 Good morning everyone. I hope I'm good morning. Okay. Good morning. Good morning. Yeah, so good to see all of you. Welcome to our week 10 of our class. It's good to have all of you here. Welcome to our e-learning students as well. Thank you for ensuring that you're doing your work and your course through the week. We continue to encourage you to stay abreast with what is what we're doing. I hope all of you all are well here on the online platform learning through each week and using these skills that we've been learning through the past week. I hope so. Yeah, maybe some responses of especially these skills. It's a very practical way of learning how to talk to others to build conversations and to enhance your listening and your speaking. So I hope that it's being used. Okay, so a quick recap. Anybody would like to take us through what we did last week? You can put it on the chat. If you're unable to unmute and speak as to what did we cover last week? Am I audible or is it that no one's saying anything? Yes, ma'am, you're audible. Okay. We learned about the micro skill, the second micro skill that is responding. So we learned about how can we respond to others to their responses like feeling words. We learned about reflecting our feeling through listening accurately and paying clear attention to what we are communicating and forming that and not giving solutions but through conversation we can motivate them to find solutions. That's what I understood. Thank you. Good, very good. Yes, we spoke about responding which serves as a mirror for the person who's speaking. We looked at a couple of different kinds of responding, responding with feelings, responding with content, responding with meaning and summative responses. So we looked at that. We did a couple of, I think it's last week that we did some role plays. You all did try and do some on your own. So that's good. Okay. So today we're going to be looking at another micro skill which is something that becomes very, very easy for all of us especially when we are trying to have a conversation with somebody. Can anybody figure out what it is? That's the first thing that we do. What would it be? Some guesses? So till I put up my screen, you can keep thinking. Okay. You don't have a chance anymore. So that's not it. Okay. So what is that? Questions. Yes, Samuel. Absolutely. So we just love to ask questions. Don't we? So this is a class that they're all just going to ease up because you have, we're learning about how to question. Now you're going to be asking, oh, is there, even in counseling, do you have to learn about questions? Don't questions come easily? Okay. So that is even asking questions also is a kind of a skill and we will be learning about, about this very, this very part of it. Okay. So I thought what we could probably do is initially, sorry, I'm just going to stop sharing this and I will share a bit later. And maybe I think we can start before we really look at what questioning is. Let's look at a, let's look at a case example and look at how we question wrongly. So this is a good time to just mess up and figure out what is the wrong way to ask questions. Okay. So let me, I just wanted to put up that, let me put up that example and let me share this. Okay. All right. So here's the, here's the condition here. Okay. There is a young 19-year-old student by named Mary and she comes to you worried because she's not getting on with other students in her class. Okay. So this is the, this is the scene. I'd like somebody to be Mary. Okay. I'll be, I'll be the counselor and I want the rest of you to really note the kind of questions that's being asked. Okay. And so what I'd like y'all to do is probably pick up some question that you think is absolutely not necessary and tell me why you think it's not necessary. Okay. So I hope I'm clear. So I'd like one of you to become Mary. All right. You're, you're, you're the, you're the 19-year-old student who comes very worried because you're not getting on with other students in your class. Okay. So that's, that's what, that's the place you are in. And I'm here as the counselor and I want all the rest of you other than Mary or even Mary can to, to write down the questions and tell me what's wrong with these questions or what's right with these questions. Okay. Are we on? Yes. Yes. Okay. Good. Okay. So who's my Mary? Someone would like to be Mary or can I volunteer be John? Yes, I really can be John. All right. Yes. Please go ahead and be John. Thank you. Okay. All right. Okay. So what we're going to do is the rest of you, please keep a note of the questions. And this is going to be, you're really going to analyze my poor skill of questioning and going to tell me what is wrong in that. And you will pick this up only when you hear it, right? Sometimes when you are actually saying it, you may not really understand. So that's why I thought we'd do it like a role play. Okay. All right. John. Yes. Yes. Okay. Hi, John. I'm, I'm Jean. Why are you here today? My mom sent me to you, pastor, because she thinks I don't have any friends. So she thinks she'll be able to help me make