 This is very exciting. I like to closely order the staff from the City Council meeting of June 7th, 2021, the first time for us to be in person and to have some actual live people in the audience. There's very many, but we're doing this in two different ways. Today, people are joining via the meeting and we need to be screening up so we can see them. Oh, yeah, that's a good call. And Tom is going to be kind of monitoring the chat room. So if there are questions or comments from the public, since it's part of the meeting, I'll select the way. Okay, that's great. We will try to know the format of something that works for everyone. So it's very exciting. We'll start and welcome the first to introduce our incoming City Manager, Jesse Baker. We're so pleased to have you, Jesse, and for the public to see your lovely face and have you participate. So we're moving right now this month to the employee and to the transition with Kevin, all the ins and outs, we need all of the people she needs to know, or at least a lot of them, getting to know the staff. And it's quite a transition with moving to a new building and meeting everyone and coming out of COVID. Again, we need all the online stuff that we can do. Just very quickly, the process we use, we set up a public committee that included some staff to interview not to review all of the application. Yeah. Larry, can you start the record? Oh, yes. Oh, sorry about that. Oh, that's right. This conference will now be recorded. Right. Well, let me start again. I want to call to order our person person since out front and city council meeting tonight on Monday, June 7. And for the first time in almost a year. We're going to start with a pledge to the flag. So, Kevin, why don't you start it off? The United States of America and the Republic for which it stands on a nation with liberty and justice for all. And before we get into the agenda, I would just like to introduce our new city manager. And she's working with Kevin for the next month, meeting all the directors and the city and learning all the in and out and workload that you see ahead of us. We welcome you. We're so happy that you're here. I'm very helpful to you, but really helpful. We have a lot going on. So you're coming into a whole book of businesses, they say the process to identify and select Jesse included a community committee that we set up that includes some staff as well to review all the applicants. And then a little bit down to. And then the council interviewed those three liberation and Jesse will have shown everyone to her so thrilled, but she brings this off of her experience. And so, for background, many different degrees and experience in government, and just to recall, I think, attitude and love for the government. So we're very good to see you tonight. So, I have number one is. In addition, solutions are changing. Thank you. Other items for your other business or any change on the agenda. You just read the public that I think a lot of people is assessment today in the mail, available on the web on Friday. Exactly two weeks from last Friday. All that number that's on the sheet that they got in the mail today, but they can also go on the web. Right. And we are going to have an update from market. Yeah, I don't know. I'm sorry. I'm honored to be here tonight. And especially this is my first in person. It's a very exciting. I started on June 1. So this is day five for me. The entire team is so welcoming more and open in our conversations. We really have a rock star staff. Joining it. The last week we really focused on the new building, how we are handling the community staff. And we're also looking for. So we have interviewed. And of course, of course, talking with you all more as I get oriented and members of the community. And so we've been working on this for a couple of years and years. Finally, there's a little point. My parents are actually on. Go to meeting today. They are there. And I just want to thank them for all of the support. And I want to thank everyone. Well, public services. Oh, yeah. I'm trying in. So moving on. I'd like to make a brief comment this evening to encourage continued dialogue about how best as temperatures rose today. Historically quite unusual for. I'm reminded of climate changes. Please consider the impact. Of development on our quality life. Quality of life. And the planet. I really applaud you all. For acting to balance the need for additional housing. While simultaneously balancing our community. For preservation of open spaces for our. And future generations. We truly have only one opportunity to talk to the address. Again, I urge you all to consider climate and quality of life. And I want to thank you all for being here today. Thank you. Thank you. I'm touched by a quote from we are the weather. By Jonathan. 2019, which states. Motivation can forget action. But more remarkably. Action can also forget motivation. We don't track to the desert to look up. Because we're feeling. We're not. Thank you for your work. Very hard work. To balance the growth of our city. Sometimes seemingly. At the expense of our quality of life. Please carefully steward. Our precious environmental resources. And in closing. I applaud the council. Later this evening. I appreciate it for the support. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Is there anyone? Yeah. So, I just want to make sure that people at home can hear now. They were commenting. which I'm against saying they weren't hearing us. If we confirm it, they can hear one of the microphones right now. For them, for us, you want to do a test right now. Great. Can you hear me out there? No, no, we can't. Can you hear us now? Is this what you can hear us if we put our voice? That's better. That's better. I think we just need to hold the microphone very close to our mouth with the people at home to hear. How about this? That's better. Can you hear me now? Yes, we can. If it's closer to the mouth, we can hear you clearly. But thank you. All right, so let's try to remember that. We'll push it away while we listen to people. Hi, I'm Barbara Service. I live in Summerwoods here in South Burlington. I'm the founding chair of the South Burlington Dog Park Committee and I'm here to talk about the Dog Park Movement. I apologize before I begin for speaking and running, but I wanted to come and see you face to face and I have another meeting at 7 o'clock. And I was going to do this with two computers, but we can't do it. So anyway, that said, why did I come here tonight? I hope you'll bear with me. I've tried to be concise in my list of concerns and suggestions, but ever the academic that is sometimes a challenge. Thanks in advance for your patience. So quite literally two years ago tonight, the first Monday in June of 2019, the original Dog Park Committee presented its report. The results of months of hard work by a dedicated group of volunteers with the assistance of Maggie Ruggers and on occasion also Justin Mabadou and Horvitz. Two years later, we still don't have a dog park. And yes, I know that COVID. However, there's more to come. I remained a tenant to the Dog Park's activity since I stepped down as chair and especially to the development of Wheeler Dog Park. So tonight I come with some concerns and some suggestions. First, my concerns. After the site was approved by the city council, there was a long wait for environmental reports from the state to identify and categorize wetlands. We were told the administrative review would likely be an option. Instead, the RV review is required. That's mine. But it was scheduled for next week with a 30-day comment period to follow. Why was it delayed? We don't know. The sign that said coming summer 2020 has been changed to coming soon with no year indicated. What does that mean for timing? We don't know. The parameters for Wheeler were identified in general plans verbally agreed upon by all the interested parties in some great discussion. However, written plans and details were never provided. The implementation is not clear. If there is a dog park, we do know that there will be a fence and a double gate. But what about all the different entities? There were proposals for benches and shaded areas and provisions for water. Are they in the plans? We don't know. Then, too, what are the plans for maintenance? The entire area needs to be on a regular mowing schedule. Otherwise, the entrance to Veterans Park is going to look really ready. And more importantly, it will be unsafe for people and dogs to be at the dog park to navigate that. What are the plans? We don't know. There's money in the city budget as well as some donated funds designated for the dog park. How much of that money was spent on planning and what will remain after the fencing is installed? We don't know. Opening of the park to well-reenergized friends of the dog parks for fundraising and friend-raising activities to fund additional amenities. What is needed? So, what am I suggesting? I can come here with a bunch of idle hours, but I want to make some suggestions. It needs to be explicit that the city council expects the dog park committee to see the details before the construction begins. I'm quite sure they would rather provide input prior to the establishment than to have a list of missing items and their concerns after the park started. I hope the city council will ask staff to determine a date, at least a month if not a week within a month, in 2021 and not 2023, in which we might expect the Wheeler dog park to open. No one assumes the dog park will be complete at opening. Ask staff where to open will be and to specify the maintenance plan and the amenities anticipated. So, we don't know. Updates including maintenance and amenities should be provided monthly to the dog park committee and the city manager who in turn can provide information to the city council. I also have a suggestion for the now permanent dog park and the committee. Since the dog recreation task force idea seems to have been shelled, the dog park committee is the appropriate place for consideration of issues previously identified for that task force. The committee probably needs a new name because their work will extend beyond the dog parks in the areas such as guidelines for dog parks and new developments and the DRB I know has been open to that. And considerations for off-leash areas another huge area of conversation in the city. They will have an ongoing work plan to address these and other relevant issues because the number of dogs is increasing in South Burlington and the number of people is increasing in South Burlington and they are going to want places to take dogs safely. If the committee is going to be effective there also needs to be staffing. It's my understanding that no one has been assigned specifically to help the committee once we are reserving. How can that be? We don't know. Every other city committee has staffing and the DPC has some great dedicated members. We worked really well in the initial stages and they're dedicated and they can be effective in identifying potential solutions. They need staffing available to advise their solution focused work and to demand a huge amount of time from those staff. So all of that said, I have one final thought. You should be a great opening for a boiler dog. Somehow I don't think event planning is on Justin's list of things to do and I don't think it should be. He has plenty already. Public works has lots and they won't have lots after the dog park is open. Understanding the recreation department is also in transition with new staffing coming on board and they're moving to a new building and all of those things that are happening. When the ground is prepared and the fence is about to be installed I think it's the time to transfer the oversight of the dog park committee from public works to recreation parks. I'm sure that the dog park committee and friends of the dog parks will be ready and willing to actively play an active role in the planning and opening and for future events they will school poop and all of those kinds of things that are helpful to the city and to other residents and to the dogs. They just need to be asked. So what is all this saying? The original 2018 dog park task force was created in response to citizen unhappiness with dog related facilities in South Burlington and I remember having to watch all of you endure some really unpleasant moments and I don't want that to happen again. The initial year was characterized by challenges from unhappy citizens. Let's not do that again. I strongly encourage the council to provide voice and support for the citizen based dog park committee that will be able to do much of the work previously assigned to a staff group. You don't need solutions but they do need your support for their efforts. I'm confident your support will be a good investment for the people and the dogs of South Burlington. So