 Good morning, and the condition of moderator, I want to say, welcome to this session. The central subject of our debate relates to the political and institutional reforms in Latin America. And I want to emphasize the subject of political and institutional issues to reduce the subject so vast as one of institutions directed to a better representation as well as an increased transparency, accountability, and legal security. Prior to entering in our main subject of our dialogue, of our debate, I would like to explain what are the four questions that, as a common agreement, are of interest. First, debate in reference to the relevance of institutions, why are they important, and how much. Also, what are the priority areas of an institutional political reform in the region? What are the reforms? And the third place, we want the better strategies so we can have better reforms which would be effective and sustainability in the long term. And the fourth and last place, what practices can we identify as to how can we generate the level of consensus, political ones, so we can put in place these reforms and at the same time, the political consensus so we can guarantee sustainability in the long term of the reforms so the same ones will have a long lasting before, after the government. But before I become with the theme, I would like to present the members of this session. I'm sure that all of you considered for me that this World Economic Forum has gotten the best people of the world so we can talk about this complex and strategic theme. First of my life, the Minister Juan Carlos Pinzón Bueno, Minister of the National Defense of Colombia, young global leader who previously occupied various positions in the government in Colombia. I will make a short presentation of everyone here, so at the moment of the presentation will we present a curriculum. To the left is Artur Valenzuela, Professor of Government, Georgetown University. He occupied a couple of positions with the government of Glinton and is very dear in the origin. To his left, the Professor Moises Naim, Senior Assistant, International Economic Heritage. He was for 14 years the editor of the magazines. Main report for most of the numerous newspapers and I have the pleasure of reading it every week on the country and it's the most red columnist in the nation based on a gap. To his left, President Lionel Fernandez has been three times constitutional president of the Dominican Republic and also he is the president from Glor, which is a think tank of the Dominican Republic. Thank you, President, for being with us. And to his left and to my right, Jose Miguel Insunza, Secretary General of the Organization of American States since 2005 who has held several positions in the governments of consultation of Chile as the Foreign Relations Ministry and also the Ministry of the Interior. As you can see, this is a perfect combination of experiences and government positions for many years and also a rigorous intellectual skill. I want to have a brief introduction to place into context our debate. I believe that not only we have the best experts to address this subject, how to foster a political and institutional reform agenda but also the debate has taken place in the best moment. When we have significant reasons for having optimism in the region and also we have a reasons of concern due to what is happening in the political arena and the economic and social arena as well. In the political and the subject of democracy, the region has just 35 years of uninterrupted area in addition to certain problems or incidents in the region. And if we compare it to the past, the region is in a superior position in relation to what it was. But as I've been previously stated by Jose Miguel in his speech in Chile, we have to recognize the challenges that this matter has and not only in inclusion, inequality, but also in the area since we have broken the consensus that has stated in the article three of the Inter-American Democratic Document as to what we understand as democracy. And this is something that I believe we should debate. The second, because in the economic arena, the region was growing at a rate of 4.3 percent for the period of 2004 to 2011. But the last two years, there was a disacceleration that was below 3 percent. There are many reasons for this, external and internal, but there's also a great consensus that one of the main reasons is the subject of the low level of productivity and competitiveness of the region. Many institutions are closely related since this is one of the two pillars of the analysis of competitiveness from the World Economic Forum. The third good news that also generates concern is that if today, based on recent data from the World Bank, there are more people living in the middle class, 32 percent that in poverty close to 29, 30 percent. This new middle emerging cost, this middle class that's emerging has a series of demands for the political system in matters of increased transparency, accountability, access to public services of quality, not only the access, as well as the quality, education, health, security, that is also placing under pressure and under stress the capacity of the governments to provide a response and effectively an opportune response to these demands. This is why I believe that at the heart of all these subjects, the subject of the quality of the institutions, it's a subject that's a central point. With this, I want to begin the analysis asking you, Arturo, in the current situation in the current state of democracy, what is the value that you give institutions and what are the changes that you believe should take place in political and institutional reform to have a better quality of the democracy? Thank you, Daniel. I would like to take this moment to also say that you are joining us also and I want to acknowledge the great work that you have done throughout