 Hi everyone. Welcome to N5D. And got it. Check it out. The N5D home page N5D.com got a whole new look. It's looking sharp. Check it out. N5D.com. But today we have a special guest, baby. We do. We have my dear friend. I've known Julie for long, long, long years. And she is, I'm going to say, very ancient. She is, I would say, the best counselor that you could possibly get. That's how I'm going to say this. Because most counselors out there are, how do you, and how does that make you feel? They're not allowed to give you input. They're not allowed to, you know, she blends her spirituality and living in the moment. And, you know, she's going to explain it all in a minute. She blends the two together. And I really would hope that there are more counselors out there who do have the guts to come out of this box. That it's like, that's how you're supposed to counsel and maybe learn to do the way that Julie's doing things. And she's also teaching others. Anyway, I could say, I want her to say it. So, shall we introduce this lovely, lovely lady, Julie Rogers. Are you doing it? Am I doing it? Because we're both, yeah. It's done. This is Julie. Hello. She's sandwiched in the middle of us now. No. Here we go. You dragged the other one. Yes, it's lovely, Julie. And do you want to explain, first of all, a bit about your background, about why you got into counseling and that type of thing? Yeah, sure. So, approximately about 25 years ago, I was at rock bottom and I was in a violent relationship. I was trying to reach out for help. There was nobody to help me. And by chance a friend said to me, do I want to attend this counseling course? And I said, yeah, I don't want to be a counselor. I want to help myself. And that's how it started. And I had the best therapist. We were meant to have counseling for a year, but I had it for five years. And I was just committed to learning all about me. And I met my inner child. I was learning all about my patterns, my learnt behaviour. And I was really committed to myself. And whilst attending college, I was thinking I'm never going to pass this because I really thought that I wasn't taking it in. But the mind was very clever. And it did. It naturally took it all in. So it kind of came alive in me. And here I am as a counselor. But because of how it all started for me and I desperately wanted to get that help, I like to help others. And that's the reason I do what I do. Yeah. And you do it so well. You do. And it's from the heart. You can feel it whenever you're kind of talking about what it is that you do. You know, it's there. So what are you doing at the moment? How are you working things at the moment? So at the moment I'm doing bereavement and lost counselling for all areas again. Well, most areas again. But I always introduce the living in the moment because nothing else makes sense. You know, it's I encourage clients to obviously we work through trauma. We work through where they're stuck. And then I introduce their inner child to them. And I give them the tools to start living in the moment. And it works. And it does change their lives. I've had a lot of people that it's actually really changed their lives. And that's that's the beauty of it, isn't it? And Greg's done some therapy work, haven't you? Yeah, yeah, quite a bit. Actually, I specialize with at-risk youth. And it usually had to be comorbid with some kind of drug issue as well. So the anger management and opioid abuse, you know, those two things combined. But I was curious, though, when you were growing up going to when you were a child, say in your 10, 12, 13 year, were you a good student back then? No. Okay. And I'm glad you're being really honest about this. Oh, you're not going to know that I'm honest. And that's the thing, when I'm with my clients, I'm not a textbook counselor. No, I'm real. And they know I'm real. But no, I wasn't. And the reason being was because obviously, I was going through so much trauma in my twitches off, you're scared. You're not taking anything in. Theory, haven't you, Greg? Pardon me? You got theory, haven't you? Well, I graduated high school at the bottom of my class, because I was always looking out the window daydreaming. I found I found school incredibly boring. But when I got to college, or university, as you would call it, all of a sudden, you know, I took psychology and I found that so fascinating that I not only graduated with honors for my BA, but also for my master's degree. So I graduated with honors for both because I found it so interesting. Now, I was wondering, how did you do in college? Amazing. Yeah. Yeah. But it was because I was believing in myself and I was working on myself and I was healing my inner child. And I was being honest and true to me. And you enjoyed learning. Yes. About that too. It's huge when you can go to school and learn something that you actually find interesting. Now, I did have another question about college. You know, in here in the States, they teach you personality theory and you go over all these different styles of teaching. And I forgot the specific psychologist's name, but he went by the moniker of the uh-huh psychologist. And when people would talk, he'd just go uh-huh. And there'd be this awkward silence. And then the reasoning behind that was with that awkward silence, the client's going to talk even more. They're going to say stop that you would never get out of them otherwise. What kind of styles did you kind of like? Okay. So mine is the person sent an approach. And I find I like the client to lead. You know, and sometimes from my life's experience when I share, because sometimes counselors say, oh no, you mustn't share. But if you've worked on yourself and you've processed it, you're able to dip in and out without it affecting you, triggering you. So they feel more at ease. They think, ah, it's not just really important that they can open up and be themselves. Yeah. Because you don't then feel judged. You don't then feel you've got no problems. You're probably sitting there. You've got no problems. You're looking down at me. You know, that's how people feel. And that's what it's like when I'm reading the cards as well. I give a little bit of myself as well when I'm doing that, because you're kind of on that level client field then. One thing they teach you in the States is that you're not supposed to get emotionally involved. You can't show empathy to your clients. And I think that's utter bullshit. Because there'd be other therapists at this one particular company I worked for. And I would tell them, give me your most difficult clients. I'll reach them. Yeah. So I mean, what's your beliefs on that? I'm with you all the way. I'm with you all the way. Every single client I see as a unique individual. And I get into their world. And I mean, I know I get referral and I look at them and I assess them and everything. But when I'm talking to that person in blank page, I want to listen to them. I want to hear from them. I want to engage with them and not have any judgments there whatsoever. And they pick it up. And I think that's really important. They feel seen, they feel heard. And once they feel that you believe in them, they start to believe in themselves. And they'll open up more with you. If you can feel their pain and be honest with them. For sure. So when you work for, did you say County Council as well? Well, it's it's part of them. The work that I'm doing is for them. I've been with this organization for about six years. It's just got bigger and bigger. But I'm now running my living in moment workshops. So sometimes what I do is I work with a client. And then