 Well, he's getting miked up so hands up those who've got a bank account Wow, that's like 80% So if you don't have a bank account then you might want to go and get a coffee or something Hands up those who love their bank That's impressive That is impressive or you're lying or you work for these guys So, you know your your breads buttered All right, so I just a real quick introduction. I'm Ben Henshaw. I Am the director for financial services in Asia Pacific and I have the the great pleasure of traveling up and down the Asia Pacific Coast as I call it Up to career and out to China and Japan and down to Australia and even Occasionally I get to that great white cloud country called New Zealand and then out to India and all in between So I see a huge variety of what's going on in financial services and the dynamicism that's going on And one of the great things we've got with this panel over the next 25 30 minutes is we have representation from New Zealand We have representation. Yep, let's have a hand for New Zealand I Think I think he has a record for the longest travel distance to get to a Boston. We have representation from Canada From Finland from New York and actually Argentina So so I think I think we win the diversity ward All right, so I'm just going to ask some questions And we're going to hear what these gentlemen have to say what's going on their world So if you gentlemen could just very briefly in about a minute or so just explain How long you've been using redhead open shift? What's roughly in your stack What version if you know and and start off by saying your company and what you do there, that'd be great. Okay? Hi, my name is Glen Rhodes New Zealand accent probably tell I work for ANZ Bank as the platform manager for container services Stack I'm assuming technical stack run on x86 platform using VMware and current version is 3.11 and we've recently migrated to that and Pretty seamless. We run a blue-green Upgrade and it's proved to be quite good. We're busy picking out all the new Prometheus set product sets and eagerly waiting in the 4.x version as we all are. Yeah, great My name is Walid. I work for CIBC, which is the Candidate Imperial Bank of Commerce It's one of the big five banks in in Canada I'm the senior director for the data center services So my team manages all the data center services We have been using open shifts for roughly two years. We're on versions 3.7 We're obviously in the process of upgrading as well And we're looking to move some of our crown jewel applications onto open shift today It's on the private cloud. We're actually implementing supposed to go live in Azure as well in the next month or so Okay, ero arvonen from suomen asiakastieto. We are a credit information company in the Nordics Can you can you just say that a bit slow so people can understand the name of the company? Oh, thanks Suomen asiakastieto. Okay everyone repeat after me Yeah, our CEO tends to make this joke that any foreigner will go to extreme lengths not to Pronounce our name. So you're all excused for not trying So we've been we've had we've had our private Open-Shift cluster for about a year now. We are running version 3.10 It's running on VM where we mostly develop on Java on EAP Let's see what else so I'm a solution architect. I split my work about 50-50 between designing and developing our services and doing other Open-Shift related process development I'm Raj Chana from Royal Bank of Canada. I Am part of the technology infrastructure team there where I run the technology strategy and research function so we've been using Open-Shift for about two and a half three years now and We are currently on 3.9 and we are in the process of going to 311 So what's in the stack? I would say You know apart from the core Open-Shift Infrastructure itself the master nodes the infrastructure nodes and the app nodes I think some critical components are the CI CD platform that goes with it the different repositories which are gonna whether it is you know code repository or container repositories we do have vulnerability scanning Engines both for code and containers And then you know, I think all the logging and monitoring function that goes with it and you know the external load balancers etc Yeah, thank you Hi, I'm Daniel Sanchez from Banco Potecario We have started using Open-Shift like More than one year ago, but we strongly are working on that from September October of past year We are currently in a project of migrating all the API all the all services that we used to have to APIs It's a it's a very aggressive project that we are now in Keras We started that for two reasons why because the bank is Investing strongly in all the digital transformation But also because we had a need of going on that reaction because we were in an obsolete platform before So now that the project is going on we already have many things in production and we are just Start seeing all the benefits that they have But still we need to get more metrics and start knowing the product on every time that you implement anything You know how that works and you go at just and then go again At just is something that is like a cycle you are going on. Yeah, thank you So we can see here Ladies and gentlemen that there's quite a diverse maturity and adoption of Open-Shift with their different versions and their different infrastructure stacks So I think this is quite a quite a good panel particularly given the different geographies that they're dealing with Can you just tell me What was the impetus for your organization to start looking at containers Kubernetes Open-Shift and maybe just Briefly set the business context of what it was that started that journey for you I guess the business context is firmly in our digital space Bankings are quite competitive markets getting more competitive with open-source banking our traditional way of Delivering services could take weeks or months and that wasn't good enough so they challenged Technology to look at a solution. So from a technical perspective It was pretty easy Everyone knows about containers and Urban Eddies so we set off on a journey to Not only pop that but a bunch of other services that we needed a bit bucket Artifactory and so on like that Jenkins So we not only set a journey underway with Open-Shift, but also but bucket Jenkins and Artifactory to support it and that was really exciting. So we took a bunch of our rock stars We put them in a room and we got started and It's been about a year and a half and we've been live in production for over eight months now a large port in our digital services Running