friends in my class. Okay. Your mom sent me to you. Okay. So your mom feels there's something wrong. What are your friends like? I don't have any friends. I told mom that I'm not, so we change schools and in the new school, I'm, I don't have much friends. So I shared this with mom and mom said that I should, she suggested a few things I tried and it still didn't work. So I kept, I told her that I'm not making much friends. So she wanted to talk to pastor and she might be able to help me. Okay. So your mom is worried that you don't have friends. You aren't worried? I, I, I, yeah, I'm, I'm, yeah, I'm worried too. But I don't know how to say it. Because I, I don't feel like I fit in. Okay. Why don't you fit in? Well, because I'm, I'm a little, I think I'm, I'm a little shy to approach anyone and they already seem to have their own friend circles. I just feel that I can just go and join any group. Why are you such a loner, John? I wasn't a loner before. I, I love friends. I miss my friends from my previous school. I've never been just here. I haven't made friends. I end up being alone all the time and just, I end up talking to mom about it a lot. So you'd like to be alone at home, at school, but you'd like to talk to mom at home? I don't like to be alone at school. Oh, you don't like to? Okay. So how many people are there in your class? Around 40 to 40 to 42, I think. How many girls, how many boys? I don't know, but maybe around, I think there are more boys, I think, than girls. So you don't get along with the girls and the boys? Not that I don't get along, but it's just, yeah, they, everybody seems to be busy with their own wall and I just, I just end up having lunch by myself. You like having lunch by yourself? I don't like having lunch by myself. You don't like having? Okay, then who do you like to have lunch with? Someone, I think, it's so weird eating all alone. So how can I help you? I don't know, Pastor. If I were you, I would say I don't want any help. Okay, all right. Okay, so I think I've got a couple of questions that I said. Okay, thank you. Thank you, John. Okay, Sam, tell me what did, tell me your experience. I didn't feel helpful at all. It felt more like an interrogation. Almost it felt like it was my fault. And I felt interrogated. I felt confused at times. Even some were really like, yeah, it didn't feel like you were trying to understand me. It just felt like you're trying to find a fault in me, especially the questions that on how many boys, how many girls. Was it a needed question? No, I, yeah, that I, I didn't feel like it was a necessary question. There were a lot of unnecessary questions, but. Unnecessary questions. Okay, okay, good. So we heard it from John's mom. Okay, so let's hear from the rest of you. Yes, Shaye, go ahead. Yeah, thank you, Pastor. So you basically kind of showed us some wrong questions not to ask. And I just kind of noted some, like, for instance, when you, when you asked John, why are you such a loner? That was a negative question. Do you like to be alone at school? I mean, you already know his issue. So it's like the question is amplifying the problem that he's coming for you for help with. Then you asked if, why he was not getting along, whether he was not getting along. It doesn't get along with his schoolmates, basically. I think maybe the question should have been the other way around that. Do people get along with you? Maybe now they've been better. And then you abruptly asked John, how can I help? That was kind of in a way, like, it looks like he's like a case and not, not necessary a person. It's like just another problem coming to your door, coming to you instead of treating the person, treating him as a person who needs help. But yeah, so those are the negative questions I was able to identify. What questions not to ask, basically. Wonderful. Great observations. Wonderful. That's right. I think that Christopher has said the very first question in your face, question, why are you here? Yeah? Yeah, why are you here today? So that's good. You're not worried. Okay, are you not? So I think one of the questions was, your mom seems worried. So you aren't worried? Yeah, so that's again a closed question. Okay, Rose says, very unemphasic. The council reacts as defensive instead. Absolutely. Okay, easy to get along now with other students than the council. Absolutely. I think John here would say, definitely the students are better. Okay. We are all your friends. Oh, Sam, they all felt for you, Sam. They just figured how bad a counselor I was. Okay. Chaya says, only questions, not understanding. Good. I think that's an excellent observation. Through the entire two, three minutes, there was only questions. There was no form of responding that came about. That's an excellent observation. Abhinav said, so how can I help you? That was a discouraging question. Okay. I think just like what Shea said. Okay. Anybody else? Anybody else has noticed something that is, were there any unnecessary questions in that entire list? That really didn't. It's like questions of fluff, just to put some air in the entire time spent. Did you all