I know I've gone on long and I've had lots of concerns and suggestions. I appreciate your willingness to listen and I know that it will be an agenda item at some point but I just wanted to comment and bring a little bit of perspective at this first open meeting. It is wonderful to see you all. Thank you. Thank you. So I just put in the chat that our traditional protocol has been if you want to speak in your remote turn your video camera on and that indicates you want to speak. Thank you for your attention to Neil. Okay, go ahead Neil. Thank you everyone and good evening to everyone. My name is Neil Omelda. I'm a minister of the Church of Christ and I represent the brethren who are living close there in South Burlington and different parts of Vermont and once again we continue to support the many activities that are conducted in Vermont to support all of our the environment and in helping the community grow especially when it comes to faith and in doing what is needed to be good helpers of the community. So first of all we thank you for giving us this time and then secondly we just have a question on who can we coordinate with for social civic activities that we can help Vermont including South Burlington while we're brethren in the congregation had wanted to have more to be more involved in helping the community in different things like cleaning parks planting trees cleaning rivers and whatnot. So we just wanted to take this time to ask who can we coordinate with for future projects like this. What was the first thing you mentioned Neil? You said cleaning trees, cleaning rivers and the first. Well cleaning parks pre-planting blood drives whichever the church would help the community so the question is who can we communicate with further for these projects. Well we often don't have like a dialogue during this time but I think what where I would direct you first is to the city's bi-monthly newsletter because in that you will hear about different opportunities to volunteer. There's the lead warrior group that has two things going on in June which might be of interest and there's lots of other topics in there that get identified as city projects or events where volunteerism is encouraged and ironically tonight we're going to be interviewing some people for different meetings that process is kind of closed for new applicants but for the future we advertise in the other paper and if you have something applied to join a committee in particular we'd love to have you have them apply and that's another way to get involved. Okay we understand. Anyone else have any other ideas? If you want to email me I can share some ideas with you and it's my first initial M followed by my last name just like Emory Worldwide at s-b-r-l b-u-r-l .com Alright just to confirm M-e-m-e-r-y Emory at s-u-b-r-l.com Yeah You have a good name. Thank you so much for the time and again the church of crisis here please do let us know if there's any way that we can continue to support the community not only in South Burlington but the entirety of Vermont and thank you also to the counselors. Have a good one. Thank you very much. Is there anyone else? Okay. We'll move on. We have to here yet but when Sarah reads the comments I am sick because she's a very bright timeline but we'll move on then to announcements and the city managers report. Do any counselors have announcements? Okay Tom Absolutely. I want to say two things. I was at the Ethel Homestead this past Saturday at their open house and I was appreciating the contributions this council has made to the Water Valley Park District. It's really phenomenal they walk on pathways throughout that entire area and they were commenting how during this pandemic they have seen usage double if not more and I just I heard the same thing from Brett Leonard with my son participating in the South Burlington Racket Park so I just hope that so many people are appreciating all the investments over the years in our Racket Parks throughout South Burlington and elsewhere. I'm certainly hearing that a lot of people have been using that. Great. Thank you. Yeah First thing I didn't plan to say but I do wish to say since yesterday was the commemoration of D-Day which is a huge moment in our history and I am always struck when I talk about June 6th as an important date that many of my students and fellow Americans don't know that date so I just wanted to mark that date. I am a second for specialist in French studies and for the French science it's an important date and I think we're just watching the French news I was struck that the Americans which the Americans usually are highlighted as you know we suffer the greatest losses they weren't in this year's commemoration on the French news and I was struck by that and I don't know why that is I might write an article after investigating it but if I just want to say to my fellow Americans we need to remember the date if the French are going to remember our sacrifice on that date so I just want to say that I had other comments the month of May I chose halfway at least to respect something that my family in Wisconsin does because of an ordinance it's called no-mo May and that means during the month of May it's required to mo precisely because this is the time when our pollinators are at work and making it possible for us to grow food in our fields and in our orchards and so my neighbors did not complain to me but we only moed once because it I didn't explain to my neighbors what I was doing and I was starting to feel a little embarrassed but we had long rats and weeds and all the rest but I didn't see many more bees and butterflies and I've seen this one in California it's called pollinators pass where there are segments of land both privately owned and publicly owned that is left open just to to growth and to wildflowers and that is a way for us to actually be able to grow food as you might or might not know we lose a third of our bees per year and people are having to truck in bees to farms in order for us to have food so I just want us to think about that as a council I'm very concerned about the use of pesticides and I know we have a stormwater ordinance tonight and I want us to think about the section on pesticides I also last Thursday met with a former student of mine who graduated from the environmental program at UVM this May her name is Elizabeth Macken student and in addition to studying French she did a capstone project on the moral land grant act of 1862 and as people might know and if you don't remember UVM is a land grant institution and why is it important it is important because it allowed the state to invest in the state institution how so by taking lands in the Midwest there were several states that exist today they didn't exist at the time where we displayed native populations and our state was given land to sell okay and the students started this project in 2019 and the university is actively researching this I give them a lot of credit and I spoke with her and with someone called Rich by email we're going to have a discussion again tomorrow but they are very keen on speaking to our council about land use and equity I think because we do not have a point person or necessarily a formal initiative per se but yet we have initiated our communities have initiated equity issues I think that it would be really good for us to think about who we can include in that discussion and I think our native population should be in that discussion we can talk more about that under other business as we wish but I saw this in tandem with something that Helen and Jessica Luizos have already agreed to I wrote an email to them about two weeks ago again based on input from even young colleagues there is and I also had Monica Osby, Larry Kupferman and Bernie Gagnon in that email as well as Bridget Burkhart who is the chair of the school board but she agreed to let Helen and Jessica who said that they would like to hold a joint land commission council meeting on it with Carolyn Finney she is a resident author at Middlebury and she's the author of a book called That Face is White Space and I actually have it here if you're interested in looking at it I guess we can touch things now too but she gives a powerful and revealing overview of the relationship of Black Americans to our natural spaces so I just wanted you all all to know that and I also wanted to give you a heads up that on June 21st I will be introducing a resolution meeting on June 21st the dock park I already said earlier those are all my notes thank you Matt I just want to say this is my first in-person meeting as a city councilor and I'm so happy with all of you in person and I think we know lots of brag about South Burlington in terms of vaccination rating for the Vermont Department of Health website here in South Burlington the state of Vermont will be at 80% which is remarkable the other two announcements that I wanted to make or the things that I wanted to highlight is that today open enrollment began for the economic recovery bridge grants there's a lot of businesses out there but we're very happy to be together not wearing masks if we're vaccinated but a lot of businesses that are still struggling and the legislature approved and the governor signed legislation $10 million out there for businesses that are still struggling because of the COVID-19 provide that information at the ACC's website I just want to highlight the work being done by the Vermont Department of Public Service there are a lot of people out there that haven't been able to pay their utility bills because they lost their jobs and there is up to $10,000 available if you rent your home anywhere in the state of Vermont $10,000 available to pay your back utility bills your E-Wo bill your Kerosene bill your natural gas bill your electric bill so if you rent yourself there there is assistance and for businesses as well happy to give you more information that you can also know thank you can you hear me my wife Katie O'Brien is starting up the utility box paying program again so there will be a new art popping up around the town we appreciate it and it will be starting up very soon have you just recently done a go funding or was it it was about a month ago that we opened it back up oh I should see it it should still open I would love to I did last time but I just didn't see it but last time I parked the garage to the table full of pieces that's okay did you raise enough money so much for this okay city managers thanks Melon just a few things Martha and Tom today applied for our American Rescue Plan initial funding the entitlement program funding that we will get and we have been acknowledged by the Treasury Department that did receive that I think Tom is still working on whether the county white funding or the county funding is going to be available to us for kind of an odd position as an entitlement community before we report to the council later on that our moving schedule at 180 is proceeding with the library closing down on June 11 and they will start moving on June 18 followed by the funding and zoning staff later in the month and funding and zoning and tech staff what else and then there will be a gap a few days of a gap and then the rest of city manager's office can lastly the city clerk's office will move and be in along about mid-July a little bit before mid-July so that's the idea it's Jesse alluded to before a lot of staff are involved in that Jesse is really leading that whole effort to move and it's going to be a big project our tour of 180 market street for the council, for the committees for our legislative delegation is going to be on the 14th at 630 we'll gather out in front of the building so you can park along the street in the parking lot across the street and so we hope to have the council there and many others but we're back to work here all of our staff are back it seems to be going well there are those who are still wearing masks and that's fine we said if you want to wear a mask that's fine a little sad note but a good note too all of us are appreciative of the hard work of Lisa Benger at the CJC Lisa's let us know that she's going to be moving on to another position in a consulting kind of capacity and she will be helping us transition through a week or so ahead but I think all of us would agree that Lisa's just on her mouth and she'll stay in that line of work but she's going to be concentrating on our school systems I'll be participating with the quarterly on Wednesday in a healthcare spotlight where we're going to read a discussion about the healthcare clinic and the captive that we briefed on a couple of meetings ago there are 23 companies that are going to be, 23 organizations that are going to be participating in that to learn more about what they can do they've expressed interest in the same model and so I want to highlight Coralie's work on that and her involvement in