the years and all of these subjects and you have been inspiring to all of us and also your academic work is of great value. We want to appreciate this opportunity of being in dialogue with you and the forums such as this, they are very enriching subjects for all of us. We can refer to the subject of competitiveness that have been discussed, education and such, regulatory framework, and we can speak of challenges such as environmental issues. We spoke of the deficits of water. We can also speak of the great social subjects that are on the table, inequality, poverty and such. But truly, Daniel, unless we are concerned about the institutions, there's public policy really that should create the context, a legal context and governance. So we can solve these great problems. The quality of the institutions become an important element, an absolutely important element to have a democratic governance as we should have it. And at this moment, I want to say two things fast. One, we need to support and consolidate our democratic institutions. It's not easy. Remember, it didn't happen after the Second World War. That important countries in Europe could not reestablish a democratic process that the United States, to a point, is not a true democracy until the civil rights approval and electoral rights in 1965, which is a deficit also. And now they still have certain crises. And this is something I want to highlight. This is not a technology process when you reach from one point to the other. You have to be constantly looking how to improve the democratic institutions. Well, and in our continent, that is the continent of Republican nations of a long day. The nation is founded, and you had half of the members are members of the Americas, because you had as Republican independent democracies. We have had a trajectory that has been very difficult. 40% of all government changes from 1930 were due to a coup. And we never had consolidated the democracy as we should have what we had when it was another offer. Every time there was an election, there was a coup to change things. Therefore, there was something that did not allow democracies to be consolidated. It's something else from a theoretical standpoint. And then I will address the most important challenges. What is truly democracy? Democracy has to be understood as constitutional democracy. What does this mean? It's not necessarily the government of majorities. One of the greatest problems that we have is this notion that, well, if we have a majority, we can do everything. The famous Lincoln's phrase that said government of the people and by the people and for the people during the Civil War, when he appeals to maintaining the notion of democracy, he stated government of most of the people, but for the majority by the people. He did not say that. He said of the people, by the people, for the people. What it stated was that constitutional democracy has to guarantee the constitutional rights of the minorities, has to guarantee fundamental right of people. And in other words, it has to guarantee the possibility of the most of the future majority. And this is where we have an aberration that has occurred in this region, the notion that since you have a majority, you can do anything you want. You can close the Supreme Court. You can change the Constitution from one day to another with this, with you cannot consolidate the democracy when we don't have much time. And I regret, like my colleagues, Hausmann and others, that we have an academic world. We have a chip that would allow us to speak an hour and 15 minutes, and now I only have 30 minutes. And then I'll take this. I only have two minutes. There are three challenges, significant challenges in the area of institutionality in Latin America. And I'm going to place this as a challenge for many countries and for all of the countries, but also with a crisis in certain countries. And these are, first, the crisis of the rule of law, lack of accountability, the corruption and everything else. And relating to the possibility of having clear rules without this, we do not have a democracy of economic performance that depends on this democracy. Second, there is a crisis, severe crisis of representation. And I disagree with what the president stated yesterday that said, well, I had a good government because I was a businessman. Well, you have to evaluate the policy, Max Weber, which is the professor of all of this that are social scientists, he showed us a long time ago on the article as politics as a vocation is that the political affair is an important one. And why we made this representation? Because we're leaving the political parties by the wayside, which are the fundamental channels for the citizens will for the spheres of authority of power. It's not only the link between the citizens and the spheres of power and authority. They're fundamental for governance. And we need to evaluate political parties. And then we need to look at improvements. And with this, I will close my intervention. In many countries, we have a serious problem of democratic governance. The problem of democratic governance is 18 presidents did not conclude their presidencies after the Cold War. And many of them had to be dismissed. And this was due to a deficit of the presidential posture in Latin American. And this is relating to separation of powers where their president is also the person that is a minority and it does not the majority in parliament. It does not have a majority when elected and then it does not lead to the policies where the opposition will prefer the president to fail. So even though the country does not fare well, even though the country will not fare well, and what happens politics will have a bad prestige. And then what does the citizen say? Will they seek a savior, male or female to come and take us out of this swamp of an institutional crisis and then