 Welcome to Hawaii, the state of clean energy. As we continue our series on sustainability, climate change and other matters related to energy, I'm Maria Tome, the co-host for this show and together with me is Mitch Ewan, also co-hosting. And we have a special guest today, Matt Gonzer with the City and County of Honolulu's Office of Climate Change, Sustainability and Resiliency. Welcome to Mitch and welcome to Matt. Aloha. Thanks for having me. All summer and it's gone into fall now as well. We've been talking about climate change and adaptation mitigation and we got sidetracked into discussing hurricanes and preparedness for extreme events and so forth. And so I have a feeling that some of those conversations will be continued today because your office seems to be touching a lot of those topics. So welcome to the show and please help us understand what your office does and what you found of interest to share. Thanks for having me, Maria. Thank you. And Mitch, nice to meet you as well. Yes. Yeah, just before we get into the office, you know, important to note that we're already in Hurricane Wallachia, so we're in the W's, we're at the end of the alphabet for this season, which continues through the month of November. So a very busy, very active season. But as you mentioned, the Office of Climate Change, Sustainability and Resiliency is a relatively new office within the city and county of Honolulu. It was actually created by us, the voters, via City Charter Amendment in 2016. And if we go to the first image, we can see that it has a big, long title, which has a big, broad objective, including, first and foremost, greening our own city operations, right? So there's a lot of things that we want to ensure that we're being as efficient as possible, walking the talk, also hopefully saving us, the taxpayers, some money around energy and water. Just ensuring that a lot of our plans are consistent around a lot of these policies. Two things that are probably of most interest to this forum are that the same amendment that created the office created a new official city commission. So a climate change commission composed of five experts in the fields of climate sciences and the built environment, including three UH faculty, an east-west center fellow and a president of the largest architecture and engineering firm in the state, but also ensuring that we're reducing our missions and our contributions to greenhouse gas emissions to global climate change while also ensuring that we're preparing to adapt to the impacts that we know are coming down the line. Yeah, I think that's very important. We want to have a proactive approach to preparing for situations that we may face, but we also want to be preventing it from being even worse than it might be, so simultaneously doing all these things. And hurricanes is one example, and sealable rise is another example that we know that we are guaranteed a certain level of sealable rise over time, but that time is somewhat impacted by what we do or continue to do or not do over the near future in terms of our emissions trajectories. So we could try to push off some of these these impacts over time. Yeah. Yeah. OK, so and Hawaii, I think, is unique in many ways. And I think one of the things that some people say as well, our emissions are just a tiny bit. And so why should we? Well, I think that our actions have a multiplier effect. So if we're able to avoid a ton of emissions or to demonstrate how to do things more resiliently, if people are watching and I'm very often they are because Hawaii gets a lot of attention, I think it has a multiplier effect. And so we should be cognizant of not just the direct and effects, but also the whole multiplier. So the state of California just received a lot of national attention for proposing legislation to become 100 percent clean energy by a certain date. They were the second state to do that right. In fact, it's the exact same numbers in the exact same. And in addition to that and just sort of recognizing how urgent and important it is, that's why we put forth all these efforts. We can certainly have what we believe is an outsized outsized impact in terms of the inspiration and the motivation and just the the moral obligation around a lot of these these subjects. And we're seeing this leadership at states across the country. Cities over 400 cities, something like 17 states have affirmed our commitments to the Paris Agreement, which accounts for more than half of our economy, half of our emissions across the country. So we're we're confident that regardless of the lack of leadership at the federal level, we can ensure that we are demonstrating the kinds of things that we know are important because we can't ever ask others to do something if we're also not willing to demonstrate the kinds of behaviors. But it's also likely to be better for us in the future. So regardless of climate change, all of these energy discussions and hazard mitigation discussions are also the reality that we can hopefully save ourselves money, be more economically and physically capable and resilient into the future and then also just have a place that we continue to love. Yeah. And I think this sentiment is shared by many other cities as well. So I guess we have company in this resilient cities, maybe. Right. If we go to that second image, this actually was an initiative that Honolulu was admitted into several months before the Charter Amendment vote. This is the Rockefeller Foundation's 100 Resilient Cities initiative. And you can see