this meeting and lastly I would say the state has decided to wind down the COVID housing COVID relating housing programs at one time we were up to 139 I think people at the Holiday Inn were now at 46 I believe just one and the whole home was reserved for people who actually were COVID positive so those programs are winding down and the residents are moving but the Holiday Inn was no longer going to be available as of July it's they want to commend the state and all those involved at the Champlain Office of Economic Opportunity and many others who have facilitated what has been a challenging residential environment in both hotels not everything has gone perfectly we all hear about the problems that have been there but for the vast, vast, vast majority of people who have been there this has provided a safe place to be during COVID and I express my appreciation to all who are involved and particularly to Chief Spurk and Francis for their service to them those members of our community who needed their help can I say something in response to that I just want to add my thanks to the police and the CMS personnel who I think took on a challenge for which they are not necessarily equipped and they did it I know with mission in mind and humanity and compassion I'm sorry we're not mastering this microphone what is the transition plan for these people what we know Megan is that they're being transferred to other residential facilities technically hotel facilities in other communities but no funding for the program is winding down and I think the state has yet to really finalize a plan for this population this population is generally the population generally speaking in general terms that many of them have been and it has long been a goal of the state to find a means to fund a more long-term housing for folks other than paying for the hotel voucher program where vouchers are provided for hotel rooms where it gets really really cold the state has seen this as an opportunity to work on a longer term more permanent plan for providing safe clean housing for this community of people and I don't think Jesse may have more information on that but that's we're kind of waiting for that point we'll discuss it at the BLCT meeting we can talk about it I'm sorry I'm sorry I'm sorry to really put the star and I'm glad she's going to stay in the field that really is and find good replacement how? oh I'm sorry she's thank you so if the already did number five I don't order I'm so anxious to introduce Jesse can if you don't mind can we hop down to item six and have a the budget presentation from Sarah Reeves for the in solid waste so that one quite you gave us quite a bit of information so I thank you well thank you and thank you for your patience I apologize for my technical technical difficulties always happens at the most inopportune time so thank you very much for your patience as you mentioned I'm Sarah Reeves I'm the executive director for the in solid waste district and I am here to present our fiscal come-to-budget for your approval for those new to to the county or to the district CSWD is a municipality we created in 1987 to oversee and manage the solid waste generated in County we are governed by a board of commissioners volunteers to be our commissioner from South Burlington the CSWD's mission is to reduce and manage this waste generated in Chippin County and to do so in environmentally sound efficient effective and economical manner and because I'm here to talk about our budget tonight I like to talk both about how we are funded and then also how we are not funded we are funded in three main ways the first way is through what we call user fees or tipping fees and those are fees that we charge directly from materials that they bring right to us and that we then manage or store like in our drop-off centers the second source of our revenue is from our solid waste management fee and that is a per ton fee that we charge for all of the trash they bring directly from Chippin County to the county and then the third main way that we receive revenue is through material or product sales so sales from things like local color paint that we make or from our compost products and from the sale of recycling through our materials recovery facility where we do not receive any funding we don't receive any revenue it's directly from our cities and towns so we do not assess any per capita fees we do not receive any local income taxes or local sales taxes or property taxes all of our revenues generated from those two main areas and some grant funding as well so for the fiscal 22 budget we are anticipating revenue in the amount of $12,954,793 and that is we believe going to be conservative and I'll explain why in a moment we're anticipating expenditure in the amount of $12,323,072 the remainder between those two will be divided amongst three main reserve funds there's always management fee reserve fund the biosolids reserve fund and an offline reserve fund we are not anticipating raising any fees with the exception of two areas we're looking to raise the fee at the mountain compost facility slightly from $60 a ton to $65 a ton on inbound gaps coming into our facility we're looking to also raise fees slightly on for biosolids customers and it's not going to be used to be part of the program you know that is essentially a pass-through program so as these go up to manage that material we raise the fees it's only paid by the members who actually access that program we are anticipating excellent revenue this year in both the compost program and out of the merc you may recall that in past years we've been talking to you about a fairly dire situation in the recycling world and in 2020 that turned around some of that was anticipated or planned for and but most of it was not so there was high demand and there continues to be high demand for cardboard products as you can imagine many people were working from home ordering a lot online so high demand also high demand were recycled paper products like junk paper recycled paper products were used to make toilet paper paper towels and wipes also in very high demand last year that's great news for us because 80% of what we process through our materials recovery facility are paper products so that was a boom for us last year in addition with a lot of people being home either starting new gardens growing their gardens building out their gardens growing good at home our compost products sold very very well they're continuing to sell very very well exceeding expectations this year and we expect to have a similar year next year so those two main areas are showing extreme growth which is really excellent news we're also anticipating a very heavy intense capital infrastructure investment year big projects last year with compost anticipation of Act 148's final piece which was to reflect in July 1 we're all pleased to be kept out for landfill so we invested heavily in our compost facility we're continuing that investment we're also investing in 3 2 and a half of our DOC's this year the DOC investments are on a rotating year so this year coming up will be Milton and Richmond we're finishing up some investments in Essex and then in a rotating basis we're going on to South Burlington and Charleston and then after that Burlington so those are on a rotating basis in the next couple of years we're also looking to begin the process for permitting and designing for a new materials recovery facility we've been talking about the need for numerous several years I will be bringing this project to our Board of Commissioners this month in June for their final approval to go ahead with the project ending that approval then we will be coming back to all of our members cities and towns to our residents to our voters in anticipation of meeting before you with the municipal bond you have a very brief synopsis in your pocket that describes the project that is again just a very basic treatise we'll be coming back to you with much more information in anticipation of that municipal bond vote that would occur in November of 2022 so with the next general election we have applied the beginning processes and ready for application through the Senator Leahy's office for earmarks those are not guaranteed in 10 or 12 years so we're not sure how that process is going to go but we have we're shaking all the trees so we're hopeful that we will need to come to the voters for our municipal bond but we are planning that we will we are also encouraging everyone to work with the commissioners on the Community Cleanup Fund we want to get that money out to you and use the community a couple of years ago the Board expanded the uses for the projects so if you have different ideas talk to Paul Paul can help you with that those project ideas we can help you with those project ideas and get that money back into the community where we want it to be used so I know I threw a lot of you a lot of that information out to you the packet was very large I would love to hear any questions that you may have great it looks like we have one from Tom Chitman so it's a question and a point of clarity for both the council as well as those at home Sarah I heard you say and this is great that you do not need any money from the city of South Burlington because you've been able to balance the budget with the fees so if that weren't the case if you weren't so great stewarding the responsibilities before you it is entirely possible that you could come to us and demanding since we were part of the municipality an assessment of the city I wanted to clarify that that was the case that we as our taxpayers don't need to pay you anything and then the second part of that question to confirm that's the case with this murder do you anticipate that to change do you anticipate the bonding authority to shift your balance books so in the years to come that you would expect the city of South Burlington to have to contribute something to cover that bond Paul Shaking said no which is making my debt great to New York exactly Paul is correctly shaking his head no so we have three sources of revenue that we would be using to pay down the bond debt so the we were going to keep taking out note for as long as probably we could do this 20 years we would look at 25 years and see if I made a big difference if not we would do a standard 20 year bond and because we have control over the user fee the tip fee which is the we charge the haulers at the scale when they bring us the recycling that is where the first lever that we would use and we would raise the tip fee accordingly in order to make sure we cover that bond and as part of our operating budget if for some reason that the tip fee wasn't enough we have the next source of revenue which is the sale of materials so revenue from the sale of the recycling so we would supplement the tip fee with the sale of revenue from the material sale if for some reason that wasn't enough a third source of revenue is that's always management so we have three pots of money that could be used if needed to pay down that debt we would focus first on the tip and fee so if the at the mark to pay down that bond so your first question was again you know we everything that we do with our budget is designed to have each of our programs pay for themselves any kind of per capita fee other districts do that's the main source of revenue we have a much more wide variety of revenue sources so that we don't have to do that we're very proud of that actually that we have been able to pay for our services pay for what we are able to provide to the community strictly through user fees material sales it's always management fee that tax on haulers in almost nine years so that shows that again we are operating within within that budget it would have to be a very very dire situation for us to not have enough revenue to pay down a 25 year launch note we've done the preliminary performers and we feel that we can we can still continue to be very competitive given today's dollar, today's market with the tip fees so that it would increase but it would not put us out of market and we do pay attention to that even though we're one of two mercs in the state we still want to make sure that we are competitive and that we are providing a good service at a good price thank you and Tom I'll just note sorry I just note that regarding the member town assessments back in the 80's when the state created this all the way to districts for two years we did assess a member assessment but after that we were able to get everything up and running in terms of the taxes on trash and stuff and we have not assessed all the states then so we got a good track record I have a couple of questions Sarah can you hear me okay? Yes so the current MRF is owned by CSWD or owned by Cassella owned by CSWD okay and so the new one will be owned by you as well? Correct and would it be administered