 Hello, and welcome to Meta25 Talks, where activists and organizers from the N25's political parties, Meta25 Greece, Meta25 Germany, and Meta25 Italy, get together to discuss some of the most urgent issues affecting the lives of people in each of those countries, and what we can do to tackle them. Today we talk about housing. Across Europe, the cost of housing has risen sharply in recent years, with many people struggling to find affordable and secure accommodation. This has led to a growing crisis with more and more people facing the prospect of homelessness or precarious living conditions. We'll be exploring the root causes of this crisis, as well as examining both the unique and the common challenges facing Greece, Germany, and Italy. And we'll see what Meta25 can do to help improve the lives of people across all those countries. Today, we're joined by Johannes Ferre from Meta25 Germany, Federico Dolce from Meta25 Italy, and Eric Edmund from Meta25 Greece. Guys, welcome. We'll start with you, I think, Johannes. Can you give us a bit of an overview of how the housing crisis, if there is one, how it's looking in Germany at the moment, and what Meta25 has been up to on this issue? Thanks, Lukas. I think, yeah, the housing crisis definitely exists here in Germany, and especially in the bigger cities, of course, as I guess everywhere, the problem is bigger. I live in Berlin, especially in Munich, Berlin, Hamburg, the bigger cities, and then going down to the smaller scale, the problem is huge. Lots of people are on the search for a house. I've recently done this myself here in Berlin, and I can tell you that it's not fun. I'm running behind flats since you're one of many, and there's the few that have the flats, and they put high prices on them because they want to make a profit. That's kind of the basic situation, and the problem is, of course, that it gets worse and worse. That's why the people get more desperate all the time as well. I actually looked up one data which also said that the price of the ground floor in Germany went up from around 8 euros and was 60 per square meter to about 200 euros per square meter today. I'm not going to boil you with my facts, but this is just what the average price has been, and of course, that's the average price for the whole country. That's not saying how much it is actually in the big cities. The problem is big. Also, from my personal experience, I've lived in the last flats that I've inhabited with different people together here in Berlin. I've lived in a company that was owned by a Danish oligarch, and that was making money of it. I've lived in a flat of an Austrian company from the stock market. This is international money going into the city and trying to make as much profit from people that need a house as they can. Maybe one thing to actually add is that in Germany, it's particularly high that people are renting, and not only. This is kind of like a tradition from the historical point of view. This is why many people in Germany are not owning a house, and I actually that's very dependent on the price of the rent. Yeah, Germany does have one of the lower rates of homeownership among the major countries in Europe, which I think is a bit higher in Italy, for instance. But I think in Italy, we're seeing a lot of the same issues for people who are renting right now. Yeah, exactly. Ownership rates doesn't really solve the crisis by itself, because what we are experiencing here in Italy is that basically a generation was able to invest in a building house, buying their first house, and maybe the second one and the third one, because we got low interest rates or because we got in the past very low prices. Now everything's changed, now paying a mortgage or paying a rent takes up to two-thirds of your salary, and therefore we got an entire generation and an entire class of people that can no longer afford it, basically, and what used to be perceived as a relative and small problem is now becoming a huge crisis because it's one of the most physical tools that the oligarchs are putting in place to spread the inequality. Here in Italy, we always had a program for public housing that has always been very low-funded and has always been way below the European average. We got just 3.5 percent of the total houses that are actually into the program of public housing. They are old, they are malfunctioning, they are very low-efficient from a logical point of view and consumption point of view. That actually means that the poor people in needs that actually are in public housing pay way higher bills for electricity and heating, and we are facing, due to more excessive lows and the economic crisis, we are on the verge of an incredible surge in foreclosures, and we're talking about like 150,000 people, families actually, that are facing eviction in the four coming months. This is a social bond we want to export. Even though we do have an higher ownership rate, that doesn't mean that we are not experiencing an incredible raise in terms of rent and house prices in the bigger cities. We are suffering heavily gerrymandering in the bigger cities, and we are having a heavily experiencing the Airbnb and the short rent phenomena as a certified by rental agency as well. This is not just a complaint from unions or from activists. This is the certified problem that we are facing right now in the country. Eric, I think kind of unique among us here, I mean like Johannes mentioned, he had to move recently, but that was within Berlin where he already lived, but you actually moved to Greece from a different country, right? What did that teach you first hand about the current state of housing in Greece? Yeah, I mean, it's true what you said. I recently had to move back to Greece in preparation for the elections that we've got on the 21st of May now, and I found myself in the funny situation of trying to find a place to stay in my hometown of Athens, and normally you would expect that it's Europeans talking to Greeks to find a place to stay, but