 We're on to the last or nearly the last leg, but certainly the last panel. I'm Kim Boyer I'm chair of the Tasmanian branch of the AWIA and I'm really excited about chairing this panel the health of the planet where we go beyond the nation state and look at the environment and Issues of international relations in the environment than impact on the planet as a whole We've got a great panel of speakers From my immediate left is dr. Tony press of another fellow Tasmanian though Although he claims he's only been there for 20 years and so he can't count as a Tasmanian yet. That's not true Tony's been one of the key architects of the wondrous Antarctic treaty which celebrates its 60th year this year and which has been a focus for the Tasmanian branch the Tasmanian AWIA and will continue to be so then we've got the Honourable Penny Winsley who is well known to all of the masterclass attendees and well known to everyone in this audience as one of our Most leading diplomats, but today Penny is going to be talking in her role as chair of the Council of the Australian Institute of Marine Science and she's going to be talking about oceans ocean conservation and biodiversity Then we've got Nigel Warren from the CSIRO Who's going to be talking about adaptive technology in science? He says this is not his area of expertise, but I bet it is And then Sarah Davies who's got a great CV in Women peace and security agenda and Sarah's going to be talking today about Australia's role in regional health Security with probably a bit about women thrown in there, too, which is great I'm not going to do the same as the other panel chairs and ask a question of each of the Panel members when they finish speaking instead we've negotiated that they can maybe take eight to ten minutes like a bit over eight minutes to talk and then if they want to ask questions of each other That's great. If not over to you or they'll just consider themselves as part of the audience in the question asking thing So please first of all make welcome Tony press Thank you for those who don't know me I I'm neither a diplomat nor an international lawyer. So I Won't be going into the into the Legal in intricacies of the things that I'm talking about but I'm I want to just Give you an overview of the kinds of International instruments that I've dealt with in my career in The environment rather talk about the ones that I know a little bit about and the ones that I don't know much about And I'll try not to walk into pennies space I want to start off by saying That it's fair to say that our planet is Is facing a serious and fundamental threat to its health and its resilience and that threat is climate change and You can't dress it up any more subtly Then that it is a threat There might be some opportunities there but at the moment in the way the world comprehensively is Responding to climate change It remains a threat. It's manifesting itself in our own domestic environment and Onto our economy when I was born Three hours up the road a little town called car core there was about 80 parts per million carbon dioxide in the atmosphere There are now 408 parts per million concentration of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere and The trajectory is business as usual. So on a global scale nothing that we've done in the last Decade or two the lost decades has bent the curve of The carbon dioxide and methane and other greenhouse gas Concentrations like climate change many other environmental issues ignore International boundaries air pollution Ocean environmental issues Persistent organic pollutants and some of the other manifestations of Environmental damage Don't stop at the borders of the countries that are receiving the pollution or Producing the pollution So it's obvious that significant environmental issues need to be dealt with globally through multilateral engagement and through inclusion I've got a list of Agreements that have been negotiated over the years. I'll just read them out, but we go back to 1946 International Convention for the regulation of whaling 1971 convention on wetlands of international importance 1972 the convention on prevention of marine pollution 1973 the convention on international trade and endangered species The international convention for the for prevention of pollution from ships Convention on the long-range Transboundary air pollution 1979 Convention on migratory species of wild animals United States United Nations Convention on the law of the sea which we in Australia call uncloss and Many others called the loss convention the vietic convention on the protection of the ozone layer and the subsequently the protocol on substance depletion in the ozone layer one of the brilliantly successful international environmental treaties The framework convention on climate change the Stockholm Convention on persistent organic pollutants and the three At conventions or international agreements that I Personally have had deep involvement with And I'll call the first one an environmental Treaty it wasn't really it was a peace treaty and a Nuclear disarmament treaty, but it rapidly evolved to have a conservation environmental protection Component and that was the Antarctic Treaty Negotiated in 1959 followed by its convention on the conservation of Antarctic marine living resources and then in 1990 The protocol on environmental protection to the Antarctic Treaty the Madrid protocol and there's also a further Outside of that sphere, but but related was the agreement on the conservation of albatrosses and petrol's the important thing to know about the successful Treaties the ones that actually kick goals Is that they are Successful because they have active Adherence they have very good internal governance mechanisms and they engage constructively with states that have different capabilities Australia's played a significant role in the negotiation of many international environmental agreements and in their Governance and lawmaking and penny will probably talk a lot more about that in a moment Protecting the environment and aggressively tackling critical issues like climate change is in the national interest and It's in Australia's national interest the Prime Minister Said Recently at the Lowy Institute Our environment our oceans our coasts our grazing and pasture lands our water resources our soil depend upon our practical conservation Indeed they do but they are also influenced By things that happen Outside of our control so beyond our practical conservation But he did go on to say I'm determined Australia will play a more active role in standard setting. I have tasked the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade to come back to me with a comprehensive audit of global institutions and rulemaking processes Where we have the greatest stake Now I think that's a very good idea. Some people might have read some dark Intent in that but it is true That Australia has played a significant role in very important international treaties and negotiations that ultimately will protect Australia from global environmental damage and I think If there's anyone from DFAT in the room When You're drawing up that list you should look at some of the gold standards I Think the Antarctic Treaty system The the whole of the system its individual treaties and agreements But collectively all of those together are a gold standard in international trans boundary environmental management and there are and there are others so I'll finish up by saying We do have An opportunity to act in our national interest by engaging multilaterally by empowering countries That have less capacity Than us or fewer resources By capacity building But also by civil an