 Okay. Well, thank you, everybody. I have structured today's meeting today around the impact of the current COVID-19 state of emergency and its impact on our schools. Next week, we'll have time to discuss bills before us as well as any legislative action needed to help us through this pandemic, as well as prepare for the best we can for FY 21. So we'll start today with the Secretary of Education, particularly now that the directive has been issued to close schools for the remainder of the school year. We will also have an opportunity to hear from the Joint Fiscal Office on the state of the Ed Fund and some of the challenges there. We'll hear from the School Boards Association who can help us better understand governing and budgeting issues that they're facing at this time. And this afternoon I'm hoping that we'll be able to hear from Visbit who will help us understand some of the issues related to managing risk for our schools. And then we're also lucky to have Erin McGuire here who is from the Essex West for district, but is also president of the National Organization of Directors for Directors of Special Education. And I know that special education is a real concern that we have this afternoon we'll hear a little bit more from the ground in terms of we'll hear from superintendents and teachers from an array of districts. And, you know, I know a particular interest through all of us is going to be related to the directives that were tended not to be in the wheelhouse of schools, such as childcare, the meals, the new directives on continuity of education, certainly special education. I think for all of us is the concern around equity where in a time where equity is greatly challenged. So with that I, I welcome the Secretary of Education and commend you on the work that you're doing in the complexity of the job in designing something that we have never had to do before. So welcome and thank you for being here. Good morning. It's great to see you guys. I guess I'll make some general comments and then, you know, open it up to questions from the committee. The, as the chair mentioned last night, the governor issued a new update to his executive order. It's basically three areas that are the focus relative to the K-12 system. One, as the chair mentioned, schools will now remain dismissed for in-person instruction for their major to school year unless the governor orders otherwise, which could happen depending on how the virus, the response is handled. The schools are now going to be required to implement continuity of learning plans for remote learning and we're drawing the distinction between continuity of education and continuity of learning. The continuity of education is basically the disposition we are in originally when schools were dismissed. And now we're going to turn the corner and actually try to move forward with ensuring student learning continues and academic achievement progress is made and so forth. So school districts will be required to create continuity of learning plans and have them ready to go by April 13. We'll be working, the agency will be working on a series of guidance so forth to define the parameters of this work. One of the issues that's identified in the governor's order specifically is the issue of end of year gatherings and graduations. And in the order where required to issue that guidance prior to May 8 will certainly be paying close attention to the trends and the virus and, you know, be making some recommendations based on the likelihood that school would continue to be closed throughout the through the end of the school year, but, you know, certainly addressing the issues of seniors and end of year gatherings will be a priority. So there's a couple of things in the executive order that get into relative to childcare basically the childcare issue as it pertains to the K-12 is now encouraged. It's not as strong as a recommendation or requirement as it was previously. So I think that's one of the things that I think is really important is to acknowledge the prioritization that the K-12 system will now have on creating, designing if you will, continuity of learning activities and still engage significantly in feeding children as well that shifting our focus largely to that continuity of learning activity, which will be a tremendous undertaking. So I'll give you some initial statement to superintendents and independent school heads. Hopefully the committee will, I don't know to what extent you have access to those emails, but I asked this morning for my staff to send that on to Avery. So maybe you'll have access to that at some point, but basically just to my email last night to superintendents and independent schools, defining, firstly, what we mean by continuity of learning, meaning that there will be required to provide education services and related supports to all their students remotely. And that can mean a variety of issues. Certainly we'll be talking a lot about technology, but there's other solutions that districts are employing. But shifting education to a remote process so that academic progress is achieved as if schools had remained open. And we're, as I mentioned, the requirement is that districts make that transition between now and April 13. A lot of work has already gone in on the ground. In anticipation of that, we've been trying to signal to districts that this might be an eventuality. You know, folks have started to work on that and we'll be producing some guidance on that very quickly. Hopefully we'll support that work and not disrupt the work that's already been going on in the last couple of weeks. And also in my email last night, I just signaled a couple of the more immediate guidance topics that we'll be addressing. First and foremost, the issue of student attendance and calendar requirements and so forth, and that will help districts begin to structure how they're going to staff providing continuity of learning. Certainly a priority related priority is how we're going to support students with disabilities during this process. That's going to be an area where we've already put out some guidance on that we'll get certainly more specific now that the essentially the regular education environment will be redefined under this concept of continuity of learning. Second area we're going to our third area we'll be putting a lot of focus on as the chair mentioned is equitable access. As we start to employ more technology, our experience with technology that often shines a light on issues and I'm sure that it will immediately shine a light on equity issues across the state. So, this will be a focus of the work for school districts is how do we address those issues. As I mentioned will be addressing the issue of end of your gatherings and graduations. And then specifically and hopefully by this afternoon we're going to have guidance out on the format and submission parameters of the school district continuity continuity of learning plans. We're requiring districts to implement them by the 13th, but we want to have them submitted to the agency by the so we can review them and provide some feedback. And I think also there's a couple actions were anticipating, because I think that this is going to be significant work new work as the chair mentioned for a lot of us I think there is some opportunity in this but the priority is going to be, you know, taking care of our students as schools have always done, but it's going to be new, and there's a lot of work that needs to be done to implement this into plan for its implementation. So I suspect a significant role for the agency will be working intensely to support that collaboration that's really going to have to happen on a scale that we've never done before in Vermont. Being collaboration across schools districts across the state to share resources and ideas and how to address student needs. So a big part of what we're going to focus on is how to enable that collaboration. One thing I'll be doing is establishing a task force of folks to help system to design. And I see this as a true community effort, if you will the community being the entire state. So hoping to engage not only K 12 higher ed parents students, but also the business community and to leverage community resources that might be available inside of Vermont and throughout the world to bring expanded learning opportunities to all of Vermont students during this time period. We're looking significant serious efforts being spent and focused on the possibility deploying a statewide collaboration platform to do that this is using technology and learning management system. So we want to have some options for districts. We'll find districts have already or some have learning management systems other use platforms like Google classroom or so forth so there's a lot of platforms out there. We don't want to supplant or disrupt that work, but we also want to make sure we have some ability to share practices, regardless of the system that might be emerging. That could be deployed more thoughtfully statewide. So that's that's essentially what we're working on today. I just to make a few comments regarding other the context in our planning work. I think you know a significant aspect of the coven 19 response has been a communications response so you notice that we've we've had to ramp up significant communications support to the field. And that includes liaisoning with a variety of other groups within the state government certainly working very closely with the Agency of Human Services Department of Health and so forth we have been right from the very beginning of this. But also on the national level as well because, you know, all states have been struggling to respond to this into different different degrees. We've engaged with bi-weekly phone calls with the Council of Chief State school officers, my professional group so they've also organized resources and so forth. So we've had a direct conversation with other