 And I didn't folks yet in the attendees that. Oh, there's Dr. Shabazz. Now we have a quorum. Perfect. Happy birthday. Thank you, Ms. Bridges. I got my Pisces shirt on. Oh, I need one of those. Yeah. Nice to see you. Thank you, Dr. Rhodes. And nice to see you. And nice to see Ms. Bridges and Dr. Shabazz. I don't see you yet, but I'm glad you're here. There you are. What's up, Nolka? Oh, I think we lost him. Yeah. Let me just do my usual quick. Oh, there's a lot of wonderful. And let me just see here. OK. I'm going to text Yvonne and Hala quickly. OK, Dr. Shabazz, I got you. Hang on. Sorry. Hi, Alexis. Hi, how are you? Hi, Alexis. Hi, how are you doing? I'm doing well. Is that a banana on your shirt? Yeah, the banana. Nice. All right, Deborah. Good shirt. It's very good. Well, all right, I think we can go ahead and get started. I just texted Hala and Yvonne. So hopefully they'll, since Jennifer is not going to be here for a few minutes, if committee members can just keep an eye also on the attendees to make sure. And I can move somebody over if needed. And that's better. All right, I'm going to call to order the March 6 meeting of the African Heritage Reparation Assembly at 2 0 5 PM pursuant to chapter 20 of the acts of 2021. This meeting will be conducted via remote means. Members of the public who wish to access the meeting may do so via Zoom or by telephone. No in-person attendance of members of the public will be permitted, but every effort will be made to ensure that the public can adequately access the proceedings in real time. And I'm going to just make sure everyone can be heard and can hear. I'll start with you, Ms. Bridges. I'm here. I hear you. All right, heard. Dr. Shabazz. Shabazz is here. Excellent. Welcome, Yvonne. Yvonne. You're muted. Muted. I'm trying. Oh, wait, it's working. No, I'm on a different computer. I'm just like, wait, it is working. Hi, everyone. I'm sorry I missed the retreat. I heard you guys did some good work. Yeah, no worries. Yeah. Well, we're going to expand on it today and catch you up. Alexis. Hello, yes. Hi, how are you doing? Good. All right, and Dr. Rhodes. I'm here. Good to see everyone. Good to see you all. OK, so let me just do a quick agenda review for today. And if you weren't here, Jennifer's going to be back in a few minutes. She just was double booked. And Pamela, unfortunately, cannot join us today. She had a conflict. So we are going to start the meeting by welcoming counselor Lopes, who is going to join us to talk about ancestral bridges. And I'm going to quickly peek to see. Oh, OK, I'm going to move Anika over here while we just go through this. Welcome, Anika. We're just going through the agenda here. So we'll give you a minute to move over. Thank you. Thank you. I'm going to grab some water. Thank you so much. Excellent. OK, and then following that, we're going to move into more about our survey. We have some decisions to make on the upcoming big payback screening. And then we also have an Amherst College listening session that we'll discuss today, the possibility of scheduling that. And then also the Deirdre Mullen League racial justice collaboration there. And we have an update on that. So we'll give an update on that. So before we welcome Anika and move into that segment, we'll also have two public comment periods. So after Anika finishes and we were finished with that discussion, then we'll have our first public comment. And then we'll move on to our other topics and then come back to a second public comment period. Any questions at the moment or comments? All right. Great. Welcome, Anika. Hello. How is everyone? Thank you for inviting me. Absolutely. We're really, really happy and honored to have you here. And you know everybody here. That's true, right? We need to do introductions. Yeah. I've met everyone and happy to see you all again. Some has been longer than others. Yeah. So thank you, Anika, for coming. And I'm going to turn it over to you just to say that we are really happy to have you here and to learn more about ancestral bridges and to talk about maybe some assembly members have questions or whatever dialogue we might want to have. So I'm going to just turn it over to you. Well, thank you. And Shavad, I thought that you had a photo in a just for a second. I see you moving. You don't have to take it all. So yes. Hi, everyone. Thank you for inviting me to talk about ancestral bridges. Ancestral Bridges is a foundation that celebrates BIPOC arts history and culture in Western Massachusetts in general, but primarily Amherst. And we partner with local communities to create educational and economic opportunities so that BIPOC youth and through their families can survive. We also thrive, excuse me, but maybe that was pun intended. And we also we also work on home ownership opportunities as well. So we have been in the work kind of the silent organization for quite some time, but officially launched last June, June 18th for the Juneteenth through the Juneteenth heritage walking tour. And we have where we started to show an exhibit that represents the first Black and Afro-Indigenous families or the Black history of Amherst. We started that exhibit at the History Museum through that walk, and that has moved over to our first partnership with Amherst College, which I think could be more rooted and make more sense. So that's something that we have started with an exhibit. But for those of you that have been there or visited the site, it is actually much more than an exhibit. It's really celebrating this history basically through all of the scented lines are represented. And it's also just been, which has been my joy aside from lifting this history is the way that we have connected with so many other descendants from all over. And just there's they're very different perspectives and lenses for people who may have grown up elsewhere and maybe spent time in Amherst going up over summers or when they were visiting. And then for some that had never been here and learned about their connection through different sources. But certainly through the events that we have been a part of and also involvement, especially my mom with the Civil War tablets, we've really been able to connect dots and really uplift a lesser known and neglected history of Amherst. So beautiful. Thank you, Anika. And I know probably Dr. Rhodes, you haven't been to the exhibit because you have been out of town since it opened. I certainly have. And I wanted to, at the end, I just want to share. I just pulled Anika off the Facebook just the information about about the exhibit. But I want to just open things up to see if folks would like to ask Anika any questions about ancestral bridges or just open up any dialogue that that might be appropriate right now as. And I do hope that we will continue to have these conversations and be able to be in connection with one another through updating each other on our independent work and where there's possible places for collaboration. So I see Dr. Shabazz, your hand is raised. Thank you. Counselor Lopes, I am wondering if you might speak to your idea, your vision, for how this history that is being shared through ancestral bridges can be is of necessity a part of the process of repair, the process that the council has mandated us to work to extend upon the resolution to instructural racism in Amherst. Is there a relationship? And in what way do you see this relationship between the history and culture that ancestral bridges shares with a reparative justice process? Thank you. Thank you for your question, Shabazz. I think that I've thought about this throughout. And one hand, there is no separation between what we're doing in ancestral bridges and what your task to do within reparations. So even though we are different organizations, we do. Well, let me just back up for just an experience of feeling. When the exhibit at Amherst College Open, I hadn't expected to feel so emotional about seeing it. Because I've grown up seeing these stories. I grew up with these people. Whether it's video, it is within wills, ask, carry on this history, and have always felt that responsibility. But there