active engagement and When we do that We can achieve great things. Thank you Are you going to have straight then? Okay, well, thanks Kim and good afternoon ladies and gentlemen Thank you to the Australian Institute of International Affairs for the opportunity to contribute To this panel on the health of the planet as a former Australian ambassador to the UN for seven years and also ambassador for the environment I'm Very pleased to see the Institute paying greater attention to the subject of environmental challenges their impact on international affairs and their implications for Australia and Australian foreign policy Although Some at least of the subjects that we for have been asked to address on this panel will inevitably inexorably lead us or begin us With the subject of climate change and global warming I do think it's good to broaden the discussion and raise awareness of what is happening in some other areas Including on the very big subject that I was given oceans conservation and biodiversity The time available is challengingly short For such a vast topic But I thought I it was very important to use this as an awareness-raising Opportunity and to put things in context So I want to talk firstly about the importance of oceans Secondly, they're declining state Then move on to recent important international developments on ocean action and then Offer some remarks about Australia's situation first of all Covering 72% of the earth's surface oceans or what some are now calling the global ocean are simply critical to health wealth and human survival Oceans support the greatest biodiversity on the planet They're home to millions of plants and animals and a very significant part of our oceans are not yet explored So or mapped so the potential for discovery of further organisms is actually very high More than three billion people depend depend on the ocean For their primary source of protein over three billion people depend on marine and coastal biodiversity for their livelihoods According to the World Resources Institute the value of goods and services from the ocean amounts to more than US three trillion dollars annually five percent of global GDP and that figure is expected to double by 2030 The global ocean accounts for a hundred and forty million jobs in fishing and aquaculture and many more millions in indirect employment in What I'd call sea related activities Shipping accounts for the transport of more than 90% of the world's traded goods which we've discussed in earlier panels and The ocean obviously has fundamental political and military strategic importance it holds substantial precious mineral and energy sources and Here's that climate link The oceans regulate the earth's systems they absorb heat and Redistributed around the world by way of currents and interactions with the atmosphere They drive climate and weather systems. They play a key role in the carbon cycle Absorbing gases and a great amount of carbon dioxide About at the moment about 30% of the carbon dioxide produced by humans. They buffer the impacts of global warming Now for the threats Ocean health is under severe and growing pressure In the context of that growing pressure that you talked about More broadly with environmental pressures David Attenborough said at the end of his Well-known blue planet TV series oceans are under threat now as never before in human history Humanity is losing the foods the jobs and the environmental services that a healthy ocean generates the threats are from overfishing including illegal and unregulated fishing Plastic and other pollution coastal development and Here it is again the impacts of climate change those impacts include warming of the oceans acidification and sea level rise There's been a 26% rise in acidification measured since the industrial revolution Marine pollution overwhelmingly from land-based sources is reaching catastrophic alarming levels with an average of 13,000 pieces of plastic litter to be found on every square kilometer of the global ocean The threats are so extensive 40% of the world's oceans are now classified as Seriously affected and virtually no area no area remains untouched Thirdly This serious decline has led to a really sharp acceleration in international attention being paid to oceans in the last four or five years You mentioned uncloss that goes back to the early 70s When I was ambassador for the environment working on the biodiversity convention framework convention on climate change the Basel convention and so on All of these issues were being talked about but I sometimes have a feeling that this is Groundhog Day I'm back in that terrible terrible movie and we're just going over these things again and again But the fact is the situation has deteriorated very dramatically and so There has been this quite steep acceleration in international attention now being paid to oceans in just let me run through the last Four years in 2015 the UN Sustainable Development Summit and many of you here know all about the Sustainable Development Goals set one of the 17 goals number 14 as The goal to conserve and sustain Sustainably use the ocean seas and marine resources for sustainable development in 2017 We saw the first UN Ocean Conference which issued a call for action our ocean our future our call to action last year in 2018 responding to that call a small group of world leaders Then Australian Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull among them established a high-level panel for sustainable ocean economy aimed at catalyzing bold action for ocean protection and production this year in 2019 in March the world meteorological Organization produced a statement on the state of the global climate in 2018 that produced striking evidence of record warming Increasing Sea level rise loss of sea ice Extreme weather events and here in Australia. We can appreciate that quite clearly In June this year at the G20 summit So this is moving on to other Agendas not just people working on Negotiation of environmental agreements the G20 summit Japan's Prime Minister Abe launched a Marine initiative initiative and the Osaka blue ocean vision to advance Effective actions to combat marine plastic litter on a global scale last month the IPCC issued a special report on the ocean and cry Christ cry or a sphere. I asked you to help me with that word in a in a change in climate again bringing forward these Messages that these things are happening faster than we can address them and That high-level panel that I mentioned a moment ago met again just a few weeks ago and Issued an urgent call for ocean based climate action So the subjects are coming all together, but this time with a new twist Saying that they want to look at the ocean as a solution not a victim and looking at ways in which Required reductions in greenhouse gas emissions could come from the ocean sector They are going to bring their recommendations to the world ocean conference to be held in June next year in Lisbon Aimed at scaling up ocean action based on science and innovation Which brings me fourthly and finally to Australia which has both major reason and major capacity To contribute to these international efforts We're a marine nation with a huge ocean estate We claim the world's third largest marine jurisdiction More than double our landmass We have some sovereign rights over most of this estate our marine estate is a vital national asset our marine industries are one of the fastest growing parts of our economy the value has more than doubled in the past 10 years it has overtaken agriculture in importance now worth 70 billion dollars a year supporting more than 390,000 jobs and Projected to grow three times faster than