 Okay, I'm going to call the meeting to order. Licenseeering and Public Safety, May 25th, 2022. Roque Hall, Alderperson Betty Ackley. Here. Alderperson Dean Decker. Here. Alderperson Joe Heidemann is excused. Alderperson Amanda Salazar. Here. And Alderperson Barb Felde. I am here. Okay, Pledge of Allegiance. Stand if you're able. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. Introduction of community members. All right, Amanda, we'll start with you. Sure. Hi, I'm Alderperson Amanda Salazar, District 3. Dean Decker, Alderperson District 6. Chuck Adams, City Attorney. Dan Felde. I'm Tom Bill Adams, Spoilers Department. Kathy Hoffman, City Attorney's Office. Barb Felde, Alderperson District 1 and Chair of the Committee. And Betty Ackley, Alderperson District 4, Vice-Chair of the Committee. Okay. All right, we're on to Number 5, Approval of the Minutes from May 11, 2022. I make a motion to approve. Second. Any discussion? All those in favor say aye. Aye. Opposed nay. Chair says aye. Motion approved. Items for discussion and possible action. General Ordinance, Number 6. General Ordinance Number 1, 22, 23, 5, 16, 22. In ordinance amending the rule contained in Section 74 through 56 of the Municipal Code regarding alcohol possession and consumption in parks, so as to more clearly provide for possession and consumption of beer and wine while maintaining a prohibition on liquor. So this issue came up because when we had a license come through that wanted to serve wine in the park, the ordinance as it was written didn't clearly allow it, and yet we come to learn that it had happened many times. So we decided that the best thing to do was just to fix the ordinance to make it clear, and so that's what's been done. So there are two basic changes. One is in sub E that just includes the fact that they can serve and permit the consumption of beer and wine in a park if they have a temporary Class B license, and then F talks about like ban certain types of containers in the park, unless the group or organization is bringing them in, so you can't bring your own to an event, and then again makes it clear that beer and wine is allowed to be brought into the event in these various containers by the groups, but not by anybody else. So that's it. Chuck, do they get when people rent one of the park sites, do they get some rules for us, what they can and can't do? So renting a park site is a little bit different than what we're talking about here. When you rent a park site, I don't know what they get, but there are some parks that allow alcohol. So if you rent a park where alcohol is allowed, you can go there. There are other parks that don't. This ordinance relates to the parks where alcohol is normally not allowed, but says that an organization that gets a picnic license from the city to go to that location can serve beer or wine at that location. So as an example, the lobster boil that'll be later this summer in Fountain Park. Fountain Park is normally a park where we do not allow alcohol, but we'll give them a license. They want to serve wine. This actually came up to make sure that the lobster boil is all legal, although it will affect others as well. Okay. Are there any other questions? Okay, looking for a motion. Go ahead. Go ahead. I'll make a motion to approve. I'll second. Any discussion? Okay, all those in favor say aye. Aye. Oppose nay. Chair votes aye. Motion passes. Number seven, RO number 14223 51622 by City Clerk submitting various license applications. Business. So this is one of the few ROs during the year that you'll actually see a lot on, because this is the most most of it is the renewals of liquor licenses that have happened every year at this time. And so I'm going to walk through one at a time, the things that are different, and then at the end there'll be a motion to approve the remainder of the licenses. So the first one, it's license number 3540 being applied for by North Shore Property Management Inc. This is a new class A beer license. It was on the RO incorrectly. It was listed as a class B liquor license, but it's not. What they're asking for is a class A beer license. And so the motion would be to approve giving them a class A beer license. This is going to be a little shop on the South Pier where people can get like surfboards and stuff, but they'll also sell beer at that location. South Pier. South Pier. Okay. So do you want us to make a separate motion right now? I think, yeah, I think it's going to be easier to do that each way. I'll make a motion to approve the class A license. Second. Class A. Yeah. Class A. Okay. Is there any other discussion? Okay. All those in favor say aye. Aye. Opposed nay. Chair votes aye. Motion passes. Okay. Now licenses number 2984 and 3362. These are licenses. One is a class A. One is a class B. That's being issued to Jame Marketing LLC. And what we're saying is they should be granted contingent on correction of the described premises so that the premises don't overlap. What