 Becoming Mike Nichols premieres on HBO 9 p.m. This Monday joining us is the director of becoming Mike Nichols Doug McGrath Thank you for joining us Doug becoming Mike Nichols is the story of a man who Did everything in show business started out as a comedian Headline Broadway with Elaine May became a director did movies He did everything No, he did he and he did it He did everything wonderfully You know, he just I mean maybe he only went into what he knew he would do wonderfully But I don't think so he he was an absolutely brilliant performer He and Elaine when people see the clips now, which is almost almost 60 years later They're so fresh and so wonderful and so true and hilarious That you would think it would be enough for him to have just had that career But then he went on To direct for the theater the first two plays he directed were two giant smash hit plays by Neil Simon He directed Barefoot in the park and the odd couple and out of that success He got into the movies and he his first two films were who's created Virginia Woolf with the Burton's with Richard Burton and Elizabeth Taylor and the graduate Well, I thought that's pretty good, isn't it? Yes. Yes, and that would be enough That would be enough for anyone's career to have that on your resume those things on your resume and then he went on to do, you know the birdcage and postcards from the edge and working girl and angels in America and His genius musical Spam a lot and his You know so many a wit for HBO as well He just was a person of a of a wide-ranging intelligence and luckily he had a talent that could support Where that intelligence led him and somehow found time to Have Diane Sawyer as his wife Yes, he managed to fit that in as well So becoming Mike Nichols, he was born in Nazi Germany and the family escaped Came to America. He grew up bilingual The family spoke German. He had a learn English Came home and had a translate for his parents What is the movie about is it about? Becoming the genius Mike Nichols and yes coming from the background it's about You know when you have a career as long as Mike's and as full as Mike's You can't I mean, I don't think it's wise to Do a documentary that covers all that because when you have to cover everything you have no time to really be on anything You know you're it's one minute on the graduate. It's it's a one minute on working girl because there's so many things So early on Looking at the footage and I know Mike felt the same way even though we talked about he talks with Jack O'Brien Who is his pal and who's in the movie with him? They talked about everything meaning all the work But the work that Mike really wanted to discuss at length in detail and with great enthusiasm and affection Was the early work and I thought he's telling us without directly telling us He's telling us that that's what he wants the movie to be and so that's what I made the movie be so that we could spend 20 minutes on Nichols in May we could give 18 minutes just to who's afraid of Virginia Wolf we could give 21 minutes to the graduate whatever each I can't remember how it each times out But it's a lot of time on each thing and what I hope will happen for the audience is that Rather than racing through everything and getting no real feeling for anything by the end of this you will come away thinking Wow, that guy is amazing. You know for people who know him. There's It's a it's a reintroduction to the things they may have forgotten I really wanted the film to go ahead work for people who didn't know him You know who so you give them enough time and they think God the Nichols in May stuff is hilarious Or oh my god that scene from Virginia Wolf. That's incredible, right? But you couldn't do that if you had to race through and touch on everything, right? Everybody knows Mike Nichols. They just don't know that they know that they know them They don't know they might not know that they've seen all these movies. Did you know them personally? I had met him a few times through the years here in New York, but I didn't know him You know, we knew enough to say hello But then it was only on this that we spent any real time together. He passed away. I believe in 2015, right? You know, I'm terrible about years, but I think it was actually 2014. I think I Know I'm friendly. It was November of 2014. Okay, cuz what I could be wrong. You know what I'm I'm name-dropping here. I'm friendly with Nathan Lane. I went to see Is it only a play is that the name of the it's only a play it's only a play and Louis CK it's the I never go to Premier's but Louis CK is there and he waves me over at the Premier and I See a beautiful blonde Main of hair and I look over and I go. Oh my god. It's He's talking to Diane Sawyer and Louis goes, I'd like you to meet Diane Sawyer and Mike Nichols. I went. Oh my god It's Mike Nichols and I literally said well, it's nice to meet you and Louis gave the introduction I told them who I was and I said, I don't belong here. I'm gonna walk away now But I got to shake and I remember it got to shake Mike Nichols hand And I remember it was like October of 2014. I Don't remember his dying that year. I remember thinking God I when he died, I thought I did get to shake his hand was it but I guess he died like no I think it really was it was near the end of 2014. Yeah in November. Yeah, and they knew he had been sick, right? I don't I honestly don't know people keep asking me this. I don't blame them. I would do but I don't know the answer he He looked frail well, how did you come about making this documentary? Was he doing interviews? Is no no no no no we he was always a