our GDP over the next decade Overall it contributes close to a billion a year to our economy. We will see it reach 100 billion by 2025 99% not the 90 for the rest of the world 99% of our trade by volume is carried by sea 85% of Australians live within 50 kilometres of the coast so and that compares with 50% of the world population that live on the coasts, although that is going to increase to 72% over the next five seven years Given those statistics, it's not The least bit surprising that we should be a world leader For the protection and sustainable use of the ocean and to my direct knowledge as Chairman of the Australian Institute of Marine Science for the past five years and chairman of the Great Barrier Reef Advisory Committee Since mid 2015 we are Actually at the forefront of many many areas relevant for protecting ocean health and biodiversity We are incontestably a global leader in marine science and in marine conservation We have a world-class fisheries management system. We are a world leader in biodiversity conservation We have internationally renowned Marine protected areas we have the largest representative network of marine reserves in the world Covering one-third of our waters. We are leading global efforts to protect and restore mangroves tidal marshes and sea grasses We're at the forefront of efforts to protect and build the resilience of coral reefs And we are the world leader on reef adaptation to climate change ladies and gentlemen Clearly, there's a great urgency to act to address the threats to ocean health Australia I suggest I believe is exceptionally well positioned to play a very substantial role in Answering the global call to ocean action. We have agency. We have heft We can exert influence in many key areas and to do so will serve our national and regional interests and Advance our international standing. Thank you Always a privilege to follow Penny. Thanks, Penny Look, I wanted to sort of contain my remarks today around adaptive technologies and resilient and Invaluable environments. My name is Nigel Warren. I'm the executive director of growth at Syro What I will start off on though And I think it's an important point and something that I've seen change Over the last four years that I've been in the organization is science and technology Particularly in this area particularly in the environment as a really increasingly interesting set of tools and platform when it comes to Australia's foreign policy Objectives and priorities in certain parts of the world and I wanted to kind of give you Some perspective on what I've seen change inside not just the organization being Syro, but also partners and the sort of global Change and integration of the organization particularly in the area of the environment But I'll break down some specific areas throughout our region where we've seen a lot of change as well If you look back just four years ago the organization Collaborated internationally 47% of the time this year at 63% so you're seeing this huge change of our scientists Globally collaborating on issues. Why is that? Countries in our own neighborhood countries around the world have got common challenges common issues of concern and They're looking for each other to solve those large problems We've got some specific areas that we focus on when it comes to international Partnerships a great many of them are focused on the environment I probably wouldn't be a surprise to the audience here today But a common driver when you look at relationships that we've got with peer organizations is the environment We've got a very globally driven workforce 35% of the staff at Syro are born outside of Australia We co-publicate with 130 countries. So you've got this sort of globally active workforce Inside the organization and that's not different to university partners as well But I really think that global engagement and you would have seen that in a part of our 2015 strategy global engagement national benefit It's something that you're going to see even more vibrant and Ever-changing and growing when it comes to foreign policy Priorities in certain parts of the world I'm going to focus most of my remarks on resilient and valuable environments and really sort of See where that is relevant in terms of the context of the health of the planet But mainly focus on some of the research areas that we're working on And some of the trends that we're seeing and give you some examples of some of the work that's going on already It's only going to be the tip of the iceberg and Really gives you just a snapshot of what's happening, but sort of will give you flavor of sort of some of the opportunities that we're seeing When it comes to trends when it comes to sustainability Globally rising populations are depleting resources at such a rate each year 90 billion tons of primary materials extracted and used globally Only 9% are recycled. It's a staggering amount Today our industries our agriculture industry have and continue to adapt to the environmental factors they encounter, but it's increasingly difficult Climate change is really only going to increase the stress on our ecosystems, which are already threatened Australia is really considered to be one of the world's mega diverse countries However over the past 200 years Australia has lost more species than any other continent and Continues to have the highest rate of species decline amongst OECD countries It sort of really gives you pause for thought We are not alone in this regard. The loss of biodiversity is drawing increased focus around the globe Whenever I talk to any of the partner countries that we're represented in now, which is seven whether it's Chile or it's Vietnam or it's Indonesia these are very common issues that come to the front and the fore of conversation at the very start of any sort of Science agreement or joint project that we're working on and I can really only seeing that increase I also really wanted to mention the change in societal awareness And the driving pressure to see economic growth While trying to focus on sustainability. How do the two really exist and survive together? Specifically I really would like to focus and tension on energy water and food management as well as a major transition to a more effective circular economy Within that context and we've got some specific areas that we focus on I won't go through all of them, but the core areas of research and development the core areas of investment that we make The spin-out companies that we're supporting the universities that we're partnering with The countries throughout the region that we're building agreements with are focused in some key areas atmosphere and climate Biodiversity extreme events The prediction of extreme events land management and sustainable development Oceans coasts and water and The circular economy and waste management I'll only focus on circular economy and waste management respectful of the eight minutes I could talk about all the areas for probably a couple of hours, but I'll just focus just focus on circular economy It's a really a natural area for us to work on other to work with other countries and global partners on If we just look at the one area of research and the research into the recovery of metals and minerals and the development of new battery materials There's a range of growing global opportunities that we're seeing Only two to three percent of lithium batteries are currently recycled the rest is sent to landfill which is staggering Use batteries can be used for components. They can be given a second life in a different application Whether that be for electric vehicle battery or to power a home We really believe that low battery