happened is this is one of the businesses where they divided it in half. And they changed, they included that on the newer of the two licenses, but on the older one where it used to cover the whole thing, they didn't change it. Can't have both in the same place. And so that is, that we're recommending approving with that contingency. Okay. What is the separate? Is it like separate businesses on the same premises? Yeah. It's one of these little gas station restaurant things. Jame Marketing is 1710 Indiana. That's the little Indian restaurant in a BP 17th in Indiana. Okay. So one is to... One is a class A beer license, meaning that they can sell it for like a mini marketing. And the other is a class B. I think in this case it is a class B beer only. And so then they can sell beer with their Indian food. I'll make a motion to approve. Second. Is there any discussion? All in favor say, aye. Aye. Opposed, nay. Chair votes, aye. Motion passes. Next one is a similar situation, 3243 and 3531 being issued to Harbor Petroleum LLC. This is a Harbor Petroleum I believe it's 905 Indiana. Yep, 905 Indiana. They're asking for a class A beer and cider only sort of on the mini mart side. And then on the restaurant side it's a class B beer. Class A means you can take out of the premise, correct? Yes. Class A is like a liquor store, class B is like a restaurant. Both of these are beer only or one of them is a beer and cider I think but neither of them is liquor. And they just need to again make sure that their two premises are separate and don't overlap. There were some concerns with this group applying for the liquor license, correct? Right, but this is not a liquor license. This is beer only. Okay. So we don't really have a basis, we don't think to deny the license, but yeah, I mean one of the issues with the number of these is that there's some question about whether, you know, are these really restaurants or are they more gambling machine important? Yes, right. I gotta get out more. Do you have any comments, officers? Well, I don't know that like Chuck said, I don't know that there's any things you can do to deny it. No, I see plenty of issues with that. I don't know that there's anything you can do. I don't know like with a liquor license, sorry, I'm going to ask another question. A liquor license, there's like limitations of what your sales are, right? If you go over food, it becomes a different type of license. Does that apply to B and A's? So what we're talking about when we talk about percentage of food, that has to do with the underage on premises restrictions. So yes, if someone holds a Class B license, whether it's beer or liquor, if 50% of their total sales comes from food, they qualify as a restaurant and they don't have to obey the underage, there's an exemption from the underage persons, but it does have to be 50% food, not some people, some of them think it's more food than alcohol, but that's actually not the case, which is why, for example, a number of years ago, the place that Marie sometimes works, yeah, Anglers Avenue actually had to kind of divide up. They were one of the first to do that division. It's a little different than what these gas stations are, but they split the bait and tackle from the restaurant. They wanted to do it all both, but the problem was is that when you add up beer, food, and bait and tackle, food wasn't going to add up to 50%, which is why they then designed it the way they did. They did it right, but that's probably that system is what probably gave the idea to some of these others to do what they're doing in slightly different ways. So, but does it account for the revenue, would the gambling, the money they make up the gambling machines be included in that? Yeah, gambling machine money has to be included in that. So, if they're made, now here's the thing, are they really legally making any money from gambling machines and how do they report that? Those are issues that law enforcement really has to kind of deal with and monitor. No, with the bees, though, they're allowed to have the correct way. With this particular one, they're allowed to have gambling machines. They have to have a full liquor license, or full bar license in order to be able to have them. They're not allowed to have them at, which A's are bees. It's one of the two. A's are not bees. I think you can't. B's, you can't. That's my understanding. A is a gas station one. You cannot have them there. That's that. That's why they're creating these little bees next door, just because they can have them on the food side. But there does have to be a complete separation. They have to be a separate premises, separate entrances, all that. Okay. Thank you. So, next one is license 3034. Oh, we didn't do the motion. And we didn't do the finish the motion. Okay. Is there any more discussion? Can we make motion? Oh, we got that. All in favor say aye. We didn't. Right. Nobody. And what is the motion? Sorry. Motion to approve staff with a