 Hello. Hi, y'all, Liz here with Smart Business Moves, and I have our guest, Robin Murphy with us today. Hi, Robin. Hello, Liz. How are you doing today? Well, thank you. I do want to say real quick, for those of you that are expecting Tom, and you're like, oh my gosh, where is Tom? And I know, and Robin, I know Tom just really admires you, looks up to you, really enjoys speaking with you. So I'm sure he's so sad that he can't be here today, but he is in Michigan today at Lisa Scholl's business, and he's doing a May Central Academy live event there, live in Michigan today. I think it's Rochester, Michigan. So that's fun. He's having a good time. I saw a photo on Facebook, and it looked like they had a huge crowd. Yeah, oh, you know what? He has been selling those out. I'm pretty sure every single one for the last few, anyways. Just so many people using May Central. I mean, in my mind, it's the no brainer software to use, and it just does so many different things. Even though I work with people who don't use May Central and still using other programs, I just think May Central is so, it's so funny because it's complex. There's so much to it, very complex. There's a lot to it, a lot more than any other software I've seen, or scheduling software, but it also has a lot of very simple things that it can give you, you know, simple numbers, nice simple dashboards, and some stuff like that that I love. Anyway, we're not gonna talk about that. You saw I had trouble getting my volume on, or to be unmuted, it's made central kicks in my butt, but it's great for my business. So I have to say that is I'm told to, you know, I look at certain things, but I can assume all the complex tasks that it offers, which is awesome. There's so many different things that it offers, right? I mean, that it can do. You might have to figure out how to do it, because not everything is going to just be 100% intuitive, just because it does do so many different things. But... Well, that's awesome. Well, thank you so much for inviting me today. This is really fun. I, as you know, as you know, I don't know if everybody knows, but I'm a May Brigade franchisee started in 1996, a really, really long time ago, bought a franchise territory, which was three towns, three little towns in northern Westchester, which is in the suburbs, north of New York, and it very quickly expanded to the rest of Westchester, and then covered four more counties. I convinced my husband, Gary, who's been on the show before, to join me in what I think in the fun we have. And last year, we bought another May Brigade franchise up in Hartford, Connecticut. So that's our background, been doing this for a really long time, really love it. I see so much opportunity in this industry. I just feel like it has the impact of making everybody's lives better. Customers, of course, cleaning day is the best day, as well as employees and the greater community. So I'm thrilled to be part of this industry. Yeah, me too. And I've been, like you, been around for years and years. I think I first started my company in 93, but I started, actually, this is really gonna date me, I started cleaning in the cleaning profession back in 71. I can't do that. So long, long, long time ago, I was young. My parents owned a, a turn business. And so they did apartment turns and all of the kids or eight kids in my family. And I was the eldest of all of these children and we would do apartment turns for years. And the weird thing is, I almost had forgotten about that until I was reminded by a sibling. I was like, yeah, we did do that. So yeah, like you, been cleaning things for a really long, long time, Robin. Probably won't even want to talk about it. Oh, Marvin Baker's on here with the neat. They're both saying hi. I don't see that. Oh, let me, let me pop him down here for you. There's Mark Baker. Marvin Baker. Yeah. Mark and I are ambassadors for ISSA residential. So we were on a call earlier today and I think you can do if you could test it to watch. I really wish you guys would change the time of that call. I have a standing meeting that I can't, I know it's not, it's not you that it's, I'm like, Gosha, Gosha, it changed this meeting. I have a standing meeting that I've had for about six years that I can't get out of. So I'm always having to come a half hour late. Oh, is that to the coffee and conversation? Yeah. This was an ambassador meeting. So this was- Oh, okay. But yeah, I have problems with the coffee and conversation too, but it's the most awesome meeting. I think it was last week though, right? First Thursday of the month, yeah, yeah, yeah. So you were saying that you started cleaning as a kid. I mean, how much, even since 1993, how much has industry changed? So much. I mean, remember when like in the cars, like we had those big maps that we bought the gas station to try and figure out where to go and hire her when and map quest or something, I don't know what it was called. The book, the Roadrunner books. It had a big book and it had to turn the pages to find where you were going. But it was still a huge improvement over the big map, right? The books were amazing. It was like, oh, I love these books. I don't think I ever had a big map. Maybe that was, maybe I'm newer than you or I, anyway. It's like this industry has changed in so many ways but in so many ways it feels really stuck. I used to say it was backwards and it's not backwards. I see Angela. I don't think it's backwards. We're not going backwards, but we're not moving ahead as far as I think we should. And I think that it's definitely this industry that's undervalued. I'm kind of going into what's going on in my brain today. But undervalued by the general public, right? Oh, it's house cleaning. But also I think a lot of people in the industry and our staff also don't think of the job as as meaningful as