 everybody to another episode of the non-profit show. I'm really excited about this topic and our guest today. One of my favorite topics, not without its drama, not without its like angst. And so we're gonna get into it and we're gonna really dig down and say, are you engaging your board in fundraising and what does that look like? We have Ann Marie Serovi CFRE coming to us as a director of advancement from Easter Seals in Eastern Pennsylvania. And I'm really excited to hear what you have to say, Ann Marie, because again, this is a huge, huge topic. But before we get going, I wanna reintroduce myself. If we haven't met, I'm Julia Patrick, CEO of the American Nonprofit Academy. My trusty sidekick, Jared Ransom, will be rejoining us tomorrow. She is the non-profit nerd, CEO of the Raven Group. We also wanna make sure that we extend our amazing and humble gratitude to all of those that have sponsored the non-profit show. Many of these folks have been with us since day one. So we wanna give a shout out to Blumerang, American Nonprofit Academy, your part-time controller, Be Generous, Fundraising Academy at National University, Staffing Boutique, non-profit thought leader, and non-profit nerd. And we now have more than 600, I think close to 650 full episodes, a little over 950 snippets or clips that you can get to. So if it's two in the morning and you're wondering what in the heck did Ann Marie tell us about engaging our boards, you can go on to Roku YouTube, Amazon Fire TV or Vimeo. You can also download us and queue us up on your favorite podcast platform. All of our episodes are now available in podcast format. Okay, Ann Marie, I am so interested in talking to you. But first, talk to us a little bit if you can about Easter Seals and what you all do, especially in your community. Sure, so here at Easter Seals Eastern Pennsylvania, we cover a territory of the Lehigh Valley Berks County up into the Poconos and surrounding regions. So there are quite a few Easter Seals affiliates around the country. I believe right now there's around 67. So there are three in the state of Pennsylvania, but we cover about a 15 county territory. So Easter Seals is a national organization. I'm sure many people are familiar with the Easter Seals name and perhaps the Easter Seals Lilly that used to be part of our logo and brand for many, many years for over a hundred years that Easter Seals has been around in the United States. So we provide programs and services for individuals with developmental and other disabilities. So the biggest program that we have here at our affiliate is the early intervention program for children ages zero through three who might need additional identification and some help to get on track with their peers. But we also have programs going right up to adulthood that we have camping and recreation. We have all different kinds of speech therapy, physical therapy, occupational therapy, both in the home and in our centers. We have respite care, we do employment preparation. So we really run the gamut in being able to help our individuals that come to us, have their best possible life and reach all of their goals. So we serve about 3,000 individuals. We are a small but mighty affiliate here in Eastern Pennsylvania and so very proud of the innovation and inclusion that are part of our mission and have been since Easter Seals started. And our particular affiliate has been in the community for over 90 years. Holy cow. Yes. That is amazing. I mean, I haven't been with Easter Seals for 90 years, but. Well, I'm gonna say working there does something good for your skin and that's the case. There you go. Hey, so within the 60 plus chapters, are you one of the like originals? We are definitely one of the early adapters of the Easter Seals brand. So they started as an organization back in the early 1900s that was focused on at the time what they called crippled children. And it basically evolved over time. And then of course the Easter Lily and we became Easter Seals by the fact that some of the early fundraising for the organization was generated by selling seals, little stamps to people that had the Easter Lily on them. So that's where the name came from. We went through a little bit of a rebranding a few years ago again to get away from that Easter Lily and go to that fun starburst sunburst rather that kind of shows you the hope of tomorrow. And that was just a really important concept for Easter Seals to share on a national level with all of the affiliates. So it's been fun to see that rebranding too and be able to use that as a way of introducing and reintroducing people to Easter Seals. Right, well, because I mean, those of us of a certain age, certainly I remember buying those and my grandmothers always did and my mom and then they went out on the Easter cards and the correspondence. And we still have them. We absolutely still have them. We share them with our donors. It's just part of something that has been a part of our brand for so many years. And when we celebrated our 100th anniversary a few years ago, they brought those back in some ways. So we have them and when we send out acknowledgement letters we make sure to still include them so we can honor the heritage and the history that was Easter Seals and continues to be as we build upon that. Amazing. Well, Anne-Marie, I can't wait to have this conversation because as I mentioned in the green room chatter, I do a lot of board work and I just am fascinated by, I'm gonna call it straight out, the drama of boards and fundraising. So I'm