in this case it was I, a Greek, speaking to other Europeans to try to find a place to stay. Six or seven out of ten of the people that I was talking to in order to rent a place in Athens were from other European countries. It was Dutch, Austrians, French. It was very rare that I would have to speak to somebody who's from here, and that is a sort of a side effect of the broader issue, which is the fact that since the economic crisis started in 2008, which hasn't stopped since for over a decade here, Greece has been one big fire sale. The entire country has been chopped up and sold off, whether it's to multinationals or small-scale investors, be it your friendly elderly couple from Austria who had some money lying around and bought some property in Greece, or whether it's some big real estate agents from foreign nations that have been investing in the country makes no difference. The actual result for the local population is gentrification. It's impossible rents. It's the fact that entire neighborhoods are being transformed into tourist destinations without any of the basic services that you would expect from your neighborhood, like a supermarket or a dry cleaners or a bakery, but instead you've got cinemas and bars and restaurants. That's just driving people away from historical neighborhoods where people have lived and to the outskirts, both because the neighborhoods aren't liveable, but also because the prices are impossible. There's one of the first things that you notice, and the other is the prices themselves. In Greece, the minimum wage is under 800 euros, that they've raised it now to something like 780 euros per month, but you're still looking at rents upwards of 500 or 600 euros if you want to stay in the city. In general, you see the fact that for the last few years we've had a complete lack of social policy in Greece, something that was decided by the droik of lenders to completely scrap any kind of social policy, whether it's social housing, rent caps or whatever else have you. The result is catastrophic for the local population, and I had to experience that first hand myself when I moved here last month. One of the things that struck me the most about Greece is that 75% of the population who rents, so the percentage of tenants, spent more than 40% of the income on rent, which is just a staggering proportion of people, one of the highest rate, if not the highest rate in Europe. But to stay with you for a second Eric, because obviously we're basically on the eve of elections over there in Greece, in which we are running naturally as Meta25, been in parliament for four years now. What have been the proposals and are currently the proposals of Meta25 for housing, how do we solve this essentially? There's a number of things that you can do. First of all, what you mentioned, 75% of people who pay rent pay something like 40% of their income. Those are the people who are actually renting. A huge part, especially of young people, don't live independently. They live with their parents. In fact, they think the average age of people moving out of their family homes has now increased something like 35 years old, which is incredibly high even by the standards of the Greek patriarchal system, where people anyway would have moved out later compared to their northern Western European counterparts. But it's simply because people can't afford to do so. My brother, for example, is one of those people. What you can do though, in order to combat what's going on, you need to break a few eggs, because it's not that governments are unaware of what is happening. It's not that this is a policy mistake. It is the fact that they maintain the current policies because they blindly serve certain political and economic interests, namely those of foreign investors who buy up property in the country. That is essentially the result of the Troika policies of the memoranda of the past few years, which our governments have bent the need to. That's the line that Brussels is pushing. It's the local oligarchs, the Greek big wigs, who are also similarly speculating and buying up huge pieces of property, not just houses. For example, we have the old Athens airport in an area called Eleonico, the biggest piece of land owned by the state anywhere in the country. That was recently sold to a Greek oligarch, Latsis, who was a shipholder for peanuts, because supposedly he was going to invest in it and create all sorts of investment opportunities for the nation, jobs and what have you, but instead what he's done is cut it up and sold plots of land to rich foreign oligarchs from Saudi Arabia, Russia and the rest of it, who are then going to use them to build luxury apartments. This is what you're seeing everywhere in Europe. It's not a Greek phenomenon. It's this kind of 1% money exchange that is completely destroying a policy and housing policy. Let me come to the solutions. First of all, what you need to do is a return of social housing policy. Instead of putting this idea of investment at any cost and zeros instead of seeing where those zeros end up, that's the first thing that needs to change. You need policy whereby the housing investment that is being done results in social housing, which then returns back to the people. You need major investment in retrofitting. Current apartments here in Athens to make them sustainable both in terms of the green transition, but also energy efficiency and the rest of it, which has both social and environmental effects. You need to cap the amount of apartments that are allowed to be put up for rent through platforms like Airbnb, which are gentrifying entire neighborhoods, and you need a limit on foreign investment in real estate and housing. Those are all things that are imminently doable, but what needs to happen in order to implement these policies is to come into conflict with the big interests that Brussels and our current governments are supporting. Yeah, I think this first point that you mentioned is a very silent one. I think everybody agrees