 Rwy'n gweithio. Ddiolch yn ystod i'r gweithio ar y gwirio yma yng Nghymru ar y cyfnodau ar yng Nghymru. Rwy'n gweithio'r perthynau ar gyfer Llyfrgell, Cwfili, Cwfili, Bwyrr, Rondd-Berchan-Yntaf i'r gweithio'r gweithio ar gyfer Llyfrgell ac yn gweithio'r gweithio ar gyfer Llyfrgell. Rwy'n cael ei wneud o'r slide, y ffordd o'r ysgolwyddiadau ar y gweithgol yma yn ymgyrch. Y 7-day cyfraith newydd yn ymgyrch yn ymgyrch yn ymgyrch yn ymgyrch yn Brygynd ac Blinogwent. A wnaeth ymgyrch yn ymgyrch yn cyfrifol yn ymgyrch yn Mythyr Tiddfyll a Newport, ddgylched yma yn yr holl i i'r byddai'r bobl yn trafodol ar y cael eu ddarparu yn ymgyrch yn ymgyrch yn ymgyrch yn ymgyrch yn ymgyrch yn ymgyrch yn ymgyrch yn yr holliaeth ar y byddai'r bobl. Oton, o bobl yn gweld eu byryd ar yr holliaeth yn ymgyrch yn ymgyrch yn ei holliaeth ar gyfer這個 pi unconditional pan wneud hynny pwyng awyryd li. Mae'n meddwl i'r bobl wedi gyda ei herfyr yma yn ôl cael eu cyfrifol yma ymgyrch yn ymgyrch yn ymgyrch yn ymgyrch yn ymgyrch. Restrictions. We will hold an urgent meeting tomorrow with all local authorities, health boards and police forces in South Wales, from Bridgend to the border with England, to discuss the wider regional situation and where the further measures are needed. Before I turn to the restrictions, I want to say a few words about the nature of the cases in each of these areas. In Merthyr Tydfil, the incidence rate is high, but the cases appear to be mainly focused around two distinct clusters, one linked to a large employer and a pub. There are two new smaller clusters that have also been identified. Enrond le Cynon Taf, where local restrictions were introduced on Thursday, we've continued to see both the number of positive cases and the incidence rate rise. It is now the highest in Wales. We're seeing many small clusters throughout the local authority area, which, because of a lack of social distancing, have led to community transmission. Initially, most cases were in younger age groups, but we are now seeing infections in all age groups. And particularly worrying, we have 34 cases of coronavirus in people in the Royal Glamorgan Hospital. Bridgend is a growing concern for us because there's been a sharp rise in cases in a short space of time. We've identified a small number of clusters in the borough, but we are worried that the pattern is similar to the one that we have seen in Enrond le Cynon Taf. Mobile testing will be introduced in Bridgend this week. In Blaenau Gwent, we've seen cases linked to pubs and a lack of social distancing, but there have also been cases in care home staff and in secondary schools in the area. In Newport, the rise in cases appeared to start with a house party at the end of August and were subsequently linked to a number of pubs. But we're now seeing a widespread of cases across the city, which are not linked to a particular cluster of showing links with existing cases. The rise in cases in Bridgend, Blaenau Gwent, Merthyr Tydfil, and Newport means we have today made the difficult but necessary decision to introduce local restrictions in all of these areas, to protect people's health and to prevent the spread of coronavirus. These measures will be the same as those that are already in place across Rhondda Cynon Taf. They will come into force from six o'clock on Tuesday evening and will apply to everyone living in Bridgend County Borough Blaenau Gwent, Merthyr Tydfil, and Newport. The restrictions mean that people will not be allowed to enter or leave those areas without a reasonable excuse, such as travel for work or education. People will only be able to meet outdoors for the time being. People will not be able to meet members of an extended household indoors or to form an extended household for the time being. All licensed premises in these areas will have to close at eleven o'clock in the evening, and everyone over the age of eleven must wear face coverings in indoor public places, as in the rest of Wales. We will also be extending the requirement for all licensed premises to close at eleven o'clock in the evening to Caerphilly County Borough area following a request of local partners in Gwent for such targeted action. It also means it is easy to understand what you can and can't do in any of the areas subject to local restrictions because the rules will now all be the same. Guidance and frequently answered questions will be published on the Welsh Government website to help people understand what this means for them, but of course there is already guidance available in respect of Rhondda Cynon Taf. Our ability to make a difference to the spread of the virus rests in all of our hands. We will only make a difference if we all work together. Every one of us has a responsibility to make the right choices and to follow the measures which will keep us and our loved ones safe from this infectious and harmful virus. We all need to keep our distance from each other when we are out and about. We need to wash our hands often. We need to work from home wherever possible. We need to wear face covering in indoor public places and we need to stay at home if we've got symptoms and while we're waiting for a test result. We need to follow any restrictions done or in place locally. Thank you. I'll now take questions. Has today described this as, in his words, a six month problem. Can you confirm that that's the timescale that the Welsh Government is working to? In other words are we looking at six months of restrictions of one kind or another? Well we hope to be in a position but we can't definitively confirm the sort of timescale. We know that actually when we were going into lockdown measures in the spring that we had a period of time where the weather was generally improving whereas we're now moving into the