 Do you have a generator and do you live in the federal capital territory? If you answered yes to both questions, you might have to pay for a gaseous emissions permit. That's because of the FCT. There's a new law that says that you have to pay an annual levy for using generators which emit harmful and hazardous substances into the environment. Let's talk more about that, Republic of S. Analyst, Mr. Mac Adebayo. Good morning, Mr. Adebayo. Thank you for joining us. Good morning, Lost in the Africa. All right, let's begin with this situation here. Based on the angle of what the people will feel, then we go over to analyze where the government is coming from. The government is supposed to provide power for people. But because of that inability, Nigerians go ahead to purchase, generate, and purchase fuel at a high cost to power those generating sets, and that's to make sure that they can sustain their businesses. But now the government is insisting that Nigerians will have to pay money for the harmful substances that have been released from those generating sets. From the angle of the people, how do you see this? Thank you so much for having me on this topic. Let me see this opportunity to thank Lost in the Africa for always engaging in people's interest, topics, and affairs. It shows you as a pro-people, pro-massive, pro-development TV station, and it's very rare to have that in this country. And one of the things that I've noticed about your station is the fact that you go out to seek out what is in the best interest of the masses of the people, and you bring it to the fore for public analysis and discussions and conversations. And I want to appreciate a positive Africa for that. I will not be surprised at all if few years down the line you become number one, not only in Nigeria but in Africa, put those to the management of your station. And on behalf of the people, I want to appreciate that. So coming back to your question, the situation we have found ourselves is quite pathetic because, you see, look, in this arm in Abu Dhabi, I suspect that to you now, now there's no light, there's no light here. If I should I put on my generator now, we will not be able to have this conversation as my other neighbors have put on their ass, you know, all around. If I put on my two to join the noise, the commission will not, I have to shut all the doors for you to hear. So now, Abu Dhabi, what the federal capital territory administration has not taken into consideration is the fact that this country is suffering from mass unemployment and when government cannot provide employment, people try to employ themselves, try to be their own bosses to build, you know, small, intermediate, medium businesses. Now, you suddenly come with this idea of taxing, you know, the users of generators in the capital territory. Now, it is not, it doesn't go well for government to make money off the people. What government needs to do is to provide the neighboring environment for businesses and citizens to drive there, you know, it can now tax them, you understand. So you don't tax them in advance. A situation where the government has failed since independence to provide adequate electricity for the people and people have said, okay, let us provide electricity for ourselves, provide water for ourselves, you know, by drilling borehole assumptions here. So you now say, now you want to tax them for, you know, harmful, gaseous emissions. What an irony. What an irony. I think the government should be paying the citizens for providing power for themselves. I think the government should be paying taxes to the citizens for providing power for ourselves. Now, I went to replace yesterday in my term, I went to a business center to do some kind of documentation, rest of that. In that, like 20 by 20 office, we are, I saw a minimum of 80 young people who are working on computers doing for the copying, doing spara binding, doing all manner of things there. That is providing employment. That person in her own little way, in her own little corner, is providing employment for a minimum of 8 to 10 young Nigerians. Now, she has to pay taxes. Now she will buy fuel for the generator. She has to pay for security. She has to pay for the rent. She has to pay salaries for these young people. Suddenly you come out with a taxi sign where you are not providing power. And, you know, when you are running a business center, you need power 247. Now, you are not going to put a body on this woman who is struggling to make a living. And through that, let others make a living. The unemployment rate in Nigeria is staggering, as a matter of fact, it is scandalous. And I think it's ungodly, and I think it's unfair, and I think it's unjust for the government rather than relieve the pains of the people to now continue to over-body the people with over-taxation. This is over-taxation. There has been certain conversations that I have seen in the past with regards to taxation. So I want to ask, do Nigerians have a problem paying taxes or are there certain taxes that are just outrageous and inconsiderate on the plight of the people? Well, legal states, legal states is the best example of demonstrating how Nigerians are prepared to pay taxes. Legal states is the best example. We pay taxes on all manner of things, you know. Look at how much the legal states alone generate from internal, legal states have just internally generated revenue profiling the country today, and it is via the people. The people pay, the people pay taxes, but they have issues, there are two issues that they have. I'll tell you about multiple taxation. Taxes, one thing, another thing is that when people pay taxes and they do not see return on the investment of the taxes, they are paying. We are, you still have terrible rules, you have terrible state of education, terrible state of our health facilities, so people begin to query and question what are we paying taxes for? And it is a legitimate query, it is a legitimate question. And I think it is high time for government to come up with, you know, effective management of resources in terms of, you know, providing adequate services for taxes being made of the people. We pay all manner of, you know, this issue of paying taxes on gas emissions of generators is so ridiculous. It is just as ridiculous the