I bring them into my workshops, which is quite in depth. It's a six week program. And it's first of all covering what happens when we're holding on how to learn to let go and do nice relaxations in there. And number two is anxiety. Because we cannot skip over this. If we skip over it, and we do all the fluffy stuff, it's going to come out. So I want them to know their own patterns, their own learning behavior. And obviously I teach this and talk about it. And week three, again, triggers, again, looking at our learning behavior. And then for the child week. And this is where it all changes. I love it. It's a very relaxed week. And I get them to meet them in a child, which honestly is just amazing. I love it. Week five is the one I need for motions. Oh, yeah, it really does. But I get them to give what they needed back then to themselves. Yeah. Yeah. It's nothing to do with a good childhood or bad childhood. It's about what we actually took in as that child, if that makes sense. Do you find it's easier for men or women to open up and get to that inner child? I wish, I've got a lot, it sounds really bad, I've got quite a lot of men. But the women as well, they both seem to be, you know, I've got volunteers that work with me, they're men, they're amazing. But when I first meet them, they're so shy. And it's so beautiful to see somebody come to me really, you know, with no hope. And then just shine and then want to volunteer and then want to get out there and do it and help others. It's amazing. But yeah, I wish there was more men counsellors. There's not enough. Here, here, I don't know if it's the same there, I would assume so. But here in the States, you know, you build up this macho kind of facade. And, you know, it took my daughter to break that down. When she was little, she'd curl up in a little ball on my lap and look at me with her big puppy dog eyes. And in her little angel voice, she'd go, Daddy, can I watch a little football with you? I'm like, sure, pumpkin. Five minutes later, she's doing everything else other than watching football. But she broke down that that whole macho thing, because I'd be like, oh, instead of, you know, if I had a son, I'd be like, Oh, no, take it like a man, be a man kind of thing, you know. But the daughter broke that down. And she showed me that in her child that I haven't seen within myself. So do you find that sometimes, maybe those people with children are easier to reach than those without children? Sometimes, but I don't know how I do it. I just don't know how I do it, but I just do. But I can kind of gauge where somebody is. When they're talking to me, I can kind of get their pattern before they do, if that makes sense. And normally it goes back to a childhood experience. And it has affected the whole of their life, if that makes sense. For an example, I had a client that was locked in a room many, many years ago and was terrified. And her mum would not help her, which she's now, you know, she's getting on in life. And she's realized just by this one session, oh my God, I did not press them feelings. And it's kept me in victim. So she goes into their relationships because it's normal to her. Do you see what I mean? So once they make that connection, they find their voice and they start to believe in themselves, love themselves, heal themselves. It's just amazing. Walk us through that. So she was locked in a room as a child. And then her mum was at a church and she kept going to this church. And she was locked in a room and with a monk. And this monk terrified her. And she was shouting out to her mum, help, help. Was he abusing her or? Yeah. Sexually. And he was about to, he was about to, but she screamed so much that in the end he got frightened and over. But it terrified her so much. You see that it controlled the whole of her life. And for me, for an example, when I was young, my, my, my mum and dad, obviously he was violent. So I picked up that pattern at an early age that that's what you do. That's home from home to me. And they say why I followed relationships like that. But when, when I was seven, he took us on holiday and he took us in the shop to buy some sweets. And I wanted a rock, not a small one, not the big one, the medium size. And he said, you're sly like your mother. Well, then words stayed with me the whole of my life. And literally, even to this day, as control means, it's like, you're not good enough, you don't deserve it. And it's only on the money side of it. But it's such a, you know, when I have to do a tender, I have to do something. I have to do my work first. I have to write and get my feelings out before I can do the actual tender. And it's all from that. So you can imagine the other things that go into our minds as a child. Just little things that you don't think have got much significance. And they do. They ring true, don't they? Darling, I don't know if you want to share this, I'm trying to share this on your Facebook page. And I don't know how to do it. So just in a minute. From your page to mine, I can do it. Yes. Let's flash forward. You have this. So your client, you know, she's had this childhood trauma with the monk being locked in the room. Flash forward. She comes and visits you. She doesn't know. I don't know how I do it. But she's talking about these relationships. And I'm going, okay, so what was your childhood like? And she's, oh, no, it's really good. Okay. But this has come from somewhere. I feel that. And then I just said, okay, what was it all like? And then we went to that. And she went, okay, she got into them feelings. And then I've got it. And she got it. And it's just changed her life. And how does, how do you work the inner child into that whole scenario? So what I do is, if once you get it, you go back to that space and you talk from that space. And you try to describe whatever you can remember. If that makes sense. As a child. As a child. Yeah. A lot of people don't make it higher. Like, as if they're talking like a child. Yes. Sometimes you can always tell. Yeah. Yeah. Wow. It's very clever. Our inner child is amazing, honestly. Yeah. And we've got a little key inside us. We've just got to find it to unlock the door. Yeah. In my inner child love playing. We're just too big kids. We are. I wouldn't want to. I wouldn't want to be anything else. And I swear it keeps you younger. It does nothing. I think the thing is, once you start to recognise your patterns and your learnt behaviour, you kind of take it away that it's not your fault anymore. Because we carry that, don't we? We blame ourselves. We think we're not good enough. We're not this. We're not that. And we go around. We believe our faults. And it's our faults. It's almost like a computer in our minds. So all that learnt behaviour we took in as the child is stuck there. And as we get older, it activates. And we don't know why. We're confused with this, with that. But actually our faults are controlling us. So I do work with the mind a lot as well and get them to kind of recognise that we are not our faults. You were mentioning how you had these issues with your parents and, you know, getting abused. How did you use your technique on yourself? Okay, so I'll tell you where I met my inner child. So I was having therapy and there was a college. And so we obviously touched on the inner child, but I never had a clue what he was talking about. I've got to be honest. And on this particular day, the boys was out with their dad. I was in the butt off. And all of a sudden I started talking from a seven-year-old. And I was like, Mummy, Mummy, Mummy, please wake up, wake up. Because my mum used to