part of this We we all kind of figured it out together and by we all I mean myself Frank rich the writer and producer and Jack O'Brien the theater director who's a great pal Mike and Mike we all met The idea kind of Jack O'Brien Jack O'Brien has something to do with it. It's only a play right? He directed it yeah, okay, and he was an old pal of Mike's and When he heard from Mike that Mike had given up the his plan to do his autobiography Jack was understandably upset. He thought oh my god That's a lot of great stories that are about to not go recorded and somebody should record them. So he mentioned To Alex which older writer who is Frank? Rich's wife. He said oh, I just heard the worst thing from Mike This is so upsetting and Alex told Frank and Frank is very close with the fellas who run HBO Richard Plepler and Michael Bartle Frank rich for those for the people listening to the show Frank riches Nathaniel riches father he is and that's one thing he is and I once stopped him on the street. I won't stop Frank Frank riches Unfortunately, he doesn't write for the New York Times. He's with the new he's with New York Magazine And he runs I believe V bright for a month. I'm on well He was he was for the longest time the theater critic at the times Then he was a an invaluable political past the times the best it was the best I couldn't agree more and he's not only the father of Nathaniel rich. He's the father of Simon rich and Simon rich and he Is a is a producer of VP. Yes. Yes, and our and Everybody should buy Frank riches book on George W. Bush, which I can't remember the greatest something ever sold. I can't oh, yeah Just go ahead anyway Frank You know new Richard Plepler and Mike Lombardo who run HBO and he said hey What do you think about a documentary about Mike and this is the great thing about HBO? They just are if they see it they're like well, they're now they're not like who are you gonna get to be in it? They're like Mike Nichols. That's enough. Yes, and I had done a documentary for them About Jerry Weintraub and oh wow, that was great Thank you, and we'd had a very happy experience with that So I think Richard or Mike suggested it me and Frank and I knew each other the tiniest bit And he loved the idea so he called me and that's how it happened But I'm saying all that by way of saying When the idea was brought to me I heard how it had come about so I always saw the film as a kind of Film diversion of Mike's autobiography. It was a way for him on film to tell the stories that for whatever reason he wasn't gonna write And so that's why it has the sort of intimate personal quality it has I didn't want and Frank agreed with me right from the beginning We didn't want other talking heads in the movie. We didn't want Celebrities and other people telling their Mike Nichols stories I thought we have the real item the real hot item is garrison keeler likes to say on the very home companion We have it. That's Mike Nichols. Let's listen to Mike talk about what he wants to talk about Where did his wisdom come from he went to the University of Chicago, I believe right? He did You know he came from a very smart family, too You know his father was a celebrated very successful doctor German they were German as you mentioned he came from a cultured family Either I think on his mother's side, but it could have been on the father's side But I think on the mother's side his grandmother was the librettist For operas including I think salami I forget which opera it was it's the best known But so he came from intelligent people to begin with and they knew to get out of Germany Yes, they knew to get out of Germany and here's a funny thing about how they got out of Germany in those years I think he came over in 38, but it might have been 39 In those years you couldn't To get into the United States, you know to be admitted legally to the United States in those years because of the depression You had to have an American sponsor who would agree in writing to support you for the rest of your life Should you not find work? Frank's father who I mean Mike's father who was a doctor and a successful person Came first he had someone signed for him. He came first and then he found work and Could then vouch for the family Mike's mother remained behind in Germany for a while She was an invalid but the two boys Mike and his brother were sent over by themselves when they were seven and four on an ocean liner and And it provoked one of the great stories of Mike's life of Mike's life of Mike's life Which was he spoke no English until he got here But he had to learn a sentence of English on the boat because he was so cute people kept coming up to him women on the boat Kept coming up to him and kissing him. So he learned this I speak. I don't speak any English. Please don't kiss me So he got here and you know I think the essential thing in his life happened when he got here, which was that he's seven years old He wants to fit in you know kids want to fit in they don't want to be like Outcasts or anything they want to be just like the other kids but to do that you have to figure out what Ian is what are the other kids like and That's where I think he developed his acute sense of personal observation about people He studied them to figure out why are you funny and why are what makes you smart and what makes you not that funny And you not that smart and I think he carried that skill into his his work as a performer because his work as a performer is very specific and and Certainly into his work as a director and being a director was what he always was meant to be It's what he was always meant