us ourselves circled out there in the Pacific Ocean. And these were the first 100 cities that were participating. It was a competitive process. So over 1200 cities in the three rounds of applications were considered. So we should feel fortunate, one that we were just encouraged to continue to apply. We were admitted in the third and final cohort. I think there are some benefits to that. But it provides several things for us. It provides one direct funding for the city's first chief resilience officer, who's also the director of the new office. It provides technical support from a strategy partner who, in our situation, is AECOM to give us, again, technical support around specific things and help us frame a lot of these issues under the development of a resilient strategy. It provides us direct access to this learning cohort across the globe. And you can see something like almost a quarter of the cities are North American. We're also in discussions with the cities in New Zealand and Australia and some of the Southeast Asian cities to learn about their vulnerabilities. But it also provides us some access to for-profit companies, academic institutions that we can tap into for specific pro bono services on the implementation side of any of the strategies that we're trying to put forward. Excellent. Yeah, so there's a lot going on in all these different areas. I guess we should mention probably since we talk about news and right on the front page of yesterday's newspaper, October 2nd edition of the Honolulu Star Advertiser was... Yeah, there was information or something about the headline saying new data, new research shows that our past understanding of seal of a rise double it. And what this actually is, while it's kind of new news, it's not exactly new news because that same modeling is the data that was incorporated into the state seal of a rise, vulnerability and adaptation report. It's just now been subsequently peer reviewed in nature. And it's a huge testament, again, to our technical support and local resources in the university. And one individual in particular, who's also the vice chair of the Cities Climate Change Commission, Dr. Chip Fletcher and his team. Yeah, so it's very timely. This is all very, very timely. Yeah. Yeah. I have a question. So what kind of participation do we have from the Pacific Island states because they tend to look to Hawaii for leadership. And we is that a plan to do outreach to them? Are they already contacted us? There's a lot of that at the state level, I would admit, sort of at the subnational. We as the state are very active in the Pacific Islands. Mayor Caldwell through support from the Rockefeller Foundation and just getting more involved in the leadership around climate change issues is getting more connected with some of these locales. And I think we also recognize that across the four counties of which we now as the county with a real significant capacity in both mitigation and adaptation and coordinating with them. We hope that we can set up some things that that just allow for the easy adoption or rippling or sharing across the four counties, which then are hopefully also transferable in some of these other island locations. Right. Yeah. Yeah. So tell us more about what you're up to. Right. So in the next couple of images, it was kind of just a recap, you know, Josh and the office really officially started in May of 2017. Just yesterday was my one year anniversary with the office transitioning from the university. And the early phases of that was a really extensive outreach program. And if we go to the fourth image, actually, it provides a little bit of that information where we were doing two things. One, we were a brand new government, so we needed to go out and remind people that maybe you did vote for this, maybe you didn't, if not, we're here anyway. And we had to introduce the office generally. But we also had to introduce this this pretty heady concept of resilience and and what that means with respect to the Rockefeller support. So we went out to we had an online survey. We did in person polling and messaging. We had a hard copy survey. We went to every neighborhood board across the island. There are thirty three neighborhood boards. We were equal opportunity pushers of information. We said yes to every speaking engagement and we received something around two hundred two thousand four hundred individual responses to our next 12 questions survey, which really fed into some of the processing and data analytics that we're benefiting from the one hundred resilient cities initiative to come up with these these pillars of of the resilient strategy. And for us, it landed in three problem areas and one opportunity area. So if we go to the next slide, we can look at that. And these were really not just developed from people's perceptions. They were also backed up by internal research that we're doing with city departments. Some of the background research that a Econ provided as a technical support. And they're very much in line with with all the things that this program is talking about. First, I think we all know that the challenges around affordability here across the islands. And this is what we discuss as a stress. It really sort of burdens us day in and day out and saps our community and household and government vitality, which then could make it difficult to perform in these moments of crises, these shocks. And that's what that bouncing forward, fostering resilience in the face of natural disasters, really those shocks, those