 We're glad to know you're still there. It's still the breakfast on Plus TV Africa and we're looking at what is happening in River State. Remember that yesterday we had the president of Nigeria, Al-Haji, or Ashwaju, Bola Ahmed Tinubu, holding a peace meeting, as it were, with the stakeholders in the River State, including the former governor, Yesom Wike, and the current governor, Simphu Bahra, and we saw some agreements that were reached. Anyway, we have, as our guest this morning, Gotswil Jumbo, former reverse chief secretary to a deputy governor, and he is a publisher. Would like to just describe him as a publisher this morning. Good morning, Gotswil, and welcome to the program. Yes, good morning. My pleasure to be here with you again. Okay, the guest we just had before you came on, not immediately before you came on, but on the off-the-press side, the reverse is now having, at once in one, at once in two, and all that. It's been a drama in River State. So, we're not going to ask of the updates, because we already know what the agreements that were reached were. We want to find out the reaction of the Sim camp, as it were, because these agreements were mostly in favor of the Wike camp. All matters instituted in the courts by the governor of River State should be withdrawn. All impeachment proceedings, that's the only one for Sim, should be withdrawn. The leadership of the River State House of Assembly, as led by Right Honorable Martin Amaule, shall be recognized, and so on and so forth. I've seen the, like, seven-point agenda or the eight-point agenda of that meeting, and we're asking how is the other camp taking it? Okay, and first of all, let me make it clear that the government being referenced, and so far it's only TVC that has referenced that document. Media houses have a role to play in mainstreaming and, probably, you know, streamlining public information. It is our duty as media personalities, media organizations, to make sure that the authenticity of the information put out in the public is consolidated, is verified and all of that. That document, you know, has already been flagged as suspects, and so far it's only TVC that has put out the contents of that document in the public. The signatures appear to have been written by the same hand, the same style of writing. You can check them. There are people who are based in checking out handwriting, and when you check all the signatures, they have a common stretch, a common corollary running across them, and then a meeting of certain nature as critical as important as it is to the policy, the political space in river states. None of the people who attended the meeting have spoken to the press, which is strange. If you meet yourself with the president, you always find one or two persons from that meeting briefing in state house press on the outcome of such a meeting, and we cannot take things for granted in this case. And then early this morning, we heard from the young man Kalama, the spokesperson of Edison LA, you know, that the document is not authentic, that he's excellent, Dr. Peter Houghton, and he's excellent speaker now, Singh Phubara did not sign that document. And then if you also look at the resolutions, the promoted resolutions, they are all written on one side, and then they are in range of extant laws in Nigeria. Are you asking the Supreme Court has ruled that once you defect from the party that sponsored you to a political office? You lose that position. So the president of Nigeria, who is the ultimate custodian of the Nigeria Constitution as it is now, acts a sitting elected government to now go to a group of people who are by law, no longer lawmakers, and then we present his budget to them. Is that what we're expecting a sitting president of the Federal Republic of Nigeria to do? This is not a banana republic. This is not just anywhere. This is Nigeria, and Nigeria is constituted by laws. So no matter what the mediation processes are, will the president be acting a sitting elected government to agree to conditions that violates extant laws in the country, violates even in front of the constitution of the Federal Republic of Nigeria. So when we say we are sitting to it, the presidency has not been a statement. The other sitting ministers have not been a statement. The government of reverse states has not been a statement. And then probably the neutral party in this case, Dr. Peter Houghton, the former governor of reverse states, has also not said anything. So they have media needs, all the personalities and the institutionals have just mentioned, they have media needs. They have spokespersons, as any of their spokespersons come out to say this is it. Even the government has been referenced. Let's look at it now. We are media people. We have the basic things to look for in the documents. That document was the heading. It is not on any letterhead. And then the conditions it needs. And then the signatures, they are all suspects. So we cannot actually say anything on the basis of that document. And then let me also correct something. I am, if you said you want to hear from the same camp, I am not in any camp. I am a journalist like you. So I am neutral. No, no, no. I didn't group you into the same camp. Let me say that. I didn't group you. I said, how is the same camp taking it? Same for Barra. Because before we went to, I was. Yes. How are they taking it? I didn't say how are you taking it? Okay. This morning, in fact, from last night, when the government went into the public space, as Puku was my, okay, not just my friends, not my brothers. Because the governor, you know, is my brother. We are all the money. Puku and he is from Puku. I am role-balling. So we are all the same. Let me look. The same race, the same set of communities. Superboys and offshoots for money. So I've tried to reach family members. I've tried to reach a spokesperson. I've tried to reach even my senior friend, I'm up to say before, Joe Johnson, the commissioner for information rebastings. And none of them has given a feedback yet. I've also tried to reach the, the House of Assembly member representing for the Constituency Honorable Victor Okojombo, who was with the governor in that, you know, trip to Abuja for that meeting. And then he has not also given a feedback. So there is nothing from that camp. Apart from the statement by Mr. Kalama, the essay on media to the speaker of the reverse status of assembly, right? Any anything that the document is suspected that Dr. Pito de Lili and Governor Sim did not sign that document. Apart from that, nothing else. So I'm sure in the next couple of hours, we'll be able to hear from the