recycling rates can be overcome Through a much better understanding the importance of recycling an improved collection process and by implementing different ways to recycle these materials We've just entered into a partnership with a Japanese company to look at this and this is something that's Very natural and that will find that global partner that will want to accelerate that Commercialization what we really need to do is to bring that learning back to our domestic environment here in Australia The other example I wanted to just touch on was Power generation and energy generation Another green technology collaboration that we really feel has got significant Opportunity to make a change for the health of the planet is really the development of clean hydrogen technologies In May this year. We signed a new agreement between Australia and Canada Enabling enabling greater collaboration in this area and we're working with the University of British Columbia To look at some joint clean energy research and demonstration projects Including hydrogen refueling infrastructure I think hydrogen if I look at out 10 years for the future of Australia Really has the potential not just to significantly reduce greenhouse gas emissions Enhance the resilience of the global energy system But it really can become a global clean energy commodity for Australia both domestically but also on the export front We released a national energy hydrogen energy roadmap Which outlines where we believe there's an opportunity for hydrogen to compete favorably on a cost basis in Local applications such as transport and remote area power systems Yes Perfect. I'm just concluding actually So that is one example where we're seeing a Real change when it comes to the domestic market, but also opening up export opportunities that are directly relevant for our neighborhood So in conclusion a couple of examples for you broad portfolio of engagement right across this area in terms of environment But one thing I'll leave you with is that most of the countries we're dealing with this is a common challenge It's the first thing that comes up when we're looking to negotiate projects programs or Science agreements and I'll pass on the questions. Thanks Either to Sarah last but not least Thank you. It's such a pleasure to be speaking at today's event It's there's been it's been a really impressive day of speakers and it's a bit daunting to be amongst the last on this panel on this very distinguished panel and I sincerely appreciate the organizers for the invitation to speak today and I would like to pay my personal respects to the owners of the traditional land on which we gathered today and acknowledge their traditional owners past present and future I Think I was asked today because I was very fortunate in being able to launch a book that I wrote earlier this year called containing contagion which was looking at the politics of disease outbreak surveillance and response in Southeast Asia during some crucial a crucial decade the outbreak of the severe acute respiratory syndrome in 2003 up to the outbreak of the West Africa Ebola outbreak in 2014 which thankfully didn't make its way across to this region, but what I looked at over that roughly decade was the Extreme effort to try and organize regional cooperation in particular amongst the Association of Southeast Asian Nations a crew had membership across the World Health Organization the regional offices and two different regional offices and The role that the Australian government had played in being one of a number of international conduits and supporters of that type of health diplomacy That was that was really focused a key focus during that decade in a region where there has been Sometimes resistance or different interpretations of the importance of international regulations around areas such as promptly reporting disease outbreaks transparently reporting where they're occurring communicating across with neighbors about suspected outbreaks and if they're unable to detect or or Verify what that outbreak is seeking assistance to try and do so And what I argue in that book is that that was not by accident That was by a very deliberate design a very deliberate diplomatic design to try and foster cooperation to try and foster, you know a sense of collective interest And I think given the conversation today has been around. Where is their agency? What issues are we facing in the future in terms of trust and how do we think about? Those future challenges and what works in response to what's ahead I'd like to focus a little bit on those in light of the conversation that we've had today and in particular Where I think there's future room for thinking in particular in the area of health diplomacy So I'm going to put my cards on the table straight away and say that I come at this as as a functionalist Knowing that there is a certain amount of problems with the way that that that theory has developed over time But what does that mean? I think it points to what Nigel's been talking about which is the importance of thinking about cooperation and non-political context and in particular thinking about the importance of cooperation Across countries in moments when there is where there is contention where there is a sense of heightened risk Where there is perhaps distrust and what we would see as our traditional Institutions our traditional rules actually looking across and thinking where is there opportunities for collective governance and Perhaps sometimes what is seen as limited functional technical and Economic areas is actually really vital because what it often can do is capture those everyday human needs Think about what is causing everyday insecurity and that can be a really important entry point into building future diplomatic trust and cooperation I Think health diplomacy captures this approach. It's not done with the sense of blind optimism There is much knowledge and I as I document in that decade of looking at cooperation in this region There's an acknowledgement that sometimes things still don't get reported Sometimes people don't want to acknowledge what's happening, but there's also really important moments Where through that constant effort to ensure that there is face-to-face to meetings that there is this Elevation of health diplomacy to the highest levels in government meetings and regional meetings There is a person to speak to on the other end of the line when you're facing a situation You don't quite know how to negotiate your way next and forward. I Think it's really important that we think about the deliberate agency that is invested and to trying to think about how to use Knowledge expertise to improve the human conditions as we've heard from this panel already there are a number of really significant challenges that we all face and Dedicating political effort and diplomatic time and money which we've heard from Melissa Connolly today Tyler today in her report Defat you know is facing quite a significant struggle But I think it's really important to think and acknowledge about where we diplomatically can have real power and agency And I think in these sorts of functional areas. We have a really important role to play at the moment The first area where I think it's really important to think about Success or the potential for success where we could be doing more is the Indo-Pacific Center for Health Security I think the announcement of this center was a really significant move not because it actually delivered more money It didn't it was a shift of money But what it was was an ambitious political statement about in the environment where the aid budget is shrinking There was diplomatic ambition