 Well, I'm just gonna because we're five minutes in already just want to get started, but it was nice to talk to everyone in the new year. So, welcome to our glossary meeting. Let me just share very first off this year. Let me share on the screen. Let me add the link. Again, for those who should join later. Add your names, please. And as usual, as you know, this is a CNCF meeting so please deterge the code of content and basically just be respectful and kind of very easy. Okay, let's start with the glossary updates. So the Portuguese blog will go live on January 12 very exciting. Well, but I think it turned out really well and looking forward to seeing it live. You may or may not have seen it but we've updated tags and never deprecated some definitions. There's a link to a sheet which might make it easier where you can see the whole I don't know I just put it there may or not may or may not be easier. And you will also see like updates in the style guide. But, oh no, this is not supposed to be this one. Oh, I tap. I. Okay, well anyways, in the style guide there is a, let me just do this real quick in the style guide there's like an update where you can see what tags we're using so we're trying to be where we have very specific tags. And you see like how we use them. We're trying to be to minimize them. So it's not like so it's, it's meaningful. These are the ones that we have. If anyone at some point feels that there should be a new one. Don't just add a new one please reach out to maintainers and make sure that it is a tag that we should be using. And also kind of a little mention because we talked about this before but like a little bit of our approach to minimal viable definition which kind of means helps for people who are contributing with new terms. Basically, we really are trying to provide a high level overview just enough so people can dig deeper right we don't want to over complicate things with the goal is really to make it accessible to anyone and the basis to then kind of go on and learn how to provide native. So those two sections are new. And. Yeah, so for the maintainer kind of discussion. So with this code. I saw that you said something about wrap along lines and mark down come to cemented line breaks. I'm not sure I understand what you mean. I guess that was the discussion about when to wrap a line that was at one PR where I said, where I made some suggestions to wrap them on the lines to smaller ones and then the discussion went off and yeah. So for what wrap along mark down line, a mark down code, aren't we doing mark down. Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's it's it's marked on but I guess it's just about what do we what what do we understand, or what do we consider semantic line breaks. Break only at the exclamation mark or do we break even when there's no sign at all or what do we do. I guess that's basically the question we should answer. I think for editing purposes, because like when you edit the beginning of a sentence often that the end changes to right so it's like things move around because it's not like sometimes it's just like if it's just like a missing or so no but like if you're editing a sentence then it impacts the entire sentence from the beginning until. So that's why I was thinking I know that sometimes are very long, but at least for editing purposes, I find it easier to have them complete. Yeah, I guess that's just a matter of what you are used to or or what. Yeah, I mean, for me it's exactly the other way around so I like it if it's smaller. Send smaller things to edit but yeah I'm, as I said in the request I'm open I have no strong opinion to it. As far as the important things that we have a conclusion. It's like when, when you do a suggestion you know like when there is a suggestion and then like you can do the whole sentence. And otherwise you would have to have a half a sentence here and the other half a sentence there and then like a little bit there, but you could also do a suggestion for the first part of the sentence put the full sentence there and then the other suggestions just stroke stroke it out and then like break it above or something. Yeah, I mean I mean both both ways are totally valid. Um, okay I think I don't know that it's pretty much ready right to merge. And then for, do we have anything specific, before we go more into these kind of things that is more for localized teams so close stuff that you made that's more interesting before we go more in Montana. Sure. Yeah, the next one. So regarding the localization branches. There are many changes in main branch so I think all localization branches need to be updated. There are some major changes such as tags, tags, and there are to duplicate the terms. And we applied a new workflow for labeling auto labeling so those should be applied to development branch as well for localization and for instance, if you if localization team does not check the duplicate status term and they can possibly they possibly translate or localize duplicate or we will remove the terms. It is useless approach. So, I'd like to recommend to update or development branches. So, I think all localization teams know how to rebase their development branch with me. You can check the example, the second bullet. And this time I maintain a need to check all localization teams applied updated the development branch according to the latest to main branch this time so I'm going to create a project item to check all branches are updated. So I will share it when I create a project in our repository I will share it to select channel so that team maintainers can join that project. But recently, they have updated or accordingly updated their development branch with the latest main branch so I'm going to check this one. Anyway, I'm going to check. Is there any question regarding the update of development branch? Actually, all localization teams should react for this request. Okay, I guess there's no other question. Anyway, I will handle other maintainers don't need to worry about. And second one, the last one, last item is about our glossary project. We'll have first URL in the redirection case since we are going to change micro services to micro service architecture the existing micro service