 Hey, hello, everybody, I'm Alan Levine from OE Global. This is the second day of our OE Week Live webcast. This honestly was Alan's crazy idea to kind of bring some sense of excitement. Not that there's not excitement about Open Education Week, but I thought it'd be really fun just to have people in informally to have conversations and who are doing work. And that is the structure. We have like a really great full studio of people here. I had the idea before I was going to run down like, oh, look at two hours from now, there's this session coming up in three hours. And then it's like, you know what's going on and you can find the calendar. And many of these are things that you're involved with. But more or less, we just want to get a chance to talk about people who are maybe doing stuff during Open Education Week or just want to talk about their projects in this free form environment. And so I really thank people for being willing to join in an unstructured format. So like I was talking with one of my colleagues before hand, it's kind of a break from the webinar format. And that's what I'm trying to do a little bit here. So we'll see where it goes. And so I think we'll just bring folks on stage and we'll do figure out a way to do some intros and just say hello to everybody. But I want to see everybody. So most excellent. So everybody's doing the ways. I so appreciate everyone being here. And I'm going to just say hello to people individually and just and give you a chance, of course, to say hello. I did the horrible thing. I was like thinking, can I find a good question? And I actually turned to chat GPT and got really bad questions. So it's kind of funny. So with that, I just going to ask you, of course, to say hello and where you're from. And maybe just say one thing you're super excited about coming up in the next week. So I'm going to first go to my colleague who is actually quite close to me geographically, Heather Ross, who is in the same province as me. And we don't get to see each other or not. Right, Heather? Oh, no, we never seem to we never seem to get to see each other. So I'm not sure. Who are you? Who am I? Who am I? I'm Heather Ross. I'm an educational development specialist at the Gwena Moss Center for Teaching and Learning at the University of Saskatchewan. And I lead much of the open work that goes on with the university. That's great. And we definitely want to hear about it. And I've been wanting to tune in more to what you're doing. Now I'm going to go from close to far away. So coming to us from India, we have Shishumna Rao, who has been so very active in our OEG Connect space and things that we're doing. And I was so excited when I saw you on the signup form. So greetings from Canada. And tell us, tell us where you are and a little bit about the work you do. Thank you. I'm really excited. I'm from India, South India, Hyderabad, where the time is now 9 30 p.m. And I'm an educational technologist. I train faculty, higher education and school faculty and various ethnic tools, especially open source tools like learning management system model and the recently interactive content, HPIP. I'm actively training teachers on these things. I think I think you're modest because you're like running an HPIP service with the HPIP catalog site and a press book site. And so it's really exciting to see that play out. So now we're going to fly back to this side. And I'm going to say hello to my friend in Petersburg, Terry Green and Terry Green, come on the screen and tell us about you. Hi. Thanks for having me. Long time fan. I'm. Oh, hey, look. That's why I came on just to show that I'm from Peterborough, also known as Nogo Gwanang, and I am a senior e-learning designer with Trent online, which is a department that's like a sibling department to our Center for Teaching and Learning. So I call them Trent offline and we're Trent online. And yeah, that's me. Thanks for having me on the show. There's more than that. Terry, Terry does the Getting on Air podcast, which is something I've been trying to follow and catch up with for a long time. He does his great informal interviews with really interesting people. And and Terry and I have collaborated on many projects over the years. So it's great to see him. And now we're going to fly back over to to Europe to go to the Netherlands to meet Bayadalos Arcos, who I am just so excited to see again because we know each other for a long time. And you're doing one of my favorite projects that I know we're going to talk about later. Hello. So thank you. Hello, everybody. So I am indeed Bayadalos Arcos. I am originally from Spain. I don't think I sound very Spanish, but anyway, I there in my Spanish is still there. So I work in Delft. I moved from the from the UK nearly five years ago now. So now I'm based at the State of Delft, the Technical University of Delft. And I work for the Extension School for Continuing Education, which is going to have a very long name. But in a way, in a simple way, what we do, what I work, I work as a I'm not sure exactly. OK, we call it a learning developer, which could be a learning technologist or industrial, not industrial, no, what. So what I do on a on a day to day, pretty much is work with different course teams around the many faculties of of the university and help them create online education and create online courses. So if you think about it, it's kind of a perfect marriage because these guys are very smart people. They