there's a savior, male or female. And then you have a majority president, then they just clean all the institutions. They want to re-election. They want to re-elect their grandfather, their husband. And then we have a problem because it's too personalized. Jose Miguel. You have been nine years in the OEA and with all your background in Chile, what is your analysis connected to what Arthur has said that we are confronting a democracy situation that it's not going with what is written now with the conditions that is written in the three of the American. And according to criteria, what have been the reforms, the most important ones that have been done, on which areas do you think that we have to make the reforms so we can make a better quality for the democracy? First, definitely there is an institutional deficit in our democracies. I'm going to say like a part of what I'm saying or the sets. I don't remember his name. He said we have a democracy and we don't have republics. In other words, we don't have a mechanism which we allowed to handle the public in a day-to-day and it responds first to a democracy's concepts and also instability so the citizens can move. And this is one of the reasons why we should worry about our institutions. The institutions, the minister of, we have thousands of institutions. In the OER we have even have more. Institutions like the state of right, democracy, that it's ruled by rules and not by people. My second comment comments, this is a part of the Latin American where we have a story of presidents that they get to a power by democracy and then they continue governing as far as they can and then by the majority, citizens give them the power so they can take the powers. So it's very interesting that the biggest dictators of this region, they arrive not for the democratic way, they just for a, not because of them, it's because of the environment that they would like to replace the institution. That's why in a region, the institution in a region, the respect of the institution is very important. We have made reforms with this, the handling of the power. This is an area of reform, an institution that we forget in a region that they would like to be the good presidents. The people that only want protection from the president, but also they want that the president respect the rights and they allow them to enjoy the benefit of the economics of countries that have been developed. There is not only a country, there is a citizen, civil citizens that they will like freedom and also a social. Certainly because the people will like to enjoy the benefits of the development. I'm always saying that if we take the social act, we, the individual presents a certain subordination to the sovereign and change for the sovereign to protect them. And I will say that the trade off is not the protection or subordination is the legitimacy as a citizen. The citizen gives legitimacy to the governor so the governor offers sovereignty. This is what we have had in democracy when we look at the constitutions that we have had throughout these times in many cases, they have been valid, they have been good. We've had changes that have been gradual changes due to how we're here, how do we remain? And you use the constitution to say, well, you have to respect human rights of all and that the human rights agreements are superior to anything, then we say, well, not allowing me to be reelected means I'm violating my human rights. Therefore, they swear on a constitution that says that there is not a relation based on the human rights. I'm not speaking only on one president, I'm speaking of several and I'm also speaking of left and right wings. Also, on the other hand, recently we announced that finally they were going to fill the positions that are vacant in the Supreme Court of a country that is in crisis and since I'm the general secretary of the Organization of American States, I cannot mention our countries, but they have eliminated the opposition parliament to ensure that those judges are of the same political wing of those that already exist. There is something that requires a substantial change. I'm going to say this quickly. This is the phrase of the senator of Paraguay. We have senators, but we do not have republics and here's the word close. We have a subject of the quality of governments. We have had many changes in Latin America and this means it's a good news that those that are reaching the government are new. They don't know, you don't study to be a governor, will not be, they will be democratic if you have to study to be a governor or a leader and issues of efficacy and quality of the government. The problems that we have in our countries at regional and local levels, this impacts the perception of citizens. Thank you. Mr. President, you have had the responsibility of occupying on three instances the presidency of your republic in Dominican Republic. Part of your agenda was to provide a priority and emphasis to modernizing institutions. Many reforms took place as well as a new political constitution and you also develop a mid and long term view of your country in which institutions played a significant role. What are the lessons that you can help us share with us that helped you generate a great of consensus and inclusions not only with civil society, with the citizens, with the political sector? And that can be useful for those countries that are about to have an institutional reform. Thanks, Daniel. In the case of the Dominican Republic, like the general of Latin America, you have to see as a whole process. What we could do in our mandatory, we have to do with what happens before. I would say that in the case of the region, we have been celebrating in the last years the centenary independence. And the independence you have to interpret like a rupture with the European from the past century. Since that moment, since we