 Thank you for showing up for this talk. We have with us Keith Osborn and we will, we have a couple slides about bios and stuff. So we'll cover that in just a moment. Right now we have, this is gonna go through the agenda here and this is gonna be more of a conversational piece than more than anything, anything else. I only have a total of I think five slides, six slides, something like that. So we're gonna do introductions. Then we're gonna talk about the, how the Department of Education of Georgia is currently using WordPress. Then we're gonna talk about what is happening in the future. Hopefully, no, knock on wood, right? And then we're gonna talk about security and stability and then we're gonna do Q and A. And most of you, at least this half of the room, I think most of you guys know me, but I'll do my slide anyway. So my name's Aaron, I'm a father of four from the ages of 10 to 20. And three girls, one boy, the last one was a boy. So, we're done. So I own an agency called Clockwork WP and my previous agency was Sideways 8. And some of my employees are here that are gonna ask me tough questions, I'm sure. And I'm obviously an organizer at WorkCamp and I have a LinkedIn profile and I didn't know that that was gonna be there. Way to go, Gina. So thank you. And I'll hand it over to Keith. And that's gotta be like one of the longest LinkedIn profiles I think that I've seen. Right, right. I don't know what the correspondence of those numbers are, but they've got to do something. Thank you, everybody. Let me start by saying I am so glad that WorkCamp is back because I was at the one, what was it, three years ago? Three and a half, yeah. And honestly, that was I think the first time that you and I met from that standpoint. And so lots happen since those days. So everybody, thank you again for letting me be with you today. So I work for the Georgia Department of Education, a little tiny thing that deals with, let's see, 222 districts, 2,548 schools, 300,000 staff members and 1.8 million children. So I've frequently just sit at work and twiddle my thumbs. Think about, you know, is there anything for us to do? No, I just. Quite honestly, I'm thrilled to be able to do the work that I do. So I represent one of seven deputies that work for the Elect and State School Superintendent Richard Woods. My world is all things technology, both for the department, but also beginning to think about what does educational technology look like and how does it support student learning in K-12? And so some of that conversation, I'm sure, we'll unfold it today. Some other things about me. I'm a father of four as well, too. And I've just got to give a little bonus of the fact that it's a proud dad moment for me because my oldest son just has to be sitting right here. And he's a developer for GM. And so he thought he wasn't going to be doing anything this weekend. And I was like, well, you are now. You're coming with your father to WordPress. And so in the event he has to get up and run out, it's because it's not because he's offended by me or anything. It's because he's got a gazillion things that are going on over there. But other than that, I certainly have forever and a day been a huge technology enthusiast of WordPress. Erin and I were talking about that. I don't know how long I've been in it, so I just simply put the words too long. But I do date back to the day. Raj, some of you know Raj around here. Raj and I were talking at lunch. He was like, well, when did you get into this industry? I was like, my first computer had two, five and a quarter floppies, no hard drives. So that's how far it back it goes. And then. Was that a PC, junior? So no. Because mine had two, five and a quarter floppies. It was a K-Pro PC. It had a processor that was a four or eight megahertz. And you had to slow it down to play Tetris. I mean, that's how fast that computer was. That's how old to that point. So I've been in the industry for a good bit. So anyway, so yeah. Fair enough. Thank you. All right, so we're going to hit you up with some questions. And this is just some bulleted list to kind of keep me focused as we ask questions. So the Department of Education of Georgia has a few websites that are WordPress. So my question to you, question one is what do you use WordPress for at Godot? So great question. As you might imagine, we have an incredibly large kind of data presence and technology interest, if you will, that really now we're in the final days of kind of leveraging the cloud and totality. We're moving completely off-prem. A lot of the conversation around that modernization event began during the data pandemic, right? Because as we well know, the society shut down in the absence of about 48 hours. And it was during that time that we socially distanced, again, 1.8 million children and 122,000 teachers. We said, go home and figure out how to teach. And that became probably a real entry point for me to begin thinking about how do we facilitate? How do we support education? And here's an opportunity for technology to rise to that occasion. One of the most critical things amongst teachers is the ability to communicate. And whenever you've suddenly socially distanced those, imagine that if you're a science teacher, you need to talk to other science teachers about what's working, how do I do this thing, how do I work with these children, what are some resources that you're using in the midst of that? And so we really, my team, my leadership team, we sat down and we began to think about this idea of saying, how do we facilitate that in the world of technology? And that was our entry point, because this is when I jokingly say that as the CIO, I never get to touch a keyboard. In fact, I tell everybody I drink coffee and read the newspaper because my developers are like, you're not touching nothing. You're not going in our server farm. You're not doing anything for so many reasons, but they pick on me because I'm old. But I was like, I went home one afternoon and I really sat down and began to kind of prototype on the idea and WordPress kind of came to play. And so I built something. It was called a community. And it was just the idea to really think about could we possibly facilitate something? And again, looking at the ability for us to go from nothing to something very rapidly was really