URL will be expired will be expired so the PR that includes this suggestion changing the name also include URL redirection you can check the link and so when this PR is merged then we will have one redirection but it is not urgent but we need to consider how to manage the redirections because I see in Kubernetes website you can check the redirection there are more than 500 redirections and they are not quite managed well so maybe we also placed similar case so we need to have some policy to add redirection or not so it is just ensuring Just a comment on that the question is this just happened because we renamed the term right and also the file name and I would think that this is not something that happens really often and then I'm thinking about okay what's the alternative the alternative would be to change manually yeah but that's not possible to change everything by hand now what I'm thinking about was what's the alternative to go in all places and edit the reference but yeah it's too many places the reference to the all localized content stuff yeah no forget it and also it's not about how we link to it because this is a public resource and our goal is for people to use it and link to it so if we're doing our job well and are successful at some point a lot of people we should never ever kind of change a link without a redirect because then we're breaking links yeah agree not something that will I think it's it will probably happen again but I think it's going to be very rare yeah me too also it is a little bit related when we when we duplicate terms those terms are also still have will have the URL link so if someone keep the URL link to duplicate the term they don't know the term is term has been deplicated from our glossary project so that part also maybe need some redirection or one day we need to show the status of document document of each term so that duplicate duplication status can be notified by other people who already read or who already have compiled the previous links so yeah as Catherine and Noa said this case is not open often so maybe we can discuss it later once we face more complicated situation but this time sharing just sharing the status is okay for me is there any question or comment regarding on this issue okay I think this there's none okay Catherine there's just two items that I listed yeah so maybe going to the localization teams that are here anything you want to talk about or whatever I'm just going to go around as soon as the first one on my screen okay let me open here related to the labeler workflow this is already working I updated I think yesterday the Portuguese is manually right or we need to do something yeah actually I I disabled the workflow manually currently so even though you updated your development branch that will not work yet once every localization teams update their development branch then I will activate the workflow the reason why I disabled the workflow is that if any development branch does not have some setting parts regarding the labeler workflow okay then they will face failure in every PR so that's the reason okay got it thank you just one more question Catherine there is a list with the deprecated tags and definitions but I can access when I click I need to request access so I can go to everyone sorry about that of course thank you that's all I think from my side just one more thing today with help of Sioco we merged some terms that was done but this week I will review all of the updates there are a lot of changes so I will open to check the deprecated definitions there are a lot of work to do besides just localize the terms it's always a lot of work and D anything from on your site that you would like to share thank you as I mentioned you can go to those links I tried the tags and other ones we had 10 terms already actually localize already done actually but right now we have almost 24 done so I'm hoping to actually make it kind of upload to the main branch actually so what should I do or do I need to wait or something like that I was waiting for that we have almost done 24 or 25 that is probably all at once right like I guess you could just open a PR to main right just I was asking the question because is there any other thing I had to go through because as Sioco was mentioning about some changes they need to or rebasing or something like that so I was waiting for that so that was my question or should I go for rebasing or I have to wait for some changes and then go for the PR or I can create a PR right now I think you do better to rebase your development your team's development branch first if you rebase the development branch you will see some changes from English document English terms if you your team already translated or localized the English terms then you develop to check the original English document has been changed if changed you can apply to those 24 terms and then you can open the PR to merge your development branch to main branch okay great great if you have any question needs any support then just call me in any way yes sure thank you Walid anything on your hands if you would like to share hi everyone from Pakistan working on the viewer branch development for Urdu and I'm actually finally a student I've done my intro last month I missed the glossary meeting last month due to illness and all in able to attend so this is my intro basically I am from Pakistan working as a student Golan developer also the glossary localization approval so yeah working on actually working on some stuff in vocabulary for Urdu technical vocabulary basically the technical vocabulary was missing because of some word like scalability and some or more like API gateway was missing in Urdu so we are currently working on that and we'll update soon this month also you know we had exams this month so couldn't be able to work on more terms but we hope for good yeah university always goes first so that's for sure yeah exactly but it's actually our last semester so we are almost free well welcome for sure and yeah we're all very excited to see the new Urdu effort and last not this Victor anything on your end yeah hey yeah actually somebody in my last minute not showing I'm still just going around and find what I can contribute for the