 Thank you, gentlemen. We're going to go ahead and get started. Mayor Benjamin is out of town, so it's thanks to the women that came in. We should talk about you. We'll get started. Alright, good afternoon. Mr. Rickleman, Mr. Mcdowell, Mr. Duvall, Mr. Badura, Mr. Vine, Mr. David, Mayor Benjamin. Thank you. Put the record on here. Oh, Mr. Rickleman. Now, you just do it right before I could respond. Well, gentlemen, thank you for today. I think this opportunity to get together to do the work of the city and form our decisions, protect those that are not with us today, travel, and maybe working for your good homies. I'll let you know that Mayor Benjamin may be calling in during the open session. Ms. Krista. As Krista comes forward, Mr. Davis, I'll announce it for the record, the Gilstreet Greenway discussion. Ms. Krista Hampton, Planning and Development Services Director. I'm sure we have some interested parties present with us today. And also, is John going to present? That's okay, Mr. John Fellows, as well, with our Planning and Development Services Department. Yeah, this is actually going to be much shorter than it had originally been intended. The reason being, we've been communicating with the Gilstreet Watershed Association on some very good conversations about some widths of the Greenway and some compromises to try to get to a place where it meets the city and the association's needs. So I'll go ahead and turn it over to John. Good afternoon. As Krista mentioned, we have had very good on that. Yes. Interrupt for a minute. Are we recording? Can you pull the microphone closer to your microphone? Sure. Thank you. Is that open? Yeah, that's open. Go ahead. They're on. Are they on? All right. As Krista mentioned, we have had some ongoing conversations. These conversations actually have gone on for a number of months. Valerie and I have had conversations as well as Valerie and Krista talking about some of the standards. You'll recall we came to you in 2015 with some standards. Really, any of the Greenway planning came together, but we knew as staff that we need to have something to be a-diving some standards and things. And then a few months later, okay, here we go. A few months, a few years later, then you actually entered into an agreement with the county that indicated what those dimensional requirements were going to be. And what we have learned through this process is that we have some very simple criteria, but there's a lot more nuanced things that go into this Greenway. I think the county and the PDT have learned a number of things about planning a Greenway. We've certainly learned a lot about the Green, the Beals Creek corridor in particular, and some of the constraints and things that we have. And so I think it was last week we had some conversations and I shared an email to Valerie and to Beals Creek and kind of online some of the things. I'm sorry, just for the record. Describe Valerie in full name and what does Valerie do when you're referencing Valerie. Sure. Valerie Marcel and she is with the Beals Creek Association. She's been our main contact with that nonprofit here in Columbia. And so when we have had these conversations, basically last week we kind of put into text some of the things we were going to look at. In fact, staff, a while back, actually started looking at the standards that we brought to you and we needed to update some of them. We've seen some, had some partnerships, had a lot of conversations. So when I say staff, I also want to clarify it's a partnership between parts and engineering and planning and public works. And so all of those departments actually have been at the discussion table discussing things as long-term maintenance, logistics of changing the light bulb, all sorts of things like that. And we've also talked to Beals Creek to understand their concerns. And so some of the things that we're going to be looking at we're going to be coming back to you shortly, probably in a few weeks to sometime in August with some revised standards is looking at some things for flexibility because before we had kind of one width but we didn't really consider for instance those side-connecting trails. So it's sort of like if you think about a road, sometimes you have an arterial road that's five lanes but then you have that side street that's only two and so we really don't need the width to make those connections from neighborhoods to the larger dimensions but that agreement between the city and the county actually had just one dimension and so they've just been working with one dimension from that perspective. There will be some cost savings there and also a little bit of a different experience when you go from the neighborhood to the larger trail. We've also talked to them about reducing the width from rally to rally to the 12 feet along the boardwalk area as well as some of the trail areas and then we've also had some conversations about the area along the crossing road. It's a kind of interesting urban area and in our conversations we need to be able to the design needs to have flexibility because there's some constraints there's an urban condition we're next to a road we have private property we have a steep drop-off into Beals Creek and so we'll try to craft some language that then can be incorporated and then when the pennies designing the trail, those can be considered and we're also going to look for some exceptions because we know that whatever standards we come up with at some point whether it's with Beals Creek or Hockey Branch or Smith Branch there's going to be that unique situation that needs something slightly different is the solution and so we'll have some built-in exceptions that will allow for some flexibility that are maybe unforeseen and so we're going to be working on the staff will be working on that and then we're going to engage in a few weeks with the commission to have them review the comments and then we'll come back to you after there's been some revisions and both groups have gone back and forth and then we'll be able to present it in more detail some of those changes to all of you and then we can hand that off to the county John, in the original county needs when penny dollars would be appropriated they had a plan laid out and we were told that we can't make any changes that they're everything as solid the way it is have they told you we can make these changes? So there are staff here from the PDT so I don't totally want to speak for them but my understanding all the way through the process and I think of the understanding of other city staff is that for instance if there is a particular segment from a road improvement and I walked over Greenway and it was supposed to go from point A to point B that was not flexible that was the section so they couldn't go an extra block and they certainly couldn't go less but they certainly couldn't go bigger and they couldn't switch it to three streets over or something like that but my understanding is that the details in terms of some of those other types of construction type details are not part of that referendum and things have been developed over time to be able to construct those for instance I think with Guilds Creek I don't think that the time of referendum anyone had any idea of how much boardwalk or how much pavement there might be that wasn't probably even determined until maybe within the last year when all the surveying everything and uplands and lowlands and everything was actually detailed out I think if somebody's here who could confirm that for us what's specific is that the plan is the plan we have these two variations and this is the cost and we can't do anything to change that cost so I just want to make sure that we're not spinning our wheels here on something that we have to have somebody else agree to or not well I mean I think we need somebody from PDT to do that can you comment to the mic can you just say your name for the record I think hi councilmembers and my name is Amy Blizzard and I'm the deputy program administrator for the Honeypots for the bike pad greenway program and thank you for your question because there's a lot of confusion over what can change and what John said is absolutely correct the termite or the scope of the project is sort of fixed or it is fixed but when it comes down to things like design which comes much later after the referendum there are always going to have to be some design changes that will be made in fact we don't even have construction plans at the very beginning that's the process that we've been going through for the last few years and there are going to always be some adjustments that you'll have to make after you get geotechnical information, soils, information like John said things like habitats, wetlands and stuff like that so he was absolutely right and it is something that we have been trying to help coordinate between the watershed association and the county to try to get the project to where it's most appropriate for the environment there do we have contenders built into that budget? because I mean obviously things have changed we don't want to go halfway on a project not get it completed do we have a contingency for that? all of our projects have some base contingency as far as the cost and throughout the process as the design changes we look at the estimates and we look at what we're actually facing in dollars so yes to answer your question I mean for us it's important because obviously our concern will be as things move along we don't have extra funding to fund that project at this point we're struggling to come up with the maintenance money that we're going to be leading at the end so we want to make sure that whatever happens it's going to be able to go because I think people are waiting for this I'll go after you I just want to compliment Valerie and John and all the people involved in the compromise I think that's the way government should work this section of the Greenway is a very important section the reduction from 14 to 12 feet according to my conversation with David Bailey will allow us to get to Timberland which is key you cannot terminate this thing at Beeklet Beeklet is a neighborhood that's not built for the traffic that I think the Greenway will have so we need to make that a spur as John called me in his email and have the main motor walk go around to where you get Timberland I'm pleased that we recognize there's got to be some flexibility in compliment Valerie and John and all the teams and following that point that Councilman Duvall has mentioned what are the cost savings from 14 foot width or 12 foot width does that matter if you can go down as low as 10 feet and instead of 12 feet to extend the track or is it yeah absolutely it will provide some savings any time that you can reduce the width you're talking about the width of the concrete the width of the boardwalks that have to be bought and installed from some of our estimates we see on one inner foot it's about 10 between 10 and $50 a one inner foot