contingency. I'll make a motion to approve staff contingencies. Second. Second. I have a motion and second. Any more discussion needed? Okay. All in favor say aye. Opposed, nay. I voted aye also. So, she can't pass this. Okay. License 30 number 3034 is being issued to family entertainment LLC. And the only issue there is they just had needed to appoint a proper successor agent. And our recommendation is the grant for license contingent on their duty. I'll make a motion to grant for staff recommendations for accessories. Second. Discussion. All in favor say aye. Opposed, nay. Chair votes aye. Motion passes. License 3018 is being issued to the owners of Flo VN Restaurant, Tina Nguyen, and Karen Pham. And there were just a couple of issues there that they had to fix too. So, we're recommending that the license be granted contingent on receipt by the city clerk of the completed application, which includes needed information about whether it's an individual or a partnership that's owning it. And then a seller's permit form needs to be turned in. But we're recommending granting contingent and receiving those things. So, was there a change of ownership or is this just kind of mixed up before? Because we didn't have the entire form, it wasn't clear what's actually happening. And so, that's why we need that rest of it filled out. If it's going to be a change from, I don't remember what it was last time, you'll have to do the right paperwork for that, but it'll all be approved contingent on their duty. And is this a liquor? I believe Fabien has beer. Yeah, it's beer. It's beer only. Okay. Okay, I'll make a motion to approve with staff recommendations. I'll second. Any more discussion? All those in favor say aye. Aye. Opposed, nay. Chair votes aye. Motion passes. License 3254 being issued to Bookworm Gardens, Inc. The license should be granted contingent upon receipt of a remaining auxiliary questionnaire from a newly appointed officer. They have a change in officer who just need a form. I can't, I need to. Yeah, you got it. Yes, yes. Okay, okay. I'll make a motion to approve with staff recommendations again. That's all. Second. Any more discussion? Okay, all those in favor say aye. Aye. Opposed, nay. Chair votes aye. Motion passes. All right, then license 1089 being issued to Dave's who's in. We're recommending that the license be granted contingent on his continued following of requirements imposed by staff on the operations of the Tavern in lieu of filing a revocation proceeding against the license. I'll just give you a little bit of background here. There have been some issues at the Tavern. As a committee, as a staff committee we met and we imposed a number of punishments on him, penalties on him, including he had to be shut down for 30 days. He's got a number of other things that he's going to continue to have to do and we're recommending that the license be granted contingent on his continuing to follow those rules. Bill, I don't know if you, you probably have a better memory of exactly what all the rules were, but there were quite a few. Right. Yeah, I didn't bring the list of them unfortunately, but there are a number of things such as his staff should not be drinking while they're on duty, having an ID scanner that also takes a photo of the person presenting the ID so that it helps curb some of the passing off IDs to other people. No weapons on premises, using a wand, a metal detecting wand on patrons coming in to the premises. Those were the big ones. No underage people, no intoxicated people on premises. Those were the continued participation in the Tavern Safety Coalition and following their guidelines, which he has done. How long does he have to do this? I think we, did we make it like a whole year? I don't know when it's specified that he's kind of open-ended. It might be open-ended. It might be forever. So like for at least for the duration of this license. It will be for the duration of this license with these both. Okay, good. All right. Is there, what was some of the specific, some of the, did he, were there some like weapons violations that people had in them? Yeah, so he, Dave's who's in was already under a chronic nuisance with the department because of a lot of the calls that were happening. We had a couple of weapons related calls last year. What kind of, so while he was still under that chronic nuisance, there were a couple of events that happened over the holidays that caused us to re-evaluate and then impose this or offer this 30 days suspension, voluntary suspension and lieu of revocation hearing and he chose that. So there had, you know, we had been working with him at the police department through the chronic nuisance process and then because some of those issues still were not being addressed. Is there a follow-up to this? I mean, do you check to make sure he's got everything checked off before he's allowed to open or are you just going to do some spot checks after? So the 30 day suspension period has