going to ask you this question right off the bat and I'm gonna ask you, do board members truly understand fundraising? And I would add in their role in it. I would say no, but there are some simple steps that you can take to make sure that we're educating and reinforcing. So one of the things that I say is when you're recruiting for board members for your organization, you are not doing them any favors by not outlining your fundraising goals and your expectations of the board member right off. Certainly we always talk about the mission, how they're gonna support that with governance and oversight but sometimes we step around the fundraising because it is such a difficult topic and we're afraid we're gonna scare some folks away who don't want to do the ask and who don't wanna participate but we've developed a recruitment piece that outlines that and we make sure that when we're having conversations with people about joining a committee or joining the board that we are outlining those expectations right from the beginning. So they understand that they do have that give and get role to play as a member. I think a lot of them, just they look at the organization, they understand it's a nonprofit so they know that fundraising is important to the organization. But I think they certainly join it on the basis of you do good work and I wanna support that but as soon as the topic of fundraising comes up I think it definitely changes the tone of the conversation. So Anne-Marie, as somebody that's involved in fundraising and you have that coveted CFRE designation do you find that a lot of board members are like, oh, that's Anne-Marie's job, you know? Yes, I have had that. I've had people that have definitely put that back into the development departments. We are very small, like I said, small but mighty. You know, our team, basically my team consists of myself, our fundraising assistant, we do have a grant writer and events logistic person but I'm really responsible for all of the individual and corporate giving and kind of oversight of the board in terms of their giving. So I definitely think there's kind of that automatic thing. Well, the staff person's gonna handle that but really at the end of the day it needs to be a partnership because one person in a development role or even a couple of people in development roles cannot cover all of the bases and we need those board members to be utilizing their circles and their contacts and opening doors for us to get in front of new people. Now, how do you, like when we started off the question do board members truly understand fundraising? How many board members come to you and are like, yeah, I'm ready to ask versus how many are like, I'll clean the bathrooms. Don't make me ask for money, right? I mean, like what do you see? I mean, you said you have a piece that pulls them in and you kind of vet and educate, I would assume at the same time but what does that look like? I mean, are people like shocked that they're gonna have to do this or that this is a part of any board? I think some are and some are not. We have had board members where in some cases this has been their first board role period. So this has been completely new to them and in education. We have others that are certainly more savvy and even for the savvy ones they are just scared of fundraising. So one of the things that we were doing and I've been at Easter Seals for almost six years and in the fundraising world for almost 18 and what we do at our board meetings here is we always have, even if it's a very tight full agenda we always leave room for development. We always leave room for either an activity or something that brings us back to discussing fundraising. So we make sure to always be planting that seed making sure that it's always on people's minds top of mind awareness. And we've also implemented activities. So a couple of times a year we try and do maybe a fun activity, we've done things where we've identified elevator speeches when you're meeting somebody new and talking about your role with Easter Seals one fun one that we've done too is asking people around the room what's your favorite restaurant? What's your favorite place to go to? And suddenly they're very passionate and they're talking, oh, this is my favorite dish. And they can talk about it very easily. And then I say, well, now give that same kind of impassioned speech about your role with Easter Seals and as it is easy to do and if it's not, let's practice it a little bit because we want them to be able to share very easily and willingly. And I said to them, and that is part of fundraising. You might not think of it that way. You might think of everything as the big ask. You're sitting around a big table with 12 chairs around it and going in with proposals and all serious and saying, give me that million dollars. But part of fundraising is really opening those doors and conversations and inviting people to learn about something that you love and making those connections. So I love what I'm hearing you say and it kind of draws me to my next question. Is it, it makes it, you use the word empower but it almost sounds like you're trying to build their confidence. Yes. Is that something that you see? And I guess the big question is how long would that take? You know, it really depends on the board member but you really have to keep at it. It is something that you can't just do once and be done. You know, we do those activities on a fairly regular basis to make sure that people understand and feel that confidence and the