 Welcome to our interview show in which we interview LGBTQ guests who are important contributors to our community. We want to acknowledge that All Things LGBTQ is produced at Orca Media in Montpelier, Vermont, which is unceded Indigenous land. Enjoy the show. Welcome to the All Things LGBTQ interview show. As people who are regular viewers will know, for the past several months, All Things LGBTQ has been promoting an upcoming series of town hall forum that being sponsored jointly by the member organizations of the LGBTQIA Alliance of Vermont and joining us today are two of the people who have been instrumental in putting those forums together. And the first is the director of communication and development, doesn't that sound impressive, of the Pride Center of Vermont. Welcome back, Justin Marsh. Thank you. Well, I think this is actually only the first time I've been here as Justin. I think you're correct because the other two visits might have been in a very well-known persona who we will have to invite back on in the near future. But first I want to start by giving a acknowledgement at the Pride Center of Vermont. If you are not familiar with the services they provide, please go on to their website and Facebook page because they continue to evaluate need and expand the services available to LGBTQ plus Vermonters. But for today, I want to talk with Justin about you and the Pride Center was instrumental in ensuring that these town hall forums happened again this year. Why was it important that the forums happened again? And what is it that the Pride Center was hoping would be the result of the forum? Yeah, so in late 2019, I know that you and Brenda Churchill were instrumental in getting all of the very first town hall series going and I was lucky enough to be a part of that down at the Bennington and Brattleboro sessions. And what was great about seeing that and meeting queer people in those spaces is that we as a statewide organization, the Pride Center of Vermont, we are located in Burlington. Of course, it's very hard to conduct statewide services from one central location, especially when it's in the northern part of the state. So for me, it was just really great to meet folks in those counties and to have conversations with them. And so when I was finished with Pride 2020, which was so different than of course all the other prides, I was actually talking to my therapist and I was like, what am I going to do? I kind of crashed after Pride. And I was like, I just feel like I need something to kind of keep me sustained in this work. And that through our conversation was picking this up and saying, okay, there's no reason why we can't do these town hall forums in the zone that we're in now Zoom. So why don't we just, I'm going to try to go do this. And so what I knew I wanted to do was kind of par-bake the concept. Of course, you and Brenda had done so much work last year. But I wanted to make sure that if I brought this back to folks, that there was enough for people to latch on to. So I worked with a UVM student, Matt Hagberg, and Matt and I conducted this whole outline. We were going to do them all right off the bat. Actually, we would have been done by the time this is airing now, because I was on a fast track to make it November and December. And once I brought it to the group, we realized I was going way too fast. So we slowed it down. We reworked things. And it's just really nice to see a truly collaborative project among all of the organizations. And again, the point being to really connect with folks in all the parts of Vermont. I have this thing. I started at the Pride Center in 2018. And I'm a Long Island County resident. And it was my, I say it probably at least once a week at work. And that's that we really need to work on being statewide. And we need to, there's 13 other counties in the state that need our work and support and services. And we do our damn best trying to get out to them, but we could always do better. So this is, this is part of that. So you've talked about this being a collaborative effort, which is greatly appreciated. Now, could you talk a little bit about this year, obviously because of COVID, it needs to be virtual events. They can, they cannot be in person, but there was also a decision to move away from making them geographically based to issue based. Can you share a little bit about what that conversation was like? And then what are the issues that were decided upon? And how was that decision made? Sure. So firstly, the, the collaborative effort with the LGBTQIA Alliance of Vermont, the main sort of groups that are really working hard on making this come to fruition are out in the open, which is based on in Brattleboro and outright Vermont, which is the youth organization based in Burlington, the Pride Center, and of course, Rainbow umbrella of Central Vermont, which Rachel will get to later. But I just wanted to put that out there that those are the kind of the main players in this. When I brought it to everyone, I had, Matt and I had sort of concocted this very geographically based outline. And we were going to do Chittenden County, and this comes, goes back to my whole, like we need to be in those other counties. So I was thinking very county oriented, making sure that everyone