critical and being very agile and responsive. And then the darn thing just went and got successful. And then at that point in time, what was just a couple of people suddenly was 5,000 people and then it was 10,000 people. And then, well, now it's half of 100,000 people and it's growing by 500 people every week as we continue to build this, what we call our community. And it was really born on the idea of saying, could technology facilitate conversations where people are socially distanced? And so to this day, it continues to be incredibly effective. It's just in the midst of that that I had built something that was very monolithic, everything from the database, including the front end GUI was all on one box. And you can imagine that works great whenever you've got 25 people. It doesn't work so well whenever you've got 58,000 people that are hammering that box. And so I happened to be on a call one day, one of the evening WordPress kind of events that were happening. There was a guy by the name of Aaron that was talking about something. And at the end of that, I was like, hey, Aaron, will you hang on to the call for a minute? And we began to kind of talk about that. And that really began to develop a relationship between myself and Aaron and our teams. And really that is something that continues to this day, not only to be a sustainable feature for the department to be able to support the teacher workforce, but it's growing by leaps and bounds because obviously we've seen the agility of this as you will talk about later, some of the scalability and just really the governance model around what we're able to do with this. And it's been a hugely successful case for us, so. So what does community do as far as, what functionality does it give them? So it's a protected environment for, again, the teachers of Georgia to come and say, I wanna have a conversation with another science teacher, or if you're an English teacher, I wanna have a conversation with another English teacher or maybe all of the English teachers. Maybe I wanna have a conversation, maybe I wanna share materials with you. And so that has truly been built on the idea that we can personalize, if you will, around a specific content area or a thought or a theme where we can enable that conversation and if you will, the vulnerability of question-asking to happen within that protected community. And so it is, I say protected because it is, it's membership-driven and even then, somebody has to apply for membership in the midst of that. They have to validate through their email address and whatnot that they are indeed a Georgia teacher or a professor or a college student that's coming into their pathway there. And that's the way that they get into the midst of that. So, yeah. Cool, do you wanna talk about any of the plugins or any of the core membership or gravity? Maybe just a couple of those or certainly the critical piece that you just heard me talk about was really ensuring that we protected that community. We wanted it for teachers and for other teachers to be a part of that and really to be able to converse about what was very important to them. And so this is whenever the finesse of really looking at WordPress really began to kind of come into play and we began to think about some of those plugins and how do we use those specifically? Obviously, the membership-driven aspect of that was critical and then really the other pieces of that were beginning to kind of glean some information not just specifically from our users but also the ability for me to take very large-scale datasets and begin to both, first off, obfuscate those and then begin to look at trend analyses about what's happening across the state who's using this, what's the frequency of their use, when are they logging in, whatnot. And so the plugins and the choices for those were really driven by some of those needs as we began to kind of see the scale up of this application. So, yeah. So, I don't really... Probably most everybody in here has some degree of technicality. So if we wanna get into some technical components of that, please, by all means, ask what I don't know, I'll make up, or I'll say, hey, Aaron, tell the truth about those in that particular space. And if I don't know, I'll ask Marty, my developer on. Yeah, there you go. I'll get Marty over there. Yeah, so they have... So, Godot has community, it also has a professional learning site. Do you want to talk about professional learning? Yes. Okay. So, to that point, when we saw such great success with the community, one of the big components of really what's happening in the world of education right now is that, certainly, if you think about, I oftentimes tell people that prior to the pandemic, technology and education was still very much a G-Wiz bang thing. A teacher could take it or leave it. During that transformational time of the pandemic, technology switched from what was a G-Wiz bang thing to being mission critical. As we're falling to say in 2019, a teacher reached for a textbook. Today she reaches for technology. And so we began to think about, all right, if that's the case, then technology needs to be very seamless. It's got to be transparent and it cannot get in the way of learning. And the problem with technology in the past has been oftentimes that third bullet hasn't been the case. Oftentimes it gets in the way. Teachers have to roster these applications. They have to figure out how to use this application. It doesn't necessarily nestle in with what they're doing. And so we've really have been very dogmatic about the design and really chasing down those types of things that ultimately reduce the amount of time that is required of a teacher to be able to use that technology to some benefit. And one of the things that we've seen specifically is how do we take otherwise very distinct applications, pieces that are here and pieces that are there and pieces that are over there and how do we bring those together and co-join them in such a way that not only conversationally are they organized for teachers, but they're also within, say, they're a mouse click. And you know, so I'm the guy that sets the trends inside of the department and so specifically my dev team, I tell them you get three mouse clicks and you get 10 seconds. And if you can't deliver the information