I believe it is. Yeah. We're on the same page. I think our industry has a huge disadvantage. Oh, I thought I saw Maria trying to pop in there. Nope. Maria may be, Maria Dorian may be joining us today. So we'll keep an eye out for her. We have a disadvantage in that so much of what we do, and I know this is going in the face of what a lot of people think and say and want to believe, but so much of what we do can be done by people who own their homes. Now I'm not saying it could be done to the same level. I'm not saying it could be done as well. I'm not saying any of that, but it can be done. And people think that they can do it just as well as the professionals can. I mean, I think for sure that people think that they can and a lot of times people are being paid to clean who aren't cleaning to any better level, but the idea of it as being an unskilled, kind of menial only job, it's not when it's done right. There's lots of skills involved. There's technical skills and safety skills and problem-solving skills and communication skills. Teamwork, if you're working with somebody else and kind of be done by anybody, not really, not to be done well, you need to be reliable, dependable. I mean, if you're paying for somebody to come into your home, you're gonna want them, right? To be reliable, dependable, trustworthy, honest, healthy because cleaning is hard work, right? It's very physical. You need to know what to use on what surface. You need to know what things are. You need to have a light touch. You need to remember where things go. I mean, there's a lot of stuff to this. And if it were so easy, then more homes would be clean and not all homes are, so. Yeah, I agree. I think there's just a lot of confusion. I think the reason why, part of why our industry is so fractured is because everybody already knows in their own mind what cleaning is. Whether you're a professional, whether you are, live like if you were raised by your German mom, whether, you know, everybody kind of has this idea about clean in their own mind and they think they know, right? Even young people you'll hear today. I'll even hear people that are like 22 years old. They're like, oh, I know what clean is. Yeah, but do you really? Do you really? I don't know. I think it's tough. Let's not say more. I hear what you're saying. I think that also the industry doesn't help itself. 100%. Calling, I say it's time to drop the word made, right? The word made doesn't describe what we do. It's described made in five. In any case, in my part of the country, it's an unskilled, meaning a worker doing lowly work. It's like, if you look it up in the dictionary, it's a female service. It might mean you tidy, but it certainly doesn't mean you clean and calling us a maid service kind of de-values what we're doing. I think that, you know, I feel really strongly that house cleaning is healthcare. We're fighting disease. We're killing germs. We're making homes healthier, you know, providing for the wellbeing of the people whose homes were cleaning, both physical and mental. And I think elevating our thoughts to not, again, undervaluing what we're doing benefits everybody, right? It's no, nobody, you know, I mean, I guess some people think that they can take care of themselves health-wise and in some cases, they may actually be better than doctors, but nobody is looking to pay, I guess, if you want good quality, nobody, well, it's the last time you got the best quality, anything's going to lowest price. And there's something here about it, if we provide a clean home provides for the physical and mental wellness of the people who live there. And I would even argue that for many people nowadays more mental than physical. I mean, I know, I'm speaking only personally here and not as somebody who's been cleaning for decades as somebody who lives in a home. When my house is not clean, when my house is in disarray, I am not at my best, period. I'm not. When your desk is a mess, right? I mean, you can think better, you're more creative. It's just, nobody ever says, oh, I'd rather be in a dirty, messy house. You know, nobody ever says that. And yet people are like, oh, I don't clean, right? You know, it's like, if there's, tell me if this makes sense. You go to two people's homes, one person's house is super clean, and the other one's a mess. Do you ever say, wow, that messy house, that person's so cool, because they're in this messy house because they don't, you know, because they don't clean. I mean, there's just something there. It's, I don't know, it wasn't some movie. It's like, I've been rich and I've been poor and being rich is better. You know, I've been dirty and being clean is better. Okay, but part of it is, I really love the example that you just gave because that also is a little bit of a problem. Let's say you go to your friend's house and it's very, very tidy, and then you go to your other friend's house and it is very, very messy. Right. You automatically assume the non-tidy house is dirty and the tidy house is clean. You and I both know that we can go into a very tidy house that is filthy and disgusting. And we both know that we can go into an untidy house that is clean, but there were three kids that just put Legos all over the floor, you know, 20 minutes ago. True, true, true. Like when somebody calls us up and says, oh, my house is dusty. It's not dirty, it's dusty. And I'm like, do you know what dust is? Holy shit, skin cells, dust is insect-dropping, dust is mold spores. It's like, you don't want dust in your home. But you're also bringing up a really good point, bringing us right back to, taking us right back to this idea of getting the word made out. I think that there is a lot about what I call the lexicon, the language of what we do that is unclear. And it sends, we send mixed messages all the time. I can tell