in their little part of this beautiful state had time set aside for them. So that Chittenden County, which is so different than many of the other counties in the state, didn't sort of steal the spotlight. And when we, when we discussed it in the group, we kind of had this idea of, and it was certainly not my idea because I was thinking very county oriented, but someone said, why are we sort of zeroing in on county when in this sort of atmosphere of everything being digital, we for once do not have those physical boundaries of space. We can talk about aging. We can talk about rural queerness in ways that are not tied to where we get our mail. And so I think that that is, was a really, it was smart because we did shift our whole frame of thinking in the planning process. And we threw out that whole idea of everything depends on where you live because a lot of what we were seeing in 2019 was that a lot of the issues that were happening in Bennington were the same issues that were coming up in St. John'sbury. There were a little bit of differences, you know, very, you know, there's just, you know, little things. And I think that what we found is that we can talk about this at a statewide level. And the issues that happen in one community are very apt to be happening in another community because so much of Vermont looks similar. So how did you arrive at what are going to be the actual issues that are going to be the focus of the individual forums? Yeah, I mean, that was quite the process. I mean, of course, as you know, but we, we sort of started with everyone sort of popcorning ideas of what are some items that seem really that are coming up in conversations that we're having throughout the year with community members that seem to be kind of those hot button topics that we need either more support around or more resources or legislative changes, things like that. And so what we, what we ultimately after, you know, a lot of back and forth that we, we landed on six topics. And those topics are health justice, housing, rural queerness, youth, aging, and racial justice. And between January 21st and in late February, we'll be doing all of these once a week and really taking our time and having different facilitators and different participants. You can participate in all of them if you want. But it kind of allows folks to, to really pick and choose, you know, some people are very, very passionate about housing and housing equity and access to housing. And of course, price of housing, right? That's a big one. So they might want to just go to that one, and they may not be in a place to really have a lot to learn or a lot to talk about when it comes to aging or something like that. And so they can really choose where to put their energy. If they really want to go to all of them, which like I do, of course, I mean, I'm not everyone, then they can certainly do that. But then also we decided to do a, like all-encompassing caucus at the end that'll actually be on what is town meeting day here in Vermont. And that's the first Tuesday in March. And we're going to have our own little queer town meeting. It's going to be great where we're going to recap all of those six sessions. So if you don't go to all of them, you can still go to that last one and get kind of up to speed on what was discussed. Okay. So if I wanted to participate and I have an interest in, oh, so what were those, you know, forums again in the days they're happening, you will have a link on the Pride Center site that will let me know the schedule and then connect me with registration information. Yes. We're going to be using PrideVT.org for the town hall as sort of a central hub. That's our, that's the website we use for all things Pride in Vermont, which happens in September. So right now it's kind of just a shell of a website that we were using pretty heavily over the summer. And so we're going to re, rehaul that for the, for the town halls and that will be kind of the central home where you can register for the events. And we're going to, we're going to make sure that folks are, we want the people in the room who we trust and know are part of the community and can add valuable content to the discussion. And so we do want to have a way for folks to register so that not just anyone is allowed access into these meetings because we know how that can happen in the, in this day and age. And so if you have other questions and dates and everything like that, you can go to PrideVT.org for that information or just contact me and I'm glad to talk to you about it. And as you had referenced, part of the conversation is that these forms are intended for LGBTQ plus Vermont. So that, you know, in the organizing, all of the sort of security considerations are being taken into account to ensure that this is a safe space for queer Vermonters to come and talk about the issues that are of importance to them. And I know that all things LGBTQ and rainbow umbrella will also have links to the pridevermont.org site to ensure that people have updated information and access to registration. And with that, I'm going to move to the person who is actually our first interview on all things LGBTQ load those four plus years ago. Please welcome back Rachel Desletes, one of the co-founders of Rainbow