 And good morning everyone Think we'll just give it another couple minutes and then we can Go through the agenda items. Can you pop a link to the agenda in the chat? Yeah, thanks Is that also some is this agenda items supposed to also go to the github page because I hadn't seen it Yeah, so What happens is that the SIG hasn't been officially created so We're just starting to you know, this is like our first meeting really so we had another meeting like a lot of months ago, but Not many people were there. So and then the vote went out to the TOC I think last week To create the SIG and it's looking like it's gonna be you know Created but but it hasn't been officially created, right? it's so Yeah, so one of the agenda items that I have there is to Update that read me file so we can So that you know anybody can just go to the page and see what the agenda is and Anybody can join the meeting Not to make things more complicated, but you guys were tasked to do the Harbour graduation review a SIG runtime a Quinton Was the one that basically kind of spearheaded that so that's why I'm here If we can spend a few minutes to discuss that today, that'd be great We don't know review needs to be done today, but I just want to talk about it. Oh, sure. Sure Do you mind if I add it to the agenda or you go ahead and add it? Yeah, it's fine. Yeah, thank you appreciate. Yeah Yeah, so quick I haven't been able to touch bases with Quinton and I think it vacation So hopefully it's Whenever he pops up and then we should be able to you know sync up with them So, yeah, so so the first have on the agenda. It's basically call for participation. So We're looking for another color and we're also looking for tech leads. So So anybody who wants to do it's interested in run time There's an example of projects in the Charter so If you're interested in participating So and then there's also a link about the responsibilities for Co-chair and a tech lead Describing, you know, kind of like what they're supposed to do So, yeah, so so feel free to kind of jump in if you if you want to kind of, you know Be part of the group So anybody, uh-huh. Yeah, this is Diane Fadema. I'm interested Possibly being a co-chair. I want to make sure that I really understand the duties involved and everything but I think what I would bring to this is Knowledge of the AI runtimes. That's what I work on at Red Hat. So I Think I just need to know how much of a time commitment you expect it to be Yeah Yeah, I think that's not really described in the document, but I Think the reason we have co-chairs is because not everyone can, you know Say run meetings or, you know, do different things that need to be done so I Think it's not something that that you have to spend tons of time on on it so Maybe when Quinton comes back, maybe he can give a little bit more details about that so I mean I from my parents, I just kind of jumped in and and then for me, it's just you know, being You know able to kind of be in this meetings. I think at least like so we have These meetings are scheduled like every two weeks And then doing some of the due diligence with the projects and and and reviewing the projects Say like if for sandbox for example, the projects come in and then we have to kind of give a recommendation to the TOC whether This it should be considered as a as a potential sandboxy and CF project And then there's for the Innovation and and graduation and doing some some due diligence And and now so I mean and not it has the same expertise right some of the folks are gonna be Working maybe on some of the areas that they're more interested in or Okay, okay, so that gives me an idea so you don't As long as you're familiar with a piece of this you could help be a co-chair I am interested to be a co-chair then I think I could maybe give like four hours every Maybe at the most every week I think but anything yeah Yeah, something like that in it and it's it in you Yeah, it's all kind of up to you too I mean if you want to participate more a certain week or you know, you have less time another week And then yeah, there will be so it will be up to I think up to us and coordinate so And then yeah, we would love to have you right so I mean I think also the AI expertise will be great so some of the How those things maybe there's gonna be more projects coming in Yeah All right, great. So I'll throw my hat in the ring then Cool. Yeah, and then and we also for looking for tech leads. I mean, I think a co-chair can also be a tech lead or the other way around But if you know anybody else, you know who was interested, you know You know Bring it over. Okay. Yeah, I think there is someone from Red Hat who's interested in being a tech lead Okay, I'm pretty sure if I see my honey will it will be winning willing to be a tech lead from Red Hat she works on Cryo and all the runtimes here as well from the engineering team. So We just couldn't get her she's in Prague today, so we couldn't get her on the call Cool. Yeah, so it's just Yeah, and then you can send them the links to the documents to the charter, you know, so You know, hopefully when Quentin comes back because he's initially who started