to try and think about where there's opportunity for greater politics and diplomacy in the region Around an area that is of significance importance to this region as Penny was saying we are seeing rapid urbanization occurring in our region with rapid urbanization comes the risk of more poverty traps with With rapid urbanization in an environment where our climate is significantly changing We are seeing health outbreaks and disease outbreaks, particularly mosquito-bill diseases Really are going to have a massive impact on the way in which populations Organize the way in which they access water Seditation and there is real opportunities here amongst all this real risk to think about how we can diplomatically cooperate That's why I think that in the area of multilateral exchanges It was disappointing to me this morning to hear not more discussion about our key partners in the area of health diplomacy We have long advocates such as Indonesia Thailand Singapore and even China in these areas where there has been over a decade of hard work done To try and think with South Korea and the United States as well as Canada and Norway How we can collectively think about improving our regional and global health security And I would like to see more discussion about how this can be done through areas such as exchanges in the areas of Universal health care coverage, which we know some last month has been identified as a key platform Moving forward our region has a lot of work to be doing in terms of influenza vaccine production Which is an exchange which is an important area to focus on if we're thinking in peacetime Where is an area where we can think about? Vaccination production Disproduced distribution risk communication with public private partnerships and an environment where we're not yet under the type of threat that we would be during a disease outbreak I Also think we could be much more ambitious in the way We're thinking about our fellowships and our and our trend and our partnerships in an education level It's wonderful to see the ASEAN Australia health security fellowships the health Selk Road by comparison and the ASEAN China 100 program is outranking us by about 10 times that amount at the moment So I think we could be doing a lot more in that space as well The second reason why I think this is really important is because what I've been talking optimistically about What we can do I think we also need to be really cognizant of the fact that politically and operationally in our region trust and communication is something that shouldn't be taken for granted Pitch mom was really interesting this morning when she was talking about civil societies and the pushback they're sometimes experiencing in the region and these This delicate balance at the moment in the way some of those countries are going through their political transition I think what we have to be aware of and that's something that I think is quite different to what I was seeing when I wrote the book is The way in which trust and communication in the last decade has radically changed in ways that Lean more towards at the moment for there to be controls on information for there to be shutdowns on communications by states Which could actually undermine sometimes important health messages and trust in in particularly in our civil society Sector and the access to information that they are able to have Who we often rely on in a lot of disease outbreak events and in peacetime disease control So thinking more carefully about how we can bring civil society sector into our health diplomacy discussions is really important as well as bringing in our Educational institutions as well as thinking about not just the high-level Political operatives but also those mid-level senior broker and senior level bureaucracy as well Who often have to manage those early moments of trying to think about how to navigate and cooperate in a disease outbreak? emergency finally Finally I was asked to talk about gender which I won't have time to talk about was my fourth But I'll do my third one and it will come in through there. I think we need to think about The fantastic rules-based institutional approaches we already have in place There's been a lot of discussion recently about them being fragile than being not working. I Think we need to think about what the world looked like before the smallpox eradication and The effort that went into that The global Alliance for Vaccine Immunization the global fund to fight HIV TB and malaria The fact that we're now talking about a universal health care declaration Something that we aspire all countries to be trying to reach by 2030 The international health regulations and the discussions in the heated debate about whether or not that regulation Should have led to a declaring a public health emergency in the recent Ebola outbreak in the Democratic Republic of Congo None of these institutions or funding arrangements are perfect, but a world without them where they didn't exist Would be terribly grim indeed and I think it's really important that we think more About the gains that we have made through very hard efforts to think about these areas as not just technical enterprises But also really important diplomatic areas of exchange and cooperation that we invest in Okay, so it's over to you so please keep your questions short raise your hand and wait for the mic Question down here. Where are the mic people? Here we go. Thank you Brian every ham and that's to Tony press and props perhaps to penny in her role in as the ambassador in my time of dealing with DFAT and the Department of Environment here in Canberra for various conventions that we've attended I've discovered that there's a Major lack of resources to support our work on those conventions I know I've asked quite a few times whether or not DFAT could provide at least administrative assistance if not Protocol work to for example help environment people attend REMSA conventions and or be briefed How in the heavens name would we be able to deal with the various Conventions that we have signed on to and Tony you did miss out the World Heritage Convention in your list But How do we do that if we do not resource our Our people to do the both the governance and the reporting that's necessary for the proper management of those conventions I'll start Penny make want to make a comment and I Will just mention the World Heritage Convention. I Actually didn't put the World Heritage Convention in my list because it's not actually an environmental convention That's a that's a technical legal issue that we could talk about later It's a heritage convention but Look, I've written a number of reports and papers over the last few years on The Antarctic Treaty so I'll leave my comments in that in that zone, but they they're applicable to the every area that you mentioned And two things are apparent to me one is That the resources that were once available in DFAT and elsewhere to deal with very difficult problems So I'll give you an example IUU fishing Illegal unregulated unreported fishing In the Camelar area the Antarctic Treaty area in the 90s and 2000s We had a whole of government resources applied in various levels of technical Assessment and capability With lots of international collaboration involved in that and a huge diplomatic effort that that was run by the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade I'm afraid that those resources aren't there anymore So there are some resources there But the interactions that I've had with my colleagues in various departments dealing with these issues Over the last few years, not specifically the Antarctic Division, but but but Across whole of