was something about actually seeing the images up within Amherst College, where so many are intertwined with and worked with. And it really solidified that ancestral bridges, we're a new foundation, but we are as old as any organization or institution in this land. We actually connect further back. So we stand for and represent, though I speak for myself, I have to often realize like I do speak for my ancestors. I'm here because of them. I wouldn't be here to say anything, really. Especially not in this situation, having conversations with a reparations group. So I believe that there are many ways as we move forward, especially with the AHRA, I see as you are part of a much larger national movement. And we are a local foundation, though we have reach. So I would hope and imagine that there are many ways that the AHRA would be able to support ancestral bridges. Anything from we may have initiatives and there could be numerous things. I mean, there are many programings that come through us. So there could be many ways that we could be supported by, from something big to even, which is a very real thing, shielding from us being appropriated. We are in a very popular time of check boxing. So that's also, I think, a way that we could be supportive. I think with your position, there's probably more opportunities for you to support us. But I do feel like there are plenty of connections to be had. Thank you, Anika. Dr. Chavaz, your hand is still up. Did you have a follow-up? Quick follow-up, yes. I do hope that you and others will make it to the screening of the big payback. One of the things that comes through with respect to the Evanston story is the way in which the center, the space that collects and provides support for the local history of African-Americans in Evanston is in a facility called the Shorefront Legacy Center. And when I walk through there with Michelle and with Kathleen Anderson, my mind began thinking about the work of Dudley Bridges, the work that you have carried on and your mother has carried on. And in the way that in this space, the Shorefront Center, they carry that same kind of work on to preserve and to interpret and to share and to provide the descendants of people who have been enslaved in the Illinois and Evanston area, a space where they can come and learn and reconnect their history and that the wider community can also come and learn and connect with that history. It was so powerful and just filled me with so many thoughts about what could be possible and what is necessary in terms of Amherst moving forward. The story of those Civil War tablets sitting in the crates after they had been sent out to be restored and some renovation work done in Town Hall to sit in there over 20 years, and the vision of Dudley Bridges to try and had for restoring those tablets as part of a really a landmark piece of Amherst history that people can come to this town and see and learn. And then the way Deborah has built, Deborah Bridges has built upon that foundation to now create the exhibit that is there at the Bain Center temporarily, it again, it just fills me that this is so much when you have people lead or people that say, well, reparations, this reparative justice work belongs only at the federal level. There's nothing to do at the local level, except to push for the federal process. And I look at it and I say, there's a lot more to do. There's a lot more to do. And that's what came through to me at the shore front. And that's what comes through to me at Bain's and the work that you, that ancestral Bridges has been doing. There's a lot more we can do. And I hope that it will be part of the process, the plans and whatnot that and the work going forward. Thank you. Thank you, Shabana. I do feel like it is really a relay race if you think about it. And thank you for bringing up Dudley Bridges, my grandfather. I have often thought that when you're a kid and you're just growing up in it and you're with these people, I never would have thought like, this is history, you're just a kid growing up in it. But coming back and realizing time away and that if we think about the Civil War tablets being that they are for what it is, the only mark that includes us, that includes a black and Afro-Indigenous people, it's the only marker. And this was in, he passed in 2004. So that's about 20 years of further erasure that didn't have to be when you think about it that way. So it is really important that we don't allow this to continue many of whom we're talking about. These were not, they were not celebrated as intellectuals. They were your everyday people. They could travel the world and be renowned jazz musicians elsewhere, but come here and all that's afforded to them is to clean, to work to the bone. So these, and in all class, whether you're thinking black, white, otherwise, it's oftentimes this class that is not noticed that isn't visible. But then you put on top of this, the timing and they're black and they're Afro-Indigenous and they're indigenous, there's more. But when we think about, we're not talking about, they were packed up in the 40s or the 50s, we're talking about in the year 2000. You know, so I think that there is just, that alone is a healing process that I hope though the tablets, they are incredibly important leads us to, that we need more, more recognition of seeing ourselves. That's, you know, 20 years, it didn't have to be of our youth, not being able to at least come to someplace, you know, but we're here now. So imagine what will be here in 20 years from now. This will no longer be an issue, you know? So that's also what's, you know, motivating to me. And I think also the premise of Ancestral Bridges is a very unique collaboration, even my co-founder being a descendant of colonists and understanding that there is nothing that we can do really to go back and affect the future. But there is so much that we can do. I mean, to the past rather, but there is so much that we can do to affect the future. And for many youth, it's as simple as like, switching a light bulb, you know? And so I do have to say that I am so very appreciative for the Ancestral Bridges sport. I just, I pinched myself sometimes about how people have really come together and how Dudley Bridges is kind of the nucleus of so many, for why so many have come together and just his spirit of, you know, making sure, like his thing was we need to do this. Yes, this was his family. He wanted them to be honored, but mainly for future generations, you know? So I'm so pleased and just excited about this and to, you know, connect with you all. And really, you know, I think that there are so many organizations doing good work and similar work. And it's kind of about where, where do we support each other and add to our efforts and instead of kind of wasting time duplicating and whatnot? Thank you, Dr. Shabazz and Anika. Any other comments or questions? Yes, Anika, you mentioned housing. How does that tie in? So we will, Ancestral Bridges, we do have a community that is around home ownership, first time home ownership and opportunities. And that is a committee that is being built within and, you know, we'll have more to, you know, share with that as that committee is further up and running. But that's definitely an integral part of the organization. Especially, you know, thinking about it, we've had so many that were denied those opportunities. They were told how they could live, where they could live, under what conditions had housing taken from them. Housing was also a way that a lot of these folks have been erased because they didn't own their home. So a lot of people who hadn't owned them, they rented and they moved around or they were welcomed into others household, which is the way that many sustained because these were people who had boarding houses. And I think, you know, to be noted that they welcomed other immigrants being Irish and et cetera into their home to live. So housing is really, you know, as you all know, a big deal in the community, a big offense and insult and has been used in other ways other than, you know, a place of means and shelter and survival, but