depending on the material and depending on if it's high or low it may not seem like very much but when you take something that's 3.2 miles or you know that is a substantial Greenway the savings really do add up and like you had alluded to it would allow us to actually give an extra about 2500 feet which is about a half mile more and giving us a terminus that's a logical terminus so is that a half a mile for 3.5 miles it would add to that yeah the 2.2 so where is the 1.2 it's right now it's under 1 mile yeah my apologies I was thinking of all three phases my apologies so for 3.5 miles after we decrease the width you get an extra almost an extra mile of length to connect it so and why are we since we're talking about adjustment on the design and pathway from 14 feet to 12 foot why not 10 foot so staff did discuss that there are certainly paths out there that are 8 feet and 10 feet but across the country for the last 20 or 30 years as Greenways have been built they actually see a lot more volume and so what communities have had to do they've actually had to go and they've actually had to expand those because the volume of people using the Greenways actually exceeds and they start trampling the sides of the asphalt where the road starts to crumble because of the traffic and it becomes a maintenance issue and so a number of years ago when we did the Divine Street for Jackson plan we actually took a trip up to Charlotte to learn about the little sugar creek trail and their designer some of the things that they had so when we came back and we started looking for the Greenway system here one of the things staff wants to make sure is that we don't so design it so narrowly just for the sake of length that all of a sudden we're going to end up with this population using the trail and people aren't going to fit I can kind of make the relationship if you know you need a four lane road to handle the traffic of cars you know that if you only build a two lane road you're going to have congestion and people are going to complain about it so there is sort of that dimension being on the Rosewood side of the creek and particularly when you get past Timberland there's a lot of roads and a connection to Rosewood Connect so people can actually walk and ride their bike and then they'd be able to go north on this Greenway and go to Whole Foods and things like that and so we anticipate that there's going to be a number of users and so the other thing is a large portion of it is going to be a high boardwalk so when you're on a trail and it's paved you have the grass as a shoulder so if you do get a little bit of congestion people can kind of step to the side or that kind of thing but when you're on a boardwalk and you have railings there's really nowhere for you to go and the other component of the design is that one of the requirements from the cities to have the trail illuminated as well as having call boxes and so when you start introducing the light poles to Whole Foods space then that's an extra two feet by the time you put the base in same thing with the call box so at those points you actually start to have a little bit of a narrow width a brand that's not a long width but you're going to have these portions where they go back and forth and if you ever parks find that they need to put more trash cans out there that's going to be within that space and then if there's a call in the lands there are no conventions on the Greenway for our older population whether it's a street or a trail, often they would use it if there's places to rest but they will tend not to use it if there's not so if we think about it in the future if we ever happen to put benches on the trail that also, you know, a bench takes up three feet so you're going to be within those railings and so we feel that 12 provides the width for volume as well as all those other components that are going to be in that space so we think that's going to be a compromise and it will get us to a better location for access from that perspective Thank you Thank you, General I don't think we'll be able to get you home Melanie would like to speak I'd just like to I'm Valerie Marshall and I believe in transparency that costs are really important a really important factor to consider I've been trying for a long time to get estimates for the Greenway and different widths for Boardwalk and finally, just in the last couple weeks I've gotten some estimates from a couple different sources one for the eight foot wide Boardwalk that has been built on the Solutor Trail and then also the penny is provided estimates per linear foot for a 10 foot width and a 14 foot width it didn't get a 12 foot width I think at the time I was advocating for a 10 foot width so we didn't get the 12 foot width I have some handouts here I'd just like to share and I'm still I'm willing to go with this compromise but I want everybody to understand that the way I'm running numbers the penny has said that a 14 foot wide high Boardwalk would cause $1,100 per linear foot that would end up for the length of Boardwalk that we're dealing with being about $3,630,000 $630,000 that is probably twice what's allowed for in the budget that exists within the penny program for that greenway and that's just for the Boardwalk and that's just construction costs it's not labor or other things so I don't know what the penny has been planning but that's the number they gave me if we go down to 10 foot width it's $900 per linear foot I don't have the numbers as you can see here for 12 foot width because I didn't ask for that at the time I'm assuming that 12 foot would be about 1,000 feet that would be the split between 900 and 1,100 if we went to 12 feet it's still over $3 million I'm not sure again, if I'm running those numbers right, I use my calculator and use the figures that were given to me so I'm not sure where that goes a 10 foot wide Boardwalk would be under $3 million it gets a little bit closer to what the budget is the budget for that Boardwalk right now for construction is under $2 million it's about correcting but I think $1,800,000 something like that so I'm really not sure what we're dealing with but the penny has been planning this Boardwalk from Fort Jackson Boulevard to Michael Lane which is just under a mile saying that we can build that at 14 feet wide so I'm not sure where the discrepancy is I'm just giving you figures I would love more figures and that's why I'm throwing this out I just lost the mic yeah you know this may be a good time to formulate a letter to his penny and I think we've all talked about it before but it may be time for the penny to reevaluate all the projects and rearrange because I think this project originally had a stint going into King's Grant and other places which is not going obviously and should that funding be switched to that other I think this is a good time to have a conversation with the penny folks I know there's going to be some transition so it's kind of a unique time in the next six months but I think they're going to request for the committee to reevaluate the project and make sure that A they have complete funding maybe reprioritize them I think we'll be in the best interest of all the citizens of Richardson County at this point because clearly with the funding source as quickly as it's moving and this and that we're not going to be able to accomplish having the priority and really trying to get the biggest bang for the buck for the citizens I think this from Jackson Boulevard I think at one point we figured out if we did it right we could get all the way to the trustee I think Are there any type of approvals needed at this point by the PDT from the city other than this agreement on the with So to answer both questions in terms of other agreements so we would have to to adapt or modify the width we would have to re-modify that agreement with the county and my understanding is that would be the only transactional document we would need to address and then attach the new standards to that document to answer Councilman Rickerman's question last Thursday I believe it was I was at a meeting that he provided a brief update on some of the next steps that the county plans on taking I'll try to summarize it but if I correct it if I mess up on any of those off of memory hopefully one of the people from the PDT will respond but I believe County Council has a number of meetings coming up here one in August I think end of July and then in August and then following meeting in August we'll have a conversation about moving the other areas of Gills Creek to this particular corridor from Fort Jackson so the money from King's Grant and from by the lake those areas would be reallocated to this particular project would then help fund it definitely through Timmer and Wine maybe even more further they have to change that from a policy standpoint and my understanding is because of the Supreme Court case and everything that's going on they have to re-prioritize everything and do a public meeting about that we should write a letter of support and that that happening is what I'm getting at you guys is there anything else to add? that's been great about the Council's going to be taking us on the 23rd so then for a lot of for a lot of re-programming some of the greenway sections that aren't going to come to fruition so that particular meeting on the 23rd will not only look at just Gills Creek but all the other greenways and then they'll just try and which greenway will be built will not be built that's the meeting of the TVC the Oak Committee they weren't meeting anymore until August so they would have all the trails design or locations from the Phoenix Acts program? no my understanding is that so they have over the last 12 months they have finished up all their public meetings on all the different greenways so they have public meetings on Rocky Branch and Crane Creek and Smith Branch and Gills Creek happened a while ago they also had some other public meetings for some of the greenways that are solely in the county and received community feedback from that and so very similar to Gills Creek there are some portions that the community supported some portions the community didn't support and so my understanding is on the 23rd what they'll do is they're going to actually re-prioritize or reallocate however they whatever word I guess it is some items that were on the original list would not be moved forward for construction and then those other ones that had public support would be moved forward for construction and then at that point I would guess sometime after the transition those other greenways that have not had any designs the county would start doing the construction drawings and items like that I think that's the summary of my understanding thanks Jeff what I'm hearing I need to communicate the status of modifications changes so you and I what I'm hearing is some of it has been done but I don't know that everybody knows the plan that I set forth with the Gills Creek Association was done