 Yes. Good evening. My name is Catherine Porter as chair of the Amherst Design Review Board. I'm calling this meeting to order pursuant to Governor Baker's March 17 2020 order, suspending certain provisions of the open meeting law. On the governor's March 15 2020 order imposing strict limitations of the number of people that may gather in one place. The public hearing of the town of Amherst Design Review Board is being conducted and via remote participation, no in person attendance of members of the public will be permitted. But the public can attend tonight's virtual meeting by using the zoom log in information provided. On the meeting agenda listed on the meeting calendar, which is provided on the town of Amherst website. We will begin with a roll call of the members of the Design Review Board, who have been impaneled for the consideration of the items on tonight's agenda. Board members please say I or yes to acknowledge your attendance for the record. Lindsay Schnarr. Hi. Tom Long. Catherine Davis. Yes. Erica Z. Kos. Yes. Okay. At this time I would ask if there are any disclosures that you would like to make relevant to the agenda items tonight. Okay. I would like to extend my attendance as Marine Pollock planner and staff liaison to the design review board. The design review board and as accompanying zoning regulations were created by town meeting in October of 1983, the charge and purpose of the design review board under section 3.2 of the zoning bylaw. The design review board was designed to provide historical resources by providing for a detailed review of all changes in land use, the appearance of structures and the appearance of sites, which may affect these resources. The design review and recommendations to private applicants and permit granting boards within specific overlay zoning districts in the town center. The design review overlay district and the town common design review overlay districts. The design review was also provided for town departments and permit granting boards with respect to town projects anywhere in Amherst, which will result in substantial alteration to the form or appearance of a structure or site. The design review board meetings are open to the public and are recorded by town staff. Each meeting recording will be uploaded to the town of Amherst YouTube channel for public viewing. The procedure is as follows. The petitioner presents the application to the board during the meeting, after which the board will ask questions for clarification or additional information. Once the board has completed its question, the board will deliberate. If the board feels it has enough information and time, it will decide upon recommendations for each respective application. Once the board has voted on its recommendation, the staff liaison will type up the recommendations for distribution to the applicant board applicable land use board and building recommend recommendation. Tonight's agenda for Tuesday, March 8 is as followed. And I think we have, there we go. The first application is DRB FY 2022 dash 17 Amherst oyster bar. And we're reviewing the proposed changes to the color of the existing walls life fixture railings and front door installation of new signage installation of white translucent private privacy vinyl across the front glass of building and removal of the existing buildings for the Amherst oyster bar, a new restaurant under section 3.2 of the zoning bylaw. Okay. And so, marine, who do we have, are we ready to. Okay, there we go. Yes, so we have Dylan here. Dylan, if you could state your name and your affiliation and then explain your proposal, and you can now share your screen and to show your proposal as well. Great. Thank you, marine. Yes, my name is Dylan Barstow man's and I'm here on behalf of the Amherst oyster bar to present a new design that we will have for the outside and just want to thank you guys for having this meeting today. Let me get my screen shared here. We have Gabrielle. Gabrielle, are you here to make comments or think she's here to be supportive and if needed to answer questions, but Gabrielle please chime in. Yeah, okay. Alright, everyone can see my screen now. Yes. Right. So this is the existing building. It's going into the old Judy's location. The proposed new exterior would keep the same looking facade. We're going to change the proposal to change the color of the building to a dark blue. And then the fixtures you'll see around the building to amaze color. And then for signage on the frontage of the building, there'll be three signs at the front, as well as a sign on the door which will show in another image here. So we'll dive into those three signs at the top of that hexagon in the front of the building. They're all going to be about six feet tall. And then facing Northwest is going to be six feet long, the center one with the primary logo will be six foot by six foot as well. And then the Northwest facing sign is four feet. It's a little bit, a little bit shorter. The total for this is 102 square feet. And then for the front door, we're going to have just this vinyl Amherst primary Amherst oyster bar logo that's two and a half feet by two and a half feet centered on a glass insert in the door, totaling six square feet of signage. Just so you can see where the location is once again, I've numbered them here so you can see the six by six sign facing Northwest, the six by six right here, and then the four by six sign right here. The front door will rain in the same location as Judy's front door with that two and a half foot by two and a half foot logo on the front. And so the frontage of this building is a little under 70 feet long. And the hexagon is 2020 feet tall the top of the building to this roof line. There is also a back entrance to the building. For this back entrance we are proposing no additional signage we're trying to use the same locations that Judy's banners used to be supporting the primary logo on the banner at the end to kind of identify the access way. And then the elevator shaft that helps for ADA access in the back will have the vinyl with the primary logo centered in the same location that Judy's had centered prior. The light fixtures we're going to update the maze color and then the building will have the blue paint as well. And so for that banner in the back access is three feet tall. It's shared by two feet by three one. Yeah, two feet so six square square feet total for that banner, the vinyl on the elevator shaft is three and a half feet by four feet tall, totally 14 square feet. And those are those locations one more time. So this is just a fun graphic that we have that we next we originally had but we aren't going to use any longer for vinyl we took the vinyl out of the front windows. This is the paint color Benjamin more North Sea or old Navy we're deciding between the two final colors. And not included in this presentation but I want to pull it up separate. We do have a pan tone picked out for the maze color. So, at this point, I'd like to open up to the designer view board for any questions you might have comments you have concerns. Okay. Okay, so what you're saying is the lights are going to be that yellow or am I misinterpreting. Yes, those light fixtures are going to be that maze. Okay. Okay. All right. Would anybody like to start any thoughts or comments. If you'd like me to flip to another slide just let me know where you want to go and I can. Okay, all right. Well, I just offer my first sort of impression was, it's a lot. A lot of not saying I don't like it. I'm just saying that. Wow. So many lights I'm not sure, particularly when they're when they're this yellow. So with those lights we are just proposing to keep the original Judy's lights you'll see that they are green here. We're just getting the color to the color palette. Okay, okay. So what we're going to get on this hexagon right here is these lights were facing upwards. Yeah, that was fine when Judy's used to have these awnings coming out but we wanted to stick with the dark sky kind of initiative I know the town is focused on so we look them up to kind of push them down. So they're not putting this light up to the sky. Okay. Okay. And you say you're going to have the windows are going to have a translucent covering is that still in place is that what you're showing us there. We have, we have no vinyl we did, we did bring this to Marine at one point just for tentative understanding of what you guys might be looking for because we didn't want to present something that'd be far off from what you would be expecting so we got some feedback and we took away the vinyl because we knew that would count towards signage and we didn't want to exceed the 10%. So that has been removed. Okay, okay. So the windows will be clear then is that what you're saying that is correct. Yes. Okay, all right, because