in 10 seconds in three mouse clicks, go back to the drawing board because imagine yourself being a fifth grade math teacher right after lunch when 30 kids have been out on the playground and they're hot and sweaty and you have 10 seconds of silence, that's a death sentence for a teacher. So like you better get that information into your hands very rapidly. And so we begin to really think about, again, what are we doing that's successful? Community is a great success point. What else do teachers need? They need things like professional learning, some other things like newsletters and whatnot. And so those are literally beginning to be part of, again, a single storefront, if you will, but an opportunity for our teachers and others to be able to kind of find the materials that they need to consume almost immediately within getting initially to that site. The professional learning side was one of those first hangoffs of the things that we were doing with the community. And this is where some conversation said, all right, well, again, we can't build one giant monolithic thing and just continue that on top of that. And so we really began to look at the dexterity of the environment and say, how do we better organize this? And so this was probably the first instance of a headless version of the community, right? Yeah, basically community is set up where it's password protected. No one can log in if you don't have a username and password, it just, you go there, it pops up username and password. But we had events, like the event submission and approval system, we needed to expose that piece of the information within WordPress. And so with the REST API, the WordPress REST API, we're able to query, pull the information out, and we have basically a headless instance of that. So that information can be exposed. And we also, I totally forgot, we're working on getting a mobile app up and running too, based off of the data that's in community. So it's growing, and once we have that mobile app released, you know, I'm sure we're gonna have to add memory and CPU and all that stuff, make sure it scales properly. So I think that probably was the first big expansion that we did once community came to us where we were maintaining it. And then the third thing was the student chef, if you wanna talk about student chef. And so obviously the popularity of that really began to kind of grow throughout the agency. And certainly, as you can imagine, there's 1,500 people that work within the kind of concentric circle of what's the department of that. And certainly as we begin to really kind of evangelize and market on the success of that, others within the agency began to say, well, we have needs. And really from that standpoint, how can technology services help us out? And so one of those big ones was our nutrition department and specifically they run a contest each year that really involves students and whatnot. And so the ask was, hey, can you help us? Can you support us? And certainly realizing what the community project was doing, our nutritionist really came in and said, obviously, is this something that you guys can help us with? And we certainly said, yeah, it's, well, it's our job. So we better, but from that standpoint, can we reuse something that we've seen to be hugely successful? And so from that was born our student chef. That's also driven by WordPress there as well too. So yeah, two big ones and you'll hear some more that really we're doing a lot of strategic alignment around this conversation. So here's continue to build off of that. Yeah, they keep, they keep hitting us up with more and more projects, which is good. So on the horizon, we've got, we're just making sure I'm not running out of time here. So all right, so what's going on with the Godot main site? So department of education now at state level, obviously we run a pretty large scale website, because tons of pieces of information are necessary for parents and folks that are moving in, whatever from that standpoint, who need to know more about the department of education, what's happening across the state. One of the things that next came on the agenda as we were beginning to kind of modernize is looking at our overall site and seeing first and foremost that it's woefully out of date, it was actually built on a SharePoint with an old template called buying tuning. Yeah, I see the cringe up in your, don't worry. Tums will be given out for those that need them, okay? So I'm with ya, okay? But from that standpoint, at one point, superintendent came and he was like, it's time. And I was like, well, gracious superintendent, I only have a couple of other million things going on. We maintain 135 other applications that are in house. And so those folks are busy, I'm drinking coffee. But in the midst of that, superintendent says, you're gonna be updating the website. And so as we began to kind of look at that, this internal conversation began to happen because obviously we're in the business of people and we're in the business of serving information out to those and so really thinking about not just the idea of what a website did, but in this modern age of saying, what does a website do? What should it do? And on top of that, how can we begin to really think about efficiencies and kind of modifying the culture within an apartment that was really kind of paper driven prior to the pandemic to one that really is kind of digital first. And so this is where conversations began to have around, you know, unfortunately I was in a meeting one day where I threw out the term CMS and everybody looked at me and they were like, I have no idea what that is. And you're like, well, okay, content management system. And they're like, you better throw me more. And so we really began to get into kind of a cultural exchange of saying in this day, as we began to think about information, storing it is not the period at the end of the sentence. Storing it is really the start of the sentence and really doing a good job about the way that we do that is going to play into the effectiveness of really being able to kind of provide that information to stakeholders and organize palatable fashion when they need it and again in a very agile fashion. And so again, you know, the communication aspect and that conversation beginning to really grow and