also a tool of erasure. And I think that's a really great example of where as we continue with our work, although we're time limited, so, but as we continue with our work and you're developing the sort of model and programs around home ownership, how we can be in touch and see where can the AHRA support ancestral bridges efforts? And on a deeper level, as we're beginning to write our report with recommendations to the town council, consulting with ancestral bridges to see what advice or what consultation may be appropriate to include in our final report to the town council that's related to these various themes that we're talking about. Anika, I also just wanted to, you had said one such way that we might be able to support you is shielding ancestral bridges from appropriation that occurs. And I just really wanted to say that I heard that really clearly. And if there are specific ways that we might support you in that, please reach out to me or any one of us. And I know Ms. Bridges is also an assembly member, but through any channel, we've really, I think that that's really important. So. Thank you so much. And I know, you know, my, Ms. Bridges and my mother are very supportive, but, you know, she is, she's with AHRA. And so, you know, I think that just sometimes because of the connection people will assume that she's ancestral bridges and ask the questions. And but she is busy enough with you all. So I will definitely, and I really appreciate that. And I, yes, well, I really look forward to keeping in touch. And thank you so much for, you know, including me today. Absolutely. Thank you very much. And thanks for taking the time and feel free to stay in the attendees if you'd like. And we'll definitely be in touch. Thank you. I was hoping that I would be able to stay, but I do have to go. But is the the information, Shama, that you were talking about, is this available or now? Or? The big payback. The big payback is coming. Is that what you were saying? Will you send me the information? Absolutely, yes. We're going to talk about that today, but we will absolutely send that. In fact, ancestral bridges will be receiving a unique invitation and we will, we're in the process of working on that now. Okay, all right. Thank you and happy birthday. Thank you. I know I said that when I came on, I meant to. And I will see you all. Thanks a lot. Okay, see you soon. All right. Wonderful. Oh, okay. I am going to do a call for public comment. And I do see we have one hand raised so far. I'm going to go ahead and just quickly call for public comment. This is the time if you would like to make public comment, please raise your hand and we'll bring you into the room. Feel free to leave your camera on or off and speak for up to three minutes. Generally we don't respond, but sometimes we do and we'll definitely be listening closely. All right. And Jennifer's not back. So just one second. Give me a second to. All right. Welcome, Mara. Hi. I am here to make a brief request. And for the assembly. As you probably all are aware, there's an override vote on May 2nd for a new elementary school. And to help pay for it. And I'm part of a group that just formed for that initiative vote. Yes, for Amherst schools. And we're trying to get support from. People representing. Well, not representing the town, but people who in the town who people would know, would recognize to write letters or give support. I know there are some regulations about using town resources. You can't use them to support it. You can as individuals, anybody. Can write a letter or an editorial or just talk to your friends. And I'm hoping you'll consider that 37% of our students are. People who are on the same page with the same color. So. I know it's a hard question raising taxes in a town that already has high taxes, but I think this is a worthwhile cause. And I hope you'll support it. So for maybe for a future agenda, you can discuss it. Or feel free as individuals to do something. The book, the site is yes, for Amherst schools. Calm. I believe maybe it's. Org. I don't know. Thank you, Mara. Thank you so much. And we will discuss, I'll make sure we discuss whether to include that as an agenda item for an upcoming meeting. I definitely need to do a little of a refresher myself just to see what as a town committee, we would even be allowed to do and and then of course what individual members do is is is up to them. All right. So, let me just. Okay, here we go. Oh, no, I don't want to remove. I'm sorry, I'm just. Oh, here we go. All right. And then we have another public comment. Hello. Coming in. Welcome Chiara. Okay, there I am. Hi, how are you all wanted to. First of all, happy birthday. It's pricey. Yes. I just wanted to touch base on a couple of things so I did have the privilege of tuning into your last special meeting. I was a great meeting. I'm glad that it happened. Thank you to Alexis read for putting that bug to kind of get that thing going it was really good to hear from you all and that in that environment. I just had a couple of comments regarding the community survey, and just some suggestions as well. So, I noticed that, of course, in requesting demographics of whoever takes a survey. That's the category that you're going to be asking about. And so I wanted to request that it be more than just like a sort of a fill in fill in the blank of your ethnicity but to specifically have a designated box or a check off or whatever it may be to specify black American descendants of us enslaved persons. And the reason I say this is because the sentence of slavery in America do not historically have a designated ethnic identifier. It's not a color or colored Negro, that sort of thing. And then over time as demographics have changed. Other ethnicities have become absorbed into the category of black. So it's really important that that be put there specifically because a lot of times when black Americans are asked what is your ethnicity. So you might hear black, you might hear African American, and so it's not going to give you the specifics that you may be looking for in terms of identifying descendants, unless you put that specifically. Now for others, you may take the survey I think that's fine to leave it just open to kind of fill in the blank, but I do think it's important that you specify that as an option when people are taking the survey. I also wanted to add that if you did not know this, that the federal Office of Management and Budget is currently revising statistical policy directed 15 which is how they collect their standards on standards on race and ethnicity, and how it's collected and defined. And so this happened last in 1997, and it will let me not happen again for another 30 years. And so this is an opportunity where the sentence of slavery in America will be able to be disaggregated officially in terms of the data. So it's really, really important. It's open right now they're going to be having town halls throughout the month of March. And then they've already released or some of their, some of their initial findings onto their website which I will forward to you all so you can take a look at it. They have comments open people can can go on to the website and leave comments until April 12. And that's when it closes so again this is the once once in a generation kind of thing that's going on. I just wanted to put that out there. Also, and I will also send you all I did make a presentation to them. And so I will also send you my presentation to the OMB as well. I also wanted to add in terms of the survey, you asked you also asked about ideas or types of reparations that you know recipients may may get. And I noticed on there you did have like housing related housing related kind of resources, and I want to to request that you specify as well. Cash payment, even, regardless of whether or not Amherst will or can do that, but to specifically add that there and present it as an option to kind of get the idea of what people are thinking and what they may be interested in, in terms of reparations. And I think when you if you don't include that people may not may not put that and you might not