broke relationship with the colonial and every states has created a new country, we always have the democratic ideal. But this ideal was never really crystallized with exception in the past century and also in this century. The Dominican Republic the same. And it was not after the second world war that we started our democracy in not in very good terms. And I would say, like you had said, Daniel, at the beginning of this forum, is in the last 35 years that we could talk about a tendency to consolidate the democracy in Latin America. And also it started in the money republic in 1978 with the electoral process and with depressions that came from foreign countries. We got the alternative of the power. And then for many years after that, like Latin America, we have started with the democracy process, which in principle is that's how to get access to the power. When we talk about democracy is how do you get access to the power? And today there is only one way to get the power which is by electoral vote. It was not only like this. We previously have a military and the left one. Nowadays it is not acceptable, it's not legal because now we have rules that we guarantee the access of the democracy. But once in power is true, we have to establish the new rules to sustain the governability and the limit. And for this, the constitution of the republic. For the constitutions is establish the rule of play so we can legalize the power. It gives the limits to the president to see how he has to handle the power. The mechanism to create reform. The problem in Latin America is that we don't process this. We cannot withdraw any government when there is a possibility to judge a president. So. We have had the revocation of mandate that is not representative of a national area. And also in our case of Dominican Republic when we reached the government in 1996 for the first time, we are in a minority, a senator of 32 and four parliamentaries of 120. And as we concluded our last mandate, it was in the reverse. 31 of 32 and 100 parliamentaries of 120. What is possible to evolve within a democratic system within being a minority and also being able to become a majority. How can we, how did we do this? As we were a minority, one senator of 32, the permanent dialogue with the opposition on the basis of a national program that was, had the national's interest and heart compels you to an understanding because of the role of their public opinion. Their public opinion is capable of pressuring the political actors to have a consensus of subjects of a national interest. This evolved in such a way that on the last stage we had a constitutional reform based on the national dialogue to appeal to civil organizations so they could present their point of views and their perspectives in relation to how we should have a constitutional reform. All of this could be gathered in the technical working team. Legal professionals and constitutional rights due to the combination of the popular request and the legal mechanisms that allowed a constitutional reform that was by consensus in Dominican Republic. Also a national development strategy towards 2030. We have seen that one of the problems that we had in the region was that the electoral political cycles do not coincide with the cycles of economic growth. And how, with interruptions every four years when we have a new government, we could have long-term state policies. And this is based on the political agreements between actors. And in Dominican Republic, the constitutional reform, the administrative and financial reform and the national development strategy for 2030 was achieved on the political dialogue. And this implies the maturity of the actors in a democratic system. Thank you, Mr. President. Minister Pinzón, we all hope to have a successful conclusion of the process of peace that's taking place in your country. When this process is completed, when we have the implementation of these agreements, does Colombia currently have necessary institutions to guarantee rapid and effective implementation of these agreements? Or instead, will they need institutional reforms? What will be one or two priorities in which the institutional reforms will have to emphasize? Thank you, Daniel. Several things. First, I believe there is not a most important discussion and more complex. The subject of strong institutions as a mechanism to contribute to development, security, and the struggle and the fight against poverty and all of the admirable public services. Why? My impression is that institutions due to this need of having a permanent screening, a permanent review to determine if they are meeting or not their duties, they also find from the democratic standpoint, those that are the most interested in weakening the institutions. And we've seen this in several countries. Some to access power have found that the best way of doing this is destroying the credibility of institutions and doing what is possible so they don't work. And when this happens, we find double problems. Since when the institutions are weakened, they cannot solve the general problems that we have. And this is the first element. The second element. On many instances, the discussions of institutions takes place from a general political perspective that's ethereal. And each time, due to the experience that we have in Colombia, not only in my time but in successive governments, what is most important is the operational capacity of the institutions. And this is not addressed frequently. From the ministry, where I'm located, which is the Ministry of Defense, it's the artist. How can we achieve that all these discourses of the education and homes, reduction, poverty reduction? And this is also a discussion of management, resource assignment, and effectiveness that can be measured in indicators. And this is a way to respond to your question. In the last few years, for no one