 Ladies and gentlemen, you are in for a ride. We have a very special guest in the house, first time in Minnesota. No, I've been to Minnesota before. Okay, well, he's back. And that's Alan Stein, Jr. Alan, welcome to Ivy Unleashed. Oh my goodness, I'm so excited to be here. It's lovely to be with you both. This is a surreal moment for us because you're in my house. You're in where we do what we do. And not only is he here to record with us, but he also joined us for a workout this morning, a move workout. What did you think? It was awesome. You guys left me in the dust. I had trouble keeping up. It was great though. It was high energy. It was fun, great movements. I enjoyed it. Yeah. And we're very sweaty. So if you're watching on YouTube, that is why. Yeah, I'm probably glowing right now. So we found Alan by listening to one of our idols, Admylet. And Alan was on to talk about his incredible books, Sustained Your Game. So if you're looking on YouTube, Sustained Your Game by Alan Stein, Jr., an awesome book that Brooke and I needed. We needed this book so badly because we're chasing our dream. And you're basically helping us figure out how to keep doing this in the long term. So thank you so much for your book. Oh, my pleasure. Well, thank you guys for investing the time in reading it. You have a podcast and you're a keynote speaker today. You have a lot going on. So how is life for you kind of traveling, being an author, speaking for these huge corporations? How's that going? Life is fantastic. At 46 years old, life has never been better. I always like to say that I'm not speaking from a place of mastery on anything that I share on page or anything that I share on stage. These are all things that I'm still challenged by. I'm still struggling with. But I'm making progress. And I'm proud of that progress. I'm proud of the path that I'm on. And I'm slowly starting to figure some things out that work well for me. And one of the things that I said on Ed's show that I've gotten the most feedback from was the mantra that I live by, which is a candle loses nothing by lighting another candle. And that's ultimately how I view my work, is trying to help people light their candles. But I'm doing it through the things that have been challenging me for my entire life. So I'm so glad that it resonates with you guys. I'm so glad that Ed's show brought us together. I'm thankful to be here. And every time I have an opportunity to share whether it's on stage or whether it's an intimate setting like this for a podcast, I relish the opportunity to talk about things I'm passionate about. Yeah, and we have so much to get into. Awesome. Let's start first with the magic of this book. So your first book, Raise Your Game. And then you wrote Sustain Your Game. So what sparked, what inspired Sustain Your Game? Well, to piggyback on what I just said a moment ago, I write the book that I need to be reading myself. I find it equal parts liberating and therapeutic to be writing and researching about the things that I need help with. So when I decided to write Raise Your Game, I had just left the basketball training space after almost 20 years working in that business and decided to become a corporate keynote speaker and wanted to figure out what were the traits that I needed to ascend to the top of that craft and not playing the comparison game. I have no interest in being better than another speaker. I have a very strong interest in being the best that I'm capable of. So I wanted to try and figure out what are some of these principles of high utility that I learned through the game of basketball that I could now apply to the speaking craft. And that was the reason for writing Raise Your Game. So Raise Your Game was all about climbing that proverbial mountain. Now, I don't think I'm ever going to reach the summit. I think I'll be on the climb for my entire life. And that's a preference. I enjoy the pursuit and I enjoy the climb. But I started to figure out that there was a slight difference between what you need to do to reach the top and what you need to do to stay there for long periods of time. But the most important part of that is with a sense of joy and fulfillment. So how can I love my work as much at 46 as I did at 36 and at 26? And how can I keep that going in the right direction? So I'll love it even more at 56 and 66. And I came to the conclusion that the three things that undermine our ability to sustain high performance and sustain enjoyment and fulfillment are stress, stagnation, and burnout. And those are things that I've wrestled with my entire life. So I figured let's unpack them in this book. And yeah, thankfully I did. It's been a great journey. And I mean, even since the time of writing the book, now just being in the process of discussing it with others, I'm still continuing to learn. And I can say without question, I handle stress now consistently better than at any other point in my life. And I no longer fear stagnation or burnout because I believe I have the tools in place to ward both of them off. Doesn't