feel that? Anybody? How many classmates was irrelevant? Yes, asking how many? What does it have to do with his issue here? Okay. Excellent. That's a good note. The last question, how can I help you? Okay. Yeah. So that was something that, and actually the question of how can I help you is not actually a bad question, but with the flow of how the initial three, four minutes went, that became a terrible question to ask. You know, it was almost like, I can't find the problem here. What is wrong with you? Kind of a thing. But the question of, you know, how would you like or what are you looking for help from me is actually a solution focus question, which is a good question provided that it has a backing of good responses to this. Okay. Someone else has written something. Beth says, I felt one useful thing that did come out was that the counselor found out that he did in fact have friends in his previous place. I feel this would be actually useful info for a counselor to work with. Yeah, that's provided John stays with the counselor a bit. Okay. Good. All right. So, so you've kind of figured out, you know, how it can seem sometimes of how our how our techniques or what we say could actually be such a put off for people. So even if there are questions, so one thing I think is pretty clear that if you just keep questioning over and over and over and over again, the person does not feel heard. Okay. And that's why the previous skill that we learned on responding becomes so very important and crucial in an interview process or in an exploration process. Okay. So let's go to go. I'm just going to get to the beginning of this. Okay. So we added questioning skills. And let's look at what is the purpose of questioning skills. So we need to this is like I said, this is a very important microscope, micro skill and questioning is what guides a conversation. Okay. And good questions. It brings about the richness of the counseling stories. Okay. And that's what's what you're doing, but it's just not gathering data or gathering information, but rather it is helping to see the situation, helping to see what where they are at, what kind of meaning and thoughts that go about in the counsellor's mind. Okay. And we're going to be looking at different kinds of questions, which will make it even more clearer to you. So this is usually useful in the initial information gathering stage. Okay. But like I said, it is also a skill that is used through the entire counselling process, even at the places where you're personalising stages of action, all of that is where questioning skills also becomes important. There's someone. Yes, Kennedy. You have a question. Kennedy. Okay. I think that was my mistake, probably. Okay. So let's move to what does questioning do when what is the purpose of what does it really help in? Now, questions during a counselling session helps to open up those new areas of discussion. Okay. And what does it also do? It also assists to pinpoint an issue. It also assists to clarify information that can seem ambiguous to the counsellor. So questions that often invite the counsellor to think or recall information is what really aids in the counsellor's journey of self-exploration. Okay. So and that's why it's important for a counsellor to be knowledgeable about the different types of techniques or questioning techniques and also how appropriately they need to be used. Okay. So here's an example of how you clarify. So the counsellor says, I'm sorry, I didn't understand. Would you please repeat that? Okay. Or what do you think about what I just said? Or would you give me an example of what you meant by something? So what are you doing is maybe they say, like I said, often when counsellors come, they speak very vague. Not all of them speak to the point. They speak very vague and they may say things like the challenges I face with people are many. All right. So they've given you a statement like that. And here you're wondering what could the challenges be? What could the many be? Who are the people that's involved? Okay. Now that's what questioning helps and how questioning helps. That you pick up things that they may be saying they may have clarity in their mind. They could have some clarity in their mind or they're referencing something as they're talking about it. But for you as a counsellor really requires a little bit more of fleshing out. And that's what questions do. So it assists to pinpoint a specific issue, to clarify a certain information as well as it helps to bring down the ambiguity that a counsellor may experience. Okay. Now it also, of course, like we know, like we had spoken about is that it aids in exploration. And that's where it comes in your initial part of your sessions of self exploration. So here are some examples. What further thoughts do you have about this person your parents want you to marry? Okay. So it's maybe she or he has given you certain understanding or certain pointers about in this case about the person. But then you are exploring a bit more or the next one you mentioned that your father always made you feel important. What did you