you that it's been at least 20 years that I've been trying to get people to stop saying the word rag in a cleaning as a professional cleaner. Yeah, use any other word, I don't care. But look at the definition of a rag. Ask Google for a picture of a rag and look at what you get. This is not a good thing. Made is the same thing, regardless of what you, like my cleaning company is called American Made, right? MAID. Brigade. Maid Brigade, same thing. Here we are coming y'all from position of having these companies that have this word made in them. Go ahead. But I do feel like it's time to drop it. It just sends a wrong message. I made a video that it's time to drop the word made. And people came at me. I mean, it was interesting. Not customers, like I have customers that are friends on Facebook and they were all supportive. But in the industry, people came at me. So they said, well, instead of dropping it, why don't we take it back? And I'm like, you know what, let's move forward. I don't, you know, it's like, oh, listen, I respect everybody can have their own opinion and I'm not going to tell somebody else what they should. Well, maybe I'll tell them what I think they should do. But I respect them for doing what works for them. But in this video, I said something about it being, you know, it's a disintegrating word. It's like servant. And nobody thinks servant is good. Like nobody would use the word servant as an elevated title. I don't know. I gotta argue that one though real quick. I have a servant's heart. I have a servant's heart. And I think servant's heart is different than servant. There you go. So, and I think we run into that problem with language though, it is really important. It's more important than people give credence to. And more people nowadays have a negative connotation to the word maid than a positive connotation. And it was interesting because somebody else said, my, what did they say? They said their staff, I listened in my office. I say this. My staff loved to hear us, right? And they loved to hear what? That I say let's stop using this word. It's not right. We don't call our staff mates. Maybe it's a franchise. So I bought into, oh here's something to say, be mindful of Google search keywords. Yup, sadly. Now the keyword is sadly, people will still be searching maid's service near me. I, you know what? It changes hard and changes expensive. I think we need to start working for the, playing the long game. And, you know, again, I can't tell other people what to do, but I know what I want to do. But, Maid Brigade is the name of a company that I bought a franchise in 27 years ago. I recently renewed my contract. So my company name is Maid Brigade. I don't have control over that. But I did decide it was really important to me. And we started another brand where we're not using the word maid. And it's church, church. It's really, I mean, talk about like having nothing to do with cleaning. Yeah. It's, but we're going with, this is, you know, a different kind of cleaning service. You know, a different kind of home cleaning service. And we are going to work really hard to make a name for ourselves. And if somebody is Googling maid's service near me, they're not gonna find us. But I don't really want them to find me because I think a lot of times people are, a lot of times people are searching when they're searching on Google, they're looking for maid's service near me is code word for, you know, as cheap as I can get. And that's not what we are. So, and listen, I'm just talking about for me, I'm not telling you what you should do. It's tough. So going back to this idea of getting word of the word maid, I think what you're saying, your big message, Robin, is not, okay, I'm not gonna be part of maid brigade anymore, cause I'm not the word maid. But the idea is, let's raise the level of the professionalism in our industry so that we're seen as who wrote it over here more than maids. I think Stephanie put on here that that's her tagline at her company, more than maids. I love that. Yeah, absolutely. And our staff, when we're telling our staff that house cleaning is healthcare, they feel that their job matters more. I mean, COVID sucked, right? COVID was terrible in so many ways, but it was good for the mindset of my business where we weren't closed for one day. Thankfully to my staff, my office staff and my cleaning pros, but we weren't closed. But they understood no more that this isn't just like tidying up for Mrs. So-and-so. This is really, they were providing for the health and wellbeing of the families who told them that they were cleaning. They were fighting the virus and that was really good. And so for us, we worked hard and we continue to work hard on upskilling our staff, cleaning skills, you know, the technical skills, but also soft skills. It's important to our staff to think of themselves as professionals. And act that way. And when they act that way, the customers see them better too. And customers appreciate more the work that they are providing when they can walk into a home, you know, standing up straight, you know, the customer in the eye and introducing themselves. My staff for the most part, you know, nobody speaks English slowly, but it's, I'm not gonna be able to articulate this well. But I know that I can count on you to say it better. Yeah. So I'm not exactly sure which point you were trying to make with that last statement of... This is elevating what we're doing in the eyes of our staff feel better about what they are doing. They've got confidence, they're cleaning with skill, they've got pride, there's dignity, right? It's not like, oh, I'm a cleaning person. Yeah. So they are, again, they're... We're doing more than just... And, you know, I have to break it down to not even just the word made, but it's more than just cleaning. The word