have blackouts. And literally, I could not believe the feelings that was coming up in me from my inner child. And ever since that day, I've never let her go. And what I mean by that is, at first I was thinking, how do I work with this? How do I, I couldn't connect. So I used to visualize myself as a child and I'd reach out, hold her hand, tell her she's safe and okay. And I still do it to this day. And that is what I encourage people to do. Yeah. Yeah. Because it's that little girl that goes into that panic, to that fear, to that anxiety. Yeah. So you're telling yourself, basically, it's okay. Yeah. You're reaching out to yourself. Hold your own hand. But I also, whoever knows me, knows that I swear by writing. So when I first started back all them years ago, the tutor said part of the course was to do some journal writing. And the very first day that I went home, I wrote in my journal and said how scared I was to come outside because I thought my ex-partner was going to get me. But I was also proud of myself. And I've never stopped writing since, but in a different way. I obviously don't write essays anymore. I was writing all my, I was learning about myself and all the things I liked, I didn't like, but now if I wake up in the morning and I've got anxiety, I will just literally have my book there. It's not hurting anybody. And I will just put, I've got anxiety or I'm nervous. I'm safe. I'm okay. And it literally brings me back to the moment. So you're, you're basically mothering yourself as your, and that's what I wanted to say earlier. You're mothering yourself as you're holding your inner child's hand. You are becoming their mother. And you brought me a journal. You came into the shop and got me. I've still got my gold book. It's over there. Oh yes. All my clients I work with get a journal and a stone and a crystal. That's what I love. Where do you get counselors that do that? It's like, you know, working with crystals, working with spiritual. So you, can you tell us a bit more about living in the moment and how that worked in? So I'm going to go and buy my story again. And because then it, I didn't know I was living in the moment basically. So I, I qualified as a counselor. And at that point I was engaged to a guy. And I found out I was pregnant at 40. And that was, oh my God. And he left. So he didn't want to commit. So I obviously Holly 17. She's just walked through the door. You heard her earlier. But we moved to Kent, me and my three children. And I was just committed, still committed to myself, even though I wasn't working as a counselor because I was pregnant. I had three children. I was volunteering. And life was really hard, really hard because, you know, talking about picking up patterns, my sons had picked up a bit from their dad. So it was hard. And obviously being a mum to a newborn baby. So I was really focusing on what I was doing in the moment. And it kept me going. If that makes sense. I was also very aware of what my mind was doing to me, keeping me trapped, telling me, you've got no life. Everyone's out. Look at more on Facebook. They've all your friends are out doing this and doing that. And I just kept myself with whatever I was doing in the moment, fully present with that. But at that time, I didn't know I was living in the moment. So for me, as I say now, why I teach people to live in the moment, you know when you're in the moment because you're with the flow. When you go back to the past, you're trapped and you're stuck and it feels so real. Yeah. So that's where the journal comes in to bring you back to the present moment. And how you do that is you really literally tune in with what you're doing now. And if you go to the future, it's the same thing. That's why earlier, how many times have you asked me to do things? And I'm going, I find it really hard to plan ahead. I don't like to do it. But obviously, when you're doing readings and things, you kind of have to do appointments and time zones and stuff like that. But our inner children are going, I mean, we don't want to do that. We don't want to. So all the time we're trying to be, we're trying to play up and just do whatever we want to do. Yes. But yes, so they're living in the moment workshops, they really are, they're really powerful. And I send everybody a pack. I make sure, and this is just me, I just make sure everybody's got what they need. So they haven't got to go out and think, oh, I need to go and get that. And I want them to have it all there. And, you know, all the tools that I provide, I want them to have. So I send them all their packs. And then we do it on Zoom. And it's amazing. But I do like to get to know a little bit about them first. Yes. Yeah. Obviously, because, because, you know, I'm holding a group and there's triggers. So I want them to become aware of their triggers and that, you know, kind of take responsibility for your own self. And you're learning in this. So I'm holding it and being aware of, you know, people's triggers as well, if that makes sense. Yeah. Yeah. Definitely. Yeah. So that you don't say the wrong thing, knowing that it's going to upset somebody or prepare them first so that they know something. Yeah. Yeah. And it's a teaching, it's a learning. The more you learn about yourself, the hard, the hardest time is the most growing. I think you know that. And it is. It's so true. I just adopted that way. I just thought, well, okay, whatever I'm going through, I know I'm going to, I'm going to learn something and started to trust. It's trusting the process. It's trusting yourself. It's trusting the universe. It's, it's just going with it. That makes sense. Yeah. Yeah. I love that. What do you find about, for example, fellow, you know, colleagues or other people in the medical field? I know that when I was a child and family therapist, I still, I would talk to people, I had already watched The Secret and I would tell them all about it. And they think I was woo-woo. And I, you know, I believed I've had UFO sightings and I would talk to them about it. I opened up to them and most of them thought I was crazy, but I don't care what people think. I don't care. What do you find about, I mean, do you find that people are awakened? Can you talk more about it now, nowadays than, you know, me back in the early 2000s? People often say to me, what is it about you that is successful? And honestly, I have a lot of clients that come to me and say, you know, they've been to these counselors. It's just not working. And they come out feeling worse. What I would say successful is being real, being honest. And I think that since I've been doing this for the last six years, a lot of people are putting it into practice now, who I work with. But sadly, the mental health team, no, you know, it needs a bit more work on it. So, but, you know, that's why I want to talk to people because we all need this support. We do. I remember I had a friend who he was going through a lot. He was very depressed. He had spiritual attachments. He had, you know, mental health issues. He was under the mental health team. And he tried to commit suicide. His mom was desperate. So, you know, in her desperation, she came to me and said, could you help him? And I said, I can't. I don't know. I'll try. And so I worked with him. We got through it. And his team, he then within three months had turned around. He, I didn't tell him to get off his psychotic drugs. He did this himself. You know, I was nothing to do with that. I was just meeting him week by week by week. And in the end, he got himself so well that he became an absolutely brilliant counsellor and a good psychic