you could frost up I guess. Okay, all right. Okay. What's that. Tom has raised his hand. Oh, I'm sorry go ahead Tom. Thanks. Dylan, you know, I just want to say that I've done work in this space before not this specific space this market space and I really appreciate the direction you're going the kind of color palette. Marine quality and slash pinstripe blue and white that I think is happening here with the maze I think it's a great. A great color palette. I do feel like there's a lot of blue and I don't I don't actually think it would hurt your design to provide more white. And when I look at the existing facade I very much recognize that there are architectural features here that are white that remain white. Well these other elements could remain or could become dark. And I think you might actually get a more sophisticated look which I think is something you're actually going for in the sense that like, and it's not a lot. I think it's a few places that would lighten this up on this facade and make it feel less like this new big blue block that was dropped in there, but I think it was, you know, your imagery is large, it's clear, it's adorable. The colors I think are right. I just I just feel like it. I feel like you could actually get a better more sophisticated result with a little less like the, for instance the crown molding across the top of the building is has great detail that's going to be lost in the dark blue that would really be a great beautiful elegant cap to this navy blue that you guys are doing and I keep coming back to like the navy blue pinstripes suit with the gold, you know buttons like if that's the balance you're looking for I think we need more pinstripes and that's kind of the sense of getting I think it would be super sophisticated if we saw a little bit more of that. Just my two cents though, again. Okay, I appreciate that thank you. Erica Erica raise your hand. Thank you for the presentation Dylan. Professional package of signage I'm appreciating I want to second what Tom is saying about the, the amount of blue and you know it's a it's a nice part of downtown and eclectic mix of architecture, but the degree to which this building has some historic architecture I think it'd be nice to maintain that moving forward. And it's, it's, I realize that this is a, you know, it's super simple rendering but I do think that the dark color in reality will make this harder to see make that kind of the at the at the wood. roofline difficulty and so I too would vote for those to be painted in white to match other other architectural the signpost and details and actually since you flipped to this sign or to this image. Yeah, so you were just hovering your mouse over. Yeah, so this kind of roofline. If that could be maintained as white that would be really nice and then you you're you're rendering shows a quite different awning style. And I think that this Judy's little pediment is going away could you just. articulate articulate the changes here to the actual architecture of the building. So yeah from my understanding. This great predates me a little bit but this building used to be two separate buildings single family homes I guess one was Judy's at one point and one was another bar which. The whole was a pretty popular bar, I forgot to stand though, but if then it merged into one and so I guess this old awning type thing this triangle was the old entrance into Judy's so it's kind of a. It just doesn't doesn't work with the new entrance with the ramp going up and so with the opportunity to change the awnings we were going to kind of streamline that so you can see here to kind of make it one single line across the roof. And then I do appreciate the comment on the molding and the detail, I do think I tried to do the best with what we had and this is kind of more of a paint blocks but I do. I do agree I think that detail is important I think that's the intent is to keep that it'll just be painted. I do like the idea of it being white it's something that I bring back to the design team to reference but I do think I lost a little bit with kind of that overlay I had gone with there. Yeah I think that'll be that would be a nice refinement of this and I. I haven't tallied up that the square footage is that you presented but is there any ability to put some. signage branding on the awning itself. Is there anything left so what I have total right now with 70 feet long 20 foot tall and then 102 square feet of signage in the front it totaled up to seven little over 7% signage for the front so about 3% below the 10% threshold. We were just trying to we kept it a little tight, we wanted to focus we thought the branding and the front here up top was their most valuable. And so that's kind of where we brought it to and just wanted to make sure we were under the 10% but branding along the awning. I don't think if it was the right sizing could keep us or underneath that 10%. And just looking at like kind of pulling somebody in from that that end of the sidewalk or something like that could be an opportunity if you have all of that and it's a big field of blue so something would really pop if you were to put it there, but I will let somebody else take their opinion. Yeah. I've lost Dylan, I wanted to see his face so I can see it. Thank you so much for your presentation, I just want to say personally I'm really excited for the Amherst Worcester bar to come to town. You know, just to save us all some time I just wanted to say that I agree both with Erica and Tom, particularly as representing the historical commission that I, it would be a shame to me if we lost some of these historical details, and the process of this new design and if there's a way to incorporate, you know, some of those into this new design as well as maybe pull back a little bit on the blue. That, that would be great. Yeah, I definitely. I appreciate that it was something that we didn't even think about originally in the design, but now that you're saying it. I think it's something that we definitely like to keep, especially if that got us through to permanent and so if this was to be white, and kept that detail could actually accentuate it a little bit with the dark blue just underneath it which could look really nice and kind of give a good call out to the old, old as well as the new building going in there. That's a fine question. So on this rendering. I guess I can't really use my mouse necessarily but so that was it the hexagon. Yeah, we talked about the white trim at the top molding to keep that. How about on the other portion of the roof line, if you will, with the top of the building with board members want that also to have a white border at the top, or just the hexagon. A full back someone drawing. That's me. Okay, so you are okay cool back so you can see that you can see the detail does run around. I think. I don't know if it falls through flying but I maybe just say all location. Just to be clear. I didn't catch that. Sorry. I was going to say maybe just all the facial just to be clear, which is that edge of the roof that runs around the whole building even where there's not that detail the dental detail in that in that gable and yeah. Yeah. I'm wondering if maybe that entire that entire gabled area couldn't the whole top of the of the building be white. I think if we have blue and then we have outlined white and we've got gold lamps and a lot of blue in the front. I don't think we have too many options too many looks because I was going to chime in I'm glad that Tom brought that up because I think it's a lot of blue and I think the personality of the building is lost. Maybe it's just me but this one the newer addition which which is the vertical windows that was Judy had a number of years ago was sort of the personality of the building and it's really pretty much lost when the whole that whole area is so solid blue so I would vote for eliminating as much blue as possible and keeping it simple. I think we'd want to keep the anything that's the siding of the building to be blue but I don't think there's any problem with the molding. Yeah. Why couldn't you do this. Is that a like see hand or is that a new hand. Oh Catherine is it okay. I just before we moved on to too far beyond this I wanted to bring back up the lights. I know that you had said Dylan that and I'm trying to look at both picturing both current and the new design at the same time. I'm wondering where you are hoping to position those lights and how that might interrupt that design feature. And then the second part of this is that I find the maze to be really, you know, lovely juxtaposed to the blue. However, I on that portion where you have the logos, it feels a little heavy to me a little busy. And I just wanted to, you know, put that out to the rest of the design review board and, you know, see