 from the Sands Convention Center, Las Vegas, Nevada. Extracting the signal from the noise. It's theCUBE, covering AWS re-invent 2015. Now your host, John Furrier. Okay, welcome back everyone. We are live in Las Vegas for AWS Amazon web services re-invent 2015. This is SiliconANGLE Media's theCUBE, our flagship program. We go out to the events, extract the signal from the noise. We collect the dots, we connect the dots, share that data with you, interview the thought leaders, executives from the companies, making the changes in startups, and we do all that here. I'm John Furrier, the founder of SiliconANGLE, our next guest is Alan Cohen, who is the COO of Alumeo, CUBE alum. Well, welcome back. You guys launched on theCUBE last year. Not launched, but you kind of launched. We were like three weeks out of stealth, but you're not really launched until you've been on theCUBE, right? That's right. Totally, right? Yeah. And so you guys had good success. Obviously, great investors. This perimeter-less security model really was pioneered by you guys. You guys were the first ones out there talking about, I'm certainly not pioneered. If the security model is what it is, it's a market, but it's a sea change from perimeter. So that's kind of genies out of the bottle. So what's next? Well, I mean, I think some of the news, John, that we want to talk to you, the folks about, is that last week we made a bunch of announcements with both Docker and Mesosphere. So if you think about it, you're seeing this fundamental change in the compute layer, right? I mean, we went from bare metal and client server, 10, 12 years ago, my investor, Steve Herrod, those guys, VMware came in and they started to create much more distributed computing. We're seeing one more bigger wave now with this container movement. And the thing that's very exciting about it is it's very easy to spin up, it's very dynamic. It's also very different, right? Because you could run a Docker container for six minutes, lock it down. A lot of this stuff is now starting to run in environments like Amazon, right? And we always think Amazon is the company that broke the perimeter for the enterprise. And now the compute layer is a lot more active. So you're seeing all of that evolution going on. And for you to know, the thing for Lumio is that security had enough trouble in the data center and you see the two years of breaches we've had. Now you come into this environment with much more dynamic computing. And so for us, being able to move in with these emerging leaders in this space, pretty exciting. A lot of our customers are very excited about this. So one of the themes here at Amazon Reinvent this year is the data layer, the fabric. Or data is now the most important commodity or resource, not the compute. So the data is traveling to applications, you got internet of things. So it doesn't really change the security model, but it will have to be, not tweaked, but thought differently. Well, let me give you something to think about. In the old days, you would write your application to the infrastructure. And if this show and what's going on teaches you anything, infrastructure has to compete, I'm sorry, infrastructure has to compete for applications, not the other way around. Applications are just how you use your data. So we are effectively a data and application out security company, not an infrastructure in. So what you just said, we completely believe on it. Every day twice on Sunday. That's exactly how we think things are going on. It reinforces the infrastructure mindset of the perimeter that's going on. So people are coming to get to that, but the reality is is that the tsunami of app development workload focus really is a data conversation. Well, it's a data conversation. And if you think about who's the fast crowd in the infrastructure world, it's the DevOps guys. It's the people who think about continuous delivery, right, in this new model. So they're in charge. Like they may not be in charge everywhere, but they are increasingly in charge. Budgets are going there, decision-making's going there because they actually face the business and they're all about fast. You know me, go slow and know, right? It's like the fast crowd or the winning crowd in applications. So this is the sticker. This is the T-shirt that you're wearing. Absolutely. Better, stronger, faster. That's some clouds in there. I get the cloud, okay, cloud. I mean, obviously bumper sticker, literally. What does it mean? Well, I think you could actually reverse it. So faster is the key motion, right? The reason why there's now, I don't know, 19,000 people here in Amazon and an $8 billion run rate as a business is because I could take a credit card and I can actually start to build an application in minutes. So that's the faster. The better part is about how does something become much more resilient, reliable, and secure? And the stronger part is I'm putting really significant data into the cloud. If I build a Duke cluster, if I put