 So why property? That's because it's the only asset class that will give you all of this before you buy Good evening and welcome back to the first time home by a show as you know I'm your host SD class and and tonight I'm sitting with an absolutely amazing guest But before we get there you know that we have amazing content coming to you live every night this week So I'm in Tungua, Kumalo with the private property podcast and the guest we have tonight is no stranger to that as well And of course every Tuesday and Thursday night That's Mbali an award-winning farmer that podcast is amazing for you If you're looking to invest in land farming if that's your goal definitely tune into that and every Monday and Friday night We travel South Africa with Chad Viveros our host from the home shopper show Are you looking to invest in amazing townhouses mansions across Brixton all the way to Camps Bay? Well, be sure to check into that show every Monday and Friday at 8 p.m. And without further ado I'm sitting with the absolutely amazing Ebo quack rain, correct? That's correct I got that right for the first time since being up, but yeah, I'm sitting with the absolutely amazing Ebo He's titled what he carries what he does is a mouthful So I'm gonna hand it over to Ebo to explain but before we get there. This is a man that I've been I've been surrounded by his Presence from a few weeks back till today and I feel just being in his presence every day you learning so much more Every single day that's pressure. Yes, Ebo. Lots of pressure And I just I thought that you know, it's a perfect opportunity to share this Education and the knowledge that this man carries with all of you at home. So without further ado Ebo quack rain Good evening. Good evening, Estie. And thank you so so much for the opportunity to be here. Thank you so much You know When we first met you were like you spoke to my brother and the show was so amazing. When is my turn? I hope he does it. Yeah, that's it And so if you you know Ebo obviously has a brother doing very similar things they both man of Men of power. We hungry. We hungry for success We've come from a family that has taught us that you know where you start does not really determine where you end up And also every gift that you've given is not really your gift But it's an opportunity for you to basically expand on because there's so many other people that need to benefit from your presence in this world 100% and with that being said Ebo today is youth day. Yes, right and if we look back, you know back to Sophia town what happened, you know, the youth overcoming oppression and Overcoming and I feel like this is something that today as someone who can vouch and confidently speak about it It's something that we're still overcoming. Yep, right and for you to say, you know that Sharing success and sharing these moments is something that I think at a young age. We need to already start thinking about And just even before we start and just dive deep into it. How are you actually sharing your success? So at properties that come what we've always done is to make sure that we surround ourselves with the youth, right? So as a 100% black youth owned and managed company having youth around as is one of the reasons That we grow in so well Because yeah, hmm and on the on the note of youth What are the first three things that come to mind when you hear youth? CDE So basically it's curiosity as dynamism and its energy everything that you're doing, you know, it's somebody There's this thing about curious to kill the cat Yeah And if you've read my post in the recent weeks, you'd have heard me put out that curiosity did not kill the cat Actually the cat died because it was ignorant. You need to learn always you need to always ask questions because the more questions You're asking the more your mind opens exactly. That's that dynamism The mere effect of being youth is that you are allowed to make mistakes. You're allowed to change. You're allowed to discover yourself There's no pressure to be anything, right? So you need to be dynamic in every approach and everything that you're doing and the last part of course energy Energy wants every single day if you're doing something, you know passionate about it You're going to be flat and if you flat what's going to happen is that? People will pick it up and then you become that lukewarm person that everyone spits out and you don't want to be that person So it's curiosity dynamism and energy nice and you speak about energy and I feel like You know today you still need to carry that energy and just to the viewers You weren't here before the show started if I was playing, you know some some some tracks in the background And I asked him why and one of the reasons was you know, this is your You'll hide you up. You'll pick me up songs and and I think that as the youth We need to figure out what it is for us that yes, of course we have our down moments Of course, we might not always be so energetic, but figure out what it is for you that is your pick me up moment So that's my question to you viewers at home tonight What is it that you can use as a mechanism that picks you up when you're feeling a little bit down? And I'm sure about you sometimes do not