autumn and the winter the days will be shortening there'll be more people indoors. It'll be more difficult to do more of activity outdoors but I myself wouldn't want to place a definitive restriction in terms of time period for when we will be through this. I do think though it's worth pointing out in the graph you saw that we seen a dip in the cases in Caerphilly and that's important because it does show what we said at the outset. They would take about two weeks for the measures to start to have an effect and we are seeing and it's a cautious note of optimism but I think it does show for everyone else who is going into new local restrictions that it's possible to see improvements if people follow the rules as they have done in Caerphilly and I'm very grateful to the leader of the council, Philippa Martin in Caerphilly and all the residents of Caerphilly who have been following the rules and really helping to improve the situation we think for them, their families, their loved ones and their community. Thank you. The Prime Minister is going to be speaking to the First Minister within the next hour or so. Can you say whether you, as a Welsh Government, are considering taking part in UK-wide further action and is that the case, is that the reason for the call and related to that, if it were UK-wide action, would you be considering what they call a circuit breaker, this idea that there would be a two-week period of very intense restrictions? Well, there isn't a significantly advanced agenda for that call and I look forward with interest to a conversation with the First Minister about what takes place. I think it's a helpful step forward that the Prime Minister is going to talk to the First Minister of Wales but as we have reiterated the best way to have four-nations engagement is for all four nations to speak with each other at leadership level at the same time. So the Prime Minister, the First Minister of Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland and key ministers to have a joined up conversation because I do think that joint UK messaging will help all of us, those of us in government, in the health service and crucially the public to understand what the rules and expectations are and to understand from the outset if there are differences why those exist. It may be the case that UK-wide measures will be taken but those will require all four governments to exercise our varying shares of power and responsibility to do so. We've demonstrated before at the outset of the pandemic that we were prepared to do so where the circumstances said that was the right thing to do. I think it may be the case that we need to do that in a concerted way through the course of the autumn and the winter. The only way to determine that is for us to share information and to speak with each other much in the same way that I expect to have that conversation with other health ministers and chief medical officers across the UK later on today. Thank you, Adrian. We've now got James Williams of BBC Wales. Thank you, Minister. You mentioned a meeting tomorrow with council officials, health officials, police forces in the wider south Wales area. Are we to take from that that you are looking at tighter restrictions in that wider area and you've also talked about looking at increasing measures in those areas that are already seeing tighter restrictions. What kind of measures are we looking at as the next step? The conversation with people across the 10 authorities that make up the capital region is an important one because we see Gwent, Cardiff and Vale and Cymtaff Morganog that are joined up in the way that people work socially and economically, lots of travel across the region. It makes sense though with six of those 10 authorities and six o'clock tomorrow having a formal local restriction to have a joined up regional conversation. Now that's to make sure that we don't simply wait until other events happen. It's a way to have a joined up conversation rather than a deliberate commitment to then taking measures across the whole region. If from the intelligence that we gather from another day's worth of data we need to do that, then we can of course make that decision, but it's to make sure we're having that conversation in a preemptive way rather than waiting until there's a pressing need to take action. And as you've seen from the figures this weekend, you can see coronavirus spread very, very quickly over a significant period of the country. So there isn't just a message for the south east of Wales. It's a message for the whole country about what all of us need to do. And I know that partners in west Wales, mid Wales and north Wales are having regular conversations with each other. So it's a genuine watching brief that is taking place, but obviously the concentration of concern and new cases is in the southeast corner of Wales. Thank you. And you've said in the last week or so that we could be heading for Wales wide lockdown if things don't improve. Just for clarity by that, do you mean a march style lockdown, i.e. that businesses are shut that we're basically stuck indoors and so on? If so, have you got any, any meeting with the Treasury to make sure that they can fund businesses, employers, employees and so on, if Wales goes down this unilateral route and England doesn't? And also how much discussion has there been in government about doing things short of a lockdown as in adopting a Swedish style approach of targeted inventions and sheltering the and shielding the vulnerable? Well, as you've seen from the measures we're taking today, we are taking a more targeted form of intervention at this point in time. It's in line with what we set out in the coronavirus control plan, understanding the data, but also the softer intelligence