 We're back with the breakfast in Plus TV Africa. Nika Gule joins us this morning for Off The Press. It's actually the last for 2022. Nika, it's good to have you join us this morning once again. Merry Christmas. Good morning. Merci. Merry Christmas to you and Merry Christmas to our viewers. All right then. Let's, you know, delve into the matter now. We start off with the nation newspaper. The nation says G5 governor's position puts a tickle in a tight corner. It feels like there's a song, you know, by Nigerian artists to this situation. Why PDP candidate cannot seek elders intervention? Don't sanction WK orders. These are writers underneath the board caption. And Lagos names preferred bidders for the fourth mainland bridge. That's a billion for senators, reps, package and 2023 budget. And some people say it's a fiscal irresponsibility, the budget of 2023. Football legend, Pele dies at 82. Defend yourself against bandits, says governor. Abiyadu signs 472 billion Naira 2023 budget into law. Buhari lords bellow on security projects in Kogi. Buhari lords bellow, that's a higher bellow on security projects in Kogi. That's what you find this morning on the nation. But let's turn our attention to the leadership this morning. Sanction threats, G5 governors, their PDP say we're not afraid or really. It's a lot. We have done nothing wrong or Tom. There's no crack in G5 rugs. WK saying struggle for sudden presidency continues. I really don't know what's going on. It feels like, you know, we're living in a different dispensation. We're proud of your higher bellow on security projects. Execution president, Mohammad Abuhari is quoted on that. And the leadership is also talking about the soccer legend, Pele, that died or who has died at the age of 82. Superstar of Brazil, quite unfortunate. But I had some prayers with him and, of course, his family. Lagos lawyer, MBA demands five billion Naira compensation for Balanley Rahim. Allege terrorism, court stops DSSC from arresting a mafia. A beyond the science 472 billion Naira 2023 budget, that's for Ogun state. I said on the leadership. Now we have the punch. The punch says, aggrieved PDP governors demand tunable support in five states. Oh, wow. PDP governors concerned about political careers seeks assurance from tunable ex Lagos governor to brief party. And so you know the issue of it's a gentleman agreement. Now, yes, he has to go to the south. Well, what part of the south are we talking about now? Is it the south west or the south east? G five governors visit a current Madu in prison, returned from the United Kingdom. A budget court bars DSS orders from arresting a mafia. This might just be dominating all of the papers this morning. Telecom six and CC approval to disconnect banks. We had this conversation yesterday with the stakeholder. And we probably might just be heading towards, you know, that destination. The daily sound says I am not perturbed by G five governors plots. Should you be perturbed or not perturbed? But at the end of the day, you know, Nigerians, the electorate, of course, they have a mind of their own that definitely decide who becomes the president, even though you have all the factors that might affect it in 2023. I think we're saying I'm not perturbed by G five governors plot and all seem to be tilting towards the APC, according to the reports this morning. Bandits killed 20 in Fauci communities. Residents flee. Rain of tears for Obi-Azo, as a mate is better holds February the 16. Jonathan, article, Karlu, to Nubu, Obi-Okoa, Moosu, others pay tribute to Ohaneze's presidents. Now, don't forget, a mate is, you know, the Ohaneze, former Ohaneze's president was late now. Ballanley killing. Police will work with Lagos, a Tony general to prosecute corporate IGPs saying, do we need all of that? Is the law not very explicit on the issue of mother? Allege terrorism, more drama as court basties as IGP from arresting Godwin MFLE off the Central Bank of Nigeria. Fauci dead in Kogi explosion as Buhari visits. I will pursue, I will pursue Agiakuta still issues to conclusion before leaving office. That's what the president is saying. I mean, they're more interesting headlines, but we're out of time. Let's have a Nika Gule join this morning and share his thoughts. Nika Gule, which of the headlines would you like to react to this morning? Yes, we have quite a lot on the plate. I think I would like to start with the mother of the lawyer because it's a really sad one. The year is ending on a very sad note. That is because the Nigerian police that is being paid by Nigerians that is being recruited, trained and paid by Nigerians have again turned their guns on the people that they are expected to defend. And the scary aspect of this is that it is just a question of who is next because all these shenanigans, you know, the statements issued by the IGP and all of that in the usual Nigerian way, we don't see any hope that this case is going to be prosecuted with logical conclusion. And this officer who has deprived in Nigerian of her life, we also have his own life deprived. We're not confident. We're not hopeful that that is