ease of it. You know, just being able to talk about their role and about the things that drew them to the mission of Easter Seals and being so excited that somebody else feels that passion and wants to learn more and they invite them to learn more. So really underscoring that that is one of the biggest parts that we as development directors and development departments at nonprofits everywhere, we're just always looking to get a foot in the door. We're looking to get that introduction and be introduced to a circle of people in businesses and in places that we might not be able to get into ourselves but that through our board members and their circles are able to bring us into that fold. And that's really, you know, I tell them, there's a lot of fun to be had in fundraising truly and you don't have to be scared. And the big ask comes from me. It doesn't come from them. They can be present if they would like to be for the big ask, but they don't have to make it. That's not what they're expected to do. And I think once they hear that, there's a little, oh, there's a little sigh of relief. You know, it almost sounds to me like you're asking your board members to be part of the introduction journey and not the ask journey. Right. Is that fair? I mean, just say, look, you made that brilliant comment. I'm going to do the asking. I need to get past the gatekeeper. And is that really more of the structure that you're taking? Yes, it is. It's really the door opening. And like I said, you know, making those introductions, you know, one of the things that we've done too with great success is, you know, a lot of people, you know, making an introduction over lunch or coffee is very relaxed and takes, you know, that stress out of it. So if there's a company or a person that you want to get in front of, don't be afraid to kind of, you know, noodle around in one of your board members linked in pages. You know, see who their contacts are, because we've had some board members and to great success, I might add, who I've reached out to and said, I've noticed you have a connection with XYZ. How do you feel about introducing them to me over lunch? And we have this lunch where kind of between myself and the board member we tag team, you know, they talk about their reasons for being connected to Easter Seals. You know, I certainly talk from the staff standpoint and together we really make a very strong team in getting that person introduced to our mission and then moving that along. So whether that's, you know, eventually to an ask a sponsorship, you know, but it's again, it's just opening those doors and from those lunches, I've talked to those board members and said, no, was that really that awful? And they've said, no, when I go, but you just did fundraising. How did that feel? And they felt very good. And like I said, it's led to a lot of really great successes and new great relationships with Easter Seals. So walk me through that. I mean, when you, do you have, I've been on boards where at the start of a meeting there's like a target list and it literally on the piece of paper, it goes around and everybody's like, who do you know anybody on this list that you could help make an introduction or you used, you know, LinkedIn as an example of doing some of your homework, but how do your board members come to you with this information? Are they saying, hey, my neighbor's the head of this bank or are you finding that you have to push them more? I, it's both. It really is both. I think now that, you know, we definitely have some board members who've been with us for a while and have, you know, heard the rhetoric and worked through, you know, several of these exercises with me and with our team, you know, they have sort of that mindset now where they're saying, hey, I know so and so they're the head of and, you know, they're really looking to take on a new nonprofit. They're, you know, they have a foundation. I really think that this would be a great opportunity. So it really is a mix of both. Again, it's doing my homework. It's, you know, keeping my eyes and ears open to what's going on in the community, you know, listening to, you know, other sponsors, reading the local business journal, reading the local newspaper. I mean, I can't, I can't emphasize those enough that there's a lot of really great information in all of our local publications that you can look through new businesses coming into the area, businesses expanding, purchasing other businesses. You really can get a wealth of information. So that's my little plug for local publications and newspapers. But yeah, it's definitely a combination between the board, you know, they've been coming to us with some really great leads. And likewise, when I see something and I can go to them and ask them for that introduction, nine times out of 10, we're able to get it. I don't think any person that we've approached at a business or as an individual about a lunch or a coffee and having that general meeting, I don't think any of them have said no. And if they have said no, it was a matter of timing and not lack of interest. So I think that that's been very telling. Absolutely. You know, I love the ease in the natural aspect of taking somebody who might come on to a board with one notion and then helping them to understand how they can be part of an even bigger story, which I think is brilliant on your part. And I think it's necessary throughout, you know, board service because not everybody understands that. But now I wanna get into like the sticky wicket conversation