and operated by the contractor Cassella again? it's a great question and that has not yet been decided but I think the last time we went out to bid for operating services was oh Paul you probably would remember better than I would know 12 to 15 years ago and there are a lot of companies currently in Vermont who have that expertise but we feel that it's my opinion that we should go out to competitive bid because there may be companies who might want to come into the market but there is also a possibility that we could bid on the process the operating as well so that has not been yet decided that we need to talk through that with our board but my recommendation will be to go out to competitive bid and does the CSWD own the land under the current MRF right now? we do. And you also own the land that you would break around on to build a new one because of decommission that's another excellent question so it is an asset and yes we do own the building, we own the land so there are many different possibilities we could certainly sell the property we could lease the property we could use it for other solid waste purposes it's already in an industrial area so it is properly zoned for that we've talked about could it be reused for something like a special waste facility where we could consolidate some of the bulkier goods like mattresses or furniture, film products there's a lot of different options that would present itself if we had that asset available for new use my last question concerns the Burlington DOC and I know that I personally criticized the CSWD for limiting it to compost only after the pandemic kind of lifted and I know some other people did too have you had a change of heart or are you reconsidering other materials besides just compost because that's the only local place for people in the south and the northern or western part of Burlington too well a lot of what we might want to do there at this point hinges on what the city does around consolidated or franchise collection so I know Burlington is making a decision very very soon on which way to go there I know that Burlington has been talking about that as well so we need to think wait for the city to make a decision when the city just tells us what decision they're going to go in then that to us we have a couple of options the current site of Pine Street has always been too small I don't think you've realized but it was originally designed as a walk up location so it was never designed for vehicular traffic the walk up version quickly was abandoned so we've always had traffic problems at that location it's always been far too small so once the city decides which way they want to go with the consolidated collection then we'll want to have some more conversations about the two options we do own property on Twin Avenue that we have held basically for 15 plus years as the location or a location within the city for a new modern drop off center so we still do own that property right now we're renting for the building space we do like the location at Pine Street it is I think a better location to serve the population you're talking about so could there be some possibility there to extend that location the city owns more property than just what they lease to us so I think we want to have some conversations with Rowington and see what might work also depending on the scope of the service or franchise collection there may be far fewer people residents in need of a drop off center the way it used to be so we this is all to say that there's a lot in the mix that we want to have some really intense conversations with Rowington and I think again by the end of the month the end of June we'll know much better what direction they're going in which will inform what direction we may want to go thank you okay good question are there any other questions I just wanted to note that the compo seems to have made a breakthrough it's supporting itself which is wonderful that's what I was very interested in the news I'll just note that's in large part because the board decided several years ago we need to reduce the complexity of our process and offer a lot fewer goods and it saved a lot of money you know cost I should say and so and then staff did a great job executing on that and I appreciate the level of tipping I think that you've done a really great job to maintain moving it to reserves as opposed to using reserves to fill out your operating budget seems like you're really moving in a very good direction all right does that end the year I know we have to race off or not race off log off and then log into a couple of places good luck thank you very much I just I want to publicly thank Sarah for the excellent job she's done leading the district throughout this pandemic she's been very strong and very effective and we were blessed she agreed to accept our offer I think five years ago now so we're very fortunate thank you thank you excellent if the council might indulge maybe it falls on the screen if we could move to item seven before we go back to the content agenda we need to appoint a representative to the board our current representative is Paul Stapler and my understanding is Paul you would like to continue yes I would I'd love to continue to serve I'm really dedicated to the mission of the district and the board itself and the staff I think I have a great relationship with them I am no longer the chair a couple of years ago I decided to step down and you know it was good to get new leadership and this past year Brent Oakleath has been the chair and done a great job and we're now going to be appointing a new chair this coming this month but I'd love to continue to serve if the city would like that okay shall I move to the representative for the CFWD alright is there any discussion okay all in favor of appointing Paul Stapler to continue as our representative the CFWD board signify by saying aye aye that carries 5-0 so thank you very much Paul for your passport and for continuing thank you so much and I really appreciate your confidence in me and I encourage you to reach out at any time if you have questions Tom I know you said you wanted to talk about some things there when we were voting so let's get together sometime I'm surprised you didn't ask I was going to and then I said I'll call up with you soon Paul alright so let's move back to item 4 which is the consent agenda and we only have one item tonight consider and sign the disbursement I'll move to approve this person moved and seconded is there any discussion okay all in favor signify by saying aye you're in no nays that carries 5-0 so we'll move on it works consider and possibly endorse the solar installation concept parkway water treatment plant and we have our energy project manager here and you gave us some really good presentation yeah well you know I read it I get what you're asking the one thing I want to say look this project program here I read what that in a variety of ways normally we start looking at what's it going to cost and we track the solar when the markets is costing and usually this is applicable on the other one guy then we can begin to ask one of the replacements and the benefit all of a sudden we get into manufacturing that sort of thing that the benefit is growing down to the solar system because of the way that it works and I'll go through and talk a little bit about that so let me go ahead and talk to the next group of people oh I'm sorry yes now I'm ready to start it why don't you need okay I'm a little busy energy manager for the city part-time job where we've been following this possibility of putting a solar right out of the water treatment plan on the airport parkway so looking into that we discovered was that if we really did it just as normal course of business all the benefits would flow because of that meeting contract with the city or with the green mountain power would all flow down to the school district if that raises a question why does the city want to invest a couple hundred thousand dollars for the school district to get cheaper energy and so how can we work that out so I'm not here to ask for any agreement on any exact proposal or anything like that what I do want to do is present a concept for how we could fund the project in the airport in an equitable fashion it has been discussed with school officials not the board and they understand the concept and they agree that it's something for one board let me walk through the chart and make sure that people understand right now the array that is over at the landfill virtually pays for all the electric bills in the city by me all the water treatment bills in the city which is our biggest expense flows down in colors almost all the school buildings running in the sun now as spring and fall when we don't have as much solar energy that starts to drop off and the school doesn't get as much benefit when we go to the water coming we get very little benefit from it and we're going to show the next chart how to diagram how that works some discussion about that may have occurred the agreement that we have right now is very beneficial to the city therefore we don't want to do anything that would allow that whole agreement to be opened up started again renegotiated so the idea is to put the array on what we call the inside of the meter to plant and for those of you who went through the discussion about the water treatment it might be very similar to that kind of arrangement so the conclusion we came through is that the school really should pay a reasonable energy charge for the energy that we're going to supply and the bottom line well when the building when the array is paid for completely maybe the city and the school splits the benefits or something basically it's a good project for the environment and also for the city ready for the next one I hope it's a top show of summertime when first call on the left the landfill is providing and you see it's running in the summertime and as I said the airport parkway apartment bay and most of the school system is being supplied with power basically at no cost you get the spring and fall the array doesn't produce as much power as you can see schools start to drop off and the whole arrangement is on a full-time arrangement so we get the first power and then the high school gets the first school power then the middle school then the elementary schools and so now when I first saw this I didn't understand the difference between the red and the green green is you've got power and red is capacity and it's not being used okay so and for instance it's like water going through a pipe they're all green pretty much you've got that power coming out of the front of the animals that fill up all of the recipients but as you can see the ones that end the chain don't get as much as thank you let's try another way if it's green we'll pay for if it's red we do at the end of the state no 200 precisely and I put that on there particularly because that's the green amount of power address that they use on our bill it's really what is I use to know a simple school mark my school yeah yeah and we just need to remember to use the mic the the second line is what would happen on normal the last line is it would put solar and the slight difference is that in an airport parkway we're not using as much power because our own solar would supply the power so the green amount of power would less be what that means is that more power flows to the school and as you can see in the middle school I believe it is I indicated all their power would get paid or could be erected that scenario would roll continuously through the month and vary as the season goes through what the attempt was to show how the power flows down without the erect so in the summer then it would fulfill all the needs it looks like it's about the same or maybe it's more than what you see because the difference between the green square the park the airport parkway and the little red on 200 market street is about the same so with an additional solar array it would cover everything in the summer yeah it was exactly what those numbers are diagrammatically this is the way it works just to clarify it just means that the amount of money that Chamberlain and Orchard and Rigmarcott School okay that's what we're not paying for it doesn't mean that power flows past Chamberlain it gets to the middle school and then doesn't quite make its way back to Chamberlain no and the system that we're in right now we've used for five, seven years something like that works very well all the mathematics of it is nice and smooth and easy and we don't want to touch it so last slide potential cost sharing models some basic data right now the array that the landfill was producing over two million kilowatt hours that's a lot of power we're not talking about anywhere near that the array we would put in would be about a tenth of that size which