say, well, we've had some successes, you know, these things that we've been doing and thus began to think about, you know, what do we do with our site as a whole? They didn't like me because, you know, the first thing I said was that we're not going to upgrade the previous site. We're not. For all the reasons technically that you were shaking your head but on top of that, there were instances where pieces of information were probably more than a decade old, probably not real relevant for today. And so, you know, again, I get to be the guy that says, you know, that site's going into archived state which really liberated the opportunity for us to begin thinking about what does the 21st century look like and specifically what should a website begin to look like and then was born the idea of saying, we've had some success with really approaching this from a CMS stack and really kind of building around that but also beginning to think about this collaborative nature of an agency and then the conversation about WordPress began to enter in and it wasn't even my idea which meant that something I said eventually rattled off onto somebody had stuck because they brought that up and I was like, well, you've had a very good idea, let's explore that. And that really began to kind of build upon the conversation where we brought in obviously teams to say kind of help us, let's do a little background work and let's just do some kind of forensic discovery about what's been there, all the various hands that have touched that and really began to kind of build on a long-term project. Can I say long-term, but actually we're gonna bring that thing to fashion pre-rapidly. By January 1st, right? By January 1st, in a world where it's not atypical for it takes two years for a project to start, this agility and responsiveness that we see, certainly something new kind of in the public sector if you will. And again, whenever you've got proven technologies that you can begin to kind of stack off of and build off of, both the cultural piece but also the application layer of that really kind of shows the pragmatic value of that. And so as with that, that we really looked at this whole idea of saying we're gonna aggressively look at our overall site and from the very front to the metrics in the background of the way that we work across the agency, we're gonna build a website that's actually a utility for us and not just a dissemination of information from that standpoint. So that will pretty soon, so you guys obviously those are, all the URLs are definitely the ones that we're using from that standpoint. Again, you can see the front end of the community is like Aaron was saying a second ago, obviously geto.org is still up, but there will be a very clan best I moment one night where you might look at it five o'clock in the afternoon wherever you see it the next morning at eight o'clock or whatever, if you happen to do that on like a Saturday morning, you might see a new site and you'll know that that is really built on a CMS stack or specifically WordPress in the background is actually, again, not monolithic but I just simply do the size and all the diversity of information pathways that come into that, it will be built upon that whole idea. So, yeah, tons of that and we were, can't remember the session that we were in earlier, but really beginning to kind of think about you know, how do we serve information very rapidly? We really began to kind of conceptualize further on this idea of the whole idea of, you know, what is our CMS if we write a headless and then we put something like an XJS or something on the front end of that to really be able to kind of take advantage of some of the more modernistic components in the ways that we do those types of things and so that's really the expectation of the pathway that we're headed. And if you have technical, further technical questions about that, unless it's something like orthogonal frequency division multiplexing, ask him because that's his pathway. Yeah, what we're gonna do with that is we're gonna have a headless WordPress instance for that mainly because I kind of see this site as it needs the last 10 years, you know, that the information needs to be there for a very long time and by just using WordPress as a headless CMS, we're gonna build a custom front end to pull that data out and then in five years when that's old technology and something better has come in, we, in theory, don't hold me to this. Don't worry. But, you know, in theory in five years we'll be able to, you know, swap that out and still have the same back end and not have to redo all of the content. So that's the my goal with that. So in theory in 10 years, you know, it's the content should still be good enough and then, I mean, I'm sure it'll have to be maintained and all of that. And another thing that we're gonna do for that is we're gonna have a content submission and approval system for basically everything. Post pages, media, all of that. That Gina told me today that she can't find a plug-in that does it well. So we're gonna write a plug-in to do that and make it, because we need to be very, we have to have full control over what's being submitted, how it's approved and all that stuff. So we're gonna do something custom for that and then our, then the other site that we're gonna do that we kicked off last week, maybe two weeks ago is the teacher retention site. Do you wanna talk about the three R's? Yeah, I'm gonna go back to one and just mention one other thing too that really is important to us and it's a term that I've told Erin many times that I've just without shame of stolen from him. That you can imagine whenever you deal in a very large scale kind of public facing instance. Sometimes a simple word or a simple conversation can actually cause just almost immediate storm to happen. And I remember a very early conversation that Erin and I had many, many years ago where we talked about something called the Oprah moment. Everybody know what I'm talking about? An Oprah moment, Oprah gets on TV and she holds up a book and she says, this was a great book and then the next day the whole world sells out because Oprah said it, okay? So there are instances where we have that as well too and so one of the additional things that we've had is really to consider how do