 Thank you for staying with us. You're still watching the breakfast on plus TV Africa right now It's time to take our hot topic and this talks about ex-governance lawmaker's others demanding new constitution for Nigeria Joining us to have a conversation is justice away with his a human rights lawyer joining us from a budget. Good morning sir Thank you for joining us Thank you Okay, so we're talking about the Nigerian Constitution and now many have said that the Constitution is a little bit obsolete There are a lot of things that just don't it's not necessary anymore And we need some form of Reconfiguration for the Constitution and especially if we're looking at a renewed hope I mean that's the era we are now in so we're talking about a renewed hope over talking about prosperity for Nigeria A lot of people say we need to look at our Constitution and try to look for ways to just rejig it if I can use that word But first I mean you are a human rights lawyer, so definitely you have access to the Constitution You know what it's all about. You've probably read it What do you think about the Nigerian Constitution? Would you agree that it is a little bit obsolete? I may not be advocating for Scrapping up The whole Constitution For me the 1989 Constitution as amended also has some Good provisions in the Constitution, but there are also some provisions in control that are already absolute and again We need to amend if I will need to continue amending the Constitution in order to be in funding with the development and norms of the society because as the society grows the law grows along with the society So I believe and I agree to the fact that the Constitution at this point in time needs a serious and holistic amendment Okay, so speaking about a serious and holistic amendment like you've said What do you think are some specific specific lines or Specific areas of the Constitution that you think according to you I mean, this is just your own opinion that you just probably think we need to amend this Well, first of all, I believe We should also look at it before the Constitution We talked about it from the mental human rights There are certain things we should look into there. Then we'll also look at the Directed principles which The the position may not be just visible So we need to look at this also so that that session of the condition for me It should be just visible at first. I'm confined If we look at it, then we also look at the executive powers, you know the Constitution compare a couple of hours to the presence of the governor's and other we should also look at all those areas because I think the Executive they are using that area of that section of the country stop and also It is a that area will look at how we can work at them the powers of the executive and Secondly, we should also, you know, have a realistic approach of the condition so that we can also have some other provisions for example the Consulate provided for Federal collector and all the re-metals as I as me and you know or if you don't know me I know that we are not using in any way comply with the positions of the consul and secondly, I think we should also look at Inspiring a position with the consul that will also make it criminalize it when people do not really abide by the position of the consul whether the executive, whether the legislature or whether the district so that there will be a penalty for people who abide the position of the constitution So how easy is it to draft a new constitution or even Just amend this constitution Who are the key factors does the public have any role to play or is it just some select few that just comes together and say We want to amend this constitution and this is what we want to do. What is the process like? I just want you to walk me through it That is they are they are they are major functions As far as the law is concerned But you should also remember that That's why they are there they are representing people. They are representing the total zone Federal zone Consistency and all the way and it is also the law that Why you are here if there is going to be a measurement or anything that is going to happen You should take a call go and consult with your constituency That's what we call public opinion And consulting with your constituency They have the stakeholders meeting, they have the town hall meeting, you know, people will be carried along People will say that at their own institute and all the way The national assembly members go back home, consult their constituencies, have town hall meetings with them and all the way So they are the Faddle the responsibility of amending the constitution of the bulk their major function is to make law on the country So what are some if you were to criticize the Constitution? I just need maybe like two or three If you are to criticize this current constitution that we have and say we need to change that what would be your own criticism To the Constitution and what would be some things that you personally would add so for instance One of these lawmakers has come to your constituency and you're trying to give your own public opinion and say This is what we want, especially for my own constituency. What are some things that you would want to put in there? For our personally Advocate that we We actually have one single Instead of the feelings and the national and the and the house of wealth because it is money-consuming I thought I'm confined if I if you look at this very well The most you must have been the same thing I thought I'm concerned. Yes. They are doing the same thing. So why why that and secondly? We should also look at the power conferred on the on the police assembly and all the way So the You know movement of the book at the test system We are not a game pass for me I'm also Advocate that will also look at the the process of the calling Recalling a little bit of if you come back home in this color that it is a mission almost important for you to recall Representing people because the the essence of Democracy that when somebody is a lecture I've been elected by the people and the person goes there and nothing what the people wanting to do that should be You know and have the news The the citizens will Recall a person, you know and maybe put in a letter for the best the the process here is so combatsom We also want us to look at the