to be but I'll tell you this I know many people including my friend Woody Allen who was a very precise and sophisticated sense of what a good actor is and If you talk to Woody about Mike one of the first things he always says is That guy is a great actor and he does not just mean a Sketch comedian though Mike was a brilliant sketch comedian. He means he was a great actor and yet what Mike says in the film Was he had that he certainly had that talent, but he felt that his stronger impulse Was to direct and he was not Elaine may straight man. In other words, he wasn't directing Nichols and may well Yes, no, but part of the reason they broke up is because that impulse was growing in him And he started he tells this in the movie. He started giving her notes and he said that really wasn't Doesn't make for a very happy partnership, you know, they come up together. They're they're great partners. They They're doing everything kind of as a team and then suddenly in the middle of their Broadway run He's passing her backstage and he's like, I thought you were a little slow tonight, right? And I think yeah And didn't she get bored with it was he did well talk about a person, you know, it's hard to be Smarter than Mike Nichols But I think if I was gonna pick anyone who might be able to be able to be counted as smarter than Mike It's Elaine she has a brain of such uncommon quickness, you know, you look at their sketches You're right. He is not the straight man. He is as funny as she is throughout But the level of her comic invention is just breathtaking and she became a director and a writer Yes, indeed and she directed. I think two of the all-time best comedies in the history of Hollywood comedies or American comedies a new leaf and The heartbreak kid, right? Oh, the heartbreak kid. Oh, I could talk about that for six hours. We better move on. Okay, and There was a great article In the New Yorker that I read it must have been 1999 I used to keep it in my desk. I don't know where it is. It's a profile of Mike Nichols He did suffer from Some Worries he worried about money. I remember this. Yes. Yes. I remember this. I haven't read this article in 16 years. He Was convinced all his money was gone and he would well temporarily. He was this wasn't always true That no and then he would go visit his accountant and the accountant say you have X amount of money But then he'd walk out the door and be convinced was down to zero the other thing that I remember from that article And I circled it and I always come back to it. It's a great quote and it's true Never tell anybody in show business what you really Want to do because then they know what to take away from you Well, that's very smart. Do you remember a project green light? Uh-huh. I Only watched the first episode of the first season the first incarnation and there's the poor guy Who's been selected as the project green light director? at a meeting at Miramax and He is talking to the studio executives about the film and he says listen There are a lot of things that can change But I'm telling you the one thing that can't change in this movie is that it has to take place in that period He wanted to make it I forget if it was the 60s or the 50s But he thought it was essential that it happened in that period and I got a sick feeling in my stomach as soon as he Said it because I thought okay. Well if we know anything, it's not going to take place in that period now They are gonna devote themselves to making sure the one thing you want goes away. Why is that? I don't know you can never I don't it's a perverse. It's a perverse business But he's right. And you know, Mike was very shrewd about how he played his cards like Jack Warner Wanted to be his friend when he was making when check Michael was directing who's afraid of Virginia Woolf Jack Warner kept inviting him to the house and Mike wouldn't go And I think Jack Warner wanted it to be in color and Mike Nichols insisted that it be in black and white and threatened That's right Well, the color issue was a defining issue for Mike Warners, I mean Jack Warner was insisting that the movie be in color because at that point in the 60s everything was moving toward color and I think he probably thought you know They used to resist color because it was so expensive But when TV kind of came into prominence and once TV start having color They really couldn't have movies coming out black and white. They felt they were gonna get left behind. So He tells them Warner says, you know, I'm sorry New York wants it to be in color and Mike is very funny on this subject in the movie But he said well, it can't be in color. It has to be in black and white They argue about it a little bit and Warners are like, you know what? I'm sorry. That's what it has to be and Mike said the great discovery one of the great discoveries of his career was right then He said well, all right, if you want it to be in color you make it. I like it at home I'll go home and all of a sudden Jack Warner who was nobody's pushover said all right black and white and Mike said he realized right then A what his power was, you know that he had a certain amount of power by Threatening to to leave and he said you kind of that's the way the old guard was you just kind of went ahead and did it The way you needed to do it That's not to say people didn't try to change his mind his DP try to change his mind. I'm sorry the old guard respected somebody who Well, they allowed it. They per they grudgingly Respected it because they felt well. He's willing to stand up for for what he believes Did they take away? They were always willing to