know their story. And what what I do is help them tell that story online in the best possible way. So I don't necessarily do open openly, but I work all the time in the background trying to get this open, you know, doing time people to be more open, but without necessarily labelling, opening, open on the time. Excellent. And and I have to say, you sound very Spanish to me. But do I? That's great. But I I always get like, you know, I hear somebody and I say, like, oh, are you from are you from the UK? And they're like, they roll their eyes and they're from Australia. So I have to stop. But but why are you here, Bea? I really want to hear you share about what you're doing for open education. Week, because again, I really want to talk about your photo contest. So can you tell us a little bit about we like sharing? So I don't know if you want the long story or the short story. Pretty much I was I was looking for something. It comes different ways. But so what we do every year for Open Education Week is we run an open photo competition and pretty much it all started because, you know, as I said, I work with course teams, creating online courses and these guys use photographs all the time. And I was, you know, I was having a hard time trying to make people understand that, you know, you use a photograph, you can just get something from the internet and put in there. Even if it is your own photograph, you need to attribute it. You need to look at the accessibility. So and so it is said, why don't we actually create a photo bank? Because all the time is, well, I don't know where to go to get photographs and this and that. So it's OK. So let's create a photo bank where initially we're going to start sharing the photographs that we do. So the photographs that the course teams create, we're going to share that openly. So that's how our open photo bank is really a flicker account. So there's no fanciest of it's a flicker account. So we started sharing the photographs that we created. And then in order to, you know, since it was open education week back in 2021, and since it was a perfect occasion, you know, why don't you invite everybody to actually contribute a photograph to the repository so anyone can actually send the photograph. We started pretty much with the university. So anyone, whether you're a teacher, whether you're one of the support staff, whether you're a student, and we made it even your, you know, your husband's, your wife's, your friends, everybody can contribute. And it's that idea. So you send a photograph, the copyright is always going to be yours. The university is not going to take your copyright. And the only the only condition, the only thing I want you to do is that you choose the creative commerce license that you want to attach to your photograph. So it's a way for me also to, to help people understand a little bit more what is a creative commerce license. So in a way that so it starts is growing from 15 photographs. We run the competition in 2021 for the first time. So we have like 50 photographs. And then I try to get it going. So most of the time, pestering my colleagues. I think, come on, show me what do you have in your phone? You have a photo. Did you go on holidays? Show me what's in your phone. Give your phone photos. I'll know the life. You know, this, this photos can actually be open for anyone and everybody. So that's pretty much what it is. Um, I mean, I can go on and on. Well, it's a simple idea. So let's have fun. It's open education week. So let's celebrate sharing in a very easy way. Because everybody, these days you have your phone. Everybody has photographs in their phones. So it's about looking at that and saying, okay, yes, I am happy to share in the photograph. And then something wonderful could happen to your photograph is somebody else reuses it. And I have to say, Bay has invited me to be one of the judges the last few years. And I like how you have a theme because last year it was about energy and kind of a sustainability theme. What is this year's theme? This year, what we said to people is, can you capture in one image what open means to you? So it's been very, very interesting to see how so people's imagination and creativity as in what, what, what, what it is, what is open, what is open to you. So, you know, from somebody who kind of goes into something really abstract, the mountains and open spaces to, you know, throwing in a little bit of humor. But that's kind of part of it. It's like exactly, you know, what does open mean to you? And it doesn't have to be open in terms of work, education, stuff like that, but just open it up, open up your mind on what is open. So, yeah. That's fantastic. And I'm sure some other people might chime in and it's, it's great to see. But I think also you have, there's like, now there's an option for like a public vote, right? For the people's choice kind of thing, right? Yes, that's right. So normally, so what we've done in the past years is so an international jury. So I'm, so this is Alan and there's a few. So every year I pick different colleagues around the world to kind of also help me raise awareness of the repository, right? So normally this guy's going to pick the award winners this year to make things a little bit different. We decided to go on, you know, go for the people's choice. Right? So, so instead of having the jury to pick a photograph, I'm the, so I'm going to open up the vote to absolutely everyone