get the same kind of feedback so I think, because other forms of operations for others have been cash payments I think it's important that you that that be included as an option. And I know the reason why I say that the housing related program it of course that that Harkins of Evanston, Illinois, and one of the challenges with Evanston from the survey that the survey that they had is that it did not provide cash payment as an option. The options were very limited to either. You know, repair assistance with home repairs or with a down payment. And so it was very limiting it was not presented as an option. Now, and in recent days a few days ago I believe the Evanston operations committee voted to, to actually pay a cash payment to two of the recipients, because they were not able to use the initial resource as it was because they were not property owners. They were renters, as our most black Americans. In fact, our home ownership rates the disparities have increased since the 1960s when it was legal to discriminate so to kind of create and create an environment where recipients may not be able to actually use the resource is going to create a problem. Also because you know now that they're going to be paying these two individuals. Others who did not have the option or were told that that was not an option for cash payment are now kind of like it has a potential to create a big problem and so I think learning from that and just when you're doing the survey just present that as a possibility. We'll see how that flushes out and out on the on the other end, but just to present it out there as an option for people to select if that's what they believe preparation should include. And so I just wanted to add that, because for me it was very, very heartbreaking to watch, you know, an elder, the first denied access to reparations they were approved for, and then having to plead to receive something. As reparations very, very heartbreaking to watch an elder have to do that and so just to kind of avoid those kind of complications ahead of time I think it would be great to at least include that cash payment as a possibility or an option for people who take the survey to select that. So I think that's all I had to say for now but thank you. Thank you so much. Here. Thank you so much. And I've made detailed notes as well. Okay, let's see here. All right. So I think there we go. All right. So before we move on to the other items in on the agenda today, including the survey and including the big payback screening. Are there any questions or comments right now. About counselor Lopes's visit or or anything related to public comment that we heard. All right. So I think I'm going to, oh, could I just check in what time do folks have to leave today. Just quickly we'll go around Ms. Bridges what time is your hard stop today. I'm sorry, I can't hear you. You're muted is what I meant to say. No good for 330. Okay, excellent. And even three o'clock, three o'clock. Okay. Alexis. Okay, Dr. Rhodes. All right. And Dr. Shabazz, possibly 330 as well. So I'm going to come to you, Yvonne, since you have the, the stop that's coming up soonest and just say we have to make some decisions about the big payback screening. And then we also have to go through the survey. So what do you feel like you'd like to participate mostly in of those two items. I hope we can start with the survey. Sure. Yeah, let's do that. Okay. So I am going to share my screen here and just please give me a moment. Does somebody do you hear like a outside voice? I was Jennifer. Have you been hearing it the whole time because my phone was not my thing was not on mute. No, thank goodness we have it. All town secrets right there. Oh, goodness. All right. So, Yvonne, just to catch you up a bit. We started going through at the retreat last week, these different survey topics. This is a structure that was put together by the Dunahue Institute after Irvine I had the opportunity to kick off our work last week before the retreat. And so as we move through this, you'll see where I have added to this based on the discussion at the retreat and what so you understand what I'm hoping to do is, and this goes for all assembly members is I am hoping to provide a set of feedback to carry an open discussion this week. So tomorrow, essentially after our meeting. So they can maybe get a first draft going that then we can take back to us at our next meeting and further refine. We have until about the end of March here to get the survey completely developed. But I did want to talk to the group actually I'm going to be away next week so that's a separate matter we'll get to. So, I'm going to go through here I took the feedback from the retreat I've added some things I have some questions. The first part just to review will be an introductory statement so like a cover letter that will explain what our charges our objectives the purpose of the survey, it will explain the confidentiality matters and then also of course, I would advise folks that it is completely part voluntary to participate. This next part I wanted to dig into a little bit more we had some thoughts that float around float that we floated around at the retreat, and I wanted to make sure that I was clear about what this meant in terms of an eligibility screener. So, eligibility screener is typically a way that in a survey. The survey might screen for people who should take the survey or should not take the survey. But it is also used to focus for people that your particular people like for example current residents to a particular portion of the survey. So you might want, for example, and I think in our case it was clear that we do that residents of African heritage may have questions that the rest of the community wouldn't answer that we wouldn't want them to answer. So if we include that as an out if we include residents of African heritage as an eligibility screener than the way Qualtrics works is that it allows for that to for the for the sort of a jump down to those questions for that particular category of people. So I want to make sure I've added what I think we might want to use as eligibility screeners, but I want to check with the group here. And of course the first one is being a resident of African heritage and we would need to think about what particular where where would it lead where would the survey lead people of African heritage differently than what everyone who or anyone who takes a survey would get. Yes, Alexis. So, is this different. Like is there. So like I'm thinking about like what Chiara was just, I'm sorry, is that, is that how you say it. Yeah, what she was just talking about. Is this, is this separate from like demographic boxes so like, if you're, if, if you're a resident of African heritage like if that's a bot or like a checkbox let's say that like opens up more questions. And that then leads you to more checkboxes where you're like, specify, is that the sort of situation or like is, are these like two separate things. If we were to, you know, do it like that, I guess is what I'm asking. Yeah, I'd want to get more clarity from Kerry on that but that's a great question. I think the demographics are all like checkboxes like in terms of whichever demographics we choose. But like here for resident of African heritage just to follow up on what Karen was talking about is, do we want to further delineate this so maybe maybe not and that's a discussion that we need to have. We may want to in the demographics, but do we want to, in terms of additional questions that we might ask a descendant of an enslaved person, as opposed to a black immigrant, for example, like, do we have different kinds of questions that we would ask I don't know the answer to that but if we did, then we would want to have that those further delineations as an eligibility screener. Does that make sense, Alexis. Yes, okay. So, I'd like to get feedback on that from folks in terms of, you know, are we asking the same set of questions to all residents of African heritage or are we asking separate questions yes miss bridges I see your hand. African heritage and black immigrants. Can