and that is talking about board policies. So many organizations are fearful of this and then it creates, I think it creates measurement, which I think is always good, but talk to us about what you all do, what your board policies are and frankly, how you administrate that. So we definitely make it very clear that we have an expectation that 100% of our board members are going to give to Easter Seals. We understand that that is going to look very different depending on the member that we have. You know, we have individuals that are on fixed incomes that are in their retirement years, right up to some VPs of some very large organizations that are able to give more. What we outline when we talk about our board giving campaign is we would love if every board member would aspire to our president's council giving level, which is $1,000 for an individual or couple over the course of a 12 month period. Again, we understand that $1,000 can be a real stretch for some of our board members, but then again, we have some board members that that $1,000 isn't that much of a stretch. So what we reinforce is meaningful giving. So as a board member of Easter Seals, are we among your top three nonprofits that you support during the year? And we think that that's reasonable. And so that's what we underscore all the time, a meaningful gift. So something that you feel is a stretch for you, but is something that's really important. So we don't want to scare anybody with that thousand. So as soon as that comes out, and I see the look in some people's faces where it's like, well, I can't do that. But I say, what is meaningful? And if you can aspire to that over the course of your board membership, we would certainly love that. But if not, there are certainly other ways to help our organization. If it can't be out of your own pocket, but your business can do a matching gift, you know other people and can help us raise money, that's how we can make up the difference. And once people hear that, they feel very settled. And we feel that those are very fair and reasonable expectations. And I've had conversations with colleagues in this area and in other areas of the country where they say, wow, a thousand ours is 2,500. So I feel that we're in a very realistic place for where we are and for what we consider major gifts. And like I said, the board has been universally responsive to that and no one has balked at that. And we brought a few new board members on over the course of the past six months or so. And each one of them has been completely on board with those expectations. Have you ever looked at the concept of scholarshiping? Maybe so that you can get younger or different types of people. Yeah, we definitely would love to be able to do that, because diversity on our board is certainly something very, very important that we've been working towards the past few years. So whether it's diversity in age or background, color, you know, disability because we're disability organization. But yes, to be able to get younger folks on who certainly that thousand would be way out of their range right now to be able to participate. But yeah, I love that. I love that idea. I think it's a really, a really strong idea. I think because so many, to your point, you know, you might have somebody that's like a thousand bucks. Shoot, that's like snippety snap easy. But yeah, I think that the, that concept is something to really look at. And especially when you have that struggle with attracting younger board members who are new in their careers and or, you know, new have a new family. And to your point that thousand dollars or twenty five hundred or whatever might seem like a lot. So it really very, very interesting. I'm fascinated by this journey that you've been talking about. I love that you do these exercises. My last question to you is, how much reporting and reporting against your goals is given to the board members? Does that go under the CEO or executive director dashboard report? Or is that all on you? That's all on me. And I'm so pleased to be able to do that. So we have currently five board meetings a year. We have development committees that meet on a regular basis. So they are constantly in the know that's something that I prepare is kind of that quick snapshot dashboard so I can compare. So whether we're looking at an event, we're looking at our annual giving campaign, you know, anything that they're working on, they have a designated board giving campaign as well. They're constantly being updated on progress to goal. And likewise, when we exceed that goal, we also celebrate together too. Because I think that that's something that's super important too is, you know, we're lying on the board for so much and for those individual gifts. And I think when we reach the goal, we just kind of, you know, put that in our back pocket and say, good, we got there. But if we're not celebrating that together, it's really not motivating. And I think that, you know, certainly in this day and age and so many nonprofits are really being impacted since COVID, I think all of those celebrations need to be had wherever those wins can be found. I love that you brought that up because, you know, to your point, it's, it just seems like a drudgery. If you're just, you know, you always have another thing you're trying to tackle and you forget about it. Another question, and before I let you go, because our time is almost up, but how has, you know, the work from anywhere, the digital nature of having board meetings, how has that impacted this