is pretty comfortable to what's at Market Street going in right now that's an interesting question ever since I walked into that place the perfect place to put it is right over all those tanks it's been done in water barriers it's been done in my period and just built a structure over its top if you want to get a good idea go down to the parking lot echo in the back and you see that's nice that you have nice rooms over there so your cars are shaded no, they're all solar arrays the same thing behind me the church at the Gobba Church Street and there's ample places to put solar arrays we just haven't taken advantage of don't get me started don't do why not it does provide shade you don't have to do quite as much plowing so there were some other benefits yes we won't get those benefits at the waste water treatment plant because do you put this out to bid or is it just an understanding of what the current cost is this is pulling it right out of the air just to get a model to generate what the concept might be and the reason for doing this now is personally I didn't want to do it but you can see we wanted to exercise ourselves and also contractors to bid on something until we had an arrangement until we knew it was financially appropriate so what I'm trying to do is get a concurrence from you folks that this is what I'm going to talk about in just a second here makes some sense if it does it will take the same thing to the school board if they agree then we'll move forward with a big process of design get good numbers does that put it in context thank you there's a question remotely Michael Mitag asks these facilities are on city-owned property have we considered major lines in the same spaces no yeah good point the proposal is the school would pay and save directly for the power that we produce out of the array because we know it was directly to the city we would charge them on a reasonable rate right now the GMP array structure has all kinds of things like efficiency chargers that kind of thing we kind of cleaned it up and assuming we did this somebody would be back to you with a very specific arrangement and everybody hopefully would agree to decide what that would be but just applying some sample numbers through it shows that basically is the link would be paid off in six, seven years reasonable number cost in school district is absolutely zero because the array would be put that's the constant they pay us instead of paying the GMP simple as that I say green light I have a question are we confident that this would not be in violation of any regulatory structure to sit around with the utility commission in terms of like cost avoidance by putting our own panels behind the GOP that would be described pre-mounted power meter and then thus have more of the net meter credits than flowing down to schools so we're confident that this doesn't violate any regulation I haven't seen anything that says that it might need to be investigated further keep in mind we're doing that with the microtermin right now this would be a little bit more power right this is like the equivalent of like 50 homes approximately in terms of microtermin yeah so we've had some very brief discussions with GMP employees that are knowledgeable about these kinds of things nobody said I'll do it well it would be good to get that determination I mean just to make sure just to make sure I found that you talked to people who wouldn't know your sense is that it's not violation but before we actually we certainly we aren't going to go after anything like that okay I think that's amusing so you had an initial conversation with someone at the school regarding the swap their school day what would happen would you what would happen to the power if the school decided not to just it could be yes and that your question very directly was what would happen if they said no and I go back to my little office way over there and I start scratching my head because spent a fair amount of time thinking oh my god is this project dead is too good a project to be yet Tom and Kevin and Brooks the leaders of the Seoul District you know and I don't know about this but I do know that in 2017 we got under the wire with the current solar array from the CPG so the CPG was issued in 2016 I believe in 2017 the legislature changed the rules but there's a 10 year window on that what happens in 2027 with our current solar array in terms of that metering good question to look into thank you you're much further ahead of the things that I okay so your next step is you get some sense from the council and then go to the school board and make the same pitch okay so what's the I mean I would let him continue to investigate and start it up that would be my vote if you say what I think you just said then tomorrow morning Terry gets a copy of the slides I think you should pursue it there certainly are some outstanding questions to get answered but there always are it's just like this but it seems like it's plausible and would be positive for the city in the environment solar is the soft charge solar is one of the cheapest sources of new power in the country today the chair really asked me to watch the chat I'm taking my role very seriously so I'm going to drag it I'm going to tag both echo support for the city should go for it great thank you alright well thank you very much thank you good thinking and we appreciate your attention to this okay item nine is the update on the citywide appraisal and Martha Lyons is with us tonight who is our assessor property property tax collector this is the one for the guys here yes I can oh you turn it off now we'll be going well I'm here tonight I have an update on what's going on with the reappraisal as you probably know the residential and the condo notices were mailed on June 4th and they have hit the mailboxes today and the hearings are actually going to begin next week I've heard from a few residents that they've already had their hearings scheduled and asked me for some information which I got for them so that's all moving along smoothly they are probably pretty busy with Tyler technology and the deadline for condos and residentials to request the hearing is June 18th at 4.30 and there are going to be four hearing officers and they anticipate the hearings will be complete by July 2nd and this all depends upon of course how many people call and request a hearing the commercial notices are scheduled to be mailed on June 16th and then the deadline will be 4.30 on June 30th for commercial properties to request a hearing and the hearings are also going to begin as soon as people start calling in on the commercials and John Valente he is also doing the commercial properties for the city of Burlington and so a lot of those owners he knows also on properties here in South Burlington how his schedule is so that should be helpful with that can you tell me again please the commercial will be mailed on June 16th that means that we rely on the web as well yes and then tentatively the I do have a tentative timeline for when tax bills will hopefully be sent out and of course this all depends upon how many hearings and how long it takes them to get the results of the grievance hearing notices out and that is July 16th is I should be at that point given all of those changes will be in the grand list and then I will be able to turn over the second 411 to the state of Vermont so that they can start working on our education tax rates I spoke with Casey at the state last Thursday or Friday and so they now know when we are tentatively on a schedule for and he said that they should be able to have our education tax rates by July 23rd so once that happens and I will be able to finish off the veterans things like that that we are announcing the education part of the tax rate and we will be able to come up with our municipal rates I have spoken with Chris at Nemrec and he knows what our timeline is and if that all holds true and if I do have that information on July 23rd then the following week I will have all the stuff done in the grand list I will meet with Chris our file will be uploaded to Minuteman Vermont and tax bills will be mail by July 30th and the payment will be August 15th no August 30th if you wanted an earlier date I would not be able to charge penalty and interest until it's been 30 days for when the tax bills are mailed but that also leaves us where we won't have to move the November or the March install so they'll stay on the 15th that sounds reasonable one of the taxpayer is out of town so there are a few and everything is available by the phone so I have people emailing me I have been giving them the toll free number so they can call and set up their appointment same for the hearing it can be done virtually and what if by July 2nd there is a change in the value what impact would that have on the tax rate well that's why the tax rate won't be set until all of the hearings are done so then it's that's the values then people will have the next step which is going to the board of civil authority but those changes are not going to impact the current tax rate do you agree with the commercial assessment? yes that's a quick turnaround between June 30th and July 2nd thank you any other questions? no that's been work yeah I want to recognize Mark the incredible work that she's done under a difficult situation coming in late in the reappraisal process and I know Tom will back me up on this you've done a remarkable job stepping up to the plate and the community OJU would do it, thanks I certainly appreciate what you've done Mark the delays that we're experiencing on the commercial side are not due to anything happening in South America so that's not on us, it's not on Mark Arthur's done an extraordinary job thank you thank you so the commercial delays will be ready until June what percentage of them are complete? do you have a moment? well John is going through those values now on June 16 actually I will have from him the information June 10th or 11th the delay to that is then I have to do a quick review of it upload the file get the notices ready with white and Tyler technologies it'll a minute man from on will then bail out those notices and they need like three days for those for that to print stuff and mail I think that we've seen the residential the average has been an increase on the commercial side could you say the same thing from what John just told me so they both are experiencing increases and they're somewhat relative to each other the same that there won't be a burdenship as far as we know correct but we'll see are you receiving a lot of calls from residents about the impact on their textile? yes and unfortunately I can't give them a whole lot of answers except for it's probably going to end up being about the normal increase that we normally see somebody for where the residents where if they may see a larger increase where if I took a small two-bed ranch knocked it down and built a two-story several thousand more square foot house in the same spot then yes I'm going to be paying more what is it on a percentage basis so it's a normal increase on the residential and the condo side I have seen it's usually 29 to 33 percent increase some of them have been a little bit less it's interesting if you take the spreadsheet and create a cell column for just a percent delta change from the older to the new and you go neighborhood by neighborhood it's very interesting to see that closer to the length that the older neighborhoods with the more median price homes are seeing probably a greater percentage of the higher percentage increases and of course the homes that were sold sold most recently probably are seeing a lower percentage because their assessed value is very close to what the actual construction value was and that usually holds true so it's pretty interesting I urge everybody to take the spreadsheet website and kind of do a sort on it and go through and take a look so you know you'll be getting some calls and our pilot will be getting some calls yes any comments? there's a comment in question in the chat and I also have a question is it true to say that if your price your value of your house went up approximately the same average of all the houses and your tax bill should be approximately the same that we're level funding the budget so to speak if your increase is about the same as the average increase in all the houses you shouldn't expect any more than a usually increase in your tax correct may I read the comment in the Michael Midtag states June 18, 2021 deadline for residents who appeal request grievances too short he received his assessment today he gives him just 10 days and he's traveling so he really only has 8 days do they have options do people have options after this window if they're traveling right now? no, that's set by state statute that it's 14 days from the date that they're mailed and we