you build for the Oprah moment? And this is really where, somebody was saying earlier, this is where planning really ensures performance from that standpoint. So you can imagine the conversations that have happened where it's not, there's, I don't know, there's probably between five and 10,000 people on the site right now. I don't know why people need to go to the education site on a Saturday afternoon at 2.20 when the doctor went in but that's near here or there, whatever their business is, so be it. But you can imagine there have been events, like the governor announcing that we're gonna close because of a pandemic and suddenly it goes from 10,000 to literally swelling over 250 to 300,000 users that are simultaneously trying to hit the site. And it's never good whenever they're met with a 404 page or something from that standpoint. So we have to try and figure out how do we govern against that and so really, again, a lot of what we've been talking about, that's always in the back of our minds. If I go back to the very monolithic application of community that I told you about, whenever you build, whenever you've got MySQL and you've got a CMS stacked on top of that you've got a GUI imagine on that and then suddenly 5,000 bus drivers hit that simultaneously. You know what they get? Connection timed out. And so that didn't bode well whenever those folks were like, well, you told us this was the site that we had to come to. And so we have to be very liberal in thinking about the ways that we're gonna be able to kind of accommodate that. So that was playing into in the headless WPPs came into play as a result of that as well as something that would enable us kind of that dexterity, if you will. So the next piece is just one more, really in kind of the grand step of what we're doing. I probably don't need to say it, but I wanna say it and that is that you probably tell from this, I'm a huge fan, most of WordPress, I see value in that. I love the concept of the open source community. I always have, remember one of the individual books that you saw up there about me is that I'm a Linux, do we have been? I'm proud to say my entire home environment runs off of Linux and just because that's the only way I get to tinker with these types of things, but true to that point, being able to kind of show that these types of tools that some may want to dismiss, being able to kind of show that they truly do have utility not just in the consumer world, but really if you think about it in the huge enterprise world, we can actually see the massive utility of these tools to be able to not just do the job, do the job very, very well and that's critically important and that's what we should be about in the aspects of education. And so again, as we've continued on with new things that we're thinking about and building, one of the big things that the whole world is dealing with right now is the whole idea of employment attrition, right? Chris Clark, who is the president of the Chamber of Commerce for the Georgia, was in a presentation with him about two weeks ago and he really talked about that for every three employment opportunities. There's one person applying for that job right now. And education hasn't been spared of that for all the reasons of the pandemic and everything that's happening. And so you can imagine there's a huge conversation about saying, first off, how do we continue to attract people into this profession? Second piece is how do we keep them? And then the third piece is how do we continue to grow them? Because obviously there's every aspect of society and everything that's happening with that is under a constant state of change. And now beginning to again think about the specifics of the teacher and the network and the whole entire genre of the employment aspect of that really became a huge project for us. And so one of those pieces is really the awareness, right? If you don't know about it, it's not even something that you're gonna get involved in. And so really beginning to think about first off, how do we tell teachers about job openings that are out there? There's tons of teachers that are certified. They're not working or they're working in some other avenue of that. And certainly we wanna make them aware of the instances where we have that. And it's unfortunate, but certainly some of our metro area schools may still continue even this far into the school year to maybe have a hundred employment openings even at this moment in time. I hope it's not, I hope I'm overstating that, but I don't know. I haven't looked at the numbers recently, but we began to kind of conceptualize on this idea of saying, what if we put in place something that we would call a teacher retention site? Well, we could put information that's palatable to them. It's useful for them, but it would also show them what we are doing from the agency's perspective to support them as the professionals that they are, but give them an opportunity to look for whatever that we have there, be it from teacher recognition all the way through to career advancement through professional learning opportunities where, again, so I'm a teacher. I have what's called a T-level, an S-level, and an L-level certificate. And that's because I started as a teacher. I went into the service field as a network engineer, and then ultimately became in the leadership role. And so those were the career opportunities that befell my path as I got to the point where I'm at today. Same thing happens in the midst of this. As we see teachers go into the profession, by the time they get to the 10 or 15-year profession, oftentimes they're thinking, maybe I want to do something else. Well, we want to do what we can to keep them in that field because they have a lot of historical and longitudinal knowledge. And so, again, that's what this site is going to do is really be something specifically built for them with a conceptualized idea of saying what information is critical for you, and that's what we're going to kind of put inside of the midst of that. And so that one's just, again, that one's still in the kind of design phase, but again, it's going to kind of roll out in the whole regiment of time associated with the update of the website there, so, yeah. Very cool, thank you. I don't remember my next slide. So, all right, here