localization my native town is Mandarin Chinese so I actually started to offer to help the planning skill they have a Chinese documentation I'm helping there so I probably cannot spend that much time also probably not qualified to do the localization so is there any like just random help in there I see helper there's a role called helper I guess that's for more like helping with this lack and technical help not language help so you are looking to contribute like for the regular glossary you mean like the English yeah basically just in the community any project that needs like localizations help yeah so just like short term either review or translate something what type of role is that is there such a role in the community that's needed well for a localization team they're kind of every team works has their own little flow so I'm not sure if there is like anything there but like for like on the English glossary I mean there are a lot of issues that are open generally it's like working on issues or and yeah like if there are any questions on slack it's always great to see the community kind of help and and answer those as well but they're not to be honest I mean if you're on the slack it's not like there are like tons of questions so anything Noah Jihoon can think of yeah no I was just asking myself where did you see this helper role and respectively did you did you read the contributor letter for example or I mean there you can pretty much see how how you would enter the different paths I mean yeah so you want to become a contributor it's pretty pretty much stated there what was expected and how you how you can climb up the ladder if you want so yeah that's my comment on this okay yeah yeah for now I'm just helping a particular project with that translation so I guess I'll just keep on doing that and that question is there's one term I like it's just like software service I know the translation was not quite right however it's already been translated a long time ago so it's already kind of established so for a situation like that the translation can have a better choice it's not that committed it's just it's probably translated a long time ago by some somewhere else for a situation like that does the cncf terminology that is there like a need to change that so basically the software as service translated into Chinese is actually software is service that's the current translation so but it's already kind of established as the term to be used for that English term so I don't need to make that clear yeah yeah I think what you're saying is that it's like there is an established Chinese form of saying it and then it's translated like it's translated differently not like the established way right so it should be different the current way to translate it's translated before probably the cncf probably even exists that term can have a better translation so for a situation like that for cncf perspective should we make corrections so it's a better translation so software as a service I think is one that was deprecated anyways and it's not it cannot be that old because the glossary is not even a year and a half old so to which term are you referring I'm using that as an example for cncf that's probably a new term but that term itself has been there forever right so that was translated in a way that was not quite his software is a service your question is if we should define this term in Chinese language to kind of correct this translation if we translate it to be quote correct it will be different from what the commonly used in the industry at this point so that's the thing about the localization right localization is not translation so like translation would be literally taking the words and then translating them into your language but if there is already a standard like a term established term in Chinese you're not going to make up you shouldn't be making up a new term right so it may be that at some point someone didn't know that established termed and simply translated it just because they weren't familiar with it and then yes we should definitely keep established terms because yeah we don't want to introduce new different variations of it we should definitely stick to what the industry is yeah is referring to that term yeah yeah just wanted to say that I agree on that but I guess that is something that that you could discuss in the Chinese localization team so yeah that's like something that's definitely that I would it's like not a discussion with the because like we cannot say anything about it you know you tell us this is like very short you tell this I don't know anything you say about Chinese so I think I would start with raising that discussion there and say like yeah it's just the actual term is this it's established maybe you can show some links where it's like you know like and then and then update it yeah I already brought it up yeah I think you're right you probably should stick to the established term even if it's not the perfect translation yeah I know if it's established that's what people go with so otherwise everyone is kind of putting their own little burden and then we have to that that will be crazy okay cool anything else from anyone because if not I think there are like a few things that we wanted to discuss that were more like within the month well kind of questions that we as maintainers had that we're going to discuss now may or may not be super relevant to you so you're welcome to stick around or just like I know it's late for some of you so yeah we'll just continue with that and yeah so okay so we just discussed the code the markdown thing and then like data center so I just noticed well first of all like typical problem people always do that the problem addresses and people start talking about the solution like we did it so many times and then I got it here to again like people start talking about the solution so we need to change that and then of course that was a little bit in the how it addresses how it helps sorry and one thing that I realized that it was very much focused on the cloud and yet clouds are data centers but what is the problem that a data center actually addresses it's not necessarily not having that infrastructure because if you have