you tell me that forgive me but what the difference there. And one more why is, why would town, why is town employee there I just need to, maybe I missed that one. I don't. I added that miss bridges I'll start with that I added that just to see like, is there something that we might want to gain in terms of our charge specifically from town employees, and specific like to have specific questions that go to town employees that are relevant to our work in terms of our charge, and maybe not I just it was something that I, that I thought of, you know, in, I've, I've heard, I've heard quite a bit of quite, I've heard from quite quite a bit of, you know, whether we, from an employee or from just sort of understanding the history of the town where there are circumstances that we may want to pull out from in terms of that. Do you have because you're, you, what is your sense of that miss bridges. I know, I just didn't understand what, why, as far as eligibility screener town employee yet and understand. That's what I mean. Yes, I know I might be confused so. Yeah, I think this eligibility screener is actually very confusing so this is not who is eligible for reparations. So that's a whole separate question set of questions that we need to ask. Okay, like a technical research term that happens to be the same word as a word that we're using in terms of our charge. So I wish we could even change it to just it's really who is eligible for taking the survey and sort of what, what, where we want to break out different groups or people to ask specific questions it has nothing to do with whether any one of these groups would be eligible for reparations. That's confusing. It's very confusing. For example, you're saying you're saying who's eligible, but then you say it's got nothing to do with who's eligible. Right. So who is eligible. Let's think maybe we can use a different word this is the word that the, that the research folks use but maybe for our purposes, we want to use like we just maybe we just want to say screener, just to make it. Just stand I get that I just didn't. If you if you're using the same word and both both ways it's like but now I get it. I get it. All right, they're they're conditional questions so I don't know if you want to use the word conditional. Okay, sort of way. Like conditional screener you mean is that how about just. This is your background what would you say questions that screener stuff needs to be taken on all we're trying with the objective here is to try to collect some demographic as to who is filling out this. This questionnaire or this survey. And so, therefore, it should reflect that it's, it's not a screener or anything like that it's, it's, I guess I need to think we need to think about the wording of that but that the wording as it is right now is misleading. And, and but the objective again is to know who's filling out this or the people. And so, and we need that information and that data. So, I think we just need to reword that. Yeah. So let's talk to Carrie about that and this isn't anything that the survey taker would see like they wouldn't this is just for us really the number two so it if we decided to use these screeners it might say, if you're a current resident you're going to go to this set of other questions that somebody who's not a current resident wouldn't see but let's let's kind of sit with that and move on from that for right now. And then we'll, we can decide whether, you know, whether we're going to use that. Ms Bridges, your first question though yeah I wanted to come back to your first question about residents of African heritage, and maybe Alexis, Alexis, do you want to speak to that. Yeah. Yeah, so I, I, I agree with Kia that that the ethnic piece is important. Because culture is tied to that. And there's certain. And I'm not trying to like, I'm really trying to like avoid getting into anecdote, like personal experience but like folks who have enslaved histories feel differently about certain things in a lot of cases, then folks who have not experienced that at this continent. And so when you know the African diaspora can mean a huge thing. It can mean anyone who has any sort of genetic tie to Africa. And this is specifically, well I'm hoping that we can, I also hope that we can be a little bit more specific and saying, are you a resident with enslaved history maybe we can say so say that a little bit better. Or are you, are you of one of the many African ethnicities on the continent. So it's an ethnic delineation that I think would be important, especially because that's going to change. Or for, for, for, for I think, well we'll see. But I think that the, the answers may be quite different for folks who have African American enslaved history versus folks who are coming to the continent after. Thank you Alexis. And let's go to Dr. Shabazz and then even. Um, whether this corresponds to the term screen or not, I don't know, but I do think there are sort of three areas that the survey ought to get into early on. And one is residency. One is lineage and another area is identity. With respect to residency, then we are asking these questions relative to, you know, whether they're year round, whether they're here as a student, whether they're here. You know, or living, you know, considers Amherst their residents but they're currently not living here now. We can, we can kind of, you know, survey for, for that information in terms of the residency area. Then there is the area of identity. And I think this should be similar to the census. A question of how do you identify in terms of racial identity. Black or a person of African descent. White person of European descent. Asian Pacific Islander in Native American, whatever are the same kind of categories that the US census uses we could, we could ask that and then that's a question where a person is self identifies and there can be more than, you know, they can check African and European like they should be able to check African and Asian, they can be able to check multiple boxes or they could just check the one box that they identify as a person of African descent. If they are not multi multi racial in that in terms of their identity, or in terms of how they identify. And then thirdly, there is the area of lineage. And that isn't that should be a question along the lines of do you descend from a person or persons who were enslaved in the United States. Yes or no. And then maybe follow up in that area as to, you know, do you need help. In terms of genealogical information to to confirm this or do you already have such a confirmation of your descending from a person who was enslaved in the United States. And then you've got those three areas covered. Okay, I wouldn't pose this as a question of, you know, or getting into questioning of a person is black, and of, you know, descended from a person who was enslaved versus black and an immigrant. You know, I think we have to be careful in the questions and how the questions are shaped how the questions are asked what questions we're asking, because if, because it really is not a matter of what someone's immigrant immigrant status or city or even citizenship status. I don't want to go there. In terms of the questioning I just really want to know if the, under the lineage question, does the person know that they descend from someone who was enslaved in the United States or not. And if they, if they do or if they don't do you wish to have genealogical assistance to try and ascertain this. Okay, that's the lineage question. So again, zero importance to me to identify a citizen of the United States zero importance to me that you may identify as a citizen of the United States and somewhere else or zero identification, zero importance to me of whether you're a immigrant status. So I think that's that's very important in terms of the way we're asking these questions. We're simply trying to determine within this survey of those that that answer, if they know and have lineage that is to an ancestor who was enslaved in the United States, that's it. Okay, so that's new. Those are the three sort of ideas of critical