this charter so we can You know at it at everybody who would like to participate That's great Cool. So the other item that I have there is the Runtime charter it's it's you know what we talked about before so it's the PR is open. So there's still some review That need to be addressed. So Quentin's not here. So so but then for awareness, you know, everybody can take a look at that PR and Cool, yeah. Oh Yeah, so so another So I've seen some of the other six for example the six security They've been around for maybe six or eight months. So they've actually have a pretty well established process So one of the things that that we maybe going forward would like to have is somebody who you know writes down what goes on in these meetings and basically do the scribes And so that and it was will hopefully set up the process as we go forward So the other item to see sick process. So Liz Rice is just the chair of the TOC to and some of the other TOC members came up with process of interaction between the TOC and the sick So like a flow diagram So it's it's still in the works It's not fully defined yet. So if you have any input feel free to chime in So the idea is just a you know, the six are meant to be there to support this the TOC and improvise on guidance to them and a lot of the members and the TOC don't have all the expertise But nobody has expertise on every area So the idea is just kind of spread the load more and and have the six do maybe some of some of the work that does my TOC doesn't have time to do or doesn't have expertise and so So you can help out in that area Any questions about this or I mean anybody has any input on that or we've been I've been participating in the SIG app delivery process For a couple of these things it it's a little nebulous, but it is getting more firm and more better documented or so it's it's all work in progress. Yeah, so Is anyone here know sort of the you talked about the sandbox. Can you talk me through how the graduation process works because at the I've worked with Projects that are, you know, at the end like Prometheus and things like that. But how did they enter this process. Can you explain that. Yeah, myself are not a completely, you know, knowledgeable about every step of the way, but the generally is You know, they go into sandbox then then PR gets open and it gets approved and it goes into sandbox and then Then when the project has gather or has gather, I think, TOC sponsors then then PR gets open and then into like so that project goes into incubation and then there's some due diligence. And I think this is kind of like where the six come in and they do some more Due diligence about the project, whether that's kind of on the path to graduation, for example, or, you know, things like having more users, some companies be using the project in production. And then finally, I think when it's incubation and incubation for some time, then PR also gets opened and Project to graduate and I think there are some criteria defining on some of the CNCF pages or readme files in the GitHub repository. And I think the criteria there is like you something like used by say, you know, over 100 customers or something like that, or, you know, a large number of people is running in production for more than, say, two years. So some of the, you know, making sure that it's a very stable project. But that's, that's kind of like in the summary, what it looks like. I don't know the details. But if you go through the pages, you can find, you know, more details. Okay, great. So then if we identify a gap, because that's talked about in this document, if you identify a gap to you then go out reach out to an open source project and invite them to be part of this process. Is that how you fill the gaps? Oh, okay. So, um, yeah, so I think you can, I mean, there's no, yeah, I mean, if there's a gap, you can, right? So I mean, yeah, I think anybody can, right? So like if you If you think you have potential to be part of the CNCF and then you gain benefits from being part of the CNCF, yeah, so But it all has to go through the process, right? So I've seen there's a few processes that are a few projects that haven't been approved, for example, right? So I mean, they try but then there's some criteria that they don't fit in and they don't get approved. Yeah, so certainly any project that wants to become part of the CNCF needs to basically open the PR for the donation and then they need to work with the TOC to identify two sponsors, potentially three, they're basically having a discussion to change it to three that are willing to sponsor that project into the sandbox. As part of that, there is some very light due diligence that happens by the TOC for sandbox later on as a project advances stages, whether it's incubation or graduation. That's where the six come in and they're responsible for Shepherding the much larger due diligence that needs to happen to make this work. If you actually look at the Harbor Graduation Review, that's one of the items on the agenda that I have. You can see the due diligence talk is about 26, 30 pages. This is what we created as Harbor Team to basically go through