 Oh, to my viewers out there, welcome to On the Waterfront with Melinda. And today my guest is Tabitha Paul Moore. And Tabitha is the president of the Rutland Area Branch of the NWACP. She and I also have served on the Planned Parenthood Board together. I have known Tabitha for several years. And Tabitha, I want to thank you for being on my show today. I want to talk with you about the work that you're doing and about the racial justice movement in Vermont. And so thank you. Thank you for being here, being my guest. Well, thank you for having me. It's great to be with you again today. It's good to see you. Unfortunately, we can't be in person, but thank you for being with us. Right. So first off, I understand that you are a sixth generation Vermonter, which I believe makes you a true Vermonter. And I'd like to talk a little bit about your family and how did your family arrive in Vermont? And tell me a little bit about your family. Right. So I am a sixth generation Vermonter. Very proud of that. My grandfather actually died in 2012 in the house in which he had been born in 1914. So lots of history in that house. My family came to Vermont through Canada over from Europe. That's my mom's side came over that way and settled in Rochester in the hills of Rochester, Vermont. And that is where I spent the majority of my childhood playing log tag and fishing in the Brooks and just a deep sense of pride on the McIntyre side to be part of Vermont's history. Well, sixth generation Vermonter. I mean, that goes back to what? The early 1800. I mean, it goes back. So how, which relatives were the first that arrived here? Where did they arrive in Vermont? Because right now, and I think that for a long time, certainly in the town that I'm from in Huntington, we have really studied and written books and articles about the Black settlers in our town and how instrumental they were. So can you tell us a little bit about that history? Right, so the first thing you should know that it's my mom's side and my mom, I'm mixed race. So it's my mom's side is white. So it's my white family that came here. They, so it's the McIntyres and the Simpsons that came down through Canada. Some of us are in Wilder, some settled in Wilder, Vermont, and then others continued to Rochester where they are farmers, like many people were back in the day. My grandfather was a logger, had over 100 acres that he lived off the land. And those are the values that were instilled in me as a child is that you live with the land and you live off the land and you have some cows. He had beef cattle was the other way that my family traditionally made money. My grandmother also taught piano lessons. She was a big pianist and my grandfather was a fiddler. And so they spent a lot of their time when they weren't out tending to the cows or hauling logs out. Do you remember the beach nut factory over there? Yeah. My grandfather, it was my grandfather's logs that laid the floors in the beach nut factory when it first started way, way back when and it was before all those big roads existed. And they would tell us stories about hauling logs for weeks out there. But that was definitely people of the land. And my grandmother, it was a baker too. So she baked donuts for the local shops and the brush that would come from the logs, she would use that to make reeds. And that's how my family... What a great story. Are your parents still here? They must be still alive. Well, my grandfather passed in 2012 and my mom inherited the house. She had five siblings and each of the siblings was gifted five acres of land right around the family homestead. So when I was growing up, I had a lot of my cousins around up through sixth grade when we left. And so my mom inherited the farmhouse which she'd opened up to all of us in my generation for all of us to be able to go there and walk through. And my grandfather's fiddle cannot leave the house or the property. I mean, it's just one of those things that became very important to us as a legacy, that legacy of music and in the land we're just critical. So in the work that you do, Tabitha, you serve and you're an activist. And a lot of the work that you do is a thankless job standing up for the rights of others. Who in your life do you believe inspired you to take this road in life? Well, I think it comes from a few different places. What I learned from growing up, the core on this farm and living off the land was that you need to value the earth. So that's where my activist spirit around environmental justice kind of came, was that we need to protect the earth and we need to work with it. My family has an incredible work ethic which has always been something for me that's important that you just keep working. It doesn't matter if the world is falling down around you, your job is to make sure that you can not just provide for your family but provide for your community. Community was really important. And I think a lot of it also came from what happened between my parents. My mom and dad met in the military in the mid-70s which was only a decade after loving versus Virginia pass which was the law allowing people to marry interracially. And what happened was that they had to pay extra for their marriage license because it was still, I mean, even just because it was illegal didn't mean that they were gonna make it easy. So they had to pay extra to get married and I tell people sometimes, my birth certificate is wrong and it's gonna be wrong the rest of my life because it has both of my parents back when they listed your parents race as white and that was just