over the next few weeks staff was going to convene for tomorrow for us to try to get through drafting some more details guidelines and the exception section and things like that and then we're going to give it to Gills Creek for a few days for them to review and then we're going to come together as a group and review those documents and then once there was consensus on those things and if there was a consensus something we'll bring that up to you and say there's something that needs to be balanced there but we hope there'll be consensus and then we're going to bring it back to your work session for you to consider and then the idea would be that those formal documents between the city and the county would come to council and then what happened last time was Ms. Wilson I believe sent a letter over to the county but if you wanted to send a capital letter now in support of their actions on the 23rd that probably would be something that could also be done but I think we need a good we're going to need we probably won't be able to see you with those recommendations until probably one of your August meetings we just need a number of reasons that's Gills Creek I think we're talking about an overview John I guess my concern is this is that going to give us enough time to collaborate not only with the county and with the association and all those persons involved enough time to come and own the 23rd reasonably bring this back to us on the 23rd so I think there's two different things I'm confused there's the process that the county is going through and they're going to have that at their meeting on the 23rd and that is something that is exclusive of Gills Creek they're just basically going to decide which greenways they're going forward with and which ones not and believe there is support for a portion of Rocky Branch and Smith Branch and a little bit of Crane Creek in the city and then obviously Gills Creek but there's some other ones that are fully the counties and that's what they'll be dealing with on the 23rd from our end with the design standards that is something that we'd not have done by the 23rd we'd need about a month or so to collaborate and then bring it back to you and then like August, August, September something like that, that's when you can communicate those dimensional standards and obviously in the process we're going to engage with the design team over at the county to make sure that they're looped into. So do you all want us to reiterate that once we've already sent regarding prioritization of city projects to the county before their meeting next week is that what I'm hearing? I don't know if it's next week. The county's meeting is next week. I didn't realize the county was meeting in their off-session they usually meet during the summer there. But if they are I mean, you want to say she's not city projects, I think it's in general than the overall piece of that overall plan budget effects every other especially the changes that have happened and the reality is the money's coming in quicker costs have gone up so there hasn't been a true balance of that since then and so it would be worth just to encourage them. Okay. Yeah, we can do that. Make it brief. We're getting started. Well I think it's going to be a letter saying what y'all are reporting or whatever it's going to be. After that meeting to see what projects, what movement on and after that meeting. If you'd like an update we can certainly after that meeting I'm sure the county team will provide us whatever minutes or whatever the action was and we can certainly send you an email update. Thank you John. Thank you John. Okay. Can I have you go to the next item? You done with this item this time? I'm not going to do that. Okay. Alright our second item Chris is up a lot for this and her staff with this work session is a text amendment for eating and drinking establishment which is on your agenda for tonight and we wanted to make sure that council have the opportunity to ask any questions of staff and seek clarifications. And Rachel are sending a strange order with this. The provisions that are coming to you this evening are included in the proposed new code but they are coming forward earlier to help alleviate some of the confusion that's happened with regard to eating and drinking establishments and there are three very clear clarifications and I'll let Rachel kind of describe those to you. So we're breaking it down instead of having it restaurants and drinking places we have eating establishments which the example I give is a McDonald's so they're open at various hours of the day but they do not serve online. We have eating and drinking take one which encompasses a mix of restaurants, bars and places that do serve alcohol but the cutoff is midnight so we're looking really at hours of operation now. Type 2 is midnight and later so if they're open until 205 they fall under type 2 and they have to get a special exception from the board of general appeals and they also have to present a great deal of information up front before they even go to the board from the business plan and all of that. Why 12 to 2 when state law is 2 right? We don't have the closing time set in there so if they go and get us an hour's permit that's one thing but the midnight cutoff What's the difference between 12 and 2 how do we the midnight cutoff will encompass more of those late night places that have been more of an issue and that neighborhoods have wanted to have more of an opinion on so in certain districts it'll bring it before the board to go over a proliferation so if there's 5 places in a row that are open until 2 in the morning that's what they're going to be looking at whereas an Applebee for example can sometimes be open until midnight but they would fall under type 1 so that's just we originally had it at 11pm and we pushed it to midnight or we'll become an 18 hour city so we have to plan that Some places will come before the boarders and appeals will be fine but we're gathering all that information up front so that just more transparent when the packets are published for the board everyone in the neighborhoods can see what's coming and it also gives staff an opportunity to really build a portfolio of what these businesses are Yeah So I've got a couple of them One, I've noticed in here that restaurants are going to be allowed in C2 zone properties, should I read that right or not? Yeah, and they currently are with a special exception with Bozo or not? There's a sizing requirement currently in C2 that will remain of the 5000 if they go above that it's a special exception but type 1 is allowed if it's within that sizing and type 2 is the fast food The other question I have is on the patio and the 200 feet distance between RS1 RS2, RS3, RG1, RG2 it's a 250 feet limitation from an outdoor seating to RS1 is that from the edge of the outside seating the building, the property line where does that come I mean you have to, it's not clear on this ordinance It'll be from the outside edge of the outdoor seating to the property That's the part that I have parted with because we just got through talking about greenways we're talking about walkability we're trying to create corridors where people can live and eat How is that going to affect the VISTA or at 5 points if we have developers come in put restaurants in patty and they got rid of it and the neighborhoods next to it I mean there are a lot of neighborhoods that are growing who people want to walk and go eat in their neighborhood and I think this is going to create some restrictive problems Should the patty getting to be by special exception a rule of 200 feet or 250 because I mean you could go in Rosewood and Shannon right now and you could eliminate people in today's thing and it does not call in there for anybody being grandfather I mean if it's existing we're not going to go get them and make them shut it down but it would be if they expanded it and the VISTA for example doesn't back up what if you put a new rail that's an improvement then you're cut I mean that's the way it reads for the type 2 what falls under the type 2 comes under the special exception for improvements, expansions and everything like that I want to clarify outdoor seating is permitted it just has to be further than 250 from the so you can have your arrangement it's just where you put your patio you want to put it at least 250 feet away from the parcel so if I'm in my backyard in my house right but if you're living next door to a commercial district you know what you're if you're moving next door to I don't know pick a restaurant there and they have outdoor I mean you've made that decision I mean what I'm hearing you do is your handicapped and the ability for people to create an atmosphere that people want to walk to and be part of a neighborhood by restriction well yes because you're putting it by foot that is the antithesis of what we try to do in planning which is walkable neighborhoods what we're trying to do is encourage outdoor dining but for them to place it generally towards the street as opposed to in the back of their property so why don't we just say that we just say because you can't not because you can measure six different locations this the edge from the front door right so we're talking about from the edge of the patio to the parcel one so 250 feet that's not even a house of law outside here from the edge of someone's residential parcel to this and this is for new development why buy a parcel that's adjacent to a commercial property of which I'm very familiar then and it's an office yeah that's cool but if it converts to a restaurant and they want to put a patio in the back that may not be and I understand that it's commercial but we're putting these protections and just to make sure it's easy because you can bet they'll be back here talking to y'all about the fact of the noise and perhaps that's why to me it almost makes sense to make it that it's a special exception so that you have to put out a real plan along with all the criteria that goes with that a set of just saying it's too I mean I don't like the 250 I think should be longer but is it 400 feet now there are no restrictions what is the 400 you're making it up with your other that's for liquor that's in the current so let me let me just I know I've done restaurants all my life just about I mean it is impossible to locate a deck or an outside seating in front of a building or back of the building it just depends on the demand and the growth of the business and everything else I'm not comfortable with 250 feet from the edge of the patio I mean I'm not very comfortable with that at all number one, number two I don't think it's very clear to hear that all the ones that is in existence ran is grandfathered in we need to make that specific because otherwise you're going to close half the restaurants in the city the number three is on some of the requirements here for the specialist sections requiring restaurants to bring you kitchen equipment staffing