just is causing some problem there because cleaning is a really big thing. And knowing how to clean is a really big thing. And cleaning well and correctly. And in a way that actually changes the environment, that's a really big thing. But I also don't want to underestimate how important, especially for mental health, is the straightening and tidying and neatening things. So we do more than just cleaning also. We also straighten and neatened and tidy. And the whole thing is bigger. It's not an either or thing. We do a lot more, period. We are protecting people in many ways, not just their physical environments, but also their mental health. And that sounds overly blown, I know, right? They're psychologically well-being, but... I think it's right on. But I did a different video a few, I was probably a few months ago, about there are things that you shouldn't go cheap on. Right? Yeah. You shouldn't go cheap on insurance, mattresses, somebody added plastic surgery. I said sushi. You don't want to go sushi. But health cleaning should be added to the list because this is a really, it does take skills. You want somebody, as I was saying before, who you can trust, who's honest, who cares, who's reliable, who they're in your house, touching your personal stuff. Like why would you want to go cheap on this, right? How much do you pay? How much somebody pays reflects how they value the work that's being done. And that is from our customer's perspective. You know, with regard to our customers, and it's also regard to us as a company. It's the race to the bottom is like trying to be the cheapest company, right? Yeah. It's not going to get you, our staff are, we call them our internal customers, right? Our staff are, there's no customer, paying customer that's more important to us than any one of our internal customers. And we need to make sure that our staff are understanding their values. And again, the healthcare, you know, raising what people earn and the different compensation packages. We shouldn't be paying minimum wage or anything close to minimum wage. We want our staff to have a reliable paycheck so that they're not worried at night and that they can come in in the morning, happy to do the job that they're doing, not worried about, you know, not being able to pay their bills, right? Does this make sense what I'm saying? Yeah, absolutely. And I mean, now is great time for this, right? Because the whole entire country is on board with this idea. Back right before COVID. So I live in Washington state and we have one of the, for many years, we had the highest minimum wage. And when our minimum wage here went up to $15 an hour, I thought people were going to lose their ever-loving minds. This was like five years ago or something. And everyone was told and everyone in our industry was like, that's ridiculous, we can't, how can we ever charge that much? We're never going to be able to charge our customers enough to be able to pay that. We can't pay the same amount that, or why shouldn't we pay the same amount for 35-year-old women that are trying to support a family as 17-year-old high schoolers that need to buy new phones, right? It doesn't match. And what did we find? We found that that was not true. People would pay more because this is quite a few years before COVID. Now, we all recognize since COVID that people will pay more money for cleaning, that they value clean, right? And they understand to a much deeper level what clean is and they'll pay more for it. But even back in the day, people would pay more. They did pay more for a professional service. The right customers will pay more, right? Yes, they value it. And I'm not saying anybody should pay, charge a lot for crappy service. You need to elevate your service so that you're meeting, you know, you're more than meeting anything. I heard the definition of value equals more than what you're paying for. You know, and so how can you offer as a company more to your customers and more to your staff? And we've got the paid time off. We've got the 401k. We have ongoing training. You know, we've got the onboarding training and ongoing training. The hard skills, the soft skills. We have a dream manager where we're helping our staff figure out what their dreams are and showing them, helping them find a pathway to get it. And we are just now able to offer our staff insurance, health insurance, no deductible and no premium. So it's a huge win for our staff and our staff come in in the office. We've got such a nice office that we built out for our staff. We wanted our staff to know they're not just working just anywhere. They're working someplace really special and that they have to grow with the opportunities that we're going to provide. Provide for them? Is that the right word to say? Yeah. But that's it. We have our office is beautiful. We have dinner every Friday night. We've got a fully stock refrigerator every day. We've got a bevy machine. I don't know if anybody else has seen these machines but they have them at the Delta Sky Club. Our staff come in in the morning with their water bottle and our values in Spanish. And they pick what flavor water they want, whether it lime, mango, peach or whatever. And do they want it still or sparkling? Do they want it with caffeine? And it's just like it's treating our staff as value as we value them. And then they are going to do that much better work for our customers who are their customers. Yeah. So we have a wait list for employees. So we've got employees who have left us for certain reasons who want to come back and other new employees, all who want to come work for us. And you know, anyway. You know, this idea of employees first, right? Treat your employees well and then they will treat your customer as well. So back in the day when I first started our business our mission statement was