mean? Okay. Now these are statements that they make. But when you flesh it out a little bit more, it adds to the richness of the of the story that they're saying. Or what are you feeling as we are talking about this? Okay. Now this is a very, very powerful question because even like so usually some of these questions are asked when, you know, maybe as a counsellor you're bringing about a perspective change. Okay. So let me give you an example. I'll give you an example of one of my cases that I saw yesterday. So this client, this counsellor was saying that when he gets the messages from his wife and right now they're separated. Okay. So when he gets the messages from his wife about a statement that suggests that she and the children are doing something, it kind of triggers him not doing something. She and the children are grateful for what he is doing. He supports them in some way. So then she sent a message saying the children and I are very grateful for what you're doing. Now that sentence triggered a sense of anger. So then, you know, the fact is all that he would say is, you know, it triggered me. Now I'm trying to understand or I want to understand what about that statement seems like a trigger because maybe as you and I may look at it, he's saying, okay, that's so nice. She's actually being very grateful for all that he's doing. But it has bought about another sense of a feeling. So when I asked this question, what are you feeling as you're telling me this information, he says, I feel left out. I feel that they treat me as somebody else as if what I'm doing is an obligation. Of course, I will take care of my children. So, you know, that's what he said. But this kind of a question really helps to understand where he's at. So when we changed, when we looked at it a different perspective, you know, then it began. So while we were talking, I give him a different perspective. I said, okay, could you would, is it something that you could just look at as, you know, they're just plain words, they're plain words or a plain sense of gratitude. And it doesn't have any agenda or any intent behind it. So then, then when I asked, what are you feeling as we're talking about, he says, you know, I feel much better. At least, I know that I'm being acknowledged. So you see how, how that changes when you ask important questions like this that really helps them to change their perspective and change the way that they look at a certain situation. So this is, it aids in self exploration. It encourages, what does questioning do? It encourages the council to talk. It is, it is an invitation. Okay. So the, the common questions, I mean, the common example that we would find here is, sorry, yeah, you said something about your sister a little while ago. Are you interested in telling me about her now? So some kind of information that has been brought up, you're encouraging them to talk, talk a little more. Okay. Or it helps to open up new areas of discussion. So it's again, here is an example. You are very disappointed that the way you are treated at office. How do you feel at home? Okay. So here it's opening up something new. It's, you're tending to understand whether the concern happens in different spaces or different areas of the, of the council is like, okay. Now, even as we look at questions, let's look at that. There are two frames of question that can be productive questions or they can be unproductive questions. So the, these productive questions is something that is a positive form of questioning and these questions create interactions that, you know, have significant payoffs for both the councillor as well as the counsellor. But in turn, unproductive questions, which I will take you all through after this brings forth information. It may give you information, but does not yield good responses. Okay. You may not get too much from the councillor if they're unproductive like, like we saw in, in John's case, right? It, it wasn't productive at all. And there was nothing that there was as a focus as to what, what the 19 year old was going through. So it was, it was a very unproductive form of questioning. So looking at productive questions, let's, the first thing, productive questions should energize thoughts. Okay. What makes you think so? Or what is happening in your mind right now? Or how do you explain his behavior? You're encouraging them to think, not just give information, but encouraging them to process and understand what the behavior means, what a certain response means, or what a certain action means. And that really energizes their thoughts that you are getting them to think. Okay. The next thing it does is productive questions should bring about a place where you can express feelings. Now, this is absolutely important going back to the previous skill of responding. Okay. So what makes you feel this way? Or what is happening between you and your husband right now? So you're coming, bringing them to a place of actually getting them in tune with their feelings. Okay. Or even things of what, what are you feeling right now? Now that helps in expressing those feelings. Okay. Often