that we need more housing, but if you just unleash private investment like that, then what you're going to get is luxury condos. It's not going to be social affordable housing because that's where the money is at. That's how we squeeze the most profits out of a large investment, like building an apartment building or something like that. Johannes and Fede, what eggs are Merit25 in Germany and Italy looking to break to sort this out? To start with you, Johannes, because it's only in Greece that we're in the eve of elections, but also in Germany, Merit25 is about to run in its first elections ever at the state level in Bremen. Yeah, exactly. Bremen, beautiful city on the north coast of Germany for those who don't know it. Maybe worth a visit in the next weeks to help us campaign. In Bremen, that is now the obvious example, but similar things exist in general in Germany. There's two big housing companies that I want to take as an example. There's first Bonovian, which is an international, a European company where you already see as with the examples I mentioned before, you cannot tackle this problem only on the national level because the companies are international companies. This is the biggest German housing companies. They own over half a million flats and they are a stock market company that tries to make as much money as they can. They are owned by lots of people from around the world and capital, hedge funds, and so on. BlackRock, of course, has quite some share. Also, the Norwegian state fund has quite some share. So, Norwegian state fund making money from German rents to enhance the pension fund there is also a pretty crazy idea to invest this way to make profit. But back to Bremen, this is one of the big companies there, so international companies. Our solution is to go to the core of the problem. The core of the problem is the ownership. Of course, we also support rent caps, more taxes on these kinds of companies on an international level with our international approach. But very important is also to look at who's owning what and how are they running things. So, I think our idea is to actually go head-on with these kinds of companies and put expropriate them, expropriate the flats that are in these kind of private hands that only try to squeeze money out of it to actually put it in public ownership where there's no motive for profit, but just the motives for making good living conditions for people, affordable, and very important also in nowadays times to try to renovate in a way that it's actually run without destroying the climate. So, we have warm houses in winter in Germany without burning fossil fuels. And for that, it's also really important to understand what the difference between us and the current political centrist parties who are also governing in Bremen is, because the other big company that is having a lot of flats in Bremen is called Gibuba and is owned by 75% by the state of Bremen. And it is still run to make profit. So, state owned doesn't really mean that it's necessarily a social policy down there. I guess it's a little bit better than the international hedge fund. But in this example, you can see in the recently saw an interview with the mayor of Bremen defending this and saying, yeah, you need to make a little bit of profit at least. And I think for us, it's very clear with Mayor 25s that we want to put an end to that. Yeah, that's where you get when you when you self impose a debt break on just about everything, right? Which is a common feature of German politics, not only at the federal level, but also on the state levels. Even the public goods have to turn a profit at the end of the day. Fadde, same question to you and Mayor 25 in Italy. Yeah, we're looking at a slightly more dreadful situation. So first thing we're trying to do is to fight locally to stop evictions, like the last minute, the tragedy, avoiding thing, because what we're facing is something extremely dangerous, like we're talking about hundreds of thousands of families out on the streets. And more, many of them will actually lose their work if they cannot live within the city. So usually, complex problem requires complex solutions. And I think housing, as basic as it is, because it's a bad need, is one of the most complex problems that we might face because it involves finance, high level finance, and basic need, and the very rest of our society when they are homeless. And that view, one of our approach, of course, will be try to implement a change of the laws that actually makes extremely appealable and to invest into becoming landlords as a way to diversify a near or high income. And because this is one of our major issue, the complete inequalities among a certain percentage of people that actually can afford two or three houses, can afford to leave them empty. We do have up to 7% of our houses completely ineptated and empty because it's more convenient for the owners to live in that state. And we are facing huge difficulties with something that is a city-level policy, the house managing and the public housing managing, but also the regulation on plans for the city development. Because even the most progressive mayors are putting in place strong gentrifying policies because it actually helps in terms of money for them, in terms of taxes. And they are thirsty for funds because the general, the state level government completely cut all the funds to the municipalities. So they are willing to manage the cities with no planning, no perspective, and just turned to the market to have some little money in order to maintain the general expenses. We need planning. We need planning in a larger scale. We cannot leave this to the cities. We need a broader vision and a broader action because this is one of our, is becoming one of our main concern for the future. I just wanted to jump in quickly to add something because Fede touched on evictions which are kind of, you know, and homelessness, of course, which are kind of these very great and horrible examples of