about your employees treating that idea. And I got so much pushback on that you cannot imagine. So again, we're talking, you know, almost 30 years ago. Back in the day, that was not a normal sentiment. The sentiments back then was customers first, period. High quality. Right? High quality and all about the customers. And if you treat your customers well then they'll treat you well and then you'll be able to build a good that was how things went. I think now it is a given that it's employees first. That they are your biggest resource. You have to value them first to be able to get the best service. Looks like you might not agree with me there though, Robin. I wholeheartedly agree with you that you believe that and I believe that. I'm sure Don and Mark and Amber and everybody else all believe that, but trust me, not a lot of, not every business does. And it's their loss, right? Because having people clean, I say having people clean better. Having people do everything better, right? Like who does anything better when they're not, you know, feeling valued and supported and in a good place. Well, I have to interrupt you just for half a second here because you said, happy people do everything better, right? And when people are happy, they do everything better. And so you just, that was the perfect opening for me. And an event that we are doing. Oh my goodness, I lost you, there you are. And an event that I'm doing on the front end of the ISSA event. And it is the art and science of happiness because I know, right? Don, what a great segue. I'm going to post about that event real quick here. Oh, live stream. Okay, sorry, Denise. Yes, I will. I mentioned that the live stream is available. If you want more information about this event, but I agree, Robin, that happy people provide better service. They're happier in their lives and they're happy to provide the service. But happiness is not as easy to come by today as it once was. I mean, times, times. And I'm actually going to argue that with myself just a little bit. It's just, we don't know what happiness looks like as much now as we used to. And the reason why this event is about the art and science of happiness is because there is a science to happiness, the way our brains work, how happiness is perceived by us and our different, we've all heard of cortisol and the different things that are running through our systems. We process happiness differently than we used to. So we're going to be talking a lot about this at that event and how to create that happiness for yourself because so many people in our industry struggle, struggle. And you know, you've seen this as well as I have Robin, especially smaller businesses. They're trying so hard, they're pushing so hard. And this is a hard business. This business is darn hard. And how to maintain happiness through that, that is a challenge for a lot of people. Which again, it is very hard, which is why if we charge more, you've got more money to solve problems with. To do more with happiness now. So anyway, that is not my answer to your happiness, but I love what you're saying. It's, yeah, it is, like, this is kind of going off on a different tangent, but you know, there are different things. Like you can decide when something bad happens, you know, how you're going to take it. It's like, okay, cool, I'm lucky to have these problems. This is what I come like that. I'm lucky to have these problems because now I get to solve this problem. I'm challenged with this problem. You know, and then there's somebody, I don't know, you know what Ellen Roar is? Who? Ellen Roar. No, don't tell her my answer. She's a home service person. She's the president of a company called Zoom Dream. And she says, sometimes you live, sometimes you win, sometimes you learn, you know? Yeah. But it's just a different way of like saying it, when like, God, I can't believe this happened to me, or I can't believe this is going on. It's like, okay, you know, let me, you know, think about it a different way, but yeah. And how to be, how to be happy regardless of what's happening out there. Because there's always going to be bad stuff happening out there for everybody. I, you know, right before this call is what's going on in Israel, I was really like, I, Gary walked in right a little bit before we signed in here and he just told me what's going on the latest. And I was like, okay, take a deep breath. You know, it is just, you know, just a huge tragedy. I'm not sure how it's going to end. But yeah, but anyway, sorry. It's okay. I'm sorry that you're dealing with that. But I'm glad you're able to figure out how to move forward because that is a large piece of bringing happiness to your own life, right? Is understanding how to work with what's out there, but not have it impact who you are inside. So all right, well, that's enough about the happiness. That's enough about happiness. Let me just see what else. Yeah, when I was also talking about here, right? I just, I think I've talked to everything that I can, I thought I was going to be talking about. Well, I have a couple of questions for you. So along with this idea, how do you recommend or suggest or do you have any ideas about how do we bring together the idea of what clean really is? Because some people think clean is one thing, other people think it's something else, right? Some people think it's not clean if it's not disinfected. Some people think it is clean once it's disinfected, even if everything is messy. So like, how do you do that? Are you talking about customers? Are you talking about clean house cleaners? Wouldn't it be awesome if it was only customers, but it's us in our industry. We're not on the same page. We- I know they're, I'm not gonna be able to answer that for you. I was just curious, like your take on this, because I think that a large part of the