that comes from our contact tracing teams and our public health advice. We may reach a point, though, where the spread continues, where we need to take wider action across a region of Wales or indeed across the country. So we're anticipating what may be necessary, and we're considering all of those actions within that. The local restrictions that we have already introduced in Rhondda Cynon Taf, and the ones in Caerphilly, are short of the full lockdown, if you like, that we had at the end of March. So we're of course contemplating a range of action. So there may be all Wales measures. There may be always measures that are short of the measures we introduce on the 23rd of March. That's a conversation that we have to have about the impacts on public health and avoiding harm. We also want to have that joined up conversation with the reality of people being supported as well. Individuals who need to isolate, as well as businesses, because we don't want to see viable businesses go under because of the significant strains that coronavirus presents to all of us. That, again, is why a four nation discussion is really important. Not simply one that takes place between individual ministers talking with their counterparts, but at leader of the government level to make sure that we understand the range of interventions that are available to help us make the right choices. So I think it's in all our interest for that engagement to happen and for it to be regular and predictable for each and every corner of the United Kingdom, and certainly for us here in Wales, where we are responsible. Thank you, James, and I've got Dan Barnes from the South Wales Argus. Thank you very much. Can I just ask, with the rising number of cases and new lockdown restrictions seem to be moving east from Caerphilly into Newport, Blenau Gwent, do you feel see the other regions of Gwent and South East Wales falling under similar restrictions in the future? Well, it's possible. It's possible that coronavirus will spread as we saw it spread through February and March and April. That's why we're not just taking this action today with four additional local authorities, that's six out of the 10 authorities within this part of Wales having coronavirus restrictions in place from tomorrow evening. That's why we need to have that regional conversation as well with the four out of those 10 authorities that don't currently have restrictions to understand what's happening there and how the region works as a whole. But to do that, though, it's really about not just anticipating where we are, but the key messages are for all of us. So for me, for you and for people watching this and people not watching today's press conference, it's about the things that we can all do. The government has a responsibility. The health service has a responsibility is preparing for more cases to come to it. But actually, the best thing for us to do is to prevent and avoid a spread of coronavirus. That's why the action we take to follow the rules to limit our contact, to have genuinely extended households that aren't mixed across a variety of others is really important because household spread is a key factor here. The most significant challenge we face is indoor contact. If we follow the rules, we're more likely to see a reduction as we started to see cautiously in Caerphilly. If people follow the rules, it makes a difference, and that will avoid harm. And we've all seen the sort of harm that coronavirus can cause with more than two and a half thousand people in Wales already having lost their lives. Thank you very much. And my follow up question. On Friday, the First Minister expressed his desire to keep schools open in Wales. Since then, obviously, these new restrictions are coming into place, and we've had at least three more schools in our region sending children home after confirmed coronavirus cases out of the schools. So has this desire to keep schools open changed? No, it is very clearly the priority of the Welsh Government to keep schools open. We know that because children and young people are less likely to have coronavirus, less likely to suffer harm, less likely to be infectious. We also know the very real consequences for children and young people if schools close as an impact on their mental health and well-being. We also know that in lockdown, not every child thrived with distance learning, and there's a longer term impact on educational and life prospects. So we've been clear that keeping schools open will be the priority for the Government and will shut other areas of activity to make sure schools can open. Now keeping schools open does mean that some schools will see clusters and groups of their school needing to isolate, whether they're staff or individual classes, but it's important that each school is managing to organise itself to have unique groups of people in the schools. You don't see very large groups needing to isolate, but that is preferable to the whole school closing or having a wider national school closure programme. That is absolutely not what we want to do, as I say, because the harm that we know that causes. And it's predictable and planned that we would have a range of schools being affected if coronavirus exists within the community. You'd expect to see it within that school community too, which is why we've seen most of the coronavirus infections that have taken place in affected schools have actually been in the staff group. So that's why all of us need to go again, take on board, not just the measures for COVID security in a school, but each of us can avoid the potential harm caused to us, our friends, our families and, of course, the country. Thank you, Dan. We now have Mark Smith from Wales Online. Thank you very much indeed, Health