schedule days of hours a lot of that stuff is already within the DHAG permit you've just given them another step another red cape for businesses to open up and start making revenue and start operating I just think some of that needs to be cleaned up a little bit more if that's possible I'm definitely I'm going to urge for grandfathered in quote in here that 250 feet has to be rediscussed and maybe look at the exact location where the 250 feet comes or maybe more and then maybe some of these other requirements that you guys require restaurant owners to do they've already done with DHAG or any other government agency to qualify so I think this is my three concerns in here more than anything else but if you tell me C2 is already in existence with special exception and stuff like that I'll leave you on that just to follow up on those requirements that you referenced those are specifically for the type 2 ones when they're coming for a special exception and just to give you some background how we handle it now when someone comes in for a restaurant or a drinking establishment I ask them for all of that information in making my decision anyway so it's just putting it down and writing that they have to give me the business plan and all that information because it builds a record so that if they begin to operate in a different manner than what they presented to the board when they go for a special exception we have that information but do we require that of all businesses did they submit a business plan I can if I'm unable to determine really what their use is and what their specific is what's their requirement in the city of Columbia no it's not no it's not so why are we going after one industry I mean this is to me selective and it gives me heartburn it does because models change business change you have to change your hours if the business isn't there and all the other things and then they're going to have to come back and get a letter from you we don't do that with law we don't do that with non-tax paying entities we don't do that with other folks y'all I think whoa whoa whoa this is not bars this isn't bars don't muck up the issue let's talk about the facts most says that they already do this to DHEC if they already got the information why is it not easy DHEC doesn't require you to give them a business plan you have to give them a kitchen plan that they have and that's what I got in here kitchen equipment, menu, park DHEC already requires that there's no reason for you to do that we know why they think CBD guys are busy we have required business plans of other businesses just to ensure but technically they don't have to give it to me because it's not a requirement by the city am I correct that's what you just said so this is what I have a problem we're putting it in there as a requirement for folks to do that I think having your drawings having your all the things that you need that's conditions that we have to do asking somebody for their business plan very true listen too if we're not going to do it for everybody we're not doing it for one industry those guys open up a store and they start off selling candles and then they're selling water bombs and vaping like that we don't go shut them down we don't go back and do it but we're picking on a certain industry please understand where we've been coming from with this critique and focus on how we've been permitting businesses especially in the hospitality districts so we are responding to that and we understand your concern if it's the will of counseling we will move it can I just make a statement hold on I appreciate everything you're doing let me just be clear we are not upset about your hard work and everything that you brought to us please understand this we love everything you do and we understand you work hard and you try to please everybody but there are some things in here that we as counsel every single one of us has specialty or knowledge or experience beyond a normal person that's what makes a collective counsel but when we make suggestions we're not attacking you guys just be careful so that being said are you changing or doing any modifications on the food trucks because technically they are restaurants even though they're not brick and mortar but are you requiring a business plan staffing schedule hours of operation kitchen equipment this is just something that we want to eliminate as government what you call red tape because you're making the process longer than it needs to be so that's the things we want to improve we want to help you to make your job easy at the same time we want to acknowledge our expertise and our knowledge in that field to make this better and what we're trying to balance is making sure it's easy with the protections we've heard that counsel also wants to have so we will try to walk that line and we need to know from you what's what's essential to protect information or what you would like to remove to make it easier to apply I think we're going to ask for a business plan we ask for everybody I think we have our laws are supposed to be an ordinance it should be that everybody has to comply the same way and this is what causes problems, headaches and this and I understand that they're concerned from some people but they're not the majority of the community we have to quit tailoring things to the minority there is a whole world outside of five points but and it affects every business so if we're going to do it, it has to be across the board it cannot be in one industry that's just not fair and we don't want to discriminate against eating establishments whether type one or type two or type ten I mean you know it's we have to be business friendly as much as we can and I don't think this is not a conclusion Christian you're going to we're not presenting tonight we've got some time to maybe take into account the discussion here if there would be to follow up I'll be glad to sit with you at the end the only thing that stands out to me is grandfathering that that's a horse it's got no feet something good let me just make just because it's grandfathered and I think it's still specifications or adjustments as if you are grandfathered and as Daniel said if you're going to add a rail or add something to improve your patio is that going to go in front of I mean this is something we want to discuss as if you are grandfathered and you decided to put a fan in your patio that goes out to get an exception we need to be clear that's what I'm saying in our audience and we'll point out to you as our non-performing provisions that are very clear that was one of the goals of this code is to make non-performing provisions and I understand a lot of this code a lot of this language belongs to the state we'll point that out thank you guys, I really appreciate it and we do appreciate your hard work on this so you anybody have to do some follow up with their story to do that to be clear so this was an item for tonight though right so we're going to hold it actually we'll just have to take it off because I don't have to go back to the planning commission can we not amend it the amendments we're talking about tonight we'd call into the state statute of requiring a planning commission with you and that's why we're doing it thank you I mean there is no rush for this there's something that we'll just be and proactive about we'll just have to wait for it so it's fine thank you you're all right Christian may you all stay there I'm here all night I'm here all night I'm here all night all right so we have our development ordinance review so when we have a public hearing we we've heard a few comments from that but we'll ask for a work session to come back on the code I know that one issue raised is about flexibility in the landscape ordinance so I went through and looked and ensured that so we've got alternative compliance remains which allows for the standards you know if it's unreasonable and practical due to site conditions and those types of things it's a staff committee that can review an alternative plan according to certain conditions and such as similar quality consistent with the purpose and intent so that's one area of flexibility the other part of flexibility in the ordinance that actually applies code wide which we're really excited about is an administrative adjustment and this can be granted by the zoning administrator for any numeric standard parking up to 10% and then up to 20% of any dimensional standards so if you've got a setback if you've got a other type of dimensional standard the zoning administrator can administratively improve that variance instead of going to Boza again it's according to certain criteria so it just can't be the racial things that's a good idea that day are we making that clear and in black and white so you can understand so we have this discussion of palm trees I've been corrected that they're not palm trees they're grasses yes I was corrected the other day from Sarah that it is a grass not a tree makes a difference and so I said well how does that affect us on the landscape if you're doing a swap does it become the perception that we think it's a tree or is it you're based on the reality that it's a grass you can plant them all day long it's just not going to count as a shade tree you know we have certain standards for what a shade tree is but I get out that's the issue that we found on Rosewood is that we allow the university we allow the fair all of them to plant that and count towards their landscape but yet we wouldn't let the guy across the street match and count that as part of this landscape and so that's do we I didn't feel like when I read I like the fact that we have different levels and that there is alternatives because I think that's one of these complaints we get you know is there flexibility and having it not have to go to a committee and having the administrator make a call I think it's great but this type of instance to me that's where I didn't see the flexibility unless I read it wrong now palm trees they count for one? they count as part of your density for your site but they do not substitute for the shade tree requirement so to use your example about the fairgrounds they did plant palm trees but only after they fulfilled the shade tree requirement so they interplanted but there I would argue the fact is that both of those companies or things did the same thing except they wanted to plant it out front and we were told they cannot plant those they cannot plant them in the right way and then we as the city turned around and planted palm trees right across the street from them and so this is where the problem that I have is that is it doesn't seem that we have the flexibility either flexibility in the code or flexibility in the ruling to help create synergy in those corridors I guess is where I'm really going now I see how it can look up here that way but they can plant palm trees they just have to fulfill the street particular requirement for the shade trees first so that's where I would