reader. He got in touch with his higher self and everything. And I was invited to the mental health team to give a talk to the other people there to see if I could help anybody else. But as soon as I mentioned that we worked with angels, I wasn't allowed to have anything more to do with any of them. Have a lot of beliefs. No, there's a lot of beliefs, a lot of beliefs and conditions. I don't like the conditions. I kind of, it's like, what's the word? People, we have all this learnt behaviour on the conditions as a child, and I get them to uncondition their self, basically. Yes. If that makes sense, you know. Yeah. Have you ever had to, you know, count school people who are highly religious and kind of don't like all the other stuff? How do they react to you? Well, I go with them. Like, I had a lady once and lesser. She's not here anymore. This was when I was working for Macmillan. And she was really religious. And I only spoke about meditation. And straight away, she put her hands up. You know, that's it. So, I just didn't mention it anymore because I just knew we're not going to get through to her otherwise. I'm just going to trigger, trigger, trigger. But she did follow the other way with me, if that makes sense. So, she's fine with the what? She still went with the tools that I gave her. And she still threw and she was looking after, saying we're doing all the right things. So, she's just finding a way in really. Yeah. Yeah. I'm curious about the whole inner child technique. Now, there's certain things like, say somebody was labeled, you know, bipolar, schizophrenic, you know, and you need some kind of benzodiazepine, like clonopin or something to treat them with. You wouldn't be taking care of somebody like that. But then again, I was thinking, what if there was somebody that was obsessive-compulsive? That might be something different where you could bring them back to a point in time where all of a sudden, you know, they're counting every Lego or every domino or they start counting things obsessively. You could probably use that with them. Yes, you could. And to be quite honest with you, I don't think my own personal experience is that until you work with the inner child, because you have to, you know, this is a computer in your mind. It's what we've taken in as that youngster. And until we work with our inner child, no real therapeutic, it really can't, you know, we've got to make that connection somewhere. That's what I've come across. Because I'm going to come out, it's amazing. And, you know, there we go again. Once I start talking about the inner child, my passion just comes alive. Honestly, it's so magic. It's unbelievable. We all got that key inside, but we don't believe in ourselves. Nine times that 10, we don't feel good enough, you know. And actually, once you find the real you, you know, what's your space? It seems like men would be more, well, less likely to show that inner child because it shows that they're vulnerable. All of a sudden, they let their defenses down, which is what I did with my daughter. And that was easy in that situation. And I think any, I think most men, I can't say any, but most men with daughters would probably fall into that, you know, situation where, you know, like my daughter had me wrapped around her little finger. But, and that that would bring down. But it just, I don't know, it's just an observation. It seems like, you know, men, men would seem to have their guards up more than them. Yeah, I just, I really don't know, because I kind of work with them first. So most, so if they come to me for bereavement and lost, I work with that. And I start to bring them into the moment. But then we normally make a connection with our inner child. Once they do the men, they thrive. Honestly, I can't tell you. It's when they start to believe in themselves. Yeah. That's when it works. Yeah. And I've got a poem. Sorry, so again, I wrote this little poem when I was, yeah, I'll read it. If you want me to, would you like me to? Yeah, of course. Finds it. Here it is. Let me just put my glasses into it. So this is when I was really going through it. And I was pregnant with Holly. So it's called meeting my inner child. So little children of the world, don't be afraid of who you are. Look inside and see what you see Feel what you feel because it is so real. Please don't push your feelings away, because you may feel scared to look or feel them. You sure are going to need them. They belong to you and will guide you through your life as you strive to live this life. If you are scared, then allow yourself to feel scared. You will become used to the feeling and it will be your friend. If you hate, then it's for a reason. Please don't ignore it, accept it as your feeling. Hate, love, resentment, disgust, respect, praise, caring, sharing, betrayal. Accept them all. They are your key to freedom. Please little child, allow yourself to just be. You are beautiful and free. Don't change if you can help it. You are who you are. No one can hurt you if you accept all your feelings, even if it is to yourself. Don't hide them and live a crippled life. Share them with yourself. Be proud to be clever and know who you are. Don't let people take them away. They are yours to treasure, even if you don't like them. Make them your friend. Make your beautiful self your friend. Take it from a lost child that didn't have this knowledge and who can feel the feelings I hid when I was a child. Just to survive in a horrible world which could have been so beautiful, if only I trusted in you, my child. People tried to take us away from our real self, who was once so free. By becoming aware, you can love yourself back to the real you. You are not mad, little child. Far from it. Learn to just be united and tall. Wow. That's beautiful. That's really beautiful. I felt that. I really felt that. Wow. It's like something happens inside you, doesn't it, when you connect with, when your inner child is being acknowledged. It's like, I've always wanted to be acknowledged, mom or dad. I've always wanted to be acknowledged. If you look at why the inner child gets locked away, it's the parents. It's society. It's both. It's growth. Get a job and grow up. Be responsible. School does it, unfortunately. It can be a sentence, can't it? Like I said, don't cry. Stop crying. We get that fear and we're told not to do it, so we don't do it. To be quite honest, to me, it's like a spell. That's what that poem is about. It is a spell. I was locked in a spell for many, many years and that spell can still come back just because I'm fully aware of it and I know how to accept myself and move through it. It's still there. It's so automatic. It's learning about them triggers, learning what does that. Does that make sense? I was watching a post-game interview with a coach in American football last year and it was the last, I think it was the last game of the season and it was the coach of the Detroit Lions. He's talking about the effort that his team put out there and he was so proud of them that he started crying and you can see the tears dripping down his face. They lost, but I believe they lost that game, but the team played really, really hard and they believed in him and they had a strong finish at the end of the season and he was just so proud of them that he was crying. I'm thinking, this guy, somebody that has to be in this world of macho sports and stuff like that, able to show his emotions like that, he's in touch with that inner child easily or he isn't at the moment. Of course he was, because he was able to cry on TV in front of a large crowd. That's amazing. It is better