we go. So, security and safety. Before... Questions? Yeah, you want to... Actually, we, let's see, we're 35 minutes in. Why don't we just go ahead and go into Q&A and see if anybody has anything, that'd be fine. I can't, I was told I need to repeat the question, but I don't know if I can say the word that Micah just said, so, what was the word? Do you want to know how you're... Multiplexing? Or diagonal frequency, that's 16 points on the sine wave in case you know that. Yeah, I'm not smart enough to know that. You're just saying, I got nothing, I got nothing. I got nothing. Yeah, I got nothing. So, yeah, it doesn't play in there, but you know, so I use that a good bit at the agency because sometimes people like, you know, you tech people out there in technology services, you're weird, you know, like we are, because this is our conversational topic when we sit around at lunchtime, we're like, hey, anybody done anything interesting with orthogonal frequency division, multiplexing, and everybody's like, just shut up. I don't want to talk to you anymore. It's a great conversation killer whenever we need it from that standpoint, so, yeah, yeah. But, you know, obviously, you know, from the CMS side, there's lots of complexities of that. One of the things, you know, just a testament to all of you and the work that you do, you know, sometimes people don't necessarily understand that the industry that you're in and the skills that you bring to play, that is, it's definitely one of my jobs to make sure that people recognize that you didn't wake up this morning and sit down in front of a bowl of cereal and say, hey, I'm going to do WordPress today. No, it took a lot of... So some people do that. I was going to say, there's probably at least... I've done it before, but, you know... A lot of sweat equity went into that. And, you know, there really is, again, the last session that I was in where the whole planning conversation that leads up to really kind of a performance piece and the ability to really be, you know, kind of tangential to what's happening within the organization and strategic priorities, takes a lot of planning. But in order for that planning to happen, you bring a huge skill set. And so it's really pivotal for us, really, right now in the world to say, you know, technology, you know, the mission criticality really depended upon those people. Make sure that whenever you're planning, they're sitting at the table with you. You know, so, yeah. I didn't answer your question. I didn't either. I didn't either, but it's okay. I'm going to move on. Yeah. Karina. So when you take a system that has this age in it and an organization is large as a department of education, how have you handled onboarding the users and monitoring their satisfaction with the changes that have been made? You know, because it's a lot of people are very resistant to this kind of a change. They absolutely are. Can you rephrase? So the question was, whenever you're working with an organization this large, obviously that's kind of changing. And I'm going to kind of paraphrase you. So you correct me if I'm wrong. But how do you change the culture? Because people, once they get comfortable with using something and comfortable seeing that and comfortable with the information, and then your mavericks come in and say, we're going to change everything overnight. How do you deal with that? And the answer to that is that long before anybody knew that there was going to be a change of gado.org, you started at the strategic level of steering within the organization, who are obviously the deputies of all the other divisions. And you say to them, we're going to be doing this work. And here's the reason why. And then specifically within my leadership team, I have one lady, her name is Joyce Bearden. And she is the director for knowledge and resource management. Her job is to do nothing more than really kind of prepare people for a cultural change. And then she helps them understand and implement that. And that happens honestly, probably a year in advance before anybody really began to kind of know because to that point you're saying, nobody likes change, nobody likes change. Once we get comfortable with something, even if it's incorrect, we're like, I don't want to change it. And so really to kind of come in and really kind of change a culture and say, I want you to be comfortable with change. I don't want you to be comfortable with not change. I want you to be comfortable with that. There really has to be two things. Obviously in advance of that, we have to market and evangelize the changes that are coming. And then the second thing is, we have to slip in up underneath them a very secure safety net that says, as we change, there's going to be somebody that's going to travel right beside you. There's going to be SMEs that are going to help you understand this and the new processes. And then obviously, we have project managers that are going to be amidst of this and the whole realm of a small army really begins to kind of circle the wagons around the totality of the teams that just kind of help them get comfortable with the fact that new things are coming. Critically point, an excellent question because oftentimes that's missed. We were talking a few days ago about what happens in the enterprise and the world of development. And if you think about it, a lot of people think that you as developers that you're just really like an army of one. And my organization is not. There's going to be a whole army of people. There's going to be a PMP. There's going to be a BA. There's going to be a technical rider. There's going to be QA. There's somebody that's monitoring you out. There's going to be an infrastructure person that are part of your team. And so all those pieces, nobody sees that they happen but they're there. They have to be critically because a developer can't do all those types of things and really us be able to deliver an MVP on an agile timeframe. And so getting those pieces and getting people comfortable with the idea of we got it. You just continue to work and we're going to help you find ways to kind of triage and transition your job role. So did that answer? Yeah, that's it. I mean, to me, to simplify it, you just have to get buy-in from the people that are at the top and eventually