mean I'm immune to them. And certainly doesn't mean that I don't feel stressed. But I feel stressed less consistently than I ever have before. And that leads me to believe I'm at least moving in the right direction. Yeah, something that I think you do really well too is applying these concepts to anybody. I think it starts from basketball. And you can learn a lot of life lessons, I think, from basketball and sports in general. Sports in general, yeah, the grit that you need. And I think stay a whole mom could read your book and say, how do I not get burned out in this? I think anybody can read this book and think about getting aligned with what they want out of their life and then continually doing that so that they don't burn out. Well, I appreciate you saying that because ultimately that's my goal, again, from page or from stage, my goal is to translate the principles of highest utility to people that don't share the love of basketball that I have. And I say this with great humility. If I'm talking to a group of people that love basketball, that's too easy. Like that's shooting fish in a barrel for me because that is my language. That is, there's no problem with that. It's making sure that I can apply those lessons or teach those lessons to people that don't love basketball, that don't love sport. I used to stay on stage kind of as a joke. It doesn't matter if you know the difference between LeBron James or Rick James. My job is to make sure that you walk away with lessons that can impact your life. And I take a lot of pride in that. And I think that's part of being a leader, being a communicator is being able to take these ideas and share them across the board. But then I've also tried to make sure that I step out of my bubble of only learning from the game of basketball and read, watch, listen to and research people from all different walks of life. And I have an absolute blast doing that. And you're damn good at it. Thank you. Reading your book, even the way, all the stories that you share with the professionals that you've worked with, Kevin Durant, for example, but more so just all of the coaches in your life and the stories that you share. Yes, they're around basketball and sports, but they're so applicable to anyone. And when we reached out, it was moms and women, they need to hear this. They need to hear about how to manage stress in a way that isn't overwhelming. Our whole goal with Ivy Unleashed and Gold Ivy is to simplify making people feel good. Yes. And you break it up in three parts, which are awesome, because whether you're dealing with stress or stagnation or burnout, there's so many different practical tools that you can apply. But your work really starts with the fundamentals. So let's get into that, the importance of fundamentals and why it's so hard for people to master the fundamentals. Well, this stems back from the first time I met Kobe Bryant and I had a chance to watch one of his early morning workouts. And I'll kind of fast forward. I have the full story on YouTube if anyone ever wants to see it, but the lesson I learned from Kobe, which I believe is the foundation of my life's philosophy now is that the best never get bored with the basics. That if you want to be good in any area of your life, and this is where it has practical application everywhere, you want to be a better spouse, you want to be a better parent, you want to be a better lawyer, you want to play the piano at a higher level. It doesn't matter, you have to learn to stick to the basics and the fundamentals. And that is difficult. I'll readily acknowledge that often in any area of life, the basics are monotonous, they're mundane, and they can get boring. And I also believe that society is wired to make us feel that we should always be chasing what's flashy and what's sexy and what's new and what's hot. So we've got the temptation to feel that the basics are boring. And then over here, we're constantly being tempted by what's new and what's shiny. I think that's the reason that many people kind of skip over the basics. And I know in my life, anytime I'm not performing at a level that I believe that I'm capable of, whether that's as a father or as a keynote speaker, once I have some self-reflection and some introspection, I can usually acknowledge I've started to wane away from the basics and I have to get back to them. So the goal is to never leave them in the first place, but because we're human, we're fallible, we're flawed, that's going to happen occasionally. So I make sure that I'm always going back and drilling in on the fundamentals. And one point to that, it doesn't mean that you only do the basics. It just means they're the foundation to which the rest of the house is built so you never leave them. So in a game like basketball, your footwork and your shooting mechanics are the basic movement patterns. So you do them for 15 to 20 minutes every single day. Then you graduate to more advanced skills and drills and techniques and so forth. So it doesn't mean you only do the basics, it just means