Minister. First, I'd like to ask why local restrictions are being introduced so much more quickly in the likes of Blimey Gwent and Bridgend than they have done in Murthyr Tiddville, where cases per head has been at a significantly higher rate for much longer. So does the Welsh Government perhaps regret waiting so long to put Murthyr Tiddville into a local lockdown? Well, it's an interesting point. What we saw in Murthyr Tiddville, though, was that a large number of the cases were linked to a single employer. And if you turn your mind back to when we had Rowan Foods and two sisters in Wrexford Anglesey respectively, their case rates per 100,000 were significantly above the threshold for action. But we understood it was largely about a single site, a single employer and large numbers of workers being affected around that. Now that meant we were able to act effectively around that group and to help those people to isolate the employers cooperated together with trade unions to get a message to those people. They were tested rapidly and were able to get on top of those of those challenges. We also, though, had community testing. And that meant that we were able to understand there wasn't community transmission in particular in Wrexham, where we were concerned there could be community transmission. We tested within two significant communities. And at that point in time, the very good news was community transmission was not taking place. The picture differs now in the south east of Wales, where having had that understanding of a large cluster based around a single significant employer, we're seeing more evidence of community transmission in Merthyr. And we're seeing that evidence of community transmission in the other authorities we're taking action with today. It's about understanding not just the data and not just the numbers, not taking that mechanistic approach, but understanding the broader intelligence of community transmission or otherwise. And that's why we have to take this very difficult but necessary action today. And I'm very pleased, though, to say that all of the local authority leaders support the action that we're taking today. So we've got genuine buy in across not just council areas, but the political spectrum. This isn't a matter whether she will be a division on if you like traditional party lines. This is a genuine challenge for the whole country. The measures we're taking in southeast Wales are a marker of what could happen in the rest of the country if we aren't able to get on top of the choices we make. And what that does for the ability for coronavirus to spread and cause harm. Thank you very much. And secondly, once in a while, since the rule of six was introduced in Wales, as well as the regulations on wearing masks in public places like shops, what feedback has the Welsh government had from retailers and the police about people's adherence to these measures? Well, certainly from the police, we've had good reports about people's adherence to measures in general. When we introduced in Caerphilly, the local restricting for the first time after the first week or so, there was a very positive sense from the police that people were following the rules and understood lots the seriousness of the situation. And as I say, we have that cautious optimism about the start of a fall in cases in Caerphilly. The challenge then is about the rest of the country. And actually, we're seeing across the Gwent and the southeast, the South Wales Police area, we're getting reports back, both about community support in general terms, but challenges in enforcement. So local authorities and the police are undertaking more spot checks of businesses to make sure they're following the rules. And I think there is a developing centre community understanding of the point of time that we're at, where the choices that we make will really make a difference. It can't all be down to the police and the local authority finding people who are breaking the rules. The starting point is that each of us should want to follow the rules to avoid the harm that we know COVID causes. And of course, we have regular feedback on a daily basis. We're local authorities and police about what they're finding in their enforcement and community intelligence activity. Thank you, Mark. We now got Mike Hughes from LBC. Minister, thank you very much indeed. I'll just pick up on that point if I can. Contrary to what you say, and I'm sure there are lots of people out there obviously adhering to the rules. We have heard anecdotally from one police force about breaches of local restrictions, particularly people crossing from one county into another where there are restrictions in place. Have you had feedback on levels of compliance in that particular area around movement of people in between local authority areas? And if things continue to remain difficult to police, are roadblocks, for instance, on the cards? Well, there's the general point that I think still holds that most people are following the rules. And we know that there are fewer journeys taking place within the areas where restrictions have already been introduced. But the challenge with this disease is that a minority of people who choose to break the rules can actually have a really significant impact on the wider community. And that's why the message is to people to look for a reason to follow the rules and to do so, rather than to look for a reason to avoid the rules or find a way around them. Because that increases the chances of harm. It increases the likelihood of the measures lasting longer or potentially being even more significant. And we should not forget this is a significant intervention in people's liberty. These are generally extraordinary measures we're taking in restricting