something up on Cassandra, a set of databases in Amazon and if that's not protected and that security is not stronger, I've got a big problem because I have just put my IP and my company's brand in my reputation. So security has to be better, faster, stronger. Better, we were just all thinking about Kanye West when we were kind of coming up with T-shirts. Well, we definitely need you for marketing for theCUBE. Yes. We'll talk about that later little side deal. What gives you the update on the Lumio status? Obviously, you guys had the product, we went for a briefing at your office, got the whole lay of the land, whole new, go big or go home, as you said on theCUBE. Yeah, that's right. How are we doing on that? How's it looking? Well, so the company right now, I don't know the last time we saw you, we're growing very rapidly. We're in about 50 production customers. It was probably a dozen when we saw you, I don't know, six months ago, lots of very large deployments. I would say that we're 140 people. We're trying to double the company if we can find enough really good people. Yeah, that's a challenge. I'm on theCUBE today, great developers, great salespeople, great marketing people, great DevOps people, we're all looking for you. Are you overvalued? Will the people make money in the stock options? Everyone's going to make money. If you think that, you know, if you were for pure storage, three billion dollar valuation. Well, let me give you a sense of this, right? I mean, just give a taste for the recruiting message. Well, I mean, you know, look, we don't talk about valuation, because valuation is a point in time and it's irrelevant until something is liquid. But I think the thing that's important is that the security market today is about $75 billion, the cybersecurity market. It's supposed to be about 100 billion, according to the Gartner in 2018. And it's supposed to be about 150 to 100 to 200 billion in 2020, depending on how you estimate it. Security is growing five times faster than IT spending. So the market's there, the addressable market, obviously we have to continue to execute. Need budget timing, all there. They're all there. Well, I think, you know, what we're coming out of is a period is that most companies have a security deficit. They've underinvested in their security or they have focused on the perimeter, while the attacks are in the interior. So there's going to be both a shift of focus and an increase in spending. So, you know, people have to pay down that security debt and they have to get out of that security deficit. And we're hoping, and we're not the only ones working really hard to take advantage of that shift in spending. So we've been talking on theCUBE, obviously since you were on the Burma Scourge, Steve Herry laid that out, I think the year before at VMworld, the perimeter was thesis. But now the conversation shifts to, forget that, that's the horses out of the barn, the genies out of the bottle. It's how you approach security. It's no longer defend, it's assume they're in. So that is the new model. So John, I'm going to give you a preview sneak only for the preview. Next week, you're going to see a piece of research that Illumio sponsored with a research house about interviewed close to 1,000 IT folks around the world. And their number one issue is containment, right? The issue isn't, is the bad guy going to get in? The question is, what's the blast radius when the bad guy gets in? So you assume that they're in? They're assuming that you're in. You got to look for the pattern of in, not prevent. That's right, it's definitely, well look, you still want to prevent, right? Basic things you can do. I mean, you live in a house, do you leave your front door locked or closed when you go to bed? You lock your front door, right? Nobody's not going to leave it. You don't leave it and say, hey, maybe they don't. Now I lock my door. Very household, the door is always locked, the alarm, the doberman's at the front. We know all about that. You go downstairs, the combination to the safe is, no, we'll get it. That's right. So the issue is when the bad person is in, how far can they go? Can they exfiltrate your data? Can they fan out and get into all your other servers and get that really important IP that you're trying to protect? You know, we're talking about data. So our focus is really about seeing when something bad happens and containing the blast radius. And you know what, that's going to, I predict that you heard it on theCUBE, the next 12 months, most of the conversation is going to be about containment as opposed to it. Because, you know, if you think about something like a piece of malware, it gets on a server, it may sit there for three years, until it does something, you know? It's like you're kind of going to get detection fatigue. The question is, when it wakes up, did you recognize it doing something bad and did you contain it? That's exactly the way we're seeing on theCUBE. So, as we collect the dots over the series of events, it's very clear that is the new normal. That's right. So the question is, is your data, is your security, is your infrastructure, is it doing what it needs to do to contain the damage? And the number one variable in containment is timing. So if I see something, in Illumio's world, we see something bad in the first 30 seconds, we can alert people, hey, something bad is going on there. 