states and we're kept the prize regularly of how other states are responding to these challenges. So our congressional delegation in Vermont has been exceedingly responsive. So we've been been able to give two way feedback and hear from them about issues that are going on in Congress relative to funding and other policy waivers that we might need to ensure that we have the adequate flexibility to respond in Vermont. So there's been some areas where there's been we've been tremendously successful in that regard I would say feeding students has been exceedingly successful, both in terms of the programmatic support from the federal government the waivers, but just boots on the ground in Vermont have responded exceedingly well to make that an imperative but you know those as an example of an activity that's gone exceedingly well initially, but we'll need continued logistical support, both financially and to address issues as the likelihood that staff that are engaged in supporting these communities become ill with the COVID-19 so you know we're off to a good start in some areas and we've built out some really good communication structures, logistic support structures but all those things will be tested significantly as the passing of the virus continues as expected through the first part of May. So, I think all in all, the system has responded exceedingly well. Now we're going to put increased emphasis on continuity of learning which will be a whole new world, just reading, you know, Twitter feeds this morning I think folks are as much as we anticipated this eventuality is still somewhat of a shock. I think folks are going to confident they're going to rise up and do some really interesting work but right now we're, we're going to need a couple weeks to really start to articulate out what that means. As we start to address the equity gaps and so forth and make sure our most vulnerable students are supported through this process. Why don't I stop there and be happy to answer any questions you might have. I know that Representative James house one I wanted to just start with. I think a lot of us are quite concerned about the mental health needs of children, particularly given that we, the schools have access to the designated agencies, and I'm wondering, are you in contact with the agency of human services around our children that that have some significant mental health issues that are likely to be exacerbated under the current conditions. Yeah, we are certainly in direct contact I would just also say that just a general anxiety that this, this virus has caused among children, and just the role the regular classroom teacher that often we sort of take for granted and handling the needs of students emotionally and from a mental health perspective so a better part of. We have to be very cognizant of as we try to do remote learning is just to acknowledge that the role of teachers play in the lives of students in terms of providing that stability in their daily lives and as you know with some families that's more significant of a role than others. But it's a very important aspect of just the underlying supports for students we need to ensure that teachers can maintain regular contact with students and certainly to coordinate with other mental health agencies but a significant challenge for us is just how to maintain that regular contact with parents of students or excuse me with teachers that students find so reassuring the stability of the school routines that also bring them to the insurance so it's going to be a big part of our challenge I think in the work before us. I think we're hearing from the superintendent sonnet as well representative James you had a question. Can you hear me here. Thanks, Secretary French I thanks so much for being here I realized it's probably too early to talk about this. As the schools, you know have still a couple more weeks to get their, their plans submitted. But one of the things I've been concerned about. And I know I'm hearing this from some of my constituents are families accessing remote education when they don't have high speed internet or any internet at their home and I just wonder if you have a sense of what kind of options or alternative schools could offer to families that were relying on schools and libraries and other public places to connect. Thanks. Thank you. It's good to see you. The. Yeah I think you know certainly we're going to be using technology significantly concept remote learning. And that's that's appropriate I think and but it varies greatly and once again technology will will shine a light on many of the equity issues we've known that have always been there just makes it more visible to us. So I think the concept of remote learning is is going to be more broadly defined beyond technology as well. We've already seen examples where schools have been used as hubs to distribute materials and so forth for students, you know, pick up sort of like take out at restaurants you know we have schools are having students or parents and students drive up and grab things stuff like that so we'll be pursuing all kinds of options. I think you know the Department of Public Services done an inventory of Wifi hotspots and so forth so we are going to aggressively do it weekend to ensure students have the technology access and I know some districts who previously were not did not have Chromebooks for instance or laptops deeply deployed have made accelerated efforts to do that. But I think you know we'll see a variety of things I'm particularly concerned or interested in the K through five approach and remote learning I think high school, you know we have a better conceptualization particularly with technology of how to deliver high school online you know high schools are largely structured around the course as a basic paradigm for education. We don't use courses generally K through five you know we use classes, you know it's not, it's pretty typical at the lower elementary to have one teacher teach a variety of subjects if you will or it's a much more integrated approach. So how that ends up being deployed as a remote learning concept when such a priority is placed on the socialization of students with their teacher is going to be a challenge for us, particularly in Vermont where we have approximately a third of our schools are less than 100 students and many of them are very small elementary schools. So remote learning as a pertains to elementary will be a significant challenge and I think also we'll see some really interesting and creative responses in that regard and it's my hope that you know Vermont will really help redefine what what that might look like in the 21st century way. But we have a variety of things beyond technology available to us so we'll have to well everything's on the table basically in terms of deploying creative solutions in that regard. Do you anticipate and then then I'm done. Do you anticipate that many schools would need to scramble to try to purchase and distribute Chromebooks to families. We've seen districts doing that already, you know, buying large numbers of laptops and so forth but I'm not sure to the extent that'll you know how widespread that will be on a state level but you know we have we have in spite of what we think in terms of internet access there is quite a bit of internet access around for schools. But there are certainly pockets where it's just there is none as you know there's no sellers in some spots as well so it is it's going to be a challenge for districts who from an equity standpoint who are going to rely significantly on technology they're going to have to figure out a way to provide a non technology solution for those those parents and students that don't have access. Others there. Let's see we have Larry first and then Peter. Can't hear you Larry. Oops. There we go. Can we now. Yep. Dan, a little concerned Howard, how are the many, many teachers and students that we deal with on a daily basis, how are the teachers reporting. Should they become sick with this COVID-19. Are they reporting directly to their superintendents or to the agency. In contact, some teachers are going house to house, leaving studies and so on to the children. Is there a way that they're reporting this should they become ill. Yeah, I mean so teachers are, you know, subject like Oliver monitors the same health guidance that, you know, all of us should follow so you know their districts we've seen in a couple of cases as teachers have become ill. Because teachers, you know, generally play a significant role in their communities, you know, due to the web of connections they have with students and so forth. The knowledge of a teacher being diagnosed or confirmed with COVID-19 tends to have ripple effects through the community and cause for concern and so forth so it on the one hand, it's treated just like any other confirmed case, you know, where, you know, people basically quarantine themselves or file those guidelines from the CDC or Department of Health and then if they have more severe symptoms they see their health provider. We have, you know, the issue of communication often with with a teacher becomes confirmed and so forth where they work, you know, closely with their supervisor and most cases the principal and then ultimately the superintendent teachers like Oliver have a right to privacy in terms of their protected health information so standards like to come into play as well. But I think increasingly as as the virus spreads will see more more confirmed cases and as a society will become more comfortable with that as a reality. I think the related issue on continuity of learning will be how do we support the continuity of learning when the teacher becomes ill, you know, in the regular school setting that would mean a substitute teacher and so forth. So, the issue of lesson plans how how content can be deployed is one thing but, you know, that issue again of how important the day