to be able to vote for their favorite photograph. So all those photographs are available already openly on YouTube, but people will be able to pretty much go in and select, you know, so it's actually very simple. It's going to be a Google form where you can actually click and select your favorite. So in the end, whoever gets the most votes will be crowned the people's choice. Right, right. Very great. And I mean, photos are like one of the things that are very accessible to do. And, you know, my colleague, Isla, who's behind the scenes is behind the Wiki loves Africa photo thing. And I've always think like, you know, yeah, getting people to understand how to edit Wikipedia articles is really something to teach. But that's a that's a big take. And so contributing media to Wikimedia Commons is a much quicker thing that people can understand and see how the impact of what they contribute does. So I'm sure other people here have experience doing things with photos. I don't know where to go next. Like, does anybody want to talk about what they're doing this week? Maybe I'll go back to Heather because I was so excited to see University of Saskatchewan on the event schedule early. So what's what is coming up or what has already happened if I missed it? Well, yesterday we we were doing kind of a combination of things because it's actually in Canada, there's a whole bunch of different weeks this week. So there's International Open Education Week. It's among post-secondary institutions. We're all doing stuff around the sustainability and development goals from the United Nations. Aboriginal Achievement Week is going on. Tomorrow is International Day of the Women. So we're trying to do a whole bunch of different things that are going on. And we yesterday started off with a panel of our sustainability faculty fellows that is actually they're working with sustainability and open together. And one of the things they're going to be doing is creating an open an open resource on how to integrate sustainability into teaching and learning that will include their experiences as part of that. And then in the afternoon, I did a session that's just sort of an intro to open. Both of those are on our YouTube channel now. And can be watched. We're doing we have a session today on press books. Tomorrow we have the panel that I'm going to get back to in just a minute because that's what I'm here to talk about. And on Thursday, we're doing a session around our new OER repository that was just launched. The panel tomorrow, the panel tomorrow is actually we have three people on it. It's being facilitated by Nancy Turner, who is been an open advocate for a long time. And it is they're going to be talking about the how to use open to advance certain initiatives at the institution, indigenization, reconciliation, sustainability and universal design. And so this is an area that doing this this topic is an area that's something that I've really been pushing the past couple of years and and we're starting to make some movement on if you look at our our strategic documents from the institution, our learning chart and so forth, open is not mentioned at all. But I've been showing and we've been showing as a teaching and learning center how open can be used to advance all of those initiatives. And so if you want to do if you want to be working on reconciliation, well, we need to be doing a better job with our learning materials that are all from a Western perspective. And one of the ways to do that is that if we use open, we can be getting in those voices, not just through open textbooks, but open pedagogy and using that to get in those voices that have historically been left out of these conversations and these materials with sustainability and the SDGs access to education is a key part of that. So using open to if we're if we're make improving access to education for everybody through using where we are, that's helping to hit with the sustainability and development goals, UDL, so universal design, we we can make sure that our resources are meeting those guidelines and are are accessible and aren't just written the way a particular commercial publisher thinks they should be written and so open while it's not it isn't listed in the strategic documents, it is something that we're showing across the institution can help make those help enable those make progress on those possible. That's fantastic. So like, what's the climate on campus? Like, are you still having to make the case for OER or people coming to you? Is it some of both? It's it's it's some of both. It is a lot more people coming to me and coming to those of us who are supporting open this year. I think this year we're saving students around one point eight million dollars. We're it's just it continues to grow. I think we had a 30 percent increase in that of our students who are benefiting from open, which is great when it comes to OER, but we're actually also seeing a big increase in the number of instructors who want to do open pedagogy type work. So students as creators and contributors instead of just consumers as Robin DeRosa would would put it. And which is really exciting because they're they're getting a lot more interested in authentic assessment. And this is a great way of doing that. So I think that I think it's becoming much more of a oh, yeah, I know what that is. And my colleagues doing that or I'm already doing that or something then as opposed to in the beginning