an automatic assumption. They saw my mother's white so they assumed that my father was white even though if you look at me, it's very clear that both my parents are not white. And I remember in the late 90s I was gonna be studying abroad and I wanted to make sure I would be able to get my documents and I called up the state of California and I said, you know, my birth certificate is wrong or I called up the visa office at the consulate and I said, you know, just get it fixed if you can call up the state of California which is where my parents were stationed and see if they can fix that for you. And I called them and they said, oh yeah, we can absolutely fix that but you need to come here with both of your parents and this is in the late 90s then in order to fix a flaw that said that my father was white when he was black but they wanted me to present him to the court and I'm like, no, and now my father's dead. So my birth certificate is just gonna be wrong because of the ways that racism impacts our society and I never got to meet my grandparents because my grandmother passed away, she was apparently very ill and ambulances would not come into the side of town where she lived in Ohio at the time. So she passed away in her house because of racial segregation in the 50s and 60s. So knowing all of this and knowing what that would mean for me, I really kind of set out on a course to do something different, to try to get to know my roots in a different way. I could go back generations on my mom's side but on my dad's side, that ability and growing up in Vermont as a brown person, you just feel so invisible. You're hyper-visible and invisible at the same time and so that really just created a fire within me and so I sought out to make this place better and different for people who don't fit into the mainstream. And you're doing that? Yeah, I had to leave. I'll tell you, I had to leave Vermont. I left in 1996, I was leaving Vermont, I was never coming back, I was never getting married and I was never having kids. So in 2009, I moved back with my now ex-husband and again, two children, we have three. And I'm like, no, Vermonters deserve something better. Whether that's sixth generation Vermonters or new Americans or people that are just moving here today, everybody deserves to be seen and valued and celebrated for what they bring to the table. So you touched a little bit on life growing up in Vermont. You went to school here and you were raised here. What was that like? And I know you say that you felt invisible and can you sort of segue into where you are today? Sure. The movement that you're seeing today in the state because everybody thinks people think Vermont's so progressive and it's so liberal and they're just, and I'm kind of like shaking my head and saying, you know what, I like to think that. I mean, we all love Bernie Sanders and the progressive movement, but at the end of the day, we have a dark side in this state that still is alive and well and I wanted you to share a little bit with me about that experience. Yeah, Vermont definitely has that mentality or people have that image of Vermont as this bucolic, like very liberal place, but there's a difference between being liberal and being individualistic. And I believe that Vermont is much more on the individualistic side, which believes that everybody has a right to be themselves and to do what they wanna do. As long as you're not messing with me, it doesn't matter. And Vermont falls much more into that category of great fences make great neighbors. And, you know, there's a difference between that and believing that our greatest strength is our diversity and our community and our ability to come together and see each other. And I believe what we're seeing right now is kind of the clashing or not clashing, but the rubbing together of those two ideas. So growing up here, I loved my little farm. I, you know, I am so grateful for the education and the ways that I came to know and love the earth because of that. Like I said, it really gives me a deep sense of environmental connection and justice. At the same time, what was missing was anything that felt remotely validating of my blackness. And so what happened was like things in church, they would pass around, they passed around these little railroad hats for everybody to try on. And I had this, you know, I mean, back then I would have said unruly, but I just didn't know what to do with it. But I had this beautiful curls, it's a giant fro and my mom didn't know what to do with it. And I put the hat on and it pops right off, of course. And everybody's laughing because they think it's this cute, funny moment. But for me as a young black girl developing my identity, it was just this moment where I realized I didn't, like I don't fit in, I'm not like everyone else. And so there were all these reminders growing up that I'm not like everyone else, whether that was walking through the mall with friends and having security officers stop me for no reason, asking me to empty my pockets or trying to date and just realizing that, you know, when you're in high school and everybody's like, you know, who do you picture yourself with? And the other person describes your ideal person or their children and none of them look like you. There's all of these ways that you get this message that you just don't fit in or when Black History Month comes around and they start talking about, you know, slavery and everybody turns and looks at you. I remember in the 80s, that was the age of, tell us what the black people think. And here I am, 11 