always have that energy of course, of course So the trick in life is that you need to know your abilities, right? And you also need to understand yourself, you know, we put too much pressure on ourselves as human beings. I Remember when I was sitting back in the days when I used to take the metro buses, right? I would sit on the top floor always and I would insist to sit on the top floor and Because you get to see the city right and when you look at it you get to dream and I had this dream of being on Forbes magazine, you know that song I want to be a million. Yeah For real that song is stacking my head from that time till now. Yeah And there's this pressure you want to be on Forbes magazine, which is not a bad dream You shouldn't have it however in having these pressures is being able to allow yourself to make mistakes and Acknowledge those mistakes and say I fell here. I can rise again I made that because I did that so I can change that because I you know The human journey is fluid and you need to allow yourself to To feel it and to know yourself and to be better at it and when you flat like always happens You saw me pick up my pick me up song you need certain things when I was in sales. It was my perfume There's it's just a trigger you about to click that deal to spray something and you Automatically you zoned in the pen that you hold in your hand before you hand over to the client and say please sign on this Daughter line because I'm making a hundred thousand is those little things Is right you call it rituals if you would yeah, but you need those things because they Research your mind and get you to grow further definitely rituals I like I like that because I have similar rituals that I use You know in my spare time whether it is that you're moving into a new home What is the ritual that you do around this home whether you know burning sage get out of rid of that negative And whatever it may be and I think it's so important to to to have these things because it does kind of have you It allows you to reset when anything happens, right? And then my next question to you we just spoke about youth the three things, you know energy Curiosity Dynamism and energy and you said you spoke in you you you remember things and using the alphabet yeah Yeah, oh, that's one thing you'll find from most of my conversations. I always think in alphabet. I Always ask myself this question. Why is it that and you know when you like four or five you start reciting the alphabet, right? Why is it that we do that? it's actually a way of Getting the mind to program things in the chronological order. Yeah, so I've always whenever I need to bring up concept that out That would burn within me. I put it in yeah, that's amazing smart move. I mean I might use that We talk about youth and the first thing that came to mind as you mentioned and then I wanted to know what you think about What what comes to mind when I say youth in property youth and property? So for youth and property It is endless possibility Because think of it this way you have come in into this world With no precious right And even if there is precious, you know, because I must be honest. We've got black text at home 100% Thank God my family's never burdened us with that. Okay honest. Yeah, my mom and dad They've always said we are giving you the best so that you can be your own right and they've never burdened us So that's one thing I'm very very grateful for but We do have endless possibility whether we are burdened at home or not because you are a canvas and you determine What you want to paint when you're six feet under because when people are looking at that painting and they paint in you Everything that you have been is what will be on that canvas and there's the endless possibility you have so it's up to you to say Up to what limit is my possibility exactly? Yeah, it's endless the possibilities are endless and you you said something earlier that And I solely believe in this that before I reach the age of 30 I can make as many mistakes as I want to right now and I should be making those mistakes You know whether it's whatever may be of course I I mean as SD I overthink everything and I'm like no I need to do it this way that way But I'm just like if it goes wrong It's okay, and it took me years to get to that point where I could be okay with my flaws and Mistakes that I make and I think that that's something we need to take very true And also just leveraging others. So one other thing is it's not every mistake you have to make. Yeah I mean my mentors when I started out were telling me about how they slept in your cars How they've had ten marriages and all of these little things and I made a Decision that I actually don't want ten marriages I want that girlfriend that I had in high school to be the person that I'm going to basically die with And that's my wife by the way we've been together since my trick So you don't have to make the mistakes that other people make you can learn from their mistakes and do better Same thing with property you can if there's things that's running through your head and like can I make this mistake? Will I make this mistake? Feel free to contact a mentor if you have one if you don't my office is always