to day social interaction between teachers and students can be. So, when teachers are ill, you know, what's that impact on remote learning it could be significant from an emotional standpoint on students so. But the issue of teachers going around, you know, the teachers should be following the social distancing guidelines and I think we have really well established protocols from the Department of Health on that so we'll put out some guidance on that and we'll put out more guidance as necessary to just reaffirm the you know the priority one right now. And the reason that schools have been dismissed is to, to address the spread of the virus to slow it down at this point you know so that's that's got to be on the forefront of everyone's thinking right now and we need to protect the care system at this critical moment in the spread of the virus so we're going to work hard to do the continuity of learning but we have we have to really be disciplined as a society to understand the importance of this particular next four weeks or so that we're going to go through. Thank you. We're going to be hearing from the field this afternoon and I imagine after we talk with them. We're probably going to want to have another another chat with you next week, particularly around just the concern of continuity of education continuity of learning in relation to the inequities that that are very obvious to to all of us. We'll discuss that later I know Peter you wanted to you had a question. Yeah, you know a lot of where we're where we sort of stopped doing our business was assuming business as usual business as usual out the window. Again, I wanted to ask a couple of questions about sort of our work and our logistics. You know we've got some legislation that we've been working on this legislation that the Senate has been working on. Is there anything there that you would like to see continue. And I also had a question about various deadlines that are set in law and I'm thinking specifically about Act 173 if we need to be doing some adjustments there in order to face the new reality. I mean there's, we are turning some energy on that you'll, as we, I think I telegraphed at the beginning of this crisis you'll be probably not seeing Ted a lot. It's great Ted's on the call this morning but Emily Simmons our general counsel will sort of be our liaison to you in that regard. I'm meeting with Emily this afternoon to start reviewing that work and making sure the ice get dotted and tease and so forth get crossed. I think obviously you know work on 173 the timelines and so forth will need to be adjusted. Again, we were prepared to, you know, we were working on bringing a coherent and consensus recommendation to you as a committee prior to the outbreak of COVID-19 I say coherent and consensus I mean among all the various stakeholders this year we're going to try to, you know, bring that forward together. But we'll, we'll, we'll be making sure those things anything you need from us that Emily will be your contact will be ready to support you and your work in that regard. But certainly the priority right now has been on COVID-19. And I think the chunk of the work will be financial that will be working very closely with the General Assembly on as we get into the issues of the Ed fund and cost liability and so forth and what we're seeing so far from the federal government as we're seeing, I think a real lot of support both from the financial end, and also the flexibility and I think the two go hand in hand. Well, yeah, what this is going to cost. But we do know that it's going to require us to have some flexibility to address the conditions on the local ground in terms of student education and support the school districts and so forth. So, so far I'm very optimistic that what I've seen coming out of Congress seems to indicate that we'll have adequate flexibility. And that's a critical, real critical component. But yeah, Emily will be our liaison to you and your work and we'll, we'll make sure that those priorities are surface pretty quickly for you. And we'll have an opportunity to talk about that quite a bit next week and I will check in with Emily, I do know that we have two bills in our committee right now to miscellaneous that bills that are those bills for that I know that there's 173 language in there. And we can look to see what we can, we can move what we need to really move through quickly. Thank you. Great. Okay, Mr. Secretary, I thank you we will definitely want to be hearing from you again. Hey, I just wanted to mention two other representatives had questions sorry to know I see that now. Yes, so Rita sorry yes. Great question. You're on mute. Can you unmute. Can you hear me. Yes. Yes, you can hear me. Yeah. Okay. I want to just go back to what Kate was talking about about the concerns about the mental health of the children. And I think, you know, we're all aware of the impact of emotions have on learning, you know, especially anxiety. It's going to be something built into the program every day, you know, either by a phys ed teacher or something that kids could do, either in their living room or something that's safe. But where they're physically active, you know, every day for, you know, half an hour or 40 minutes in order to help them lessen their anxiety. Okay, that's an important aspect to consider. And I think we'll see those patterns they've already emerged from teachers just as they've been building out their initial thinking around continuity of education and sort of initial phase just to maintain things. We've seen acknowledgement of the importance of physical activity emerge already but certainly I would consider that a best practice. Thank you. Dylan, you had a question. Yeah, greetings. And thank you, Secretary French for coming and joining us in this new format. We're in a new world. I am just wondering about, now that we're entering this phase of continuity of learning, just as we move forward. I'm wondering about AoE capacity, we know that even in normal times, we've had concerns about capacity on the field. And specifically, I'm just wondering about the speed with which guidance is getting to the field. I have seen incredible and heard incredible stories about in terms of the initial phase of continuity of education and standing up systems. Our districts have moved very quickly to stand up, things that we never thought were possible really I mean we're talking about food for all our kids we're talking about services of shifting to online education. Does the agency have what it needs because I just want to make sure the field is getting directives in a very timely fashion recognizing you're doing everything you can recognizing you're in crisis. To me, the moment we're in requires really clear guidance that is timely. And I was just concerned because I heard some rumblings last night that maybe the guidance didn't get to superintendents until after the news landed in the press that schools were going to be closing for the remainder of the school year. And to me, if you need support, we really, you know, we need to know it. I don't know what we can do about it, but I just want to make sure at this point that we're having an honest conversation about what you need, so that the field gets what they need. Thank you. Yeah, I think right now we're doing fine in terms of that. I think, you know, will certainly COVID-19 will have a significant impact on the structure of the agency itself. We have a division, for example, the divisions in the agency are comprised of essentially 25 to 30 employees. A division that was organized around pathways, which is act 77 CTE and so forth, will be leading the work on continuity of learning so just the aspect of giving them that charge and housing that that activity inside of that division will fundamentally transform that division. So it's premature, I think, to see, you know, what shape that work will take relative to staffing at the agency. But right now I think we have the ability to do that. I think an area where I've identified previously, you know, to the general assembly in terms of need over time will be the back office sort of functions of the agency where those have never received a lot of attention, so to speak. We've gotten into the like the SSTDMS initiative, the centralization of the business functions and so forth. You know, the agency's increasingly going to need capacity to manage the financial aspects of the system and to provide oversight. As you can imagine, the financial implications of this crisis are significant. And I suspect we'll be dealing with the financial implications for many years. And we're no doubt going to have to keep an eye on that. You know, as federal resources are being targeted for support of COVID-19, some of those resources are being targeted for SCA or agency capacity. So we'll be leveraging those to support districts as best we can. But, you know, back to the communications piece, I think, you know, we've been in some case sometimes producing guidance too quickly. But it's, we've largely been in a phase of needing to respond to emergency emergency situation. And the guidance has largely fallen into that category of sort of the need to put out emergency directives. And I've been holding direct weekly calls with the superintendents to sort of have an opportunity to discuss with them beyond what the formal guidance says more informally. But I think as we turn the corner into continuity of learning, we're anticipating ramping up other structures within the agency to support that, particularly the collaboration piece that I identified earlier. Our structure, communication structure as it is right now will be challenged somewhat by what I anticipate the communications needs to support the field in this way. So we're actively looking at infrastructure issues, meaning I think I talked earlier about a customer relations management platform or CRM, which many states have gone to gets us out of