powers of the executive like I've said We are the president almost has when I call it 99.9% of the powers in Nigeria and all the way, you know the power to appoint these appoint the behind-the-cham and appoint the The CDN Because for example, if you say that I know he's independent in Nigeria and the present also The opportunity of appointing the next time and we're not moving forward. That is not democracy I thought I'm concerned. So we'll have to look at some of this was a and so many other things that will the country forward because People are moving forward. We cannot, you know, stay behind I mean, I like the fact that you just highlighted the president's being able to appoint all of these people right in power and Because that was even something I was going to ask something about power distribution Because if you look at you know this for instance, maybe we've been talking about the state's police For a while now, but if you look at it the power is centralized with the IGF police We have just one IGF police and that everyone comes under him So do you think this constitution will be able to, you know, just address issues like power distribution Resource control and federalism as a whole because this is supposed to be the federal Republic of Nigeria Do you even think we're practicing that at the moment and if this constitution will be able to address such issues? Yes, we know that everybody in this country knows that Nigeria is certainly a Republic of Nigeria, but we're not even passing through federalism. That is just for the same And that is why I say that We should also have it as a law that so that when you are in office and you are not in funding Or comply with the provisions of the constitution, it should be, it should be criminalized It should remain a criminal offense so that people will know and people can pay for what they have done So if we want to continue something as a decision for anybody that is coming in So as I am concerned, we are supposed to set out all these things policies to what is called true democracy and true federalism But let me tell you one thing, through federalism, you cannot talk about democracy without true federalism And that is why today, we want to approach it in Nigeria today, whether we like it or not is what I call party democracy So we must look at all the things holistically and tell ourselves the truth The problem we have is that we don't want to tell ourselves the truth Anybody that enters as a president, we want to move into our own way Why? Because of the power that the constitution has been voted in the president Or also, you know, that position of the president of the federal republic of Nigeria That is all the truth Okay, so have there been any way where we've tried to amend this constitution in the past? Was it successful? And you know, do you even know of any other country that have been able to do this over time? And then they get like very good results on this Yes, of course, if you remember, when we were, I think before it was 1989 constitution, before we got to 1999 And even before that time, there have been three of them, and basically my problem is this We have normally told the key areas where we are supposed to have a policy amendment In order to make sure that there is true democracy and true federalism If you like to talk about countries, look at countries like Burkina Faso and some other African countries that are moving for look at South Africa, for example The former president of South Africa is even having a wealth and life because of the constitution Because the constitution is not a set up of any man The constitution respects things even more, we are respecting some people His family is telling the truth People have always argued and have always even argued That there are two sets of laws operating in Nigeria One for the poor and one for the rich Yes, we are saying that democracy is all about rule of law And what is rule of law equality before the law? And you and I know that in this country, everybody is not equal to the law We are not like trying to practice this animal family That all animals are equal but some are more equal than others That is the point where I mean and it is only the constitution that can solve this problem So, well we are not all equal clearly as you said You know the constitution is for some people But then But we are supposed to be all equal That is the policy before the law What should be all equal? If the president can be said Okay, you remember in the time of the original currency When you were accused of the state standard and all the way I mean, it is a country No, anybody has seen it We could think of it as a country where it becomes a unique country But how do you expect that country to move forward? Okay, so my next line of question talks about the public The civil society, organizations, the public What role do we have to play to ensure that the constitution is holistic Like you rightly said We need one that is not just for some select few people Or that you know kind of protects Because in a way it seems the constitution is drafted In such a way that it protects some people It gives immunity to some people We want something that it makes everybody equal And the constitution is no exporter of anybody Everyone has to respect this constitution So what is the civil service organization and the general public What role do they have to play in all of this To ensure that we have a better constitution in Nigeria As you're asking this question, I'm not laughing Nowhere I'm laughing Why? Because let me tell you People may not like what I would say You may not But it is your opinion So you should be able to speak freely Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah I know, but you see I am in that field I know what I'm saying And I know what we are going to The truth of the matter is that We lack what I call security of purpose Yes, many people who see today That say they are civil society organizations They have human rights, lawyers, human rights They are just giving them for their selfish interests And that is why when any of them Or any group of them gets one political appointment Of God, I see that they don't do anything against So that is why I talk about lack of sincerity of purpose Because life is just for being For the totality of the nation We are supposed to be looking at How