Umbrella. Welcome, Rachel. Thank you, Keith. And thank you to Ann and Linda for having both Justin and myself on to talk about the queer town meetings. This is, and it's fun to come back. I can't believe you, I can't believe you've been on for four and a half years. That's a good run. Because neither one of us look a day older. No, of course not. We're as youthful and vibrant as ever. So since it's been a while since you've been on, you want to share a little bit about rainbow umbrella. Oh, I do want to talk about rainbow umbrella. I know you do. Go ahead, girlfriend. Okay. So, Keith, I know you know a little bit about this story, which is, you know, when more of us in central Vermont were retiring, we were less interested in traveling, you know, a lot of times it was Burlington, but it could have been anywhere in Vermont to attend social and cultural events. So a few of us decided to get together and to really think about, you know, what's, what do we really want? And then we invited other individuals from particularly central Vermont to get together to see if there was at all number one an interest in planning events, or were we doing it just for ourselves. And then also we wanted to be able to foster our community and also increase our visibility here in central Vermont. So we started inviting people in different towns and almost believe it or not, almost everyone in central Vermont from different towns came to the meeting. We even had some people from Caledonia County. And so we met twice a week, I mean, twice a month, good heavens twice a week, twice a month. And we started to organize social, political and, and then to intellectual events. And they were happening in our backyard, which was really much easier. And this was back in 2015. By easier, I met travel time because a lot of us didn't want to drive in the evening, which was a serious issue. So what's also worth noting about Rainbow Umbrella, unlike some of the other organizations that Justin talked about or mentioned was that we did not have brick and mortar, meaning we did not have a building to operate off. We didn't even have money to be able to sponsor these events. So if you think back in the 60s, and most of us who were part of Rainbow Umbrella lived through those years, it was a lot of grassroots organizing. And that's what Rainbow Umbrella, that's how they organize themselves in organized events. So we relied on members to volunteer their time. And so we function in a very unusual way, especially for 2015. So we didn't, as I mentioned, we didn't operate out of physical space. We relied on donated space since we hadn't applied for a grant and didn't have money. And then when a little money came in from some of the events, we then were able to pay some type of stipend. But some of these places were the usual, you know, the library, they were always welcoming, the senior center, and at times we met in our home. And so the other thing that happened is that since we didn't have any money, we really were relying on using our own money to jumpstart a project. So it was grassroots organizing at its best. And believe it or not, that is still how we operate today. So one of the reasons that the LGBT town for meetings are so important are, you know, first of all, it speaks to our community here in central Vermont because of the way we organized. And it also, it's our beginnings of collective action at a local level. It looks a little bit different now than it did in 2015. But we're still involved in bringing events to our community. And the town meetings are really one of those offerings. So on February 18, Rainbow Umbrella will be facilitating a discussion on aging, which will be one of the six town meetings statewide that Justin mentioned earlier. So that's, I was going to say it's spoken like the true grassroots organizer and activist that I've been working with and growing old with for longer than either of us care to admit. Also, I wanted to do just a brief acknowledgement that all that Rainbow Umbrella has a Facebook page so that people can go in and look at what are the current activities that are being supported because I know there were women's discussion groups, there are book groups that are forming, etc. So you had mentioned that Rainbow Umbrella will be helping to facilitate, you know, the forum on aging. Why a forum on aging? Well, you know, of course, when we first started, we were thinking that we were looking at events and forming some type of membership that would be for folks in retirement age or let's say even 55 and older. So, you know, the aging is, you know, right there the top of our list and what that looks like, because we're looking at some, we want to create something that's a little different than what our parents experienced. So there are a lot of, you know, several reasons why we wanted to have aging as one of our issues for this year's town meeting. And, you know, we live in a time when the aging population is rapidly rising. And this is nothing new, this has been going on for a while. And when this is compounded with a lower birth rate, you know, this could be a little concerning to folks. And so in recent years, the population in the, the rise in aging population has really come into focus. And it's a great concern, especially