those events. And island innovation and exposure is the two sides of the climate change coin. Ensuring that we are rapidly reducing our emissions and contributions, but also really being honest and clear-eyed about the need to prepare and adapt for the impacts that we're already observing today, but we know we'll get amplified into the future. And then community really told us that they still, they see it, they observe it, they live it, they participate, and there's a ton of community strength out there. So how does government ensure that we're not a hindrance to these good things but that we're also learning from the leadership of communities because the reality is that a lot of these climate change discussions will require some changes. And without that community support, community engagement and the allowance for people to do the right thing, we're going to be challenged to act on any of the strategies that come forth. Right, right. So I think that many of those, I think that many of those reflect what we try to do on the show. You know, getting the community to be participating and sharing information with each other, looking at the technical side of things and the analysis side of things, you know, preparing for disaster. You know, we did the whole hurricane preparedness thing and the solar under storm type of thing. And making it, you know, keeping it affordable to the extent you can and, you know, prioritizing and affordability kind of go hand in hand because if you're spending money in one area, you could be saving money but it is probably costing something else in the short run. So those are all. And these are all important. But we can't lose sight of the fact that we export this island almost $3 billion annually for dirty fuels that don't enhance our communities at present. Right, so we already spend a fair amount of money on a lot of things but in the transition, how do we ensure that it's equitable and doesn't overburden those who are already stressed around electricity prices, food prices, multiple jobs, poor wages, et cetera. Right, right. So we will have a chance to continue the discussion on those topics. We do need to take a break. So why don't we take a quick break and then come back and we'll pick up with Mitch's question. Freedom, is it a feeling? Is it a place? Is it an idea? At DiveHeart, we believe freedom is all of these and more regardless of your ability. DiveHeart wants to help you escape the bonds of this world and defy gravity. Since 2001, DiveHeart has helped children, adults and veterans of all abilities go where they have never gone before. DiveHeart has helped them transition to their new normal. Search DiveHeart.org and share our mission with others. And in the process, help people of all abilities imagine the possibilities in their lives. Hi, I'm Bill Sharp, host of Asian Review here on Think Tech Hawaii. Join me every Monday afternoon from 5 to 5.30 Hawaii Standard Time for an insightful discussion of Contemporary Asian Affairs. There's so much to discuss and the guests that we have are very, very well informed. Just think, we have the upcoming negotiation between President Trump and Kim Jong-un. The possibility of Xi Jinping, the leader of China, remaining in power forever. Welcome back to Hawaii, the state of clean energy. As we continue our discussion on climate change, resiliency, sea level rise, you know, working together as a community with Matt from the City and Counties Office of Climate Change, Sustainability and Resiliency, and Mitch Yu and my co-host from Hawaii Natural Energy Institute. Mitch, you were going to ask a question of Matt. I was going to ask about sea water, sea level rise, because we see these charts that the University of Chipp Fletcher puts out. Now we've just heard that it's like double that. So it totally covers all of Waikiki and all the lowlands we have now. So my question is, do we put a dike around Hawaii? Like in Miami, they're facing the same thing on South Beach and they're looking, they already started building big dikes down there. So what do we do? Build a fortification around Oahu? It's interesting that you mentioned that. So there are certain places you can take to the North Shore of Oahu right now that are suffering from pretty chronic erosion that's threatening structures and properties. And the reality is, based on some of the same research that tells us our shoreline change that informs the sea level rise modeling, there are certain things that if we do say harden these beach areas, those beach areas will be lost forever. And that's one concern in a more conservation rural area. You're talking about Waikiki, which is all filled land to begin with. And a city like Miami Beach where they're raising roads, they're building huge pumps to pump it out into the back bay side. We hear a lot about Dutch strategies. They've lived below sea level for a millennia. I think some of the concerns are the reality of our geology and our substrate. And if we were to just put walls up, we have issues with groundwater penetration. So our freshwater lens sits on top of the salt water in the ocean and that rise and falls with the sea level tidal change. But it will also continue to rise as sea level rises and it could push up onto the ground plains. So I'm not certain that just walls and hardening will ensure that the low lying areas in the coastal plain will remain dry. So these are the kinds of adaptation questions specific to sea level rise that are really in discussion now around the idea of managed retreat that