pounce if it if it if it didn't work Did he lose final cut on who's afraid of Virginia Woolf? Did he get fired at the very end? I don't think so. I mean, he doesn't talk about it. I'm you know, I'm I Don't think so. I think on who's afraid of Virginia Woolf. He finished principal photography He did like the first edit and then when it came time for the final mix Warner Let him go and then he discovered well, that's the way it works. You get fired and I think he came back I don't but to be honest, I don't remember. I think that's it. Yeah, I think I read somewhere I can't remember. I think what happened was He got fired and then was told. Oh, that's the way the old guard works You get fired from your own movie. You still get to be called the director But now Jack Warner is going to do the final cut and then either the sound editor or the editor would call him on the phone and run the the mix for him I And then I think Mike Nichols said I can't work this way and he called Jack Warner and said I'll Give up something. I'll give you all the money I'll give you all the money if it's not. Oh, I know what happened He was friendly with Jackie on asses Yeah, and they were worried that The oh, yeah that the Catholic League of D's at sea or something. Yes that they weren't going to approve of who's afraid of Virginia Wolf, he said I promise you when you screen it for the rabbis and the priests and the Cardinals and the popes Jackie on asses will sit there and give it her blessing if you give me the final cut and Jackie on asses came and Gave the film her blessing Right that that sounds familiar. Yeah, that that you know that sounds Not only familiar, but correct Very good story. We don't have it in the movie. I wish it was in the movie Very quickly you've been very generous with your time. I can't wait to see this movie I mean Mike there. I mean angels in America If you don't know who Mike Nichols is and believe it or not Well, you know, it's understandable people wouldn't know who Mike Nichols is you've just seen every one of his films Yeah, I mean people don't read credits. So there's right Jerry wine trout passed away. I believe around the same time. Yes There is somebody who Got exactly what he wanted in life is one of the things he got was Two women two wives or two women who love my two wives, but a but a wife and a girlfriend At the same time. Is that For a middle-aged man Working in show. Is that possible or is that what they just saying that for the movie? No, no, no, it's possible. I'll tell you what Jerry said because Once was talking to a teamster who had seen my documentary and said got the most amazing thing about him He has a wife and a girlfriend So I called Jerry and I told him that and he said give me the guy's number. I'll call him So he called the teamster and he said I understand you want to know how you get a wife and a girlfriend Is that right? Do you want to know that and the guy said, well, yeah, he says, all right Here's how you do it. The first thing you need is several hundred million So That's your first step Wow, that's a credit It was such a great guy. I really miss him He who was Jerry? What was he to explain because people haven't seen the movies I didn't know he was until I saw your documentary always rolling over in his grave if he could hear you say this he believed everyone knew him and He Jerry Wendrum was an absolutely sensational music promoter Who became an absolutely sensational? Movie producer But really his greatest product and he made many wonderful movies and promoted a lot of great music But his his greatest product was himself. He just sold Jerry wine trough above everything. I Knew no one I have never known anyone like him He was really a joy to know and to be friends with and Boy was that a blow. I tell you every day. I Miss I miss him because you know, we didn't speak every day, but we spoke a lot and Now when my phone rings, I have that thing of looking at it and thinking, huh It won't be Jerry These guys get do they get everything they want somebody like Mike Nichols. I mean Mike Nichols. I Don't think of him as for example a screenwriter Right, right. He wasn't so he wasn't getting up every morning compelled to put something down on paper even though He was a brilliant comedian No one gets everything they want. I mean, don't you think I mean, you know, what do you Alan? You know, you think they get everything they want it seems like they get everything they want But when you dig right down into it, there's always a rosebud somewhere. I'm not saying people aren't happy You you and I'm not saying Mary and Davis. Wait, wait, Mary and Davis is clitoris. What does that have to do with? That's land. Oh, yeah, you know, there's Jesus the sled, you know, there's always That Mary and Davies clitoris though Well, that is a rumor I can't speak to it personally thankfully, but that's the rumor Well, but when he Alan I'm not talking about personal life, but I'm talking about just in terms of a career Woody Allen gets everything he wants Larry David gets everything he wants. Oh, well, maybe I'm misunderstanding what you're saying In your career, I mean they get they get they can do the work they want if that's what you mean Yeah, but then having been friends with Woody for years. I know that he's plagued by Even though he works all the time. He's always plagued by feeling he didn't get it right But it could have been better that it, you know Maybe next time it it might be better, but very likely it won't meaning this is him not me He feels there of all the films he's made I forget what the numbers up to but you know He thinks out