to economists. So that, and this is not just a U.S. phenomenon, this is, you know, a global issue. I mean, when you look at China and what's happening there, you think that we'd be paying more attention to these issues. But looking at the U.S. numbers, because, you know, in getting ready for today, I've been also, you know, for our town meeting, I wanted the town meeting, I wanted to be a little bit prepared with some numbers. So those of you who are interested in numbers such as myself, you might find this interesting. But in 1950, the percentage of people over the age of 65 was 8% of the total population. Now this is in the U.S. only. By 2020, and that's the year we've just left, which many of us don't regret, that the percentage more than doubled to 16.9%. And that's just in seven years. Now that doesn't sound like a whole lot. But when you look at those who are of the age of minority and those over 65, you're looking at a middle that's being squished. It's, you know, not as big as one would think. So, and I just read the other day that in 2015, the percentage of people over 65 will be 22% of our total population, total population again, in the U.S. So that's almost a quarter of our population. So this does have a serious impact in the workplace, but also in how we think about retirement. I know that when I first started to think about retirement, I was well into my 40s. And in part, that's because I was working in the world of non-profit. And therefore, I wasn't making enough money to think about retirement, let alone save for retirement. So then I started to talk with friends when I retired, that is. And to just have a better sense of was I the only one who wasn't thinking and preparing for retirement. And the overwhelming majority of people that I spoke with said that they just happened to land a job that included some type of retirement package. Essentially, it was sheer luck. So, you know, and I think in part, you know, we were losing generations of people where this, you know, was part of their workplace, you know, you didn't have pensions anymore. And so it really was incumbent upon us as individuals to be taking more responsibility for what that was going to look like. So now we are living at a time when the average life expectancy in the United States is 79 years. And when you look at the percentage of people living in the U.S., who will be over 65 in 2015, we're looking at 22% of the total U.S. population. And I just read yesterday that the United Nations is projecting that in 2050, there will be 3 million people worldwide who will be 100 years old and over. So that's only 30 years from now. And, you know, that it really exclude any, you know, or many of the developing countries. So again, you know, you can sort of think or understand why economists are concerned that when you look at the age of minority and then anyone over the age of 65, you know, we're living a very small middle. So we do have not only shrinking incomes, but we also are facing a shrinking middle workforce. So I think, you know, I think it's important that, you know, this is we need to move forward and think about this not only for those of us who want to retire or who are retired, but even folks who are, you know, new to the workplace and be thinking about not just now, but also, you know, at least start thinking or talking about what is retirement going to look like, because believe me, when it happens, it's like, it's a little scary. So in our last five minutes, oh, no, I know, because our time goes quickly, just really briefly, you know, it's one of the people who are helping to put the forum on aging together and the involvement with rainbow umbrella. What are you hoping that people who are participating are going to gain from their participation in the forum? Well, in this age of zoom, I loved what Justin had to say. Yeah, it's bringing us all together. I mean, you know, Vermont is a great state. And one of the things that I love about Vermont is that it has annual town meetings. I used to live in Plainfield and they were the best. And they bring a lot of value to the community, you know, in which they're held. But it doesn't address the issues specific to the queer community. And this is really an important time. You know, it's a great opportunity to really to connect with other queer folks in Vermont, and to also have a place where there's an equal place for us to be able to at the table so that we can talk about specific issues that impact us and have a voice. I mean, you know, we want to be heard. So I think that's one of the one of the greatest feature. I mean, certainly everything that Justin mentioned earlier, but the other thing is, is that we're a small state. And although we're a small state, we also are divided by a mountain. So by having these forums and zoom, it allows us to connect with folks from all over, regardless as to where we live. So, you know, we have people living in rural areas, and then we also have people living in urban areas. And these are two very different and distinct, you know, concerns and issues. So we want to be able to look and acknowledge at all the voices and be able to find ways to have people have an option to be able to age in place. And this is a great opportunity for that to happen. And