already expired. So he has recollected his license and he's open again. Third shift officers, they generally deal with the taverns for the most part and they have officers assigned to every tavern in the city and they do regular inspections and they're all familiar with the requirements. Okay. All right. Any other questions or comments? Looking for a motion. It's only a motion to approve with staff recommendations. Second. All in favor say aye. Aye. Opposed nay. Chair votes aye. Passes. Next one is license number 3333 being issued to the caller company. We're asking that this one be held pending a request for them to make an application for an extension of the requirements of the continuation of business ordinance. So basically they need to come to you and ask to be extended. This is a little bit different than some of the other ones because this is one of those $10,000 reserve licenses which we're not as short on but we feel like because we have the ordinance that says you still have to do this we think they should come to you. It may not require sort of the same restrictions. You could probably grant it for a whole nother year and they probably should be coming back every year to do this until they actually open or until such time as we start running out of $10,000 reserve licenses in which case you mean one of it. So caller company is opening in Sheboygan the city of Sheboygan? This is in the golf on the golf course that they want to build so they got a liquor license for their golf course and they chose to get it right away I think with the idea being they wanted to have everything buttoned up so they'd be ready to go once everything else settled but of course they're in all sorts of litigation. Don't they have to use it within so much time or? We're telling them they need to come in and ask you for an extension because it is a reserve $10,000 license and because even though we do have restrictions on the number of those we're nowhere near that restriction and we hardly have anybody come in and ask for those licenses. We don't need to be as restrictive as we were if they were just if they were here on a on a regular $500 to some dollar license they would have already lost it because six months and you and then you guys will generally give you know maybe another month or two or whatever but this is a little bit different because of the type of license. Second. Any more discussion? All in favor say aye. Opposed nay. Chair votes aye. Next one is another poll. This is license 2301 applied for by one more time LLC. This is Mojo Tavern and we're requesting that this license be held as well pending a hearing by you regarding the staff's decision to recommend that the committee not renew the license. So our out of our committee we determined that they should not be renewed because they are not meeting the continuation of business ordinances and have not requested despite our conversations with him an extension of the requirements. He obviously has different feelings about that and he requested that he have a hearing and that hearing will happen two weeks. Well it would normally be three weeks but we'll talk about that. Hasn't been opened actually for probably almost two years now. It's yeah they did get about this time. I don't remember exactly when it was but last around sometime last year we dealt with him and he provided us enough evidence to show that he had opened briefly like on a Sunday during a Packer game and had 15, 20 people. This time he tried to provide us some evidence that he might have been open recently but the evidence I don't want you guys are going to have to decide whether that evidence is sufficient. Okay the staff didn't think it was he thinks it is. You guys will get to decide. Okay any other questions? We have to do any action on this. Motion to hold. Motion to hold. Second. Any more discussion? All in favor say aye. Opposed nay. Chair votes aye. We'll hold that one. Next one is 3504 license being issued to streamers to LLC. We're recommending you grant the license but contingent on receipt of one remaining auxiliary questionnaire from an officer just missing. Make a motion to approve contingent on staff recommendation. Second. Any discussion? All in favor say aye. Opposed nay. Chair votes aye. Next one is license 1337 being issued to the Schwoigen-Elkslach number 299 benevolent association. This license should be granted contingent on receipt of a remaining auxiliary questionnaire from the newly appointed officer. Motion to approve the license be granted upon retrieving an auxiliary questionnaire from the newly appointed officer. All in favor say aye. Aye. Opposed nay. Chair votes aye. I want pass it. 3307 being issued to Umisushi and Steakhouse Inc. That license should also be granted contingent on receipt of a remaining auxiliary questionnaire from an officer just where their officers didn't turn it in yet. Motion to grant a digit upon receipt of a remaining auxiliary questionnaire from an officer. Second. All