that review. Okay, thanks. So the other item that I have in the agenda is this new CNCF project that or this project that The OpenPR for For donation from Microsoft and Red Hat. It's called Kira. It's Kubernetes Autoscaler. So I think Amy is not around. So I don't know if Some of the other six actually so I'll think back with the security and see if they have any format. I think less Said on the Chat that If we don't have a specific format, then we we can actually interact with with our six The Asian or TLC liaison. I'm sorry. So to find out whether we can recommend it or not. But I'm going to, I'm going to kind of wait until Quentin is back. And so you can Go forward on on this project. And then and then the other item that I have is the written me for for the initial Segment time. So people are aware of the segment time that is available and then that is there and they can find what when we have our meetings. And so basically to get the group started. So I think we can talk about your heart Harbor graduation now. Absolutely. Thank you, Ricardo. So, so essentially me, you guys don't mind. Let me let me show my screen. Sure. It might be a little bit easier. Let me know if you can see it. Can you guys see my screen. I see it. Excellent. So essentially the so we have a PR for the Harbor graduation proposal. And as part of the PR, the responsibility for some of the shepherding of other six that may have to review it Lies on sick grand time. That's something that Quinton kind of spearheaded here if you see in the comments later on. So there's storage and security seek that also need to take a look. But since you have had asked us to go through sick runtime first, which is why we're here. Now we are willing to work with you guys to to spend as much time as necessary to answer your questions. But I think the first starting point is this two documents. The first one is this technical due diligence document for graduating Harbor. This is something that I created as a maintainer of Harbor. It walks you through a gamut of logistical governance security architecture items on Harbor. It's 30 pages. We tried to not miss anything so that when you guys go through this, there's not much that you have to ask more of us to produce as a team. Obviously, a lot of these have links back to the GitHub page that Harbor has. It has customer testimonials. So I feel like, you know, you have a complete view of Harbor. In addition to that, Quinton created these due diligence by the CNC of six, which is where you guys as a sick get to add some feedback in terms of answering some questions for Harbor. You like I don't feel like you need to answer each question one by one, because we I tried to follow the same format in my due diligence, you can probably just say meet all requirements or something like that. But if you want to be more explicit and spend more time on this, obviously feel free. So, so that's, that's kind of it. Any questions on that? So you have to update this document or this is something. The US as a sick have to update this document. The other documents on we create. Okay, so, and then you have a place for questions and then and basically we have to, as a sick specify passes criteria passes or. Yeah, okay. Yeah. And I don't think you need to go through each one of them super like I mean, like, I don't know if you want to sit down and answer these questions. If you look at the, like, for example, you successfully in production, you can come back to my document. And basically there's a Harbor users adoption, you can go here and look at people that have used it. So each of them I tried to make it easy for you guys to find things I created my document before Quinton created his. So I'm actually put here the document that sick runtime has to complete. Cool. Yeah. Yeah. So I haven't gone through the documents. So I haven't, yeah, I haven't synced up with Quinton. So I don't know what the, you know, we had in mind, but yeah, I'll take a look at the document. The biggest thing that we're looking for from a, from a Harbor team is to have some formal understanding of when you guys might start looking into this because we've been waiting for a couple of months right now in this graduation stage. So just let me know we'll work with you guys and identify the right, the right thing. Yeah. So we have a sick runtime slack channel. So if I think if you join that channel and then maybe you can ping us and then they can Quinton too. So and yeah, and Diane is here and oh, sorry. Yeah. And by the way, I don't want to be, I would also like to participate in sick runtime. You know, I'm already one of the leads in Kubernetes community. So I would love to participate more, but I will feel like it will be a conflict of interest to participate before a hard work review gets done. So yeah, yeah, good job. I think since I was saying that since Diane is here. So maybe if you want to be part of participators, you can also take a look at the document. I don't think you have to read it all, but then we can also kind of wait a little bit until we hear back from Quinton. Absolutely. So what I've already pinged Quinton on the on the PR. I