now than it has been. I mean now people don't just kind of jump at men when they show their emotions. Most women find it actually a bit of a turn on that a man can actually show his inner child and throw his feminine side. But it's got to be a balance too. You don't want to be a sissy. I don't want to be, you know, you're going to have that balance of masculine and feminine, you know, the protector, the warrior, plus the softer side of the lover. Well, the thing is what I discovered as well is that obviously when I first started at the college training, I was so dysfunctional, but I became a fully functional person. But that doesn't mean to say life's perfect. It's far from perfect, but I will never ever deny what I'm feeling. I will never skip over it. I will never push it away. Even if I just say it to myself, I'm sad or I'm angry. I'm safe. I'm okay. You know, it's like you're talking to yourself, but you're quickly bringing yourself back because you're aware of what's happening. It is that awareness, if that makes sense. My dad, total sense. Absolutely total sense. When we were talking about, you know, what brings it on, yeah? Mark's one of our moderates. It's our toxic society. Yeah. Yeah. And like Allie said, school and, you know, parents, everything. Yeah. There needs to be a new type of school for children for sure. Well, when I work in because I work in a school as well. And well, I don't anymore. I did. And do you know what? I used to, I've got some amazing stories from the children, but they give them a little scrapbook, a big scrapbook, and I get them to draw their feelings. And I get them to become aware. We stick it in there. They, honestly, so amazing. And I say to them, when we're finished, take that book with you. When you get older, look back in that book, there's your answers. You know, talking about suicide, you know, there was a young boy that I had 10. And I was getting him to look at his cycle, how he was feeling, and to name what the feelings was. And in there, he was putting, I don't know, I don't feel loved. I want to commit suicide before. How amazing. Now, the thing is, he actually wrote that and underneath it, he put, I'm not going to do it, but the feeling's strong. And just by expressing that, he was able to come back and move through it. And this is so important, because this is why we've got it now in society. Yeah, because it's from that child that we believe it so much. We believe our faults. We are constantly chatting to ourselves, all this negative talk. We believe it. And so, but that is not who we are. How do we correct this, though, before it gets into adulthood? Yeah, it's because when I work with people, that's why I go back, if that makes sense. I get them to look at their patterns and everything. But the way, for me, the way that I do it is just my self-awareness. I've been committed to my self-awareness. I will never run away from it as hard as it is sometimes. And it is up there. My journal, my writing, it really helps. So when you're writing in that journal, you are normally writing from a child's space. Even though you're writing from that adult space, it's the child that's writing. Are you writing with crayons? Yeah, she does give you crayons in your pack. Yeah, I'll give you crayons in my pack. I was in the pack. She puts crayons in there. Yeah, I do. Because it's, you know, as well. And then this is another thing. It's like, when we get the feelings, like, we don't want to live anymore, or we're not, you know, what's the point? Again, these needs to come out. So you just get the great big piece of paper and you just write it on there. I don't want to be here anymore. Keep going, keep going, keep going. And you come back. You're not swallowing it down. You're not suppressing it. It doesn't then come out and fester later on. Can I just say, Mark, you're doing an amazing job, UFO Mark. Thank you so much for doing all the moderating there. Thank you so much. And we haven't said hello to everybody on there, but we haven't ignored. We just obviously, I've been kind of looking at the comments as well as we're going along. So thank you. The last time I was over there in the UK, we went shopping, we went to this like dollar store and Ali bought a bunch of, you know, toys for the kids. And I'm thinking, I want to play with them. Were they for the kids? There was like this little miniature golf thing. I'm like, I want to play that. That's it. Yeah. Yep. Love it. And hoop-plar. You know the old fashioned hoop-plar and things like that. Yeah. It's great. And dancing is good because when you're dancing, even just dancing by yourself, just getting out. Acceptance. Acceptance of ourselves. This is what we need. When, when Brittany, when Brittany was little, when it would rain, when we were living in upstate New York, it would rain and we'd make rain hats and we'd put on old clothes and old sneakers and we would jump in every mud puddle. And people would drive by and they'd see this adult doing that and probably thinking I'm crazy. We had so much fun. And the bottom line is I always told Brittany, if you didn't get dirty, you didn't have fun. What she was doing was building up her immunity system as well. Sounds amazing. Yeah. You love being daddy, didn't you? Oh yeah. We still love being a dad, but being with the young Brittany. She's an amazing young lady now. So where are you now? What are you, your, your, your, because you wasn't able to take on clients, but now you are. I can take on some clients because obviously I've got stuff. The main thing is as well that we take self-care seriously. We need to look after ourselves to be able to do it. So again, I think you said before, Greg, with a balance, it's so important to get that balance right. And I haven't been able, I mean, I have done private work, but I've been so busy and, and through so much that, you know, I've had to get the balance right. So now I'm able to take on some private clients, obviously, and run work. I want to expand. I want to help more people. That's what I want to do. Yeah. It needs to get out there. It does. It does. And the other thing is, is teaching other therapists the way that you, I think that's, that's going to be a big thing. So have you got any plans to maybe help people who've got counselling skills and maybe they want to kind of take it to the next level? Yeah, I'd love to do it. So could they contact you if they've, if they've got that? And this could be worldwide. There doesn't have to be any limitations with Zoom and everything. There's no limitations or clientele, you know, to have these clients. It's the self-awareness and, you know, to be a good therapist, I feel like you have to have that self-awareness. Otherwise, if you, across as a textbook counsellor, the client will pick it up. Nothing's going to happen if that makes sense. So self-awareness is what teaches us. Yeah. And it's exciting. It's hard, but it's exciting. You know, I remember the hardest time of my life, but my book was my best friend. And this is why I believe in it so much, my writing. That's why you've got one hand, Ellie. I can't remember what you was going through at the time, but I remember dropping it off to you. I know, I know. Yeah, I didn't do it as much as I should, though. That's definitely, I didn't. I didn't. I still need you. I mean, the thing is, as well, it's not about writing all the time, but you know, sometimes when you are feeling stuck, and you really feel down, or you're feeling really low, just scribbling the words. I feel really low. I'm really down. You know, what do you know? I do it on record. I record my voice memo. So