government, hear from the same baracam, and probably even from the F-16 minister and probably from the presidency. But for now, everything is in abeyance. But let me also make something clear. If the president, being the father of the nation, wants to interfere, wants to mediate in a crisis situation, what would we ordinarily expect him to do, given the circumstance? We will expect that no matter what the mediation, you know, processes will look like. We'll expect that he will stay within the ambience of the law. True, he will mainstream the interests of reverse people, who will be the ultimate beneficiaries of victims of whatever their point of that mediation process will be. And then we will also expect that he will bring caution to the table for all parties, whether the governor or the FCT minister, who is actually his staff, you know, he will want to bring caution to the table. But whatever it is, let's make sure that the policy is stable and peaceful. Whatever it is, that's what we expect the president to be. That document in circulation does not carry those. So for the people of reverse state, generally, we'll be talking to a lot of people across, you know, Otakon, Boni, other places. And reverse people do not expect such a thing to be hidden on the table at all, at all, at all, where the law should play out its course. They expect the courts to, you know, look at the issues and deal with it. And even the competent court of law has already said that this is the speaker of the reverse status of assembly. That is what stands, is the president going to reverse the decision of the judiciary. I would not expect that to happen. I would not expect him to do that. So let's not put it on him that that is what he's doing. He cannot, you know, put himself in that kind of situation. We should expect that he will not do that. So for reverse people, they are waiting, you know, with baited breath, to hear from all the parties involved in that meeting last night to be able to know whether what is being bandied about in the public is true or not. So for now, everybody is in suspense and waiting. Well, until that official statement is made, the possibilities are 50-50 on the minds of people, because until they deny it, it could be true. It could be a lie. And we are waiting for that official document. For now, this is what we have to contend with, maybe a propaganda or something. But in the first place, does the president have anything to do with an internal crisis of a state? Does he even have the constitutional powers to be the one to mediate? Some people are worried that no matter that he is the father of the nation as you described him, he clearly has an interest in that issue. This person, like you said rightly, is his employee. And he has not held him down and said, okay, I want you to concentrate on what I have given to you and leave River State. He has not cautioned him in any way, at least openly, that we can see. So people are thinking that he has an interest and he shouldn't have been the one to even meddle into the affairs of River State. River's people are mature enough to settle their own differences. Okay, as for that, yes. And let me speak, the president has not said he was happening in River State. It is an elected governor that is on the saddle, elected by the people of River State, constitutionally recognized. And then he has an issue with one or two persons and then the president can't give any governor in Nigeria as a whole. The president can't give anybody orders. He can't give any of the governors. When we hear he was the governor, was the president of Nigeria controlling him? Was the president of Nigeria telling him what to do? If at all the president wants to come in, he will come in from the perspective, the angle of political solution. And then, but the first thing he will do is to caution his staff, his employee, the niece of Mickey, he should call them to order and say, Mr. Mann, I gave you an assignment, focus on that, get that sorted out. Once this cat fighter, you know, you know that kind of fight that cocks do in the village early in the morning, they want to decide who has a superiority for that day. They sort it out that morning. So you see all the cocks, there are five cocks, six cocks in the village. That morning they will still, they will be fighting with each other just to assert their superiority and then the next morning they will repeat it. Isn't that what the university minister is trying to bring for us from the university? I think the first thing the president will do as a responsible person, as the person who understands his role as the president of Nigeria as it is now, you know, he will call his employee to order. He will tell him, look, focus on what you're doing. But as far as the legal right to intervene in the snow, the president does not have, because the president cannot give the government orders. He cannot tell him what to do at all, at all. And then let's also look at the issue of the House of Assembly. The president is a self-team. The House of Assembly is legislating. So will the president be telling the legislature what to do? Obviously not. The legislature will sort out itself naturally, you know, and it is being sorted out. Both, you know, in the court and not in the court. It's being sorted out. Already the both parties have gone before the judiciary, which is a different arm of the government to ask questions. And the judiciary has come out and said, between the two of you, this is the person that is the speaker. And then this other group has also, you know, have also indicated that there are no members of the party that sponsor them to an elective office. Automatically, they lose their seats. They know the implications. They know the law. They know the position of the law. If they don't know their lawyers know, they know the position of the apex court, not a court of first instance, not an appeal court of first instance, but the apex court itself, the supreme court, has taken a position that in the party, political parties sponsor you to office. And you leave that party while in that office. You also lose that seat. It is there in black and white. But that's what I was just going to ask as well. But there is this, there is this condition that if the party is in disarray, if the party, there's a problem with it. And they are citing some problems within the party as the reason they left. They're talking about with a national secretary of the party or something, but that there's a rift inside the party. So that's the reason they're left. What would you say about the condition, so to speak, of the PDP in river state? Do