email and off the phone, because we just we have dynamic communications demands that need to be managed across teams and our teams are now working from their homes in a distributed way. So we need to have that infrastructure in place that allows us to manage the responsiveness that will be necessary to the field. So we are, we are actively exploring expanding that capacity. I am aware that ways and means it's going to be looking for Mark fairly soon so I think what I'd like to do is shift and thank the secretary so much for your time and your work. Great idea about using your personalized learning folks. A lot of expertise in that department. Good to see you all thank you. Thank you. So, Mark. Good morning. Can everybody hear me. Yes. Yes. Okay, so earlier today I think Chloe sent over to Avery a couple documents. I don't know if you've got access to them but if you do. I'd like to start with an education fund outlook. Okay, so given the time we have I can sort of get you up to speed on where we are in terms of the current year and then just talk a little bit about the issues that ways and means is having to address in terms of setting the property tax rate parameters next year. Is this the one dated 32420. Yes, it just says possible COVID-19 revenue impacts 32420. Yeah, looking at it. I've got it up front on ways and means at the moment. Okay, so should I go ahead. I'm going to pull it up on our on my screen too. Here we go. Thank you. You can send it Avery or should we find it on ways and means. Oh, I see. Thanks. Okay, great. So I'm going to start. I'm not going to spend a whole lot of time on this but I because I can explain what's going on I think pretty concisely but if you take a look at the middle column which is labeled FY 2020, January forecast. That was what we were looking at for FY 2020. About a month ago the beginning of this month. And again, just just to keep everything clear 2020 is the year we're currently in. So if you look down at the bottom of the sheet if you go all the way down to line 31. You can see that at the close of 2020 we were expecting to end the year with a full stabilization reserve online 27 that you can see a $26.4 million stabilization reserve. That is a full 5% reserve. And in addition to that if you drop down to line 31, you can see that we have a $12.9 million surplus. So that's what we were anticipating we were going to be looking at at the end of the current fiscal year. That was before any adjustments to revenues for the COVID-19 outbreak. So now if you go back up to the top of the sheet. On the right hand most column, you can see that we've added one new line in there which is line nine and it's COVID-19 revenue downgrades. We don't have a really tight estimate for what revenue downgrades are looking like for FY 2020. So there's a range there of 35 to 45 million. That loss is entirely due to sales and use tax revenues, purchasing use tax revenues and meals and rooms tax revenues. The reason for that is, you know, as we enter into a downturn when people lose their jobs or have business losses, consumers cut back people aren't spending money. And so those consumption taxes are going to drop. And again the estimate right now is 35 to 45 million. So if you look on the sheet in the right hand column on that line nine, you can see you there we've subtracted from revenues $40 million, which is the midpoint of this estimate. So rather than having that 1.7 billion coming in we're anticipating that 1.67 billion coming in. So now if you can drop back down to the bottom line again you can see the impact of this. We've assumed that expenditures have not changed, but now online 22 you can see instead of having an annual operating deficit of about 16 million. Now it's about 56 million. What that does if you drop down below as you can see online 31, where we had been anticipating a $12.9 million surplus to carry forward into 21, we now have nothing. So if you jump up to line 27, you can see that instead of having a $36.4 million stabilization reserve to carry into FY 21, we're now anticipating our stabilization reserve of about $9.3 million. So that's only about 1.3% of the target. And it could be, you know, $5 million worse $5 million better based on the range of estimates we have but we will still be heading into FY 21 with basically, you know, most of the covered bear. So I'll stop there for a minute. I have a couple of questions. And then I'm not going to have a lot of time to get into the revenue, the issue brief, but you might not want me to anyways but I can hit a couple of high points and also talk a little bit about some additional information we've gotten yesterday in terms of the federal stimulus package and the aid that's included in there for schools. So it would be great and I know that I really would recommend that committee members do take a look at that draft issue brief that's on maybe. I'll pull that onto our website as well. Because you have some really important points in there that have an impact on the work that we do. So, yeah, I wanted, I want, I want to warn people it's a pretty dense document I'm going to try to draft up something that's a little bit more accessible to people that don't live in this world. But there is there is a lot of information in there. So why don't you give us some highlights and also if you have anything on the federal stimulus. So, in terms of 2020 just briefly, the revenue issue is primarily the consumption taxes the non property tax revenues that come into the fund which are about a third of the total. There's not an education property tax issue we don't think in 2020 because most of the money from the education property tax that is due for FY 2020 is already in the bank. And as you can see in the report if you flip through later, we still think there's about $125 million outstanding, and there's a number of districts, I think about 62 that still have half fully half of their education property tax revenue, still outstanding so while the $125 is not a big deal for the education fund outlook itself, because you know even a 1% failure to pay or failure to collect a net area would be about 1.25 million so it's not huge but a little concerned about the 62 towns that still have half of the education property tax liability to be collected this year. Those districts may have some some issues some shortfalls that they have to address. In terms of the just the not the non property tax revenues, you know I don't have a lot to add there other than the 35 to 45 million we're hoping to get a better estimate soon. That represents about 2 to 2.6 million per cent of the education fund so it's significant in that year. One other point and I'll move on from this then is that in addition to the money that we don't we're anticipating we're not going to get the administration is going to allow businesses who collect these taxes their trustee taxes businesses collect them from consumers and remit them to the states. They're going to allow businesses to defer payments in March and April and make three payments on May 25. The only concern there, assuming that we ultimately collect all the money that's due is that it could create a cash flow problem in the education fund, because the last payment to school districts which includes one third of the education payment, one third of all the big number it's basically one third of that 1.7 million that we were anticipating goes out to districts on April 30. So we wouldn't be getting in these additional receipts from businesses on these taxes until after that to do In terms of federal aid, the only good news I have for you for 2020 is that we've been looking at the federal stimulus aid package. And within that package. There's 13 and a half billion dollar in formula grants to states. States are allowed to distribute 90 90% of that money directly to school districts and retain 10% of it. That's what our emergency needs. Now I've been trying to figure out exactly what Vermont share that 13.5 billion dollars is in my back of the envelope calculation indicates that it's going to be about $30 million. So that could go a long way towards closing this gap that's opened up in 2020. So for like the era money that we got from the feds back in the great recession, the money is going to go to the agency of education and then directly to school districts and it'll bypass the Education Fund. We got around that back in I think 2010 and 2011 by reducing the general fund transfer by the amount of the federal aid. So districts remain whole, and the Education Fund. The problem was dealt with. We no longer have a general fund transfer to the Education Fund, we have dedicated taxes so that's an issue we're going to have to work through. So that's basically it for 2020. If there's any questions like it's probably a good time to jump in and then I'll just, you know, briefly go over what we're looking at for FY 21. So, questions. Okay then. So, FY 21. At this point we're pretty much. I'm sorry Dylan, did you have a question. Yeah, I do have one mark. There's been a lot of interest and community activity around abating perhaps meals and rooms tax for those periods those collection times maybe it's going to be through April 25 or maybe May 25. I just know there's a lot of activism there. Do we have an accurate estimate on how much abating, not just the penalty and interest that's been waived by the authority of the tax commissioner but actually abating the tax amount. For those businesses during that timeframe would be. Yeah, I, my last conversations with the administration indicated that they were not playing to obey any of it. That all of the tax would become due on May, I think May 25. And what they're being forgiven interest and penalties so if they don't pay it, you know that they're encouraging businesses that can to go ahead and pay right along. And if that happens, then this is not such a concern bigger concern. And they are going to follow up with businesses if