it productive questioning, what it can do is it helps to link certain, link certain comments that the, link certain comments that the counselling may be, the counselling may be making. Okay. Like this example, it says the client, the counselling says, my mother constantly calls me dumb. I guess maybe I don't work hard enough, but the work is too hard for me. Okay. And what's the counsellor saying here? Saying, I hear something in what you're saying. I wonder if you seem to agree with your mother. Okay. So the client has, the counsellor has only given a comment about what they think about the mother. But it says, you know, there is some kind of a link that the counsellor makes with regard to what she thinks about herself. And what the counsellor is trying to activate here is, is it something that you are also agreeing with what your mother says? And that's again, helpful to understand the frame of reference of the counselling. So that's, that's one of linking comments. The next one is to redirect. Redirect is to move course. Okay. Like the example given here, is it possible you focus on your son more to avoid what is happening between you and your husband? Okay. So here is the counsellor is actually checking to see if there is, you know, if there is an avoidance about what's happening in the marriage and the focus has been all on the son. So it's a redirect question to help the counsellor to understand what kind of a process that they may be in. Okay. So those are some set of productive questions. Let's look at unproductive questions. Unproductive questions is very much what we did in the roadplay. It's picking at the counselling, you know, asking things like what's the matter with you? Why do you always ever say that? Why don't you ever listen to what I say? I think some of the things that I said, why don't you fit in, you know? Or I think another thing that I had said is why don't you get along with others? Right. So this is just picking at the counselling and that's not, that's that that can be very disrespectful. Okay. Or the will gatherers. Will gatherers are the examples that I took as how many people in your class, how many girls, how many boys, you know, what are they wearing? Or when do they come to school or what time does your college start? When does it end? I mean, all of them are irrelevant. Okay. Or even this, the second question, do you think that the session is supportive for you? Okay. These are all ways to just fluff up something which aren't helpful at all. Okay. So let's just focus on what are some characteristics of good questioning. When we, when we're looking at building the skill, what should we, should we understand? Now, often in counselling, and I think, you know, when, when we were amateurs at it, it seems that a counselling session always consists of just questions. Okay. And we were always taught that the, the counsellor who relies too much on questions is an error. Okay. And that it's only one among the very many tools that you have in your toolbox or, you know, in your skill box, in your skill set. Okay. So what are the characteristics of good counselling? So let's look at it one by one and figure this out. Okay. So the first one is it should be used as instruments to open channels of communication, not to only interrogate. Okay. So it is not just information gathering, but it's helping the counselling express things using different channels, which means they may be using it by words. There is a, there is a sense of a body, body language that comes about, there are gestures, there is silence, there is crying, there is emotional outbursts, all of that. And that's again, opening up a channel of communication. So when, when you ask a good question, you know, it should, I'm sorry, a good question should be able to erupt the person to think. Okay. So that's, and that I think comes only through, through practice. Okay. Even, even, so going back to your counselling sessions and looking back, how could I have better asked this question, you know, what, what else could I have said to really help the counselling come to a place of improving what they're thinking about. Okay. So it's, it's to help, it's not just a place of an interview, not like an interview that you'd go in an office, but this has a lot more a deeper sense of a meaning. Like for example, let's say in John's case, you know, after we get to a point of understanding that she is, she is lonely, or he is lonely in college, maybe a question like, uh, what, what does this, what does, you know, the fact that others don't communicate to you, mean to you, or what does it feel like to you to be isolated. So this actually helps for the, for the counselling to come back a lot more in tune with what they're feeling, with what, how they perceive a situation. Okay. It really helps to bring about that. The next one is interspersing active listening with questions is important. So, uh, active listening goes back to the skill of responding. So having a good balance of responding to feeling, responding to meaning, responding to content, having a summative reflection, all that we learned last