you don't leave them. And the practical takeaway for everyone listening to this is figure out what area of your life you're trying to up level and then get crystal clear on what are the basics of that and how can I work on them? You know, I'm a huge believer that one of the basics for human connection. So this would be whether you're trying to improve your intimate relationship, improve a relationship with a colleague or coworker, improve your connection with your children is what you two are doing so beautifully now which is actively listening. Listening is a massive connective tissue. So if you want to improve any relationship in your life immediately, learn to become a better listener. That's one of the basic building blocks. Well, to get better at anything, you need to get in reps. You need to practice. So we all need to practice listening. Now, which is wonderful because there's no shortage of opportunities to listen because everybody likes to talk, you know, on social media everywhere, people like to talk, but practice the skill of active listening. I know that's one I've had to really work hard at over the last several years because I was an awful listener for the first 40 years of my life. It wasn't because I didn't care. It was because, you know, I had some deep rooted insecurities so I wanted to be liked and feel worthy. So I was always spending time figuring out what could I say to add to this conversation? How could I prove to you that I was smart? How could I one up you? And that's, that will actually erode your connection with other human beings. So once I learned to kind of take a deep breath, actually and genuinely care what other people have to say and practice the skill of actively listening, it's getting better. I'm not a world-class listener yet, but I'm better than I was before and that's all I can ask. I think that's a tricky balance too. When you are a speaker, you have a podcast. Like your job is to speak and same with us too. You know, we do have content we want to get to in this episode, but Brooke and I always say like, let's just be curious. Like let's just see what Allen has to say. Like if we don't get to this stuff, whatever. Like maybe we'll try again another time, but it's so true. Like I do think it's tricky when also you're a high performer. You do want a good speech or you do want a good podcast episode, but the magic really is in like the moment of what's gonna happen. I know one of your fundamentals has been meditation and it's something that we've been throwing into our routines too. And so could you just talk about some of your fundamentals? Like when you are like, let's simplify, let's get back to the basics. Like what are your go-tos? Sure. And let's, I want to backtrack real quick on listening because it is interesting because I am paid to speak. And literally that is what people pay me to do. However, it's the listening that happens beforehand that ensures that what I'm going to say when I speak hits the target. So later today, I'm so thankful you guys will be joining me for the keynote that I'm giving to 60 different franchisors and franchisees and a variety of different brands. And I remember vividly a couple of weeks ago being on the pre-event call with the gentleman that's running this event. And I didn't keep a stopwatch, but I'm willing to bet that if I recorded that conversation, he spoke for 90% of it, I spoke for 10. Cause I was just asking question after question. Who's going to be in the audience? What are their biggest challenges? What are their pain points? What things are going well? What do they need to hear? What behaviors do they need to change? What can I do to make this a home run? So it was just question after question. And he did most of the talking and did a brilliant job sharing everything that I needed to know so that I could take my notes and then customize a keynote. So today, when I'm the one doing the talking, I'm hoping it hits the mark. And same thing in anything. We were joking off before we hit record. I've been on a few dates recently. And during most dates, I'm pretty quiet. I am genuinely fascinated and I like to get to know the other person. I want to hear about their journey. So on most dates, and it's not that I'm shy and it's not that I don't mind talking about myself but I have a genuine curiosity. So I really try and practice the skill of listening in as many opportunities as I can. And the one that's been the biggest difference makers with kids, like listening to your kids, letting them share has been a big one. Yeah, I even think about in your book you mentioned picking someone's brain, right? And so business wise, knowing how can I be of service to you? And so coming to those relationships with, hey, here's how we think we could serve and help you and how just more authentic and the rapport that comes from that. So I think whether it's a business relationship or a personal relationship coming from a place of, how can I help you? It's not about you, it's the we but kind of putting that other person first. Yes, and