 Live from San Jose, California, in the heart of Silicon Valley. It's theCUBE, covering QuickBooks Connect 2016. Now, here are your hosts, Jeff Frick and John Wall. I hope you're ready for high energy. I think we have high energy for you here. Welcome back inside San Jose, the convention center here, along with Jeff Frick. I'm John Walls, we're here on theCUBE and bringing you live streaming coverage throughout the day here at QuickBooks Connect 2016. I talked about energy, our next guest came up to us. We didn't have met and all of a sudden started a high five and everybody on the crew and said, we are ready to rock this place. So I guess we are. Don Brolin, who is the founder and the CEO of Powerful Accounting, a Connecticut-based accounting firm now joins us. And Don, are you ready to rock this place? I'm ready to crush this. We're going to hammer this right out. No question. We're going to teach. All right, tell us a little bit about your firm. So you started as a one-person shop, a solopreneur, and now you've evolved to where you've got, I believe you said seven people working for you, three of those in a virtual environment. So tell us about all that, about that growth and about the challenges of having that virtual office set up for three of your key employees. Well, it's been easy. No, I'm just kidding. Yeah, so we've been growing and growing and really starting to laser focus on our practice. And so we do provide bookkeeping services, tax return services, the basic accounting firm that does all those kind of things. What we're really passionate about is IRS representation and helping civil or criminal cases, helping them get out of that, hopefully keeping them in a civil environment. But it has been tough. We've had policies and procedures. We've had to create transparency, virtual people where you have to make sure they can still be part of your team, even though they're not in your office. And so that's been a really big focus for us is to continue our, we are team Brolin. That's how we roll, Brolin with Brolin, right? So we love it. And we really try to have that team atmosphere. I don't call them employees. I call them my team members because they truly are my team. And they're like family. And I think that's one of the things with our core values is that we've really tried to define who we really are as a firm. And that has revolutionized our practice because we really know who we are. And I think everyone needs to do that. So is there a moment where you redefined and decided we're going to be something specific versus just kind of general purpose accounting? And if so, what was the catalyst for that? So interestingly enough, I had built a relationship with a law firm, Green and Sklars. They're in Connecticut. And they're just, they're my boys, I call them, but they're great people. And they're passionate about helping their clients get out of the issues that they're in. And so he and I just kind of, Eric Green and I just kind of formed a great friendship. And he said, you know, will you do all of our accounting for our clients when we have cases come in? I have had experience testifying in court. Unfortunately on that one, I was on the IRS's side, which is good, because you know why? Here's the secret about that. Now I know what they look for because I'm watching them build a case against somebody and helping them build a case. So I know what they're looking for. I know what they know and what they don't know. So that's fun. Jeff, I want to talk to you later, by the way. So fun, like bulletproof vest, eye black. We go in hot, you know what I mean? Down on her elbow. Yeah, we're totally coming in hot. It's awesome. So that became just a passion, right? So one of our core values is passionate, be passionate and we're passionate about our clients. I'm passionate about my team succeeding as a group. Definitely our clients are just so important to us. But what about the virtual environment, though? I mean, dealing with that because, you know, a lot of people like that face to face. You know, they like to know who's doing what, especially when you're working with numbers and clients want to work with people face to face. So how have you been able to bridge that or maybe allay those concerns to the point that you can have success? Yeah, you know, it's really, obviously the technology is just everywhere, right? For us, we face time with our clients. So if we're going over a P&L, we may do a go-to meeting, but we're still seeing each other. And it's as if we meet together in person all the time. The technology's allowed us to do that. Of course, cloud technology, QBO is, you know, we don't have to be on their machine or like the date back of the day when we had to log on to their machine and take it over. Like that's just so ridiculous. Please don't do that. So that's a great recommendation for people. So we take clients who are willing to accept how we work with them. And we want to make sure that it's personal because it really means a lot to us to help them grow. I mean, that's what we're here for. We're not here to book entries anymore. It's a whole different ballgame now with technology. And have you changed kind of your building relationship? We've heard about that. You know, to get away from the hours-based building to a retainer or some other kind of mechanisms that define your building relationship with your clients. We have a great client onboarding process. And we defined it because I said, you know what, I love clients. And they're obviously, we don't make money without them, right? Yeah, you wouldn't have much of a business. It'd be kind of boring, I think. Well, I don't know. We have a basketball court right outside our office. We would just do that. Very profitable. It would, exactly. So one of our processes, we teach them how we work. So they may not be totally familiar with all the technologies that we use, but from the first call that comes in, they understand that we're going to exchange an engagement letter. We're going to exchange a payment authorization form. You're going to pay a deposit upfront. And that's going to happen through our document management system right from the beginning. So we don't exchange paper with them. It's all done electronically. Right signature. Right from the beginning. Right from the beginning, we teach them. This is how we exchange information together. And they get it or they don't. Most of the time, they