then the usual suspects, you know, we are always looking at, we, you know, the alliance has been very instrumental in bringing things to the legislatures here at the state house. And when we needed, when you, when we were facing, you know, the elections of 2016, and we started thinking about God, we need to protect ourselves, you know, to protect the rights and the the rights and the protections that we had fought for and had won over the years, we didn't want to lose those. And we also wanted to be able to take a position. So we were in a prime, you know, place to be able to fight the bigotry and hatred that was existing and already was growing in numbers. So we wanted to be able to come as one united voice, both at the statewide level and then when it warranted at a national level. And with that, thank you to both Justin and Rachel. I look forward to engaging in some active and inspiring conversation in the town hall forums. Again, we will be listing the connection to the pridevermont.org site where you can get additional information about the actual forms, their dates and registration information, all things LGBTQ and rainbow umbrella on our Facebook pages will have those links as well. So with that, thank you to both of you and I look forward to some interesting conversations. Thanks, Keith. Buddy, I'd like to welcome writer of poetry novels and other interesting forms of writing, which we'll talk about later. Welcome, Celeste Castro to the show. Thank you so much, Linda. How are you doing? Doing pretty good for Friday night. Really? I'm going to first read your bio if that's okay with you so people can get an idea about who you are. So Celeste Castro is an American Mexican owned voices author from small town rural Idaho, where most of her stories take place. She grew up with learning disabilities, though she always kept a journal. When she was a young adult, court ordered volunteer work to help her find her way community outreach. In 2009, she graduated from Seattle University with a master's in public administration. She began writing fiction in 2005. Her writing credits include Homecoming, Bella Books, 2017, Lex Files, Bella Books, 2018, and We've Got the Power, Briss Books, 2018, The Taking, Bella Books, 2019, and Prize Money, Interlude Press, 2021. That's your new book. In addition to fiction, she's a staff writer with Hispanic Dotes, an online magazine for Latinx writers, where she publishes essays and poetry. So that's pretty impressive, I got to say. Thank you. And your new book is coming out in May of 2019. Yep. And what is that about? Well, Prize Money is, I bill it as a rodeo romance. And so it takes place on the summer circuit rodeo. It's about a two time world champion, barrel racing world champion, who meets somebody on the circuit, another character who's an equestrian stunt woman who's fresh off a Hollywood blockbuster. And when her family needs her to come home. And so she's brought home to take her dad's place in the rodeo. It's kind of a family run business, they're bullfighters. And so these two characters meet at the rodeo and it's a chance meeting book. And it's a pure romance, which is a book that I've never written a pure romance before. I've written paranormal, a fantasy. My very first book was a sweet romance, but it had a little bit of a natural disaster in it. So I don't kind of count that as a sweet romance. And so it's got a happy ending and a lot of action, a lot of Wrangler butts, a lot of mentions of Patsy Klein and Dolly Parton and all those sorts of things that go along with the rodeo. I'm really excited about that one. I really love Dolly Parton. Yeah, hope me too. Did you see her Christmas special? I didn't, but I did see a special of hers on, I think it was Netflix. They did like a biography or Oh, cool. That's pretty cool. Yeah, she's an amazing. Yeah, she is. And you work and you do some work with Hispanic Dots. So tell us about that. Is that like an online magazine or? Yeah, it's an online magazine, Hispanic Dots. And I saw their a tweet from them. I guess it's been a year and a half. My first, yeah, been a year and a half since I saw that. And I was kind of look, I wasn't really looking for an outlet for my poetry and essays and things like that. But this seemed like the perfect outlet for that. And so I submitted something to the their art issue, which was could be anything about art. And so I wrote about the art class that I took very first freshman year of college and Mrs. Mason's art 101. And one of the very famous artists, Bosch, and his stuff is just all over the board crazy. And it was the first time that I just kind of saw that. And it kind of tied it back to my college experience and how kind of wild I was took me six years to do college, by the way. And so so they, I submitted it, they accepted it. And then I submitted again the following month. It's every month has a different theme. And they reached out to me Cindy Tovar is the founder and asked if I wanted to join them. And I said, of course, I was so excited about it. And just to have that a place to talk about all things related to my identity and my family, my family's featured a lot in there growing up as a little kid. And my favorite post I did was flash fiction about a memory that I had when I found my