when I was having to explain the basics. Fantastic and happy to see. And I know we talked a while ago about you're looking for the repository. So how has that been working out? Well, so we've had an institutional repository for a number of years where things like open access publications can go, dissertations, theses. And there was recently a new person who's come in to the library who runs the repository who's a big, very aware about open and OER and we spoke. And she said, well, let's just set it up in the same system. And so she set up an OER community within there. And the first few things that have gone in so far are things from the Teaching and Learning Center so that we could show how this is done. But I'm also, I've been talking to instructors in a variety of different departments that have needed this and now are starting to work with the library to get materials into that. And some of it's instructor created but some of it is also student created. Excellent. Well, thank you so much and it's great. And I got to get up there to see you. So I promise it'll happen cause Heather's only a couple of hours away from me. Yeah. Great. So maybe I'll ask Sushin to talk a little bit about it. I know you're probably doing so many things but I understand you're running a kind of a development kind of sprinter workshop this week. Yes. Yeah, this week actually my OER week celebrations. I enjoy this like a huge festival. Like we do a lot of festivals in India and actually it's always falls into a good festive mode and that way OER week is also a huge festival for me and I still really celebrate this whenever since it started but never people not really understood that. When I started doing in my regional language developing open educational resources I tried for quite some time. I just want to tell you a little bit of history and then I'll tell what I'm doing this year. So when I said open educational resources or OER week celebrations people were like not really keen on that. And but I never lost my focus or lose my focus but I always concentrated on this particular point wherever I am and with whichever organization I'm with. So I started my journey like that now people are taking seriously per past maybe I should say two, three years even if you observe that OER week events very few from India though they do like certain things towards openness and towards open pedagogy they do work. There are some libraries, there are some repositories but not really as active as it should be. I mean taking a good digital footprint as I say. I mean as I observed. So this year you could see many organizations taking part in OER week that I really congratulate my fellow Indians who are part of this OER week celebrations and big thank you to OER global for this kind of great opportunity where we learn from each other. And talking to about OER week 2023 my celebration starts from tomorrow actually there are three days that we are gonna do a kind of a workshop with Dr. Indra Konero I think we will be talking about it tomorrow about that workshop especially we are concentrating this time in this workshop about creating, educating awareness about not only OER open educational resources and also asking them to repurpose static, I mean text OER into interactives that is H5P interactive OERs and especially focusing on engineering faculty. This time we took technology and management college and then their faculty are on 30 members that we are going to train them in this three day workshop and then we are gonna make them publish these repurposed OER as interactive OERs with open license publicly making it available to them. And there are a few others that I'm really excited about and the one is on 10th of this month I'll be participating along with the Pam Gill and who posted in OER of G-Connect about the rubric that we were discussing about the quality measure of the published interactive OERs. So, and we have both of us we are trying to talk about why we came up with that list and Dr. Mustafa Diak is going to talk about the importance of these kinds of quality measures in rubrics and that's one open forum kind of thing we're doing. And last year I made my faculty where I'm working with now is Etiraj College for Women that is in Chennai in India. I trained around 26 faculty about repurposing this OER and creating interactive OERs especially suited to Indian style of education. So we took oath that we will be doing 100 of them in one year. So we are completing, we are reaching that goal. So we will be celebrating that naming it as a creative one on 14th and 15th of this month. There are many things that I'm involved this time promoting open educational resources and learning a lot from various webinars too. I'm attending a lot of webinars too. Well, thank you. I'm like catching up with all your activities and it's great to see and we appreciate so much how you're sharing and that the fact that some of these questions and comments because I remember seeing Parm's kind of sharing the first iteration of her rubric and so happy to see some collaboration growing from that. Well, yeah, but that way I should thank you, Alain, for such a lovely platform where otherwise we won't even know that unknowingly I'm developing a rubric and unknowingly she is doing a list and a quality measure for her faculty and now we are coming together to develop a list of discussing with other faculty around the globe to come up with one document. Maybe it