time is very important with questions. Otherwise it's going to be, it's going to be a Q and A. Okay. It's going to be like how you sit in a courtroom or you sit in a police station and having questions thrown at you. Okay. And too many questions are bad. Too many questions can make the counselling feel extremely defensive, extremely, um, cornered. Okay. So interspersing this is very, very important. So we've worked, we've worked in, in counselling, we were given a rule. Okay. Uh, especially in a, in a, in a shorter sense of a conversation, you know, when, when I mean that the, when the counsellor is not very articulate about, um, about, about the story are, you know, we were given this formula, two to three questions, then comes a response. Okay. Two to three questions, then a response. So we've had to, you know, very consciously keep that in mind before, uh, you know, you move on to, to significant questions on that. Okay. Now questions must follow on from a previous response and must encourage them to build upon their last response. So for example, in John's case, um, going back to the question that I asked, I'd say, you know, what does this mean to you to feel left out in class? So, uh, maybe John would say, I just think I've lost myself or I just feel, um, very alone. I feel miserable. I feel horrible. I feel I'm good for nothing. Okay. So these may be certain, certain, uh, responses and your next question should encourage that. Okay. So maybe that next question is, uh, um, how do you feel in other places? Um, or let's say, how do you feel in a church? How, how do you feel at home? So that gives you your next, you've also understood that at home at church, which, which he mentioned at church at home, he's perfectly okay. You know, he has friends, he has people. So you know that this has something to do within the, the class or the college in itself, that something is going on there and this is not something that is universal. So that really helps. So you, you encourage the next question, depending on the previous response. Okay. The response, uh, at the end of questioning to clarify a problem situation, always clarify by summarizing. So when you've questioned, uh, you know, a lot, they're telling you, let's say an event. And at the end of it, you clarify a problem situation and you clarify it by summarizing. So you may say, okay, um, John, what I heard you say is, um, you know, that, that you feel terrible going to college. Um, you feel concerned that, um, that you don't seem to, uh, to have friends there. And that's, that's a huge problem for you. Okay. So you're, you're, you're kind of getting that. And what I do see is that you would like to figure this out, right. And you're looking for ways to, uh, feel better in your, in your setting of college. So you've kind of clarified the problem. Okay. And you've clarified it by summarizing. So that's what your, your initial set of questioning should help in, in that area. Okay. My screen is frozen. It's the minute. Okay. All right. Okay. So let me just give you an example just to, just for us to, um, uh, understand how sometimes, um, this, this is about Mary itself. Okay. The flow of questions with, with Mary. So here, Mary, um, now this is a, a, a good way of, of bringing about questions. Okay. So Mary says here, I'm very concerned that I'm not getting on well with my classmates. Okay. So the council, the councilor says, you're very worried about these relationships in class. Can you tell me more? Uh, so Mary says, yes, there are six of us. Sorry. And the others seem to be friends. So the councilor here says the others get on well, but how do they behave with you? Uh, and Mary says, they're not openly nasty, but they do not go out of their way to speak to me. Okay. Um, so, uh, so here the councilor again says, so you don't feel included rather than they dislike you. Have I got you right? So here the council is making some meaning and says, it's more than not feeling, not being disliked. It's about them not just including her. Okay. So Mary says, yes. And how do you behave towards them? So Mary says, I tend to keep to myself rather than try to talk with them. I seem to be afraid of them. So here the councilor is summarizing it and says, you feel lonely because you keep more to yourself and would like to overcome your fear of them. Yes. That's right. Okay. So, uh, so this is one way that, that it can go. Okay. It can go in very, very many different ways, but, but this is one form of how it can be, it can be shared. Okay. Now to learn from this, to understand that when you're looking at questions, be cautious to not over question. Okay. And why? It's because it brings about a message to the councilor that they are in control. And it also gives an understanding to the councilee that the councilor has every answer or knows all about the situation and can bring about answers to every problem. Okay. And here we said questions in quick succession can often make the council feel extremely interrogated. Okay. So being cautious about this, because when, when in determining these effective questioning techniques, it's