grandmother's wig under the sink. I was like five years old, a scared to crap out of me. And it's a great big huge beehive wig. And I turned it into a little short story written from the perspective of a little kid who finds it and puts it on. And it's like a time machine. And then go back in time and trick all their friends and be the most popular kid in school. And so that's kind of, I do some fun things like that with Hispanic Dots. Wow, that's really that. And that must be, that must have been really funny to find. It was funny, I guess that's a word for it looking back now, but you should remember opening, I shouldn't have been snooping. I was opening it and just, oh my God, you know, it's just shocking. Do other people write for this? I mean, is it collective? Yeah, it's right to the right for this group, or is it mostly a group of already people who are already doing it, you know, like a cooperative or collective? Yeah, that's a really great question. So it's anybody that identifies as Latinx can write for it. There's a handful of staff writers. So those are writers that have signed on and are committed to submitting monthly. And then it's open to anybody that wants to guest, they just like guest write. So those are, we get those every now and again, there's some names I recognize that don't submit every month, but maybe, you know, a couple times a year, three times a year. And, and so we just opened it up. We had some staff writers that needed to step away for a little while, and we just added a couple of new staff writers. But you can find all of our bios on Hispanic Dodes website, and then a link to the archive of our work. Very good. And you grew up in Royal Idaho, not that growing up as a queer person in Idaho, rural Idaho. Yeah, rural, I say rural Idaho, because it was pretty darn rural. Caldwell, Idaho, if you ever ever heard of it, I usually say it's by Boise. I want to say like, maybe 12, I'm so bad at like distance, maybe 12 miles from Boise. So it's, it's probably more than that. I don't even know. I'm so bad at that. But hopskipping a jump from the Boise airport, farmland. And so, you know, I remember when we got our first like fast food restaurant, it was a Taco Bell. So that was a big huge deal. And, but a small town. And we, I grew up kind of sheltered. My dad is a preacher. And so, I'm the youngest of four, we're all preachers, kids and everything that goes along the rebellious nature, sneaking out, all those sorts of things I had. So grateful for my older siblings, two older brothers and a sister who kind of helped me navigate and did a lot of partying. And, you know, I didn't really, I didn't really discover who I was until I left to go to college, which was in Washington state. And I think looking back, like I was, I was a big tombo, I'll tell you, people would always say, Oh, you have a really, you know, good looking son there. And you know, and my mom would be like, Oh, that's our daughter. You know, so I looked like, like a baby dyke. I was looking at those pictures, looking back, my friends knew we didn't talk about it. I just don't think we knew how back then. I graduated in 1997, put a little, you know, little insight as to when I grew up. But it just, we were just going to school, just trying to get through trying to fit in and rebel in our own way as kids do that go to Christian school their whole life. And but the friends that I that I had, and I grew up with, know who I am today, and are except me and except my wife. And I guess it kind of, I'm glad that I have them. And I don't know what that would have felt like had I gone to like maybe a public school where there was just a lot more people. But my graduating class was like 32 people. And so it was very small. And your parents were okay when you came up with them and all that? They were after a while. I think my, my dad was the more accepting than my mother was. And a lot of people so I think it would be the other way around. My dad's a preacher and all that. But he lives and breathes acceptance. And he's, he's one of my role models. I write a lot about him in Hispanic Dotson. You know, mothers, we all have mother issues, I have a lot of mother issues, but you know, you only got one mother and she is accepting of me and my wife and you know, came to my wedding and both of them did and we're all, we'll get along now. Not that we didn't get along, but it's just, you know, it's there's there is a little bit of rockiness there for a little while. Yeah, I think, you know, that happens a lot, you know, in, in families that acceptance and, you know, you're lucky to get it. So you work and write. So how do you write all these great books and work? That's a really good question. Back before I'm new to Chicago, I've lived here a couple of years back when I started writing, I lived in Seattle. I had kind of a weird schedule where I worked for four hours and then I at the University of Washington. And then I worked at a farmer's market. And so I had a period of time where I worked part time during the year. And so that was really easy to make time for my writing. But then when it was farmer's season, I don't know when I did that. I think I did it on the weekends and like we didn't do a lot on the weekends. And now I can remember some conversations