going to happen, especially now that is government. So that's actually the scary part. All right then, let's move on from, you know, that headline and look at all the issues this morning on the pages of a national deal is G5 governor's position, position puts a ticker in a tight corner and that's on the nation. Now on the leadership it says that G5 governors, they're the PDP. They say we're not afraid. So that's a question as to why they haven't been sanctioned, the issue of sanctioned because you can't say that you work for a certain organization and then you're, you know, pushing the cost of another organization. It's very contradicting. And without any, you know, any saying, I mean, what should be done. It's expected that this is, you know, contrary. It's not legal. It's not what should be. But this is what, you know, these governors are saying and they're also demanding support according to the report from the presidential candidate of the All Progressive Congress. What are your thoughts on this really? Has the PDP lost itself, you know, a house that cannot put its act together, cannot stand? Yes, this is a real problem for the PDP because they cannot just come out to sanction these governors because we're talking about five states. To win a presidential election, you need to win the popular vote. That means you need to win the highest votes, first and foremost, and then you need 25% of the votes in two tiers of the states in Nigeria. So two tiers of 36 states is 24 states. So if you now have five states taken out of 36, you are now battling with 31 states, first and foremost, to win that 25%. And you see, these governors are very much on the ground in their states. They control the party structures in their state. They control, to a large extent, the electorate that comes out to vote because the electorate that cannot be controlled, that is, those who are where to do, who don't need a mitigate from a governor or so, those who also have voter apathy. They usually will sit at home in their houses on election day or some will even fly out of the country for various reasons that they will give. So these governors have these structures in their hands. So the PDP is fully aware that, look, we cannot be joking with five states. And that is why it's difficult for them to visit the sanctions that ordinarily should have been visited or any member of a party who is engaging in anti-party activities. On the other hand, the G5 governors themselves also have a difficult situation because, you see, right now they are harping nothing. Some of them haven't come out to say they are supporting any other presidential candidate. So look, we are two months away from the polls. And as a governor, you are yet to take a stand to say, okay, this is where the camp, where I belong. That's also a problem for the governors. At the end of the day, these are politicians. And politicians have a way of resolving their issues the political way. So I believe that there will be some sort of host trading and all sort of night crawling meetings and all of that to kind of have a resolution to this. And we look forward to the next few days or weeks to see where this is all going to end. Well, but the question would be, should this be, I mean, should this be the case? Are you not surprised that the fact that you have governors who belong to a certain party not placing or putting their loyalty to the party but seem to be, you know, having affiliation, fraternizing with other political parties, is it normal? I mean, that's what it's like if you have a family, I mean, if that would be a good illustration and then you seem to discard your family, then you are supporting another family and projecting them. In politics, in a normal course of things, as a family is not normal. But in politics, there is what they call in politics, there are no permanent friends. It's all about permanent interest. Even when there's a law, I mean, even when there are rules of engagement. Politicians don't understand those rules. So let me draw our attention back to 20 in the run-up to the 2019 elections. We had governors from the PDP who actually left and joined the APC and that contributed to, I'm not even talking about 2019, I'm talking about 2015, when President Buwari first won election. In that 2015 election, there were governors in the PDP who actually, I think it was a G7GA something, I remember what that G was, but they actually left and joined the APC. They were a bloc that joined the APC and that contributed to bringing President Buwari into office. So these are the kind of things you see every now and then, especially Nigerian politics where these politicians continue to jump ship from one party to the other because of their own interests. They don't think about family. If these guys think that family, they will even treat us better. How is a father watching children, hungry, children seek, can assess medical care, and that father will care nothing about it. That's the way the politicians are treating us. Today, this thing is all about politics. It's all about interest. It's all about grabbing. So they're not