trickles down. So. See the difference, see the answer buy-in was the perfect thing. This is what happens whenever you get a politician in front of you. We're going to take 45 minutes to say the word buy-in. Okay, buy-in is the answer. I just have a very low vocabulary so I couldn't use big words. That's why Micah's question really tripped me up there. Other questions? I just learned that we're actually at San Diego and I know that they're mentioning that, I think this is a really important one. We have numbers in this site and in our party's site. So right now, when everybody talks to me, they're just saying that we need to transition to everybody right now in the virtual conversation. So I didn't know if we could just switch on any buy-in. Is this site currently a WordPress site? And I'll rephrase the question just so the mic picks it up. But is it a WordPress site currently? So the question was, right now they have a WordPress site where each person has, I guess there's one login for everyone and they share that. I mean, I know at Godot that would never fly. Do you wanna? Well, so we're gonna tag team this because there's two pieces of this. There's an administrative answer and there's a technical answer. Okay, I'm gonna take on the administrative and then you go into the technical saying, and we're gonna wonder out loud right now, are you the administrator of your site? Okay, that's good. We can work with that. We already got growing ground. So the first thing is, is that as you can imagine, anytime that you're on the public internet, there's gazillions of bad guys out there that are just really trying to hammer that site and see if they can just take control of it. Not because, and you may think in your mind, there's really nothing that's worthy of industrial espionage or anything like that. It has nothing to do with that. It's just really the street cred of being able to say I took down a site. And so from that standpoint, you can imagine that really the entry point is who's coming to that site. And so if you can't find ways to create that uniqueness of them, either be through IP management or who is the individual and those types of things, that's your first problem. Because the minute that that happens, you don't necessarily have any forensic data that will enable you to kind of backtrack and see where those problems are at. And so again, going back to something we've said twice here, this is where planning is gonna help with that performance piece where you really need to sit down. And this is what we would call the governance layer where we begin to think about not just what the site's doing, but really how do we make it palatable to the individual users? And that's another piece of this. It's really the experience that people are coming to that site for, they're coming to either provide information or share information or maybe glean information from that. And so if we don't begin to kind of look at that dynamic nature of what Web 3.0 is right now, we may miss that opportunity from that. And so there's a security piece that I think about, but secondarily to that, is that I'm trying to make sure that we're thinking about the individual user and try and find ways to kind of customize that experience. So if you're using a single user and a single password, you can see where if Aaron and I are logged in and I love green, well, he does too, but anyway, that's not a good example. But from that standpoint, I'm like, I'm gonna change my background to green. And then he logs in and he's like, I hate green, he changes it to blue. And then I log back in and I'm like, who in the world did that? I'm gonna change it back to green. This is where we wanna customize that, but the more important piece really right now is I know without even knowing what your site is, I know there's somebody out there that's just trying to hammer it right now. And so really that critical piece of making sure that you've put up a good gate in front of that is really the most important aspect of that. And so how would we control that? We would control that with technical and that would be when... Yeah, so to me, one of the things you've probably sent that username and password to a slew of people. How many people have that username and password? Yeah, 200 to 100, sorry. 300? Okay. Yeah, that's good. So all it takes is one person's email to get hacked and then that it's an admin user, I'm assuming, where if you have 300 users, chances are not every single one of them need admin rights. They might need editor role or, I can't think of the roles, right? I'll just stick with editor. You might just need editor right now. So I would make sure that the 300 people only have the access that they need. And that way you can also, there's plugins like Stream that keeps track of each user and what they're doing. That can come in handy too. So if the site is, the content is deleted or something, you'll have a log of that. If you're all logging in as admin and you have Stream installed, you're still gonna have that, you're still not gonna know who did it, who broke the site. But go ahead, you... Actually, the members only have like an informational access to the content. Okay, that's not, I mean. I don't know, I get the site all of the time. Gotcha. Okay, that doesn't scare me quite as badly. Okay, I was like super nervous for a second there. If it's just a password for a page, is that, or a section? Okay, okay, that's not nearly, I thought you were talking like 300 people who have access to that administration. Okay, then I'm not, I can sleep better. So thank you. That's like second round of tones is about to pass it out right now, so. Yeah, I was nervous. So the next question, or is there, yes? I'm on the same topic, forms spam. I get dozens of forms spam every week. We capture the whole thing I do with this spam. So there's, what form plug-in are you using? I'm not familiar with that, but so the question was form spam. You're getting a lot of that. There's a couple different ways to block that. I use, in your plug-in, I'm just not familiar with the plug-in you're talking about, but I use gravity forms and I use the recapture plug-in version three because version three is better than version two. Version three basically runs in the background. It doesn't do the, are you a human check box? It