might suit some kind of interactive content types. If it's all they want to report to. There's really a wonderful platform that way. I love it, the collaboration. Oh yeah, and thank you so much. And I keep meaning, it's been on my list because I remember maybe a year ago when you mentioned the use of Storyweaver, which is a, it's an amazing platform of openly licensed children's stories in so many languages. I'm gonna do a write up on that soon because what it's producing is amazing. And it's... Yeah, that's what, I mean, a lot of initiatives are there from India, but their digital footprint need to be really more. That's what I believe. That's why I keep posting here and there and then I try to collaborate. Yeah, yeah. And thank you, I love forgetting that Lincoln. So thanks again for being part of this. And I kind of have plans. I kind of want to do this, well, if it works out in an ongoing manner because I think it's a fantastic way to increase the connections between people and open education. And now I'm gonna have to go to the podcast pro, Terry Green, what do you even know too, Terry? It's been a while since we've talked. You can talk about, well, you can talk about whatever you want, but I know you're doing a lot of innovative work there at Trent. And I personally, I'd like to hear about the progress of the Liberated Learners Project, but you dropped some hints about something else you're cooking up. Sure, yeah, thank you again for having me on. Before I talk about the Liberated Learner, I'm not allowed to spill the beans about the specifics, but the same pot of funding that helped us develop the Liberated Learner, we had a number of other projects and one of the other projects just won an award that I can't tell you what it was yet, but kudos to the team on that one. Anyway, so the Ontario government put out some call for proposals through Ecamp's Ontario to create some virtual learning strategy, learning things. And we put in a proposal to kind of make a follow-up to the Ontario Extend Empowered Educator framework slash microcredential that Alan, you worked on as well in the creation of it and the delivery of it with me. And that was super fun for me when we got to work together on that. So anyway, but that was for educators. And the idea back then was that we should do this, but also for students if we ever get the chance. And this was the chance. And so through the funding, we got a group of educators from a number of Ontario institutions together to collaborate on a process where we, as the people with the jobs and the salaries, we're just putting an environment in place for the students to co-design and design with us. A similar thing, but for students. So it's a microcredential, it's an open educational resource and there are four modules. One being to be a learner, how to be a learner, but also how to be a collaborator, how to be a technologist and how to be a navigator of crazy institutional pathways and stuff. And with the spirit of getting as much money and help from students into students' hands as possible, we created this a press book that includes tons of H5P and not just like a wide variety of different types of H5P, which was super fun. Student created animated videos that introduce each module. Seneca College has a music, a couple of music programs. So we were able to get chill beats to study too. So this has its own soundtrack. The graphic designer was in her graphic design program when she started the work, she'd finished it throughout the year, but. And I really like what we came up with because it proves, I think, that student co-design can really make some cool stuff and we're lucky enough to win the OE Global, best OER for last year. Really proud of the award, but proud of the product big time and hope it can get used more and more and more. And since then, the same music program has keeps offering the opportunity to the students to add more. So we've got another song recently. Oh, and also using a splot, which is the acronym changes, but Alan is behind these simple WordPress themes that allow you to collect things easily without collecting personal data. We used a splot in a design sprint with students early on in the process to hear their stories of their wicked problems that they've faced in how to get through and achieve success in their post-secondary programs. And those stories, I love the kind of serendipity. We got 99 problems in the end, which is awesome. I think Jay-Z should let us use his song, but we haven't gotten into contact yet. Anyway, so the 99 problems were then taken and coded and which modules of those four I mentioned earlier, do they fit? And those were not only kind of the stories that helped kick off each module, they're also the stories that informed the content and the activities and the stuff that students will do. And also the splot, the collector, the wicked problem site is a place to collect more. So not only did those stories inform the actual content, they're gonna be kind of the culminating activity of doing the liberated learner as a student is to add your story to the pile as well. So it kind of came full circle too. I probably missed a bunch of stuff in there, but it was a great fun project to work on and like amazing people that were with us on it and met so many amazing students that did just like amazing work on it. So endlessly proud of that project. And what I love so much about it is that like, you wouldn't have designed