some call it or intentional realignment is another way to call it. You know, really thinking about these vulnerable locations, thinking about these places that are filled land already. Are we going up? Are we hardening? Are we protecting? Are we moving back? What are the engineering and architecture solutions for some of these? And it's really about trying to interpret the data and come up with a holistic vision, but right now it's kind of been piecemeal as properties are grappling with the issue. Yeah. Good question, thanks. But it does go back to the timing question of all of this. So the guidance that we're getting from the Climate Change Commission is the leader of sea level rise by the end of this century. It's prudent to consider the impacts of that ultimate sea level rise by the mid-century because the ocean isn't static. It comes and goes with the tide, but you also have other coastal hazards that could impact it. And we know, locally, we have a small contribution, but hopefully we have outsized impact in our leadership. And globally, if we're able to drastically reduce our emissions, more affordable, more beautiful energy systems, we can push off some of those sea level rise impacts further into the future that doesn't solve them, but it certainly gives us a better chance to fully consider adaptation measures. Yeah. That is very true. Yeah. So I guess part of the effort here is to get the good information that will inspire folks to take the actions that are needed. And the young folks, too. That is the challenge of their generation. You know, how do we adapt to what nature is going to be giving to us in the form of storms or temperatures and, okay, nature partly. Yes, partly. Mostly. Yes. And that's important. We cause it and nature delivers the impacts, I suppose. We think about hazards and we think about events, impacts and those impacts are flooding, erosion, high winds and storm surge. So for me, I find it more helpful to think about those things because those are actually where our rules, ordinances, design policies, land use strategies that we already have the authority to consider and incorporate into any of our decisions. So even sea level rise is somewhat of an abstract. You can think of it as like real slow burn, it's not to say that we have oodles of time to think about it, but we should start considering the reality of potential permanently lost land, temporarily inundated land. What does that mean for any beach park, for any industrial area, for any critical infrastructure like an airport or wastewater treatment plant and what are the appropriate strategies around those contextually specific locations. Another question. So when you went to all the neighborhood boards and all these meetings with the local population, what is the feeling of their awareness of the problem and more importantly, their willingness to take action and action translates eventually into paying for it. So let's start with the first part and then get to the action part. The general, and I think it's a testament, even just the fact that this office exists, the voters of this island, as island communities, I think we all understand the issues and the reality. It passed by 17 percentage points, which is a landslide in any election process. And when we were going to all the community, the neighborhood boards, and really in any of our other discussions, there was a lot of shaking heads. People weren't saying, okay, so what? They were saying, okay, so now what? Right. Which is somewhat of a different discussion than even a couple of years ago. And the thing that you're asking about is what does it mean to me? How does it potentially impact how I live and what could I do to act upon it, advocate for it, support any kind of measure? And that's actually what we're doing now. So we just last night had the second climate action plan community meeting. So climate action is really around all the emissions reduction strategies. And that's exactly we play this scenario game where we're trying to calculate how we get the emissions down over a 2025, a 2035 and a 2045 time period. And they're selecting from the major sectors that we have of transportation, electricity, waste, aviation, et cetera. And then we talk about the pros and cons, feasibility, what does it mean to me? What could I do differently? But it certainly will require thinking about spending money differently and certainly upfront capital in new infrastructure will be costly. But we have to think about government has a responsibility to think on long-term horizons, and that's what we're excited to engage the community discussion around. Yeah, I mean it's almost 2020, you know, that's so 2050 is not that far away. You know, it does take a while for infrastructure to get designed and built and changed and you know, even just have the community stay on board for these. So I wanted to take a look at one of these other slides you had here. Yeah, I think if we go to number nine, this is probably something that you too and the viewers of this program are extremely familiar with, which is just the mixture of Oahu's energy. You can see almost 65% of that comes from oil and probably a lot of people are not so aware that such a large amount comes from coal. That's just a base load. And this is the reality. Coal is dirtier in terms of emissions than oil, so we could think about replacing coal, which maybe requires bringing in more oil, but that doesn't supplant the emissions. So how do we ensure that we're getting towards our state committed