in favor say aye. Aye. Opposed nay. Chair votes aye. There we go. Then as to license 3250 being issued to FinalQuest LLC this license should be denied because there isn't a license to renew. So it's a little bit of a weird situation but what happened is two weeks ago you guys approved the transfer of this license from FinalQuest LLC to JLLC. So this is Bezut of Arakari owns some gas stations and things. He bought the work zone tablet down on the far far south side and you guys approved that two weeks ago. Um for some reason Kurt Hins chose to put in a renewal even after that but because the transfer had already occurred I think he was just like being super super careful but we can't grant it so and so and there were there actually the J's renewal is also on here. He can't do both so it's just going to be to deny FinalQuest LLC. Technically we'll have to send him a letter saying he got denied and he's be like why'd you send me that letter I don't want it anymore but right. Oh okay okay okay okay okay. Okay 14. Go for it Dany. You gotta be mouthful. Motion to deny. Second. Any discussion? All in favor say aye. Aye. Opposed nay. Chair votes aye. Then all other licenses on this RO should be granted and Amanda you can vote on this one. I can. Yes because we already took care of the one you can't. You'll have some other ones you can't vote on later. This will be number eight right? Our own number. No this is the remainder of the license. Oh I get it. Oh the little. Okay. Along with the bad hearing is the bad site. Motion to prove all other licenses. Second. Any discussion? All in favor say aye. Aye. Chair votes aye. Right so that passes. Now we're number eight. Our own number 1522-23. 1516-22 by City Clerk submitting various license applications change of premise. Yep so these are all changes of premises and two of the businesses asking for changes of premise there's like a whole bunch of different ones they're asking for. The ones being issued to the John Michael Kohler Art Center and the legendaries we're recommending granting those contingent on their obtaining the street festival permit that just needed to happen before we could issue it. Okay. Make a motion granting them contingent upon obtaining a street festival permit. Second. Any discussion? All in favor say aye. Aye. Opposed nay. Chair votes aye. That passes. Then the rest of the licenses should be granted. You're not you're not affiliated with the Art Center Amanda? I'm not. Nope. Okay. Just vote for her. Just vote for her now. Okay. So do we do have a motion to grant all the licenses on this RO? Yeah. Second. Discussion? All in favor say aye. Aye. Opposed nay. Chair votes aye. That passes. Number nine. RO number 1522-23 direct referral by City Clerk submitting various license applications. All right. So this also has a number of changes of premises and when sidewalk cafe couple things we just need to take care of separately as to the changes of premises being issued to Il Retrovo we're recommending granting them contingent on obtaining the street festival permit just like the legendaries. So we should do that one on its own. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Granted contingent. Motion to approve granting upon contingent contingent on obtaining a street festival permit. Second. Any discussion? All in favor say aye. Aye. Opposed nay. Motion. Chair votes aye. Motion passes. And second one on here a change of premise being issued to time and a half. That one we're also recommending granting contingent on obtaining street festival permit but also contingent on their confirming that they're going to maintain a required five foot walkway required by Americans with Disabilities Act. Their map didn't have enough information and there is a small area of their sidewalk cafe that or of their change of premises area that they're not going to be able to put anything there. Last time it sounds like all they did was mill around and it'll be fine but we just we need that confirmation so that we are not issuing a license of violation of ADA. So we're recommending that you grant contingent on those two contingencies. Can I ask a question? Is this for one day or is this for? Yeah. This one is I believe a one day it's either one or two. It's either one day or it's like a weekend. Okay. It says a one day event to be held on 6 12 22. Yep. There you go. One day. Great. Yep. Yep. Okay. We'll make a motion to approve with staff recommendations. All right. Any discussion? All in favor say aye. Aye. Opposed nay. Chair votes aye. That passes. Then we're recommending all other licenses and applications be granted on that arrow. Motion to approve all other licenses on that arrow be granted. Second. Any discussion? All in favor say aye. Aye. Opposed nay. Chair votes aye. That passes. And discussion regarding the time of future committee meeting. So there's two issues that we need to talk about. One is the four versus five o'clock thing. And one is when are we going to