problem is that we as an industry, we can't, we can't decide on, we can't agree. And you are even in the same situation. You're like, I'm not gonna tell other people what to do. I don't wanna tell other people what to do, but I know what it is, what works for me. Like for example, we don't use microfiber cloth to clean with in our office. We use them to dust, I'm not saying dusting isn't cleaning, but we don't use them to clean bathrooms or kitchen, and we really mostly use them to dry. So if we're cleaning a shower, bathtub, and we need to dry it, that's what we use our microfiber for, because I don't believe that you can get the contaminants out, you know? And people, we had a call, the ISSA residential coffee conversation, we had a call, we were talking about this, and I know Mark Baker feels strongly that the detergents get it out, but I look at the microfiber cloth after they've been used, and I know I wouldn't wash my face with it. You know, it's not clean enough for me. I wanna use something that's sanitary, that we're opening up a package and using something that's brand new, and single use, right? Disposable is a dirty word, but single use. And we do call them cloths, we would never call them rag, ever. We call them shraphos, that's in Spanish, which I don't know what it means, it must be cloth, but that's the towel, maybe? Yeah, anyway. Lots of it, right? Wiper, a lot of people share a lot of different words. And then we also use, for dusting, we use feather dusters, which is like a dirty word for a lot of people in this industry, but if you're using the right type of feathers, you know, ostrich feathers, moo feathers, have the negative positive charge and attracts the dust and. All right, so talk to me about that a little bit, Robin, so we have some questions here that I'm gonna hit you up with too, but talk to me about, so one of the things that you like about ostrich feathers is that they attract the dust and hold on to it, but it sounds like that's exactly what you don't like about microfibers, that it attracts the dust. True, but you can tap the ostrich feathers and it lets it off, right? You can, and you can wash them and dry them and you can see that they're clean. You can tell when an ostrich feather is done collecting, right, you see the dust collecting the dust as well, it feels, it feels different. You go outside, you tap it a few times and you're usually okay. Have you tried measuring? So I know one of the things, I wish Tom was on here right now, because I know that one of the scientific studies that he did, this is quite a few years back, he and his wife Janice did, and yeah, they did with microfiber and they tested it with, oh goodness, who can remind me what the ATP meter, right? So they cleaned with water and the ATP meter. Anybody give me the... I'm not scientific enough for this. I can call Adrian and he can probably do this. I'm not either Robin. If somebody can show it to me, you're not supposed to wash the cloth in hot water, right? You can, up to a certain degree. Up to a certain degree, so I think it's just 165 degrees. 165 degrees is the same temperature as like a chicken, right, a cooked chicken. I don't know, it's like if you're, somebody's more scientific and I just may be all off on this. Yeah. My gut says I'm not. And I'm gonna trust my gut, even though we're not trusting times right now, but I just, if I take the microfiber cloth, I smell it. I know that's not clean, like would you use it to? I'm not sure I can use that though, because I for sure wouldn't take a feather duster that somebody tapped clothes. A lot of feather duster, but I also wouldn't put that on my face. True, true, true, but a single use cleaning cloth that's fresh out of the bag. A box? Yeah. Yeah, I think that a lot of people prefer the single use. I've seen quite a few different, and some people even prefer paper towels, right? So I know somebody that actually dries with, what are they called? Facial tissues. Yeah, it's also the not using the microfiber is not having the staff sit in a car with a big bag full of dirty cloth as they're driving. And it's just, again, it's taking better care of our staff. Plus environmentally, the laundry and the water and the plastic beads going into the waterway. And the time it takes, the labor it takes to do the laundry and having somebody touch it. Yeah, I know they weren't gloves, but still, it's so gross. So I, okay, I see that we have this long thing from Mark and I'm not gonna read the whole thing, but I'll let y'all read it. It is... I've gone through this, and I'm reading. I think, so I'm gonna go back to what we were talking about originally, right? Dropping the word mate and change how people think. I think that just this conversation is part of the problem, right? We can't all get on the same page. And I kind of feel like until we all get on the same page, we're part of the problem. We're perpetuating the issues because, and I'll give you my example. Electricians, it doesn't really matter what anybody thinks about how we manage electricity. It's science. This is how electricity works. And if you're going to be an electrician, you have to follow certain laws, certain standards, certain processes, certain procedures. You can't do it your own way. Even if you think your way is better, right? You just can't, if you're an electrician. We can't, period. And we don't have that in our industry. So you probably know Tom and I are big into this idea of everybody getting on the same page and professionalizing. We built the PHC program, the professional house cleaner program through ARCSI because we believe in this. But how do we get everybody on the same page? Because you said it, exactly the same thing that we run into with everybody else. We feel like we know the truth. Regardless of what the science says, we're all in the