it's a secret that in Colombia, we were able to essentially strengthen the institutions that were relating to the armed forces. We strengthened our military capacity. We strengthened our police capacity. We found international assistance and support. We professionalized our armed forces. We did what we have not been able to do in 200 years of Republican history. We had territorial control at large. I can say something that's difficult to say and in front of Moises. But what is true is when Colombia was born, the reason was that it started to divide was because Bogotá never had a territorial control on the rest of all of its territories. And this is something that we should debate elsewhere. But truly, what happened was in the last 30 years, we had in check the existence of that government. We could not control our territory. We were able to deploy a control of our territory. Since the year 2000, we had approximately 60% of the municipalities of Colombia, approximately 1103 that were affected by terrorism. By 2009, we have 25%. At the close of last year, we only had 10%. It's to say we have a certain sense, we have been reconquering our terrain, our territory and stabilizing it. From the point of safety of the Colombian, it's not if the country is gonna be in the hands of a terrorist activity or drug trafficking. Now the concern is a small drug trafficking, gangs, theft, extortion, but please note that we are now seeing that even in the cities, the criminal organizations, inclusively the small ones are capable of recruiting young adults, people. And I close with this comment. In Colombia, we will reach the peace. We have been building peace as a virtue and achievement of the armed forces and the Colombian people that decided not to submit to the guerrillas. We're in a stage where President Santos have stated a path of political solution that is reasonable and this is what we've been pushing for with a strategy that is to create pressure, but also this stable peace that should reach Colombia can only reach Colombia if we can strengthen the operational capacity of the institutions that will respond to what is happening with young adults that respond with occupation and educational alternatives for these generations that will respond with infrastructure. And we have many opportunities for competitiveness, but we also have significant challenges of infrastructure. What I want to show is that the great challenge that we're gonna have in the last few years is to ensure that our institutions are operationally effective since this is where we have the true stability and we have to take this into account. There are gonna be many interested parties in weakening institutions and take advantage of the context of a world free of conflict. So these institutions are weakened and take advantage of this. The last subject, which is important in our case is justice. This is a subject of Latin America. Colombia prices itself and being one of the most institutional countries based on the government organization and there's great dependency between powers that justice has reached such a level of independence that each judge of the republic interprets legislation. And this generates a challenge since practically any judge on any subject can issue their own appreciation. This is an important challenge in the years to come in the Colombian case. Thank you, minister. Moises, years ago you were the one that emphasized, one of the ones that emphasized that the consensus of Washington, Washington consensus, we're not gonna have the expected outcomes if there was not a second generation of reforms. You were the one that initiated this terminology of the second generation of reforms where the emphasis was precisely on institutions. I am under the impression, please correct me if I'm wrong, that you have been moderating your devotion for institutions and to date. I see that you're more of a skeptic in things that I mostly read and things that you write. I would like, first of all, your opinion on the subject of institution pinpointed to Latin America and then a question since I believe it will be absurd to leave this tremendous conversation without placing in the center the subject of the crisis in Venezuela. Venezuela is where it is now because it has a low institutional capacity because it just left as institutions by the wayside and I don't wanna say it's all the fault of the institutions. What was the role of the institutions on the current crisis but facing on the difficult solution of this crisis? Thank you. And Arturo, I want to be joining and mentioning your contributions on the privilege that we have with you moderating. The first question and the second question I will give it to Secretary Dinsultza since I know he's eager to answer. No, I'm gonna try to answer both. Both are great questions. Yes, effectively. I feel somewhat guilty since I contributed to create a monster with the subject of institutions when you do not have an idea of what is happening of a country and you say, what should you do? And you say, well, you have weak institutions and you sound intelligent, competent and trained but truly it doesn't, you don't know what it's all about them. Institutions are the governance and the subject of policy what the virus is to medicate, to medicine. When you feel ill and you go to the medicine then the doctor sees you and the doctor looks at you and says, you have a virus. And at that moment you know two things. One, you have a virus and then you know two, the doctor does not have a clue of what he's gonna do with you. And this means that when we speak of institutions we speak of a great number of things that are so different. And there are three examples that have been placed here. The Secretary Dinsultza spoke of the subject relating to the Supreme Court of a country in Latin America that shall not be named. That has been transformed in the