. So that we can have this ready for the town report. I can be early next week. I can be early next week, I can be early next week. I could do Monday. Monday, sorry. Okay, Monday is, the day is 20. Angelina, does Monday the 20th work for you? For Monday. Oh, it should be fine. Okay. What time is the earliest that the board could meet? 8 a.m. I could meet at 8 a.m. I could do four with a person juggling, but I mean, I don't know what your schedules are. I think the earliest I could be is 4 30. That's fine. I'm just saying, you know, five o'clock, Brad, is that? Four is possible. I just need to do a little finagling. I don't want you to have finagling. When everybody wants to meet, I can always leave work early. We're not real busy right now. I mean, it's gonna be a short meeting because we can also spend it. We can do five. I mean, I just thought it would be better than waiting till seven. Five works. Five good for you, Angelina? Yep, five o'clock on Monday. So I will write something to non-dollar amount. And I'll send it to you so you can see if it sounds okay. Good. You guys will be there anyways, so. For our town meeting. For town meeting? We will be there anyways. Well, thank you folks very much. Thank you very much. Thank you. Okay, Dana, a letter from Sister Lauren Sieber. Yes, Sister Sieber is interested in being appointed to the Conservation Commission. I move that we appoint Sister Lauren Sieber to the Conservation Commission. And I second the motion. Any further discussion? All those in favor? Aye. Move in carries. The approval of licenses, permits, vouchers, and applications. I make the motion that we approve the general funds accounts payable warrant number 20G13 with checks 1998-90 to 1999-28 in the amount of $44,090.00 and two cents. Payroll warrant number 20-14 for payroll from December 22nd, 2019 to January 4th, 2020 in the amount of $45,967.02. Also reconciled December bank statements for the general fund, sewer commission and water division and general journal entries and tax administration adjustments for December 2019. Second. Any further discussion? All those in favor? Aye. Motion carries. What if you wanna do your additional data? Whenever you would like $250.00 a dime for the difference. So we're putting off the approval of the 10 of meeting warning. Yes. Approval of the select board report? Yes. Let me get myself organized. I'm sorry, I'm a little at sixes and sevens here. Oh boy. Yes, the select board report, it's a report much like you do every year and it has been updated and I am looking for your input if you'd like to improve it or if you would... You put new numbers there, right? I did. Okay. I did. And I will have Diane check the numbers prior to giving it to Corinne. Yeah. So I moved to approve the select board report as presented. And I second the motion. Any further discussion? All those in favor? Aye. All right. Motion carries. Okay. Downstreet? Yes. Downstreet is going to be at your next meeting. As you remember, they were here on the 19th of December and they've been discussing their project and they have a draft letter of an MOU that they would like the town to consider. You haven't seen it yet because I am revising it. And so I'm going to finish that, send it to you. And so you'll have a chance to look at it before next meeting. Okay. What they're asking, I just want to tell you what the items that they're looking for the towns are part of the responsibility. They're asking to secure the new town center, state designation for the area, encompassing the project and include the property in any capital improvements or capital planning for improvements within the new town center. I don't see a problem with that. Ensure the availability of municipal water and sewer. I just don't have, Tom has allocation and that's not an issue. They are asking for the town to endeavor to secure public ownership or public access for the mall road. In other words, have the town accept that road. So they're not, this is not a, they just said endeavor is the word. And I'm not sure if that's the word I'm gonna leave there, but they're also talking about funding for sources outside of the project. So that would be funding. I think they're talking about his life, the TIF district or something like that. Support and cooperate with developers in good faith during the zoning approval process, et cetera. And I think we do that anyway. The large thing, one thing they're asking for is the funding for this will is a block grant which a town has to manage. And so that would be you or me or Diane, even better. They want you to support an application for the stabilization, the thought stabilization which you can't do that because there's a process that, so that's one thing changed. But I just wanted you to know kind of what things it is. It's not anything shocking. And with an MOU, if you write it right, it's not all that. Do we have any block grant? No, we don't have a community block grant. I didn't think so. Right, so anyway, I just wanted you to know that was coming up. Thank you. In the, I have the ordinance that I need to go. We just want the ordinance. Yeah, sign. I think the dog got me all of this up. I will sign that and I can actually get these kiddos home. Have a good evening. Perfect. Have a good night everybody. Thank you very much. Here as well. I think I've done that. Okay. There's nothing there for the party. No, I'm trying to fix all the way. Do you want to check those to make sure we have them? Yes, because we could have missed them. That's easy to do. It is so easy to do. Justin found a couple of them. So we've got no street water ordinance to do it every time. We do, no matter how hard we try. Okay, great. Who will the select board minutes? Or the January 2nd meeting? Yep. I make the motion and we approve the select board minutes for January 20th, 2020. It's presented. Second. Oh, that's on those. Angelina. Angelina must. Nina, second. Aye. Okay. Any further discussion? All those in favor? Aye. Those in favor, Angelina? Motion carries. Let's see here. Budget. We never did that. No, I think you haven't approved it yet though. You're going to prove it today. No, that's what we're looking for you to approve. And the total amount is 3 million? 235,181. Did I hear you correct? It was 3 million, 235,181. That's 81, yep, we can pass. I make the motion that we approve the budget as presented in the amount of 3 million, 235,181 dollars. Second the motion. Any further discussion? Hearing none, those in favor? Aye. Aye. Aye. Motion carries. Let's see here. So we get the budget ordinance, this one here. Ten Ministers report, Dana. Yes. Round time recovery. Thank you. You're welcome. Thank you, Diane. We're very back. On February 11th, over at the hospital in conference room one and two, the Vermont Department of Housing and Community Development, these are the folks that we got the grant for helping pay for the consultant for the Newtown Center. We'll be having a ceremony to announce it and to do a little PR. So I'm hoping that maybe one or two or more of you could come to this. I don't have the complete details. They've got, the room is available from noon to 2 p.m., so it's noon and two. I would in a heartbeat, but I'll be in Chicago. I think I'll be in Las Vegas. So I won't be able to be there, but I would if I was in town. It's the 11th, it's a Tuesday. Yep, I am. Can I go with you? Of course. I will plan to attend. Thank you. And I think Carla is also planning to attend. And the next item I have, and I know that you'll jump on this, the passive is looking for people to be nominated for their board, which is the insurance arm of the League of Cities and Towns. And so if you so desire, let me know. I'd be glad to nominate your names in there. That's all I have. Do you have a slick board member? No, it doesn't, but in Berlin, I'm sure it really looks better if it is. Anything else? No, that's all I have. Okay, thank you, Dana. Thank you, Dana. Roundtable, Justin? Yes. I don't know if we talk about it at the roundtable or not, I don't think we need to vote on it, but it was the dedication of the annual, we had spoken about that and Tim is retiring and we thought Tim would be a good idea and Diana also recently retired. And so maybe we could do, dedicate a combination to both of them. I think that would be nice, it's been on my mind too. Diana was with the town since 1998, so she had 20 years of service. Tim has been with the town this latest, about eight years, I believe, and then he worked with the town prior, so he's probably has 10 or 15 years, anyway. And unless you can think of someone else to dedicate it to. I think they're both good choices. Yeah, okay. All right, you don't need to vote. Yeah, that's why I was just writing. Are we having executive session tonight? Yes, we are. I guess that's all I have for right now. Well. I don't have anything to round to you. Well, okay. Maybe we have executive session? Yes. Do you have any motion to go into the second session? I make the motion that we enter into executive session to discuss a personnel matter pursuant to one BSA section 313A2. Second the motion. All those in favor? Aye. Aye.