same exact boat. You just did it, I do it, who does it? All of us, we do it. How are we gonna get ourselves on the same page? I think we're moving dust. Whether you're removing with microfiber or using it, removing it with feather duster or single use cleaning cloth or disposable microfiber, right? Whatever, yeah. Whatever we're choosing for this. Say it again. Whatever we're choosing to use for this, for example. Yeah. I mean, how can you know, right? There's a lot to do. I mean, what would we be doing using the tester or to make sure the dust level is down? I mean, we've got the, again, I don't know what it's called. You know, the tester thing to see. The ATP meter. We have that in our office and so we train with it. That's awesome. But it's not what you're going to use in everybody's home. You can't possibly touch every surface. Even in a hospital, they're not doing that. Yeah. Yeah, they're not. So that's why it's tricky. And so that's one tiny piece, right? That makes it tricky. Here's another thing that makes it tricky. Not everybody wants their house clean to that level. They don't find the value in that. Some people, like the example we used earlier today, you go over to your friend's house, as long as everything is neat and tidy and put where it belongs, they're happy. They feel like the house is clean and that's all they want to pay for. And then there's the other clients that, no, no, no, I don't care how neat and tidy it is, there better not be any, not one speck of dust anywhere. We're going to take a white cloth on the kitchen floor and it's better to be clean. Oh yeah, a white paper towel test, right? So everybody has this different level of what clean is. That's another twist to the problem. And then we have the professionals, you, me, Mark. I would consider every single one of us here on this call today to be a professional, I would. And we all can't get on the same page about what clean is. We can't get on the same page about how to clean. We can't get on the same page about what's important to clean. If we can't get us on the same page, how are we going to get everybody else on the same page? So what do you think? I don't know. I was hoping you were going to come on here as our guest and answer everything. I trust it. Okay, so I get to make the decisions, right? Yes, yes. We trust you, Robyn. I'm based much of like a libertarian. So yeah, it's an interesting thing and that's what's kind of exciting that there's things you're going to keep changing. And we're acknowledging, I'm trusting it's going to help us, help us more. Mark is going to prove that the microfibers are cleanable. Robyn, I love that you and I are both hanging our hands and our hats on technology and we both struggle with technology. Yeah, but we are, I mean, just think about like mindset's change and we need it. And going back to house cleaning, it's for people to understand that it is important. And listen, even doctors do things differently, right? And there's lots of professionals. We're saying electricians, so that's a trade. But interior designers, they do things differently. Do they do things differently? Say it again, I didn't catch it. Interior designers, I don't know what to say. There's lots of people. Doctors do do things differently. There's lots of different mindsets and lots of different ways of thinking and that's good as long as we're elevating and we're improving. Like our company's purpose is to improve people's lives. And when we say people, it's not just customers, it's our employees too. It's like, I want everyone's lives to be better. I didn't expect to be challenged this way. Oh, I wasn't expecting to challenge you. Just that this is hard. I'm not. But that is, so let's be up for the challenge and figure it out and not just like be happy with like, oh, we're good the way we're doing it, you know, it would work. It's not, we should always be looking to improve. We should always be reaching, you know, higher and better. And actually, that's kind of back to what you said way back in the beginning of this call, Robin. What were things like back when we started, right? In 1993, 1996, we're not doing things the same way that we did back then. It was funny. I was listening to a video and it was 1993 at Burger King. They were interviewing people. Have you seen this video? They were interviewing people. This is 1993 interviewing people about using a credit card at a fast food restaurant. And people are like, that's crazy. That would be nuts. Maybe those like people who are away on vacation are going to use it. But this is so funny, but it's like, this is it. It's like, we can be, you know, mind, things are going to change. They are. And so do you want to get, you know, whatever on the bus or under it? And I would like us, our industry to move forward. It's just better for everybody if we do. I agree 100%. Definitely want us moving forward. I have a tendency. I'm the reason why you're stuck in this horrible conversation with me, Robin, is because, the only reason I'm saying that is, it's because I do tend to make a challenge out of everything because how I naturally process information is what can I do? Like when I hear a problem, my first thought is, well, what can I do? What can we do? How can we move forward? What do we do? It's not enough to just think there's a problem. How does your family feel about that? Well, that's what they depend on me for. How are we going to get it done, Gal? Yeah. To me, it's, I think I make everybody crazy. It's like, there's a problem. Let's try and solve it. Let's figure it out a different way because the way staff is closed up it, there's got to be a better way. If it's the way that everybody's doing it, we're going to have to find a better way to do it. So. And I believe in doing things the way that everybody does it to a point because