goals of 100% renewable energy by 2045. Now there's a carbon neutral by 2045 and the four counties have actually committed to 100% renewable in the transportation sector by 2045. And that's what if we go to the 10th image there, we really are starting to learn more about because we were really progressing on a lot of the electricity sector, the energy sector. But as through the recession as transportation is also directly correlated with price of oil, that started to come down as well. But now we've seen this divergence in the progress. So we also recognize that ground transportation is a significant component of our emissions. And it's a doubly beneficial opportunity to think about other community benefits around health, access, clean streets, urban forests, better storm water management because these are actually the largest connected public spaces. They are all of our public spaces, the road rights of way. So we have the authority to re-envision how we move about our communities. Yeah. So the urban planning side, you know, what type of community do we want to be in every day? Yeah. So what about public transportation? We have a really great public transportation system that people just want to take. That takes so many drivers off the road. Right now when's the bus going to show up? You know, it's inconvenient. I want to go here. I can't get there on public transportation. I have to walk too far. What's the impact? Because if you had clean buses or a clean train, you would really knock out a lot of the transportation. You could see that graph go down. Yeah. And that's where the discussions of co-benefits and different visions for our communities really come into play, because the reality is we could have all electric vehicles for all the registered vehicles that are out there today. We'd still have traffic. We'd still have long commutes. We'd still have potentially this spike in pedestrian fatalities that we've seen lately. And that doesn't necessarily ensure that it's a different community future, but we've cut our emissions for sure, but we still have all other problems. So investments in shared mobility, investments in perhaps autonomous mobility, but certainly public access and public transportation we think is a huge component of all of this. And that's the whole notion around transit-oriented development and the reality of developing this urban spine across this major corridor, which is the development of the rail structure. Yeah. So I think one of the other topics that we're interested in is the intersection between the electricity sector and the transport sector, not just how we can have less emissions in our transportation sector, but also how if we do have electric vehicles, you know, we do need the other types, the other modes in the bicycles and, you know, transit-oriented development and less need to travel, but for the electric vehicles that you have, what would they be powered by? And how would that support the grid? And when are they being charged, I think, could all be worked into this, it's a small part. So I'll make some, you know, what I could very easily say is you have batteries on wheels running around and they're able to suck up all this abundance during the daytime and you guys know how to explain that way more than I do and I would say he's been on this show twice. I have a colleague with me, Mold, who's our energy program coordinator, so I'll leave it to him and I think you were trying to toss me a softball there, but I don't know how to do this. And also, Mitch is the hydrogen program thing, so, you know, hydrogen is one of the ways you store energy, you know, if you have an excess of energy from probably your renewable sources and you store it in the form of hydrogen that can also be used in the transportation sector. So just to make the connection there. Yeah, different fuel sources. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Okay, well we're running out of time, but I wanted to give you one more chance to highlight something that you think is important. Right, I think maybe just to leave it with you all, we have our first preliminary data for our 2015 Greenhouse Gas baseline inventory and this is the first step in our reaffirmation of the Paris Climate Agreement. It requires one, doing an inventory, two, setting targets for reductions, three setting the course to meet those reductions. And if you're able to, we can show the last image. I know we're running low on time, but it does show you that. So is that number? Number 11. It shows the mix and it shows everything that we kind of already know that it's in the energy and electricity sector on image 11. Image 11? And then it's also in the transportation sector. Oh, try 8. Sorry, it got moved. No, that is 8. Try left. Well, unless it gets swapped. Well, anyway, we know that it's, that our big things as we continue to progress on the grid and the electricity sector, we're going to continue to make that progress. But we need to tackle ground transportation and aviation. And aviation is the one that the city doesn't have really control over. But we have to account for it, because when you do an inventory, you have to count for all the emissions within your jurisdiction. Got it. Yeah, so, thank you so much. We're so happy to do. To participate in our climate action planning. You can go to resilientowahu.org sign up for our newsletter, sign up for e-mail blast, sign up for social media, and that's the best way to ensure that you're getting engaged in the discussion as well. Thank you so much.