government is that there's been both a loss of skill, but also an absolute Reduction in the number of people Able to be engaged at any one time on these issues That makes it really hard so Started off by saying I've written a number of reports over the last few years in each of them. I have said That in my view, there should be more be more resources Available to do the soft and hard diplomacy That's required in these kinds of conventions and to solve these kinds of problems Just to add to that I mean it's 10 years since I left DFAT And I'm not across the intricacies of their finances, but it's it's pretty widely understood that they're under significant pressure financially there's no new moneys and That's a difficulty a few things though that I would say We all think of foreign affairs and trade as the sort of key foreign affairs department But there are an awful lot of other departments that Working on these international issues. We've just heard about health I'm conscious there's someone here from industry and Innovation and science they do their they're very focused on the international agenda as we heard here from CSIRO And It's so it isn't just the fat in the environment on these environment issues and There there is really a very significant effort to try to find are there any pockets are there any ways in which We can tap into things that have been identified as important By the government and by ministers and see if you can do what you always do craft as a good bureaucrat You craft the proposals to try to fit it There's money in the Pacific. So do we try to latch on to that and broaden that across into other parts of our region and I'm quite confident that that's being done very deftly very quietly by those bureaucrats that are looking for ways in which to Protect and advance the genders that we've been talking about at another point. That's really important is that Everybody recognises that these big global challenges not only require International collaboration between governments and countries none of us can solve these problems without collaboration but increasingly We're talking about finding ways of doing it with the private sector and With philanthropists now, that's not a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow but there is a lot of effort going into that and certainly in the case of the Great Barrier Reef Some very significant effort to try to raise the funds that are needed That's making making good headway. I think that that will more and more internationally in our region Be a fact of life that we're working to raise funds from the private sector and to engage the community Crowdfunding and so on this is really working very effectively To address these problems because frankly the community is ahead of government in terms of environmental concern and environmental awareness and wanting action So what do you add to that from the health perspective in terms of funding? I think I think Penny captured it very well. Thank you. Okay. I think there are a couple of questions over here Hi, I'm Tejesh Khashab from the Coral Bell School at Ainyu My question is to all the panelists Do you think that climate change is actually turning into an existential crisis and as the Honourable Penny has mentioned that We've been doing a lot with respects to ocean protection and The health of the ocean, but we still lacking with like our Australian energy system is still dependent on fossil fuels As well as our carbon emissions have been rising last year according to a few reports So do you think that with America taking a backseat to the whole climate? Climate change crisis. Do you think Australia has a bigger role to play? At the same time, it's okay. Okay, Mark Beeson, AWI and UWA I Expected this panel to be slightly depressing and it's true to form that has been because the subject matter is as well I'm a professor of international politics and the most inspiring political figure in the world today It's clearly Greta Thunberg a 16 year old school girl Who's had more impact on some of these debates and most the conventional political leadership in the world has for a long Long time and that's a great thing in my view So my question is and Penny Winsley is directed to Penny Winsley in particular But you suggested that you're experiencing groundhog day in your feeling about what's going on or what's not going on in Actually addressing problems in the world today, and I'm not surprised at all I mean one if one of the key areas we're focusing on is Trying to manage the oceans which don't actually belong to anybody. We can all deny Responsibility for doing anything about them. In fact, and it's not surprising. We're not making a lot of progress My suggestion would be or my specific question would be why don't if we're serious about doing something about climate change Why don't we start where we live? Why don't we get our own house in order where we really can act if we choose to do so and we can close down The coal sector or we can move to do it rapidly. We can certainly Stop any new coal mining occurring in this country and that would be a very significant contribution to the entire Process of doing something serious about climate change because why would you expect okay? I think you've asked the question and I think that now we're into a Statement so can I pass it over to the panel to respond to both questions? Well, I I think that Your point is very understandable, and I'm addressing the second speaker but The fact is rail politic right now. It is in almost impossible to have a sensible discussion About climate policy in Australia the public debate Just is not healthy and I I think we have to be realistic and recognize that there are differences of view in the community that there is a fundamental approach by the government that says that we have to focus on Having a prosperous economy in order to be able to fund Find the resources to do the sort of things coming back to that question about resources so I don't think it's as simple as Just saying we will close down the power stations We saw that in the federal election where there were people standing up and being countered and putting very strong views about Adani and so on and equally there were a lot of people in the community had very strong views who Disagreed with that approach. So I don't think we're at the point in our own community To be able to have that Discussion and make those decisive Take those decisive steps. I think we've still got a fair way to go and I think that that's rail politic In the first the first question. I don't want the first question to be neglected. Oh I'm gonna answer the first question and of course the rest of the panel can can comment as well, but Do I think it's an existential crisis? Crisis to our existence I do and I I started reading IPCC reports From the very first round and I have followed the language That's been used in the IPCC reports and these reports are Absolutely conservative the the kinds of of negotiations that the People went through to get those words like Highly lightly Whoa, it's highly likely and actually in in conversation that means it's happening now We The globe Will survive These increases in carbon dioxide emissions but not in the kind of economic Social and political environment that we live in now So it's an existential threat in so far as it threatens our economy. It threatens our populations. It threatens our Health it will change things that will fundamentally Change the nature of society and the way that countries and populations interact with each other But I'm not a pessimist. I Actually think that there are things we can do and the health of the oceans The oceans