last 15 years in an appendix of the presidential palace and the president decides what the presidential palace does and the other is gonna be a renewal of the positions and then there will be a reflection of the constitutional change. In Mexico you have another constitutional change that has taken place in new policy and you have strengthened the anti-competency agency and now the government of Mexico is trying to create competencies in the fight struggle against monopolies and they're facing Televisa and other organizations of Carlos Slim. This is an institutional change and then you have the miracle of Colombia, a country that you cannot recognize now in comparison to what it was a few years ago. They have readdressed the territorial control and the armed forces are the most professional, the most tested in Latin America. I give you three examples because there are three different environments and what do we call all these three institutional change? We argument that this was the strengthening of institutions but truly we do not know what we're speaking of. I do not have a simple recipe to recommend but we know that in Latin America several things take place. Institutions are more volatile than what they should be. Permanent institutions become transitory and improvisation becomes permanent and this volatility is related to the economic volatility. A country that undergoes an economic crisis, they cannot survive it. There's severe consequences for the institutional environment when you have a country with a disarray in the economic arena and a lot has to do with the leader. What we have found that there are leaders that are institutional builders and there are other leaders that are institutional destroyers. In Latin America we have gone into death. We have surprisingly noted an epidemic of ideologic necrophilia and we see policies that do not work, policies that have been tested in that country and in other areas and what we see, political leaders that are passionately in love with these death and repeating these mistakes. This also relates to the institutions and at the end we have important subjects that are relating to the subject of corruption because we haven't addressed it since corruption is in the center and the subject is to how do you operationalize institutions or how do you have a public sector that is capable of attracting or retaining talents in a world that is very complex. In a world today it's much more complicated to direct a ministry of the defense than to direct a private enterprise but the challenges that the ministries have and those that manage these, they say they don't have the salaries, the career paths, they do not have the management of the conditions that would allow you to attract and retain the talent for an organization that is complex in the 21st century. This has to do with institutions. I'm trying to show you the range of the subjects that are relating to this entire pot and that are very complex and at the end everyone has a lot to do with the subject of power. We're living in a world where power has been easier to attain, easier to use, easier to lose and this is related to this. I can continue however we will readdress this. On the subject of Venezuela it's very difficult to speak briefly of Venezuela. It is a tragedy that the world does not understand clearly. It is a tragedy that has been distorted by propaganda. Yesterday we were reading in the New York Times an article of President Maduro for those of us who read the newspaper is just inherited that the fact checkers of the New York Times that say that every affirmation that you make you have to ensure that it's truly, I believe, they were asleep. When the article on President Maduro was written because the article has many facts that are not so and what I'm saying in this is because to see how complex the situation is. What you see is a government that has not shown samples that they do not tolerate people that do not think as they do where the opposition is not opposition. There are mortal enemies that do not deserve a voice, do not deserve to participate or exist. They're willing to incarcerate parliamentaries and they're also willing to violate every normal standard maintaining a discourse of dialogue. The world is willing to say that there is a moral and political symmetry on both sides. That opposition and the government are basically two parts of one country and what they have to do is to the converse, to discourse and what happened is one of the areas of that country is armed and they have violence. They are the ones that violate the constitutional principles and have generated a country where there is no democracy. And while this happened, Venezuelans or Democrats will cease with sadness and indignation how the rest of the Americans and the organization of American state remain silent and do not intervene in a scandalous situation, an obscene situation of basic human rights violation. Now I'm opening. We are close to the ending. Really this should be around four or five hours so we have a very wonderful expert and only one hour but well, the time that we were assigned is only one hour. We will respect this. So we will now be taking questions. Please give your name and say, make your point. And if you want to address this to only specific person, but please be sure and consistent. Sorry who are behind me and also we'd like to see if there is a question. Since I've been ignoring all this time, I will give you the priority to you for being discriminated, being behind me 50 minutes. My name is Diego de Suella. My name is Diego de Suella. I am part of the Young Global Leaders from El Salvador. My question to the forum is now that we just finished a lectern very tight and now we have a new authority who have a tight to people who are very expressive and dialect. How can we approach to a new government who is willing to dialect? But