what is important is also important to consider the nature of, or the personality of your councilee and your ongoing relationship with the council, with you as a counselor and what is the issues, issues at hand. When they're meeting you for the first time, if you're going to get into an interrogative mode, it definitely appears that you have all the answers. But as you build, let's say, you have gone to a place where in your counseling sessions, your exploration is much deeper than what is being presented. It's not the issue at hand, but maybe it's a lot more about, you know, you're going down to the needs. What kind of need seems to be unmet that this is manifesting its way. When you go down there, sometimes it's okay to bring about questions a little bit more often because you're helping them to think. Okay. And, and you're giving them an opportunity through your questioning, you're giving them an opportunity to explore further into what they may be experiencing and what they may be feeling. Okay. Okay. Let me stop here. Are there any questions? Any questions up until now? Yes, Shay, go ahead. Well, mine is just a comment. I just wanted to add that I think the tone, the tone used to ask the questions go along with the questions may be right. But even the tone to which you asked the question to put off the canceling. So I just observed that when we were going through the examples. Absolutely. That's right. Yeah. So like we said, there could be great questions. Like for example, the first question I asked John, you know, why are you here today? It's not a bad question. That it was put the, you know, it was, it was a very direct and there wasn't any any initial attending that was done. Right. Like, hi, John, good to meet with you. You know, I'm glad that you've come. You know, I'd like to know why you're here today. That's perfect. That's actually a good question. But like Shay said, the tone or the pitch with which it is said, the force with which it is said can make all the difference. Okay. Any other questions? We're going to be doing some roleplay. So let's get up for that also. Remember, it's a time to ask questions. My students love this hour because you can ask questions. Okay, what should be done when questions get only responses as monosyllables? The counseling is not responsive. Okay, so often you would see that monosyllable answers come with close ended questions. Are you feeling sad? You know, are you, are you upset? Did you have a fight with somebody? So that's where you get your yes and no questions, especially for a counseling who's not very responsive. It can be very hard. So to, to ensure that you use a lot more, which we're going to be looking at our next session, next class, next hour is open ended and close ended questions. So it's better always to bring about more open ended questions. And this, of course, you want to clarify something very, very specific, you know, it's a very specific question. Like, you know, do you also have a sister in your family? It's just to really understand if there is a sister in the family. Like, like, suppose if you've asked about, you know, would you tell me about the members of your family, you know, that's, that would be a definitely a better question. But let's say she's gone through it and she's missed out one, one person and you know, says, do you also have a sister in the family? And so that that's helpful. So always trying to change your kind of questions from closed to open ended questions is always helpful. Okay. Any other thoughts? Yes, Christopher. Yes, I was just thinking that you know, this could apply to both, it could apply to both open ended questions also. You know, where the councillor is, you know, doesn't want to really, you know, you know, really respond to questions. And, yeah, it's really, you know, maybe, maybe the councillor is quite upset or doesn't want to really cooperate. And the other thing I think is that, you know, sometimes when you ask the question, maybe in a councillor, councillor, I mean, environment, but also just generally when you know, when you have someone. Sometimes the question that one asks is also is, you know, the person responds back with a question, not an answer. So how do you manage that? Okay. So, okay, so yeah, so I'll take up your first question when they even when they're open ended questions, often you will have clients saying, I don't know. I don't know. I'm not sure. Right. So that's when or let's say they don't say anything. That's when you pick up on what you're seeing, you respond. You respond to the to different cues that you're seeing. Okay. Like for example, what I see is you seem quite unsure about that that question. Would you like to explore that a little bit more? So what you're doing here is that maybe here. So here, here, you're making some assumptions that one, they haven't even thought about it. Secondly, they have but they don't want to talk about it. Okay. So, so through that this question, you know, I sense that, you know, you don't have clarity on that and that's fine. Would you like to explore that more is going to give you either a yes