don't want to ping him again. If you guys can talk internally and then since you guys meet every two weeks, I will likely be here in two weeks again to discuss this. Okay, great. So what is so Harvard's already in incubation, right? That is correct. How long has it been in incubation? About 15 months now, 14 months. Okay. So I don't know. More than that, like 15 months. And I don't know if there's a timeframe for that for between. That isn't really, it's more around, you know, has a project reached maturity to facility. The need to actually give it at the level of the status within CNCF. We have, we have so many users that we don't know off like every, every few days or every week we find out about a new user that's using Harbour at a scale that we never even fathomed. Like, you know, we had the other day, like right before the Christmas holiday, that's a company that's using Harbour and they have terabytes of storage in Harbour with thousands of images and tags. We didn't even know about these guys. There's so many of them. So people are coming out of the woodworks and telling us that, you know, hey, we've been using Harbour, we love it, we're putting in production. So kind of getting that to the next stage in CNCF is the natural progression. Yeah, sounds like, um, yeah. I don't know, I'm trying to be a graduate. All right, anybody has anything else? I think there's a short call. This is our first one. Any other items that they want to talk about? One, once, twice? When is, so, when is Quinton back, I guess, is the question? And, and do you, yeah, just so we could get his two cents on the review of Harbour and I have no idea. So, I mean, I haven't been in touch. And then I think Michael, you ping him, right? And he's not, he hasn't replied yet, right? That is correct. So, I don't know if he's still off from Christmas vacation, possibly. I think he might be off the grid because I haven't seen anything. Completely off the grid. Yeah. So, and so we do have a, there's a meeting on Tuesday. I won't be able to make that meeting too. There's a TOC meeting. So, some of the people interested in the secret also can attend that meeting. So, I started attending those meetings as well. Oh, and, yeah, Michael, you can also bring it up on the, on that meeting as well, too, if you want to. Well, the TOC is aware of this process. They already did the due diligence. So, Zhang from the TOC already gave thumbs up. Okay. So, this is just the six right now taking a look at this, but the TOC members already looked at it. And we have, I think, three sponsors. So, that's like, we're pretty well set on that. Diane, by the way, are you the Diane that used to attend sick windows meetings a couple years ago? Hi. Diane Mueller, did you? I didn't. This is Diane Fatima. This is confusing with two Diane's. Oh, okay. Yeah, I was talking about Diane Mueller. Yeah. No, probably it was me at some point. I've been pretty busy with a few other things. And I'll probably just listen in on these calls, because I'm also the community person for Project Quay. So, and Quay and Claire. Very cool. Our heavy users of Claire. All right. Well, in about 20 minutes, we're going to do a briefing on Claire 4 and Claire Core. If you want to join us, I'll pop the URL for the meeting in the chat. I have a conflict, but if that's going to be recorded, my team would definitely love to see that. Okay. Well, it will be in, and if you look on OpenShift Commons Twitter channel, I'll tweet out the recording. Yeah, it's a little bit confusing with two Diane. It's all right. We deal with it all the time. The only two Diane's in all of Red Hat, though. Yeah, that's it. You only get us and you luckily get both of us. That's awesome. Yeah, I love this link. If you can pop that in the Zoom chat, that'd be great. Thank you. Yeah, Diane, I want to see that too. In OpenShift Commons today. Give me a second. I'm just popping around calendars here. What's somebody else on the call? Is that Derek? Hey, yeah, so I'm just listening in. I'm a container to maintainer. Okay. Yeah, I mean, we'll see. I mean, I'm at Docker. Been on container D for a while, but my thing is usually limited time. But I can try to participate when I can. But I don't know about time commitments right now. We'll see. By the way, Ricardo, I'm assuming we're going to start recording these meetings in the future because folks might want to come in and view them offline. I know it didn't happen today, but I think it's been recorded actually. Yeah, it is being recorded. Oh, okay. It doesn't show the recording icon, I guess. Yeah, it shows for me. So if there's a little red dot on the top left, it says recording. All right. I put the link in the chat. Thank you. Got it. So these meetings are set up by the CNCF. So Amy from the CNCF set up this meeting. So I guess all these meetings from CNCF are being recorded. It's all good. All right. I'm going to drop off. It sounds like we're at the end of it and I'm going to get ready for that other briefing that I'm going to do in about 20 minutes. All right, guys. All right. Thank you guys. See you next time. Thank you. I'll see you in a couple of weeks. Bye.