importance to me. Now, for those who are checking off that they're on their identity they're of if they're they're only checking European American right, or they're only checking Asian Pacific Islander, or they're only checking some of these differences and they don't check. Okay, then we know the person responding there is not a person from the harmed community, which is all we really want to know. I really don't care about the demographics of who's filling this out that in terms of not being of that of the harm community. I mean, I need to know who's answering from the harm community, and then cross referenced that with residency that they're not. And, and then we know we've got a certain we then have an end value we have a numerical value of how many responded to this survey from the harm community that identify as as a person of African descent that that that answer that they believe they descend from an ancestor who was enslaved in the United States, then we've got a particular data from that particular constituency that is our harm community that our operations program is really, you know, in terms of those concentric circles, that's the community that's at the center of our concern that we're entering in this whole process. Now everybody else in other concentric circles around that. Great. And then we know where the data is coming from, relative to those who have clicked who are not part of who in answering the residency, the identity and the lineage areas that are outside of the harm community then fine we know this is data coming from that in value that numerical value that number who responded to our survey. It's coming from outside that home and then we have the basis when we get to our report of reporting. Here is what we got overall, in terms of people's responses on these questions about reparations and reparative justice and whether they support and so on. And then, but we've also got a specific numerical value around the particular harm community that we're that that this report is trying to center. That's my my two cents all. Thanks Dr. Shabazz and that is really super helpful I just want to I just want to let folks know I'm not crying there's nothing wrong I just my eyes are burning from being on the screen and so if you see me. That's that's I'm just comforting my eyes. Do we need a pause. No, no. No, not at not at all I just one assembly member so kindly reached out just to make sure I was okay and I just wanted to say that. I want to go to Yvonne because Yvonne has to leave but I and I also would like to get some sort of consensus about what Dr. Shabazz just proposed is the way that we approach this because I think it's key and I think if we all can agree to that. And this concentric circle model and so and having the center the way that he spoke about it, that would help us to move forward. So I'm going to go to you Yvonne. All right, I do agree with almost everything that Dr. Shabazz said I think it's a great way for us to move forward I think I don't know I missed the retreat so I'm not sure if there was a conversation about who that what the definition of the community, the community, the harmed community is like what those, and I agree with those concentric circles I think it's great. I think that whole thing is great I do. I will say that we've never had a conversation about whether we would limit the scope of reparations only to those we with the lineage where they have a connection to someone who was us us in us slavery. And I think that that it, honestly, my personal opinion is that's the job of the federal government that there's also not a lot of documents where if how would we prove or how do we document that and and the minute you get into having to get folks to prove who they are I don't like that. I don't like stepping into that area because they're just, there's often there are not great record keeping and I'm not an expert on this I'm sure there's others in this room who are. And so that's just my, you know, initial response to how do we prove lineage, you know, and as far as, you know, the community of harm in Amherst in particular for using funds from Amherst, I feel like that is beyond limiting to having people prove who they are, you know, and I think some of that conversation is a part of this, you know, when you send a survey and you ask people for their for personal information. Some of that is about like how people are self identifying and a lot of it is on the phone because, you know, until you get to deeper into the conversation, how do you get those folks to actually prove that they are who they are, you know, I'm saying that we're we're we're stepping into an area where we really need to think about dealing with those questions. You know, if you know for, let's say, you know, often it's been a big issue with the Native American community, because Native American communities are very mixed community and often there are folks who who present as white who are not white who are Native American. And then it's like, well, how does this white presenting, Native American prove their Native American, you know, so I'm saying that this is a this is a very tricky kind of situation that might might need for us to really think about it. And maybe there's a way for us to get help there might be folks in this room right now who know what the answer is to that. But I think it's a very tricky kind of thing when you get into that and I'm not sure and I agree with Dr. Goss, I'm not sure the survey is where we want to do that. I think at this point when we're doing the survey, we're relying on folks to get to give some of this information so we know who is answering the survey, and some of the information that we get might not be specific to the work that we're doing, but still it's valuable information to get to. And I will also end by saying, there has to be one or two or three ultimate goals were using the survey for and we should stick to those. And I think that Dr. Shabazz covered some of that and in his comments. And I'm going to silently leave when I need to leave. Okay. Great. Thanks so much. Alexis. Um, I, so I, I appreciate how Dr. Shabazz broke it down. I guess one thing that I'm stuck on and I'm, I'm okay with folks not agreeing with me. But like, I definitely have a personal issue with race and ethnicity being like conflated in a question. Though again, like we're getting into like that muddy area of like self identity versus like actuality right and so like in, in my humble opinion, a person who is not unambiguously black is not black. And, and when we're talking about race, we're talking about the social construct, we're talking about, you know, when you get pulled over by a police officer, that police officer gets to decide what you are in that moment. And so I guess what I was thinking of was like, if, if we're basing what we're going to recommend to the council, off of these answers. I guess I was, I was thinking that it would be important to know those differences though maybe that maybe that is something that we don't maybe specifically we want to just focus on ethnicity. I, I think that when we're getting into the heart like the, the actively harmed communities I think that this is where it gets tricky, right because someone who can pass as white gets all of that privilege, right. So, I guess it. I, I like the idea of, and I, I'm having a hard time because Dr. Shabazz said it in a really, really nice way. So I like the idea of that though I think, like when we have like a thing that says select your race. So one of the options is white and one of the options is like European like European American isn't a race. So I don't, I don't know how we want to deal with that if we're going to make that a specific question. So yeah that's that that's like the one thing that I'm like stuck on I guess for this. Dr. Rhodes. Yeah, it's this survey serves multiple purposes with with them, and the main purpose of it is that which would allow us to report back to the town, and also allow us to go forward with our work and our recommendations. And that's one the second thing that Dr. Shabazz captured is that it's