they if they think that their business is not remitting the money that and they're able to. The only other the only wrinkle there in terms of lost revenue is that if a district unable to make these first two payments when we get to May 25. There's an open question as to whether or not they're going to make be able to make those three payments all at once into the education fund and if they can't, then that 35 to $45 million gap is going to grow as a result of that. And there's also a question of the abatement of education property taxes and under current law, because we have a very decentralized system and we give responsibility for raising those revenues to municipalities, even though it's a state tax. They have the ability only to abate the municipal property tax, not the education tax so they get it sort of a double whammy if they don't collect money. On one hand, they're going to be short of municipal property tax revenue. And on the other hand, they're going to have to remit to the state, the education property tax that they all, whether they've collected it or not. Now, the, you know, the commissioner can does an 8% penalty for late payments to the state as well. The commissioner I think has the authority to waive the penalty but he does not have the ability to waive the authority for them to, you know, the way of their pay that money through the education fund. So that answer your question. Yes, yes, I actually just have one final question and this this is probably too early to say but we eliminated the general fund transfer we have dedicated revenue sources now into the Ed fund. Just real quick back to the envelope do you think we'll be better off through this crisis or worse offer that decision I know it's hard to say because we've had robust revenue growth from those sources and years. So that's the question we haven't had a chance to look at it yet. We were starting to look at it. In terms of what we were looking at at the beginning of the month, the middle column 2020. We haven't gone ahead and looked at it for what we're looking at right now but it's, we come up for air, we'll find out but I'm not sure. Let's make maybe make this the last questions I know that you have to go and it has to do with the towns that have not yet passed a budget. And we have several districts that have not yet passed a budget, which if they don't get a budget in place by June 30. My understanding is that I'm looking at the statute I think you told me that they may borrow up to 87%. Yes, word is borrow. Who are they borrowing from. They would go out and borrow like they do now for short term borrowing. So it's whoever, whatever bank they can go to they wouldn't be borrowing the education but it would come it would be from their own. Reaching out to banks to make loans. Okay, that sounds easy. Yeah, the other thing that would happen I found out since then is that the commissioner does have the authority to impose the base tax rate on them for the homestead tax, which is a dollar. Without any adjustment for spending because they won't have a bill passed yet. So those two things will be taken care of but there are. It's a question now as to whether you know there were a number of votes that failed. And there were a number of towns that haven't voted at all yet they normally vote later. And one of those votes going to take place. South Burlington, I know how I'm had a failed budget and they also had a remote schedule which they have now postponed indefinitely I think. So, there's those questions but that's the kind of stuff that ways and means is having to wrestle with this morning in terms of trying to set the yields, you know the property tax parameters for next year. There's a whole range of issues and you know I can know I'm running out of time here but I can come back and talk to you about FY 21 because the real problem in FY 21 right now is that we have no idea what the revenue impact is going to be in 21. It's probably going to be bad in terms of the non property tax revenues, but it also may be an issue with collecting the education property tax revenues. So that's really going to be tricky trying to figure out where the yield ought to be set. This is the fault in law. There's been some discussion about using the December one yields because those are what school boards had in mind when they were, it's, you know, creating their budgets and what they submitted to voters. So those tax those tax rates wouldn't the tax rates that result from the yields that were set. Or recommended by December one, maybe a way that we could go this year as well. That doesn't address the bottom line of the Ed fund but we don't really know where we are right now. There's also just the incredible complexity of the collection of ed taxes given that it's the dates are all set by the municipalities. Are there, are there, is there a conversation at this point about trying to standardize that. I don't know how we could do it at this point but you're right, you know, we have, we have a 259 towns. They all have different billing practices, different number of installments, different due dates. But we were able to actually Chloe did a lot of work on this. I was able to figure out how much we have outstanding right now. Going into next year I know Buell score is the only tax collecting entity that I know that has already moved their collection dates to try to, you know, address some of the immediate needs people have and push the taxes back a little bit but that's all I've heard. So, but I do think municipalities may have the authority to move those dates. Sue may have a better answer than that for me. We'll be in touch with our sister committee over there and the ways it means just to follow up on that it's a complex problem here. Okay. Be to let you go and we have. Sue, thank you so much Mark. Okay. And then we have Sue and Aaron. And how would you like to do this Aaron do you want to speak with us. I'm fine if Sue goes first I'd be interested to hear what she says and happy to follow up after her. If you'd like I think that's the way we were situated on your screen. Okay, great. Well thank you Sue and welcome. Thank you so much and it's great to see all of you can you hear me. Yes. Wonderful. I hope everyone's doing well I hope your families are well, and just going to take the opportunity to give you a brief update I know you have a lot of people you want to hear from today. First I'll just speak really briefly about what's been happening in the past few weeks, and then move on to future concerns. So as you know for the past few weeks for months education community has been sharply focused on the urgent issues that have been posed by this pandemic. It's really been an all hands on deck situation involving very long hours and new issues arising by the hour. The three main areas that have been addressed by the education community during this time were the provision of meals to students, child care for essential employees and moving to new ways of providing education and planning for the continuity of learning and provision of services. The logistics of course involved in all each of these areas are very significant and we can't think our education community enough for their dedication to the health safety and the well being of students in Vermont, everybody is really doing their part with the can do attitude. With the governor's announcement last night that schools are dismissed for in person instruction through the end of the school year, and that schools are required to have continuity of instruction. Sorry continuity of learning plans for remote learning implemented by April 13. We are entering new territory with many challenges ahead for my education community will need clear guidance from the agency of education as we continue to support students during this crisis. We all know, of course that remote learning cannot replace a student's experience in school communities that when they're with their teachers administrator support staff and other students. However, because we're in this unprecedented situation. It's important that we all pull together parents and caregivers students educators staff administrator school boards and the agency of education to help students continue their learning through the end of this school year. The VSBA thanks Secretary French for the leadership and guidance he has provided during this difficult and challenging time. And we know that there's a lot more to be done. Clear guidance is going to be critical moving forward to support districts in their implementation of remote learning, including specific recommendations related to students with special needs and disabilities English learners and early learners. VSBA and other education associations are meeting with Secretary French and his team on Monday in order to offer our assistance with this work. In order to provide support to the field with a unified message. In addition, I wanted to let you know what VSBA is doing to support school boards in their role in responding to coven 19 in a way that allows school district leadership teams to provide a unified message to students parents employees and the general public. Superintendents are the chief executive officers of the district with the responsibility to make many of the decisions during the initial period of this crisis. Moving forward, school boards have a vital role to play in staying connected with their communities we know they have to do that remotely and working with their superintendents to provide calm and positive leadership. To support school boards in that role VSBA is providing them with daily updates addressing questions they have on governance matters. Some of the things that we've covered in our daily updates so far are open meeting law questions. Budget vote questions from districts who have not held a vote yet and from districts whose budgets did not pass the first time they voted on them. This is a postponement of annual meeting