people's ability to travel, restricting what people can do in their own home and who with and restricting on a significant basis the way in which licence premises and businesses can operate. So people need to understand that in terms of the significance of where we are. Generally the picture is good. Most people understand the reason for the measures and support them. We need to deal with the minority who may not generally understand, but also the minority who simply don't want to follow the rules. And that is a risk for all of us. Thank you very much indeed. You've obviously underscored today your commitment around education and getting schools back. It is freshers week this week with university students returning back as well. A lot of these measures affect areas where there are universities and campuses and so on. What conversations have you had with universities particularly around it in forcing these guidelines and what's the potential penalty for universities should there be mass gatherings and people mixing in different households? There's a couple of different points there and of course I have in the dim and distant midst of time I was a president of my own student union and president of the national union students in Wales. So I understand the joy that freshers normally brings and the activity meeting new people, going to a new place, having new and different experiences and this will not be a traditional freshers experience for people going to university for the first time or ended people returning to university. It will still be a very different experience but that again underscores the real significance of the times we're living through. The education minister, the first one I self had conversations with each other. The education minister has taken a lead on conversations with universities and student unions in Wales as well in particular the leadership of the national union students in Wales to understand how they can rearrange some of their activity. I don't know if you heard but on an alternative radio station they were having interviews with student leaders talking about how they're rearranging some of their activity to do things remotely to not encourage people to gather in large groups and as you know we've already taken powers that mean that people who organise large gatherings can be subject to significant fines and penalties so there are powers to enforce for people who organise events that plainly break the rules but again the starting point is to ask people to find a way to have a university experience that follows the rules and to accept it will be a different sort of experience to a traditional one. We need to get through this to avoid harm being caused, to avoid harm being caused both to those young adults going to university for the first time but to the whole country as well and you can expect to hear more during the rest of the next few weeks about the measures that are in place but I think actually universities and student leaders have been very responsible when they're working together with the Government and the Education Minister in doing so. Thank you. Andy Davis from Channel 4 News. Thank you. The First Minister on Friday said that it didn't make sense for people to be travelling long distances into an area in a form of lockdown to get tested and he said that on Friday there would be discussions with the Lighthouse Labs about this. Can you tell me what happened with those discussions? What was the result of those discussions and are you now going to try to stop people entering these areas travelling long distances to get tests there unless they already live there? Well I'm about to have a conversation with my officials within the programme working with Lighthouse Labs at the challenges. It's a UK run programme so at this point in time it's still done on the basis that anyone in the UK can go on to a common website and get a test and wherever the nearest test may be. What we're doing though with the Welsh testing resources we're deploying is looking to have those done on a community testing basis so you'll need to be local to get a test and that point about local tests for local people is really important because we are looking to restrict movement between different areas and we are looking to understand the pattern of infections within those local communities so it's really important for us to understand that. It's also a factor Andy that part of the challenge we face is that because the Lighthouse Labs are not just restricting the number of tests but there's a slowdown in the turnaround of those tests it's not unusual to have a wait of three days or more in some instances we've had reports back of people waiting around seven days to get a result and that's just not frustrating for the individual but it puts an additional risk on where we are. Asking people to self isolate while they're waiting for a test result is difficult not everyone does that we know that. We also though know that those persons contacts if they're not contacted in that time the person does test positive they'll be largely going about their business as before so the risk for infection becomes greater if the speed of the testing results isn't addressed. That also means we have a gap in our knowledge and the data we have we're operating with something of a time lag and again that underscores the urgency of the action we're taking. We're seeing a pattern moving in one direction across the four authorities where we're taking measures but that gap that exists in the speed of turnaround means that our excellent contact tracing teams here in Wales aren't able to chase down those contacts to advise people appropriately as timely as we would want to so the challenges are real and it's certainly something that I expect