open Hit me up on social media wherever you would and I'm willing to share I mean, we've done some bad deals Very very bad deals, right? But then trick of these is with the moment you realize this deal is bad Get out of it. So you find along the way that I always have an exit strategy to every single deal I'm making nice. It's if it goes bad in one month. I'm out Yeah, let's talk about that because as we mentioned before the show is for educational purposes and sharing knowledge Imparting knowledge on the youth specifically today and you talk about you've made many mistakes And if you could just share one mistake, right? Because the point is for us not to make the same mistakes so let's just share one mistake and What was your exit strategy for that particular mistake? You know, what's funny the one mistake I'm going to share with you is actually the mistake that helped us build properties.com. Wow, so We entrust everything of ourselves to the people that surround us And we sometimes then feel that they are too knowledgeable To lead us wrong Sometimes the things you need to do is actually educate yourself a little bit. So this was in 2010 I was doing very well in my banking career and we decided, oh great Let's just hand all these properties that we've bought to this certain agent to manage them for us And in the process we went to sleep. I totally went to sleep. I never checked the bank statement I never checked whose tenant is paying me. I never followed up It took me about six months when I really really needed something and I checked this and I realized wait a minute This tenant has not paid me for the last three months What's my agent doing about it? And then confronting the agent and the agent went I don't know and I said are you for real? Okay, give me my keys. I'm going to do it myself And that's how I became an estate agent from the very beginning and we set a rule at properties.com There will be no agent that will owe us more than a month's rental One month's rental not paid you out and we have our strategy in place to actually ensure that our clients always get their rental all the time Oh, wow, because So, you know you started properties.com, but just before that at the age of 29 if I'm not mistaken You did something Absolutely, I mean out of this world and Because I'm that age now, and I'm just like, okay Why can't I just so ever retired right at that age and what was your which spoke about exit strategy? But like yeah, what was your exit strategy retiring at the age of 20 30 30? So it all started with can I share this? Yes, please 2009 December the 22nd I'm sitting having a conversation with my banker and then I say to her you know what we need to really start buying property I've learned enough. I really want to go all out. How much do I qualify for and she goes on the system? Da-da-da-da-da-da and she comes back and she's like hey able for 775,000 you could go out shopping said, okay, thanks Then it took us about a month later and we went shopping for a million rent of property Now what that did when people go wide you go They gave you 775 and you go and shop for a million because I could and you must because you must negotiate, right? I sat down and I said how much money do I need on a monthly basis to be able to survive? And I found these two properties was funny enough Together when the tenants pay would have paid me exactly how much money I needed to be able to not push for bigger deals in the bank But to become a person And it's weird, but just Calming down and knowing that I'm not chasing the next big deal But I'm rather going to be in touch with my client made me the next year there after the best financial advisor in standard bank at the time So it's yeah things work out that way now fast forward to 2013 and I'm retiring There's a trick we all as financial advisors ask you guys this question. Yeah when you turn 65 What's the life you want to live and then you tell us the whole life and we paint it down and we say start saving 10,000 in a month and you go what? No, and then you walk away. So having done that so many times I started asking why should I wait till 65? Yeah, I've got these properties. They do pay me what I want. Yeah, so what is the life? I want to live and I wanted to live a life of meaning and purpose. What does that mean? It means that every single thing that I'm doing I must know that I'm happy with it I must know that it is leading me towards that bigger goal of the people around me being more successful Where people you know when they call your name when you six feet under and I refer to this a lot But for me, it's all about when you are no more. What do people say about you? Right? What have you lived here when you're gone? What are they saying? You know, and I love that and we talk about imparting knowledge and imparting Yeah, what we've learned on others, right? And I feel like you know again in the spirit of youth day and in the spirit of us trying to educate people I'm sure there are youth out there who are wanting to retire Yeah, and you've used property to do that, right? And I think that there's a way that we all can get into and that's one of my questions, right? And you even asked me just before the show is like what was my