runs a JavaScript script in the background. But one of the things that I think everybody should be using if your infrastructure allows Godot's different. But I have most of my clients using Cloudflare. In Cloudflare is for DNS, is completely free. Now they try to tell you to use the $20 plan. I have about 185 sites that are on Cloudflare, that are on the free plan. And it has a really cool tool that basically you just, you turn it on. It's literally a check box. Once you've migrated your DNS over, you turn it on and it does a bot blocking tool and that will wipe out a lot of your spam because a lot of the spam is coming from, I shouldn't say well-known IP addresses, but Cloudflare because they have so many millions of websites on Cloudflare, they can look and say we're getting from these IP addresses we're getting tons of spam so they can start blocking those IP addresses. So to me, Cloudflare is cost you nothing to use it. So to me, why not? And that normally once I have the recapture on there and Cloudflare, it's not a problem for most of my clients. An important piece to consider is that, so he's talking about a solution that's upstream of that, obviously we know that there are plug-ins available in those types of things, but you see that's kind of, as they say, a horse of another color. So let me ask this question. So are the users that are coming to your site, are they kind of organically driven there or do you have like a specific use base? Is there a frequent domain of email that oftentimes comes to you or is it just really just kind of like anywhere, everywhere? The two of them are very good. Yeah. So and- Right up close from far and- Yeah, and it's tough, obviously. The minute that we put a note on the public worldwide web without you doing something akin to like some content, some continent blocking, which obviously there's features. Somebody may say, hey, we don't want the entire country of Turkey to see our website. So we can put features in place that do IP blocking and IP block ranges from there. If you're able to kind of look and do some analysis that that's specifically where your spam levels are coming from. But again, the other piece is to look at your firewall in front of that. See if it's got some advanced functionality, some pieces that let me look for tests for the presence of an SPF record or those things that we would expect to see a mature professional email domain be able to kind of present in advance to say we're legitimate. Oftentimes, again, some tools in front of that. Because the big piece here is that if you've got a smaller site, you can probably put those, the pressure on your WordPress to be able to do those. But if it's something that's growing, here's an opportunity for us to begin to think about what else exists within your network that really can kind of take that load away. And if we can deal with that before every one gets to your site from there. So, yeah. Like a. Yeah, I was assuming you were talking to the absolute. They've shown them now that AI is about 100%. Yeah, yeah. Of the recaptures? Sure. So I can only imagine, yeah, the upstream solution. I think I'm just cutting from David Walsh that said, put a blank form input on your forms until he's able to do not put anything in the top. Right. And then open it. Yeah. I just worry about the form that's pretty much taken. And the other is, are you meeting people or are they going to start with bots? I think that kind of piggybacks off of what Micah said. I think that with AI and stuff like that is going to be, it's almost useless to, it's getting where bots can process that. Literally, I was just going to say, from that standpoint, there's this conversation about what's the difference between AI and machine learning? Really nothing. And if you think what's machine learning, it's just really the opportunity for a computer to figure out all the steps necessary to complete a task that otherwise a human would do. The short of it is that you build a better mouse trap, they're going to build a better mouse. And so this is, we're not going to get to that point anytime soon. Obviously as Micah said, things like AI and stuff like that are going to definitely test us. Because obviously we're still in the very, the split neck areas I like to call in regards to some of those tools, but they're growing at such rates and leaps and bounds, that they're kind of leapfrogging the ability for some of our most advanced tools to be able to kind of protect our networks and stuff like that. It's definitely the piece that keeps us up at night. Yeah, so. Cool, we got one more. Time for one more. Yeah, I think using Atlas helps with this, but for the stuff that aren't Atlas that we should say, how do you guys vet plugins that you're going to use on there? Or as a plugin author, how can I tell y'all that plugins aren't right? These are likely to use their plugins. So the question was for, as a plugin developer, how do someone like me that vets plugins, how do I make it look like it's, or make it appear to be a good plugin that I would want to use. That to me just boils down to, I always look at the ratings on when I go to a plugin, I look at the ratings, I make sure that it's getting a certain amount of stars. I understand sometimes the star rating system. I mean, it's like Amazon, right? You know, most of the things on Amazon are bots. I mean, like if you're getting four stars, it's because they're paying people to buy the product and stuff like that. You don't have quite that so much in the WordPress community. But I mean, if we're getting zero one star, I'm gonna be like, no. The amount of downloads is important. And really the thing that's different for like my agency, I've got developers like Marty and Chris and other people that I'll say, hey Marty, go look at this plugin and make sure that they know what they're doing. Because no offense to the ecosystem, there's a lot of stuff in there that's just not built the right way. And so, so I just, I get a developer on it. And to be honest, I would tell like, if you don't know if a plugin's any good, work camps are great. Get a developer, be like, hey, can you spend 30 minutes and just let me know if this plugin's any good? That's the way I vet things. So, and we are out of time as of now. So, thank you. Thank you all, great question.