also we also are capturing and need to capture data on what the surrounding community thinks about what are their thoughts not to do that would in terms of where I am setting is would would not be good. It's an area it's a time and place where that data needs to be captured from the rest of the rest of the community. And this survey is now being formatted will capture that data. Thank you Dr. Rhodes. Dr. Shabazz. Thank you. This is really, really rich discussion and I find myself in concurrence with a lot of the other points that are raised, you know, the recent the question has really came to come up to me a lot. I thought when we're relative something you've on was raising. But when you know what about Puerto Rico, you know, Puerto Rico, you know have slavery slavery extended there beyond the time that you know beyond 1865 slavery there involved. And that's what we're referred to a lot today as Afro Latinx people some of them are here in the United States some of them are here in our own community. And, and so, you know, and given the fact that, you know, Puerto Rico, although not a state in the US, it's been, you know, pretty much a colony of the of the United States. How do you, how do you cast them out. How do you really cast out Haitian and Haitians in a sense given the way the US imperialistic role and role and holding down holding down Haiti it's invasions of Haiti. I mean, I really feel a lot of those those questions but understand the survey is not the basis of who's getting any benefits of the reparation program. That's going to come down the line. That's going to come through other kinds of of of checks and balances and and other kinds of things that that will have to look at even as much as, you know, getting reparations declared as a public basis through the state legislature. So, in terms of a home rule authority. So there's a lot more down the line before we ever get to actually extending any, any benefits to any individuals. And remember, if we have two million raised, and you think about there being a thousand people, perhaps a thousand people of African descent, generally, in Amherst, as regular residents, you divide that into two that could be a $2,000 cash benefit. I'm not saying that's the way we're going. What if people said, I would just like to get my $2,000 cash benefit, and they qualify according to all these criteria is we still got a long way to go before we're ever even at that possibility, in terms of the home rule authority, in terms of a way of having to, to verify and just very quickly to the indigenous people that came up in the United States, and it's a federal government issue, federal government certifies and it's and it's problematic deeply but they based it on this so called Dawes role of the 1920s. There is a federal kind of census in the 1920s that went about saying, here are the legit, you know, indigenous people in the United States that we recognize they put you on the Dawes role. And then from then forward, that has been the list. If you don't dissent from somebody that was on the Dawes role, you're not considered indigenous Native American vis-a-vis the government, vis-a-vis the government. So, you know, there is a, there is a future that we're, that we're laying out here in Amherst. There is a future we're laying out in terms of how this process ought to unfold. And so we have to think about all these steps now, because it is a part of, you know, projecting what, what can be the case down the line in the future. So, very rich discussion. I'm so glad to be a part of my colleagues here. Thanks, Dr. Shabazz. I'm sorry, I got to go, but I also am fascinated and it would be great to continue this on another meeting when we have time. Absolutely. Absolutely. Yes. Thank you. We will continue. Thanks, Yvonne. Sure. Bye. So we are getting down to a smaller group here. And I think we're going to pause on the survey. I think we had a very rich discussion and I would like to turn toward the big payback event just to get some questions answered so that I can between now and the next meeting do some things. So, first I just wanted to, and if I don't know if folks noticed that Jennifer had to leave so I just wanted to note that Jennifer did have to leave. So let's see here. All right, I'm going to go ahead quickly and share the screen again. So hopefully everyone can see this. Oh, there we go. Okay. Can you see it? Yeah. Okay. Great. So this is the flyer for our event as it stands right now. And I just wanted to make a few notes here. So we received a very generous sponsorship from the Lewis Sebring family foundation for the event. And I wanted to note that Chuck Lewis is a life trustee at Amherst college. He is from Evanston, and he has been working with Robin Ruth Simmons for, for several years now. And supporting the effort in Evanston as well as supporting Robin's work with first repair. So he is very excited that we're hosting this event he has reached out to Michael Elliott the president of the college, as well as other folks at the college about the event. And so what I, what I would like for us to answer here is how do we want to approach I have hesitated to put this out in any, any broad sense until we've answered some questions in terms of how we want to approach registration on this, how we want to approach special invitations that we may have to state or local leaders and or local leaders and other people in the community. I did have a good discussion with Cyrus, who is, as you know, the chair there of the Association of Amherst students, and he encouraged for us to invite and try to reach as many folks in the broader diverse community. And at the same time, he'll be sending through the student senate and invitation to the entire student body. And then we'll of course be inviting particular people at the college. So we need to think about how we want to approach this and I'm open to, I'm open to suggestions on that. And now just by the way there's no way for folks to read like we haven't set up a way for folks to register the venue holds about 200 people. It can hold up to 250 if we don't want to use the stage in terms of a panel. One of the things that we have to decide on is other panelists, and I had one thought about that that I wanted to share with the group, which is a gentleman that's been hired by Amherst college to assess its history in terms of race. And I, he has gathered quite a bit of information and I thought he might be an interesting person to include. So I think with the date that's coming we do need to make some some really quick decisions on this. I have endorsed a kind of a special invitation and the, you know, and some of those, which could certainly include many of our elected individuals from government state government, federal government, as well as local government. But I really think what it goes into is the question of kind of the goal of the event, I think it ought to be really conceived of as a as a very challenging town hall event to to think of and situate the the effort here in in Amherst and in the in the in the region, Western mass region within the national context, drawing upon the, the example of Evanston as as reflected in the documentary and as reflected as available to us with the person of Robin who Simmons being being with us, but then going beyond that because she's gone beyond that specific moment in Evanston she's no longer a counselor. She is part of first repair which has been dealing now with about 100 municipalities all over the country engaged in reparative justice work. So it really to me then is an opportunity to to get at to try to sum up the lessons, some of the lessons of where we are in this local work toward really infusing the the the agenda here locally but also in in Massachusetts and and the country itself so I would encourage us to go ahead and and you know, get to a more formal flyer or invitation notice beyond just save the date but an actual notice and that'd be, you know, something along the line of, you know, a town hall summit on or, you know, a an Amherst a local summit on the question of the the local drive for reparative justice