that's one area that I've also had to make a major flip because I didn't navigate the first 40 years of my life through that same paradigm. I was incredibly selfish. Every time I would meet someone, I was unconsciously thinking, what can they do for me? How can I not take advantage of in a malicious or a manipulative way, but who do you know that you can introduce me to? What can you do to add value to me? And once again, this is all rooted in insecurity. If I feel like part of me is missing that needs to be completed, then I'm going to be searching for it somewhere else. If I already know that I'm not broken, then I can just come from a place of service. So I often speak as if there's been two Allenstein juniors. There's the previous one and there's the current one. And I realized that all of the makeup who I am, and this sounds really kind of fufu, but I've forgiven the previous knucklehead for some of those mistakes. That's just where I was on my journey. At that time, I was still doing the best I could with what I had where I was. I just didn't have a certain level of awareness and I certainly didn't have the emotional intelligence to be able to navigate that. So now, yeah, and I also realize it feels great to be of service. Lighting someone's candle certainly helps them, but boy, it feels really good to do that. So there are so many ways that I am now that I wasn't before, which is always fascinating because when I meet two wonderful people like you, you only know me as now, but I have some people in my life that have known me before and that's an interesting dynamic too. So always trying to level up and make these improvements and yeah, in that part I'm enjoying. What shifted? Yeah, that's a good question. Boy, a variety of things. I think when I hit 40, that was kind of a big eye-opening moment. You start to question your mortality, started going in for some therapy and some things around a divorce. Yeah, just like this perfect storm. Within a couple of years, you get divorced, you go through therapy, you've got young kids that are getting older, I decided to leave a 20-year vocation and jump into another pool and do something completely different. So it was a massive shakeup and all for the good. It wasn't easy. I can make it sound easy now. It wasn't easy going through it, but that was the right of passage. And yeah, I always say it all comes down to awareness. You'll never fix something you're unaware of, you'll never improve something you're oblivious to. So you have to have that level of awareness and I didn't have it for 40 years. If you would have asked me these same questions 10 years ago, I would have thought I had my stuff together. I would have thought, I just didn't know and so I'm thankful now that I know. And part of that is surrounding yourself with people that can help you see your blind spots. If you would have asked me 10 years ago, did I think I was a good listener? I would have said, yes, absolutely. I've heard every word that you've said, but I'm not really listening to it. While your lips are moving, I'm formulating my response or many times I would turn, because I'm very competitive, would turn conversations almost adversarial, like how can I one up you? If we're just having a friendly debate on something, I'm spending way more time thinking about how I'm going to beat you in this conversation instead of how I'm going to learn from you and learn your perspective. So yeah, it's all part of the journey. Yeah, I think something I'm hearing too is the desire to want to have that awareness, right? And I think that comes from two crises a lot. You're at a point where something has to shift, something has to change. And the only way to change is to do the hard work and to get that awareness, taking that reflection, slowing down to even know, what am I doing that isn't serving me? Yeah. And some of it just comes with life experience and maturity, I'm happy I've kind of quote unquote, seen the light at 40, because some people don't see it till 60, some people never see it. And that's another thing is you have to learn how to let go. I talk about the principle all the time of move to the next play. Do you dwell on the 40 years that you were less aware with lower emotional intelligence? Or do you dwell on the fact that that's no longer me? Now I've got potentially 40 more years where I can live a much more engaging and fulfilling and curious type of life. So it all just depends on what you focus on. And still to this day, I have my good days and my bad. I mean, yeah, no one's ever immune or cured from any of this stuff. It's all about incremental progress and consistency. Those are the two most important things for me. So I still have off days, I still have bad moods, I still feel lousy at times, but those times are a lot less frequent and certainly a lot less consistent than they've been at any other time. Yeah, something that Brooke and I struggle with business is when you're reading like entrepreneur books, like yours is different. Yours is like what we are really