to discuss with other health ministers when we meet later on today. Apologies if there's some break up with my picture but you should be able to hear me still. I'd like to ask you about the data breach involving information relating to 18,000 people in Wales who tested positive for COVID-19. Do you believe it was the right decision not to tell the First Minister about the most serious data breach in the history of public health Wales and have you and he had any discussions about the fact that he apparently wasn't told until the rest of us 10 or 11 days later after you had told? So the First Minister knew before the information was made public it's normal when serious incidents take place within the National Health Service for there to be reporting from the organisation into the Welsh Government and then I receive an alert about the fact that that's happened. It was also a deliberate choice for public health Wales to practically release that rather than wait for there to be general knowledge of it so they made the choice as they should have done to confirm what had happened and to confirm the action they were taking and as you know they promptly informed the information commissioner they're having an independent review that we publicly reported and it's also the case that there's a relatively low risk of harm coming as a result of what is a serious and significant data breach. Now I speak with the First Minister every single day at present on a range of different challenges. I'll continue to do so, we'll continue to share information about the unprecedented challenges we're facing and on this issue I think public health Wales have done the right thing and I just don't think there is a problem in terms of information and communication within the Government. It's a matter of the judgments we make and the choices we make for the country at this point in time with the unprecedented challenges that we all know we're still facing. Thank you Andy. We've got Claire Hayhurst from Press Association. Thank you Minister. Can I ask about face masks and face coverings? What is your understanding about how effective fabric face coverings are compared to surgical masks and given that rates of coronavirus in Wales are increasing if surgical masks are more effective should people be encouraged to wear those for example in busy public spaces in the door rather than cloth face coverings? So a three ply face covering provided in accordance with the guidance that we've provided in the World Health Organization has endorsed is a it makes a contribution to reducing the potential transmission of coronavirus. The challenge comes that if we're really going to try to say to the public to try and get a hold of surgical face masks then we know that that will actually lead to pressure on people who need those surgical face masks at a different grade and level. So it's about using what is effective within the community. It makes a contribution but it's not a silver bullet and it's not a substitution for social distancing and I certainly wouldn't want people to think if they're wearing a surgical face mask they can ignore the rules and the requirement to distance and you record it wasn't that long ago going through March and April had real challenges in PPE supply into this country not just Wales but the whole UK. The last thing I would want to do is to act in such a way that people are going after precious resources that our frontline health and care staff really do need to keep the rest of us safe. So please follow the rules where a fabric face covering the complies with the guidance and do so in all indoor spaces in every part of Wales not just those counties that now have individual local restrictions. And my second question you obviously mentioned your concern of the cases in the Morgan hospital. What more detail can you give us about those cases particularly the age of those infected that their level of illness? Well we're seeing infections coming in partly through both the unschedule care if you like the emergency route as well as some challenges in staff spread as well. So it's part of the community reservoir around the hospital that we understand is manifesting itself in what is a closed environment. So we're reiterating the guidance that exists already about testing people both in an emergency setting as well as planned care admissions as well. And the challenge is that people who are already in hospital are of course more vulnerable compared to fit and healthy adults who aren't in hospital. It's a closed setting so the risk for spread are more significant. That also means we have to reiterate the guidance not just within the Morgan hospital across the country about the reasons for moving COVID suspected or COVID positive patients it's got to be for a clinically urgent reason what to minimise and control infection spread and we've seen within Wrexham privacy that this can take place very quickly and cause very real harm that's also why not just the measures with an individual management team to have oversight for that particular incident but we're also testing staff on a regular basis within that hospital too. Thank you Claire and I've got Tom Magner from Careers World. We'll move on we've got Andrew Forgrey from The Daily Post. Good afternoon minister. You've heard earlier for the difficulty talent the challenges that big people who have to self-isolate. What sort of in England as you know people have been offered 500 pounds that they have to self-isolate. What sort of funding has been promised to Wales by Westminster to introduce a similar scheme here? Well this came up on the weekend in a call with Michael Gove. So the offer was there for there to be a Barnett consequential for the sum being spent in England and for us to