it's the same kind of thing. I get my thoughts and everything and emotions out using that rather than writing. I suppose it's the same. Yeah. Yeah, it's everybody's different. That's just my way. But, you know, for me, it really works. I've got so many journals everywhere. I just grab whatever one is. And also being honest. So for an example, when I run my workshops, if I'm having a bad morning, I'm not going to sit there. I've got on a fake smile and just make everything. It's okay because it's not going to work. You know, actually, I'm having a really bad morning. I've got a bit of anxiety. And as soon as I say that, I'm back. I'm present. Yeah. You've released it. You've released it and able. So we've got a question here, exactly the same time. We've got a question here from Elaine. Define self care, please. Okay. So self care is just like when Ali was saying, when can you take on? It's about taking care of my health first, myself. Because if I just say yes to everybody, and I'm not going to have no time for me like to just do my walk or to take care of myself, I'm going to be ill. I'm not going to be present. Just, you know, and if I'm just doing it because I'm such just want to do it and say yes, it's not going to work. Self care is saying no at times. You know, and it's like even with our families. No, actually, I can't do that. Yeah. You know, you need that time for yourself. Yeah. Does that make sense? Shish now, right? Shish now. No, it's true. I, you know what, and I love Ali so much because she puts love in front of her own needs, but she's doing that and she's putting her own health. Don't stop me on that one, Greg, because I have told Ali this so many times. Her heart is so big and loving and she puts that ahead of her health. But you need to have that self care before you can help others. I know. I know. No, you don't. I need to have a whole day off. I never have a whole day off. How are they? I don't. I don't. So I do need to have a whole day off. And again, I get that because when you're working and you have that passion for what you're doing, it's not like a job. No, it's not a chore. No, I am the same. I am the same, but I do know. I will say being self employed, having a day off, sometimes you can't necessarily afford to take the finger off the pedal. And if there was enough money, I would gladly take a week off or a day off or whatever, but there's always something in your head saying, I've got to think ahead and it's going to be quite difficult. So it is hard to get that balance. It is hard, but I know that I need to. So I think what Elaine was saying, how can someone else give themselves that self care? What's an example of that self care? We do this on the workshop as well. So what I say to people before you say, yes, check inside, can I do this? Do I want to do this? How is this going to affect me? Yes, because you know, sometimes we just say yes. And then we think, why did I say yes? Because I've got this, this, this to do. It's just literally tuning in with yourself. That's true. Yeah, that's true. I actually did that today because there was someone I know who was absolutely desperate for a reading and it was time related. Does that make sense? Like, I've got to have it done. I've got to have it done before then. And I just couldn't see myself being able to fit it in the whole weekend. It's like tomorrow we've got, not tomorrow Sunday, we've got our 12 hour kind of thing going on. There was just no way of fitting in before Monday and I felt bad about it, but then I thought, I can't do it. So when you felt bad, when you feel bad about it, that's when you're writing your book. I'm feeling really bad. Don't hold it. Okay. This is holding on and letting go comes in. Yes. Admitting that I wanted to, but I couldn't. Yes. And it is okay to say no. Yeah, yeah. Because sometimes, I mean, obviously I say these things in my readings, does that make sense? But sometimes we're the worst people to actually take that back on ourselves. And I do say that when I'm doing the reading. It's like, I'm saying this to you, but I'm crap at it too. Because again, I want to be real. Do you know what I mean in the reading? It's like, you know, I'm telling you what my guides are saying, but my guides are also telling me. Yes, because when you do go over, when you do neglect yourself, you're going to feel it afterwards. You get headache, irritable. You get angry with yourself. You think, oh, why did I do that? You know, and I do get that bit as well when someone does ask you and you want to get, you really want to help them. Because you know how difficult it is for them. Yes. What do you do? Put your boundaries in. Difficult on families though, isn't it, as well? Do you know what I mean? You have to have your boundaries. You have to. It's hard. It's tricky. Easier said than done. Yeah, it is tricky. Yeah. I mean, what advice would you give on setting boundaries? Would you give boundaries upfront or at the time? Like, if someone wants to ask, well, you know, Annie, when you've asked me before and I check in myself, don't I? And I say, oh, I'm not sure I can say that yet. So I always check in with myself. I'm actually got a diary as well. That's really important. What am I doing on that day? Am I going to overload myself? Yeah, me too. Me too. Yeah. That's a good one. So boundaries. Boundaries is really checking in with yourself. And again, it's that question, how is this going to affect me? Do I want to do this? What works for me? Actually, I need some time off. I need to go for a walk. I need this. I need that. It's not selfish. It's self care. Yeah, that makes sense. The stewardess on a flight says you have to put your mask on first before you help others. Yeah. But if you're a service to others person, you're not going to be asking yourself those questions. You're going to be saying, what more can I do? I don't know. Exactly. And putting more on your plate, you know, get ill. Honestly, this is what happens. We go on and on and on. And we become ill. And then we go, oh, what do I need to do now? So what we want to try to do is to stop ourselves getting that ill. Yeah, beforehand beforehand. Yeah. You know, what you could do is sort of like say, right, I need a day off. What you do is you you say to everybody, you're working that day. Yes, I do that. You allowed to do that. But you're not lying because you are booking that to be you. Is that, is that a noi or is that? I'm always telling the kids I'm working for a family. And I'm hiding. My family, my family get it. They go, you know, it's like, you know, you know, actually people like it when you put the self care in because it encourages them to do it as well. Yeah, that's true. We think people don't like the word no, but they soon get used to it. She says. Yeah, exactly. Greg's in deep contemplation now. What are you thinking? No, I was just trying to think about, you know, I'm I'm still back on, you know, just being being a workaholic. I know we both are. You know, we both are. But sometimes it's workaholic, you know, when you just, when you get gratitude out of helping others, when you, I know, I'm the same. You do do it, darling. You do do it. You go, do you know what? I'm going down the beach. Yes, you do go down the beach. Which, which is you're in a child going, I'm sulking daddy. You have to meet the beach today. I want to go to the beach. Yeah. Yeah, you're, you're in a child is sulking. Well, I go to the beach. It's uplifting, isn't it? Brings you back. Yeah. I mean, Julie only lives around the corner for me. So, you know, but we keep saying we're going to meet up. We're going