 consultant for Miigmao-Ganama-Nui in Nova Scotia. So what kind of work do you do for them? My main job is to work with Miigmao language teachers in Miigmao-Ganama-Nui schools and assist with Miigmao language teachers that are in the provincial schools, which aren't very many, but that's a part of who we, because their students are part of the communities that are part of Miigmao-Ganama-Nui. And not all communities have their own schools, so students have to attend provincial schools. So do all the teachers do the same kind of curriculum? No, the teachers go by what they have been using over the years. They adopt a lot of what Eskizoni has developed in the immersion school for Miigmao language. And because Eskizoni is a bit stronger in Miigmao language, other communities rely on them for their expertise, and the teachers have developed their program in Eskizoni. So it helps other schools in other communities because it's pretty well successful in Eskizoni. It works for them, and because it's for lower grades, it's good for the communities that don't have speaking students. What grades like do you cover? All grades, from kindergarten to grade 12. And what are some of the things that are important for teaching the language? To teach the language, we have to integrate a lot of the culture. There are students now who don't identify with being Miigmao. They don't understand the implication of speaking the language, and it's really sad because they lose a great deal of their identity and their connection to the traditions and the culture. And I believe that if you're a parent that you should share your language with your children because when they lose it, it's gone. Have you seen any impact on the students since they've had taking language courses? Some students are proud of what they have learned. They're going to be using Eskizoni again, the immersion school, because they have a teacher now who teaches physical education, but also the cultural side of Miigmao. He has blossomed and developed this program where students are learning, they're learning off the land, even though they're in a classroom. He takes them out and they learn about fishing and harvesting medicinal plants. He teaches about basketry and anything that's important in the culture. So because he's teaching that, he's teaching them the words that go along with it and the students, I believe, have really taken to it. They also have a drum group and dancers, so they're invited to attend graduations and ceremonies and grand openings to display what they have learned. And you could see it, you could see that the students faces how much pride they have from learning this. So I think learning the language is important. And it's tough for some communities, but I think if you're resilient, that it'll eventually be stronger. What do you think it is about the Miigmao Language Program at MK that makes it so great and so effective? I think it's because we embrace technology. One of the programs that I am involved with is called the Holistic Assessment, the Olnoimk Assessment. And it's an assessment where we try to gather data from K-4 in primary and grade one students. They're introduced to a puppet that's a moose, and we call him, his name is Andle, and the students are introduced to him in the classroom, and he becomes a part of the classroom and a part of all the curriculum, not just the Miigmao Language, but all of the curriculum. This assessment is gathering information on how much the students are learning about themselves, about their home, about what language they use at home, what language their parents are using in the community. Parents are also interviewed as well, and caregivers, because there are parents or students who don't have parents, and their grandparents or custodians, whoever's taking care of the child. We also interview school staff and bus drivers. Any people that have contact with the student are involved in the whole assessment, and I think it's really successful because we are getting data on how much the students know about themselves. How do you measure success in that way or in other other ways? It's hard for, I can't put out, how can I say it, An assessment of the language skills of students can't be measured accurately, because in each community, in each of the province of Nova Scotia has a different level of language. Unfortunately, the mainland communities that are further away from Cape Breton have literally no speakers. There's one community that has two speakers who are very elderly, and when they're gone, they're gone. I'm not sure if it has anything, I know it has a lot to do with the residential school and the location of it being in Sebeg Negati. The communities around there have lost the language, and like I said before, the concentration of Big Maw is in Neski-Soni now, which is in Cape Breton, so we're separated geographically by the causeway, but I've noticed that communities that are close to whatever was left or the land where the school was, the language is pretty much gone, but it's hard to put in a data-wise assessment number on it, because they are trying to bring back the language in the school, and Sebeg Negati has an elder in their classroom, and she helps the teacher with teaching the language, because she's a speaker, and she knows a lot of the culture, so she teaches the teacher who's teaching the students in the classroom. So while they're speaking in Big Maw, the students can see the conversation between them, and they can see the facial expression, so it's hard to put a grade number on it, because you don't want to discourage a community and say that your students are not learning, but they are learning. It's just very slow, and to me it's hard to measure that assessment number. Like if someone else wanted to make a language program, like