say I'm a little confused by that because if I go out there right now there are no shade trees in that corridor on the university side or the fairgrounds right there they planted all palms all of their shade trees are within the parking areas and others they don't have them on the premises right and the that's the argument of why would we allow them to do the similar which they had done if there are other business which is down the road was allowed to do that I think the palm trees are referring to the ones on the bluff road side bluff and so those roads made it in the right way that was the O2 decision that wasn't to fulfill our requirement we just couldn't make the decision of what to plant there because it's not a right way so what we're talking about we regulate the parcel what he's talking about is the decision of the city of the O2 is what to do in the right way which is totally outside of what we regulate that we regulate why do we plant the trees the grasses excuse me but that's the point I've got pictures of us planting those things right there and that's why I was like when I talk about the flexibility I want to make sure that we're thinking about this because these are the type of areas where things being consistent bring it looks much better when you're driving in and suddenly you've got this area that doesn't match the rest of the street whole part of the agreement I don't think you disagree I just think how do we fix that part the landscape ordinance doesn't regulate outside of the parcel so anything that was outside of the parcel in the right way I wouldn't have seen that go through the encroachment but here so you really totally understand that if you go out and you look at their plat and out into the road because it's so old with a piece of property the fairgrounds the jakes corner jakes the food is good there too DFT they're not here okay so for you so I guess the question would be in these type of instances do we have the flexibility where Rachel or you or somebody can make a judgment call because I think that's one of the frustrating things for citizens today is if they call for water or whatever is that everything is so black and white and there isn't a black and white issue anymore I mean it is clearly everybody's in the gray area with every type of issue with this does the staff have the ability to dress those with flexibility so that we can move things along that we're not sending things back to somebody or oh you can't do this well let me look at this I've got some flexibility is there enough flexibility in your belief that we can deal with people on a case by case basis I would say yes and we've got a staff who wants to do that well we still make everybody happy no well if you figured that one out then you need to write a book there will still be people who want to go further than we may be able or willing to in the alternative compliance so that is certainly an issue and I've really appreciated these folks for their creative thinking and trying to get the projects done but there are sometimes when we need that shape tree I mean I have painfully and I say that just because it's a lot to read and it took me several months to go through it in the time I did ask some other business folks to look at it they all felt that it was a vast improvement for the city so I congratulate you on that there were just some things of where are those judgment calls and does this allow us to do that because we're going to have things that come off that don't fit even though I think y'all have attempted to try to come up with every scenario that is giving y'all a headache in the past and trying to solve I just want to know that you feel that we have enough flexibility that y'all can make those calls there's a lot more flexibility and also some enhancements that will make some of these relationships among our neighborhoods and our commercial districts easier to do so we hope that that will encourage development and make these neighborhoods and business districts work better let me say that I haven't read every line but I did go up to the public sessions moved around and even the diagrams and so for the whole like that but if we can exercise the flexibility that's intended this time I think it will go a long way especially some of the folks in this community the way we do business I don't fully understand we're headed in that direction but I hear what everybody else is saying just to continue maybe some of the educational sessions might further explain the difference between a palm tree and grass thank you one more the workout place I think that's something we've never addressed in zoning before is that something that you guys have worked on to modify so it won't be in this as I mentioned last meeting we've got a number of revisions that will come through between adoption and the effective date because the effective date will not be upon when we have second reading it will be 6 to 9 months out to allow us to do that mapping process so we have a number of revisions that we will need to make and bring to you one of them and it probably will just be a spacing requirement so be aware that that will be a spacing requirement from residential that we'll be proposing to you I'm going to back the world in front of me we'll make sure we make that clear okay good I haven't read a lot of this stuff but I'll thank you hopefully I think I know we're headed in the right direction compared to what we made I got a thousand sticky meds in a lot of highlights if you want to cheat and grade mine okay so we'll bring it to you for first reading and second reading in August thank you so the drinking is that I mean the food and everything will just be an amendment to that so prior to so this will go in effect on January 1 correct? well because we've been pushing this back we'll probably be pushing that date back a number of months but what we'll do is if you still want us ahead of that this amendment we will bring it back to you and that will be one of the amendments to the new code as well does that make sense? do you think we can get it on the next agenda? I mean there's just a couple items to fix well we need it to go back to the commission it has to go back yeah there's significant enough state statute requires that if and it uses some term that I think it's significant so it's not black or white but I would say what we're talking about is significant enough that the planning commission would need to review it so it's not subject to challenge okay I don't know if I agree with you that it's significant if you if you read that amendment there's a lot more detail we're talking about I would argue that it may not be significant well if you take out the 250 it would be significant no it wouldn't why wouldn't it? that's one of the key things have you read it? yes and how many other items are in there it's this one little yeah but that's the key one if you've got the 250 separation which is what the coalition of neighborhoods is thinking of oh so that's what I'm talking about actually that was just proposed in the ordinance as I don't know if they like it it's all amendment that's been in the code ever since we had that okay what do we do I think a special exception is a better way to do it but that's just me what we're going to do is we'll work on some amendments we'll work with you all you can sit at that also and we'll get started thank you Krista you getting over three now nothing else from that Christmas okay our next item number four alternative payment of funds Ms. L. Matney parking services director this is an idea that Mayor Benjamin proposed to staff so I really felt like we needed to bring it to the work session so we can make sure all the council is understanding what the concept is I haven't even delved into all the ins and outs so Elf you could walk us through it I would suggest that we tighten up the timeframe for the proposed moratorium so anyway take it away Elf thank you city manager city council thank you for allowing us to be here first of all who is excited in the room that parking services is bringing something fun, fast, friendly ready to go on it's a field shop I knew someone was dumb I didn't expect that from you at all I'm capable of that donations for citation while we can't solely own the idea of the concept it did come out of Las Vegas we want to champion right here to Colombia and perhaps thereafter start a phenomenon with other parking services throughout the country today though who's going to do the presentation for us Jessica Argo, she is our new business liaison she's been with us about six weeks and she's going to run through and tell you about the program what we're going to do similar to Las Vegas and some modifications that we are proposing do you see this in operation in Las Vegas? I have spoken to someone in Las Vegas their operation is much much larger we were building up a tractor trailer but it's been very successful go ahead I'll just like to introduce myself my name is Jessica Argo I'm sorry so donations for citation is a back to school supply drive by parking services in the city of Colombia upon city council's approval and resolution on August 6th kick off should start on August 7th anyone receiving a city of Colombia issued parking citation between August 7th through the 21st may satisfy their citation by bringing you unwrapped unused school supplies of equal or greater value to the parking fine amount including the receipt of the citation and the receipt of the school supplies to the party service location on 820 Washington street across from the Colombia police department our office is open Monday through Friday 830 to 530 p.m. final donation date will be September 4th 30 days after close again, financial donation date will be September citations must be received within the period of August 7th through August 31st to be eligible citations received prior to August 7th will not be accepted and they are excluded actual donations do not begin again until August 7th only non-public safety citations will be satisfied by this program citations below will be excluded such as traffic and movement violation issues by CPD for excluded handicap parking violations residential parking permit violations parking improperly parking in no area parking zone, double parking block driveways loading zone violations for their parking quality for those donations such as pencils, pens, erasers we are looking at maybe also publicizing local school districts supply lists donations received will be delivered to why not YouTube which is a local non-profit what's the name of that? I'm sorry the donations received will be delivered to and donated to why not YouTube why not YouTube? isn't that the bottom of her of their hand out there bottom a bit too bright I'll get this one oh he's got it so the so the ticket then you get a parking ticket you go out and buy supplies present your receipt it has to amount to the receipt not towing is not on me right is that on that if there was an individual that