same way as the police and FECU special officers will stop you on the road and be asking for your roadwardness certificate on roads that are absolutely fickle and muddy. So it's quite, you know, it doesn't sound straight to you that on Nigerian roads, somebody is asking you for roadwardness certificate on these terrible roads. So now one of the critical questions we must ask ourselves, and which the federal capital territory administration is yet to be able to provide answers for, is that these taxes you are going to collect, what are you going to use them for? In what ways are you going to absorb the harmful gas emissions? Are you going to clean the environment? What are you going to do with it? So they have not been able, because they went around, you know, distributing all these letters all over the place, you know. So they brought it here too, and I wasn't around, I would have had the same questions, what are you going to do? Okay, assuming without considering that this tax is necessary, what are you going to do with the tax you are collecting? You have to clean the environment, do you have the technology you have the wherewithal, how are you going to do it, when are you going to do it? So it doesn't, it doesn't, and then they cannot provide the answers up to now. But who should these questions be directed to? Because, you know, that's, I think it's one of the challenges that Nigerian people have, you know, they might complain, you know, about one thing or the other, but they're not sure who to direct these questions to. Should it be the, you know, National Assembly, you know, is there, you know, a permanent secretary, is there an office that these consent should be, or these questions should be asked? Because you're not going to direct it to the, you know, officials who bring those letters to you. I know, but, you know, the federal capital, you know, administration, the federal capital, that is distributing these letters asking for these taxes that is responsible for the collection of these taxes should be able to provide the answers. The only way you can bring in the National Assembly, because the FCT does not have its own assembly, it is the National Assembly that is responsible for this place. So you only, if you want an intervention, I think the best way place to go is to go to the, to the National Assembly and present a petition to the National Assembly, because this thing is going to kill small, intermediate and medium businesses. And that is my major concern. I just gave you an example of a small business where I went to do some paperwork yesterday. I think minimum of 10 young people, I saw them they are working, doing what all or two things, you know, to make a living. For that, you know, same woman that is trying to make a living by giving people other opportunities for a country that is overwhelmingly burdened by youth unemployment, you know, should the challenge here or be imposing taxes on Nigerian businesses who are providing power for themselves or about governments providing power for the people? It is about government providing power for the people. So why is the government not focusing on what it should do instead of, you know, seeming to go after people who are providing that for themselves? Like they say, if you ask me now, who are you going to ask? So it is, it is the, that is what the government is supposed to be doing, but it's not doing it. It is like punishing the people for the failures of governance in this country. These taxes, these kind of tax is like punishing the people for the failures of governance. It is like this, you know, they are discouraging creativity, they are discouraging industry, they are discouraging, you know, a lot of young people all over this place are showing and making efforts, not all, not all Nigerian youths are, certainly the Nigerian youth is lazy to the best of my experience and knowledge, and what I've seen, what I've seen, these guys work so hard, if you know, if you know the number of, the number of CVs that I have now, even though I'm not a politician, I'm a political activist, even though I'm not in government, I'm half of a 500, and these are qualified graduates of Nigeria. They are asking for, just yesterday, very painful, very painful, young ladies just call me and say, sir, look, get me anything, even to be a cleaner. I almost shed tears. I was like, whoa, no, no, no, no. I can, you have 21 and say you are looking for a cleaner's job. So it has come to that, a lazy youth does not do that. So when you are now breaking taxes, is that all? We should learn from Rwanda now. Learn from Rwanda. A country that does came from an atrocious, terrible civil war that cost almost two million lives. One million lives were lost in Rwanda within four months. Now, they are coming out as one of the best business-friendly countries in Africa, and that is why it is developing. Look at people, businesses that are moving to Rwanda, and people are focusing on Ghana. Now, go and research as what is happening in Rwanda. A country that went through such a terrible, a terrible situation of brochures. Now, they are coming out. Now, they are the cleanest, they are the cleanest country in Africa. They are moving very fast in terms of social interaction, social integration. They are not solving from it religious antipathy that you are solving in this country. They have learned from their past, they have learned from their mistakes. We should go to Rwanda now. You can see that businesses, you know, you can see that international, international businesses are moving into Rwanda because of the stability, because of the leadership, because of the creativity, because of the patriotic engagement of the citizens, but the leadership of the country to find solutions to their issues. And that's why they are progressing. There is lack, you see, what we, the decision we have now is that when you have a leadership that's devoid our breadth of thinking, they impose burden on the people rather than suffering their burden. And that's why I was going to, I was going to bring, that's what I was going to bring in next, you know, the thinking, you know, because somebody sat in his office and thought about, you know, ways that they can either generate more money from the businesses in Abuja, how the FCTA can generate more