what other people think or is this just something that's popping out to me. And, you know, when we change this potentially in the new design to having a white holding on the top. Will that be more busy or will that solve some of that problem. There's a lot of lights up there, somehow when it's lower and pointing up it doesn't really strike me in the same way, but from the top. Yeah, it's it seems a little cluttered. I think if they were more neutral color, like black grave. I don't think we would be talking about that. But again that's my impression there's a lot of little gold lights. And I think you want to, I know you're, you're aiming for a really classy kind of exterior and I'm not sure it's coming off that way. Just a little busy, a little blue. How long has Chris's hand and in London. Yeah, I mean just my two cents on the lights is I do feel like they're busy in this in the context of there. I, I don't think this rendering is doing you a lot of help right now. Let's put it that way. So I feel like, you know, there are just some decisions that are going to be hard to judge like, I'm in the building now and I'm looking at the lights. I definitely notice those lights because they're dark and they're against a white surface so I can't say they're going to be any more obtrusive or obvious in this context. But I but I do get, you know how close are they to that molding piece and how far do they drop down and I think those are things you want to consider. It's just blue wash like that you don't see that detail and it's hard to tell exactly where those lights are again which is why I feel like the rendering is not helping, helping you help us help you so. So, I think, I think I'm okay with it if your architect decide like figures out how to get them below that line so they're not encroaching too far but but it's going to be, I think it's going to be, it'll be a tricky solution. Lindsay. Yeah, I guess. Hi, I don't. I also just, I think overall I think it's really bold and cool. So I, I hear what everybody's saying and I think it is a lot of blue, but I also, I think it, it's fun and jazzy and so. Aside from a few of the comments about you know the fascia. You know, I agree with the fascia I also agree that maybe, maybe rather than just the like yellow lights, I think maybe you can get a little more architectural about it. I think that the lamp posts could be yellow, and that might really kind of like ground it. And then just kind of having the fixtures of lights like I really like how you have the gold railing you know it's like maybe have a gold front door I can't quite tell what that little band is at the top of the ramp but um, you know maybe if you could find some ways to articulate that goal that's more integral to the kind of the rhythm of, of what's there that's not just a fixture so I might suggest at least the lamp posts. If you, if you do create that kind of like top edge of the white fascia along the roof and then perhaps there's some other places where you could have a little relief of white. I think just a few of those kind of details might help balance it a lot. And then the other thing I would say is that I think it might, might help your signage to have something along the along the ramp. Can I draw, I think. But essentially, I won't see how but, but along that kind of like, I guess it's the awning, is it an awning or roof edge that runs along the ramp. That's an awning. Yeah. So I wonder, I know that there's a lamp post to kind of break it up, but, and I do think you have quite a bit of visibility but it just might. It might be worth considering I'm sure you have considered it just seems like a long stretch that doesn't have any signage so it might be a place where you, you could have your AOB again or just something that kind of keys you back. That being said I think that the color like all ties it together so you know I don't think you necessarily need it but it could be something to consider is just having another kind of AOB. And then could you switch to the back. Yep. That's the front door that's the signage that you would see when walking. Yeah, I think that looks really nice. So this is the existing back currently the Judy's banners down the side, those green lights. And this is the proposed. Yeah, so again here I think, you know it could be something. I don't know if other people would agree or not but like, where again you bring that yellow down the lamp post. And, you know, perhaps the lamps themselves or even have to be gold. It just, you know, just a thought of like, in that process we kind of were, we're deciding on how to address that in those light posts here and then also in the front of the building are a white PVC that we don't want to get into. It's kind of not a paintable material. That's why we kind of went after those the lamps instead. What is that a copper. What is the lamp itself. I believe it's, it's some sort of metal I don't, it don't think it's copper. I think it's something. That's kind of risky to in terms of weathering. I'm actually going to paint those are those lamp posts. I mean the lamp's going to be painted. Let me see. That's on some of the existing material. I didn't catch that. Sorry, I was flipping over something. The lights are painted. It is a metal that got painted. I agree with Lindsay. Weathering could be a problem with that sort of thing, then you're going to end up with a lot of, you know, sort of half painted. We'll end up taking them down and painting them in a shop and then we'll bring them. Sure, but after a year or so, you know, yeah, that's up to you. Erica. Okay, so it occurs to me the longer I look at it. One of the things that I'm struggling with a little bit on the, on the front and particularly with the half hexagon tower piece is that the existing building is kind of marked by or that portion right. The hexagon is marked by the flatness ring that the windows and then these MDF panels and then the surface trim. And then we kind of move up to how you're going to be covering up those Claire story windows with new signage. Are you intending in that again this goes back to Tom's comment about the rendering being kind of over simple. Are you intending to carry that trim line up so that it'll be marking the corners are you how are you meeting the corners with your new flat super flat panels what are we going to see there. And I'm glad that you brought up the windows as well up the top here. I meant to mention those earlier that is has been a problem with Judy's that they battled with for 40 years. I don't know if you remember in the space that a giant orange umbrella. And they had shades coming down they always thought that Western sun to the point when we decided to design for this and it was we really need to do something with those windows it's nice to have the light but it got so hot in there that the heat they ended up going back and kind of shading it all out over time. But yeah the upper upper panels. And then there's probably some some detail to bring into those corners in the hexagon. Because the down below they're just they're painted blue but if you continue that line up so that it was still blue but there was a little bit of detail and that's one of the things that we don't see here is like all the surface texture and how shade and shadow are going to make it feel less monolithic than it does in this image. So I'm fine with the amount of blue as long as that fascia is is white throughout. Because I think there's going to be more to it than we see but I, I would encourage your designer to ensure that that trim carries all the way up the corners and somehow as you know a consistent design detail that while painted blue still frames your new signage, at least in some way like if not fully outlining them right that there's there's something there that is a carry through. I can see Tom wanted to jump in probably to disagree with me. I actually I agree with you and I actually think. This is why I'm saying I don't think this is helping situation is that there's almost no way in how you're presenting the material later on that all of this stuff is going to look as monolithic as it does right now. Because the wall paint is never going to match the vinyl that's never going to match the Pantone color from your signage and that's going to be on some other material or whatnot so we're going to see more individuals items and elements and details in your show that you're giving yourself credit for here. So there's going to be a lot more nuance and I think, as you know, Eric is saying that those edges that they stay clean would, and those signs are inside and offset or however they're organized on like framed paintings or whatnot will make a huge difference because it'll be adding more detail rather than flattening it which is what it feels like. I don't think it's going to be