to go, you know, we don't do it, do we? We need to do it. Do it. Yeah. I'm always here. Yeah. Yes. Do you work with children as well? Yeah. Yeah. I love working with children because, as I say, then when they get older, they've got their own tools and I say to them, keep your little sweat book, never let it go, hide it. And when you're an adult, go back to it because there's your answers. Yeah. Yeah. I remember one of the, one of the things that they taught us here in the States on in child psychology, I thought it was pretty fascinating, is if you're working with a child, you can do the house tree person test. We have them draw a house or a tree or a person. And if, you know, if you have a sheet of paper and they draw themselves down in the lower quadrant and a little tiny person like that, it says a lot about them. The house, it doesn't have a door handle to it, says they're closed off, but the windows are shut. There's all sorts of things you can look at by a child's, the way a child draws. I thought that was like a really fascinating. Yeah. I had a very young child bless him and his mom died when she gave birth to him and oh, he was so lovely. Anyway, he was staying with his dad's mom. That was his nan. And he said, I just don't like staying there. I'm really, really scared. He said, I said, okay, what is it? Anyway, I said, let's get the paper and the crowns. And he said, there's this mirror. He said, and in the bedroom, he said, I can see all these horrible things coming out the mirror. So I said, okay, let's draw it. And he drew it. And I said to him, describe it as much as you can. So he drew knives and all these horrible things, monsters coming out this mirror. And after he finished it, and I said, right, okay, what does it make you feel like? So he wrote scared and all the feelings he was feeling. When he finished, I said, okay, let's get another piece of paper now. And he drew it in color. I said, now, what would you like that mirror to look like? And he drew an angel and it was his mummy. And so every time he went to say his nan's, he was happy. Yeah. Oh, that's so sweet. Love you, love you boy. Yeah. You see, now me, if a child was drawing that sort of thing, I'd be like, oh my God, let's quickly turn the page and do something else. So you're saying to let that flow, let the fear flow and then replace it. So once get it out, because we've acknowledged it, haven't they then? He's getting it out. Yeah. And then he's putting it back with the positive, if you like, to what he wanted, wants that mirror to be like. Yeah. Kids are amazing. Honestly, I think the younger you work with them, the better because they are really, really, really amazing. I love them all, brilliant. Wouldn't it be lovely if you could go around all the schools and they can have a day, a day with Julie. I'd love to. They're a wonderful team, you know, and that could be, they would never forget that lesson. They'd always remember that. Honestly, they do, but they're amazing. And also, I find that the people that I work with would make the best counsellors because they really get it and they really would know how somebody else feels, if that makes sense, because they've worked through it with themselves. Yes. Yeah. So people are going to be asking this, they're going to be saying, OK, so I need counselling. How can I get hold of you? And it's through the email address here. Yeah. And it doesn't matter where you are. You know, you can do it through Zoom and you can work through the time zone thing as well, can't you? I was curious. Do you have any adults who didn't have any childhood issues? Yes, they would say. A lot of them say it. Yeah. A lot of them say, no, I'm OK. And then again, I know my childhood was OK. And when we do the Inner Child Week, they go, oh, there was something. And they're very relaxed when we go into the Inner Child Week. But it's not, again, it's not their parents fault because their parents have got the learnt behaviour, but it's just looking at what you took in as that child and how it's your life. Because you follow the same kind of patterns. It's like learning to talk. It's automatic. Albert Bandura had that theory of modelling. Basically, that says that the apple doesn't fall far from the tree. You're going to model the behaviour of your parents, basically. So, you know, my parents, I got hit with a belt. You know, if I did something really bad, I got hit with a belt. I remember one time. That's how it was back then, wasn't it? In eighth grade, my father came down to hit me with this strap. I tried to get away and it caught me diagonally across my back. And I had gym class later on that morning. And I went into the boys' room and I lifted my shirt up and I still had a mark across my back. And I skipped gym class that day because I was too embarrassed. But that was the day. Through introspection, I said to myself, if I ever have children, I will never hit them. That's where the apple doesn't fall far from the tree. That's where Bandura's theory of modelling goes completely out the window. But I mean, what are the odds of a child using introspection to break the cycle? You either go one way or another, don't you? You either copy it or you like you. And I'm very much like what you did. I say, no, I would not do that because I get it because I know how I felt as that child. But some people think it's normal. But once you start to talk to them and they start to look at that and see what happened to them, that's when the change can happen. But again, it's that awareness. But it's taking the choice of do I really want to look at myself? Do I? And again, becoming aware of our faults. That is so important because the mind is so powerful, isn't it? It's always in play and it's always telling us how bad we are and oh my God, we've got to do this. We've got to do that. And then you get it from the TV and all the programs and everything. But you know, awareness and being aware of our thoughts and introspect, that's not something that's taught to children, generally. No, as an adult now. So for me, I'm just going to talk from my experience. If I get the thoughts of, I cannot put it, I'm not good enough is a big one, or say somebody's ignoring me. Someone ignores me, it's an instant trigger. And then it sets off a cycle, doesn't it? It goes from one fault to another, to another, to another, to another. And then you feel actually cracking on the floor, basically. Yeah. That is the fault. I'm so aware of what's going on. I just grab that pen and I do it because I know that if I try to push it away, it's going to make me feel so much worse. But do we reason then? And we think to yourself, that person might be busy, genuinely, that person may be just, I mean, they're not delivered. In my right, in my centre, of course I would. But if something else was going on in my life that's triggered me anyway, yeah, for example, when I've had a split up or break up with somebody and I'm not feeling good in myself, etc, etc. You're in that zone. So anything can come along and boom, you're off. So it's just being aware of you and you start acting differently. You start thinking differently and you start acting differently, if that makes sense. It's catching it. Yeah. But it takes practice. I mean, as I said, I've been doing this for a really long time, it still gets me. So yeah, it's a journey. It's some lovely comments here. Can I share some with you here? Look, so Leona from Australia, as light workers and givers, we do need to look after ourselves. And this takes practice, practice and more practice. Boundaries are essential for our sanity. Yes. And then