my wife said, Are you writing this weekend? Because I really like to go wine tasting. So I think I just kind of fitted in where I could. And this past year, 2019 was when we moved to Chicago. And I was lucky enough to take that whole year off to get us settled in our new apartment. And so I wrote all year. And I actually wrote two full length novels. One of them was prize money and then another one. And so I feel like I did a lot then. And I'm finding now that I have a working again, I'm finding it really hard to find time for it. And I don't know if it's because I'm doing actual work from home and then like, Okay, I'm done. And you know, I get my other computer and pull it out. And it's like, Oh, another screen type of thing. It's actually been kind of a challenge for me. And I don't think I'm alone in that. And so you're on zoom for work then. And yeah, yeah, it is green day and night like that. Yeah, it has been feel like you really need a break from that. So, so when were you married? 2016. Yeah, in Chicago, it was in October. And the Chicago Cubs were in the World Series. And so the Chicago was just crazy and fun and, you know, very, just electric in the feel of it. And so we plan that we plan for the Chicago Cubs to win the World Series on our wedding, not really, but so that was kind of cool. Yeah. Anne and I, she got her a PhD at University of Madison in Madison, Wisconsin, and we used to go to Chicago a lot. And you know, it's one of my favorite cities, cold, but you know, but yeah, cold. Yeah. Yeah, it is cold here. And I also like Seattle too. It's an interesting city, although it's gotten pretty expensive by Yeah, it really has. So, did you find that it was easy or hard to write with learning disabilities? Do you find it gave you some advantages or disadvantages? It had to overcome? You know, I think that I've never been short of imagination, which looking at my journal collection, I save them all. That's pretty clear. I think the thing that's been really difficult is the grammar and the sentence structure, you know, I took English 25, 025, which is the English you need to get into college. I took that a number of times before I was able to get into the class that counted towards, you know, college credits. And I took that one three times. And I think that it just that part of learning like the structure has been, I'm feeling that now going through edits and how to set things up. And I do beta reading for other authors. And I can see clearly like, they're very, oh, I grew up writing, you know, and I started writing in third grade. And this is so and so is English class. And you know, I never really had that because it always felt like not a chore, but like this thing that I had to overcome. But the imagination is there. And I like to hold on to that because when I get like that draft back from the editor, that's like the stories there, the sentence structure, that's another story, you know, and so but but that's okay, because I think, I think sometimes that can be fixed and that can be learned, you know, and which I'm learning right now. But I guess growing up, never read a lot, never did formal writing a lot, but did have an active imagination. And why romance? You just attracted to that or, you know, you know, because there, there isn't really a whole lot out there about lesbian romance. So why that one? Well, I, I just happened to, I found, I got a Kindle, and I was like, wow, I can get books immediately. So that kind of piqued my, my reading a few years ago and just started reading so much. I read a lot of Stephen King when I was growing up, I really liked that and that mystery and horror. And I really don't know how I ended up finding lesbian romance, but it was like this beam of gracious, glorious light, you know, that I found this really cool genre and read Found Jerry Hill and read most of her work and learned about all the different authors writing in that genre. And I guess I really like it, lesbian romance. I, in terms of my own writing, I kind of bill myself as lesbian themed fiction because I'm kind of branching out to other types of stories, not just romance, but that's kind of where I got my start and the kind of books that I like to read. And the characters, I know you said they were based in Idaho, around your hometown. Are any of them based on people that you actually know? Or, I mean, I know you can't probably say, oh yeah, that's my friend Alice, but, but it's kind of based on your life there and the interactions with people. Yeah, I wouldn't say, I think what's based in Idaho is more the setting. So the physical landscape, what it feels like to live there. And I have a really deep sense and connection with the landscape and in the cornfields and the, and the stone fruit and the hops and the vineyards and the beautiful mountains. And I connected a lot with nature growing up and fishing and being outside. And so that's really where I'm, where I'm coming from when I write books that are set in Idaho. The characters are like what I envision it could be like there. It's no secret that it's a very conservative part of the United States of America. And so I kind of populating the state of Idaho with more lesbians one book at a time. So that's kind of my secret agenda. But in terms of if these