question? Why invest in property? And you were like, why don't you even ask me that? Like, that's a stupid question, of course, but ever why? So why, why, why property as an investment? Can I teach you? Yes, so this is what we're going to do ever is going to actually this, like I said, this platform educational It's time for us to learn. So let's take it back to the classroom, sit down, relax and let's head on over to the board So you were asking why property? So this is something that we were taught when I started out in financial planning, right? So rule number one in investment management is we are given the asset classes, right? And it started off basically saying cash, then it goes to bonds. So basically somebody is lending you money based on interest rate, then it's property. So let's build the house with the foundations and then basically we say business slash stock. Then if depending on who you are, you go on to the next part, which is the derivatives, where now we have your bitcoins and your cryptocurrencies and your futures and everything all here. And we always told our clients as you go down this curve, the risk gets lesser and lesser. Well, sorry, as you come this side, the risk is less, but the returns are higher. And as you go this way, higher returns, lower, higher risk. Now you're asking why property, because actually when you start off, you want a foundation, yes? Property is actually the only asset vehicle that number one, a bank will give you money for to go and do. If you say you start in a business, they tell you go stuff off. So we've always said real estate is ideal because from your property, you get income. As it depreciates, you still earn money. You are able to build in your equity. It appreciates in value. And you are always able to leverage as you do in here, you grow up. So why property? That's because it's the only asset class that will give you all of this before you buy. Without putting in money, you already know, will I make an income? Will it be higher? OK, yes, no. If the answer is no, I'll walk away from the deal. OK, the property is depleted. It looks ugly. Will I be able to fix it and be able to build in equity? Yes. Or it looks great. If I, you know the story of Harlem, how Harlem was ran down. Yeah. And now Brooklyn is what one of the most expensive cities in New York. Why do you think that happened? Because you run it down, you can able you pick up equity and you make money. So that's why property and not any asset class as a start. You, of course, grow and you should have a little bit of something in your portfolio. So let's talk a little bit more about how we can make this happen. How do we? What is their formula to this? So the next question you were asking me was what were my assumptions before I actually got into the property game? Funny enough, it is the same graph because, you know, in investment management 101, you thought, oh, by the way, so you probably know that by now that I did major in investment management as a as as one of my courses. So you always believe that what they teach in those books is as the Bible, you know, so I thought, OK, let me get a bit of cash. Then let me basically participate in the RSA retail bonds and stuff. And then I can get interest. Then I'll go into my property. And my assumption was when it comes to property, because it is the third asset class from here, it actually has higher risks and a little bit of return. That was my assumption. However, as I've grown in the property game, I've realized that property actually comes here. It is the lowest asset class in terms of risk than anything else. Because you don't need to go back too long to realize that African Bank went bust when 2009. Yeah. And now 2013 to 2019 for Ubusani and them to build it back up. What took them down? It was the money market, right? So everybody that was investing here thinking that, oh, I've invested money in money markets, it will never ever crash. They felt the risk. So there's risk there because you're not in control. What you're not in control of is actually more riskier than what you're in control of. Property, you are in control of it from the very beginning. You bought the property, you have the tenant. And if you don't have the acumen to manage the tenant, you've got us. That's why it's teamwork and makes a dream work. So yeah, so that was my assumption that property is a little bit riskier. But as we've aged, we've realized that property is actually the foundation of all of these things. So in other words, it should actually be here in your portfolio. So you build everything else on top of property. That's why we've built properties that come on top of property. Right. Now is the business section. So I just want to quote something that Evo says, because as he said before this, I dived into his DMs and I literally deciphered his entire LinkedIn profile. And that's how I do my research, right? You said you've mastered the art of successful real estate investing. And so, Evo, I'd like to, you know, find out what is the art of successful real estate investing? You know what, I'm really grateful that you did this work because there comes a time where you have to break things down into the most core so that it gets