had received an amount of citations that would able them to veto you're still subject to veto what we don't want to do is create bad behaviors so I just want to go out and buy school supplies and I want to create unsafe parking situations we don't want to create that even though it's just two weeks in the future it could be a lengthier period of time but you would still be subject to veto if you run down the target and you purchase $215 worth of supplies I'll waive those citations if it's in the time frame associated but you would be responsible for the toilets so it's only the citations that are given between that date of 6 through 21 yes, or 7 through 21 it's a two week period and then you have an official two week period to make the exchange the donation so if you could use this to pay off his pass fines that would be correct so if you have received citations in 2018 and 19 you can't present those for an exchange are you putting values on these items this being our first annual we can't put necessarily a price tag we don't know what to expect if it will be a handful of folks where it will be numerous the most common citation we expect is an expired meter or a timed meter citation and those are $8 so the receipts are the bad ones correct so the receipt would be the minimum so the receipt value would need to be $8 if it was 10 we're only taking off $8 so you have to bring the receipt with your school items let me make one recommendation I think handicap parking violations should be off this list because handicap violations should not be exempt for anything but anybody that parks on a handicap violation should be paying a big fine every single time it is it is the list on it's a total of same we're walking the driveway we don't want to create parking I'm assuming that parking services will do some sort of PR campaign are you all going to put that in with the fine we have a lot the only reason I say that is you always have to have something that you're putting in with that envelope with that ticket because what about all the people who I'm just worried that you're going to get contested if a guy from out of town that's the right checking and he finds out well I could have given I could have gone to Walmart on the penny day and bought you know the question was since you're going to do a PR campaign which I think would be good why don't you include in that while you're at the Washington street office you can get one of these passport things not passport but park cards which is the cheapest way to park in the city you mean the reason why I don't get parking tickets anymore? that is a wonderful invention not enough people take as many of them just been an opportunity to get that before you or you could tell the courts when they come in with the notebook paper say why are you here why don't you where are people to open these things up the parking services office the parking services office more than a house them there so with great success we'll have everything housed in one place and it will have more of a media a wild factor when we've collected all of these things and we'll be tracking financially when we are on the back side we'll know where this will be we'll certainly be good after 21st to give us some idea how that track that's about and how we looked at the very end of the program let me ask you this once all of that is done we're going to deposit those items within that why not you too say local organization nonprofit we've worked with in the past not associated with parking services but with fireflies and with bags I believe the city has worked with them before and then they will distribute throughout midlands schools okay I was going to ask that that was the next question how that how why not you too okay once that's done how do they identify the schools that you're going to be doing that is it in districts or how does that work I couldn't answer that question at this time but we certainly want to be aware where the school supplies are going we'll have that answer by August 6th and know exactly where they're going any photo opportunity any where the school supplies end up and how they're emerging our local schools we won't be sending out a water bill between now and then this is all scattered I guess my question is is there an advantage living next year to consume the notice from the water bill can I get you to a row momentum I think that's a great idea and hopefully there are only other communities even though again we won't own it for a great cause we can encourage other communities with regards to parking because as we know it can have a negative connotation but when you're doing something positive you give it back to your community it warms people up not that they're ever warmed up for citation however do you have a good PR name for this campaign who are you thus far for the donations for citations we're open to ideas either way we could you know folk around the county be paying their taxes and of course vehicle taxes still gotta feed the meter it doesn't matter no exceptions no don't stop is there way as a part of the PR campaign to give the Richland County building some pamphlet over there some handout for persons they're paying I mean if their car is a ticket engine it's almost like an engine they obviously get ticketed then you go in and pay taxes and then you get a ticket how helpful would it be to have some information in the county as a part of the PR campaign when you're asking them to make sure that people know that they can donate that's gonna be a part of it that's gonna be a part of it excuse me that's gonna be a part that's gonna be a part of it and I think in elongating the PR campaign that could very well be very important well is that something that's going to go out during that two week period with the tickets is there something that's already going to be attached to the ticket whether it's the county building or wherever it is if you have something at the time the ticket is issued then people will know automatically I guess to Mr. Rickerman's point too I need to know that there's a cutoff to receive a citation for that in five periods of time when you've incurred late fees very good very creative let's do something for Christmas too oh lord great morning one program at a time thank you L so much for your willingness to the program and nice to meet you thank you alright just alright our next item is the coordination of regional public services and the implement weather service agreement on this little budget program management director will take you through a few of the changes that you recall when we brought the contracts just a discussion of continuing the various contracts with your own council agenda this evening for homeless services there are several suggestions from council regarding particularly with the United Way as our coordinator and service provider just a few tweets as far as the focus that needs to be placed on certain areas and so really thank Jennifer I know she's probably working on this and is here to work with Missy if you have any questions and thank you Sarah for being here also but they've really tried to work with you addressing some of the items that you asked about before I know Mayor Benjamin's not here but he was very interested in this item too and I know Chris is here to take some votes for him so at this point right is all of the United Ways here along Syracuse Jennifer is here to address any questions that maybe you have regarding two contracts there's actually four items on your agenda like the resolution for approval related to the homeless services contracts that the city has as Miss Wilson mentioned we did bring up United Ways regional coordination of homeless services and that's one resolution that our second contract also was with the operation and the weather center then just a few tweets that have been made services provided as Miss Wilson mentioned that have come through various discussions with city council and with the city manager over the past year as well as the United Way adapting as we kind of go along with regards to the services that are providing the different focuses for each year those items were attached to your items on the resolution but Jennifer's here to sort of overview about the many answering questions Good afternoon council see you next time Good just a very quick overview so we have worked with staff over the past year and then also spent some time in the March community development committee talking through this as well and also working with our vendors and partners in the work so just a few updates of the things that we're proposing I'll start first with the United Way as the most modern changes for the IWC of course has the cold water shelters for the adults from November to March the biggest change that we're going to suggest there is changing the vendor for the transportation so we've worked for the first five years of operating the center on behalf of the city with a private company doing the transport they've done a very good job very high quality services this past year we did start talking with the comments so they can deliver equivalent level of quality of services but at a lower cost so we are recommending moving that vendor choice to the comment the other thing, we talked a lot about this in the March community meeting I know we're going down and you were there and Mr. Davis about the the Incubator Center really was always structured to be a very bare-bones facility so shelter and life's resort for people but it doesn't provide any kind of staffing for case management services or triage and that's one thing that we do very specifically in the United Way is our role in the community is to really triage people who are experiencing homelessness and get them to the appropriate housing and care that they need but we just don't have that level of staffing about IWC and that concerned us because the folks coming to IWC many times are people who are living in very challenging situations and they only come in for shelter so we have worked with partners all along we've had very strong partnerships with folks like Mercy, the Nell O'Lanister Recovery Center went 80 plays our public defender's office to have folks there to help us with that triage and screening since then we've also talked with the USC Housing First program which also is one of your vendors in the city work about possibly having some of their folks down there to help us with the triage they're closed Friday afternoons so their staff are there till 7 during the evenings Monday through Thursday so it might give us the opportunity to extend that partnership a little bit more within the city work and offer that triage that we really need there so that's the two major things with the Incluent Weather Center so I guess maybe just pause and see what questions or recommendations you have there Can you expand on the climate transportation services as far as the time if there are any changes of location and or pick where they're picking up