do. People are pretty good. Nobody with a flip phone, we won't take clients who have a flip phone. Who they have to have a smart phone. But anyway, so we kind of vet through that process. And I loved your question about the billing. So with the bookkeeping, it's easy to do value billing, right? Because as you're getting better, you're making more money because you're not billing by the hour. With the IRS representation work, we bill by the hour. Because those cases, you don't know what's going to happen. It's a real important niche area that even bookkeepers, accountants, CPAs, EAs, anybody can get involved in that kind of work. It's a huge market out there. The attorneys don't want to do that. They're tax attorneys, you know? They want to do their law part. So they're looking for more people like us. And that relationship's been, I'm just so blessed with that relationship. And do you need an attorney just legally to get involved in that process? They need somebody that's past the bar to represent them? Or not necessarily? They don't necessarily. So a lot of the times we'll come in and we deal with the agents 100%. So we're on the POA with the attorney. We're under likely a covel letter, which means the IRS can't bring us to court if it's a criminal case because we're protected by that relationship with the attorney because we're not natively. So that process that we go through, we handle the agents a lot of times. And that's a skill to handle an IRS agent. Because if you think about it, they want to get their job done. They have inventory. Inventory to them are these cases. A caseload. So when you are more open with them and overwhelm them with information, they're so much more likely to remove a penalty, an accuracy penalty, a fraud penalty, because you as the accountant are so open with the information. And it's just, it's a relationship that you have to groom them and get to know them. We give them coconut milk. They want coconut milk, you know, whatever you want, man, we got you. Right? And that's, I mean, that's how we approach it. So it's obviously better if you don't get in trouble with the IRS in the first place. I'm just curious from your point of view, and there's a lot of tools here represented on the floor beyond just QuickBooks Connect. How do people usually get in trouble? I mean, if you could get ahead of some of your clients that have gotten in trouble, what are the two or three kind of really key things that aren't that complicated that will help them avoid the trouble in the first place? Definitely one thing is documentation. I think with all the apps that we're using out there, it doesn't matter, Expensify, all of those T-sheets, tracking your mileage, mileage tracking, all of those things that most business owners don't want to do. The technology is there, they just don't know it. And so you prepare a tax return, here's one of them. Mileage, you've got to track your mileage. Don't, oh, I drove around 30,000 miles last year. Okay, so how much of that was, I'm always doing business. No, you're not, okay? You're not always doing business. So you have to really work with your client to say, hey listen, you've got to have documentation. So we work very paranoid. Our firm is, I say we work very paranoid because we see these cases that happen. And they're not necessarily, they're not happening to our clients necessarily, but that documentation, home office deduction. Like these are just standard things where you've got to be careful. Home office deduction, if you're on your kitchen table, that's not a home office, right? Like so people are, I work from home. Okay, well you can't work, I mean, who doesn't work and watch football? We all do, right? But just having that documentation and every solution is here that you need for your business owners. And I always tell them do one at a time. Pick one application, one big pain point, or something you're not tracking now. Receipts, you have to have receipts. I know that sounds crazy. But the IRS will accept an electronic receipt. So it's interesting, I've done some research. They literally will accept whatever the standard of technology or the standard practice of the times, if you will, in the receipt in whatever format. Because it used to be, you have to have all the pieces of paper, but they don't require that anymore. And they're all thermal friends and they don't last for seven years or whatever. And they don't last, absolutely, absolutely. So going from when you start, how long did you start the company? So I've actually had my third rendition. So we don't want to do things once. We want to do them three times. I started my first bookkeeping company in 1999. I had two babies that I love so much. Two babies under two. So I said, oh honey, how about you raise them? I'm going to go start a firm. And so that's when I started and it was just a guy who was actually building an in-law apartment for my parents. And he was like, hey, my bookkeeper isn't, you have an accounting degree, right? Can you do my books? I'm like, okay. And that's literally how it all started. So you've gone from that to when now you have maybe as many as eight now in your firm as of January 1st. The growth pains that you had along the way. Yes. Share those with other small business owners out there about what you've learned. And then maybe from a QuickBooks perspective, those pain points that for you, how they have been solved or how you're addressing them through various QuickBooks services. Sure. And I love that question because every journey is a journey. And I've personally gone through an amazing journey in 16 years and I'm looking forward to the next 16, right? But the pain points for me, one of the biggest pain points for me was running a business and then having, how do you get home and get to your kids and get to your family, right? And your husband and everything. So that was a really big struggle for me because I'm doing the technical work because when I was by myself, I'm doing the billing. I'm billable, I gotta be billable, but they still have to run the company. I have to manage it and administrate it. So when it's just yourself, it's really, really tough and you lose and you sacrifice. And we all know that Michael Phelps talked about that yesterday. I mean, we sacrifice when we build a business. And so you have to accept that. And so the more you can kind of get that support team around you to build a business