in the United States. You know Michelle is the head of is our GOL is our language Maven, so I'm sure she'll come up with something more more profound and I'm coming up with right now but but again I did something. I wanted to move quickly toward ratifying a we should move from this meeting to ratify a formal event announcement that can then go out, but then gets tapping our local governmental leaders are local higher ed leaders are local school towns, you know, town of school officials and and have that, you know, kind of RSVP a little bit of an RSVP if they are not coming fine and we're not trying to hold any seats, and then the rest is first come first serve basis for everybody else. Thank you. Okay, and that last part of is particularly interested in Dr Shabazz the whole thing. Thank you very, very good. But so if we are, we're putting out special invitation, and then we're not going to in terms of the process so it's possible that some people would have to be turned away at the door, if the room has already been filled. And I just want to make sure that that's if everybody's, at least this group here is is comfortable with that. And one of the things I'm looking into, and would love to talk with you Alexis about is whether our community license agreement with the producer of the film allows us to be live streaming this as well, so that folks who are not there physically at the powerhouse are able to watch it from home. So does that format seem appropriate to other assembly members. Good. Okay, Miss Bridges does that. Do you have any thoughts on that. Okay. You know, I think what's important is, we do want to invite our local government and higher ed officials and school officials but we also want to make sure that our community feels included in this process and so two to 250 people, I would go for a special space for the panel, so that we can fit 250 people and then just rearranging toward the end the screening to make room for the panel so that, as opposed to taking up 50 seats to just have a panel or folks okay with that. Okay, awesome. That's great. Okay, and then Mike Jiric is who I was referring to he was, he's the racial history of Amherst College Research Fellow. He spoke to the Student Senate a couple weeks ago Cyrus reports that he has uncovered quite a bit of really interesting information about the college, and it's ties, you know, and so I, if, if folks I would like to reach out at least and see if he would be interested if folks are okay with me doing so. And also open to other suggestions on this. For me, it seemed like counselor Lopes, you know and I have not spoken to her at all about this but may have some really interesting connection in terms of what she could speak about related to these various, you know, these various things as well as any other suggestions just shoot me a text or an email. And that doesn't have to be, you know, that doesn't have to be clarified immediately. One last thing because I do have to call a second public comment is the Amherst Student Senate has asked if we, let me just hold on one second. If we would like to host a listening session at the college or they've actually asked that we do host a listening session at the college for the student body. And this would be with the, let me just the BSU at Amherst College so I think that's the Black Student Union. They've offered us their space to host the listening session in the Black Student Union. And so I wanted to plant that seed, they are ready for us to come now and do that. I'd like for us to think about whether we want to do that prior to the screening, or whether we, which would be tricky, or whether we want to wait till after so just I'm planting that seed. All right, let's see if there's any other public comment. This is our second public comment period. If you would like to make public comment, please raise your hand. And I see one hand raise I'm going to promote. We do have to keep a quorum here to keep our public to be able to offer this public comment. Although, as long as we're not taking any action we're okay so if somebody does have to leave, please, I think, feel free to. And Lauren should be entering the room. Lauren, can you hear us Lauren. Yeah, sorry hi I can hear you. Yes, wonderful. I'm going to say I'm a, a March birthday person as well. So I be in the same month as you. I wanted to make a couple of comments and I'll try to do it as quickly as possible. I think this meeting kind of made me more confused as to the survey and the questionnaire where you guys are going. So I just had some suggestions and hopefully they'll be helpful. One is how still I'm not sure how the assembly wants to define reparations is that going to be a question on the survey. Is it defining the harm group, and does this group have to be linked to slavery does the reparations the local reparations that the assembly foresees, does it have to be linked to slavery. As you guys were conversating. One of the goals I think of reparations is building intergenerational wealth so I would like to know how that that would play out and how you see the best use of reparations, you know, being used on a local level. Also, I wanted to share with the assembly, some current events that have happened the Boston area, where I'm from has formed a task force or reparations task force by the mayor and I'm sure you guys already know that but I just think it's, you know, good, as you guys already do to compare what, you know, what is going on in those spaces. And so again, I'm just like has the assembly identified, you know, a console paid paid of agency that has done reparate reparations work before. And if not, why not because I still I, as I said, I know that. The work going on but I'm still a little confused as to the direction of the assembly. And also, I guess, just lastly, there was also in the news, the NYPD. They had the police made a settlement with 300 residents of the Bronx. And it was because of how they were dealt with at a protest in 2020 and it was, I think the the payout is $20,000 each, but I might have that that number wrong. I would want to know if the assembly will consider that reparations. So, those are just my thoughts and I'm probably more confused than before, but happy birthday and that's the last day. Thanks. Thank you very much Lauren and hopefully over the next couple weeks, it'll be less confused. I'm definitely working through a process here and I really appreciate your comments. We do have one more public comment. So let me just change the attendee and Kiara I'm just bringing you into the room here. Let's see if that worked. There we go. Great. Welcome. Thank you. I just wanted to say one more quick thing in that I see that sometimes a little bit of a discussion around a separation of what's happening at the municipal level whether Amherst, Evanston, what have you San Francisco or ever with the federal reparations effort. And I just want to say that it's not really as disconnected as we might want to imagine it it's very, very connected. Whatever is happening at the lowest levels of government is going to reinforce and set a precedent for what's going to happen state level at the federal level, whether that be in terms of eligibility. The form that reparations takes everything is going to be interconnected so I don't want to kind of draw such a distinction between what happens and what's what's okay or what's useful at the state levels or the municipal level, as opposed to federal like it's like it's so vastly different because it's all going to inform on the federal claim at the end of the day. So that's I just wanted to just leave that in there as well, but thank you. Absolutely. Yeah, I really appreciate that. All right. Wonderful. Okay, I'm not seeing any other hands. So just checking in with assembly because everybody stayed even longer than we thought, really, really appreciate that. Are there any questions or comments from assembly right now. All right, and Dr. Shabazz I can't see you but I assume not. And if then that's the case. Are you good. Are you good. All right. Yes, thank you everyone adjourned at 336pm. Thanks so much. Bye bye.