questions from districts who have not held their annual meeting yet. Absentee ballot questions questions about how the governor's executive orders change decision making authority for school boards and questions about resources and best practices for meetings remotely. We're developing resources right now for boards including information on the temporary changes to the open meeting law and a guide for organizing and holding remote meetings. Getting near the end here at the federal level we understand that the Senate passed a bill on Wednesday that the house is expected to vote on today. And just generally understand that the bill includes funds for schools to buy technology to get remote learning off the ground sanitize school buildings and pay for summer learning programs. There are also funds for child nutrition including school meals. We're working to understand how this bill will affect Vermont's education community. I also wanted to let you know that I'm on weekly phone calls with the executive directors of all of the other state association school boards associations across the country and learning what's happening in their states and how they're handling specific issues. I'd just like to close with probably the most important point is that throughout this crisis. We believe it's critically important to prioritize resources to address the safety and well being of our most vulnerable students. Thank you. Thank you, Sue. Questions for Sue. I know that we're going to be probably hearing at some point what's happening with the the districts that have not yet passed their budgets and the struggles that they are facing. Yes, we are compiling that information. Okay. Any questions and pursue or should we go on to Aaron. Thank you. Thank you so much, Sue. We'll, we'll stay in touch. Hi, good morning, everyone. You have been working at the federal level as well. So, so, and you also have the expertise and special ed. I know that our committee would be interested in knowing what we can and can't do what levers we can pull and understand that there are very few. I did provide some written testimony and it feels worthy to just introduce myself in the many roles that I'm sitting in right now so I serve primarily as the director of equity diversity and inclusion for the Essex Westford School District and include special education within my roles and responsibilities but is also very focused on issues of equity. So your conversations about that are very relevant to me. I also serve as the president of the Council of administrators and special education at the national level and so have moved through presidency at the state level and have now taken on that role and so have been very involved in federal issues. I'm also a mom of a child who's home and trying to work and educate at the same time so I serve lots of different roles in as it relates to all the conversations you all are having and grateful for your time today. So it feels most important to share with you the challenges about IDA as it relates to the COVID-19 implementation of special education, and want to first share with you. This may sound obvious but IDA was not built for this situation, most of our laws were not and so we are running into a number of challenges as it relates to implementation. At the federal level we are working really hard to be family and students centered in our work as we think about implementation of IDA and I would say that's true for Vermont and the work we're doing with the agency as well as the work we're doing locally in the Essex Westford School District. There are equity issues that are showing up for sure, the ability for a student with a significant disability such as autism to be engaged and inside of educational experiences that are equitable to what other students experience when we're expected to educate from a physical distance is really challenging and what we're doing is doing our best and trying to figure out what's reasonable to expect. Parents are now partners in this work and so it's nearly impossible to educate kids without the parent involvement at this point. That's really a mainstay of what we're trying to work through and figure out and parents come to that from very different places. Some people are working a lot right now because of their own roles and responsibilities as it relates to COVID-19 and making it really hard and some parents are really available and want to engage and are able to spend lots of time working with their children. I do want to answer the question directly Representative Webb asked which is what are our levers and what can we do and what can't we do. IDEA is a federal law the limitations on the Secretary of Education in the US Department of Education is those are pretty significant. There's not a lot of leeway that OSAP the Office of Special Education programs has or the Office of Civil Rights has as it as it relates to rules around special education. The Senate bill that passed and is being considered now by the House for stimulus includes a provision to allow the United States Department of Education to offer what flexibilities under IDEA are necessary. There are a couple of points that are important. It's really challenging right now to comply with timelines. Expecting families to engage in quality conversations about where their child will be in one year from now which is a huge part of the role we play when we review an IEP and think about a new IEP and do an annual review. There are many families who are just not in a space to be having that conversation right now and so I think it's important to recognize that and not pressure people into these spaces because IDEA comes in from above and says you must review annually. But right now without some flexibility that is where we find ourselves our ability to evaluate students from afar is also very limited and so that's another area of challenge. I would say for me one of the biggest challenges is trying to figure out what FAPE, a free appropriate public education is inside of this scenario and how is it that we document that. Yes, we just had a little glitch in there. Maybe you said one of the biggest things and then one of the biggest things right now is trying to figure out how to deliver. Can you can you all hear me now is that yeah okay. The, the free appropriate public education that is promised by IDEA at all times to students who have disabilities and are eligible under special education, figuring out how to deliver that in the context of COVID-19 when everyone is home has taken up a great deal of our time and trying to understand how is it that we document that should that or shouldn't that change the current IEP should it sit outside the IEP, making sure that parental rights are intact and valued and families have their, the role that is their right to have in deciding what the IEP looks like it's the LEA's obligation to offer it, but it is our responsibility to work with families and consider lots of family input in the design and so we're basically in the situation where we need to redesign in order to implement. We don't know what flexibility is going to come, if any, from the federal level. There are lots of attorneys across the country working on these issues and trying to figure out how we handle what we've got going on. By writing every single IEP in the country for COVID-19 circumstances would collapse the amount of time we have to serve students, the paperwork that's expected under IDEA is significant and so we are working really hard to figure out how is it that we don't move into some kind of enormous paperwork event and stay focused on students and families staying flexible to address the mental health needs and the well being of families is really important and so figuring out how to be legally compliant while also staying focused on what we need to stay focused on has been much of the conversation. I can directly engage with OSEP as it relates to thinking about these issues and have been providing leadership for all of our states we've had several meetings and we've offered webinars thinking about the continuum of learning that's happening right now it's different all over the country. Some school districts have been shutting down around the country, articulating that they are not able to create equitable access. They have spoken about this issue and said that is not what should happen. And in so doing, the ability to create parity or true equity of educational access for one student versus another when our mode of instructional delivery has been contained so significantly by requiring distance between children and teachers is very challenging. I also in my testimony that I provided you and writing spoke specifically to the equity issues that Secretary French talked about in reference to Internet access. It is true that being able to talk with you like this in this environment of video chat is much more efficient and effective of a teaching modality than simply trying to consult with a family by phone to try to cause a parent to be a teacher. Where we only have access to phone and consultation or talking on the phone to the child to try to instruct. That's a really big challenge and is creating a significant equity issue. I would also say that for families who are experiencing food insecurity right now. That's another factor, as well as mental health issues that's another factor. How much of academic work can or can't be done in any given circumstance. I am deeply worried across this country and in Vermont and in my own space of local directorship about creating a further divide from an equity perspective in this work. That's not to say that I think we need to stop. I don't we need to figure out how to do this, but I think we need to be very aware of the equity issues that are showing up and what students with disabilities can and cannot access under the circumstances and how we're going to handle that. So I think I'll stop there. And again, feel