our, you know, the kind of general, you know, thought in which mainstream politics is done today. Because I think for us, and I think I can speak for everyone here, is housing is just a human right, right? You don't grow someone on the streets and also you don't let someone live on the streets. This should be obvious, I think, for, you know, every society. And I think it is for many people. Many people would support this, but unfortunately, the governing politics in this day and age doesn't. So that's why we are here and that's why we want to change that to just say, you know, every housing first, every, you know, homeless person has the right to have a house. And as Fede also said, and I think that's the same in Germany as many empty houses where people bought a house and then they're just waiting for it, you know, to raise and price because they can also sell it. And with a higher profit, there's no one living there. Or they wait for people to actually go out to be able to renovate the whole house and then sell it at a higher price. And this just needs to be especially with housing, which is something that is, you know, scarce. And we cannot run it on a profit model. And we just needed to run it on a very social reasonable model of people coming together and deciding how they want to live and who does what and how how we are going to build our houses and do our architecture so that there's space for everyone. Sorry, if I can roll Yes, Fede, go. It's not really a scarce good. It's a rare good. Like we're not growing in numbers that day. We just have a huge disproportion of distribution. Like this is something that we are managing so bad because we gave up. And as you said, it's one of our basic needs. And together with jobs, it's one of the most ranking failures that the market gave us in the past 20 to 30 years. Like the whole society in the very fundamental is crumbling down because we just gave up trying to manage it and control it and planning for ourselves. So that's just it. Fender really touched on my raw nerve here with these evictions. It's a very good point. We also it's a huge issue here in Greece. And it's such an excellent example of how the entire system is not designed rationally. It's not designed in order to serve people's needs the way people who promote the market sort of as a solution to everything propagate, but instead in order to drive profits. And it doesn't matter how those profits are distributed. If they end up in the pockets of three people and result in the suffering of the vast majority of society, then so be it. It doesn't matter. Profit is king. And this is what you're seeing because here with the economic crisis in Greece, we obviously ended up having a huge amount of unserviceable debt. When people lost their jobs, their sources of income, everything just collapsed. And people had mortgages that they could no longer service. What happened was that these the banks who held those loans, those mortgages ended up selling them to investment funds from the United States from Delaware, from Cayman Islands, from wherever have you from Jersey, for a fraction of the amount owed. So if somebody had a, let's say, 300,000 euro mortgage, the bank would take that loan. It doesn't matter how much money they would have gotten back from that person. They might have gotten half the money or even 70% of the money back. They would take that loan and sell it on to one of these funds for a tiny fraction, sometimes 10% of the amount of the loan. So 30,000 euros. So the banks would get 30,000 euros. They would have ended up losing a huge amount as a result. And then those funds who bought it for 30,000 euros would be eligible to get all 300,000 back from the people that still owed that money. So it's a huge profit margin that these funds get instead of offering the people who have those loans the same right. So if that bank is selling that loan for 10% of the price, why doesn't the person who has that loan have the same right to pay it off if an investment fund from Delaware can get that debt for 30,000 euros? Why shouldn't a citizen? That would make sense. But we're not running our societies. We're not running our democracies for the interests of citizens. We're running it for the interests of investment bankers. That's what we're doing. And it's absolutely appalling. These kinds of things that we need to be pushing out into the social, into the common discussion, into society, because people are just not aware. We're still running off this illusion that our governments are at the end of the day through the market, through capitalism, still serving our interests. But they're not. We're very, very far away from that kind of capitalism with the social face. That train's led the station years ago. And what is happening is the absolute plundering of public ownership and of people's investments, of people's property everywhere in Europe and essentially everywhere in the world. What scares me the most, Eric, to be honest, from what you said, which is a horrible thing to have to hear to know that it's happening, is that I think it's especially for younger people, it might not even sound that strange to them because we don't really know, and I say we because we're all relatively younger, youngish here. We don't know anything else. We were born at a time, which was really the first time ever in human history, in which housing is treated as anything else that you might trade in the stock market. We've dissociated ourselves from the concept of housing being a public good so much, because again, we don't know anything else, that it's hard to reclaim it, but it's a fundamental thing that we have to do because for the simple fact that it is a public good, it is essential, it is as essential as healthcare, as education and so on and so forth. But the question that I wanted to turn to now is we're talking a lot about rampant speculation and foreign companies and investment funds coming into housing markets, buying up a bunch of the stock and then squeezing