on that we're starting to develop onto the platform. So It's been interesting. It's been hectic Massive learning curve for everyone involved, but we have fully automated CID CI CD patterns Integrated with service now. We have an inbuilt app that Automates all the testing and approvals for that. So it's pretty much a zero-touch solution and You know that that's big tick in the box to all the techs who are involved in and so on because It's really meant that we've been able to take what was probably a cadence of two to three months down to three or four minutes And they could drop every day if they wanted that they don't Glenn can I just quickly ask and what's the reaction from the business been like? I mean, have they seen that improvement or that that agility and that time to value? Oh, definitely So I mean if you think the business come up with an idea or a concept for a feature and It's in production the following week versus Three or four months. So definite business value smells all around smells all around. Yeah, right. You're the hero I'm not Very modest. Yeah. Thank you Yeah, so I think actually for us is kind of interesting because it wasn't really driven by the application team or the infrastructure team is you know, it actually was a move from the architecture team saying and we want to Indistralize if you like microservices create the API marketplace and open, you know, this API is for you know Used by everybody. So it was really, you know a push into creating that open Bank if you like and there's a session actually that Our architecture team are going to present on Wednesday if you're interested you can go and listen to the team talking about this whole Transformation that is really how it started. This is you know, who pushed us into the container space from an infrastructure Deploying containers, you know using open shift to support the teams. We actually have roughly 40 or you know or plus You know microservices running there, but you know to to your point Ben around, you know What the reaction was in fact actually what happened is that we the other 80 teams or the application development team got quite excited about the potential So as we were building this API marketplace and building infrastructure to support it You know the demand was just you know was really beyond what we expected We actually have a bunch of apps that even went to life today in our private cloud You know if you're into structured notes, you can go notes to CIBC.com You know this is a plug if you you know if you want to do structured notes in capital market But you know it was it was really interesting that I think you know the the teams the 80 teams started seeing the potential, you know in terms obviously of the time to market in terms of you know, how the You know the architecture really differs from the legacy that we have And you know, we're seeing a lot of excitement, you know, right in that space. Thank you Well for us our business is very critical during the business hours. So We used to have to deploy in very strange times such as Sundays or early mornings or stuff like that And you don't like getting up at 2 a.m. In the morning on a Sunday. Do you? So So that's definitely that That is something that was mended by by the OpenShift platform now another thing regarding this high availability thing is that the way we used to run Our systems is that we have a set number of application Servers which are crammed with Deployed artifacts and now if one of those goes haywire that can affect other services as well So resource isolation provided by containers is definitely a huge factor great So at RBC we've been going through a cultural transformation for a couple of years now mainly to You know enable the business to you know move faster to be more agile, right? So to that end we've done a lot of things with agile DevOps how people interact with each other the way we do We reward a open-source culture and engineering culture how innovation happens, etc so all of this is to Enable faster time to market right faster provisioning enabling applications to be delivered faster These are some of the core things. I mean there are obviously other benefits that come with it like you know To be able to you know better utilize hardware to do you know developer Efficiency improve developer efficiency, etc So yours was more driven by the need to Provide or shorten the supply chain of getting a developer productive And enable the business to make right which is about getting code introduction, right? Thank you in our case Customers are expecting to have more functionalities every day and if you want to go in the market you need to go and then So of course the business in the bank want to make all this in parallel So we need to have not a monolithic application We need to go and have the functionalities Dividing containers to be able to touch all in same time Given that and the velocity that we have for deploying in in that architecture and also for the stability that they give us and The ability also to scale in that big days is some of the factors that make us go in that direction Right. Thank you Daniel. I think you know, I think Folks again just with my experience across Asia Pacific I've seen in financial services this real switch from a cost-saving Sort of model of save money, you know IT department to now How do you enable the digitization of banking or financial services in the most? Expeditious and fast and agile way How do you get your code out into production in the most efficient and productive and stable high-performing way? And it sounds like from all of you really that's been the prime motivator I've not heard really about as much how do you save money to how do you actually deliver code? You know in a consistent and much more lean way Can I can I ask you gentlemen What are the top two things that you're planning on doing with containers or open-shift in the next sort of 12 months? Just to give the audience a sense of you know Now that you've got the platform in or you're actually, you know putting a number of applications already in production What what are you next looking at? What are the top one or two things that you're looking at doing? Over the next sort of 12 months just to Just to yeah, we We put ourselves under pressure so it's about five, but I'm for a customer with Looking at a QM or Kafka as a service also service mesh For the team we're focusing on obviously on version four. Yep, but also with vision for potentially a gen 2 Platform redesign, so that's our key focus One of the other things we're doing also is is showcasing