necessarily the idea of the chill beats. And this was students said like, look, what works for, if I paraphrase right, is like one of the things that really helps us study is having some really good background music and then saying, let's create some. Is that pretty much how it happened? Yeah, yeah. So there's like a YouTube channel called Lofi, I think it's Lofi girl chill beats to study to and I'm sure you've seen the animation of a girl just sitting, writing and studying. So we took that as the inspiration and thought like we, this is like, it's funded by Ontario for, so it's for Ontario students, but we were allowed to give it an open license so it's for everybody. But we wanted the Ontario students to tell the stories, Ontario students to help us create. And then the kind of cherry on top was Ontario students to make the soundtrack for it as well, which was pretty fun. That's great. I have to admit, like my references to that are so dated. I think I have to go back to multiplication rock, you know? Anyhow, thanks very much. It's great to see and hear everybody. I hope, you know, be good to have some open discussion and maybe we have this something that my colleague shared you know, a question on Twitter about what is the open movement? Like how do you describe it? We use this phrase open movement, but what does it mean to be part of it? Because I would say all of us here are part of it, but it's kind of like, is it an amorphous thing or is it really well-defined? This is where I need some chill beats to come in. I want to go before Heather because her answer will be better. I don't know. Yes, Terry. I just kind of think it's a pathway, like it's a journey towards finding out what can happen if you share stuff. And it's cool because in the beginning, if you're just joining and learning, you get to take, you get to take and take and take for a long time before you ever really are expected to, you never expected to give, but after a while you probably want to give back, but there's all open textbooks, open pedagogy, open people that you can get the resources from, connect to on whatever social media or whatever and learn from and maybe collaborate with. And after a while, you start to get your confidence up enough that, hey, I can contribute. And then you find a shared sharing simple ways to get into it with the photo sharing and like simple, it's like, yeah, a pathway. It's walking towards sharing and seeing what comes to that, I think. So Heather, what's the better answer? I'll mute now. I'm going to say it's causing good trouble with the hope it ripples out to make learning and life better for people everywhere. I like that one. We should quote that. Any other thoughts? Bea, or Shishana? How are we going to read that? It's not a contest, okay? Terry made it a contest. So if you think about the idea of a movement, right? I like that because the way I see it is, and I know you guys, or I've seen you, maybe I don't know you personally, but I've seen you, right? And so what I like about this idea is that we're in constant movement so physically moving and talking about open and doing things in the open, and we don't seem to get tired. So even if we get tired, we managed to hopefully inspire somebody else to continue moving so that you can take a little rest and then come back with more energies and all that, right? So for me, so I like this idea of movement because it's a life thing. We keep moving and we're not going to stop. But for me, also, it's, and I agree with Terry, and it's true with the pathway, and it's a beautiful definition. But for me, it's also an attitude. So some of my new colleagues here in Delft says to me at the beginning, or they keep saying to me, oh, but you're so passionate about open education. And I say to them, it's not a passion, it's an attitude, something that is inside you. And in a way, we all have it. You may not have discovered it in yourself, but it is there. So it's kind of grabbing it and realizing, yes, this is what openness is for me. And then just kind of trying to keep moving. See, I don't know if I'm actually making sense. No, you are, you are. And it reminds me, a long time ago, I asked some colleagues about this and my good colleague, Nancy White, who's the most brilliant online facilitator. She said, openness, we talk about all these open things, but she said that, she says, it's really an attitude. Like, it's that simple. It's the way we operate in all these other spheres. And to me, I think many of you described is that we kind of run into familiar names and also unfamiliar ones in many different contexts. And I think that's what happens because, I might be reading somebody's blog post and I see a comment from, wait a minute, how does this person I knew back at Maricopa know this person in the Netherlands? And to me, that feels almost magical. It's really amazing to listen to these definitions of open moment. I really love, somebody said, it's a movement. We keep moving and it's an approach. It's an attitude. Yes, I do agree that I see it as a step towards future. It's an approach to become more transparent, to be more happy, to be together. It's like an approach to moving towards for a better future. That's what this open moment is all about. I don't know whether I'm making sense. Oh yeah, yeah. And it's everywhere. The idea of a movement though kind of says, I like the sense that like nobody's in charge of it. Like it's happening kind of collectively, maybe. And