money and add to its own contribution to the IGR or something. So, so where do you think this idea came up from, you know, that totally ignored the fact that these people are using generators because the government has failed to provide electricity? Who, who, you know, would you say must have thought about this very brilliant idea to tax business owners in Abuja for gaseous emissions? Mr. Yeah, well, part of your question that I was a break, some kind of, if you can hear me now, can you hear me clearly? Yes, it's coming back now. Yeah, I was asking, you know, about the thinking, you know, where do these ideas come from? Who sat in a meeting or in his office and thought it would be great to tax business owners in Abuja for gaseous emissions, completely ignoring the fact that government had failed to provide electricity? And when did Nigeria become so concerned about gaseous emissions and climate change? Look, where did somebody sat down in his office and was thinking of how, it is a death, it is a process of desperation. It is like our fire brigade approach into issues of governance here because the thing is that we are going to close down businesses rather than calling businesses to expand because somebody will say, okay, for providing electricity for myself, we are going to steep the government. Look, we are paying, we are paying the government for this, the electric electricity they are bringing. We are bringing. Now, it is not, it is not consistent. It is not current. Then what do you do? You go and buy a generator, and then you buy the fuel, the generator will break down, you service it. All that is taking, taking away from your capital, taking away from your businesses. Now the government now comes up for, even for providing electricity for yourself, you have to pay that for a service that government has failed to provide for the people. Now you have to pay for providing services for yourself. Let me tell you, thinking has not gone into that, into that decision. No thinking has gone into that. It is a thoughtless and unfair policy. That policy, this policy is not good for, and if the government, if the government really believes that it's supposed to be for the well-being and welfare of the people, it's not supposed to be this type of a policy at this time because the question remains that if you are not providing for myself and you want to punish me for providing for myself, how does that, how does that even, how does that even sound to people who are making these policies? And before you know it now, they begin to send in secret agencies to enforce the payment of these taxes. So just talking about enforcement, Mr. Adebayo, the Director of Public Health, HOD, Environment, AMCA, Ahmed Aruna, in the statement that he signed yesterday, he said that, you know, the people who violate this order, organizations and businesses who use per-generating set and fail to comply by paying the levy would be punished and arrested. Wow. How stringent do you think this is? This is because we have, we operate an extremely punitive system of governance in this country. It is always, every time the government finds new ways to overbun the people, to punish the people, as if we are not being punished enough. So because, look at the threat, look at the threat. You will know that these guys are in government not because of the people. They just want to snuff life out of everybody, out of all businesses, out of the masses, and it is unfair, it is unjust. And I find it difficult to even believe that these people really think that the government is about the people. I don't think they think so, that government is simply about the people, that what you call government is about organizing society, organizing people, and providing so-called for the challenges of the people. I don't think the people we have in government actually think about that. It's quite unfortunate because, you see, new businesses will be discouraged. They will not be able to even open again. You understand me? Because if you want to succeed in any business in this country, probably after getting a space, the next thing is for you, even before you get your furnitures to go, to look for generators. You need a generator because, so that is why I do not see any, no matter how small, the literature that they are selling, to Sashi Water, they need a generator to make it code. So every little business, every medium, scale business needs a generator. Every large scale business needs a generator. So if you say that you are going to be taxing them, for that alone, we may lose out to 40% of new business initiatives that are about to come in. So in that light, let's take a look at the ease of doing business ranking. 190 countries were assessed. At the last count, Nigeria ranked 141. But it seemed that Nigeria moved up a couple of spaces up. We're now 131 out of 119 countries ease of doing businesses. We celebrated that. There was reports celebrating that Nigeria has moved up, meaning that, well, very good when it comes to doing business in Africa or second only after Togo. But now that the FCT is introducing this, how do you think this might affect our ease of doing business ranking? And is it likely for other states to begin to adopt this gaseous emissions levy? That is my fear. Some of the states who are also not thinking well will follow suit. That is my fear. They are going to wait maybe for a few months after when they see the limitation, how it goes, and then they will start bringing all these things on board. That is my fear. And it's not going to go away for all of us. It will increase the insecurity. There is a connecting link between insecurity and poverty and unemployment. And where a small business is employing ten youths and now brings taxes, and the business starts like five of them or four of them, you are increasing the unemployment rate. By that, you are increasing insecurity. And you are increasing what you call cybercrime. Because some of these youths are very good on the use of computers and the rest of that. If you close down where they are working, they also join the ongoing army of Yau Yau Boys. We need to not go away for us. Well, not necessarily also having to fire staff. It also might mean increasing the cost of goods and services in order to meet up with these bits of taxation