characters are based on anybody, not really. They're kind of just, they're just there. And I guess I know how to give them the background of what it's like to live there and grow up there and be, and be something, be something in terms of what they do as a profession. But yeah, and I guess the experiences of a lot of them are set in nature, you know, like prize money is, is set on in the rodeo scene. Lex viles is set on nature preserve. And so that's kind of that's that's a correlation. And for my last question, I'm just going to ask you who are your influences? Who did you who do you really like? I mean, it could be anybody or, you know, like you felt like helped you along, whether personally or reading or in any way. I would say I'm going to say Jerry Hill because that's when I got it into my brain that like, I want to try writing a story. And so she's a big influence on pushing me to actually put something on paper. And I also want I think a lot of the influences and support that I have right now come from a group of individuals that beta read my work and have helped me be just helped me craft my stories that they're there to bounce ideas off of a couple of them come from Bella books, which is taken shepherd and Kate Haddock strong, who I met through through Bella and through Twitter. And I'm so grateful for their their friendships and also to have them to be able to bounce ideas off we read each other's work, we explore all sorts of things. So that that has really given me a lot of confidence and I know that they see have seen me grow as a writer and I've seen them grow grow as well. I also want to recognize, I guess I do have a English teacher that helped me, Mrs. Pritchard, who was the third time I took English 101 and I finally passed it. And so I don't know what she did, but I guess she was just very patient and helped me help me pass it. And it's like, Oh, I got that done. And so little, little did I know that I would continue to write and do it for fun versus for college credit. Does she know? No, I don't know. I she might still be at Boise State. Maybe she's retired by now. Well, that's that's interesting. So why don't you tell us your books that are out now and maybe just a little bit about what they're about. And we will have it up for people to be able to go to your website and order books and to see more about you. So just briefly, if you don't mind, yes, the three books you have. And I'll have you one again when your new book comes. It'll be very exciting. Yeah, thank you for that. Yeah. Okay. Okay, so talk about the books now. Yeah, just just a brief little thing. Okay, your new book, you know, your your other books, guys, give people a quick synopsis about, you know, what they're about. Okay. Okay, well, the first one is called Homecoming. It's one of those where somebody comes home, they've been avoiding home for a very long time, and they find love there, set in Idaho. And the next one is Lex Files, which is a paranormal romance. And actually, this one is is inspired from a lot of different things. But my brother, older brother told us this story about the Lake Lowell ghost, scared the crap out of me, then not now or anything. But that that's kind of where I drew the inspiration for that one. And the taking is it's a portal, kind of a book of portal fantasy. The main character steals an amulet and it transports her to another realm. And she learns that she has powers that she didn't know about. And it's full of Faye, seers and shifters and those sorts of things. It's one of I'm envisioning three of them, I got the second one plotted out in my head, just got to put it to paper. But so that one, those three are available. And then really excited for prize money coming out in 2021, my rodeo romance and also very excited to work with a new publisher interlude press. And they have been extremely supportive and I'm really happy with the move that I made. I also want to plug a couple of other things. I am involved in an anthology with a couple of other writers, a couple of them I mentioned, taken Shepherd and Caged Strong with Bella books, it's wedding themed, it's coming out in June, I believe of next year. And so I have a penny dreadful included in that one. So it's not quite a romance, but it's a penny dreadful. And then the other one, another anthology, this one is with Bold Strokes books. And it's called In Our Words, a career stories from black indigenous and people of color. So I wrote a book, a short story called Pale Moon Rising. It's kind of about a cryptid and some bird, people that I don't even know what they're called, but they like research birds, I guess bird, bird researchers. But it's about the Puchen, which it's kind of like a vampire, it's kind of along the lines of like, you know, Bigfoot and Swamp Thing. And so cryptids. And so I'm really excited about those like a lot coming out next year. So I'm going to be very popular. And we're looking forward for these being out in the world. Well, you are very prolific and very exciting to have you on the show. So we'll have you back. And thank you so much for coming. It's been a wonderful interview. Thank you. Thank you so much. Thanks to all things LGBTQ. Yay. Thank you for joining us. We'll see you in two weeks. But in the meantime, resist.