embedded in your DNA. Come I show you on the board how this really looks like. All right. I don't know if you've read the book by P.T. Berman, the art of getting rich. But when I read the book and this was sometime back in 2008 as well, I realized, gee, everything in this world is actually a science. And if you really, really take time to know what to do, you can duplicate it. So what is the art of real estate investing? Number one, I think we shared this in the other question about having ideal in the foreground of your mind always, right? So I need income. I need depreciation and equity. I need appreciation and then I need to leverage. So let's start. What is the art? The first part is knowing what you want. OK, do I want income or do I want capital? What am I going to do with it? So the first part is therefore then having that goal. What am I going to get out of this? The second part is I want to have as much education as possible to say, wait a minute, depreciation. How do I get depreciation? My education tells me that as a property investor, everything that I do to produce income, I can claim back from SARS, right, because it's a tax deductible expense. So when I go and I hire a real estate agent to manage my property, I'm not losing because SARS will have to pay that portion that I give to properties.com when I take it out from the income that I've received. So now I pay less tax. So it's the education. The third part is the and I wouldn't say it's the biggest, but it's very, very important and that is strategy. If you don't have a strategy, what type of properties do I buy? Am I buying to flip? Am I buying to or am I renting to rent? Am I am am I doing what we we now do at properties.com? That is we take in your property, we manage it, and then we able to get our service fee from it so that you can benefit longer. Am I trading in that game? Because maybe I have a terrible credit record. I have a terrible credit record. You know, everybody says when you invest in property, you must have a great credit record. No, you don't need that to start investing in property. Let me bust that bubble for you right here. You don't need that. And you you joined us when two years ago, you just turned 21, by the way, last year. Now, she's already in real estate. She never sent to start off with, but she leveraged other people's skills, other people's assets. Did she need a good credit record for that? No. She just needed the hunger to go to someone and say, I am ABCD and I want to help manage your property. I have a good mentor who is going to make sure that I give you the service you need. That's all you need. So let's not go too far. Have a goal, have education and have a strategy. But very important, have a team. Get people to support you. Get people to do the work that you cannot do. Leverage, leverage, leverage. This is the hidden secret of success in property. Leverage, leverage, leverage. And you can always leverage through a team. That's it. Eva, you talk a lot about leveraging and I feel like that is the secret ingredient. If you had to write a book, right? And the secret ingredient was leveraging. Actually, let's double tap on that, right? If you had to write a book. Yeah. But everything you've achieved and accomplished thus far, what would your title be? You just gave me the title. The Art of the Leverage. That is actually, yeah. The Art of the Leverage. Yeah. You should charge royalties for this. I really should. I'm actually going to... And you at home, you don't steal this book. Actually, I'm going to ISBN now. You have to. I'm registered. You have to actually start writing. I can do this. The Art of the Leverage. And then how would it end? How would it end? It would end with how we ended up taking a generation of people that believed in themselves but did not really know the possibility at the end. And now they all grew from not just thinking, hey, I'm black. I come from a very bad home. My mother didn't have money. My dad didn't have money. So therefore I went to go and take a job and blah, blah, blah. No, it would be this group of people who decided to take fate into their own hands, went into real estate and accumulated massive wealth that would provide for them three generations beyond. Because it's all about what you leave behind when you're six feet under. And I already gave you the title for your book, right? But I want to add a little something. I feel like let me help you. Let's go. You just spoke about how, you know, just because we are people of Kali in South Africa and we come with black tax, we come with poverty, we come with this mindset, but it's about breaking the narrative, changing. Changing the narrative, right? And breaking the barriers that have been put out. I feel like it's so difficult for us to shift because whether it is example, right? Let me use myself as an example, right? You move from, let's say, you grew up in the hood, right? The Kasi and you move from there and you're like, OK, now I live in the burbs, but I'm still paying my own rent, but I still have black tax. And I still have to do all these things. And but at the end of the day, you still have to go back home, right? And it's not it's not to say, I don't want to say that you need to