start counting the day after so they're mailed on the form so then we start counting the day after that so if you have another paper reporter you give these like big headlines that they're in a short window and this should be front page this week I'm married to questions you certainly may I'm not sure what the percentage increase is for those so right now I can only speak towards the condos and the residentials and that is the range of some that I saw on some of the condos were like 20% but there weren't too many so I'm not sure what the percentage is for those so right now I can only speak towards the condos and the residentials and that is the range like 20% but there weren't too many of those there's more the 25 to 33% range of increase on that last one Keith Epstein says he just looked at the residential noodle the average increase to be about 26.8% so if people's houses assess a 26.8% increase they should expect the no more than usual expected tax increase correct we've all been reading about how people from out of state are coming here to Vermont because we all follow COVID regulations and live civilly and can actually meet and not fear getting sick and people offering 20% more than the listed value of a home paying new cash are we facing another potential kind of cliff like the school district had to face last year I'm not sure on that I do know that from somebody that content can be today that is a potential buyer they had a 5 o'clock deadline today to put in their bid and they were asking about the taxes and so I asked what property all the property's new value was approximately $530,000 give or take the asking price on it is $719,000 good so my concern is that the state is again going to shift what you know this is what you're selling for this is what is assessed at and that we're going to be facing that cliff much more quickly than we have in the past I hope things level off and that will avoid that cliff because I know in 2006 with the last re-appraisal we did have a cliff and it was almost immediately after we used that process the market then it was probably more close to the 2008 when the market took a dip but then it kind of leveled off and we were able to go this long without having to do a re-appraisal and it's my hope that the same thing happened this time last question do you have any advice for homeowners about what resources they want to bring with them or access ahead of time when they have that call with Tyler Technologies yes they can go online to the city's website and under tax and assessing you can see a link for property record cards it's in blue you just click on it you can enter in your parcel ID and then it'll bring up your property record card it is the old one because I have not received the new ones yet but you can make sure that your square footage is correct that if you're in for any finished basement or not and things like that so that you can have that information beforehand because they'll be talking to specifically about your property look at these spreadsheets of ballot sales for the last few years they had comparable homes and things like theirs yes and those are also all on the website sounds like good advice so that probably would be a part of well that's your question there's one more from Sandy she's asking doing these high sales prices affect the CLOA I think she means CLA the common level of assessment and if so it's bad news for SOHO but our CLA gets adjusted after the appraisal yes the state will be adjusting our CLA that's one of the things that they'll be doing once they get not the first brand list that I will launch by the end of this week but after the hearings are done with the new values after all of the hearings then the state will look at what our CLA is compared with the sales and they're hoping that we come out at just under 100% then the state yes so Sarah Duff asks is there a set interval between reappraisals 15 years since so long it all depends upon the state and where our CLA is once that drops too low or goes too high then that is what creates the need for a reappraisal but don't you have to do it every 10 years? no oh you don't they eliminated that it's now based upon actual I guess probably good so maybe we'll do it in another 3 years is that they have that kind of money to help export on the state level sales for CLA and reappraisals let's hope not any other questions for Martha well thank you very much for your candor and your information and again thank you very much for an incredibly difficult job that you did very well thank you so let's hope this all works out objectively keep up your work okay I am 10 council consideration possible action on a resolution for policymaking to reduce carbon emissions and counteract climate change so councillor Emery has that sure and the public emailed me asking why and I said I would deal with her tonight if she insisted so I responded to her and then she copied all the council so the council is aware of my comment to her I would like to I guess read my comments since it was copied to the entire council to public now so I just want to look at my phone okay so what I wrote to I'm having an issue with my certificate and the server yes I'm not alone in that so I have it up on mine there's a microwave somewhere it's not very perfect one will we just take a five minute break a little bit earlier and we'll figure out if you can bring it up it would be nice to hear it I do have it I never let's just take a five minute break we'll be back at 8.09 so 8.15 the south brunt and city council back to order and we'll continue with item 10 the resolution for policymaking to reduce carbon emissions in counteract climate change councilor emory has something that she would like to be yeah I had a resident contact me and several members of the community and committees as well as the entire city council and I responded to her and she wanted to know about the resolution the resolution for the south brunt and city council says it's principle guiding mission on the basis of equity with regard to vulnerable populations the reduction of south brunnington's carbon footprint to achieve a minimum greenhouse gas emission reduction goals mandated by the GWSA and to target reductions in line with the 2021 federal goals so I said I appreciate this is a burning question and so we'll send you a document I've reviewed and that holds a nugget size paragraph of all the points that say a lot and it comes from the Harvard school of public health with regard to COVID and the vulnerable populations for illness and not only COVID of course all viruses and bacterial illness so what we see in the United States is an increase in exposure to hazardous air pollutants is associated with a 9% increase in COVID-19 mortality and there's also been an association between air pollution over many years with an 11% increase in mortality from COVID-19 infection for every one microgram cubic meter increase in air pollution it's also been found that people living in communities with more long-term exposure to tailpipe emissions were associated with higher rates of dying from COVID-19 with a 4.6 parts per billion increase in nitrogen dioxide exposure that's the socks and knocks if anybody sort of that which primarily comes from urban traffic resulting in an 11% increase in the case totality rate after controlling for other factors that may increase risk of dying from the disease it's also been found that annual nitrogen dioxide exposure pollutant comes from tailpipe emissions to be associated with COVID-19 incidence and mortality in Los Angeles County neighborhoods while adjusting for numerous co-founders excuse me with an 8.7 parts per billion increase in nitrogen dioxide to be associated with a 35 to 60% increase in mortality rate and this states from 2021 this report our transportation overlay district this is me speaking now is not the only place that I see for affordable housing nor should it continue to be full of individual motorized vehicles that is if we wish to have a place on this planet for the two generations ahead of us and I'm speaking of my children's potential grandchildren so we're three generations off with COVID we are living in a crazy time with regard to housing prices see the free press article below the current housing market should not be the measure so let us take this back to 2019 and before in order to compare just after roughly 100 homes were demolished in my neighborhood in 2017 after which the housing vacancy rate dropped from 3.3% to 1.8% countywide here's the information that I collected from the 10th of October 2018 Champlain housing trust report and which I accessed back in November 2019 it is no longer live link email I'm happy to forward it to state and federal planning authorities specified 5% as an optimal vacancy rate in spite of an increase to 3 and 3.3% in 2015 and 2016 respectively the vacancy rate in Chittenden county again dropped below 2% 1.8% in 2017 that's after the F-35 maps from 2016 actually before the F-35 2016 maps or 2015 a noise exposure map 2016 led to further demolition in the Chamberlain neighborhood which has put an upward pressure on housing prices and rental rates and this comes from the Building Homes Together campaign released as results of the first two years approximately 200 South Burlington homes have been demolished since the mid 1990s due to noise produced by the F-16s according to the 2019 Building Homes Together report issued by the CCRBC we learn the following the campaign and I quote to encourage housing production in Chittenden county is keeping in pace with its overall production goals but the gap between housing costs and wages is growing however affordable homes are falling 33% of the low targets 140 new affordable homes per year on average for a total of 700 over the five-year campaign which is giving the average share over the first three years 280 affordable homes were added falling short of the 420 goal so we are meeting our housing goals but not affordable housing goals in the Building Homes Together campaign you can see the difference that 100 homes made back in 2017 out of state home buyers have altered this picture in a way that we simply cannot compare the Free Press ran an article about housing prices and home ownership for Vermonters in general but I'm not convinced that this applies to the Northeast Kingdom or everywhere in the state is hard when you have healthy people using FaceTime video to buy home site unseen with cash that's from the Free Press article of Sunday if there's a run on Vermont and specifically certain places my husband and I were just in the Northeast Kingdom this weekend which is why I speak of it and housing prices and land prices are still reasonable there we can find solutions perhaps better public health policies in California is one way to curb the fight since the largest number of new home buyers in our state come from California this again is just one piece of the solution a UVM colleague of mine who works with refugee resettlement and a successful grant seeker is seeking to expand the program outside of Chittenden County he agrees with me that the answer lies in economic development outside of the county sorry Patrick I'm speaking to an O'Brien who was copied on this email but we cannot simply build our city or region out of a housing shortage there are other pieces to the puzzle that need to be dealt with and I respectfully disagree with your view and that of the current affordable housing committee that more housing in South Millington is the sole answer and I heard here and now today it's aired on VPR and there was a fabulous report on home ownership the audio is now available in regards to Biden's plan for home ownership as well as equity issues with our Black Americans so there are a lot of pieces to the equity equation let us come back to my first bullet points the Harvard School of Public Health report people who live in polluted areas are more prone to severe illness and morbidity this must be our first concern as a city just coming out of the pandemic and key to that is the current food zoning and our consideration of land use all my best and so tonight and I followed up with an article from the Washington Post saying that our carbon emissions are right back up to where they were pre-pandemic and that we are just basically not learning anything and I wrote to the resident here's another article I read today which highlights the urgency of not returning to business as usual after the pandemic we have to get out of our cars or at least those who can telecommute or walk by or bus and rethink how we do things now let me say now to the public something I have not written as you all know I come from the Chicago area and that is a city that was of course struck by redlining and that is something the resident wrote to me that these land preservation goals could be viewed as redlining let me