drawn to to not burn out, right? That's like what we're going for. But a lot of the books and a lot of the people like, go hard, you don't sleep, you push, push, push. And they are successful. So think of your first, you know, 10 years of being a performance coach, like very successful, huge connections, your ability to go, go, go and make all those connections. And maybe you did feel selfish or maybe you think you were, but it worked. Like you are connected to some huge people and have had great success. And so that's something we struggle with is like, we're trying to sustain our game here. But like at what cost? Like would we have made more money in the last couple of years if we pushed harder and didn't sleep, you know? Or do we do this different? And like literally your book is like telling us we're on the right path because we are trying to pepper and rest and meditation and manage our stress and come from alignment. And so I'm curious your thoughts on that, like grind versus rest, the balance of that with business. Well, I'll ask you, do you think you would have made more money or accumulated more listeners or followers if you would have pushed harder over the last 10 years? Because I don't necessarily know that you would have. You may have, but I don't know that it's guaranteed. You know, one of the things that I did learn from the strength and conditioning world is that you want to do the minimal amount of work needed to create the maximum effect. And when I say minimal, a lot of people, they click on the mental cruise control and they think, oh, that means easy or that means taking shortcuts. No, I mean, if the workout we did this morning was phenomenal, really, really, really hard. It was 30, what, 32 minutes long? Yeah. Yeah, that's perfect. Now, could we have gone for 40 minutes? Possibly, but would we have made any more progress adding eight minutes to that? I don't necessarily know that we would have. You know, if we all went out this evening and we all had a bunch of cocktails and drinks and tomorrow each one of us had a small headache, we would each take the minimum number of Advil necessary to remove the headache, not the maximum. You don't say I'm gonna take 10 Advil to get rid of the headache if two gets rid of it. So I've always believed in doing the least amount possible from a volume standpoint. So I always thought that if my basketball players could come in and I could give them an amazing workout in 45 minutes and you two took 90 minutes and they got the exact same results, then my program would be superior because it's more time efficient. That would give them an extra 45 minutes to work on the skills of the game or to watch film, you know, because time is our most precious resource. So I think that's part of the problem too. Not only is the hustle and grind culture, it's not sustainable. I don't necessarily know to a point that it's more effective. I was talking with a coach one time. So I'm a huge Coach K fan, the recently retired coach at Duke. Coach, do you know what was it? 42 years at Duke, won over a thousand games and he was a worker. I mean, he was, you know, even up until his last year, people would say he's working 60, 70, 80 hours per week. And this, I'm not saying this with judgment. He was doing what he wanted to do, but I asked a young coach and said, okay, if over 42 years, if Coach K worked five less hours per week, 52 weeks a year for 42 straight years, that's a significant amount of time. Do you think he would have won any fewer games than he won? And the coach said, no, probably not. I think he would have won the same. So that just makes you wonder. And that this is by no means a judgment of Coach K. I mean, I consider him the goat, but it does, it makes you wonder. So for me, my goal is what's the minimum? It sounds weird saying it, considering I'm in the quote unquote motivational space. What is the minimal amount of work I can do each week to produce a maximum result? I'm not looking for shortcuts. I wanna be the best I'm capable of on stage and on page. I want my podcast. Like I want those things to be extraordinary, but if I can be extraordinary in 25 hours a week, verse 45 hours a week, that frees up 20 hours to be with my children or to train for a race or to do a lot of other things that I'd like to do. So that's part of the hustle grind culture. I think that comes back to something you talk a lot about is focus, right? If you know you have 30 minutes to get this done, you are laser focused, you're getting it done. And that's what we've developed is, okay, we're working a full-time job on top of trying to build our business. And so we're chunking our time. And so we time block. You know exactly when you're getting the things done. And then you're sticking true to that. You're doing it when you say you're doing it. So then that's your commitment to yourself and you're building confidence, but it comes from being focused. And in today's world, it is so damn hard with all the distractions. So I think what you're saying is awesome if you have that