thinking about families. And I can assure you that this is all politics and they are going to settle this thing in the political way, in one way or the other. The next few days or weeks ahead will make it clearer to us. Okay. Let's turn our attention to the Ajakuta Steel. The fact that there's been several allocation funds have been allocated to the Ajakuta Steel without any, you know, I'm not sure they've produced anything, you know, for a very long time now, but we have been allocating resources. And on the punch, it says Ajakuta Steel projects 500,000 drops, 1.6 billion dollar annual revenue. I really don't know where that's coming from. The president is also saying that he's not going to give up on that. He will definitely continue your thoughts really. Nika Gule, can you hear me? All right then. What do you make of the Ajakuta Steel that has not been productive for a very long time? And the fact that we still have expectations. I don't know if this is real in paper or just the hearsay or statements that's been made by the president saying he will continue projects, the job opportunities and what have you. So we constantly have to, you know, invest money, allocate money to a sector or an agency or an organization. Whatever it is we target, that's not productive. Nothing has come out of it. Yes. So what I'm saying is Ajakuta is a sad story in Nigeria, just like the power sector, the petroleum sector, the gas sector, these are low-hungry foods that Nigeria has failed to pluck over time. You cannot have development without ion and steel. You know, you cannot have development without electricity. You cannot have development with gas. You cannot have development without having all the infrastructure. And Nigeria has taken her eyes of these basic ingredients that, you know, develop nations area. And we heard about these plans all over the country and we have allowed them to rot. Just as we have allowed the refineries to rot and we have allowed our gas plants to rot and all of that. And one of the reasons behind this is what we keep preaching. The government can't do any business. You see, even in the advanced world, in America, in the UK and all those kind of places, where systems are working, institutions are strong, government has realized that they cannot run business efficiently. And so they have handed over these factors of production into the private sector. In Nigeria, we have a very clear case. We look at nighting of those days and we look at telecoms for today. And we cannot even, there's no basis for comparison. And the only difference is because the telecom was handed over to the private sector who have brought in their money, their expertise, their technology to provide these telecom services to Nigeria. The same thing needs to happen. Of course, for this government, they have less than six months to go. So we are looking at the next government. One of the first things the next government must do is to privatize totally the state sector. Hand over this in a very transparent, open and legitimate privatization process. Let those who are operating in the state sector around the world come in and then take these things and then run with. And Nigeria will be the better for. Not only are we not going to have the necessary raw materials to develop our own industries so that we are no longer importing cars, importing machinery and all of that. This thing is going to create humongous jobs for the young men and women in Nigeria who have graduated and have nothing to do. So to me, that's just the solution. We need to put these things in the private sector and then government sits back, regulates the sector and then makes humongous money from the taxes that will not be paid. But at this time, the Ajakuta Steel is a project so it's projecting 500,000 jobs, $1.6 billion annual revenue. So should then not be given another chance. And on the second hand, why have we constantly allocated resources to Ajakuta Steel when we know that it's not productive? So we've been paying salaries for nothing. It's no result. The same way we're paying salaries to refineries that are not working, paying salaries to the past sector and also electricity is all about the Nigerian problem. Let us ask ourselves, these steel plants were built, I think in the 80s, from the 80s till now, a period of more than 40 years, they have delivered nothing. How then are we going to be sure that these promises that they are making will not just be on paper, but it will result into tangible delivery? I don't have any hope for that because I asked myself, what is going to change between the way they are operating now and the way they will operate to deliver this kind of humongous returns that they are talking about? I think it's just a scam. It's totally a scam. It's not going to happen. We have waited for more than 40 years for it to happen and it has not happened and there is no hope that it's going to happen even in the next four years when a new government comes in. The solution to this is as well we have done in the telecoms. Let the government step back and leave this thing into the hands of the private