from? Yeah so times would not change it's still on demand starting at 5.45 running for an hour until 7 o'clock with the requirement that they do need to come back if there's folks waiting at 7 o'clock to make sure that they pick up so that has not changed what we have talked with the comment and we've talked with city staff and CBD about is actually moving the location from the pick up from the current clean up hard facility of your metro pay quarters here across the street to the comments location at the corner of Moral and Sumter we think that's better in several different reasons because if you've been if you've looked out the window at 6 o'clock you know that there's a lot of overflow in the streets there's just not a lot of room for people to stand especially on nights when it's raining or even other kinds of precipitation we just didn't feel right about that so we think having an opportunity to move to give them something climate controlled a little bit more space so they're not slowing into the street because it's a black place to stand we think that's a better move for us I think my concern back in March was the whole idea of that triage approach and how important that he is it's important period but particularly during the months where we experience real cold with an apparent condition so that triage support and I'm glad he did say that and moving forward with that I think is going to really help us a lot and we totally agree so at United Way separate even from the city work our role as a lead for the local homeless coalition is to do that triage for the community so we have a vulnerability screening instrument that screens for health conditions other kind of factors that would prevent them from accessing and being successful in housing and then we actually run a prioritization list of people so that we can make sure we get the people who are most vulnerable at the top of that list into our very limited housing resources first what we really want to do is again expand that how do you see it is very limited not having case management staff dedicated so just saying that to bring that to your attention that's something we want to do but we're trying to be very creative with partners to make that happen what a homeless court too is played a tremendous I mean they sort of heaven meet the way in terms of that triage approach we've been so proud of homeless court we've worked with them from the very beginning it's all in and out I'll speak up very proud of homeless court I mean now they're spreading to rural beach Florence talking with the county about possibilities standing there so it's really amazing what homeless court has done you mentioned about triage work and case workers and I think in the past at least in the beginning I know that last time I counted I think there's 6 DI groups so some of them are homeless and folks in need so are we able to continue those partnerships and help them in there so is that something that y'all are able to encourage them to come to the shelter be part of or are you looking for another space to get more room for that I think we have space there and I'm going to speak up we have space and we have had strong participation from partners it is after hours so it is partners working with us to make sure that they can accommodate their staff schedules to do that and we had strong participation beyond just the case management we were really happy this past year we had a hepatitis A and flu clinical site from DHEC and we had about a third of the folks who were there that might actually participate in the shots and the way we actually got that success rate because it's a pretty high success rate to DHEC hosting a clinic especially in an open space like that we had our providers down there to really engage people and sell the concept of getting the shots so we've had good success there it's a matter of just working with each individual agency figuring out what funding source they're using to pay for their staff if that's an eligible activity that they can do and making sure that they can accommodate it for us Jennifer y'all do a terrific job and I appreciate the briefings several of y'all give for the coalition of downtown neighborhoods on the Fridays with Daly and Coopers all year long doing this work I've read an article on the McKinsey and County over the weekend on San Francisco and the problems they're facing with homelessness and how it takes multiple groups working together and doing it from different ways just like you have described to get control of this situation I sent it to Missy and to Risa maybe they can forward it on to y'all but it's a larger problem than we've got but it's the same type of solutions people working together multiple groups working together we totally agree in any way we see ourselves as a convener of the strong partners because that's what we do a lot of discussion we had during the course of the contract about some of our more challenged individuals that are kind of frequent fliers for lack of a better word as far as whether CPD have to engage whether their mental health challenge is going on talk a little bit about the emphasis on that and if there are any changes that will directly impact that so moving on to the regional contract so the second contract is the regional coordination contract so just a couple very quick changes there and I'll get to exactly to the city manager's question this past year we instituted a travel voucher program so folks who had an opportunity to return to their home community that we could verify that they had family or friends that would be able to accept them there we did partner transitions to have that to your home community we had 67 individuals take advantage of that amazing program we've had only three that have returned that had issues that made them return back so we were very pleased with that in the new contract that you'll look at this evening we actually proposed increasing those resources slightly because we ran out of money about nine months into the contract so unfortunately Saplos moved some money around so we could continue that on but that is one thing as the travel vouchers we felt very strongly about one thing in the contract we want to decrease emphasis on is whether our housing coordination so we had established landlord networks kind of working very one on one working with landlords to get them to you know overlook kind of blemishes in the past whether it be credit or background issues when they're looking to take on renters we found that to be very good work but it was it didn't have the opportunities to bring to a systems level it was just very one landlord at a time matching with one provider at a time when we really felt that we could reposition our staff to be more effective with the city resources so what we would like to reposition to is our frequent offenders work so in November of 2017 we started working with city center partnership with CDB with the solicitors office the public defenders office to look at those individuals on the streets that we believe were homeless and had high interactions with law enforcement and we started with the list of 74 individuals we then prioritized folks based on individuals that were having high re-arrests or high complaints especially in the main street area and then what we did is we worked very diligently with our outreach staff and our street outreach workers to really review that list to make sure everybody was connected with the service provider and we were doing that housing triage so we were screening everyone for housing what we found with this group of individuals is this was a very challenging very isolated population these were people who on average had been homeless for a long time had been through a lot of different services and getting them to interact with another service provider again was challenging so breaking down that barrier with them really was very important so we have a weekly team meeting where we get through the list and then we follow the providers we have a formal outreach meeting monthly where we get through the list and then we meet every other month with our core team which includes the solicitor's office and north and metro region of CBD to go through the individual listing of individuals so what we've been able to do with our original list of 74 is we have 16 folks in housing in sustainable housing we have three who have been able to return successfully to their home community that had just very compromised medical conditions and so now they're in an appropriate long term care facility and unfortunately one individual has passed away from this time on the streets so it's very challenging work I know we handed we had a handout that we did at the March meeting I brought another kind of updated copy today if you'd like me to share that we did present a couple of the case studies that we work with each situation is just very very challenging of folks and working just very carefully and have piecing those puzzle pieces together to really figure out what the solution is for that individual so what we're proposing with the regional contract against to diminish that housing work a little bit and really focus on the frequent vendors list to make sure that we're screening we're triaging our most challenging folks you're giving me statistics on how much that you say 71 it started with 74 did you get any statistics on how much public money that 74 incurred while they were being bad on the street and going to the emergency room not the 74 now we've done so at United Way we managed the homeless management information system so that's the database where if you stay at transitions or if you're working with an outreach worker or a social worker re-record your case management notes so we have a very rich database of history on clients that goes back roughly until 2007-2006 of information and we have done a couple different reports we're happy to share that we've looked at health care utilization of people who were experiencing homelessness and found tremendous use of public services and private services and then we've also done a report on youth homelessness looking at trying to map the pathway that young people experience early in life that leads them to homelessness later on we'd be happy to share that we haven't looked at the 74 in the public usage it would be certainly interesting research for us one comment that I've got an email about I'm not sure if anybody else did do we have a food committee that we do? yeah we sure do so Kathy is our homeless services coordinator and Jeff Armstrong is our U coordinator I do the city grant but Kathy coordinates the meal share committee that we've had since the very start of the city so they have a steering committee a leadership committee that meets monthly and then on the quarterly months we have the larger group so we invite participation we had a great meeting this last month with the supervisor of your park rangers from Vinley to really get on the same page about how they