tell you a little bit about the history of Chicago history of Chicago is it was a boom town and a lot of people moved into the city and what it brought was traffic and what it brought was pollution and what you saw after the Jim Crow era began after the Civil War is you saw a lot of black Americans from the south come into the city so this is a time when the railroad is going the need packing plans are up and running this is a time when you have Sinclair writing about those need packing plans and what happened was is you saw fear on the part of the residents of that big city when they saw these black Americans arrive and you saw the beginning of banking policy discrimination you saw the beginning of a flight you saw the beginning of people now wanting to sell their homes to people who do not look like them can I interrupt for a second what the relevance of this is to the climate action resolutions because I've been asked a question about equity and the equity question is that when you have a city that builds like Chicago what you have is an inner city problem today because the answer of that time period was to build build build and it did not sell any solution to our climate action resolution I'm just responding to Sandy okay well maybe is this the appropriate time to do that or are we supposed to be I said I would respond to her in the meeting tonight I can stop though but I just want to say that pollution and building homes and adding more pollution you have an inner city problem that begins that's not because of redlining it's because of pollution and because of all of the different factors so we have to look at this as a historical movement if we truly want to understand what redlining is about it's not about thinking environmentally can we focus on the yeah that really hit my funny bone a little bit too hard do you have some comments about your resolution I want to say that it was reviewed by the energy committee and that they fully endorsed my resolution it was reviewed by several residents who asked to see it as well and I understand that there are there is a proposal here made by counselor Matt Coda I find that resolution to be we might as well not pass the resolution if we pass the resolution it's not just like our residents spoke here at the beginning we need to act in order to feel we need to act in order to be motivated and if you looked at that Washington Post article that was not forwarded to you but I'm happy to forward it to you now it is saying that we are in mental health crisis and an anxiety crisis in part because of climate change which is the number one concern of 60 to 65% of Americans and they feel powerless and therefore our anxiety levels are increasing and I think it's important for our council to be leaders here and to give people an example of action to show them the desert and the stars so that they can feel that spiritual awakening that they are ready for need they are craving for leadership and that's what I want this resolution to be I compared all the whereas classes but I think it's important for people who are feeling anxiety to see that this has been prepared over many years that our city has been planning for it and our comprehensive plan our state has been planning for it our state is a lot slower than our city can be in favor of us passing the resolution that has teeth to it I mean not teeth in terms of fines and what the coordinates would have but where we actually direct our staff and our committees to go through a climate change lens when they consider a policy including what they buy and they can present things to our council and they can say we have looked at the options here is what is best for the environment here is our budget can we afford it I think this is a good question for us to be at best and to have to answer just as an example how do you want to discuss and share if you want council to speak before public about Sandy you as asked you draw your attention as soon as you are willing to why don't we work on the resolution and that would train, I think, of, for strand of the conversation, you know, one, whereas chief, was it there for, or therefore this was not part of the resolution? Okay. But I do know I have some additional language in certain matters. So do I. Oh, you have some additional, too? Well, I mean, I have some ideas. Okay. I'll have some ideas. Yep. Do you want to hear about the room? Well, I was, well, I'm just wondering if we, if the council shares their different thoughts, then the public could come in on all of them, rather than just focus on making very, very lengthy, but very complete, almost like term paper kind of, um, articulation of the issues around global warming. So I think that would be helpful. So I'm here, Matt, yours went out in the packet. So do you want to talk about your option first? Yeah. And I would like to thank Council Member for bringing this up. I think it's important that you, thank you very much for that advice. It's important. People of South Rowland and else, but the city council is united. Our understanding, our belief, our knowledge, that epidemic greenhouse gas emissions are what cause global warming. I think it's important to bring this. I would disagree with you, Council Member, that my resolution, my substitute, is not worth passing. I think it is worth passing. The reason I cannot vote for your resolution as you're active, 73 to 77, the three reasons. Number one, it resolves to target reductions in line with 2021 federal goals. That's for the same. There are no 2021 goals. That's not a thing. President Biden in April of 2021 did create greenhouse reduction target 50 to 52% is what you suggested for the 2005 levels. That target is for 2030 federal goal. It's a target created by the White House. That's just that. That's the federal level. So, but number two, it's the principle guiding mission. That's problematic. I think it's important that we always do climate change and all the decisions we do. I agree with that, but it cannot be our principle guiding mission. The principle guiding mission is many things. We have fiduciary responsibility taxpayers. We must provide essential services, provide for the public safety and welfare for our citizens. We have to look at all the issues that come before us, whether we're talking about parking ordinances or mask ordinances or changing their development on maps, holistically and not through a seat. It's very important. Thirdly, what this resolution also does, the non body resolution, but there actually are some as you say, that requires city staff, city taxpayer dollars to account for the resolution to verify the city appropriately factored climate impacts into all ethical actions and decisions. How much time is that worth? How much staff is going to be devoted to that? Because of the pandemic, city for a load of 44 employees, we have at least seven staff positions that haven't been built. Now we are going to vote taxpayer money, city staff time to this created kind of task force. We have time to task force. It's called the Vermont Climate Council. These are experts in their fields that are creating a climate action plan to be delivered on December 1. We have the Department of Public Service experts in the field, developing the 2020 comprehensive plan, providing a pathway to eliminate controlling the environment. This is the task force. We should absolutely as my substitute amendment. You're following what the law is, the Warming Solutions Act, what the Climate Council does, what the climate action calls for, what the Vermont comprehensive plan does in order to reduce carbon emissions by the mandated amounts. So I will be voting for resolution is drafted. I will be supporting efforts that recognize climate change is real. It's impacting all of us, that we need to work collectively. A town by town approach is the wrong approach. And I am concerned that this resolution will be viewed by partisans. On one side, they could say, well, this is your principal guiding mission. Ours is to take energy to build an open space. So we can't build, it'll be used by others saying, but we don't build here. Then we're just going to move people or next to the two largest employers of Vermont, move them further away, exacerbate climate change. So we need to build more will be used by both sides to make their case. We need to look at all the issues that come before us holistically, not through one singular lens. So I would hope that members of the council support my substitute. I don't know if I can respond or not. I think we're speaking past one another, Matt. What I said was that this would be just a piece of what we consider and that this would be calling for it to be a piece of what we consider. So if we determine that we cannot invest in all new electric vehicles because of our budgetary considerations, that is, of course, our prerogative as the deciding body for this city, we can only do with the funds and the resources that we have. And as my multiple warehouses, and I apologize, I'm a researcher that's I write turnpapers. It's there to show you what we have been doing. So we are not asking of our staff much more than what they have been doing already. We are simply, simply asking for it to be put on paper in front of our eyeballs, so that we can make informed decisions. There you have So I love the research that you did behind it. And I think that the bulk of that could be moved to another document that acts as a reference document. You know, I'm really fond of keeping things as simple as possible, so that the public can quickly see what the point of what a point is that City Council is trying to do. And I think that what we I think what the City Council would like to do here, and I can be wrong, is that we would like to tell the public and our, our taxpayers that we acknowledge climate change. We know that it's having an impact. It's nobody in the public. We acknowledge it and we know it's having impacts on our community in various ways right now. You've got storm alert issues, right, which are being tested for the first time in hundreds of years. We have temperatures that we haven't seen in certain times of the year in years and years. And, and so I think it's important that we tell people that, you know, we, we are alarmed by these things and we see changes taking place. But we want to be able to have, we want to assure people that we're we acknowledge it and that we're going to help develop a plan to adapt to it because I don't think we have any choice. We, we have to show some resilience in the Japanese thing. So first of all, I don't want to make this resolution to be too alarms. I don't want people to be afraid once they read it. I want them to feel, I want them to feel comfortable with the fact that the city is taking actions that are in everybody's best interest. And that includes reducing their CO2 carbon footprint and other things as well. I'd like to cut down and I think Matt's proposal similar the, the whereas is to just a few simple things that, that, that make us pass the litmus test on climate change, which is seems to be really important right now in a lot of dimensions of politics, right? And at the same time, have a couple of their force that, that tell the public what the city intends to do. So that's, I think where we want to go, I can't take a, I can't support a four page document that's mostly, you know, whereas, and then, and then I can't accept the morality closets in there either. You've got it. Okay, I know, but I'm just trying to say that, that, you know, the first resolution just went way too far. We need to something that's simple, compact, and explains to people in terms that they understand exactly what the city is going to do. Well, I took some liberty and came up with a, you know, another proposal that makes it shorter. It uses just three whereas is that are not exactly math, but similar. And then I felt strongly that the result, the result in Megan's document were really important, because I felt that, yes, we need to make this really clear to the public that we're interested in doing something that is important, that we can't wait. The weather changes the weather. I don't want to have a spot, you know, in five years. And there's little atolls in the Pacific that are no longer. And thousands of people have to leave their country more, because we haven't done anything. I get it. But there are things that we tend to. And I think one of the things that's not just to wait for the state to come up with a grandiose plan, but actually, I mean, how different is it going to be? The issues have been identified. But what we can do is really ask our city staff and committee to think about using a lens, but not the only lens of global warming about how they make suggestions and recommendations. How do you look at some? I think this is not meant to end the whole country pouring in the city itself or only the