as monolithic as we're seeing so I'm agreeing, but I think that some other rendering or gesture tell different stories. This is my thoughts on it. Are you suggesting that we ask them to come back with a modification of what we have here? I don't think so in the sense that like I think as long as we stick with as long as the top detail that we talked about, the molding at the top is kept white. I think, I don't think we're going to have the problem we see in the image and I think we're reacting to the kind of monolithic quality that we're seeing, but I don't think that's actually what it's going to look like. So I'm actually not concerned with seeing it again because I don't think it'll ever look quite like it is here. I don't think it'll be much more nuanced and have a little bit more variation in it. I have a couple clarifying questions. So is there a building wall on the side? And in the blue wall on the rare, would the board want white molding at the rare and if there is some sort of a side building beside would you, I guess we need you to clarify if that exists. It's a zero lock line so we're built right up to the neighboring lots. Yeah. And then the rare I did notice in your rendering it does show us like a tiny ounce of blue wall. Yeah, there's you can see in this a little bit better. This is actually right here, just this wall is the end of Judy so that would get the same pain. So does the board, it doesn't get, does the board want a white trim at the top or, or no, you could go to the next slide that shows the rendering. There is no molding at the back entrance either, just as a clarify. I want to go back to the window, the front window. I think you mentioned that where, yeah, the where it says AOB, you're not going to have that. You are or not going to have the panel with the oysters in the back. I can you clarify that where it says up on the awning AOB. And there's a design in that panel. Is that going to be there or panel. Yes, and that's this is, you can see the detail here a little bit. Okay, this is pulling it out. All right, okay. Okay. Oh, sorry, continue. Sorry. Sorry, I was just the front of that hexagon is just going to be the blue, the two either side will have that pattern. While you have to say downtown Amherst, that's, that's pretty obvious. That's where you are. Is that just a balance off the print. We just thought that was a bright and being in downtown Amherst and wanted to call that out. That'll be on marketing that goes on our website. Yeah. And I had one other clarifying question about the light fixtures the light posts in the in the front along North Pleasant Street. Dylan, did you say that the the that material, you would not be able to paint over that or it's white PVC. So it's, we wouldn't paint it. It's got it. Like a plastic almost. I believe Gabriel Gould would like to make a comment. Hi guys. I just wanted to say I think we have eight or nine new businesses opening on this street alone in the next two to seven months and the reinvention of our downtown post pandemic is really important to the economic growth and area and adding that downtown Amherst and they're in that point of pride in marketing and showing who we are. And that we are a community that is revitalizing and becoming more vibrant than we ever were before is really exciting for me from my position. I agree that this I see where everybody's coming from but I also, we all know that these computer renderings never show the nuances and the shading and the coloring and I think this is going to be quite an incredible statement and as someone who is looking at Judy is every day and walking by, we are looking at something that has fallen into great disrepair wasn't looking great pre pandemic is looking really rough now and it's really exciting to see this coming to fruition, and taking into account that that handicap ramp was put in years ago but never really addressed fully in terms of entrance and that sort of weird triangle thing and welcome to the block and also to keep in mind that the existing lamp posts that are there are soon going to be replaced with the same style that is down by Kendrick Park and I think that that's going to really add some beauty to this whole building as well. So I just wanted to put a shout out to that just it's so exciting to see these things really starting to happen, and to see the change and to see the pride in our downtown. So you're talking about these posts right here and here in the foreground. I am, I am those are all changed out soon. Yeah. Great. Okay. Okay. Anything that anybody wants to add. As we pass on this approval or recommendation. So everybody's happy with what we have suggested. And marine you want to go over the specific sort of changes. Yeah, so make the, the, I guess the roof line molding white for the front building beside. And make sure that the edges are clean. For the trim of the, particularly the hex the half of hexagon building part. That was it. So well so the back the light fixtures, or the light posts in the rear. The front light posts can't be painted. So did the board want to be consistent with, with that with keeping the light fixtures white in the rear then I would, but others may feel differently. Anybody want. So are we, is everybody happy with the white post and the gold. I mean, I think with the PVC factor, it makes sense to keep them as they are. I don't know if there's a PVC and the back are as well. Okay, then forget it. They'll even white. All right. They're easier for maintenance for operations. Oh, definitely. Yeah. Okay. Anything else marine anything any of the board. I have a question. So like the light. I'm sorry, the banners. So the, the banner closest to our view has that logo. We don't necessarily see that repeated in the other banners, but. Is that. Will the logo be in the other. We're open to. To anything that we just had the leading one. Okay. So I have a suggestion that I might just use your pattern. There. The backwash pattern. I think I'd be really elegant and simple and probably the same to produce, you know, just a solid color. So that was. Right there. Yeah. Yeah. I mean that I think you have it behind some of the signage out front too, or some pattern out there. So, you know, that could just be a texture that you could use there to reinforce that without the logo, logo, logo, logo all the way down. That's a good idea. Or don't even put them on just have the, you could just have that. Right. To the entrance to the back. Okay. And so. Okay. Yep. But what's the intention of the color. Colors shown at the back door. Are you referencing this? This is the elevator. Shaft. This was just a. Probably getting too cute was trying to. The colors are not going to change from with the existing shaft. We're just going to replace this with the. And we're so it's your bar primary logo. And it says gray. Yeah, it just stays the same gray. Tom. Oh, okay. All right. All right. So we talked about the, the white molding. The making sure the trim is, is clean. The edges are clean and add tech, you know, if possible, add texture to the rare banners. And I think that was it. Okay. All right. Okay. So do I hear a motion that we. Approve the application with those additional. Comments or recommendations. And it looks like Tom has one more comment. Okay. So, so moved. Oh, so moved. Okay. Is there a second? I can. Catherine, are you seconding? Okay. Okay. It's moved and seconded. Let me take a roll call. See how you all stand on this. Lindsey. Yes or no. Yes. Okay. Okay. Catherine. Yes or no. Okay. Erica. Yes. Okay. Tom. Yes. Okay. Catherine. Yes. Okay. All right. Very nice. So do you have an idea when this will be opening and. So yeah, this was our last step for article 14 approval. We did some demolition and construction as soon as possible. The meet times on items are all, I mean, I'm sure you all have heard about it all, but. Where we've been juggling it, we're looking for July, mid July. If we can, as long as nothing else comes, comes around. So hopefully this summer we'll be up and running and excited to have you all down there. So. Okay. Thank you for your time tonight. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Okay. Thank you. Okay. Now more rain. We have James Richards. Who is here to. Show you his proposed signage for his new retail shop. And this, which is located at 40 Main Street. And James, if you could share your screen. I could, if that's helpful. I believe you said that you might be, you might have called in. So let me pull up your application. There with me for a moment. So James, once I pull this up, if you could explain, if you could introduce yourself. And explain what you're proposing. Okay. Can you, can you hear me? Yes. Oh, great. Can you see me? No, no. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I just asked you to start your video. But. Oh, there you go. So. I don't believe that I have a video, but you do. We see you now. We see you now. Oh, great. Great. Hi, my name is James Richards. And this is my shop. Proposal for a sign. Simple. I think this can not be as complicated as the oyster bar. Amethyst in the purple lettering. And that's like a Broadway script. Kind of an art deco style. Is what I'd like to have. And that's the front window, which I've already installed a sticker type of sign. And the same color and the same. Style. Say amethyst. And those are just the two pieces that I am looking to get approved. All right. Okay. Your door. Is this your door? That is the door. Okay. Are you putting anything on the door? It's just a sign that says open. Okay. All right. Okay. I'll just finish showing everyone the photos. Okay. So. Your retail shop. But the. The underpass. And so there's three windows through that. Underpass. So it was window one. Window two. And window three. And then the final photo shows you looking back towards town hall. Okay. And that shows all three windows. Okay. Thank you. Thank you. Lindsay is raise your hand. So I think. My only suggestion might be to invert the white and purple on your sign. Cause of the. Like outline. Just think you would stand out a lot more and be a lot kind of cleaner. If you had, you know, just a purple field. Because it's a state of the art, it's your future. So I think that's a good idea to add to everything. Have you considered that? I would be glad to do that. Yeah. If, if that. If other people agree, but that's a good idea. Be glad to. What do other people think repeat that? Do you talk about the sign? Lindsay or the one on the window? on a white background have basically a purple background which is white lettering. Okay. No border. It hadn't occurred to me but I, I like it a lot, especially looking at the other awnings which are solid. You know your neighbors on the street solid, a white letter. Yeah. Yeah, she has white sign with black lettering. Tom. I was just curious what your plan is for the material for that and whether it's like a little kind of quality or material you might expect that to be a sign. Yeah, the hanging sign. Well, yes. Amherst copy is, is making that it's a standard metal. Like composite sign that they do. Okay, also the same as my neighbors there. Cool. Okay, thank you. Any other thoughts or suggestions. So we're really focusing on the sign on the outside of the building. Everything, the sign on the window is, is okay. I mean, I generally speaking, I'm fine with it either way. I'm fine with it being white on black or white on, sorry, purple on white or white on purple. I think, I think either one's going to stand out in this perpendicular format. So I'm okay with it. Okay. Catherine. Hi James, are you planning to put any signage in terms of finals to gone letter and the three different windows that go down the tunnel to the parking. Are you going to leave those assets? Yeah, I wasn't planning on adding lettering to that necessarily at this time. So those were just included. Yeah, they, they, I decided to cross the street and take some photos of the, of the, of the different of the existing conditions. I mean, if the board wants to make recommendations. So if you have existing signage, that's perfectly fine. You know, technically, Mr Richards, you know, those signs that you do have the existing signs that you do have in the door in the various windows do need a building permit approval and, you know, the, the building inspectors will, you know, talk to you about that. So, you know, the board has jurisdiction to provide recommendations to the, the, the, the decal or the lettering and the signage that is shown in the photographs. So I suppose. I know it doesn't. Are you saying that I, that I need further approval for things that are on the window as, as they are right now. It'll be part of your building permit approval process. And so, and so because of that, that triggers a DRB. You know, review so if the board wants to provide any additional recommendations other than the other than the proposed blade sign that's perfectly fine and you know the building inspectors can incorporate those recommendations as well. Okay. So do I hear any further comments from the board about further signage or the signage that we that we're, that's being proposed. I'm not sure about the original proposal to have the purple background and the white lettering. Is that a recommendation but we're not, we can, we can suggest this, but I get that I don't get the sense that if they he doesn't follow through that we wouldn't approve it. That's why I'm saying this Lindsay. I just want to say one other one other pitch for that idea is just that I think it might, you know, it might weather better like think the dark background will hide some of the kind of dirt that will accumulate over time so in my opinion I would make it a recommendation but it's really, you know, it's a question for the board to whether or not that's something that is agreed upon. Okay, thank you. Catherine. I actually want to agree with Lindsay on that I think that in terms of, you know, not just whether but in the continuity of the other signs on the street, having sort of a solid color background in the white lettering. I think that it might just look nice. Okay, and sort of just continuity six. So Gabrielle. Maureen I'm sorry I just wanted to follow up with you. I understand he needs the building permit for the sign to hang the Amethystine but you said windows. Does he have anything in the other three windows, I thought it was just the front window, the temporary open sign. Yeah, so I can go through so the, if you see the Amethystine lettering in the front window so that is signage that, you know, under the zoning bylaw it triggers, it triggers review just like the oyster bar that we just reviewed. So this is signage the, the red, the red star and these yellow, yellow signs here this is, this is signage considered signage on the zoning bylaw. And this open sign here on the door is considered signage. So it just, you know, technically, Mr Richards should have included, you know, he should have consulted inspection services about the proposed signage for the business as a whole. But, you know, it's fine that it is up, but you know, the building inspectors may have some questions but I'm sure they're, they're fine with it. But, you know, here the design review board does have, you know, just, this is your opportunity to help guide the building inspectors in their decision making for approving the building permit for the signage. And so this is in a way education for you, Gabrielle. Exactly. As you were working with businesses is that, you know, these sorts of things, you know, they need to go through, you know, unfortunately, bureaucracy will dictate that that, you know, town hall needs to abide by the zoning bylaw. And so, you know, needed permits are needed permits and so these are, you know, the technicalities of the zoning bylaw. So my question is like the open sign heat, those are temporary right so he sticks those in the window when he's open and then take them out when he's not an assuming. Exactly. Right. Yeah, so those are conversations with the building inspector of what that all means. Okay. Yeah. You know, his neighbor over at Art of Intimate, she have had hers put on the window and a knife. I know the word it's just not coming to me. Are you sort of saying that's preferable to a yellow fine or. Yeah, and so for the across the Art of Intimate, you know, for example, that business owner had proposed all the lettering that you see on her windows in doorway and went through the building permit process. Great. Thank you. Yeah, I just wanted to know and then the last question I have and again this is educational for me to help businesses going forward. During the holidays and certain seasons, people like to decorate their windows with you know, some hand painted glasswork or hearts and things like that I'm assuming that that's all fine to go with as long as it's a temporary measure. Yeah, that would be my, my opinion. And I, and so, so if you're asking me, I think that's fine. But you might want to just double check with, you know, inspection services. Thank you. To Mr. Richards, we don't want to alarm you or scare you it's fine that you have, you know, the yellow signs and the open sign it's just, you know, technically you should have gone through inspection services before putting that up. Okay. I think Catherine has her hand up. There you go Catherine. Thank you. I want to just apologize to the board and to Jamie, because I actually have to leave the meeting but before, before I go I, the reason I asked about the windows in the alleyway. And then my second part was going to say, if we do recommend changing the sign to a solid purple with white