hold the next meeting? And I'm going to start with the second one first. So the next meeting because we have five Mondays in May would not actually be until three weeks from today. You mean June? There's five Mondays in May. So we're going to have a lecture week before we get to the first the session in June. So there's no council meeting next week. It's two weeks. Okay. And then LHPS is three weeks. Because of that and because we're at liquor license renewal time, that's going to be the last LHPS meeting that we can deal with a lot of this stuff. However, that also is when both attorneys in my office cannot be here on the 15th because that's our annual conference. So we're hoping because we're going to have some hearings, I mean if we're just going to be going to grant licenses, I would have just said fine just do it without us. But you're going to have to have hearings. And so I'm recommending that you're going to probably have to find a different day to do that meeting. And you can do what you want. I know you normally meet on Wednesdays. If you met the Wednesday before, it would be just two days after the council meeting. I don't know whether you only meet to do like required hearings and things like that at that time and hold the normal date on the 15th just for piddly stuff. That would be one way to do it. So it's sort of what you're used to. Another way to do it might be to do it the day before. But I know a couple of you are in public works. And so we'd have to be done before you could get there. So that's potentially a problem. Especially if there's hearings, you never know how long those can be. Oh my gosh. But that's kind of that's kind of our thought. It is instead of June, I think June 15th. June 15th is the normal day for the meeting where they can maybe June 8th. The only and you could make actually make that for the most part your regular meeting date because the RO from the committee should be done and ready to go. It's just it'll be a little quick for us to make the turnaround on the RO. But we also try to make sure that this was the big one. Hopefully most people got in on this one and not the next one. Okay. So here's the thing. If we do it on the A, we move it to five o'clock. I have to leave at 5.45. Can't do that then because we shouldn't do five o'clock. So if we do four o'clock and if you think we'll be done with hearings by 5.45. Shouldn't we do five o'clock? We don't have to anymore. No, we could do four o'clock. She has to be done by 5.45. And if it's a year, I have to head out to Huesburg. I have to be in Huesburg. I can't miss this. I promise I'd be at his graduation because it's a hearing. Right. You don't want to miss it. So I'm thinking of four o'clock. The four o'clock would be that should work. I would expect you would be done I would expect so. These are not the two hearings that I expect we might have are not complicated. And it's not so far. Yeah, so far. Although, yeah, if they haven't applied by now, they've kind of missed their right to have a hearing so quickly. Whereas these people that there's the one that we talked about and then there's another one that we denied that will become that the appeal will be coming through likely on that. Or could we move it to Tuesday the 7th? I will not be here. We have like Carlson. I have a I have a Carlson judgment. Okay. Oh, yeah, that's the night of the FNP meeting on that. There's going to be a lot of Alders who are going to want to be at that. Yes, you're right. Yes, you're going to say that. We have to serve the people too before that, right? Yeah. So that's and I mean, we didn't even notify the one guy yet that he's getting denied. Right. And then he has to. It's going to be tight. It's going to be tight in any case, but yeah. Or we could go to Thursday night. Does anybody have anything on Thursday? Thursday night. It's the last day of school. Oh, yeah. I don't have kids in school. I don't have to worry about it. And how the conference you leave? Are we on the 15th? Well, it's the it's it's Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, 15th, 16th, 17th. But the problem of course is being the 12th is FNP the 11th is or 11th is FNP 12th as public works. And we can't push that an extra. We're not allowed to make it another week, right? Because do they have the right to be here? Yeah, they have the right to have the hearing and then have the common council make a decision based on your hearing decision before the end of July. So the council has to meet on the July 20, unless unless there was a special meeting and I don't like forcing special needs. Okay, so we got to do the it but is it okay if she were to leave? What would happen if we had some weird thing where we got a dead lock and she's gone? Then what happens? A tie is a tie. A tie means that whatever you're voting on fails. It's like a defeat. Okay, I just wanted to clarify so we can make sure we all understood what would happen, right? You know, because we have Joe, but then