to salvage this country How to provide grants for our children And our children, yes, are gone If you go to the Western world Most of the countries today That they are failing to deal with Do not give them any time So how are you working for? Who are you trying to make the society to be better for? Why do you not give them our children? They're here We do have children Nobody is talking about losing a legacy And a good film work Because everybody thinks Getting a zoo has a position Maybe your children have this issue of one weapon control The other is the best We are shifting ourselves on the leg But not to worry about it Nigeria is our home And nobody can come here to do it for us Or to better it for all who must do it ourselves So what I'm trying to say And I'm doing here And I am still here At times, let me tell you the truth It is even for people To really be called at a time What you are even exciting for The topology of what you are fighting for For the interests of the people The people, you have probably Some of them you are fighting for Is it the ones that are getting you What the nation? But that is the truth So what we need is what I call Sensuality of purpose And because of the kind of government we are running Everybody wants one way or the other To get into government By act or by omission By roof or by cook Everybody now believes that it's the national case Let me go and take my own So we can continue this road We must tell ourselves the truth It's really, it is not better during my time But we should be able to be happy And to be proud That even though we live this road Our names will be written on gold Our names will be remembered Let me give you an example I am from Imoltec The best government we are running in Imoltec Is Lich Dr. Pam Omnat Well, there's something wrong with the internet provider I guess And we've seemed to have lost this audio Because it's cracking Anyway, so we've just been talking about Drafting a new constitution So some ex-governors, some lawmakers Have come out to speak on the Nigerian constitution And how we need to probably re-jig it How we need to reconfigure it Maybe not change it entirely But have some specific line items To ensure that it is a holistic one for everyone And so we've just been talking with Justice Wig With a human rights lawyer He was joining us from Abuja And just having the conversation And in fact, my final question was going to be How do we start to push the government To ensure they have this new constitution One of the constitution reforms Do we have Justice Wig right now? Hello, sir Okay, finally Okay, so I was going to ask you What are some potential impacts We can see with a new constitution Like positive impacts And how do we even start to push the government For this new constitution For a constitutional reform Or reconfiguration If I can say that So what are some positive impacts That everyone in Nigeria would definitely see And even feel as well If we have a new constitution If we have an amended constitution That is now holistic Fine, a point of call Let me say to you that I go back Like for example If at least little they are sincere to themselves They can do the job What they can do They have nothing there That is why they were elected That is why they are there And when you have a proactive president Even the amendment comes up And gets the results for action You should not hesitate to sign it Because everybody knows what is good And when you look at it Very well You see The excellent and the major advantage Of this good constitution Is that it will carry everybody along It will make all the citizens to feel belong It will make all the citizens to feel You know to feel like This issue of I am from here I am from here So let me shock you I propounded a theory Which I call the wonder bill And that is the only thing that can solve The major problem of this country I know you will be asking me What is the wonder bill Yes I am about to ask you that Enlighten me Let me give you an example One Let me give you an example And an insight of the wonder bill Okay Even you When you were looking for a job Or even said that for a set of Federal agencies, ministries Say, look at me Once you are doing a firm system If you say so for your name Your name and other names The next thing you see, look at me The next thing you see is set of origin You see where our problem lies In the profession Why are you asking me my set of origin? Why you should ask me nationality? I am an Nigerian You can not go to America And ask somebody Are you from where he studied He is from Florida Or New York He will tell you I am from United States of America That gives you That confidence to say that you are a citizen of America Right See nationality, you write Nigeria That gives you the confidence To know that you are a citizen of federal public of Nigeria And not in Europe Not in Europe Not in Europe And then the reason I ask you Is that you are a religion Let's leave that one Then this issue of set of origin What for? Right You are really reviving the country yourself The government is already reviving the country itself Let people to know that they are from Different tribes of ethnicity Instead of making people in your mind As one, as Nigerian That is what I call the wonder girl And that is the only thing That can save this country Okay But I want to leave you The moment an outside man An human man A human man Or whatever it is Be going to see him or herself As a Nigerian And not as a tribal citizen Your problem is nationality itself Well, I hope that would work And I hope that would You know possibly be in a constitution The wonder bill as you've just said But yes, this is where we have to wrap it up On this segment We want to say thank you for coming It was nice having a conversation with you Thank you so much Thank you very much All right, have a nice day We've been speaking with Justice Uig Who is a human rights lawyer I was joining us from Abuja And we've just been talking about The Nigerian constitution And how ex-governors are lawmakers You know, I've just called for Demanded in fact for a new one We're still looking at it Maybe we can have a new one Or we can just amend it But we never know We'll just see how it develops Anyways, we have to go on a short break And when we return We'll be looking at our second hot topic Please stay with us