of the 40 some films. He's made only six five six seven Came out the way he wanted He's not saying that the others are necessarily bad. What he's saying is that they whatever They turned into they weren't what he wanted at the beginning that wonderful moment where you think I know I have a great idea this would be a great movie and And then like any hall famously which obviously people love is not what he's favorite because he doesn't dislike it But he just thought originally he had such an idea that it was going to be this thing And for all kinds of reasons it turned into this thing and in his head when everybody thinks about it He just thinks yeah, but it's not that thing, you know the thing I first tried to get and You're friendly with Woody Allen. Are you able to? Talk to him without constantly thinking oh my god. I'm Talking to Woody Allen. No, I'm not I've been friends with him for 20 years 20 years easily and how did you meet him? I met him through My I mean I met him a few times in other circumstances But I really met him through my wife Jane who had worked for him for many years Although when we started dating she'd stopped or she wasn't still working for him But she had remained a very close friend of his and so I started being included when they would go to dinner so becoming Mike Nichols Monday night on HBO and the Jerry Wontraub documentary what other films have you made? Well, I've I would he and I wrote bullets over Broadway together. Oh my god Though he really wrote it, but I was very pleasantly encouraging throughout I wrote and directed Emma Nicholas Nicolby infamous And his way that Jerry directed Nicholas Nicolby. I did on Broadway No film. Oh, okay, because the Broadway play is still going the Wasn't that like the three-day? Marathon it was well, you could see it over two days or you could see it all in one day and uh-huh There is never I'm telling you it was one of most thrilling theatrical experiences I've ever had seeing that play. Yeah, it was just Fantastic Oh, so go on. Let me hear the other sore listeners. No, that's it. That's all That's it and what are you working on next? I'm working on a new screenplay Slowly slowly making my way through the fog. Okay, and did you work on the Broadway play bullets over Broadway? I didn't I was just what he did it himself. I was just a friend of the courts so to speak I came and saw how wonderfully he and Stro Susan Strowman had had done it. What what is I you've been very generous with your time But what what is it? What is it like to write with Woody Allen? We always think of Marshall Brickman Right sitting with him What what what is the process the thing that was so great about working with Woody is that he did not at any point though, he could have at every point Lord over me his Vast artistic and intellectual superiority. I was so impressed by how He really you know the only point of a collaborators to get us another point of view so he was always genuinely curious that I Share my point of view that I'd be honest with him if I thought an idea wasn't good. I learned so much from him to about How much he respected the audience in terms of you know, studio executives tend to be afraid of the audience They're always like oh you can't mention you Gino Neal the audience won't know that Woody doesn't care about that But he what he does care about is that the audience is engaged and he's always talking about well if we do this scene It's kind of repeating what we did earlier The audience will get bored. They're not we don't want that he's very alert to Making sure that at all times, you know, the story was moving forward And I was so impressed with his kind of ruthlessness in cutting, you know and making sure that it wasn't Repetitive or or too long because he talked a lot about how he felt each idea had a certain amount of time an audience would sit for that idea You know Rick Santorum the senator who just went to Hollywood and became a motion picture executive for some Christian organization and I never Understood why he thought he could make movies because the key to success in movies is killing your babies and What did you learn From making this documentary about Mike Nichols, how did you become a better director? Listening to Mike Nichols. I'll tell you the story. He told that really impressed me Unless I've already told you this I hope I'm already told you this about the country girl. No he directed a Broadway production of the country girl in The early 2000s so late in his life and late in his career. He had one. I forgot nine Tonys or four Emmys the Oscar, you know, what? a Giant in the business and for whatever reason that production didn't work. It was pretty widely panned and Mike said that when he you know the reviews came out. They were pretty devastating The business wasn't good and when the show closed That day he came home and he took out a yellow pad and he wrote like eight pages of notes About what he felt he'd done wrong. I Was so impressed with that story because he could easily have just been resting on his laurels at that point He could have thought oh that's stupid critic what does he know? He could have blamed somebody else He could have put it on the cast whatever it was he could have found a way not to face it and If you have a career that lasts as long as his and you have the success He has you have to face it whatever it is good or bad. You have to face it so you don't keep making Mm-hmm that mistake and I was particularly impressed with it because of his age at the time It's one thing to do that when you're 22. It's another thing to do it when you've had every