so it's not necessarily being steered by an entity or an organization or an evil billionaire. Like that's just not happening. So I will, I'll ask just in the interest because like I hate to bring up something that like is so overblown right now, but like artificial intelligence. Like how, it's so interesting to see the reaction. And of course there are things that are just like being said, that's ridiculous. But I mean, there's opportunity and there's all this thing that's happening. But most interesting is like a feeling that, oh my God, we have to react to this thing that is coming from outside when it's kind of been there. Like, you know, and not to say like I saw this coming with the explosion of things happening. But is anybody like tired of it or anybody really excited about it or just want to inject about what they're seeing locally in terms of addressing people's concerns? If I can come in briefly, I think it's super interesting and what's been happening here. It's more, it's been a way, so it's like holding up a mirror to your own practices to what it is, so the way that you're teaching the way that you're especially kind of, so the conversation here is like, oh my God, but now they're gonna cheat, right? So how are we gonna, it's all connected to exams. So now all of a sudden the conversation is, you know what, so maybe what we have to do is just change the way we give assignments and the way we give students the scores. So it's not, if they can cheat, that means that we need to change the way we teach so that they can't cheat. See what I'm going, so that's what's made it really interesting to me, that it's all of a sudden, you know, you're in a kind of, in your comfort space, but then all of a sudden this, when I call it the robot, it's coming to disrupt things, even if it was there, but because everyone is talking, having conversations with this robot, it's like, oh my God, this entity knows more about me than I do. So what I think I'm gonna do is, okay, I need to change the way I'm teaching. And that is interesting, in that conversation, so if as teachers we were in a comfortable space where I think everything's fine, then I think that's wrong because we should all, you know, keep moving as in, how am I gonna do things different? And if this chap thing actually helps towards that, as in making your better teacher, making them, I think it's awesome, really. Anybody else sort of have like, what's going on locally, Heather? Yeah. Well, I know there's a lot of concern about academic integrity. I know there's educators who see opportunities in this, but they're also looking at, well, you know, what do we do now with students being able to use this? And yes, AI has been around. It's not a new thing. I mean, anybody who, you know, what do you think Siri is and stuff? And it, but I think the thing that we need to, and I absolutely agree about, yes, getting students, we need to change the way that we're, not just how we teach, but how we assess, that's what we're looking at. But I think it's really important to remember when we're trying to redesign what we're doing, and we are worried about what does this mean for teaching, not just learning. AI has the brain, it does not have the heart. So our students, it can't respond to our students who come in and say, I've had a death in the family or my kids sick or, oh my God, there's a pandemic and we're suddenly being thrust online and I don't have reliable access. And getting students to, when we get students to contribute in ways that are coming from the heart as well from their experiences. AI can't replicate that because nobody can replicate what your experience is. And so I think that if we can start having those conversations about not what it is and what it's gonna do, but what isn't it and what opportunity does that create for us? That's fantastic. See, I quoted you already. And also like, there's the thing of human encounters where the unexpected happens, like things that are statistically improbable and since AI is generated on things that are statistically probable, I mean, that's not the heart, but there is some element that maybe can't be quantified. And anybody else wanna give their take? That's the thing, everybody had a take on AI, right? What's your take, Terry? I saw Sashimna, you unmuted, go for it. Oh, okay. Yeah, I do agree that anything new that comes is it's always like create somehow a step first. And then especially this time, it is everybody jumped on to this, oh, what happens to minds to meet assignments, especially the assessment, as Peter said, we are saying, yes, I do agree. But then it gives, I also mentioned that one or two ideas that posted in, or you connect it. One of the idea, I look at it in a very positive way, anything, something new, as you said, I do agree, AI is there past many years, we have been using it annoyingly and now knowingly some tool, an application has come up and then where we can utilize it in a very positive way and then anything, something new that comes, like first we look at it like as a disruptive thing and then like when the first internet thing, this is my experience that when the first search engines or the information through internet have come, like everybody's like, oh my God, now everything is available on a fingertips. Now, no teacher, it's like no way. I mean, it's definitely, you didn't wanna understand what exactly he needs. It'll be too much for them. A teacher or a