lettering, would we then also make the recommendation that the amethyst on the front window also goes to white lettering. And I was wondering if the purple and blue banner behind it is a permanent fixture. I feel like it makes the sign a little difficult to read and obviously your goal and our goal in general is to make sure that your sign is visible and that people know that it's a shop and to come in. So I am going to leave that there to the rest of the board. And thank you so much. Thank you. Okay, all right. You know, I was thinking about those side windows which are very interesting. If in the future you just, you feel as the business grows, you may think gee I might like to put some little something name of the store or something in the windows you could always come back to the design review board with your suggestion, because sort of interesting that you have those other windows and people walking through maybe just a little tiny sign or name of the store, but you don't have to do that now. You know, I like excuse me but I, yeah I like what my neighbor has done that's, you know, it's really pretty. It's really nice. Basically she's just putting her name and putting the hours up with other people just have like small signs like sort of what I did. Yeah, yes in the future. That might be a nice thing to add on to that. I do agree with Catherine about the sign with that pan and whether that's an art glass behind it but it doesn't stand out. And I don't know whether the board would agree that maybe having that with with white outline of the letters or something to make that more visible from the street. There's a little lost in there now. Anybody have a white background. Maybe yeah, I mean, to any any others. So what do we have what if we conclude it here that we're recommending that the sign from the wall, have a purple background with white lettering. Lindsay that's where I think you stand and you recommend that that's your recommendation. That is my recommendation. Okay, I'm fine with that. That's fine. Yeah. Okay. Any other thoughts to pass along on this. Okay, if not, so marine what do you have down that we're for the blade sign the proposed blade sign have white lettering with a purple background and no outline. And then leave it to his discretion as to what he wants to do with the sign on the front of the store. So it gets more visibility. Okay. Okay, good idea. Okay. All right. So do I hear a motion to approve this as as we have as we've adapted it for. I'm not recommending the change specifically on the sign from the building. So move. So move. Is there a second. Okay, Erica second. I'll go through and take the roll call. Lindsay. Yes. Okay. Here, Tom. Right. Okay, Erica. Yes. And I, so yes. Yes. So, okay. Well, hope we've been helpful for you and you can always very contact marine and if you have other ideas about signage, bring them back and we'd be happy to look them over. Okay. Oh, great. And I'll be making the windows along the passageway look better than the way they look right now. Yeah, I mean, I just really think they're quite neat and just make something of them get a little sign in there. I stopped by after I took the photos I stopped in your shop and I really like it. It was really fun to walk around and I got a rock for my work station. So it was, it was a nice, nice little visit to break up my day. So. Great. Great, thanks. Thank you. We'll move on to the next item, which is for coordination cafe, which is located at 103 North Pleasant Street, which is the old location of Bart's ice cream. And so this application is in regards of their proposed signage and outdoor seating. And let me pull up. So I believe Joe. Or, or it's sorry if I'm mispronouncing your name. I believe he will be presenting. So, second, where did he go? Oh, here he is. Okay. Joe, if you could state your name and I don't know if if you're able to share your screen, that would be helpful. If not, I can share mine. But yeah, if you could state your name and explain what you're proposing, it'd be helpful. Hi. My name is Joe Kurtz. And that's okay. It was not spelled right in the, in the minutes, but it's K U R T Z. I'm a. Oh, sorry. No, it's okay. No problem. I would have a hard time trying to pronounce that myself when I looked over the minutes. I'm not sure how to say that one either. But I am from, I'm here with Coronation Cafe and as was already mentioned, I'm sure you know the space and I will share my screen. You said I should do that, right? Yeah, I can do that too. If that's, if that's helpful. You got it. If you can. Coming up. And can you see that picture? Yes. Okay. So you would of course recognize that as being the, what used to be Bart's ice cream for, for many years. And we are putting in a cafe there. It's called Coronation Cafe. And this is pretty, let's see what this picture is showing you is going to be the, the outdoor, the outdoor seating. A few small tables and chairs that we, that we put out there. These, these already exist. We just put them out there. And I took a photograph of them. A few, a few days ago. And let me see. I'll show you the next one. I think it's very similar. Just another angle. Yeah. It's very similar, just another angle. And did you want to, I don't know if you wanted to pause and talk about that, or if you want me to go through and show the, the signage. Well, I just have one question. Wait. Am I muted? No, we hear you. Okay. Okay. Are you keeping that same fence or. Yes. Okay. All right. Yeah, we don't. Yeah, I don't plan to, to move the fence. Yeah. Okay. Why don't you go to the signage because that's probably the most critical piece of coming up this. Yep. Okay. So here we are looking at it from the, from North Pleasant street, of course. Coronation cafe. The, and here is another picture of the angle on the side, the, the little angle there at the corner. Okay. And then I'll show you this one, which is on the side. These, these signs, all, all three of these signs are three foot high. And the, now I'm looking at the one from the street again. Okay. That one is, that one is as proposed there on the picture. I mean, of course the designer did the best she could. It's 21 foot long. That one's 21 foot long. And the one on the angle. Oops, I went the wrong way there in my pictures. Sorry about that. This one is 12 foot long. And this one is 35 foot long. Now, yeah, that's, that's proposed. I'm not set on this. In fact, it seems like I may, I almost wish to make it smaller. And when I say smaller, I mean not three foot high, but maybe more like two foot high. And so what I did was, and I regret I don't have this image, but Hare East is the business to the, to the right of it, which I'm sure you know where I'm talking about. Their sign is I would call a banner type sign. And it's, I think it's exactly three foot high. And so I, yeah, I continued that. Let me see if I can go back to that front. No, you can't see it. It's just cut off right there. But that would be my screen, my screen and share Google street view. So this is the old Barts signage. And then here is the here, here East. So you're saying so is this from here to here the blue is that there must be three feet. That is correct. That is correct. And then this is the black is that awning or is that No, it's not. No, it looks like it goes. At least it's flatless, but that way. So and are you saying that that's also three feet. It is, it is, but if there's a there's a marquee on this building. The architectural aspect of it is only 18 inches. And so what I'm saying with that is the sign hangs down 18 more inches. So that's for a total of three foot. If that makes, if you understand what I'm saying. Okay. So you're proposing to adjust the. Okay, okay, I say now was the that that does look like a an awning marine. Maybe it's the fabric that gives that sort of feel. Yeah, I think it's just a vertical a vertical fabric. Yeah. All right. Yeah, there's metal frames behind it all the way around and okay. It's outboard of the building. And then I'll give this other view. So everyone sees. Okay. All right, I'll, I'm going to stop my share. Okay. But folks can ask if you want me to pull that back up. Okay. So. Comments. I suppose there'd be two ways. Two comments, maybe about the, the longer sign, but also the. Sign that says coronation cafe and. How that. Balances with the rest of the signage. So. Any comments. People okay with this. Anybody have any thoughts. Okay. I'm excited to see that there's a new cafe coming in town. So thank you and congrats. I like this elevation that we're looking at here. I think that everything is working. There's still, it's a bit busy. You know, with the script and the multiple signs, but I'm. Relatively fine with this elevation. You go to the last street view. Oh, sure. That's right here. No. Sorry. The presentation. Oh. Oh, sorry. Then that