or a no direct question. Okay. So they may say no. So, so you may respond like I see that maybe uncomfortable. We could probably pick this up maybe a little later. And then you could go back to what else do you think is significant that we should be discussing here. So you have bought back the ball back into their court, but they're going to pick up the next thing that they want to want to share. Okay. So I'm fine with the fact that you don't want to talk about this. What else do you think is significant that we need to discuss here? Okay. So in that way, you bought it back to the councillor Lee to pick up. Okay. So that's the first one. The second. What was your second question, Christopher? You know, when they respond, you know, you respond to your question by asking you asking a question. Okay. All right. So often this is what you will get. You will get something like, you know, they're trying to get a validation from you. Right. They say, ma'am, do you, what do you think? Do you think that was right to do? They're going to get to ask you that. Okay. And we've been taught in counselling, do not validate their either it is right or it is wrong to not validate it is right or it is wrong. So some way of responding to that is one way of saying is, you know, I'm, I'd like to understand that from you. What do you think about it? So generally respond to a question. You respond to a question back with a question. Okay. And especially when they're asking you details of your own understanding or of your own thoughts, you generally respond back to them or saying something like, you know, I'm, I'm keen to understand it from your point of view. Okay. Now, sometimes they may, they may continue pressing on life, for example, even if it becomes very personal ended questions. Okay. So that's where you, you can deal with the questions very politely and maybe give needed answers like probably they may say ask you more personal questions of, you know, what some something that's that's extremely personal that you don't, you don't need to divulge. You could say, you know, probably this information may not be relevant for our discussion. I'd like to go back to what we're talking, you can change course. Okay. And that's perfectly okay to do where you are, you're not, you're not disrespecting that question, or you could say something like, you know, maybe we could discuss that probably later, but we are at our point of time, we are focusing about this one thing. So would shall we look back into this? So, you know, you can do that in an extremely respectful way. But if there's a question that's asked to you, respond back with a question and say, what do you think about it? Or I'm interested and keen to understand what your stand on this is. And I'd like to hear that. Okay. So you're refocusing them back to their own space and their own thoughts on it. Okay. All right. Yeah. Beth, you said if they ask your opinion, can you lead them to what I'm sorry, the Bible, the Bible says about it instead of giving your opinion. So often, what you can do, and that's something we, what we try and do this carefully, is because we would want it being generated by them. So like we, they may ask, okay, what is your opinion about it? I may ask them, I'd like to understand what you feel about it. And what you think scripture says about it. What have you seen as what scripture says about it? So you're also getting some kind of an idea. Or the next thing to say is, you know, can we do this as a task for next week? That you do a little bit of a search to understand what it means or what, what it is, what it means in, in, in scripture. Because what you want to do is not spoon feed them. Okay, what you want them to do is to come up with a place where they are exploring things for themselves. Okay, because if it comes, so is it a bad idea to, to tell them about what the Bible says? No, definitely not. It isn't. But you're getting their buy-in. You want them to be involved in their process of healing. Okay, so getting them to say, okay, and maybe the next time that you meet with them say, you know, this is what we left off with. Were you able to figure that out? So, so that's something you keep in mind and, and bring that back. Because you shouldn't be the one who should be giving them the answers. You are facilitating a time where they are able to find their own answers. So I, what I always do is I say, you know, have you thought about what scripture says about it? Have you looked into what scripture says about it? And maybe they may say something. And probably what we can do, which, which we sometimes do is maybe give them a verse and says, this is what scripture specifies about it. What meaning does it make for you? That's something you can do. You know, this is what is said in scripture about this situation. What does this mean for you? What do you think is speaking to you? Okay, so there again, they, it's the onus on them to find out and make meaning on that. Okay. All right. Okay. Let's stop for a 10 minute break. It's 10.54 on my clock. We will be back at 11.4. You can grab your coffees and come back.