 Okay, welcome back everyone to our final segment, wrap up day two of our coverage of live, wall-to-wall two days coverage of Red Hat Summit. This is the GUI, our flagship program. We go out to the events, they extract the signal from the noise. I'm John Furrier with my co-host this week, Stu Miniman from Wikibon. I'm going to also be at the OpenStack Summit, also a bunch of other events too. I thought it was a great week and I want to say it was a real pleasure co-hosting with you, subbing in for Dave Vellante, not subbing in, but usually it's Dave, but you're the lead on the cloud in infrastructure. I thought it was pretty amazing. I mean, you had a lot of Red Hat executives, but we needed that. I really wanted to hear from them and I learned a lot about what they're doing and a chance to ask them pointed questions. Also, talk off camera and get a lot of insight. So I want to ask you a first thing, what's your key insight walk away from this show? Yeah, John, you know, it's been great to get to know the culture and some of the key players inside of Red Hat. It's been said that if you look at the big open source communities, it takes a big personality and some leaders like a Jim Whitehurst to be able to drive this forward. And I think we see, you know, coming out party here. Red Hat has always been a good partner in the ecosystem, you know, driving that Linux message out and they're really trying to increase their position in the marketplace, try to become the, you know, Red Hat of open stack, trying to, you know, push their virtualization solution more. Going after the developer community, I mean, John, you know, 4500 people here at the Red Hat show and 700 at Dev Nation. So we've been to a lot of shows when I look at kind of a percentage of the show that actually drew in developers. This has got to be one of the highest percentages. Now it didn't hurt that the chef conference was going on down the street. So a lot of people were bouncing to both. You know, a lot of good actions of really good people and obviously a big community because, you know, Red Hat is all about the community, open source and all the contributors, most of which are not working for Red Hat. Yeah, Stu, I was really impressed with Red Hat. I've always liked Red Hat, so, you know, disclosure, I'm a big fan of Red Hat, you know, being at my age and having a computer science degree back when, you know, the early stages of open source will really get taken their roots around commercializing open source. You saw that, that the Apache hit the scene, you seeing J Boss, you saw that what Linux did. And, you know, I've always been a big fan of Red Hat but one thing that struck me is that, two things, they're alpha geeks. They're computer science guys, X-deck, a lot of systems guys, they're super technical. I mean, I always knew they were technical but I didn't think they were like this Uber technical at senior levels. So we're not talking about like product manager, we're talking about the senior staff of Red Hat, super technical tech athletes as we say. And the other thing is that they're really low key, they don't like the grandstand. So their marketing is, I'm not going to say weak, I'm just saying that's not core, they're not a big marketer. They don't like the grandstand and that's part of the developer open source culture. You know, developers don't like to see people marketing a lot of stuff. Our marketing is a waste of money from a developer standpoint. So you see the same thing with Amazon. They don't always have the best amenities at their conferences because they put all their dough into servicing the developers and having more guys fly to the event to do training sessions, to do hands-on labs. That's the difference. And I think that kind of hurts them in the public sphere, in the press, because the big PR firms get all the other firms get some press, but in the long game with open source, truth always rises to the top. And I think Red Hat is poised due to be major force in being what IBM did with Linux when Red Hat took advantage of that. Red Hat now can be the master of their own domain by setting the agenda for OpenStack. If they could do that and galvanize the industry with an ecosystem behind them, they could run the table on OpenStack and be in a prize grade. Yeah, John, you bring up a good point because Red Hat has always played well to the Greek geeks. When you talk about the guys that are back there coding, they've always known Linux and Red Hat, but if you went to the C-suite, a lot of times they were invisible. So how does Red Hat become more strategic and help get a bigger seat at that table? Red Hat's still for all that they've done, they're only a $1.3 billion company, which makes them one of the larger storage companies, software companies, especially if you look at a company that is all software. They're in the top 20, but compared to the big infrastructure and cloud guys out there, I mean, Amazon's way beyond them. Almost triple the size in revenue. And there's plenty of opportunities if Red Hat can hit it right. Well, Red Hat, they're not a greedy company because they have balance in the upstream of the stores and commercializing it and that's always a challenge in itself. We heard from the management that it's a balance, but here's what's happened with Red Hat. They got 65% market share in the enterprise in the open source software. And what's happened is back during the, I'd say the down cycle of IT, server consolidation, the open source was clearly a low cost alternative to proprietary vendors. So