years old. I don't even know what I think, let alone a whole race of people who are my people that I'm so disconnected from would potentially think. So there's a lot of pressure to perform, a lot of pressure to know more than I ever possibly could. People would try to be helpful and loving, but often only perpetuated stereotypes. Like I have really long fingers, but I'm five foot three, five foot four. They'd be like, you know, they would see my long fingers like, oh, you're gonna play basketball. And I'm like, I'm a cheerleader. What am I gonna do with a basketball? Or, you know, in PE class, I happened to be able to do the standing long jump once. And my PE teacher was so proud of me. He's like, you know, you people have always been better at sports. And I was just like, I have no idea what you're talking about. And I'm like, how do you deal with that as a child? And so many Vermont children kind of face that. And so, you know, I laughed after some particularly difficult experiences. Did you feel special or did you feel discriminated against? How did that make you feel, but... Right, the way I describe it here in Vermont, and it really depends on the adults around you and the messages that they give you. I was naive enough when people would be like, you can be anything. You can do whatever you want. I'd be like, yeah, I can. So I had that plus this hypervisibility and this invisibility thing going on at the same time. And there's a crossroads that you come to kind of in high school and early in your middle school, high school years, where it's like, what am I gonna do with this? What am I gonna do with this hypervisibility? Am I going to shrink into the background and just try to get along and just try to be? Or am I gonna use it as a platform? Am I gonna use it as a stage? And I was in acting. I loved acting. I was cheerleader, I played soccer, I played softball, field hockey. I tried everything. I just had this desire to see the world. And so I decided I was gonna use it as a stage. I decided that I was gonna use my voice to do something with what I had. And I credit my acting teacher, Peter Marsh, to this day, I was actually talking to somebody and I'm like, I don't think he understands how when we're standing on that stage, we're firmly rooted in our place and we are learning to project into the back of the theater how much that grounded me in my identity. And I don't think my cheerleading coach knows how much her value of my strength and my voice played a role in me just surviving that system and being able to love myself in ways that many black and brown kids don't get, especially here in Vermont. And so I carried that with me and I turned that megaphone into a microphone and here I am. Into a voice for change. Yeah, I mean, and a voice for illuminating a mindset and a reality that I think a lot of her monitors just don't think about in our... Right, and the white monitors don't think about these things. They don't typically have to. I was in a session recently with somebody and I was talking about seahorses and the fact that seahorses can either reproduce asexually or they can change sexes depending on what is needed in their community and how we don't learn about that in high school and that there's a very real reason we don't learn that gender is not as dichotomous as we like it to be. And my life is dedicated to illuminating those realities because those people exist. It's not just the seahorses, there's humans. There are people like me who have contributed, this country was built on our backs and all we ever learned about is how slavery was really bad and Martin Luther King did good things. And so to create dimension is really important to me and to make it clear to Vermonters that we miss so much. So tell me in the, what do we have? In the 12 minutes that we have left, how have you done that? How have you taken all of this that makes you who you are? There's 27 different languages spoken at Burlington High School. We are an incredibly diverse city in Burlington and you're down in Rutland and I don't know how that bears to Burlington but I'd love you to share with our viewers. And I'm talking to Tabitha Bulmore who is the president of the branch, the Rutland branch of the NAACP. And you have a long resume of all the extraordinary things that you've done. And so I encourage everyone to Google you and read about your accomplishments. But how have you taken all of this? And in this, not just this defining moment but really I wanna focus about this defining moment right now in the history of our country that we're going through which was such a wake up call. I mean, we all say, oh yeah, well I marched for civil rights back and I say, you know, with Lyndon Johnson, blah, blah, blah, you know, we're like, and it's like, aren't we just the best ever? But at the end of the day, you know, we fell short in a big way. And that's the lesson that I think so many of us are learning as we're reading and trying to study and actually get called out from time to time which is totally reasonable. So you are that voice right now and you are being, people are turning to you as a woman of color to say, hey, and so here you are again, you're in that place but I think now you're an activist you're an activist and you're changing minds and you're changing the way that Vermont looks at itself. And so tell us a little bit about that work and how you're feeling doing this work. Right, so I started the branch in, well I started doing the work of the branch in 2016 because I knew that the Rutland area is not like Burlington. We