focus. So I'm curious how you have focus. Well, yeah, I'm gonna backtrack one second. I know I keep backtracking, sorry. It's your podcast and I keep hitting the rewind, but no. The other thing I learned in strength and conditioning is you don't get stronger when you're in the weight room. You get stronger during the rest and recovery period in between that if you decide to do a full body strength workout seven days a week, you're going to burn out. You're going to get injured and you're gonna stagnate. You're not going to make progress. So you need to follow really intense work efforts with appropriate rest. That's how I view my work now. Cause I don't want this to be taken out of context. I believe in hard work and I will put my work ethic up against anyone's. It's just my on switch is not on 24 seven. My on switch is on for a few hours every day where I do have razor focus and I'm giving it my best effort, but then I turn it off so that I can rest my mind, body and my spirit so that I can come back and be even better. So that's the problem with the hustle grind culture is they never talk about the off. And when they do, it's kind of this, this almost male bravado chauvinistic, you're like work hard, play hard. Like, yeah, we'll work 16 hours a day and then we'll go out and we'll have some drinks. Like, no, that's not rest and recovery. That's not how you become your best self the next morning. That's how you burn yourself out. So that, that is a big part of it. From a focal standpoint, really I've got a crystal clear vision of the person I'm trying to become and every decision I make, I run through the filter of, is this taking me closer to being that person or is it taking me further away? From what I eat for breakfast to who I follow on Instagram to what I watch on Netflix, I ask myself, is this taking me closer to the person I want to be? And if the answer is yes, then maybe I'll decide to put some focus into it. If the answer is no, then I do my best to abstain or find something better. And I'm not looking to bat 1,000. Yeah, I don't mean every single thing that I eat is perfectly, you know, nutritious for me, but most of the things I eat are nutritious and feed my body. Like, I have that approach with everything. So for me, that's the filtering system. And then you can break that down into silos. So I have a certain goal that I'm trying to reach from a speaking standpoint. So I ask myself, is saying yes to this opportunity going to take me closer to reaching that speaking goal? If it is, I do it. If it's not, then I at least have a hesitation to decide whether or not it's worth doing. And that means you have to get good at saying no, which is not something I've been habitually good at for the first 40 years. I was a bona fide people pleaser. Love saying yes would often say yes to do something to satisfy your needs, even though they were completely contradictory to where I was trying to go. And then I felt frazzled. Then I felt like there's not enough time. Then I would get irritable. You know, there's just not enough time to get done what I want to get done. Well, yeah, cause you've been saying yes to everybody else. And you've been, you know, helping them do what they're trying to accomplish. So now I've learned that you can say no with tact, with civility, with professionalism, with courtesy, you know, I appreciate the offer, but that's not a great fit for me right now, but I wish you the best with it. I mean, I literally cut and paste that into emails when people ask for opportunities that just aren't in the right fit. And that's okay. And then many times I say, you know, this isn't the right fit for me right now, but please come back in six months because it may be then. You know, if my speaking schedule is really full one month, I don't have a lot of extra time to do people's shows and things like that. It doesn't mean that I don't want to do them. I know it'd be a wonderful conversation, but come back in December when my speaking load is a lot lighter and then I'll be happy to make time for you then. And most people are incredibly gracious about that. Yeah, I love too that, you know, when you're saying yes to something that you're not super thrilled about, you're saying no to something that could be a lot more important. So it's like, if I'm saying yes to this, what am I saying no to? And is it even in that filter of that alignment? I love what you said about that of, you know, what is it? What type of person do I want to be? And is this aligning with that? And if it's not, I'm probably gonna be resentful or have guilt or shame about it because I already know what I wanna be doing and this is not it. Yeah, well, so without getting too granular, I'm 46. I know that I'm not promised the next 20 years, but if I keep taking care of myself, statistically I should be around for another 20, let's hope. So I want the 66 year old Allen to be physically, mentally and emotionally fit. All right, that's a pretty big umbrella. I want the 66 year old Allen to have a deep connection with his kids