is really important. And then when you add on, staff is really, it was really where the rubber meets the road. And it's always the first one that's the hardest because you, you know, a lot of times people go into it without into it, get it? Into it. Come on, you got it. You got me. I caught it being with that right in there. I was so smooth. I was there. I was there. Cause we're all on the same team. Of course we are, except you like the nationals, but we'll talk about that later, right? We'll get around to that. So we are, we are, we're suffering. So, you know, for me, it was really about how do I gain my life back? So I'm like, okay, I need to, I know I need to hire some people. And I was playing softball, of course, was what else do you do in the outfield with another outfielder? And I was like, hey, what do you do? She's like, I do some bookkeeping for this club. I've been with them for like 15 years, but they're closing the manufacturing plant and moving and whatever. And I'm like, hey, you want to work for me? She's like, sure. And you know, we're running out. And of course I make her run after all the balls. And she was a great, and she was a remote, 100% remote right from my first person. And this was in 2011 when I brought her on. I had a partnership in between that and I learned so much in that partnership and carried that on to, I call the third rendition of now powerful accounting. And I really find that hiring people and making sure you have a lot of transparency, you have to have procedures in place for consistency, policies, and those are so important. And really over the last year is where we've really zeroed in on that because we found that I say one thing and then I expect something different, right? Cause we don't remember half the time what we're talking about, right? So I learned that I had to really structure my company. And in order to grow, I needed to structure it and literally document. And so the applications were kind of for me an easy transition. I'm very open-minded to technology and it's really important. But growing a company is not an easy road. You just have to know and I loved it. You have to sacrifice. It's going to be sacrifice. And then the QuickBooks side of it. So the QuickBooks side, yeah, absolutely. And that transit, I was on the Intuit Accounting Council back in 2008. And because, and the reason why I went is I had met someone who had done a certification in QuickBooks and her name was Leslie Cappacetti. She's one of my favorite QuickBooks pro-advisor people in the world. She's like a mentor to me. And I went up to her and I said, how did you get this training gig? Like, and plus you have a really nice sweater. It says Intuit on it. How do I get one of those? Right? And I just talked to her about it. She said, you got to get on the council, Brolin. Get on the council. And so I did. And then I got on the trainer writer network. And so QuickBooks for me, I've been really part of their team in growing products and working with them in their development. And QuickBooks is just, we don't use any other accounting software. We use QuickBooks. That's it. And you know why? Because we don't have to do anything else. And that's in, you know, people are like, oh, but aren't you kind of like limiting yourself to one software? No, I'm using the best software there is. Why wouldn't, you know, why do I need to go to a different company? And it's been a great relationship. Did you have to fire any clients when you made this move? Unfortunately, we've, it's funny to ask that because so we have a folder structure we use Smart Vault for our document storage. And when a client, either we fire them or they leave, we move them into an old client file folder. And I scroll through it every once in a while. And I'm like, wow, that's a lot of people. I want, am I that bad? You know, and I'm thinking about it, but yeah, so it's tough to fire a client. And we really, if they're not seeing value in us, we say, listen, why don't you, you just want a bookkeeper. You don't want someone who is consulting with you and helping you grow your business. You just want to collect a paycheck every week. And there's nothing wrong with that. But I don't feel like we're giving you enough value. And I take that very personally every single client. I want them to have value. And if they're not seeing it, it's not, it's not healthy for anybody. So last impressions for we have to go. Your thoughts here at the show. I thought we had five hours. We do, but. Okay. I know, I get you. I got it. This is the East Coast feed. That's right. We'll do the Asia Pacific feed later. Later. Impressions of the show. How many years you've been coming? Well, it's only been a couple of years, but kind of what, what does this represent as a support and resource for you trying to grow your business? So I love that you asked that. And the reason for that is I feel like this is like a family reunion for me. I'm very good friends with a lot of the application partners here. And we see each other at conferences. My fellow colleagues that I was either on a council with or we're, you know, on Facebook or doing something. We just really get to see each other and learn. And the speakers are amazing and inspiring. Like we need that refueling. And I remember the first conference that I had, had gone to years ago. And I just was like, wow, if I got out of my office and came to something like this, like there's something bigger than me, right? Cause you just, you're just in your office and you're working and you're just trying to get work done. But then you come and people are so nice and like friendly and it's a big family reunion here. And, and so honored to be part of any of it, you know? So. Well, you told me that the only thing you use a file cabinet for is to put your t-shirts in. Absolutely. So probably an Excel, Jeff. Yeah, you're probably, yeah, about an Excel. And we actually sell our loot. We sell it and we donate it to a charity. Even better. So one of our staff picks the charity and we just, and we pass it on. Put mine on Jeff's tab. I will, yeah. No, I'll take this credit card when we get off the stage. Don Brolin from Powerful Accounting. Thank you for being with us. Thank you for having me. It was high energy. Hey, we got to do it. We're going to crush it out. We did crush it. It was very good. I appreciate it. Back with more here on theCUBE and San Jose in just a moment. Awesome.