are just so important in not only in terms of driving global climate, but also in terms of mitigating climate change We have seen significant contributions to Practical technology reforestation and things like that that are very useful in in Drawing carbon dioxide out of the atmosphere It's going to be a hard slog. We are going to have to take the fact That some countries may have to reduce their growth or maybe even hold their growth steady In order for the rest of Society and the world to catch up, but I am optimistic That it is possible to do this, but it takes political will and international craft I Just gotta I've got two or three comments and I'm I'll go I'll go on the optimistic side as well to sort of give you some hope I think we've got some amazing Sort of resources in front of us we've got I think an unbelievably aware skilled And Important asset right in front of it with us, which is young Australians that I think Now once they once they've got access to data Digital tools and they can integrate that with the real world. You're going to have a far better suite of abilities to Look for solutions and look for ways to start to work on some of the stuff We just did a data 61's a part of our organization's 500 data scientists We just did a big kind of open day in Sydney last week. I was energised and amazed at the young Scientists and young partners. We've got that are working on climate science analytics They're working on digital twins of cities think of the matrix think it don't think of the matrix anymore Think of it as being real where you can digitally look at, you know Greater Western Sydney and plan better So I'm kind of optimistic that you know my sons who are 15 and 17 who genuinely care about this as the most important issue And those 15 and 17 year olds will become 18 19 and 20 year olds They'll have a voice in the public system as well is they've got this umbo this unbelievable change going on right now with data tools We're trying to ingest a digital future for Siro to kind of figure out How do we take traditional science and integrate it with data? So digital science diplomacy is huge and really relevant for The our neighborhood imagine if you could do a digital twin You know what half a meter of C rise might look like in a country for example in seven years from now and Be able to act on that. It's I'm kind of optimistic. We're gonna actually figure some ways to sort of start to address this in a serious way, so I Think of a quick answer of that. I think my concern about using existential threat language is that it implies it's too late And it implies and that it's in the security realm and that you need then these Sort of Almost transcendental type responses and then that makes it allows it to see remote It allows it to seem like it's out of our grasp and I don't actually think it is I think what we've heard here is that actually there are very good Politics and policy around knowing what needs to be done in this space And I think it's actually about the threat language I think can sometimes be useful it can galvanize attention it can make us pay attention But I think we also need to focus then as well very much on there are solutions at hand and it's not something distant It's not something that's going to happen in the future. It's happening right now People are being affected by it and I think a little bit of my concern has been that up to this point There's been a sense that we will all be affected by it one day And we've been able to be quite those of us in more privileged positions have been able to feel remote from the people who are losing They're clean water because the sea water is starting to affect their filtration systems or losing their houses. That's not been our reality I think now there is people like gridder have done a really amazing and others You know, there's a number of others as well who've done amazing work and showing it is affecting us now And even if it's not we have a duty and there are Things that our politicians can and should be doing and just as a quick note I was reading I'm reading a biography of Angela Merkel at the moment And I think what's really interesting though, you may have different views about Germany's response to climate change I think it is one of those developed countries that have been a bit more progressive in this area And what's interesting is when you read the biography is that as a scientist She was reading and thinking about these reports She was thinking and crafting policy about how to respond to it Excited by the opportunities of what could be done And I think it's that sort of thing as well that we could demand a little bit more from our leadership as well If I could just add very very quickly first of all to note that Angela Merkel began as minister for environment And she was working on climate change a long time and if I've Projected gloom. I certainly didn't want to project doom all those points. I made about what we're good at we have got Real opportunities with Australian science Australian research and Australian technology to make a very strong contribution to finding solutions We're already out there. We're doing it And we can do more if there is greater political will and a greater clamor from the Community for for Australia as a whole to be doing this Thanks, Penny Over here two questions over here. Thank you. Hi. My name is Jessica Coot I am an international relations and security student with the Coral Bell school at the ANU and a new Colombo plan mobility scholar I'm currently conducting research on the relationship between gender identity and perceived threats of climate change Some of you may have seen the news recently About the fact that men are generally less likely to use things like reusable shopping bags and keep cups in the light Could you to a fear of being seen as too feminine? Um, I was wondering whether the panel believes that there's a gender divide in the way Australia perceives the threat of climate change Why this is the case and what we as a society can do to change this? I think the men should answer that I Think I must live in a sort of work in a Environment where that doesn't manifest itself. I think you do Yeah, I mean I might the one thing I'm pay a heck of a lot of attention to is my children and So I I don't I kind of don't see that but I Get up every day and think about what does the world what does Australia look like for you in 10 years time? Because I was lucky enough 25 years ago that we had Leaders that were thinking about that in different ways. So I kind of don't really but you know, you're asking maybe Maybe I am I'm just not sure but I mean now I do know I've got a I do know I've got a heck of a lot of recycling bags and like And I do have a keep cup But it's a fair question, but I just don't myself. I think it's kind of this is such a massive issue that it's just kind of transgressed and Yeah, I think we're just kind of all this together really, you know, I Went I've got family that live in Western New South Wales from Dubbo All around the Dubbo Gilgantra Gala gum bone Cunabara brand those kind of places lots of family and we have a we have a family reunion every Five years or so and the last gathering two years ago They're about 120 Relatives turned up over a couple of days and We all got into discussing what was happening on the properties out in West New South Wales and Climate change and all that kind of stuff and out of that group of Country people. I think there were only three That did not think that climate change was affecting the region that they lived in I think I Know what you're saying But I'm not quite I think it manifests itself in different parts