and his family and his friends. Again, pretty wide. And I want the 66 year old Allen to be doing work he considers meaningful and in service of others. So those are big, that's what I mean. I'm not getting too specific, but that pretty much covers everything that's important to me. That covers my physical, mental and emotional health. That covers my relationships. That covers my vocation and where I'm choosing to put my energy. So now I just ask myself, is doing this taking me closer to being that person? But the beautiful part is I'm not postponing anything. I'm making decisions in the present moment for who I'm trying to be in the future. So on one level I'm designing my future, but I'm reaping the benefits in the present. Again, I don't mean for this to sound like it's lacking humility, but the 46 year old Allen is physically, mentally and emotionally fit, does have a great relationship with his kids and is doing work he considers meaningful and in service of others. So I'm doing those things now. It's not like I'm not making the mistake that a lot of people make of postponing their happiness. I will be happy when and then you fill in the blank. When I get the next job, when we get the next house, when my kid can start, and there's obviously all sorts of landmarks with children. No, I'm not postponing anything. I'm as happy as can be right now, but I'm making these decisions and laying the bricks and the foundation to make sure that's who I am at 66. And then 76 and 86. And depending on how medicine goes, maybe 106, 126, 156. He ain't going nowhere. No, I'm not, we'll see. Well, what that sounds like to me is those habits and the rituals that you have. Those are your fundamentals. And you say, are the habits you have today on par with the dreams you have for tomorrow? Yes. You nailed it. One of my biggest professional honors is that quote tanging in Penn State's training room. And boy, I know, I realize I sound like such an a-hole with saying some of these things. Hopefully you guys have, you know me well enough to know that I have a sarcastic sense of humor, but my favorite joke is the quote next to mine in the Penn State Training Center is by Gandhi. So I just like telling everyone that I feel like, you know, Gandhi and I are on very similar levels. Hell yeah. Yeah, you know, I still have to go by Alan Stein Jr. He just goes by Gandhi, but you know, they decided to take these two quotes and put them up as that was Penn State's decision, not mine. I love that you're talking about this because something that Brooke and I have been thinking, right, like you coming here, like you are a very big deal. Like you have very big connections with very big people. You've had a very successful career. And I wonder what that's like to, because you're a very humble, personable, genuine, like we picked Alan up in our car today. We're like, what are we doing? How is he gonna be in our car? And so I'm curious how that goes in life when you have these huge connections, you're speaking at these big events and then you're trying to stay humble and grounded in, like I'm just Alan. You know, like how does that go and how does that work in your brain? I very much appreciate the praise and the kind words that you just shared. It's almost like a cognitive dissonance. Like I almost, because I don't view myself that way because I have people that I view that way. So I've got a list of people that if I picked them up in my car, I'd be like, I can't believe this person's in my car. So everything is perspective. Everything is vantage point that we're all making these different comparisons. I mean, I do have that lit. Like Ed Milet was one of them. It was surreal for me to be on Ed's show and sit down with him. That was unbelievable. I mean, I've been trying to track Ed down for three years to get on his show. That also shows the level of persistence I have. I can be somewhat of a relentless unshakable pain in the ass when there's something that I really want. But it took three years and it finally came to fruition. But here I am thinking that about him and it feels really weird that someone could possibly be thinking that about me. And along those same lines, I can promise you that Ed thinks that about a group of people as well. Now, he's probably had a chance to meet them. So it's just, it's vantage point, it's perspective. I just know so many people have poured into me and so many people have let my candle that I feel that I need to be a steward to pay that forward and to continue to light more. But I mean, we all only see what we choose to share. So you guys see that I was on the Ed Milet show. You don't see that there's 20 other podcasts of Ed's size that either politely declined or never emailed me back, have no interest in me, have no idea who I am and don't believe I would add any value to their show. And that's okay. I don't say that with an ounce of scorn. They're doing what's best for them. I'm trying to do what's best for me and my mission. And it's okay, I don't take it personal. So I've learned some