the technology to different teams within technology Just to ensure that cadence or that uptake of the the tech stack It becomes very visible and people start looking at it in one right, so it's a key focus. Thank you Yeah, I think there is a laundry list of items, you know upgrade, you know Make sure that you know we have the right skills and you know all of that I think the one of the interesting one For me is actually work better with or work closer with the application of the solution design teams You know the the way the architecture is is completely different from the old legacy You know at the old in the old days we used to say it's like for like what we want now is like for better So sit was that make them understand, you know how that this is not the same way, you know I have an app, you know, this is I'm gonna I'm gonna now deploy it up and then I need you know You know 15 different machines, you know, and I'm gonna you know buy 15 different nodes for open shift And then another app is gonna have another 15 and we end up with you know 600 if you consumed on apps that frankly are not actually worth that most probably right But you know, it's more around and make them understand how the architecture is and Obviously also understand better how we charge back with a bank. So at the end of the day, I give you a dollar, you know So you can save You know a certain amount could be a dollar could be more depend on, you know, how you how, you know You're finance team how stringing your finance team is so it's very important actually that you know We figured out the right cost model and help our solution design team and application team Understand actually how to size and how to design properly and how that you know, it's a change in in the way things would work There is you know, there's more sharing. It's not, you know, you're isolated legacies So like you used to do is a lot of hardware, you know, it's not just about saving but it's also about, you know Just to change in the mentality Right so for the last year It's been clear that the new way we're developing our services is pretty successful And right now we have mandate to basically make build or all of our new services Write an open shift, but that hasn't completely happened. So it's my personal goal to Pull that all the way to a hundred percent for the new new Services, so that that's one and then there's the other thing we had this merger last year We bought a Swedish company and that basically I'm I need to take my developer hat Often put my salesperson hat on to make sure that open ship is adopted and they come on board Swedish side as well so that's That's I bet that's the most difficult part. Can you pronounce the name for the Swedish company? You see The Swedes and the Finns always get on don't they? No comment, okay? I Talk to things I think Well over the past couple of years we've been doing a lot of work on containerizing Linux workloads, right? I mean We see there's a big opportunity in containerizing Windows workloads now so Essentially with you know dot-net That is a big area of opportunity for us. That's something that we'll be concentrating on going forward The the other thing too is we like this marriage that has happened between IBM and Red Hat essentially because RBC is a big IBM shop and Like every other bank here, so You know we in order to support all the IBM frameworks we had to in the absence of this You know Integration we would we would have had to create separate clusters They would sort of be like two different brains that don't talk to each other You know different resources no discovery etc. Etc. Etc. So now it makes it very easy for us to be able to Containerize traditional workloads running on most of these IBM frameworks. So I think that's something that we're excited about Interesting that's interesting about the windows About that. I mean I've been at Red Hat 11 and a half years and You know obviously having a satir talk tomorrow and then you know Microsoft do their thing and it's just wonderful to see this lovely heterogeneity and polyglot really coming to the fore and to have a bank talk about the fact that they're going to be Focusing on Microsoft workloads on OpenShift, you know one of the most highly regulated industries I think you know just testament to the fact of this stuff actually working. Thank you Daniel Well, I mentioned before that we are in the middle of this process for putting all these all services in in api some microservices But that was more than you need Then the approach that we want to do that's how open different doors or different functionalities to be able to develop in the Interbank we have created a Onboard the digital onboarding for our customers We put that all over OpenShift. It's a new channel and calling all the apis for evaluating the entity of the person calling To a agency that is going on tell agency for validating that the person is who is saying Making fashion recognition using incoming services. We were ready to launch that on December of a year and we continue evolving that and In the meantime, we are talking here They are making the last stress test because we are launching the new home banking for the bank That's also using all the apis based on OpenShift And of course every time we are launching something we need to test and ensure that all the configurations are set properly But we are going on that direction every channel every api that we are developing We are making our engineering and putting that on OpenShift. Right, right Thank you Just in the time we have and I'll leave it up to you as to which question you'd like to answer on this It's an easy one. It's an easy one. Yeah, that's a good answer The way that Red had thinks about financial services is generally sort of really three themes around digital engagement There's a you know this theme around open banking, which is really this api first approach of internal and then external and then those sorts of things with legislation coming in but then the new markets that that presents and Then that transactional operational efficiency and high security and we all know the internet's really safe, right? Yeah So in that in those sorts of those sorts of three themes It's up to you as to which you'd like to answer How is OpenShift and this whole move of agile development? Adlining to those one of those three themes if you are doing that now if you don't want to answer that question If you had your time again What would you do differently in if in having container adoption and using OpenShift in a much more rapid way? So what are