then with the server vendors and the mini-computers going wind-tell, Red Hat was the logical choice, but now banks, people, real businesses have a lot of Red Hat and it's working good. Now they got to extend that. So they don't have a lot of customer satisfaction problems. They have a customer demand problem to go to the cloud. So I think that's an interesting data point that we need to take into consideration. So John, interesting note, of course, you said 65%, that's of revenue because one of the biggest competitors to Red Hat isn't necessarily the Microsofts or even the VMware's out there, but it's the guys like Canonical. And even Red Hat admitted this in a way through really kind of that partnership slash acquisition that they did of CentOS. So who are the big contributors to Linux? It's not only Red Hat, but some of the scale guys like Google and Facebook out there that use Linux and build their business on Linux but aren't buying from Red Hat. So in the future, will they continue to buy from Red Hat? What part of the market goes free versus understanding that they need the Red Hat solution? Great points too. I think that's a great clarification and I want to get to your analysis in a second, but I want to ask you a question. At the beginning of the segment, we said, what are we looking for today? And we said, OpenStack adoption question, is the stack baked? What are some of the big names like Intel, Cisco, IBM, getting behind it, got Docker, Starter and the DevOps culture. So I'd ask you on these points we were looking for today, OpenStack adoption, your assessment based on the interviews in the past two days. So I'd say OpenStack is about where we would expect it to be about four years into its development, which means that there are real customers using it, but it's not widely deployed. Some revenue's starting to come in, Red Hat has some of it and there's still work to be done. When Ice House comes out in April, expectation is that we will see a significant jump from Havana to Ice House, just like we did when we got to Havana. So every six months, code's coming out and it's getting more mature. Really, the expectation is within the next 12 to 18 months there sure better be some meaningful revenue there because the ecosystem and everybody has put so much effort into it that we should start to see things, moving to the positive on the revenue standpoint. Yeah, I mean, I take an OpenStack adoption because I didn't hear what I wanted to hear today. I wanted to hear much more OpenStack penetration. What I did hear though is Red Hat is all in on OpenStack. They are committed, they have significant investment both in dollars and in projects and they do have meat in the bone. So they'd have production grade. They're committed and the convictions there but I was looking for like a punch in the face, like we are so in. I didn't hear that OpenStack mojo. I heard, yeah, we're tracking along. So it's like they're building the bridge, span by span and just building it out but I didn't get the knocked out of my chair with the OpenStack vibe at all in terms of other than we're definitely going there. Yeah, and I think that's a commentary really on OpenStack and where that stands as opposed to anything that would be a negative on Red Hat. And absolutely, John, a month from now when we're in Atlanta, we want to be talking to some customers and where they are deploying this. I mean, they're not head faking OpenStack, it's clear but we heard them, they're very cautious on what they ship and what they ship is bulletproof. That's what they're saying. But I want to see more. I mean, I want to see Red Hat step up and stand up front and say OpenStack is going to be legit all the way in, we're all in on that. So, let's next question, is the stack big? From an OpenStack standpoint? Just overall, Red Hat, they got DevOps, you got on-prem, you got that continuation. I like the quote we heard this morning around it's not as exclusive as the data center to the clouds, the continuum. Right, so John, they laid out their four pillars, physical, virtual, private and public clouds. Linux can now be anywhere. So Red Hat, Linux, obviously in private cloud they're doing real well. So, I think around 28% of server revenue is going with Linux today in 2013 data. That's pretty solid, really Red Hat was positioning that it's a battle between Microsoft and Red Hat for that revenue. Secondly, from a virtualization standpoint, KVM and Rev specifically are gaining traction, but it's not like they've knocked over VMware. VMware is still dominant in that space. Yes, there are companies that are looking to be able to get off of that licensing and especially if they look at something like OpenStack and that adoption, that might be a pivot point to be able to move off VMware. But I didn't see anything that made me think that we've seen a seismic shift in virtualization. All the public cloud guys have lined up to support Linux and we just had the commentary on OpenStack. So, really good progress and a lot of opportunity. I think Tim Yeaton said it best and I think I was actually not looking for anything in particular. I just wanted to see some signaling but I think there's no game-changing stack discussions going on around what's going on in the stacks. I wanted to hear their vision of integrated stacks around OpenStack and there wasn't anything there except for the container piece. So that is a real key. So to me, the stack discussion was enlightening to me. I learned a lot, really knocked me out of my chair. That piece is an