award in the world and you're In your 70s, right? What is the what is the secret to longevity because I know that Mike Nichols Are you there? Yeah, I'm here He was not a fascist. He didn't believe in the auteur theory He didn't like the this Andrew Saras the film critic for the village voice had this idea that every movie you see is Has to be filtered through the zeitgeist of the director You don't understand a movie unless you understand the director and he maintained that wasn't true that it was a purely Collaborative effort is that the secret to longevity does somebody even like Woody Allen who is I think is the ultimate Autour if such a thing exists it does even Woody Allen think that it's all collaborative Well, I can't speak for Woody, but I Think there it's an interest the Saras theory is a very interesting theory and I think like many things sometimes It's true and sometimes it isn't and Woody is definitely an auteur and you're when you see a Woody Allen film. It is entirely filtered through his sensibility, but that's because Not only did he direct it he wrote it and he is a very Active director in terms of every aspect of the film. So what you're seeing is the full expression of his taste and intelligence, but you know when you're directing somebody else's script and if you're Often directing different people scripts all the time I'm not sure that person is an auteur in the in the way Saras means me meaning Then what Mike says is right Because the director is taking that it is passing that script is passing through the director's Filter so to speak But it was still the author some other person authored that script and wrote those lines. So To me the author theory gets a little wobbly there One could even suggest that the producer in some situations could be the author because it because it becomes a reflection of your taste Less than your Your actual work, right? So what well, okay, go ahead. Go ahead. No, I was just gonna say they're very very very few producers Really, I can think of David Osel's Nick, but almost no one else who in any positive way could be considered The auteur of the Harvey Weinstein. Oh, no, no, no No, because he recuts things if he But then he when you're recutting someone else's work or when you're making another person recut his or her own work That's not auteurism. That's sort of a kind of tyranny, but it's not there's nothing artistic about it right, what is this so in terms of log just in terms of all your friends and What do you think is the secrets of longevity? Do these good? Do these guys worry about their next job or Do they when I think the secret to longevity I think is They're always looking forward. They're always going forward they All of them everybody has flops and hits well not everybody has hits But everybody has you know, the most successful director in the world Steven Spielberg There are there are flops on his resume. There are movies that didn't make their money back Or there are movies that didn't get well reviewed. He never stops working all of them the people that really last just keep working and I remember a wonderful thing. I read that Nora Efron said she said, you know I get so tired of my friends who are screenwriters who complain that they they're not getting their screenplay made They're not getting their screenplay made She said so I always think so write another screenplay You know, you you have to be so careful not to get caught up in something if it didn't work Because sometimes something doesn't work at the time and then it's later judged to be wonderful The key is keep writing keep directing keep keep turning out Whatever it is you want to say you have to keep going last question nor Efron Woody Allen Mike Nichols did they fight with people these are these are people who have a storied career These are people who just kept working. Do they fight with people? What do you mean on the scepter in yeah? Yeah, well in business Are the do they are these the kind of people who held grudges and said I'm not gonna work with this person Or you say they move forward and they don't look back Well, I didn't know Nora well enough. I knew Nora just the tiniest bit You know Mike in my film talks about how sometimes He didn't get along with the crew or sometimes he and his DP would squabble But you know say you have to if you're a filmmaker your only job really is to make sure you get the film you see in your head on the screen and Sometimes you have a crew and a cast That are united in their support of that goal and sometimes for whatever reason you get a DP who has a different idea or an actress who thinks she has a better idea, you know, you just get people who have their own ideas and Then you're confronted with how you deal with that and sometimes You have to fight sometimes you have to fire that person, you know, they're all different ways around it but the ultimate thing you have to do is make sure that Your vision of what the material is gets on that screen and sometimes that means Fighting with someone and sometimes it means Letting someone go that's tough, but in the end as Woody always says What's the point that you know all that lasts all that remains is the film itself the arguments on the set That all goes away all people have at the end of it is the film So you have to do everything you can to make that Great fantastic Doug McGrath is the director of becoming Mike Nichols and premieres Monday night on HBO. Thank you so much for doing this. I know you've got a lot of interviews to do Thank you. It was a pleasure talking with you. Thank you, too. Okay. Thank you, Doug. All right. Bye. Bye