you have to like you were saying, right? Like with doctors, there are rules. They are certain things that they have to follow these rules, do it this way. But there are other things that you have to bring the human element in as well. The doctor also has to do that. It's also change, right? Change, you want there to change. Somebody who's explaining this to me is a bicycle, right? If you're on a bicycle and you needed to go forward at a certain speed. If you go too fast, you're going to crash. If you go too slowly, you're going to fall. So it's figuring out what the right speed for change is so that people, you know, grab on. You know, there's also the different levels that you know, different people. Some people are always standing online at, you know, the Apple store to get the new release and you know, there's whatever the different stages of people and how they, whatever, accept or like or gravitate towards it. And then there's some laggers, you know, there's some people, some, you know, people who don't want to use text, you know, don't want to text, don't want to use the cell phone, things like that. Yeah. And there's all, I agree, right? There's always the front, the front adopters. And then there are the people that have to be drug along. There are some people that are still using flip phones that are not smart phones. There's always going to be those people too, but that doesn't mean that we don't still move forward, right? We don't let that pull us back. But that goes back to dropping the word made, you know, it's like made is old, made is backwards, made says, nobody says, yes, I feel good, I am a maid, you know. And, yeah, I just think that that mind, that is how to, and what should, what is the right name? I posted on my Facebook that I was on this, on my own Facebook page that I was going to be on this. And a client wrote, I say, housekeepers is that bad? I think the housekeeper is going to be here at such and such time. Is that bad? And I'm like, no, that's not bad. Housekeeper, house cleaner. It's just a gender, you know, cleaning girl, cleaning lady, maid. That part you just don't like. Just grates on your every last nerve. It just doesn't move, it just doesn't move things forward. How about that? Yeah. Yeah. I definitely think that, especially in the last two decades, the word made has fallen out of favor. And it has a different connotation now. And go ahead, Robin. I'm so sorry. And then somebody posted, I'm not sure who it is, but people are Googling maid service, maid service near me. And it is true. You know, I think I talked about this before. I'm with our, with the new brand Chirp, Chirp. We have decided to be willing to not get those, you know, not, not have those, you know, use those key words. Some people looking for that, they're not going to find that. Yeah. But they're going to find other stuff. Right? They're going to find, they're going to find something else that's better. Right. We're, we're, we're trying, we're trying, this is all new, but we're trying to do things differently and market differently and attract the people who are looking for us as opposed to looking just for anybody. Oh, Gary posted the share. The, for anybody that wants to see those pro series wipers, check it out there. And it's also, and somebody says it's like environmentally friendly, use single use. It's like no, no cleaning cloth is, the microfiber isn't biodegradable either. And these are at least the ones that we use that are made in Connecticut as opposed to China. So we, and don't go through a wash and don't have a plastic being to blah, blah, blah, blah. Anyway, all the stuff, all the stuff. Okay. So, I guess we got to wrap it up here. I feel like this is the topic that we can talk about all day, all night. And it's not, this isn't changing. There's a lot about our industry that needs work. And we're all on the same page that we need to lift our entire industry out. That nobody's has an argument about that. So regardless of, if you like microfibers, or you like single use, or if you believe in rags or cloths, or if you believe that clean is tidy and or clean is only disinfecting. Regardless of any of that, we all have to get on the same page of, let's lift ourselves up. Let's lift each other up even when we maybe don't agree. Because there's more that we do agree about than that we don't agree about. We're more alike than we're different. We have to stop focusing on only what's different. For sure. And our competitors too, it's like there's enough. I'm friendly with my competitors in my area. Also, there's enough for all of us. We all do things differently. And even if we're all following the same training, we're all doing things differently, our views are different. And the way we answer the phone is gonna be different. So it's always something. And our belief systems are different, right? Our morals are different. Our values are different. Yeah, we can be different companies. We can all work together and still be different, but still lift each other up. Lift each other up. All right, y'all, we gotta get out of here. We're running really, really late today. Sorry about that. Hope it was a valuable conversation. Keep this conversation going with your buddies. For those of you that don't know exactly what I'm doing, core profit builders, please check us out coreprofitbuilders.com and check out our circles. We do a lot of this work within those circles. And Robin, did you wanna share anything else about chirp chirp? No, we're good. We, I'm excited to be here, Liz. Thank you so much. Thank you, Robin. I do. I look forward to the conversation continuing. Look forward to seeing you in Las Vegas. Thank you. And everybody else who's listening. I hope y'all are there too. It's going to be a valuable event. I agree. See y'all in Vegas. Bye, y'all. Bye, bye, bye, bye.