you've got our lovely Phil, whose birthday it was yesterday. Happy birthday, Phil. This is the issue, how we're programming our children and how we're programming, how we were programmed as children as well. Yeah. The inner child work is like shadow work. Yeah. With that, I would say that a lot of our dis-ease is from our childhood trauma and programming. So a lot of people are seeing it. Is he a counsellor? He's a rakey master and he does a lot of healing and things. So he gets it. He gets it. I know. It's lovely. So can you just, before we wrap it up, I just wanted to find out workshop-wise. So if you do workshops periodically, are they ongoing? Do you have to start at the beginning? Are they kind of like per week or is it a one-day thing? How does your workshops work? So I, so at the moment, I've not done private six-week workshops because I've been so busy doing them from where I'm working, but I can do them now, maybe in the evening or something. But I also do a self-discovery one-day workshop, which is a bit of everything. But the main thing that I do do on my self-discovery day one is the inner child's exercise. And it's very relaxing. It's lovely. I just try and bring a little bit of everything into it. It's just a taster, but the inner child is a full on what I would do in a six-week one anyway. But it is, that's what I used to do here, Annie, in the horse bridge then. And so, yeah. And when's your next workshop starting, June? I haven't planned it yet. So as soon as you've got enough numbers, maybe? I haven't put myself out there yet, Annie, so I'm just talking to you. You have now. No, it's exciting. And I think once you, you're basically giving yourself what you needed back then. And like I say, it's not whether you had a good childhood or a bad childhood, it is what you actually took in. It could be at school, you're scared to go to school, you know, whatever it may be. But you're going to heal your inner child, love your inner child, believe in your inner child, let your inner child shine, let your inner child out. Yeah. Yeah. Now, I highly recommend, even if it's just one session, just to see what this, she's amazing. You'll keep going back, I guarantee it. Yeah. Yeah, changes your life. Link is in the more info section for her email. And it's also scrolling across the page as well. So you've got julie.rogers23atyahoo.com. So you can message Julie directly. There's, yeah, lots of people are understanding. I think Marejo said this place is more crowded. I'm looking forward to meeting Julie. There we are. And Greg said, yeah, my mom hit me with a wooden spoon and burnt me. Wow. Oh, Greg, Greg. I'm sorry. The thing is as well, it's so, it stays with us. But when we, as hard as it is, when we go back there and we try to express it and get it out, we can get it out in a creative way, whatever works for us. We are healing that inner child. And we're giving our inner child that love back. And we're hearing their voice, if that makes sense. The pain. We're not ignoring our inner child anymore. No. Well, Greg, just to Greg real quick, you know, it's important, as we were just talking about, you have that opportunity to end a cycle. So from this point forward, all that stuff can end. And here's one thing, and I hate to, I know, I know people don't like looking at it as a possibility, but is it possible that the child that was abused by the parent was the parent abusing the child in a previous lifetime? And this is how karma plays back. Is that possible? I think 100% possible. Yeah. It's like, yeah. I was, for example, I was the one that was hitting my father with a strap in a previous lifetime. And in this lifetime, I said, yeah, that sucked. You're right. I'm not talking about that, you know. I think the thing is, as well, is not to give the mind too much thought as well. And that's why I do work with the minds because the thoughts and everything, because, like I say, it's a cycle and it's a spell and it keeps us stuck. Yeah, it's past that getting out of the, yeah. Yeah. It's the, what I try to encourage people to do is to eventually become aware of their conditioning so that they can allow the thoughts to pass like the clouds in the sky and not bring them down and believe them and cling to them. Yeah. When we do that, that's when we get stuck. That's when we need to do that bit of writing. Yeah. And then we can let them pass on again. Release it. Yeah. I agree. Sorry. I want to know. You know what it's like when you're getting to your brother, but thank you for having me. Feel it. We can feel your passion for what you do. We also understand that passion because that's what we do. I know. And that's why we want to talk to as many people as possible. They've got this passion and get people better known out there. So at the moment, Julie doesn't have a website, but I think Greg may be helping you with it. Well, you said you have got a website, but you don't need it. No. I don't mean it. I've got my person centred page on Facebook. Yeah. Julie Rogers, person centred councillor living in the moment on Facebook. Okay. Perhaps we can add that maybe somehow. Do you know how to add that, Greg? I'll look into it. We'll add it. We'll add it somehow. So if you can message over to me, Julie, then I'll pass it on to Greg. Yeah. So does anybody in the have any questions that they want to ask, Julie, before we go? So we've got a few people here chatting away. So yeah, if there's anything that you guys want to ask before we go, I mean, I just think it's unique. I would like to see you starting up teaching other councillors. I would really love to see that because I think that's important now. Spread that word. Yeah. So it sometimes delays everything because we use my Facebook page and not Greg's. We haven't got as many people have seen it, but it'll be shared out there. So I encourage everybody, please share this, get it as wide as possible because there's some things, it could be that you perhaps don't need the counselling, but maybe you know someone who does or maybe just listening to this can help with a few kind of advice things when you get triggered, how to get past that, what to do. Yeah. Oh, it's been, it's been wonderful, Julie. So if there are any more questions, I'll forward them over to you. Okay. I'll just put it in the chat with my person's Facebook page on Facebook. I've done that. Oh, brilliant. So is it on my Facebook page? I don't know. I've never used this before, but I've just typed it out and sent it on the chat. Oh, oh, I see. Yes, it's in the private chat here. I got you. Yeah. Oh, no, it's not. I don't know where that would have gone. Okay. But we'll find it. Yeah. We'll sort that. So it is on my page as well. You know, you can find Julie in my friends list and it's got your photo clearly on your page, isn't it? Yeah. Thank you for coming on. You're welcome. I kind of threw Greg in a little bit. He didn't have any time to prepare whatsoever. I mentioned it, but I hadn't reminded him of when it was. So sorry. It's okay. But with his background in therapy, you know, you know, he's got lots of knowledge there. So yes, it can help me. We can do it together. I would consider that when I move out there. Yeah, definitely. Especially, you know, on the workshops as well. That'd be awesome. That would be. No, it would be really good. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you for joining us. Thank you, Julie. And thank you, everybody who's joined us here. Please like, subscribe and share this as much as possible. We appreciate you guys. Yeah. Thanks again, everyone. Take care. Links are in the more info section. Yeah. Bye.