sector and Nigeria will be the better for it. Well, it's very saddening and unfortunate, but we move away from that and look at other issues still here on the papers this morning as we coasted down and now it talks about Abuja court barring DSS and orders from arresting the CBN governor, the Godwin and Mephili, I mean to be very specific because you know there's been a lot of confusion or back and forth with his identity whether it's a Godwin and Mephili or it's just Godwin of the Central Bank of Nigeria to be precise. But your thoughts really, I mean what do you make of this that you know a very prominent agency of government such as that governor or director like you like to say will be involved in all of this back and forth. I think it's a sad day for the judiciary. The judiciary is there as a number of government to adjudicate on matters be they criminal or civil. And so when the judiciary now turns itself to blocking investigation, blocking the security agencies from reaching out to people and bringing them to the law. It is like a doctor who is now blocking patients from coming to the hospital. It doesn't make sense. What you expect costs to do is to give a free hand to the security agencies to carry out their work and then when the result of the investigation results into a prosecution that is when the judiciary should now make a determination as to whether the case of the state against this individual is strong enough to bring on a conviction. So the problem in the Nigerian judiciary is there and it's one of the things that has to be sorted because you see all these countries that we are Japan to. Japan to UK, Japan to US, Canada, all those places. It is because the law enforcement in that place is very strong. That's what keeps citizens in check and then the place becomes sane enough to attract us to start Japan too. If we don't enforce laws in Nigeria, it's not going to happen. Nigeria will never develop. And for me, the judiciary should just step back from all these shenanigans. They should just be waiting for when cases are before them to adjudicate. Why would you be stopping somebody from being arrested? He should be arrested. You know, in the US, the security agencies went into Donald Trump's office and investigated him. They went into Boris Johnson's office and investigated him. That is what should happen. What should be above the law. And for me, what the judiciary is doing here is a sad one. And actually, the National Judicial Commission, the agency to step in here and call this era, George, to book. Now, as we cost this done, I know you have talked about the issue of Balan Le Rahim. That's what you started off with this morning. But another aspect of, you know, is that the MBA is demanding that fine. Should we be talking about compensation before justice? Should justice not take preminence? Justice has to take the first step. We have this case, like we're just saying now, has to be allowed unfettered prosecution and sentencing if the offender is convicted. So that should be what should be preeminent because sadly, a life has been lost. A promising life has been lost. She cannot be brought back. But the consequences have to be meted on to those who have caused this unfortunate death. So I agree that let us work through the justice process, bring on the prosecution and then a conviction. And then if there are damages that need to be paid, they need to be paid. But what is to come first and foremost, before even prosecution is counseling. In Nigeria, we don't have counseling services. And that is why a lot of people are traumatized. A lot of people are suffering psychologically. You see, the family, I think it was said that the husband or so was even in that vehicle where the wife was shot. That man is totally traumatized. The family members are traumatized, friends and colleagues are traumatized. That's where all of the counseling services should have been extended to these people to try and heal them because it is that lack of healing that has made Nigeria to be such an angry society. You can hardly have a conversation, a decent conversation with people because people are carrying so much within them. And that to me is what is lacking. Nigeria needs to put these counseling services in place so that people who have victims of cases like this dastardly murder can actually be healed before getting back into society. Well, Nika Gule, we have to go at this point. Thank you so much for being with us and being part of the press, the very last for 2022. I look forward to seeing you in 2023 of things being called. Thank you very much and thanks to our viewers. And I think access is the last addition, let me wish all of us a happy new year 2023. If you have not yet received your voter card, please go and receive it because 2023 is a watershed moment for Nigeria, where we are going to elect the leaders that we want. Thank you. And that said, we take a break. When we return, we'll be looking at our first conversation right here. We're looking at the budget that's been passed by the National Assembly from 21.1 trillion Naira for 2023. Please stay with us.