resilience. I get told no a lot more than I get told yes. For every speaking engagement I get, I get three or four that would say no thank you or you're not the right fit. And it's always funny when they say it's not personal. I'm like, well, it's kind of personal. You're basically saying you don't want this face and words coming out of this mouth on your stage. How could it get any more personal? I don't know that it could be more personal. Yeah. I love that you said that. That's so important for people to understand even just like social media in general, like you're seeing the highlight reel, right? And I think it's really important for successful people for authors to say, I hear no all the time. Oh boy. Yeah, the book is a perfect example. So I'm proud of the people that I had a chance to speak to to be in this book. Very proud and I'm very thankful for the time they gave. I am not even remotely exaggerating that it is six to one, six no's for every single person that's in that book. Like so many times I've reached out. Now, and even of those six, maybe one or two of them have the courtesy to write back and say, we don't have time. It's not a good fit for me at this time. And I respect that. And then a lot of them you just don't hear anything back. So also a lot of the way I guide my life, I don't like not hearing back from someone. I don't like being ghosted. I would prefer that someone just says no, thank you. But I also realize that's being very selfish. That is my preference. And it's not the universe's job to unfold to meet all of my preferences. However, because I don't like the way it feels when someone doesn't return my email. I've returned every single email I've ever received in the last 20 years. And if anyone listening to this can prove to the contrary, please resend me the email. Cause it means I didn't get it. Maybe it got stuck in spam or whatever lost in the ether. But I make sure to write someone back and be honest and so forth. So for every interview that was done in that book, six people told me no. For the speaking engagement you guys will get to see today, six people have said I'm not the right fit. So that means my goal every year is to do 60 paid speaking engagements. So that means I'm hearing no 300 times or whatever my math isn't great. That's why I'm a keynote speaker. That means you're hearing 300 no's for those 60 yeses. How do you get comfortable with that? Is it just over time you get used to it and you have those practices where it isn't personal? What does that look like? It's a little bit of both. Yeah, no, I can talk myself off the ledge now because there are times where it does sting or you do feel like it's personal or someone kind of led you to believe, yeah, I'll be able to do that interview. Just check back with me. Yeah, it's gonna be, yeah, and then all of a sudden you don't hear from them ever again. So yeah, but I've learned to be okay. We talked earlier in the car about sitting with uncomfortable feelings. So yeah, I can just lean into that and try not to take it personal. And yeah, you do kind of inoculate yourself to it and you build up a thick skin. But that's the way that it is. And I said it before and I'll say it again. It is, I have my preferences in life, but it's not the world's job to meet my preferences. It's my job to adjust to the world around me. It is my preference that no cars are ever in my way whenever I'm driving somewhere. That is a preference of mine. I live in the suburbs of Washington DC. That rarely happens. There is traffic most of the time. So it's not my preference, but I'm not gonna change anything by getting upset by it. So if I reach out to you two to interview you for my next book and you guys politely decline, getting upset is not going to change that outcome. It's not going to get you to reverse your decision. So the only person I'd be punishing by getting upset and getting bent out of shape is myself. And trust me, I've done plenty of that, but it doesn't help. So you just learn to just kind of move on. And I find that time is a great healer. I play it by a 24 hour rule. So I allow myself to be down in the dumps, to be in my feelings, to pout, to complain, to kick and scream for 24 hours when things don't go my way and then we're on to the next play. That's it, move on to the next play. So yes, I feel this, I'm not a robot. I feel disappointment just like everybody else, but I learned to process it, I learned to move on. And then I try to navigate my life in a way how can I lessen the occurrence of other people's disappointment? If you guys reach out to have me on your show again and I politely decline, which I never would. I'll do this anytime you guys want. But if I were to politely decline, you still may choose to be disappointed and you have the right to do that, but I don't want to give you any extra ammo for doing it by being rude or disingenuous or not responding to you. So I've learned to focus on what's on my side of the fence and I try to tend to my yard to the best of my ability as consistently as possible.