don't have the same level of just diversity that's occurring that automatically, even visually, pushes people's boundaries, pushes white people's boundaries around thinking about and recognizing and making room for diversity, racial diversity. So I knew that we had to create an organization in our area that could be a beacon and also be a mouthpiece for racial justice initiative. So starting the branch was just the first step and a lot of what we've been doing over the last few years this first phase has just been kind of waking people up which has coincidentally or not coincidentally been at the same time that all of this national discourse and discord is being televised. It's always existed. And something I always tell people is that the NAACP is the nation's oldest civil rights organization. We've been around for 111, 112 years now. And we're still saying the same thing that they were when they started this back then because white folks still aren't getting it. So I feel compelled to have an education component where we are educating the community about what are the realities of what's happening right now developing lenses so that people can get out there and start to call out and name and see what's going on. And then bringing people together as a community to say, how are we going to deal with this together? This isn't just on law enforcement to deal with. This is not the legislatures. This is our community and that we need to be the ones leading the conversation. So that's been a lot of the work I've been doing. I also believe, like I said, in calling people in and working together as much as I call people out, I'm also gonna call them in. So I work very closely with Vermont State Police and the Criminal Justice Training Council, other racial justice groups. For me, one of the most important things that we can do, growing up here, there were no racial justice organizations. And when I came back and started the branch and then all of a sudden all of these other entities are exploding, it made my heart so worn. And so I feel because we are the NAACP, we have a duty to uplift and protect and walk alongside with, and they might feel the same about us too. Other racial justice organizations and individuals doing this work to make sure that we all survive and that we all do this together. So a lot of my time is spent connecting with other organizations up here. You have the Racial Justice Alliance that is doing the second commemoration of, so it's the 401st anniversary of the first African landing in Vermont. And like we help sponsor events that are- Can you say that again, Tab? I'm gonna interrupt you, but say that again. It is the 401st anniversary of the first African landing in Vermont. And this is their second year doing this installment. So wherever we see people who are doing this great kind of work, we wanna lift them up, we wanna be under them, we wanna support them, we wanna have their back. If they wanna side, if they need the NAACP to lead, we'll do that. So for me, that is really important that we're working together. Other racial justice organizations and people who are interested in doing this work, that we're doing that together. We support a lot of legislative initiatives. And like I said, we will work with the government, the Racial Equity Task Force that the governor just announced earlier was because myself and Stefan Gillam, who was president of the Wyndham area branch, Wyndham County branch, people don't realize that there's two branches right now, got together with the governor and were like, look, we need to address the fact that our definitions of bias and harassment still protect white supremacy and still protect white supremacist systems and other identity areas. We need to change that. The governor listened. So we're advocating on a lot of systemic levels because we know that as much as the individual interactions help build the movement, what makes the changes is what we do with systems. So talk to me a little bit, the legislature is taking up police reform and taking testimony. Talk to me a little bit about what the NAACP of Rutland is providing to support this movement in the legislature to make some systemic changes in our policing. Right, so we, you know, the Act 54, the racial disparities in the criminal and juvenile justice system, we were right there with the Racial Justice Alliance supporting that. We've supported a number of acts along the way and right now we met with Commissioner Sherling right as everything was happening in early June and he said, you know, what do we need to focus on? And a few of us, you know, gave him some ideas and said, now you need to go to, you can't go to the picnic empty-handed. At least come and say, this is what we're thinking, what do you think? And how are we gonna build this together? So trying to help the commissioner do better is one thing that we've been doing. Stefan, I believe, did just testify on the sixth about our position, the ACLU justice for all and the NAACP jointly developed a counter 10 point plan, not a counter 10 point plan, but because the commissioner still hasn't done the work with the community that needed to be done, which is often what happens is that law enforcement will silo themselves intentionally or unintentionally. I believe it was unintentional in this case, but I'm like, I don't care. You know, if you want us to come together to help you create a 10 point plan then you better go to the community immediately with that and find out what the community wants. And unfortunately, I haven't done that yet. So the legislature