every ounce of profit there is to to square off it, to squeeze off of it, and then in a lot of cases then just selling that on to a different foreign investment fund at a massive profit for them to go into the same thing. And this is happening in Greece, this is happening in Germany, this is happening in Italy, so it's an European trend is what I'm trying to say. And how do we how do we tackle this? Because one of the unique things of course about Meta25 and about Kim25 is that we don't care about borders, we care as much about borders as those investments funds and corporations do, which is I think, and I'm sure you'd agree with me, something that's essential in order to fight back here. So the question now is how do we fight back? What are some of the measures that needs that really require solutions at the transnational level? So if you think about the European Union, for example, maybe EU policy, but also just maybe bilateral cooperation amongst the national governments in order to solve them. I don't know who wants to go first in tackling this. I can, if the other two guys don't mind, I can start. There's a couple of things here. First of all, the late David Graeber used to always say, everything can be different. And he was a sociologist. What he knew is that human society has gone through a multitude of phases and a multitude of sort of common hysterias and common legends and myths that we tell ourselves about how the world is and how it's ordained to be and how those things can ever change and at the risk of maybe using too many quotes. There's another one I really like by Ursula Le Guin who wrote in one of her books that we live at the age of capitalism and its power seems inescapable but so too once seemed the divine power of kings. So the biggest fight that we have ahead of us and that is a common fight everywhere in the world, let alone Europe and the commonality that we have through the European Union is to find this idea that nothing can change, that this is the system we've got and it's got winners and it's got losers but it's the best we've got so we might as well just you know bend the knee to it and get on with it and make the best of it that we can. What we are seeing more and more especially with the environmental crisis but in general you know you see society at a boiling point. I think France is an excellent example of this right now is that we're getting to this kind of crossroad where it's becoming increasingly obvious that this system is actually not working at all, it's not that you know it's not great but at least it's working. It doesn't even work, it doesn't even do the bare minimum whether it's because of the environment or because socially it's let us completely at the mercy of the rich and powerful but also we're coming to that point where people are willing to consider the fact that things could be very different and it's the only thing stopping us from making them incredibly different is us and how we react to where we're at. This idea of a Europe that is prospering that is well off and all it needs to do is tweak its current policy is dying as a narrative and that is one of the main reasons why the far right is doing as well as it is in Europe and that's a open space for also the left to develop into instead of doing what the social democrats have been doing across the continent which is to double down to turn over more conservative and to try and preserve a system that is not in keeping with their own former ideology which they've given up on a long time ago and also doesn't serve the people that they used to represent in politics and that's the space that the left needs to develop into occupying and not giving up to to the far right. The other thing is that exactly because everything could be different the same goes for the European Union the European Union could be incredibly different. We have the European Union that we have allowed our governments to create it is a European Union that essentially acts as a broker for certain political interests whether they are of the most powerful countries in Europe or the most powerful economic interests in the world makes a little difference but that is how it's been designed instead of securing the interests of the citizens of the European Union. In order for the EU to change however we need a broad front across the entire continent that can represent this political will for change both at the national level where those you know that position needs to be cemented in the minds and hearts of people or voters but then also elevate it to the European level from that national level. It's at the same time a national and a European fight and to give a very concrete example of why it's a European fight. The current financial crisis that is brewing that started with the Silicon Valley Bank is spread to Europe through Switzerland and the rest of it. It is at the same time not like 2008 and exactly like 2008. The biggest difference is that bankers are not afraid this time around. Back in 2008 they were terrified of what's going to happen. This time they're not because our central banks everywhere in the world including the European Central Bank have told them for the past decade that no matter what happens they're going to bail them out. It doesn't matter how badly they mess up. It doesn't matter how many risks they take and how they misappropriate the funds that they have from your average job, you and I, they will always get bailed out. These are the kind of policies that we could be fighting and the kind of money that are being printed in order to bail out these banks could for example be created in order to finance the green transition that we need that will create jobs that will create the kind of sustainability that we need in our societies and our economies in order to make all of our countries and the entire continent by extension hopefully the world eventually future proof instead of just shoveling these endless amounts of cash into the black hole that is the parasitic