30 seconds is a lot better than four months, right? A lot more damage happens in four months. Well, people aren't putting their head in the sand, that's for sure. Not anymore. People are all awake, everybody's awake. Right, it's pretty serious. Okay, so I got to ask you, we got one in the last minute here, talk about what's going on at the show with Amazon, respect their security, because they're interested in some new things, some what looks boring on paper, but actually they're filling in a lot of white space on the tooling, visualization, this timing thing is coming back, having stuff readily available, the data, maybe not the comprehensive security solutions, but they got a baseline, they're out at stuff's a huge deal. I think there's two really good things that we hear from Andy, Josh, and the rest of the folks have been talking about these first days. One is they are filling out the less of the portfolios, their security portfolio, and some of the tooling that will allow the enterprise to really have a lot more confidence. The other thing they're starting to do is put out a lot of metadata, so a system like mine can now get threat feeds and information in from Amazon, and then take action. That's the DevOps ecosystem. It's all about DevOps, it's all about RESTful APIs, taking that information and making that decision and deciding to just- It actually makes you stronger, so they're a sharing economy player. They're totally sharing economy. They're sharing their data. This is the fastest growing platform in computing today, right? If they're an eight billion dollar run rate business, what, how big is the ecosystem that's going to grow around them? So I think they totally get- At least five to 10X minimum. Absolutely, so what's 40 billion dollars in the infrastructure role? That's like the size of some very large companies, so very significant opportunity. We're very encouraged by what Amazon's doing. I am too, I think it's a great opportunity for startups. I think you guys are demonstrating that startups can execute in this space because there's a ton of white space. As long as you know where Amazon's not going to roll you over. As Frank Artali said, they're like the bear running through the woods. You're either food or you're in their way, right? So faster, you know the whole adage. All I have to do is run faster than the next guy. Why are you putting your shoes on? That's right, why do you have to run faster than the next guy? That's absolutely right. Okay, give us some other tidbits, anecdotal, Alan, genius, comment, say something brilliant, go. Wow, on demand, genius. You know, I think the fundamental issue that people are going to have to really look at, I didn't prepare this, John, so- This is what we're cute all about. It's cute all about. Bringing the genius all the time, go. You know, if you do things the same way you did for the last five years, you're going to blow up from a security point of view. I think it was Einstein who said, you know, repeating something again and again and expecting a different result is the definition of insanity. So if you're going to run your IT the way you've always run it in the last five years and you think you're going to be safe, you're absolutely insane. And I think there's a small amount of people who have gotten in the last couple of years, more people are getting it, but I think you're going to see a fundamental shift. The most profound thing I can tell you is Dev Apps is the best thing that ever happened to security. The ability to continuously deliver software and continuously deliver security. So everything that makes you faster in Dev Apps is ultimately going to make you more secure. It's non-intuitive and you're going to be talking about that for the next three years. Alco and the COO of Alumeo, fast growing startup funded by some great investor, Steve Herrick, Q alumni, former VMware CTO, friend of the cubes. Congratulations. You're watching SiliconANGLE.tv's The Cube. Watch for us at other events. We're going to be here for another day and a half. Wall to wall coverage. We'll be live at Oracle Open World. We'll be at Dell World. We'll be at the Grace Hopper Celebration. And two years from now, you're going to be at Alumeo World. And Alumeo World, you heard it here first. You heard it here. We are happy to serve. And remember, we have podcasts now. Go to SiliconANGLE.tv. Guest of the week gets the podcast and we also have Women Wednesdays, top women in tech on Wednesday, featured on SiliconANGLE.tv. You're watching The Cube live and AWS re-invent. We back more from Las Vegas after this short break.