there is a very discomforting to enter into a constructive dialogue and not be the same as in the past. I will take a couple of questions now so we can take advantage of the time. My name is Jorge Medina, an entrepreneur from Peru. Here we're talking about institutions but I have not heard in any word the rule of the entrepreneurs. Isn't that the entrepreneurs responsible for improve our country if one of the problems, which is the corrections between one to three, the corruption? What are the politicians expecting from the private sector? Thank you. Good morning. My name is Ayame Glover Shaper from San Salvador and my question is complimenting with the prior questions. What is the role of the social civil people to act as a controller and balance and check to guarantee the institutionality of the country? Juan Manuel Fernández from Mercado, from Costa Rica. My country is a very well known democracy but we have a problem of the political act that it will take four years and it's political. It's important the political discourse as well as the institution and the democracy and also when a first round of answers, who wants to begin with the round of answers? The general secretary. Very well. I'm going to take one of the questions, very brief, since we're almost over our allotted time. I'm going to address what our Peruvian colleagues stated. What was the responsibility of businesses and also your question in relation to civil society and you need to ensure that when you are looking at how to have oversight on the public works and from the civil society, we need to be concerned of political institutions. This is not a subject and not only of rating politicians but also it's part of being involved in policies. It's something that is important, a role that's important for civil society but there is an important role for political parties. They need to be valued. Businessmen should be concerned on the quality of the policies of politics. They need to see how they can help to create mechanisms for training of young politicians. There are a number of instances such as this. You do this with foundations, there's international foundations that do this. You need to evaluate this. It's not only to have oversight of the government and evaluate it, we also have to participate. Secretary, the microphone please. In relation to a Salvador, everyone knows what has happened. There was a difference 0.11% would have voted to the other hand, the outcomes would have been different and therefore it is a country that has two political forces that are relatively polarizing even though there was an intent in the center. We know that that center went to one side when it came to the line and it is indispensable to seek agreements even before the government begins on subjects that are fundamental of governance as the same as the agreements and institutions that agreement or do everything. We're not speaking of a historical agreement that does not speak in one ear but just a group of consensus that rules society for long period of areas and one is the constitution of the American nations and this was an agreement which was the constitutional text that was modified to include some of the things we have discussed and therefore I believe it's an agreement of governance. There are certain things in society. There is some fundamental subjects of economics and politics that will not be modified. They will be maintained as stable as possible more so than the actual government. Salvador actually sees an unusual situation with the exception of Colombia where the parliamentary election and the presidential election is close and therefore if there's not an agreement of governance then the first year of government of president the scientists will try to earn the majority of the parliamentary election and I believe this is a clear example of a need for dialogue and seeking consensus which is for me fundamental. Also something else that has not been answered here I believe that in the case of Costa Rica this subject is what was the existing agreement. Costa Rica has been an example of stability and governance and peace in the region most of that in the last few years they've had some problems that we saw economic situations and they've had some problems with crime but they have a healthy democratic society and the subject is what are the adjustments that must be made in that society and I hope that the next president will have a dialogue in where these adjustments are made and this is a step that is totally different and the great difference between one of the others that we have addressed is that in most of the instances these countries we have been able to reach important grades of stability I know we're gonna leave this other discussion among us but truly the subject relating to governance not a quality of the governance governability and also the stability has increased in many countries in the last decade some of the questions in the role of businessmen the role of civil society could also be expanded to the political parties and the mass media I believe that we're looking at two models in Latin America a model that is inclusive and that brings all of the sectors of the society for a permanent dialogue and the articulation of a national strategy when we do this there is a governance stability and democratic stability then there's another model that's excluding some govern for some exclude others and here we need to understand that democracy does not imply necessarily the idealization of harmony democracy or politics is a general's term is a conflict then it's about how do we manage conflict and we can manage conflict on permanent dialogue now we have seen certain tendencies that take place in the region in relation to the state and civil society political parties civil society the state and mass media mass media and the authoritarian era had an important role