you say there is a problem or there is no problem? The national secretary of the party, I say whatever he wants to say. We are not just reverse people. We live and work here in river state. As I'm speaking with you now, I am in my office in Bonny Island. You will understand, just days ago, I was in the office in Christina report office in Portagot. And then we have our staff, you know, in Portagot and in Bonny, you get and other places. We are in river state. We are reverse people. We eat here. We sleep here. We wake up here. We take our bath here. We dress up here. We go about and no one visits here. There is no rift in PDP. PDP remains warm. Nobody is quarreling or fighting inside PDP. So there is no rift. There is no basis for saying no, we are the campaign because there is a problem with the party. What is the problem? The former chairman of the party, Desmond Akawo, just resigned days after he was appointed to the federal position. And then everybody on all both camps, both the Jesu, Mite, the Singh, Bonacamp and Emre Anacamp, they all came together to be the fairway, you know. The acting chairman, you know, has also been there. Nobody has disturbed him. There are no two chairman of PDP, not at the states, not at the local government, not at the world level, not at the unit level. So where is the rift? Nobody is fighting anybody within the party. Where there is a rift is in the House of Assembly. Even the executive, there is no rift. So people felt, okay, I don't want to work with the governor again. I resign. And giving him time being the governor for the opportunity granted them, you understand, to serve in the government. They didn't say we are leaving the government because we have an issue with, you know, the governor. Even at the general, even made it clear in his own letter, he said, for clarity, he is living on personal interests, on personal reasons, not because he has any issue with anybody. You understand? So where is the rift? I want to hear that, oh, there is a unit of PDP in Gokana, or in Kana, or in Popo Korok, or in Emoa, or in Ikwere, or Abu Dha West, or Abu Abo, or Oibu, or Oboni, or Prika, or Obu Olo. There is a unit, there is a what? There is a local government, you know, chapter of the part, where there is any form of current. There is none. Across the states, there is none. All two, three local governments, all the works, all the units, they are together. There is no rift, no double chairman, no double youth leader, no double woman leader, nothing. So what are we, where is the notion of a rift within the PDP, whatever state it's coming from? There is none. There is no basis for them. So what does this mean now, especially with this 27 that have decamped from PDP, which we say has no rift in the party, what does this mean? Are they going to be in another party and still occupy this seats, especially with a document that we have that says the House of Assembly is still recognized alongside the 27 members who have resigned from PDP. Even though you say the document is fake, even though you say the document is fake. But even if, for instance, it's true. Yes. Okay, let's assume without considering that the president asked and all parties agreed that these lawmakers, you know, now constitute, probably constitute the State House of Assembly. Okay, so what happens then? We have also looked at it. Does the AACC come back as a majority leader of the House of Assembly? Is that what is going to happen? Is that what is going to happen? The 27, okay, 27 before now, later 25 members, they come to the AACC. Are they now going to come back to the PDP? So we have not come and say in the course of mediation, you know, since we are trying to settle the matter, we can go to the dining table and start eating. What will we be eating on the table when the soup has already been spilled and the food has been thrown away? So what will we be eating on the dining table? You cannot burn down my village and then you say in the course of peace and reconciliation, everybody cannot go back to their village. Which village will I be going back to? Which house will I be staying in? When all the buildings are being destroyed? So you see why we are having exception to that resolution. So let's assume without considering that there is any form of veracity to dance their documents. If the House of Assembly members, you know, are not recognized, then it also means that AACC will come back as the majority leader. It means the House of Assembly members will have to revert their position on their party membership. They have to come back to the PDP and be under the control of Singh Phubara. And you know, that is where the issue is. There will be no such thing because weekend is being pressured by the federal government and by the ABC. To become to the ABC, that is at the core of this, what he wants to go with the government, he wants to go with the House of Assembly, he wants to go with the party structure, he wants to go with everybody so that he doesn't he's not like he's truly into ABC just by himself. He's coming with clouds, he's coming with the crowd, he's coming with, you know, the capacity. That is what he's trying to understand. That's not going to happen. That is because reverse people like I've said on this program earlier. The reverse stage is PDP. You understand? I am not an apologies to any of you. By the way, the only party I belong to is ABC. You understand? Why? Good politics. So what I'm saying on record, empirical evidence abounds that reverse people are truly PDP heavily. Even he gave himself. Why is he not the campaign to the ABC? That's a question. Sadly, we have to wrap it up here. I wish we had more time to have a conversation with you extensively. At one scene too. We are going to enter scene three maybe. We'll still call upon you to give us updates on reverse. But today it's been very enlightening what you have said. First of all, the document is, according to the other camp, fake. I know that the other camp that put out the document will say it's authentic. We're waiting for those small ass that will lead us to the official document. Thank you so much, Mr. Jumbo, for coming on the program. Thank you. We've been talking with Mr. Goswil Jumbo from a reverse state press secretary to the deputy governor. He's a publisher and he was talking to us about what is happening in reverse state and whether or not the agreements that are flying around on social media are true or false and he said it's fake. Well, that's how we wrap it up on the show this morning. My name is Nyamgul Agadjil. Let's do it again tomorrow. My name is Rume Paul, so you can have a good day.