some lessons learned so you can either answer both or you can take one of those Probably take the letter Go for it and answer the other What would you do again? It's not not so much the what we've done technically it's more around Yeah, it doesn't have to be technical can be a political cultural More and culture I think and one of the clear things we've noticed over the last three or four months is the adoption To look at the technology stack has slowed down a bit and maybe when we started we should have had a similar like team running in parallel that would help We've got quite a large development community Java.net core help them Will coach them onto the new technology stacks much like the innovation labs, I guess But listening today, I think that innovation labs are great It's been a red hat person up on stage with partners talking about all the success stories, so that's Quite interesting, but yeah, if we could do one thing again, I think we would put just as much effort into a team that was gonna Coach and take our developers on a journey, right? So you're saying Glenn it's build it they won't necessarily come it's build it and and get the Adoption on it on a much more way the victims of our own success. We are one of our goals was to have a Full self-service stack and it's so much so that all they have to do is apply for access and they don't have to talk to us again They can pretty much put something into create a project and run up through the CICD Pipelines and put it into prod within a week if they wanted to so and we wouldn't know So that's sort of the downside of that is Some of them think it might be too hard and go back to the old traditional way of thinking I'll put this on a server We just want to quell that and Coach and help people on the journey as well. Yeah, thank you Yeah, I mean for us open banking You know is was the driver that started you know on the container Path it is absolutely part of and parcel of our strategy in the bank It's very very important so that piece it will continue. This is gonna be a huge focus You know for our bank, I would say the other piece, you know, you know, if I go back in time I would I Would spend more time with my you know the community of practice was the development team break more barriers Explained that you know sharing is not just caring but sharing will also result and better You know return on investment and you know financial because every one of those unit obviously are liable for you know For the you know for the cost of the infrastructure gets built so more of you know explaining how you know We're changing the way we're doing the infrastructure and that you know We can we can see more of you know of the consolidation That's you know, that's an interest for us as infrastructure in general, but you know, it's also useful for our Business because they can see benefits on the you know on the on the financial side You know reducing in a cost whether it's it's you know capital on the you know, you know or or ongoing from you know You know from our computer feel like Yeah, I mean I find that just real quick on this open banking and maybe if our Finnish friends want to talk about that Because we all talk about micro services and containers and CI CD But basically in banking the ape or insurance the bank the bankings apis are the products And if the product is not performing then we need to get it off the shelf or off the field Fix it and then get it back out there And how do you do that in a really expeditious way and have that feedback about the usability of the product? So yeah over to you right well So we are a credit information company and PSD to is very interesting to us for that reason because We we could really use the access to the accounting information data now in the EU Open banking is is really driven by the PSD to regulation and there's a huge lack of standards there so developing anything on top is like Shooting in the dark basically hoping to do something right so With with platform we're able to to make them like the feedback loop much much quicker and we're able to work with the banks for instance where We can easily deploy parallel environments for testing for specific purposes and expose them to specific customers So we are pilot customers Yeah, and that I mean open ship and open shipped in that architecture makes it obviously a lot more efficient and faster Definitely, okay. Thank you. Yeah, I'll take the what would you do differently question, right? So We all know there's a learning curve with Kubernetes and To that and we find that You know, you know big enterprise, you know people are always busy. They're trying to do a lot of different things at the same time and You know Making it a lot more easier for people for developers to be able to Containerize something You know, we started off doing CI CD with some existing Tools that we had and you know, it's it's even for people who have used CI CD traditionally in a traditional environment or maybe in another Past service like, you know cloud foundry for example There are some changes when you move over to OpenShift in Kubernetes, right? So What we can I would have I would have done differently is possibly made it as simple as natively as Lambda or something like that where they would you know, like something similar to an S2I that OpenShift has but You know something that works within the constraints of a bank and within the restrictions of the bank Yeah, yeah, it's that's great In your case when you say open banking, it's the target that we are pointing Is it yeah, yeah But we have many regulations that need to go together with the technology, right? So in the case that we can we are opening some of the APIs to the to the maybe another company So or in our case we have one example of It's like a housing ministry that we are opening for creating micro credits to is a kind of social service that the government gives And that that's kind of functionalities now we are open to to provide to external relations But there is a re-education of the the business the location of the people to start seeing that opportunities, right? It's not only that the technology needs to be there and that's all now we have the opportunity Then what we need to do with that things. It's really up to them. Yeah, the possibilities that this opens up. Yeah So ladies and gentlemen, we we're kind of at the top of the the hour So Diane's gonna be very thankful that we're we're on time, which is you know unusual for for bankers Yeah, so quick put our hands together for this wonderful panel. Thanks guys. Thank you very much