to reach democracy and this is something that has to be recognized but their tensions between civil society and mass media and the current democracy and this is relating to different interests that are represented I believe that you can bet on strengthening the civil society the inclusive role of the business area without being in detriment of the political party you strengthen the political party you strengthen the civil society and the business sector within a democratic system these are the things that you have to see since this seems to be a contradiction between political party civil society mass media and the political parties in the state we need to find a way to integrate them all and have a role in the democratic system someone is telling me that we only have three minutes the police, Mr. Ministry of Final Reflection pinpointed to the case of Columbia and a final reflection from Moises I would like to say something that was said something about us I have not stated what Moises said I want one phrase please so we can have enough time just based on what we said in the case of Columbia that applies is the subject of social responsibility of the private sector in the marginated areas or marginal areas this is a subject that implies that the private sector finds a way of working in a particular relation with the institutions but in the last instance they should be concerned of the children of their region and where they're working this socioeconomic situation of the areas of where they have operations we need to find stability, security and a moment a creation of social values thank you minister secretary general I want to be very brief we need to be brief I learned once from a Moises Naim on a discussion on drugs and I've used this phrase when he said that when you reach 40 and you've done something and it doesn't work you try to do something different and the type of discourse in relation to Venezuela I listened to the World Economic Forum and I have been hearing it for many years and maybe it's been a moment to do something different when the great difference that we have now is that there is an opposition in Venezuela that cannot be ignored by the rest a few years ago they were in a delegation of O'Nan Sud and they will not have spoken to somebody to the opposition now they spoke to the opposition they ask and they ask what the church and students why not take advantage of this I know this is difficult and I know that dialogue cannot be achieved on the basis of nothing and I need to say it needs to be done based on the basis of the freedom of all people that have been pursued more so of the crime and I will not have someone that kills someone and the life and public authority well, in change of this there needs to be an acceptance of this you cannot ask the international community to have a dialogue to dismiss the government I believe there is a path is it going to be plagued with distrust? Yes, but we cannot continue doing the same thing I just want to remind you in the year 2006 we sent to Venezuela the last electoral mission it was a parliamentary it was directed a person that is how, without a doubt which is Ruben Penina which is closer to Moises than to myself he was the chief of the mission and at 12 noon he said to the opposition that all of the conditions that the opposition was requesting for the election were being met and they said they will answer at one and at one they said they were not going to the elections and they gave the parliament so let's not commit the same mistakes when there is a possibility of dialogue thank you very much we have very few seconds 20 seconds only thing I can say to this it's impossible to be not ready to the dialogue and it's not possible to be in agreement with a dialogue that's been manipulated and it's cheating and it requires condition dialogue requires condition there have to be signs of trust the government has to give the brief example of trust to try not to put incarcerate Maria Curina Machado if Maria Curina Machado goes from the airport to jail then please tell me what's the basis of that dialogue this is a conversation that includes these types of specific details that go more than the appeal for a dialogue no one can disagree with a dialogue that avoids people from being murdered on the street but there are very innocent ways, very manipulated ways of the government to lead to a dialogue on the businessmen question I'm a hyper realist in the case of businessmen I believe that they do not respond to encouragement instead they respond to incentives we can say that they can work with the children in the marginated areas some will do it others will not but this is too important to leave it at random the goodwill of the businessmen or the entrepreneur that's in the area prefer standards and incentives that will create condition and they respond and they behave in a way that is aligned with the supreme interest of society thank you I want to say specifically thank you to the regional director Marisol for helping us with this panel I believe the reflection was very important on institutions I believe that we have agreed on the relevance and the need of a definition that is precise as to what we understand as an institution unlike the fact that leaders build institutions and we have a leader that does President Fernandez and clearly we have in the region leaders that destroy institutions for a democracy of quality for economic growth for a better competitiveness for a better response from the government's standpoint I believe institutions are key and we have a takeaway message that's an article 3 of the Inter-American Democratic Letter and it's important to understand the Venezuelan crisis it's not enough to be democratically elected but the challenge is to exercise that power that authority democratically thank you very much to our five speakers and a round of applause