took it up. So ACLU justice for all NAACP, and I think we have like 11 other partners, organizations signed on and say, these are the 10 points that we want you to focus on. Let's figure that out. And I stand behind that and decide that. So you'll be here. Actually, it's actually already come out in the news. Well, I'm testifying on Sunday and those are the 10 points that I've been focusing on. Now the ACLU Vermont just filed a lawsuit against Homeland Security for stopping people at the borders. Yep. You've been involved in that. I mean, I mean. Right. We have not been involved directly in the lawsuit, but we support what they are doing in Vermont. And whenever, like I said, whenever there's an action needed, whenever they want us to step up and testify, we certainly do. And I will call on them to do the same with like, hey, this is what, you know, we're focused on with the NAACP. Can you help us with that? So yeah, those are some of the more systemic things. And then we're dealing with a lot of issues in Rutland, Bennington region with individual acts of discrimination and harassment of people. And so really trying to get local police departments to understand their role in upholding white supremacy has been really difficult with Bennington, little less difficult with Rutland, but not a whole lot more movement. So we're continuing to push that on the local levels as well and trying to get people to engage politically. If we don't come out, if it's just me and Stefan or me and the ACLU or, you know, just Black Lives Matter saying it, it gives those in power reason to be like, well, there's not that many of you saying it. So part of what I'm trying to do now is encourage more of us to step up. We have to speak. We can't just suffer in silence. Well, are you reaching out to white folks to step up and speak out as well? I mean, it goes- Oh, absolutely. Those are the first people we step up to. So yeah, so what I want to share with my viewers is look, we need to get on board here. We need to lean in. We need to step up. We need to scream out. So I need some information from you. One of the things that people can do is they can donate to your organization. Yes, nwacp.rutland.org. Go to our website, nwacp.rutland. So that's n-a-a-c-p-rutland.org. And right on the page, it says donate and become a member. And I encourage people to do both of those things. So if you're testifying or you need letters written or you need people to speak up in the legislature, if any of my viewers are interested in supporting this work, I suggest that you go to the website. Is there a phone number that people can call? Would you prefer people access you through the website? It's better to go through the website than it is to call because sometimes it takes us a little bit to get back to phone calls unless there are emergencies where people are asked for immediate access. nwacp.rutland.org. And just I want to take a quick minute. I just wanted to really quickly to say we are the second largest branch in New England. So we have a lot of power. So we want more people to join us or join our sister branch in Wyndham County and help us keep growing so that when we put out those requests, say, hey, we need you to write letters. We need you to show up at this select board meeting. We need you to show up the state house that people can spread that word really quickly. Because people are always asking, what can I do? Join us, donate, and then wait for the calls to action. So I am a member and I need to get those emails because I want to do that. So for my viewers, make sure I'm on the mailing list to get your emails because I want to speak up. And my viewers, you can become a member of the NAACP Rutland and donate because you need money to support yourselves and your organization. And stand up and step out, write letters, talk to the legislature, be active. We all need to come into this together. And so Tabatha, we have about 45 seconds here. What is the most important thing that we all can do to support the work that you're doing? Join the membership. Join the men. Read the minutes, show up at the meetings, and then take the actions that we encourage you to do. Support Black and Brown people. Make sure it's not the Black and Brown people that have to keep having these conversations with white people because it's incredibly taxing. Send your Black and Brown people, friends our way. We're trying to have a number of initiatives that we're doing just for Black and Brown folks. So send them our way so we can take care of our people. And share your information on people's social media. Absolutely. If you get something, share it. Let's get the power of the people behind this movement. Let's make the systemic and important changes that need to happen that should have happened many, many, many years ago. 400 years ago. 100 years ago, that's right. And so now is the time, and it's way too late. So for all of my viewers out there, I encourage you and ask you to join Tabitha in her work and to join this movement and change Vermont for the better. So, Tabitha. I do have just one more thing because COVID-19 disproportionately is affecting Black and Brown people here in Vermont as well. I encourage you, and I know Melinda does too, put on your mask. Wear your mask. Thank you. Thank you for reminding me. Wear your mask. It's really critical. And Tabitha, I honor you. I love you. I am amazed by you. Thank you so much for your time. And to my viewers, thank you for joining us today. And be safe, and we will see you soon. Thank you, Tabitha. Thank you, Melinda. Yep.