issue temporary permits as someone is doing a needle without a permit we shall do a generous policy of issuing a free permit so you just need to take them up on that so we do need there and so I have updated meal share calendars for you I'm happy to share what we have done is since we started this work is we've been able to combine 11 of the meals and we've had 3 and backs so really a net decrease of 8 meals and that's really just through helping people understand who's doing what to prevent duplication of services I just got an email about it not too long ago I wanted to make sure to answer it if anyone's interested just connect with us and we'll get them I'm just glad that we are collaborating with each other and that lives are being changed because of that again it was good for me to be out that whole piece on three of you and transitions and the homeless court persons have played an interesting part in making sure that those brothers and sisters out there are dealt with and assist in a real creative and positive way so we're moving step by step and I appreciate that and be remiss if we didn't do a special thank you to the Coney police department we get tremendous support from CBA we really do to the point where we're looking for someone who we've triaged and prioritized for housing and we can't find them we will send a text out to one of our captains and they will respond to us and I'll have three officers call me within 30 minutes so it's wonderful we really appreciate just the very compassionate approach that they play with us I was on that note I was Chief of the building I want to make sure particularly before tonight I mean it won't be any issue with the way the contracts fit together Jennifer but I do want to make sure I'm really clear about this drop off pickup and then the pickup site moving across to the transportation I mean just because that creates a lot of resources all the time I think that's probably fine the other issue that I want to make sure they're clear about is that through the evening continue pickup and taking to the IWC that the police department has to do because that creates a lot of burden on their resources so we just I want to make sure we're really tighten that up and make sure that they are comfortable with the setup with the comment I don't know if the comment has any ability to I know that specified time frame that we tend to continue to pick up after seven o'clock we had several conversations about that with our vendors, with transitions and also with CBD to kind of understand what would work so pickup ends at seven if those are waiting we require that the transportation vendor go back and pick them up we can't just say well you're going to have seven o'clock we're done so they are required to go back but what we found is that some folks a little bit later we talked with our vendors about moving that to maybe eight o'clock or so but it really kind of created disruptions with meals and then the stacking patterns and then we felt well if you move it to eight then you have to move it to nine and then maybe it's ten so I think what CBD has done is very smart so what they do do is they implemented this next year can you get the chief to get it listen to this I like speaking for everybody today so chief we're talking about the pickups that your officers do after the buses run for the IDC we don't like to do I've been here trying to speak for you all we don't like to do things with a very expensive taxi and your services are better to do somewhere else so the we believe that so seven o'clock is the pickup again the van has to go back we think what Captain Roberts especially had done was very smart this past year is that 11 and then went 130 and he'll have people just basically wait so that one van can take versus taking multiple officers off their duty to do that so we thought that was a very good adjustment we are open to any suggestions you know I've talked with Craig he transitions many times about this you know we will accept drop offs 24 hours a day it is disruptive because you're opening the roll gate at that point people are sleeping so for the for the safety and sleep patterns of everyone we really prefer not to have drop off after 11 but if it's an issue of people on Main Street we have colder weather conditions if that's the choice I mean that y'all are willing to transport we are willing to accept them so we're willing to do really whatever the city would wish us to do well I mean I just I know we're pretty much a contract so I want to be clear right to the council's purposes on what is going to work before if the language is very specific then that's what we're going to be held to there needs to be some kind of tweet and adjust for how y'all think it's best to do it then we need to talk about that before I mean is there a suggestion or a recommendation for us because we're very open with the resources that we have does it need to be sweet after hours what your routine does you seem to have some reservations well the issue is the strength is on our capacity to provide service to everyone else when we're tied up on this and you know what Captain Roberts has been able to do some work around doing the band tying up the individual officers and it's humanitarian really and safety issues at that point and it's usually on extreme weather that's a band it's one of the CPE bands and 11 o'clock at 1.30 is my understanding Captain Roberts does that so again you're taking one vehicle and one officer versus multiple troops so the officers do is they'll basically tell troops to wait at the draw off point until the designated time and so the comic couldn't do that I can certainly talk with Mr. Andom find out what their ability is to do that that wasn't the original conversation but I'm happy to do that the other thing we do is we work with transitions and periodically about every six weeks we would look at the list of people who were frequently and they would have one-on-one conversations with them to talk about the YZ's of resources so we could have a few behavioral modifications there but it tended to be a smaller group of people within the larger context and y'all are good across the street I'll let Captain Roberts make that call he was not opposed to that and really it's to me it's negligible because you're literally talking 50 steps across the street I guess the one thing and I'm assuming the thought behind it is we do have additional security at Central Street now but it's going to be different a different buzz than people who were in their normal course of their day trying to and they'll have a special sign to rank on the weather center but it will look like it were new buses but I'm saying it's not it's going to be y'all have worked through how that will be integrated with their normal operations for instance they would integrate it again moving the location we're finding where it is it's up to the city's wishes for us you just have more landscape for people to stand on so hopefully we won't be spilling over into the road because you will have people with their belongings and also physically into the roadway on a moral street and it could be a safety hazard for all the drivers at this point and you'll have that on the other side of the street to immerse what the people are trying to take but I'm just trying to I end up hearing about everything later so I have to ask the question to make sure that the citizens who are trying to at 6 o'clock or between 5.45 and 7 o'clock get home from work or get where they have to go that it is not an inconvenience for them we've talked through with the comment again we're happy to do it even as a trial basis and then if it's not working we move it back over during the year we talked about even maybe trying to move the access of the natural police officers being able to leave and get their cars and things like that so we have looked at some different possible solutions I think what the city is sending the bushes and the brush that's behind the clean parts building I think that's been a very positive change so you have more sight visibility there so I think that's been a positive change I won't elaborate anymore for now if council approves the contract as it is written I just wanted to have questions about the pickup and drop off to like have a judge who wants to do one quick question okay how much resources are you using to do that to transport transport homeless a lot well it was 900 pickups last year it was extremely disruptive we shifted to using our transport families it was just constant very service 900 pickups I think we've got as long as there's flexibility to address it in the best way I mean I I'll tell you ownership that I didn't ask these questions of the staff I thought maybe y'all had enough through this before I also talked to transitions to see if possibly they could use their van after hours to make money and that was not a possibility they felt like they could do so we've had different conversations to try to be creative and still have other solutions to transitions has not been they may not want them doing additional transports they don't have staff person that works that can drive the van I know but that's the we can say that too well I mean they just conveniently that I'm just saying it's so we don't the 900 transports is not something we would prefer to do but it's something we have to if we don't transport transport somebody we're going to deal with that problem throughout the night even at night I'm just sensitive to city managers concerning that I'm hearing whether it's negative negative or not there's an impact as far as cpd what I'm saying is negligible the difference will be whether they're standing in front of clean hearts or across the street in front of the transit there's been great effort with pretty decent success in the last year or so to police the transit area and distinguish when somebody has legitimate purpose to be waiting for public transportation versus somebody that's milling around you know up in the various activities and that's been successful it always complicates things when we do the informal weather pickup because it puts a heavy concentration of folks in the vicinity but whether they're across the street or on the transit side it's still the main judge people I've been in the mix of cats and buses uptown I kind of know how that works based on this conversation that we comfortable with contract as is for tonight I just got the flexibility to work with okay alright thank you appreciate it thank you okay thank you all that completes our items for the work session discussion second session motion is going to the executive session for receipt of legal advice related to pending threatened or potential claim 30-4A 78-2 and the gov. Brown resident C.L.C. receipt of legal advice to where we come at it's covered by two clients 30-4A 78-2 besides callers thank you thank you I need upstairs yes upstairs go to the table yeah we're working whatever I can say hi give her a nice thank you