means. Sorry, Joe, if you could. Yeah. Yeah. Coming up. That's the street view. Yeah. Keep going to the side alley. You want to side. Okay. One second. There. Yeah, that one feels. Kind of excessive in terms of the amount of information that you're providing. So, you know, if there was a way to. Simmer that into something that is again, I think having the. The same font for one thing, like you've got the script on the other side. That says something about healthy. Healthy. The cuisine. So yeah, I don't know if it's just. You know, I don't think you need to like list all of your menu or even the highlights of the menu. I think that's just kind of a lot of information that's relatively unnecessary. Kind of cluttery feeling. Also, it's like. You know, you know, more of the imagination can do the trick and get people in there. Maybe from a business standpoint, that's a good idea. But. Yeah. So I would just say like, if you could, if you could limit that information and use the same font on both sides. That would be my recommendation. Should I respond now? Is it okay? Yeah. We, we have actually remade. I agree with you. And we had the same thought. And we've remade it with. With only about. Two or three. Things on each, on each side. We have. Yeah. Yeah. It is, it is. I agree with you. We're planning to. Say. Fewer things there. So you said you're eliminating. So right now. It looks like you have one, two, three, four on the, on the left. And then one, two, three, four, five on, on the right side. And you're saying that you would like to eliminate to maybe three on both sides. Yeah. I actually have another design. I'm not sure I could find that real real seamlessly and show you, but I think it says handmade soft pretzels. On the one side. And on the other side, it says. Loose leaf tea. And mocha. Some. And latte and latte. Those three things. In the direction of reduction of information, but I also think, yeah, it's kind of still very specific, like where the other elevation, the street side. It's kind of more general, like you're talking about a certain type of cuisine and a certain kind of friendliness of welcoming. But I guess I just don't think you need that degree of specificity and it's a little bit distracting. So I would just, I would just be. I would suggest going more general. And again, holding the same kind of style of text, both from a font standpoint and information as on the other side. May I, may I say one more thing? I want to. Ask too many questions, but. What, what would you say as a board. If, if I would actually eliminate. This entire sign. That would be a question that I'd like to raise because. Like I said at the beginning. I, I kind of feel it based upon what I saw. Barts had done. And now when I look at it, I say, wow, this is, this is so much signage. But I think in terms of even the, the percentages that's allowed, I believe it's okay. But I just wanted to present that question to you all as well. Yeah. I'm going to finish since I'm speaking so much. And then I'll be done. I would just say, I think that the banner should remain. I think that wrapping it is important as a unifying element, but I don't think you need all that text on either side of the coronation cafe. That's all I'll say. Yeah. Yeah. I would agree with Lindsay entirely, lead the sign with your coronation. I'm not going to add to that. But. Eliminate because yeah, it's way too confusing and doesn't add to the attractiveness of the building. So Tom. Yeah, thanks. Thanks Joe for your presentation. And I'm going to, I'm going to agree with some, maybe slightly alternative recommendations here, which is. I think you need that sign because I think this is a point of entry for a lot of people who may not be walking down Main Street, but maybe coming from the side. And I think that you have an opportunity to showcase your business from there. And so I would keep this sign. That said, I'm just as comfortable with you repeating what you have on the front here on the side, which is high level general, you know, great cuisine, you know, it's really cool. That's great. That's a good message. My other recommendation is that what you'll see at many places. And I think, you know, we talked about the bakery across the street and all these other places. They use the windows and you have plenty of square footage here. I know this facade to put some items, maybe along the base of the windows. Right. So people at a distance will see. They'll see the windows. They'll see the windows. And they have a certain kind of cuisine. Let me check it out. And as they walk closer items that are smaller, that are on the glass, you could list them across the bottom somewhere in a very elegant way. And as you get closer to the building, you can see those things. And therefore it's okay to list omelettes, parfaits, bininis, et cetera, in smaller type along the bottom of those windows in a very, you know, clean way that people when they approach the building can see what's inside, what you have inside, but you don't need to broadcast anything from far away is kind of what I'm saying. So I would, I would say, I would recommend you keep the sign all the way along this facade. I would recommend losing the type and finding another location for that within the glass on this facade here. Can I just go to the front side. I'm just sorry now for my own benefit. I just want to get back to the question. Yeah. I can't really see the, the difference. And that says like naturally, naturally healthy cuisine served with a heart of welcome. Yeah, that's true. Yeah. Agree. That would be so much better. So I just piggyback on what you said, Tom, about putting the small lettering, which I think we suggested another time. But how about putting it at the top. Of the window. Sure. Yeah, I mean, I think either way, I mean, the bottom's a little more out of your, you know, not in your face. But I mean, I think, you know, you'd have to see what you can see with the railing there. And it's a judgment call. And I'd let you kind of make that decision. But I feel like it's slightly more elegant and pedestrian friendly, if it's down at a slightly lower level, just from my experience. But again, see what you can see when you're standing on that walkway outside of the railing and make that judgment call. But but I think that type could get way smaller because it's for an audience that's much closer, right? It's different than the broadcast that you have at the top. So my sense is you can have all that tax and it'll still look elegant because it'll be much smaller and more considered. Erica, did you have a comment? Yeah, I concur with the fact. I think that the banner should continue to be three feet deep and wrap all of the sides. I think that that is an I think Lindsay said it a nice unifying element. And I think that it also, you know, meeting your the height of the the banner that your neighbor has for their signage at the hair salon is is important for consistency as you move across. I think that the the suggestions about changes to the information that's shared on the banner, I could concur with those if I'm a little less concerned about that than my my colleagues are here. But the issue that I want to raise is that there's a lot of fonts. This is just the coronation cafe. I think that's a really nice, bright, bold, exciting logo. And then naturally healthy cuisine is a different script than they're right next to one another. And then the menu list on the other side is is yet another sans-serif font that's different from cafe. So how to manage that is my question. And I I don't know if my colleagues have any opinion about it, but I feel like it's it's busy just because there's a lot of different font types to manage as you as you're reading all of the information. Well, if we eliminate that the sort of the menu on this side, that would take away that that takes away one. Yeah. And there's move there could the script be the same as coronation? Yeah. That would help. Tom. Yeah, I mean, that was my usually this is my domain to critique type faces, but I was hoping someone else would bring it up. But I didn't want to be too big. I do I do think the cafe type that you have that's written under coronation is a great typeface and guessing that's like Gotham or circular or something like that. And I probably use that on the glass with the names of the foods that you're using for that would build consistency. And I also agree that the the scripts are different enough for us to recognize. So it might be something you want to think about unifying those scripts or instead of the script, you could use that light delicate cafe type that you have there. And that might that's also delicate. It's also friendly and also might work in that case. So it's just something I'd study. You know, how do I simplify the the number of typefaces? I'm