act or mighty because I think that humility is very important. It's to know where you came from. Yeah. Know what your goal is, what you're trying to do. And then just keep manifesting that, right? And I do believe that that for me, I mean, changing the narrative does not have to be that you need to go out there and be an activist. Changing the narrative can be within as well. Certainly, certainly. I don't know if you have ever had this conversation with my brother about where our family really began. But if you've had that conversation with him and anyone in my family, you'd find that we hold my grandmother, who is literally the maitreque of our family. We hold in the highest regard, right? Because here was an uneducated lady who was actually in our view and in my eyes, a symbol of how entrepreneurship is supposed to be because she would go deep into the farms. And initially, she used to sell pepper, tomatoes, onions and everything. And then she realized, but wait, everybody brings the same goods to the market. So why don't I specialize? But I'm going to specialize and still not leave these guys behind. So she'll still go and collect and then come and give them the peppers and all of that. So basically, she moved on to become the whole sailor for the other people. But then she would keep a certain fruit for herself. It should be the only one in the market with it. So people come to her, she sells off her waste and she would always refer them. You want pepper? Go to that lady. She's the best at it. She's got the best. Go to that one. Go to that. Because we seem to think that entrepreneurship is all about me, me, me. No, it's not. It's an ecosystem. It is being able to understand that I'm good at this or I have this that makes me unique, but I can facilitate for other people. And that's how it is in the in the community. So you've made it. Don't be all high and mighty. Be here. Yeah. And that's why I didn't stop you because, yes, your brother told us. Echo told us the story. But I didn't stop you because the show is about sharing stories and you're telling it in a very different way. And that's what I wanted to get across. And I think what you just said about, you know, how your grandmother, it's an ecosystem. One of your pinnacle points when you were teaching us a little earlier, when you showed us was the last point was team. And power team. We always have this chat, the power team, who is your team, whether it's your mentor, who is even just and I hate saying that this person is below you because I believe when I work with people, we're all colleagues and we're all on the same level. Yeah. So also, there's this notion of team that the people have to be working for you or working with you all the time. No, they don't. So you find that in my sphere, I have people that I just rely on for just like you call it accountability partners. I just bounce things off them. Hey, I'm going to do ABCD this time. Can you can you check in with me and hold me accountable? Then there are those that you know. OK, I am going to let's look at sectional title schemes. When we decided we're moving into the sectional schemes industry, right? You now go, who is the best at it? Or who has been doing this the longest? So we realized Professor Graham Paddox is actually the author of all of these. Who do we have in our network that can get us to him? Because you always want to go closest to the source. Of course. Yeah. So that now is the people in our team. So if I need anything and I feel like you bounce it off the best and you come back and you know that you are right. And I think that's also one way to figure out if your team is for you at the end of the day, because you can have a team that is totally against you. That doesn't want to. No, then you don't have a team. But I think that we especially again, youth, we mistake that we have these, you know, circles, friends, whatever it may be. If you can't hold me accountable, if you can't call me out on my actions or if I'm doing something wrong, whatever the case may be, you're not you're not there for me. The UCL just happened, right? And I remember posting that I wish Pep wins. But then at the same time, I was torn because I wanted Chelsea to win. Now, here's a person that is supporting both teams at the same time. And yet I'm part of the team of both of them, right? When it comes to teamwork, you would have realized that all those people and when Pep lost, what happened? The people called him out. They said, you selected the wrong team to start off with. Being the great leader that he is, he went, maybe I shouldn't have. But it's the best I thought at the time. So it's also being able to know that your team can give you feedback. And if you're confident about the decisions you made, you hold yourself up to it. Yeah, unfortunately, that's all we have time for this evening. But this is not the end. The best is yet to come next week, Wednesday, part two still sitting with Ebo, having these amazing chats. Again, this is dedicated to the youth, but do trust me, everyone. There is something for everyone to learn on the show. So that's next week, part two. Tune in again, 8 p.m. on Facebook, Instagram and YouTube. We'll see you there. Take care and stay warm.