what do you think they would need, or what advice would you have for them? I think they should research the immersion school in Neski-Soni. They have made strides in helping students to get back their language. The only drawback is it only goes up to grade four, and the grade four in the immersion school is half-and-half, half-English and half-Migamon, so they already have so much English language going into that school. To me, I think the grades should go higher, so the students will be stronger speakers when they graduate from the program in grade four, even though when they move to the regular program at the middle school in grade five, they have a Migamon-speaking teacher, and they're kept together, I guess, to integrate them into that school. I think the immersion school, the principal and the teachers are very welcoming, and they don't mind people go in there and asking them, can you help us? Because they'll help with anybody, and they'll help with any program, and they have a lot of history of developing their program, so they know hands-on what works and what doesn't work, so that would be the best route I'd say. Was there anything that you wanted to say? Well, okay, before, was there any challenges that you have running the program? The challenge about Migamon language is students are not speaking the language, that another challenge is young parents, they're young parents who have children who don't speak the language, they may have some knowledge of it, but they choose not to speak it, and then they have these babies and they don't speak the language, so it's even, the number of speakers is even getting less, and the challenge I have is trying to get parents motivated in sharing their language with their children. What are some resources you think that might help if you had them? We at MK have developed language apps, we know that parents are using nowadays, are using iPads and tablets as like virtual babysitters, and it's sad, but we knew that we've seen that trend and we knew that we needed to embrace, like I said, we embrace technology, so we have to use technology, even though technology was used against their language, we need to turn it around and use the technology in trying to bring the language back, so some of the apps that we developed were the Robert Munch books that we had translated, we were able to build apps from it, where you can have the story being read to you by one of our elders who recorded the story, so you can read along, or you can use one of the other apps, one of them is a, we call it a lexicon of words, and we also have a dull bluen app, which is sort of like a phrase builder, where if you wanted to learn how to say where is the wash room, you could just pick one of the where, and then it'll tell you like the next question, jump to the next question where is or whatever, so I think we have to do something and I think we have to use, like I said, use technology. Was there anything about the program itself that you wanted to say? I'm pretty proud of the schools and the teachers stepping up. One of the, I have to mention this, a challenge that we have with Mi'kma'u language teachers in schools is priority. A lot of the schools are prioritizing literacy and numerous, there's nothing wrong with that, but if for instance a school had too many substitutes and then we needed another one for Mi'kma'u language, they would send, they would cancel the Mi'kma'u language sub and tell the teacher that you can't go to a PD session, so that teacher would miss out on it, and we started having sessions on Saturdays. At the beginning, I was worried that nobody would want to, who was going to want to come to work on a Saturday to learn anything, and the first time we had it, we had 110% attendance, so we knew that it worked, and that they were willing to learn, they were willing to come on their weekends, and they don't have much time, and they came in to learn, so. What do I see as Indigenous? I think it's Indigenous education that has a lot to do with learning about yourself, how you fit in society. It's learning about your language, your culture, and your traditions, and how you can integrate all of these into expanding your mind. It's not forgetting about your past and your ancestors, and all of their battles and their fights, and especially upholding their rights. I think a lot of it is about Indigenous education, this language. You need to have a strong self-life of identity, and to get that, you have to have language. Is there a different way of teaching Indigenous education than teaching other things, do you think? What do you mean? Should it be taught a certain way? I think so, because to get to the core of Indigenous language, or not language, but Indigenous education, you have to follow the traditions and the calendar way of Indigenous peoples, for instance, following the seasons of fishing and hunting, planting, gathering. It's things like that, that you have to integrate into a curriculum to make it Indigenous. I think following your eccentric way is, you're just satisfying the provincial curriculum, but I think it's important to have students learn about hunting. They need to learn about harvesting vegetables, for instance. They don't know the terms about it. They don't know what a garden is. They don't know when you should plant, or what time of year you should plant, or harvest, and I think that's a big component of Indigenous education. What do you hope to see in Indigenous education over the next 10 years? That what I just said, that students would be able to learn following the Indigenous calendar, following the 13 moons, following, not following, but using language, integrating the language so that they learn the language, they learn to speak it, they learn to have pride, and they have a strong sense of identity.