here and there. Or cut down salaries. Yeah, all that. But I also want you to speak on how this can be challenged legally, or maybe also through civil society organizations or the like. So, you know, is there bodies that should be able to speak on behalf of business owners across the country? And in what ways would you advise that this can be challenged? Can you hear me? The thing is that I think at this point in time, the civil society organizations here in Abu Dhabi need to rise up. And I am going to take up the challenge by reaching out to some of my colleagues that we first need to write to the National Assembly and write to the federal capital territory administration. And then of course you have to carry people along. There has to be a kind of responsible mass action to stop this. This must not be allowed to fly. You are going to kill businesses. You are going to kill initiatives. You are going to kill. You are going to destroy the impetus of the people to go into businesses. Don't do that. Don't do that. That's the first mission. What we need to do is to find a way to stop the emissions entirely and by generating enough power, by distributing enough power, by supplying enough power. Generation, distribution, supply. That is what we need to do to stop gas emissions. You do not keep businesses to stop gas emissions. What you do is to increase your capacity to generate, your capacity to distribute, your capacity to supply. The owner is a government to find a solution, not by overboding the people with these taxes. These taxes are not going to stop gas emissions. They are not going to stop it. They are going to, they are going to kill businesses. And that is unfortunate. Very unfortunate. You cannot find your responsibility of governance to the people by punishing the people for your failures. It is this policy of taxation on generators, it is punishing the people for the failures of government. So Mr. Adebayo, yes, we understand that these levies would harm small businesses in Nigeria that are trying to survive. In other developed countries, governments is actually giving stipends and stimulus packages for businesses to make sure that they recover from the effects of the pandemic. But the opposite seems to be the case here. Yes, we do understand that fact. But also to bring balance to the story, to mention that the emissions in generators are actually harmful to the human body. A report here shows that 1,500 deaths per year in Nigeria from inhaling generators smoke. Also that when you inhale the smoke from generators, you are 70% likely to contract lung cancer. And it also causes hearing impairment in about two to three users. So yes, these factors all exist. The fact that it hurts in businesses when you impose these levies. And also the other side that generators are harmful to human health in terms of cancer, the adherent and all of that. But can we drive from the points that the government does need to increase its capacity to generate and transmit electricity in Nigeria? I think that should be where we drive this conversation towards, isn't it? That is the solution. That is partnership. So this is a problem that you have outlined. Everybody knows that generator emissions, vehicle emissions, even aeroplane emissions, anything that brings out this type of gases, it's not good for human health. It's not even good for the environment. It's not good for the environment. It is an enemy of the environment. We all know that. But how have governments in the world have been dealing with this issue? It is for them to, number one, increase their capacity to generate and supply electricity. Or people are going into what you call a grid revolution or providing electricity through natural means. You understand. Through natural means, solar power, solar energy. Cleaner energy basically. Alternative sources of energy. That is what the policies should be. That is where we should be going. Not that we will now say we want to sort of discourage you from using generator so that if you tax them, I mean, what are they driving at? That if you tax them, they will stop using generator? No. I mean, you are just trying to keep businesses. I've told you that it didn't go through deep thought processes. They just came up. Somebody just woke up and said, look, we need money. We need to make money. Let us, you know, punish this to a good amount. So let us tell them that because there is no household no matter how small. You know, people said there is something they call a better past my neighbor. Yeah. 2.7 million generating sets. Yes. Is there any information on what the figures for these levies are? Up to now, they have not said. In fact, they were asked, they didn't say. So I assume, I suspect it is going to be, it is just going to be indiscriminate. It's going to be indiscriminate. It's probably going to be. Depending on the size of your generator set. Maybe depending on the size of your generator set or the size of your house. Maybe. No, maybe. Nobody has outlined how they are going to go about it. If you bring any of those guys on TV and you are asking them these questions, you will see that they are also as confused as everybody. Because the only thing that they are looking at is how to make the money. Not all these questions. They don't really bother themselves about the critical questions that affect the critical mass. They don't bother themselves about all those. All right. Mark Adebayo. And we must change the idea. We must change this practice of punishing Nigerians for the failure of governance. Absolutely. Mark Adebayo, thank you very much for your time this morning. Thank you for always being there for the people. God bless your TV station and all of you over there. Thanks for speaking with us. We'll take a short break. And of course he's raised very, very strong points. And I would have been really excited if I could speak with any of the FCT officials. Just like these same questions. What are these, the taxation is going to be used for. And you mentioned lung cancer because of. Herring impairment as well. Debt. Yes. So when you collect the tax, does it reduce the amount of people who. Do you use the tax to pay compensation for, you know. Bye. Anyway, we'll be back. We'll take a short break and we'll be back here on the breakfast. Stay with us.