of society look I'm I might have grown up on a farm but I'm no longer That's not the sort of Society that I I move in anymore. So I think maybe ask somebody down the pub I Would definitely say that the reaction to Greta Sunberg has definitely been a gendered backlash I think there's been deliberate attempts to try and because she has been an individual who has Who has sought to if you like challenge the stereotypes and the norms around what we think is 14 15 16 year old girl Would be doing and I definitely think she has experienced a significant amount of backlash I think there's also been a horrific thing said about her neuro atypical condition Which I think have been particularly toxic as well So I think maybe what's important is to separate out the how communities are feeling about this issue then from the way in which Gender and other types of abilities can be used to push against people when they actually don't have an answer to the issue And so I think that's what's happening here And I think you know I also think we actually more than gender at the moment I think we might actually also with wonderful present companies You know present we might also be talking to about different age sectors and different sectors of experience You know so there's a whole I actually think there's a whole types There's a whole set of types going on here. That's affecting the discussion Thanks. There was a another question over the back Paul Lucas the Queensland branch president of the a For a long time The essence of liberal democracies has been private property ownership and an aspect of that has been the right to own Intellectual property and exploit it and indeed charge people for it But isn't the problem now that if we're saying to countries like India who deserve a standard of living that if you want to generate power Then you know you're not going to do it the way that we don't want to do it Isn't that then incumbent upon us to say that we should be sharing technology and What I'm asking is what are we doing in the developed in the Western world and what thought leadership is Australia doing? to in fact require More sharing of technology so older and outgoing methods of generation aren't used into the future Perhaps for petty. Thanks Paul No, I think For us and like I mentioned at the start Is where we've seen a huge increase in collaboration globally when it comes to Research and development. So whether it's just cope whether it's that core co-publication You know like as I said in my remarks, you know, I've seen that even just the last five years two-thirds of our Scientists are collaborating and it's both ways, right? So there we're looking at issues that are relevant in the country that we're working in but also What can we learn to bring back to Australia as well? So it's definitely got a two-way element or two-way engagement to it In terms of you know the on the intellectual property side We and I'm only speaking for us as an organization You know most of the work that we've seen so far in terms of the growth of the intellectual property usage Has still been in the developed countries. It hasn't been in the developing But we do a range of work You know and one thing that's changed quite considerably for us as well And been there's been mention of de fat engagement. We've seen our engagement with de fat Particularly through the Indo-Pacific double in the last five years. So we've actually been going into countries I mean, I think a great example is the Oxford Innovation Program in Vietnam Where we have a three-year program that's been de fat led with three Australian universities To look at how we can work on agricultural productivity in Vietnam and how we can actually you know work with The local environment there to help them on the you know, basically the productivity some of the commercialization around agriculture So we we've seen a sort of a growth in it. I Conquer with your comments. I think it's a really it's it is kind of a critical element to keep kind of looking and Kind of challenging ourselves to be able to look to see what we can do more of that And you know, we've made that a strategic pillar of the organization But it's been global engagement, but also what's the national benefit as well. So you're trying to balance that Consistently, but I can care with your comments Paul thank you for that question Obviously the issue of IP is Is something that we need to be looking at always very very carefully And we have to have our eyes wide open When we are working towards greater collaboration with countries But certainly in in the area that I'm dealing with most at the moment in relation to marine science and coral reefs science We are being very open and sharing there is an enormous sense of collaboration among experts and scientists across a whole range of countries About the way in which we must share knowledge and information in order to be able to respond to this deterioration of coral reef ecosystems all around the world and There is a generosity in Publishing and making available articles, I think on the part of Australia that that isn't naive. I think it's It's appropriate in particular for assisting Working better and enhancing collaboration with countries in our region We've spent a lot of time today talking about China We are working very closely with China on these issues and we're particularly working with China on It the challenges it has in its coastal regions and sharing information in the fact is Australia has the longest Continuous monitoring system of coral reefs in the world We we are developing the most fantastic Technologies using artificial intelligence and the algorithms we were talking about earlier which are transforming our capabilities to To conduct research in the marine environment and and we are sharing that and I think that's a good thing Although as I say eyes wide open or so Thank You Zara Kimpton from the LA If we're looking at what other countries are doing France About 70% of its Electricity is provided by nuclear power now that has not been mentioned today What is the view of the panel about nuclear power? We have uranium It is clean. It does not produce greenhouse gases. Why is this not in the mix? I'll give it a go. I I think that Australian discussion is Building up on this issue. I think it will become talked about more There are people in the community who are absolutely opposed to it, but increasingly you are hearing Voices Suggesting that this requires greater airing and greater discussion I think it will become part of our not only our energy discussion, but our energy equation down the track No, I completely agree with Penny. I think it's going to be an increasingly Discussed issue It's out of my knowledge. I just watched a Nobel on the planes. I'm not the right person to ask Okay, look we've got time for one more quick question, okay Ian Lincoln, this is a slightly mischievous follow-up question France used to generate over 80% of its electricity by nuclear means it's now 70% and it's announced an intention to reduce 45 why would that be? We should ask the friendship That wasn't a question He should say he was being mischievous actually being mischievous is probably a very good way to end the panel So I'd really like to thank Sarah Nigel Penny and Tony for a great panel session And making us think somewhat outside the square of normal I don't think there is any such thing as normal International relations anymore. So thank you all very much. I'd like to thank the audience actually Okay, I'm while the panel steps down I just need to ask Graham Dobill our journalist fellow in the Australian Strategic Policy Unit to come up for his concluding remarks