choose how to use that. Now it's been a consistent concern of ours and you'll have heard me say this at this press conference before and indeed in our own individual interviews that we're really concerned about the financial support people will need to self-isolate successfully. There's an invidious choice that people could be placed in choosing between statutory sick pay and not being able to pay your bills and doing the right thing for the broader community. So it's a helpful step forward. I do think though it would have been preferable for there to have been more genuine for nation engagement around this and we could potentially have had a consistent agreement on how to use resources across the UK that would have helped with communication. We'll now need to see the detail unfortunately of the broad indication that was given on the weekend. When announcers are made for spending pledges in England it isn't always the case until we see the detail that we really understand the level of resource that we've got. So the sooner that happens the better for all of us and then we need to try and plan how we'll use that to effectively support people and what that means in terms of either a confirmed case or whether it's for contacts as well and again I do hope that we can have some more joined up for nation conversation around this because I think that's in the interest of all of us. And my preference is to be clear about that about the support for self-isolation rather than waving a big stick and saying we'll find anyone and everyone who leaves self-isolation. I think the balance and the message has to be that we want to support people to do the right thing because I don't think that a wholly punitive approach will get the sort of change in behaviour that we all want to see where people do isolate supported in doing so and that's the right thing to do for them, their family and their community. Thank you minister. The second question if I may last week we read the Welsh Government technical advisory cell forecasting up to 6,000 deaths in Wales between now and next March. How confident are you that this worst case scenario can be avoided? Well the reasonable worst case scenario is there to guide planning and the potential if we don't take measures that we could see more than 6,000 deaths over the winter period is an important one for all of us both for the public to understand the scale of harm that could still take place but obviously for our health and care system to plan for what's happening. That also includes the measures that we're taking today in the southeast of Wales intervening to try to arrest the increase in coronavirus cases and the harm that we know that can cause. So that's what we're doing with that reasonable worst case scenario. It sets out some of the challenges that we may need to face. It's not a prediction and actually the interventions that we provide are actually about avoiding that harm being caused and in all of this there's a balance. You hear some voices saying we need to make sure that the cure isn't worse than the disease. What we actually need to understand is if we're prepared to contemplate that level of significant harm there'll be really economic consequences that go alongside it. It isn't the case of choosing between health and the economy but we do as I say need not just to plan for what we're going to deliver across our health and care system but to understand what significant financial support and interventions may be available across the whole UK to allow us to make the most sensible and joined up response to this unfinished coronavirus pandemic. Thank you Andrew and I've got finally Rob Taylor from rexham.com. Good afternoon Minister. We've spoken with some councils in north Wales and they have expressed the desire to increase the number of public protection officers to help with inspections, reinforcements and alike. Willwell's Government fund such expansions and touching on the £500 and stay at home payments in England councils will be in the street that is the plan the same in Wales and again will Welsh Government cover any costs incurred? Well on your first point we're already working alongside and having a conversation with the Welsh Local Government Association and in regional groups about how we can support authorities to work together to improve their enforcement capability. So we do have both a range of people who are available including people who have retired and may come back to work and we're looking to have a joined up way for recruitment. So you don't find in north Wales that six local authorities are competing against each other as opposed to having a more joined up approach and how we're looking to be able to find some funding to help support them to do so. Sorry, your second point Rob. Just touching on the £500 stay at home payments. Yes, and the process for that is not something that we bottomed out and that's because we need to see the detail of the monies that would be available and then to understand what is the best way to administer that support as well so there hasn't been a definitive choice to say it must be local authorities or that it won't be but any system we introduce we need to take out of where that data and information comes from. We need to understand whether we're going to get information shared with us from the Department for Work and Pensions for example as well as the information we get from contact tracing services about eligibility for support and then to make sure we have the most sensible system and solution to deliver that support. Now we work very well with local authorities throughout the course of this pandemic we recognise that if we ask them to undertake an extra form of activity there'll be a cost to do so so there'll be a sense