free. There are other points within the written testimony that you're welcome to review and offer you all an opportunity. Ask me questions. I'm happy to answer federal questions. I'm happy to answer state level questions because I have been very involved in state level leadership around it as well as well as the local implementation and the Essex Westford School District should be helpful. Questions. Kathleen. Yeah, thanks so much for for being here. Obviously, one of the main themes of the day is equity. As Kate has said and how we're going to try to deliver on that paramount priority at a time when those differences between kind of the haves and have nots are only going to be heightened. I just wanted to make sure I understood something you said and then, and then ask a quick question, which is that, did I understand you correctly that other districts not in Vermont obviously but elsewhere in the country when faced with the challenge of trying to provide an equitable education under these circumstances are simply throwing in the towel and calling it on the school year did I did I misunderstand that. How do you understood that correctly there were some news articles about it if you sort of Google this issue you can find some circumstances around the country where they made that decision, I am hearing concerns even in Vermont about the inequities that people feel are happening particularly for students with disabilities who have significant needs and even with the creativity and all the ideas in the world feeling like there's just no way without my child being at school that they can access their education and that's not fair. That's actually a violation of IDA under the law and so there were some that some districts that came to a place at least initially where they made a determination that they weren't offering anything to anyone because they couldn't do it within the confines of the non discrimination clauses and expectations particularly under IDA. OSEP issued guidance on last weekend about this issue and made it clear that that was not an appropriate way to be thinking about this and that they did not want to see districts not offering anything because it couldn't be perfectly equitable under the law as it was written. And so we have heard the US Department of Education speak on that issue and have been given clear direction, but yes you did hear me accurately that that is a storyline that's out there. I don't personally have a connection to any of the directors in spaces that made that decision. My counterparts across the country that I know and engage with have been moving more in line with the direction of Vermont. But, yeah, that did happen. I'm misunderstood. So, thanks. Yeah, thanks for thanks for clarifying. I'm glad to hear we're taking a different approach. Glad and not surprised to hear that we've got a very different attitude here in Vermont. So thank you. And then Dylan after that representative Jean Batiste after Thanks to questions I guess one follows up on Kathleen's question and that is I mean the reality of being able to have equity right now, given that for example some IEP really can only be fulfilled with in classroom instruction or at least one to one contact and and it's just simply not possible. I sort of understand this throwing in the towel attitude. And I guess. So the question really is, what sort of guidance do you expect from the federal level to address the fact that equity just isn't going to be possible. There have been some conversations at the federal level about what this will mean as it relates to something called compensatory services. So compensatory service is a legal fix to a circumstance where a school district does not deliver what was promised under special education. I am struggling with that context myself as a director because the district is not denying anything we have a crisis and a virus that's denying things I you know if I could I would. I have a little bit of a challenge with the federal perspective right now on compensatory education frameworks. However, they are being used as language at the federal level at this time to try to what I might describe as redress the equity issues after the fact. So there is some recognition at the federal level that some of this is by the circumstances, literally impossible. So where we have a goal for a student to engage with a peer, or a group of peers across a long period of time and play together as part of a, an IEP goal in order to address social engagement, which is something we do a lot. You know that's impossible. What does that mean upon return. Now that we've closed for the remainder of the school year. That question I think starts to also become part of the conversation. The Agency of Education in Vermont has delivered some direction around thinking about compensatory education upon return. So we not only have a lack of delivery because of COVID-19 as it relates to special education and IEP is we also have the danger of regression that takes place for individuals with disabilities that's much more prominent for students with some some students with disabilities than it is for their general education peers and what will happen if they cannot receive services in the ways that make progress for them over the term and they regress. I do think there's some federal money coming as it relates to these issues and so financially I'm for lack of a better term banking on some support from the federal government as it relates to financial investment and there is almost only so much time in a day when children need a break and you can't serve them for 24 hours a day to redress what has taken place across this crisis. I do expect we'll hear more guidance about this. I do expect we'll see a request from the Secretary of Education at the federal level to Congress to consider these issues as it relates to the federal law that only Congress can change. And so I don't think we have all the answers to those questions right now but I certainly am well aware of all of them and and fairly limited as a local director and what I can do in this very moment in time to avoid the challenges and we'll need to be very creative about redressing the impact of this lack of service and educational program for some students over the term. And if just if you could very quickly just talk a little bit about what special educators in your district are doing day to day right now. Yeah and I know that you will hear from a we will hear from someone this afternoon to go ahead. Very quick. Very quick. And so we are working with families to create something called distance learning plans for special education and we're working to figure out what families can tolerate what families feel they need. What we believe students are able to do and thinking about the goals that students can meet during this time and developing a document to the side of the IEP to be sure that we're documenting all of that and working with families around that and then implementing those plans. We are in active process of the development of plans both from a maintenance perspective, as we went through this maintenance phase so we have sort of two different sections of the plan. One is a maintenance phase how are we maintaining the progress we've made so far on IEP goals, and then upon this move from education educational continuity into learning continuity at that right, right. We will move into a conversation about what services and supports can we offer under the circumstance in order to make progress on IEP goals and that will be the second phase of the plan which will also be documented. We will be applying parental rights to all of those so I it's really important to me that parents know that school districts maybe held accountable to the work that we're doing right now. That is a huge part of special education and a really critical feature of this discussion so families feel like they're at the table as much as they want to be right now. So that's how we're addressing it we will also be documenting assessment and progress to the best extent we can, as we move, move through we are offering IEP meetings to any family who wants to do them. We're not stopping the progress and trying to implement the law to the greatest extent possible that's our legal and moral obligation to do and so we're really working hard to do that. Yeah, thank you for being here Aaron and for sharing your expertise both regionally and nationally it's super helpful and we just really appreciate it. I just had the calendar pulled up on my computer here and my head is spinning and I have a question but just I want to lay this out because it's incredible March 15 I think it was we got the word that they were going to be closing schools through April. They were implemented by Wednesday the 18th. Last night was the 26th. When the news came down that we were going to be closing schools for the remainder of the year. Here we are on the 27th and I think I heard the Secretary of Education say that the agency would be issuing guidance today. By which time, it looks like in about a week and a half on the eighth districts need to have their plan for continuity of learning put forward for review by the agency and then implemented on Monday the 13th. That's a one month turnaround and I know we're in crisis, but I'm just wondering, do you feel like the guidance is clear enough based on what you're seeing other states do. I heard you say earlier we need clear guidance and I'm just kind of holding on to that I heard Sue say it. Do you think you're going to be able to turn this around successfully in all corners of the state, because I am worried about the equity piece, and I know everyone's pulling in the same direction, but I just worried that the guidance isn't clear. And so how do we ensure everyone's getting that rich education, recognizing that we're inventing it on the fly. I will speak locally to say that I'm grateful for my level of experience