absentric app delivery focus. It's really, so I heard four things there on the stack that was very, very pleasing from an industry alignment standpoint that Red Hat got an A plus on. One, this notion of workloads, that any workload and focusing on the job at hand, having the right configuration and agile for the workload around OpenStack. And the OpenStack is only going to shift bulletproof to the app enablement, deployment, getting rapid acceleration for agile programming. The storage is interesting, right? You know, not a lot of sexy announcement but this interesting single name space and the data virtualization is very interesting to me and finally the management piece was key. So breadth of capabilities was highly impressive. Yeah, I mean John, on that container piece, I mean we talked about it a lot and because it is important especially when we get to the point that it's not just on Linux but it does Windows that really allows for some portability across clouds and across virtualization platforms. So companies don't necessarily want to have hugely heterogeneous environments but they do want to be able to move between environments if they so choose or have that flexibility and the containers shows some real promise to get there. As you've said a number of times, it's an idea that's been around for a while and it seems like it's really coming to fruition now. So Stu, I think I just want to end my piece here and I'll let you get the final word in here is that I think Red Hat is completely poised and just some notes I've made here is that what virtualization has done to the Linux marketplace around the data center and the innovation around that it's been spectacular, it's well documented. I mean we have a lot of CUBE interviews we should do, we should actually do a summary documentary just from our CUBE interviews. Virtualization has changed the game on the data center, it changed the game on all the players involved and that's been fantastic. Linux has been a big driver of that and then that's critical. So also the JBoss Linux combination is DevOps and this is not like a marketing strategy from Red Hat. It's not like they say, hey, let's do some DevOps. They actually have it in their DNA and their super geeks. And finally, this container messaging is really the cloud. So virtualization for Linux for the data center and what containers have done for the cloud combined with the heritage of JBoss and Linux and wrapped the ecosystem credibility around it. Red Hat has a lot of the rocket fuel right there, Stu. So I think ending this show very enlightening, great to meet the personalities behind Red Hat. They're tech athletes, the guys like we'd like to talk to but they have a lot of stuff going on that is interesting and relevant not just a Johnny come lately, let's throw some stuff to be sexy in the marketplace. Yeah, John, we talked a lot about OpenShift here and there's a lot of big questions around Paz. I thought it was really enlightening that Dell really gave an endorsement of both Red Hat's position on OpenStack as well as OpenShift. But at the same time, Dell was also working with Cloud Foundry and Pivotal. And our guest on theCUBE, Sam said that ideally we're going to be able to work across Paz platforms and maybe the containers are actually going to help us with some of that environment because we don't want to have a total stack or all the time. Nobody wants Amazon to win everything and nor do we want a Paz layer to become a lock-in to a certain type of environment. So the criticism that would say OpenShift is going to push you heavily towards Jboss and if you're Pivotal, they're still going to want you to have VMware about that backend infrastructure. There's companies like IBM and Dell and HP and Cisco that are going to really step forward to the table that make sure that there's flexibility and the customers are going to demand that because at the end of the day, nobody wants to be locked in. You know, Stu's been a great run here. I want to assist. The interviews were fantastic from Jim to the CEO to the guests that were the partners we had. Dell was fantastic talking about their announcement. Doug Fisher from Intel was really an amazing interview. To hear Intel talk about their innovation strategy and answering candidly, quite frankly, the Cloudera question was awesome with Cloudera doing great job validation. Hortonworks is the red hat of Hadoop. Cloudera is now fully kind of an IPO, if you will, with their big financing. So they have no pressure now in the short term to deliver. They've got the long game going on which is going to give them a lot of cover because they have a big vision and between the big vision of Cloudera and the blocking and tackling of Horton we're just seeing some massive big data action. And then we had, you know, Cisco, Padma was awesome talking about commitment to open source. And then just overall the executives of Red Hat getting to know them for our first show, Stu, was great to sit down with them. I'm looking forward to the next Red Hat Summit where we can actually have more of a year of history and find out kind of how they did and what's changing the business and the technology. And certainly the OpenStack Summit's coming up in Atlanta, we'll be there live. It's going to be pretty amazing, Stu. Thank you very much for being the co-analyst, co-host Wingman this week. Appreciate it. Thanks to the team here, let's look at Angle. Guys, great job. That's a wrap here from the Red Hat Summit. This is theCUBE signing off and we'll see you at our next event.