but I'm joined up and grown up conversation about that if local authority led payments are the route that we chose to go down obviously understanding the certainty we need in the sums available. Thank you and it's been reported that some tests in England have been sent to Italy and Germany for processing. Aside from Wales and England which countries of Welsh tests have been processed in and what's the current daily testing capacity that can be processed independently without reliance on England? Okay so in terms of the UK lighthouse lab testing programme we're not in charge of that so we're not responsible for making choices about where those tests are sent and I too have seen reports suggesting that European friends, allies and partners are helping us by delivering a range of those tests have been taken within the UK system. When it comes to the Welsh tests the ones that we actually run and provide both from community testing and some of the additional lanes we're looking to open out along the model that we have in Rodney Parade in Newport but there's an extra lane where the tests go to Public Health Wales lab those are all processed within Wales and that's the deliberate choice we're making. We have lab capacity of over 15,000 but as you've seen were some of the challenges in the UK programme whilst we could in theory we could in terms of our ability to run 15,000 tests in the lab actually the limiting steps are the number of people we have and the operating hours that we operate to so we can and will be able to process more tests that's why we're deploying them right across Wales the overall capacity is 15,000 the investment that I've announced the 32 million will actually give us the people and the capacity to run those through our labs at a much greater and higher level because I still think that we're going to find a greater need and demand per testing through the autumn and the winter and as you know that capacity will come on board through October and November. Tom is now available so we'll return back to Tom Magnett before closing. Thank you very much indeed minister yes technical failure at a critical moment. Can I ask you on the first question we spoke about overloaded GPs last week viewers are telling us or asking me to ask on their behalf whether or not there are plans to reopen those GPs surgeries that were shut before the pandemic such as those in Paris and Rhondda Cynon Taf if not why not how viewers see them as a way to strengthen the vital community links in these difficult times. Okay so whilst the physical premises may have a different route of operating all our general practices are working so GPs haven't been able to take time off during this time they've actually been incredibly busy but working in different ways and part of the challenge is where you're having community transmission about how the necessity to have some face to face appointments is managed rather than potentially having the normal walk up and walk in service that many of us are used to. If you think about going to see a general practitioner say eight nine months ago you might have expected to go into a waiting room with other people. That's now not a great environment for people who are waiting for a significant period of time if we're starting to see community transmission rates increase. So it's about working differently rather than saying that those practices are closed it's so that's the challenge that we face and actually I've had a very constructive conversation with the British Medical Association about where the general practice is working the support they require and our appreciation within the mask government for the very hard work for not just GPs but the local healthcare teams that work alongside to help keep us safe during the height of the pandemic and now as we face up to a very difficult autumn and winter. And for my second question and particularly in the light of the situation at the Royal Gremolgan Hospital English viewers have flagged a problem with guidance on hospital discharge back into the family home essentially ignoring unpaid carers and to one view it seems like hospitals are bundling people out of the door to keep beds clear so can I ask you in the light of the Royal Gremolgan Hospital what's the guidance in Wales for hospitals to take account of the family context particularly unpaid carers on admission through a hospital stay and on discharge of the person they care for? My understanding is that there should be testing for people leave so there should be some assurance about that for people in a home setting or a residential care setting as well and you know throughout this we've recognised that unpaid carers have had an even larger amount of work to do and even more pressure upon them as well we've discussed this previously and it still remains the case that the Welsh Government recognises and is hugely grateful for the contribution unpaid carers have made and will continue to make in normal times autumn and winter is a particularly demanding time for all of us as the nights become longer as we expect more people with more significant health concerns to go into hospital it'll be even more so as we come through this autumn and winter with the challenges of the flu season the campaign for people to take up their flu vaccine has started today and I hope that everyone who's watching and is eligible goes and gets their flu vaccine it's important to get yourself protected and even more so given that we all understand from the extraordinary measures we're having to take today for the coronavirus pandemic is far from over it's up to each of us to play our part in helping to keep Wales safe Thank you very much Tom thanks for us to everyone I will no doubt speak to you again in the coming days ahead