training and making board members more present with the concept of making introductions? I mean, frankly, there are a lot of people that are still not excited about having lunches out. Yes, no, you're right. In fact, we just had our first board meeting back in person a few weeks ago, which was super exciting. What's nice is that even prior to COVID, our development committee meetings had been held over Zoom just because the area in which we cover and making it easy for everyone to not have to travel and be able to fit it more readily into their schedule. So a lot of them kind of were already in that space which made the transition to the virtual board meetings a little bit easier. The introductions were still coming. During COVID, they were just in a different way. There were a lot of phone calls, there were a lot of emails going back and forth. So we made that work, but I think a lot of our board members, just by representation of how many of them were able to join us in person at this first meeting that we actually all sat in the room together and enjoyed a meal and a meeting together, I think our board members are really back in that space where they're ready to be out and they are ready to include Easter Seals in that journey. I think we have maybe one board member who still isn't in that place yet just because they have an immunocompromised person in their family, which we can all appreciate and understand. So I think that's gonna, there's gonna be an outlier I think in every group of course, but she's certainly still willing to help out where she can. And when she does show up at something, she just shows a mast and a little bit distant. And we love that, that everybody's still together, but our board is definitely ready to be back. I think. I love it. I love it. Well, you know, and I've gotta believe, Ann Marie, that part of that is your, I know your spirit of inclusion and getting everybody on the same page. And you know, I feel like board members, they wanna serve, they just don't always know how. And they need to be trained and coached and encouraged just like any other person that you engage with. Absolutely. And I think that too many people get frustrated with that and think, oh, these are executives. They should be able to hop right into a board position. But some of these executives, you know, have no, and they've certainly never been on our board before. You know, and so even if they've been on a nonprofit board before, not every experience is created equal. So we're more than happy to be able to do that training and take that time. And we encourage them to ask questions. We encourage them to ask other board members. Don't be afraid, you know, they can come to me. They can come to our CEO. I'm at every board meeting. So, you know, I have a very intimate knowledge of, you know, how these things work. And I'm always happy to pick up my phone or email or, you know, run out to meet somebody if they have questions. You know, I've had people approach me. I don't know how to read a 990. I don't understand what some of this terminology is. And that's what I tell people to don't be afraid. Don't let those things that you don't know also prevent you from taking the chance on an opportunity. If you see there's an opening on a nonprofit board and you love that nonprofit and you love that mission and you want to be a part of it, but there's things that you don't understand. Don't be afraid, don't be afraid. Honestly, we are all here to help and to help our communities, to help our organizations. I mean, you might, like I said, there's always an outlier in a group. There might be somebody who goes, I don't have time to help, but I'm always ready to help. And again, you don't know what you don't know. And like you said, it's like a new job. Everybody has some on-the-job training and learning, but I think our board is definitely a great group and they're inclusive and helpful and they've all been there and done that before. So they're available. I love it. Well, Ann Marie Serovi, CFRE, you have been amazing as director in advancement of Easter Seals in Eastern Pennsylvania. I think they got a winning team with you, my friend. Oh, thank you. This was a joy. I love talking to you today and hopefully some people feel hope because I know sometimes this topic is like, oh my gosh, will we ever come out on the other side? Will my board ever understand? Yes, they will. I promise you they will. Baby steps and just have the hope. They will get there and they'll get there with you. I think so. And I think you need to make it fun and you need to make it an achievement. And you know, I think it's really cool. I think it's great to see things happen in your community and with your work come success. And so I think that's how you naturally, you know, feed it. Hey everybody, again, I'm Julia Patrick. My trusty sidekick, Jared Ransom, will be back with us tomorrow. Again, we wanna thank all of our sponsors who are with us day in and day out who really made this conversation with Ann Marie Possible, Bloomerang American Nonprofit Academy, your part-time controller, Be Generous, Fundraising Academy at National University, Staffing Boutique, Nonprofit Thought Leader, and the Nonprofit Nerd. Wow, Ann Marie, you started off my day and my week and I should say the month. Because it's in the month. That's very true. Happy October, everybody. It's really cool. You know, as we end every episode we want to remind ourselves, our viewers, our listeners, stay well so you can do well. We'll see you back here tomorrow.