professor or a guru, we call it, is there to explain what they exactly need. So even if every information is there, right? So similarly, AI too, like it depends on how we use it, how we utilize it, any technology, because as she said, it doesn't have really hot and not only that, the brains are, again, the knowledge is taught by a human, even for that machine. So I look at it this way. Fantastic. I'm calling on Terry Green. Yeah, I'm gonna try, I wanna try to say something that you quote, like Heather, she's already got two. I'm just kidding. But like, I agree like with, this might be a feeling I need to get over, but like I would prefer to read, spend my human time and human emotion reading something written by a human, looking at art made by a human. I'm all for making use of it in the process or getting ideas, but like, if you read anything, chat GPT wrote. And you think like, is this written by all of humanity without a personality? Then it's, if that's what it feels like when you read something, it's probably written by chat GPT and it's boring. So I hope it maybe leads us to write more humanly with more personality and get more creative. There was a, at our, we had a conference a couple of weeks ago here in Trent. And one of the sessions was about this, Sue Hellman from BC, put up a slide with all the blooms verbs and we just crossed out stuff that chat GPT can do easily and then zoned in on the stuff that it can't do and thought that would be a step in a redesign of focusing in on the human stuff that humans can do. And maybe it'll be a little more focus on that. Like, but that doesn't mean that the other stuff aren't important for us to, the things that it can do is not important for us to learn as well. Like, learning a new language, there's nothing else but to learn the vocabulary to have the gas in the tank to be able to speak it. So stuff that it can do doesn't mean we don't have to learn it too. And I just, I love the analogy of thinking you could watch Richard Simmons' workout and sit on the couch and watch it and get fit. No, you have to get up and do it too. So that's my take. Like, we'll get used to it and figure out ways to use it but we'll all still have to learn the stuff that we need to learn and hopefully we can use it to help make it more efficient and fun, I don't know. Very positive. I have no answers, but. Thank you, Terry. And thank you, everybody, especially for taking questions that weren't prepared in advance. And that's what we hope to do here. I'm also thinking too, like one of the things that I do like worry about is like a lot of this is being driven by corporate entities. And so, you know, yeah, you can access the chat GPT, but I just logged in and now they're trying to upsell me to something. And we know that's gonna happen. And then of course, when this gets, gets wrapped into Microsoft products, like, you know, it's gonna impact the work that we do. So I really hope we can sort of still not be at the mercy of, and Heather's gonna come in on that one. I like this. I was just gonna say that at Microsoft, I'm worried that it's gonna be the commercial textbook publishers. And this is what our new homework systems are gonna be built on. Yeah. With the gouging students on. Yeah. Yeah. Like they can make them by the boatload, right? Yeah. But the other thing is like, I do agree with Terry, but I had the opportunity in September in Vancouver, I went to the art museum and they had this brilliant AI exhibit and a lot of it was history, but there was, and I can't even, I have to find, I couldn't find quickly enough the artist who did this. It was like this big room and she had a lot of exhibits. But one of the things she had done was this painting thing that she did on a big floor with these robot little devices that moved around and it was mimicking, but not copying the style that she was painting. And she was, it was a collaborative project and they were feeding off of each other. And she had this other brilliant thing where there was media being generated by these video cameras of foot traffic in urban areas that was generating art through some kind of artificial intelligence. I'll have to dig this up later, but there are things that kind of defy like our understanding and they actually give me hope because I mean, they're not all evil in trying to take our jobs. There are some fantastic things happening in the space. That sounds cool. Like a hybrid kind of mix, a remix. Yeah, yeah, I will try to find it later, but I wanna thank everybody again for being willing to join the live show here. I'm so happy that we have a chance to meet and connect and just brainstorm ideas and this is what I hope for. And there are, of course, more later, I'm probably supposed to do promos and plugs for some things, but we do have, of course, many more things going on with OE Week and I'm trying to tune into the gay. Anybody who wants to, I'm really trying to encourage people, if you attend something or see something interesting, just to drop a short note in OEG Connect because that's one of the things to help understand when you can't attend every session unless someone has like an AI that can attend every session and summarize it and find meaning and give me all the links. And it's probably possible, but with that, I think we'll just say thanks and goodbye to Heather, Shashamna, Terry, and Beya who lost her electricity and just hope you have a great open education week. Thank you, Alan.