your own infrastructure as a company you still own it you still have the whole that's that that's the benefit of the cloud right so is it that you can connect them into a distributed system you know like if you have all of them you have you can do like basically like a supercomputer like what is I didn't know what distributed system is the only thing that kind of came to my mind but those could also be connected through the cloud but yeah but like yeah I don't know is the question what problem a data center solves in general or is it connected to a cloud computing center not no it's just data center so it has nothing that can be a cloud you know it can be a data center or it can be like the one and a company and the definition itself was very much focused on cloud but like we have a definition for cloud and data center is not equal cloud so data center should focus on data center in general not necessarily kind of exclude data centers in a company own kind of part of a company's own infrastructure yeah so in data center in general I think probably the data center others is just centralized management of computing infrastructure or so data yeah yeah I was asking myself okay if we ask the question okay what problem solves what problem does the data center solve then I I would have to think of what has been before data centers and I don't have an answer to this I mean it's like localized computing power right everyone works on his own machine or what I don't know well that then it would be what I was like thinking right you have several computers you all you connect them all and then you basically have a super like you have a much bigger capacity because they're all connected instead of having your own you have a lot more power you can connect your individual personal computers to that like and then you suddenly like you can do things that are much more powerful right yeah I guess it's about power and like capacity and speed and okay computational power probably I don't know yeah because like I think what was before was probably like what like with the problem and addresses I like to think about like okay what did a world look like before there was that right and as you mentioned that's pretty old probably it was people with their personal computers right like you had like different stations with their own computers that were not connected so the maximum like yeah so that's the maximum you could do with was the power of that person that individual computer and that's very limited it has limited resources right okay yeah if we say that then it's it's it's the power thing the power computational power I guess the next step is like okay and doing that in the cloud right so you have the personal computer and have the data center it the company and then the next evolution is okay now you have actually clouds where you don't even need it in your own infrastructure you can just rent it that's kind of the evolution right okay and then microservice so for everyone who's else here so we're changing microservices to microservices architecture and the services definition will become like like the microservice like where we have to update that as well and so I did send something in Slack so it is microservices architecture which is kind of weird but microservices is generally kind of used in as a plural so if you see okay that's weird yeah there's they define but yeah I'm sorry go ahead yeah yeah most of the cloud service providers a microservices architecture yeah crazy okay it's always plural I mean it's microservice is also kind of used in singular but very easy and it's a weird thing is it's like a microservices architect so it is singular yeah because the architecture that one architecture is made up of multiple services I guess right so it is weird okay yeah check yeah yeah and then the last thing I know this is not super important oh but didn't don't we have now draft is true that kind of thing now I saw Chris Abraham doing because like the feedback appreciated is I don't know I think that's kind of odd it's very like draft and public like but is there a way to kind of bulk change these things if we want to it's not again it's not super important but like it's just odd and the question is do we need that if we have the other part the new section when it says like drafts true and not I don't remember what that was about yeah yeah can we not just have an or conjunction to say either feedback appreciated or draft is it not something like that actually appreciated means it's a draft yeah I meant there's some there's some place in the hugo thing in order to show it or not it just checks for completed right so only those who are completed are shown in the hugo and the templating stuff I think so yeah so does it even is it even a difference what we write if we write draft or feedback appreciated don't show us up anyway right yeah I think if it is shown or not completed anymore it is if it does not have the draft true thing that's a new thing okay I think do you remember he just did a PR like recently yeah I remember the draft to true header is for the category tags only the one usage so previously if we don't have that header to header then even though we duplicate or change the status of a term to not completed status the category count duplicative terms as well so that's the reason why Chris added more draft to true so that those terms which she does not in completed status counted for counted for the tags category because that kind of messed it up okay so is terms published based on that draft not being true now and not the completed or is it looking at both I think recently all terms which has which has status not completed Chris added those terms to the jeopardy header as well yeah yeah okay so then we basically don't need that anymore because it's draft true or is it empty or no false I guess right like so it would be there would only be instead of that but I didn't see that anymore or is it just the ones that are not completed yes we didn't apply the draft to header to all terms we only applied the draft to true to duplicate or duplicate the terms so does that mean that we don't need the status anymore if we have this header thing no draft here is used only for counting number of tags