banking system. So it's about really shifting the political debate about from this fatalistic this is the way the world is. This is the way the EU is. This is the way governments work and towards unlocking that part of our brain that is both creative and ambitious about the future and realize that there's actually quite a few things that we could change that aren't even that radical. All it requires is to decouple our governments from these parasitic oligarchy interests that we've blindly been serving for these past few decades. I think I agree with what Eric just said and I was just thinking before on on the Eric proposal for allowing people to actually buy back with the 10 percent and having the same treatment that we're already giving to hedge funds and it took me two seconds to picture in my mind headlines in newspaper and newscasts like the lazy bailouts or how comfy how about me who paid the whole mortgage why can why can they be allowed to pay just 10 percent. So yeah the thing is public debate and what we are allowing ourselves to think must be changed because we are so deep in this mindset where we are completely okay with allowing hedge funds that are as you well said completely ruling our reality at the present at the moment and we are constantly victimizing everyone who needs because that's one way to deal with the struggle one way to deal with the the reality it's like individual's fault and not the society that's crumbling down so I think that the European approach is not the right approach because yeah free money from Europe is not like that it's not like the European approach would be way more effective which it will be but it's because it would allow ourselves to start in imaging and once again what the society must be what we would like what we would dream of future to be because at the moment it looks like we gave up on that dream we're just accepting and and trying to survive in that something that it's not working as you said so a way to be more effective a way to put back again everything on the table and start debating on what we need as a society and what it's right and what it's fair and what our future is going to look like because the future is going came whether we want it or not yeah it's it's come for sure and maybe it's already here I wanted to to pick on the French protest that Eric mentioned just now happening actually just resisting to you know the pension age actually going up even more in France and just resisting everything even getting worse which of course has our full support and solidarity as in the US and France also on the streets resisting this this is an example where I don't know about you know every German every European media landscape but in the German one for sure you don't read much about this you know you don't read much about the high price of whole you know population against their government in the center of Europe and this draws me drives me back a little bit to our common experience also from different angles about what happened in 2008 and after the Greek spring the the countries and the populations in southern Europe voting for more left governments and those governments immediately being under big pressure from from the you know the center of Europe and the powerful institutions and also you know media and public opinion in Germany being shifted against the so-called lazy Greeks and so on and all these other bullshit this is something that we as an international organization and that's why DM 25 was set up after this experience can fight much better than if you're just a national party and I think that's the core why we have a better chance to actually if you know we make it to the government somewhere and we'll try everything to implement some of the policies that we discussed today that we can then actually because if we do radical changes in the political system and in the ownership of housing for example of course we can bet on being under huge attacks from those interests that own the media on the housing that don't want this change to happen and then we need to we need to support of the people and we don't need to and it's much better if you don't have that actually in one state and only but you know across borders across Europe and I think that's the unique thing for me by now also in Bremen in the local election we are competing for the new housing solidarity as we go up there in our campaign and actually I also want to link in the description of a video a petition that we have against evictions specifically in Bremen so everyone watching this can hopefully sign it and especially those that are in Germany and maybe even in Bremen also you know a call out to to join our campaign there and we'll do that also and canvassing with people from outside Germany from from Portugal from the Netherlands from Belgium from other countries coming even from Montenegro coming to Bremen and campaigning there for a policy that you know we want to implement everywhere and I think that's the kind of a unique approach of man 25 and that's why we are doing this not just you know in one country yeah and I think on that on that notes of international solidarity we're gonna wrap up want to thank again the three of you for joining us thank you for watching of course now we would like to hear from you if you have any thoughts comments please leave them down below if you have any personal stories related to housing that you've you've had in the recent past or in the distant past please share them with us and if you have any suggestions for which topic we should tackle next as well we'd like to hear from you on that if you haven't joined the M25 the link will be in the description if you happen to live in Greece in Germany or in Italy and you'd like to get active also with meta 25 in your country those links would also be on the description and lastly of course if you enjoyed this video don't forget to like and to subscribe to our channel if you haven't yet and thanks again to you guys and we'll see you next time