not against having many typefaces. I just think these are competing with each other. And just be cautious. Can I ask a question about that? When I look when I look at the the logo coronation, and then I look at what I'm showing you there naturally healthy cuisine served with the heart of welcome. Do I hear you saying that that those scripts are are quite different? They might my look my glancing at them. I think they're the same or very close to the same. But you've studied a lot more of these things than I have. Yeah, no, they're they're different. I mean, I don't I don't think they're different enough that a lot of people would recognize it. But I think I think you have an opportunity because you're using a script to just use the same one and I check it for legibility. I think it's it's nice to be consistent with you with your typefaces if you can. And again, there might be certain letters that are harder to read with the coronation type you have versus the other handwritten type has much more clear letter starts and ends. So it might be more legible. So I mean, I'm not against having those two scripts. I just know that they're different. And now I'd encourage you to see what would it look like if they were the same? Yeah, and if I could reiterate, I think that what we're asking for is would you ask your sign designer to lay it out with a series of iterations, one of which would be to use naturally to to write naturally healthy cuisine, serve with the heart of welcome in the same font that you're using to write coronation. And then try it with the same font that you're using to write cafe. And see if one of them is is clearer than either of these. Then sorry, then what we're seeing now, for consistency sake. Okay. And I would say for not for approval, but for at least my opinion is that I don't need to see that to approve this. It's just a recommendation of something that potentially agree. Sure. Good. Sure. No, I it's a good recommendation, I think I thank you for pointing that out. So is this a one of a kind or is Coronation cafe? Or is this the is this the only Coronation cafe? Are you the owner of this or are there other Coronation cafes? I am the owner of this. There is there is it's not a chain. Okay. At least not yet. Okay. Yeah, because if it was, then we would have a different discussion, I'm sure. Yes. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, tell me what a grillatia is. Oh, yeah, it's I'm gonna have to call my wife here, but it's it's it's kind of like a tortilla, like a punky shell tortilla. And it's actually gluten free. Oh, and it's my saying that, right? My daughter's here and she knows some of these things. And it's yeah, so we'll so we'll like cook the chicken that's inside it. And then we'll throw it on a panini press. And we'll have a nice grill lines on it and stuff like that. So it's yeah, I don't know. I don't know if that explains it or not. But it was an attempt. Thank you for asking that question. Yeah. Thanks for one more thought. Yeah. I also am not opposed to the message on the front that says, you know, the healthy food, healthy cuisine, which are welcome. I also want to just throw out there that I don't think it's necessary to have that message. So I think it's that's definitely like a personal business decision. I agree with everything that's been said about the type font. And it's it is maybe a subtle difference. But for people who are trained to look at this kind of stuff that is noticeable. So and and it's one of those things that just like subtly your eye gets like relaxed by seeing things be consistent. But it you know, as you're as you're reducing your amount of information on the other side, you might just think about like, what do we really need to say over here? And I appreciate the kind of like friendly gesture of it and kind of giving a little more information about what you're offering. But I also think that, you know, it's it's one of those things that's is less more is the question. So just as you're considering it, I think it's fine the way it is, though. And I'm excited to come try a try a bunch of this stuff. The was it? Gorilla Tia. Gorilla Tia. So you kind of see the tortilla word on the end of it. Yeah, sounds delicious. Yeah. Elements off the grill and throw it across the peony press. Yep. Anything else? Any other suggestions? Okay, Marine, then we're, we're offering this, the suggestion of considering comparing fonts. And then I think the majority suggested not to have that strip of various menu items on the side. Am I correct on that? Is that how we? Yeah, so, so I guess, if you you could mimic the front the front sign on the side. Or, you know, Lindsay suggesting, you know, perhaps less is is more. So having like a negative space in the white without that sentence could be another option. And then keeping the banner height at three feet. And then look into whether you know you want to consider having providing lettering at the at the bottom or at the top of each window indicating the different menu choices. And then you could, you know, you would choose if the bottom or the top would make sense, you know, based on maybe the fence and other existing factors that, you know, may prevent viewing of that messaging, but try to keep it, you know, pedestrian friendly as people walk by. So you want, you know, pedestrians to be able to see that lettering. And then, yeah, Catherine had mentioned about doing, I was gonna say do experiment have the sign designer test out the different scripts. So like the naturally healthy cuisine, maybe one script served with a heart of welcome, maybe a different scripts. And maybe even the coordination could be a separate script. So seeing those, figuring out with choosing, you know, one and being consistent all the way through. And if there's a variety of different other scripts, testing those out to see the differences, and then include it and then maybe even doing a test of this, the letter that the typeface per cafe. Did I get it? Thanks. I didn't see that. When you look at the sign that one naturally healthy cuisine would be one script. Then the other another one on the other side, is that what you said? Or that would we agreed on? I guess I'll need maybe Tom or a member to clarify. So is next do you feel that naturally healthy cuisine is one script? And then what's another different scripts? Is that okay, so the sentence is one script. Okay, I got a little confused. Okay. Okay. But the two should perhaps be consistent. Although maybe maybe it's not. Yeah. Okay. Okay. Any other comments for Marine? So we could pass this on. If not, do I hear a motion that we recommend the signage? Tom to move? Okay, Erica. Okay, then let me go through the attendance here. Lindsay? Yes or no? Yes. Okay. Erica? Yes. Tom? Yeah. Catherine? Yes. And Catherine. Our other Catherine Davis is not here. Okay. All right. Very good. Well, thank you. Good luck. Be nice to see something at that corner. Yeah. So Joe, I'll take up this memo and email you copy and then provide it to inspection services. Because I believe you're waiting for like an article 14 approval and then building permit applications and stuff like that. That is correct. Thank you. Thank you. You're welcome. Good luck. Thank you, Tom. Thank you, everyone. Okay. Alright, folks want to approve the meeting minutes? That I did bribe? Yeah. Did anybody have any questions, corrections on the minutes? I have read them, but it's been a while. Can we approve the minutes? Or do we want to? I'm fine with approving the minutes. All right, Erica, do you approve, move to approve the minutes? And what were the dates? December 13th in February 15th. Okay, I move to approve the meeting minutes of December 13th, 2021 and February 15th, 2022, as written. Okay. Is there a second? Oh, second. Second. Okay. All in favor indicate by saying aye. Aye. I wasn't present, but I can say aye. Okay. Then you didn't say aye. So it'd be Erica and Tom and I, and you would abstain then from that. Do we have any public attending tonight? I will check. I don't think now we do not. Okay. All right. Is there any other? It's so popular. There's a big committee meeting happening tonight, so everybody's rushing over there. I was wondering why Hilda wasn't here. What's it about? Our new school building, they're proposing the education plan for, for discussion. So what kind of high school or elementary or elementary? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, new elementary school plans are in the works. That's right. It's going to be a big project, getting bigger by the minute, I'm afraid. We're in the middle of a meeting. Are you still recording? Yes. Oh, do we want to adjourn? Yes. Yeah. Do I hear, I move that we adjourn the meeting as anybody opposed to that? Okay. All right. We've adjourned the meeting. Does that mean you turn on?