and understanding of the law today for my own school district and I have had to rest on that significantly in order to know what to do. I worry about directors and leaders who do not have a lot of experience or a lot of background special education directors are hard to find these days. They're not a lot of us out there and so there are people in the work who have mentors and are brand new and so I think the point being that guidance that's very clear is very important. I think the agency has been working hard to do that but doing it too quickly does not recognize the changing landscape in which we sit. And I have seen some guidance come out that for me has not lined up with either what I'm seeing in nationally or what I believe to be right and best practice where I've had to make some phone calls have some conversations. And so I think our expectation of our own agency about getting it exactly right moment by moment is a really tall order and yet I wish they could. But they're also not perfect and neither are we and so there is a little bit of two steps forward one step back three steps forward one step back, trying to figure out what is that guidance that's necessary. I would not say that we have all the guidance we need but there's more I know there's more guidance coming. I think that the issue of IP amendments is an area that is of great concern and I know the agency is working on guidance on that. We are very concerned about finance, as you all are as well as I just heard in testimony earlier, particularly as it relates to special education and the funding formula. I was very clear that I was hopeful that I would not see a lot of micro management of what will and won't be reimbursed during this time. And yet I worry that if we keep situating ourselves in laws written for not this situation, but other more normality that we will end up doing things that do not recognize the kind of crisis that we are in. And so deciding something isn't reimbursable right now that has potential to create some real problems. And so I know they're working on it. I know that this bit and the School Board Association and the superintendents and the special ed directors are all providing feedback into the agency about this issue. I think communication is really important. I was surprised not to know that schools were closing for the rest of the year, other than on the news. I mean, Dan's not here for me to say that to him, but that was an unexpected experience for me. I don't know, you know, I'm not in the agency to know exactly how challenging it is. One of the things I'm working to do right now is really try to assume the best of everyone at the moment at this moment in time. Because it is really hard for everybody. Yes, we need guidance. Yes, it would be great if it was really upfront and really accurate. Can we expect that right now. I don't necessarily know the answer to that question, but guidance is critical as it relates to consistent practice across this state, and we do need the agency to provide that. As you have said, and I wasn't aware of this that in the Senate bill that is now over in the house in Congress does give some authority to the Department of Education for flexibility around around some of the special ed issues that you mentioned, it provides an accurate, it provides an opportunity for the secretary within 19 to 30 days or I don't know if the number 19 say but within 30 days to request the kinds of facilities necessary under IDA ESSA and other laws at the federal level, given the crisis so Congress has formally asked the department, if this passes, they will have formally asked and it doesn't change. We'll have formally asked the department for their recommendation. It requires the recommendation to come forward, Congress to consider it, and then pass legislation across both chambers to make a change. So some of, and this is particularly true for IDA. Most of what we do under IDA is in statute. I think it is not regulation the regulations mimic the statute almost in its entirety, some additions maintenance of effort though is one of the areas that under crisis the secretary can wave so just so you all know as you start to think about finance and education, I would expect that we'll see some of that relief, but as far as the rules, that's the process that it will have to go through. And all of this changes moment by moment by moment that's my current understanding I have not checked the news this morning though right so what gets pulled what gets added what language gets changed seems to be a very moving target to be able to we're tracking it, trying to use it to the greatest extent we can. Thank you. Let's see representative Austin. Oh, I can't hear you Serena. Okay, hi. Hi, I'm sorry you may have the answer this question I know this is probably what your experience is is a national issue because this is a federal law. And I'm wondering if there's any conversation, you know, at the federal level of how to not suspend rules but look at the rules in terms of the delivery of special ed plans in the context of COVID-19 and so you're not spending a lot of energy trying to fit a square peg into a round hole but trying to have a context where you can deliver services to children within this context. We are absolutely trying to think carefully and support our members which are all the special ed directors in the nation about how to do this creatively within the context of the law. That's written right now. And so that is something that we're actively doing providing lots of examples sharing resources across states. The Vermont's resources and the Essex Westford resources have gone very out there pretty far because everyone's looking for examples all around the country. Kansas was actually one of the first states to close for the rest of the year and the other states in which Utah morphed the Essex Westford plan into the Kansas plan for him. So, you know, we are sharing and trying to address this in ways that are creative. By the way, I want to share I've seen some amazing work be done with students with intensive special needs through video engagement. It's amazing what's happening out there. It is still very different right then being together all day with kids. So there are a lot of creative ideas coming up. Again, parent engagement has been a critical part of that conversation and trying to be respectful about where families find themselves. That's also been one of our messages. So still within the current federal law, whatever relief we get from the federal law is likely to be more online with it's okay to extend the annual IEP meeting date. We need to extend the 60 day timeline for an evaluation. We need to extend the three year old birthday expectation from part C to part B as it relates to transition. We need to be able to address IEPs in a way that doesn't cause us to try to rewrite every IEP across the nation and maybe have something on the side that can articulate in this moment of crisis what we're doing. So those are the kinds of relief that I expect will be coming up. Whether it's happening or not, I don't know. And it's not going to stop us locally from doing the best we can for students and trying to comply. I mean, I'm trying actively to comply with annual review dates right now as a local director. Try to see if you can do it on Zoom. Try to see if you can do it by phone. Go ahead and see if you can have a conversation about these issues. I work to be very compliant. That's part of the center of my being. I certainly don't want to be outside the law ever. And so we're trying to do that as best we can. We'll see if that relief comes. But I think the creativity is about sharing ideas. I think Secretary French said that well is it related to sharing ideas, giving ideas and talking about what's possible under the circumstances for all students, including students with disabilities. Thank you. Okay. Thank you so much, Aaron. This was very, we're very lucky to have you in our backyard. Thank you. Really appreciate your expertise and knowledge and hope that you can share some of that with the special directors of our state as well. Absolutely. Absolutely. Thank you for having me. And if there's anything I can do to help, don't hesitate to ask. You may well be bringing you back. Okay. We think of where we were two weeks ago what I was thinking about two weeks ago isn't is completely gone, compared to where we are now and who knows where we'll be in two weeks from now. Yes, for sure. All right. I wish you all well, stay healthy and I'm sure I'll see some of you soon. Thank you. Thank you. Good afternoon. We'll be on again. Is that 145 Avery? Is that right? Yes, and I'll be on starting at 130. So feel free to log on a little bit early before we go live on YouTube. Yeah, organized. Yeah. That's great. So we will be hearing from the field. I know that there are some people will have some questions that some of the questions that that went to people this morning may be best directed towards the superintendents and teachers who will be presenting to us to this afternoon. It's, it's a long period of time. There's a lot that we're trying to fit in there. I think what I'll probably do as I, I don't know about you but I, this is, it's, this is a different way of meeting and I think that there's kind of an hour and a half limit. So what I'd like to consider and wondering if this would work for you for us to meet for an hour and a half and then take a five or 10 minute break, and then finish up. Okay. I'm not yes or no. Sounds good. Okay, good. Okay, can I add something. Having watched a couple other meetings of other committees I just want to compliment you and Avery this was not clunky seemed to run very smoothly without any glitches. Thank you. You can turn everybody's mics on we could just have a closing conversation. We're officially off YouTube, starting out and just, I'll let you know when we're officially off YouTube I'm just going to check.