that still makes, you know, yeah, or I mean, I could be here to five foot, right? You think take an hour and 45 minutes? I think we would probably do the one that I think is a closer call first, just so you could get it right, get it done. Yes, okay, because I don't want to get where we can't make a decision and we keep voting and we keep coming up with a stalemate. That's what I was afraid of. So I wanted to double check just to make sure. So we need the tie breaker. So the eighth at four. The eighth at four o'clock. Okay. Then the other issue and then probably we won't need to then do the 15th at four at all or five. The other issue is then once we go in late later in the year, we had moved this back to four o'clock at this, you know, the idea being that I know last year we needed Betty for you for a while and then for all their last year. But our understanding was we didn't need to do that anymore. And the issue that we have, and I think the clerk's office has as well, is if we're five o'clock meeting, we have to either pay overtime or give comp time. And the issue with comp time and it's come up in a couple of departments, our policy is that comp time can only be given that week. And if you find out that you're only finding out, it's flex time. Comp time can be carried. It's not under the FLSA and not under city policy. It depends on the handbook of the company. They're all different. Most of our employees are covered by FLSA and all the people that would be involved with this other than me. So we're suggesting four o'clock. And the other thing that goes with it with both of our offices is because this meeting falls on the Wednesday of the week after council, it also falls at the time that we're trying to put together the council agenda and go through documents. And so if suddenly we were to have, you know, and we were to go till, you know, from five till seven instead of just four to six, we'd still have to play four to six, we'd have to play a little bit with overtime, but we're adding more to that. And it is at exactly the time of the week, the time of the two week cycle when we most need to have our employees have their full amount of hours because we're crushed already. Can I ask a question? Do we have to start at the top of the hour? Like, could we even push it like 15 minutes? 15 minutes. Start at 4.15, 4.15, I would be. At 4.15 would be. The next 15 minutes would actually make a big difference. I'm off of work at 3.30 and it's, yes, you can start at 4.15. So we're allowed to do 4.15, you know, God forbid if they change schools again, I can't, I had one that was getting out at 3.45, that was the problem last year. But now she'll be getting out at 3. So, I mean, it would be okay. Yeah, I have to do by four. That's fine. I understand the city, you know, that's not fair to you guys either. Yeah, I could make 4.15 if it's like really snowing in the winter, it might be really snowing, but I will do it, make it work. What happens if we're late? Is that like an issue like we're going to? You know, a lot of meetings are short for now, for my office, 5 o'clock is really the comp time issue, not 4.30. Because we've kind of worked it out to keep our office staffed through the noon hour. I do believe the clerk's office closes at 4.30. So many meetings that go over 15 minutes, they might have to deal with it. But they're also, I mean, Cathy takes the minutes, not them. So, Cathy, 100% has to be here. And they're like, Melissa's not here today. I'm trying not to inconvenience you, but I'm trying to think, you know, at 4.15 it would help you and you guys, you know, help you guys to not have to not be speeders and stuff, try to get over here. I definitely was not speeding on the way. I can't be here. We'll let you know. And then you have to speed. Would 4.15 then work for your office? I think it works for us. I mean, I like that IT is still here at that time because so often you're right. That is a good... Okay. And they're here till 5? No, 4.30. IT's here till 4.30. But they can, once they get a stop. But Cathy's in here early, getting it set up and stuff all the time. So that's what she's looking at, if she has any issues. So I'm here at 4 o'clock on June 8th, but then after that I go to 4.50. Yes, please. Yes, please. And I apologize for the inconvenience last year with school and COVID, the way they were doing things was real weird. So we didn't happen to really release. But I don't even let someone else pick up the tool. It's depending on the school. Well, depending on the school they didn't let you cross. Okay, we're looking for a motion to adjourn because I think we've covered all the items now. You didn't have to make a motion on this whole discussion. It's really a discussion because she always has the control over what the agenda is. If she would just suddenly decide it's at 4 a.m. She could. All right. Wow. Move to adjourn. Second. Okay, all in favor say aye. Aye. Close may. I vote aye. So that means it's at 4.50.