for category not the not for the glossary term status so yeah actually I think that would be ideal for that to be to get rid of the status and just say like draft yes true false yeah that would be awesome because then it's like simple and it makes very it's very it makes a lot of sense right like the feedback appreciate just very weird so yeah could is there a way to bulk apply that part of the bulk to make it like one like not going not doing it individually but doing it all at once changes to all those who have completed to change them to maybe but it is web development issue so that's the Chris question yeah handle but the true option it was invited by Chris but maybe it is very initial airport to quickly remove quickly apply the counting tags issue yeah well I can we can ask him again it's not like super urgent but I feel like like it's more intuitive and terms that people like yeah it's just one total like the feedback appreciated and completed is not really the way these things are expressed okay let's see what he says and if you put it on his to do list at the end like somewhere in the future that's fine um anything else anyone just just one more question I was checking here that why do we need to do with the deprecated terms we need to put the status as deprecated or just remove well we don't want to delete them yeah yeah yeah so it's a little bit of so the glossary started and people starting kind of to to contribute terms and we didn't have like a real process to evaluate and then we started getting all these terms they're not really cloud native terms so we feel very sorry because a lot of people put effort in it you put effort in it localizing it right but someone input and so it is like we do feel a little bit bad about it but we didn't have a process to like it is a cloud native glossary so it should be cloud native and not have not cloud native terms so we do want to keep them still there just thinking I don't know just deleting them as like yeah we do yeah yeah is it part of the process to construct to create the glossary right yeah yeah and just FYI so we do have terms that are not necessarily cloud native so like we have the foundational tag and terms that we believe are necessary to understand cloud native terms like data center right if you talk about a cloud if someone has learned that is kind of the basis to understand what a cloud is so those we do keep and they only have foundation but if they are like debugging for instance is like there is no need to know understand debugging to understand cloud native terms and it has nothing it's nothing specific to cloud so just for you to kind of understand our logic and yes it was a hard decision and we really feel sorry for you guys that actually put all the effort as well in localizing them but yeah yeah some just don't my question is more because I saw here for example managed services we have the status deprecated so this will be the process to deprecate to deprecate someone these terms right because I will open up PR to update the tags and see the deprecated terms so yeah I think like right now I don't know if probably I don't know how it will affect our because if we have like the draft true or false and not status anymore well yeah I don't know we have to figure that out but right now I think if we put deprecated it's not going to show in the glossary so then it's gone I think at least for now because we have a lot of terms localize it and to do not do the job I will just update the tags and I will wait for some agreement about the status or draft true yeah maybe we need to announce terms have been deprecated to localization teams as well so that localization teams can be applied to deprecated localized terms maybe maintenance should make status of terms probably what do you mean should we deal with the status yeah we sometimes we change status of cycle I mean like completed to deprecated or something else could appreciate it but if that term already translate localized then the localization team may not quickly follow the status of term in English deprecated term so maybe maintenance need to find a way to make status changes information publicly to localization teams who are in public as well maybe we need to show the status of terms in glossary website on the website there would only be there is just one description but we don't show the status of the term currently all terms often publicly in glossary is completed status but we sometimes change people will not know why or when the term has been deprecated from our glossary I think something that we can do is like and we should probably do I mean in the list with the tags we have also list the ones that are deprecated but generally kind of say like hey we deprecated this term like put it in the glossary and this meeting and then kind of have like a you just just communicate it better yeah yeah also sometimes our status feedback appreciated but those feedback appreciated we are hard maybe contributors hard to find terms are appreciated status so that they can try to contribute so it is very related with other status information in public issue well I know that at some point a lot of people were localizing terms that were still feedback appreciated so that's that's what you mean right that that's not ideal because they're not they're not regarded as ready so yeah I don't know I don't know how to I think did we add that in I think somewhere in the contributor guide at some point but I don't know how to make it more visible because you have like once you go into the term you will see it but like I don't know how to make it more visible but it's not clicking on the term it's just a matter of letting people know no so it is just to open topic and we need to keep discussing ideas how to improve that yeah should be a show the status to in public or to new contributors or contributors okay well let's think how we can do that anything else okay okay good then Noah let's try to close policies as code data center microservices and then we can move forward with the next some things on the to-do list but I think we should be good okay cool well thanks everyone for joining happy new year again and I will see you very soon thank you bye bye thank you bye hi hi hi hi