negative for the global warming. But we can do things as the city asks our public to do things, but also the city that can make a difference. Maybe it's a little different than every single community in the country wanted to take on or try to do just a little bit. A lot will get done. So this is what it's a forward. It's just, you know, acknowledging the application of CO2 emissions and their effect on climate. Literally, or in words, it's in the city's best interest to pursue energy efficiency. And the city has hired an energy project manager tonight and pursued a number of key projects that use energy and carbon footprint. So it's important to our community. And then the results are, you know, what can we do? Is it the, I mean, maybe the wrong term is principle guiding mission, but it should be one of the guiding missions. And I'm happy to strike that. But I think the important one is that we can't just forget there ought to be part of the whole issue. So this is again, you know, another little work in progress, just trying to pull some common things. And I granted it, it probably could be a little worse than this. The purpose of this is not just to acknowledge global warming, and then say we're going to wait and see what the state says we should do. I think we can apply some of the concerns within our own budgeting process, purchasing process, and just the way we run our city without having, because I don't think the state has a much bigger issue. We can certainly help impact that conversation. So I'll just say a few things. And maybe since we're at time, and there's two people that want to speak and four other comments in the Q, how much you want to pursue this tonight. But I like what you're going with this, Helen. I like slowing down the warehouse causes. I had some concerns that a couple of warehouses that we could be here all night were sniffing those findings. I like where Tim was also going with this too. So I really hope that I'm going to offer my initial feedback. You're the chair, but I would encourage us maybe to bring this back to a future meeting of the next meeting. And that way we can all get out of here in a reasonable hour tonight. Okay, so I just want to also thank Council Member, I want to make a clear point of that this is important topic of the voters and staff really want to know all of us care about this topic. So thank you for all the time that you put into this. I also recognize Chair really very happy to be here for us to provide feedback tonight to try to streamline this process to thank you for that. I mentioned I had a couple of warehouse causes. My concern, and you sort of touched upon this, I definitely heard a little bit of that in the Council of CODOS presentation. The V of Resolve, it says to meet and staff and council to immediately form a client action tennis force with the mission to involve all members of the community to participate in creating a client action plan. You say all members of the community and creating a client action plan, I just think money, dollars, time and attention. And I want to address this, but I'm always going to remember Kevin in my ear thinking about a staff time is my night. And I'm concerned that if we go over commit these resources, then we're they're going to be distracted from other responsibilities. So I'm just concerned about mission. I we exist, provide emergency services via these public works, credit parks and planning and use of our lands. I absolutely want an environmental lens and a climate change lens and all those actions. I just don't want to duplicate or do what the state is doing with the depth of budget, the depth of expertise and the depth of available committed resources to guide regional approaches to these solutions. So I love the merging of what I heard Councilor Kota say, what Tim Barrett said. I also what you offer Helen on the chair really, I don't know if this adds any additional guidance to the resolution we can also put, but I just want to offer that feedback and send it to you. We would like to speak and you can go over it and there's like six comments. Okay. Yes. One. I think with respect for you and Councilor Kota, you are seeing this much bigger than what it truly is. It's simply the little steps we can take. The Energy Committee did involve the whole community and a lot of educational opportunities and coming swapping out your electric bulbs for the LVD. We know we're and that's the kind of thing. I think that it's not as big as the state action. It's simply let's look at how much an electric mower costs compared to a gasoline power mower. If it makes sense for us to choose the electric power mower, it's it's getting down to what you're talking about with public works. And like you said, I think everything that we do is a city thinking about emergency, thinking about the public works, thinking about land use, all that. But this is, I think, very a natural combination with those main tasks that we have as a city. And it's simply saying, let us take little steps so that public works and emergency services tax too greatly in five to 10 years when we have even more storms or in 20 years that we're planning for the future. And I think that what Councilor Barrett said was really important in order for us to be resilient going forward, we have to plan now. And that's what this is. Okay, can we hear from the public? Sandy Julian and Ethan Goldman. Okay. Thank you. Sandy? Yes. Hi. I just want I think it would be helpful for the public to know, first of all, I was the person that Megan was responding to, and that I think given the breadth of Councilor Emery's comments, it might be difficult to know the focus of my input. And it was strictly wanting to have a better understanding of what the phrase on the basis of equity with regard to vulnerable populations was intended to mean. And I went on to say, on the basis of my knowledge of efforts towards social justice and reducing our carbon footprint, my understanding is that one of the biggest, if not the biggest challenges of addressing climate change is figuring out how to do so in ways that do not undermine our goals for progress vis-a-vis social justice. This situation is complex and must not be overlooked. In light of this, I need to know more about what Councilor Emery means by the inclusion of the phrase on the basis of equity without regard to vulnerable populations. And while I this was only an example, I said, as an example, some view a policy of building all new housing and or all new affordable housing in South Burlington only in the transit overlay district as a measure for addressing climate change as just another form of redlining. This is a relatively new view of what had been a very traditional approach to where especially affordable housing should be built. We know the history of relegating affordable housing to areas of dense population with the rationale that it needed to be near transit and other services. Many are now viewing this policy as a tragic error because it formed a basis for a policy that one kept, quote, those people, unquote, from living in more desirable areas of towns and cities, ignore the often negative effect of this policy on the equality of life of folks with lower incomes and BIPOC families. And three, increase their likelihood of becoming renters or homeowners in places that often had better schools and were closer to better pregnant jobs. I will not go on to really say, but what I'm saying is in my view, this issue of the fact that you really have to pay attention to the social justice impacts of what you're doing about climate change should be explicitly acknowledged. And I don't think the draft does that. And that was really my point. And historical lesson on Chicago. But, you know, I think that's it. I think you answered the issue and Sandy is really concerned with the language. Why don't we move on to Ethan? Goldman. Yes, thank you. So my name is Ethan Goldman. I'm the chair of the South Burlington Energy Committee. And I wanted to ask the Council to consider a question of conflict of interest regarding Council Dakota. So I wanted to cite first from the South Burlington Conflict of Interest and Ethics Policy. In Article 5A, it mentions that conflicts can be real or perceived. And in the definition, it includes a direct or indirect personal or financial interest that lists a number of different family relations as well as business associates, employers and employees. It also defines an indirect personal conflict of interest when, quote, a public officer acts on a matter in which the officer's judgment may be affected because of a familial or personal relationship or membership in some organization and a desire to help that person or organization further its own interests. So Councilor Co's employer is the Vermont Fuel Dealers Association. And according to their 2019 IRS or 990, their mission is the promotion and improvement of the oil heat industry throughout Vermont. They engage in lobbying and Councilor Coda drew a salary of $136,068 in 2019. And I also want to draw the Council's attention to the fact that when this resolution was first proposed on May 3rd of this year, Councilor Coda's first concern was not for the impact of climate change on South Burlington or even the potential financial impacts on Burlington's residents and businesses. Rather, the first concern he raised was whether the resolution, if enacted, would have prevented the city from purchasing $900 of diesel fuel, as it had done in the prior month. So clearly Councilor Coda's employer would be impacted by this resolution. And so therefore I'm asking if, according to Article 6, in the conflict of interest and ethics policy, Councilor Coda will disclose any real or perceived conflict of interest, either for himself or for any relatives, such as parents, siblings, aunts, uncles, or any business associates. And then I'm asking if after that disclosure, the other public officers will consider the consideration of recusal. And that's my question. So I'll bring it back to Councilor Coda and the rest of the Council. Thank you. Thank you. My understanding of our conflict of interest policy is that it's really, it states what you said, but it's self enforced. An individual has to agree that there is a conflict of interest and recuse themselves if they so wish. So I think you raise a concern and I think it really at this point is to Councilor Coda to determine whether that is a conflict of interest. So if I may, according to Article 6 in the disclosure section, it says, alternatively, a public officer may request that another public officer recuse himself from a matter of conflict of interest, whether real or perceived. We can ask them, but we can't demand it. But I think, Collin, I am just ever protective of my getting to bed at a reasonable hour. And with this discussion with Councilor Coda being new to the Council and not only with policy and also all of the things that have been suggested so far, might I suggest we bring this discussion back to the next meeting and have some thoughts between now and then? And we can talk about the conflict of interest policy all night. And I agree with everything you just said, Councilor really, just thinking of the rest of the agenda that we have to get through tonight as well as the deliberate discussions. I would suggest we extend the fight 15 to 20 minutes. I think we can extend it a little bit, but I'm not sure we have a document that we can sign, but if there's stuff or go down. But if we can spend another 10 minutes in identifying some concerns that still are out there, then I think in the inner of time, another draft to be developed that gets us closer to a resolution that meets our needs. One of the things they did forget to include, I really think the research that Megan did is important to include as an appendix. That's just a listing of these are the things that this community has voted on, these are the documents that support being sensitive to active about and in some cases really require that we deal with a whole host of issues. So that would be another part of my proposal. So it's an endowment, but it's not part of the resolution. But someone wanted to understand better where some of the kind of came from. They would have, as I noted, almost a term paper of footnotes of these are the places to look in our complicated plan and post plan and the R.C. There's a lot out there that is pointing in this direction to do something about it, or at least be cognizant. Or there's some other, may I agree with you? I think you can take out the word principle as a guiding mission. Maybe we can clarify that this is a lens, one of many lenses to you. Would that language sort of appeal? I'm happy with that. The original word I used to. I think we should spend some time rewriting. That's your how during all the discussion right now. We would like this to be rewritten. Councilor Cohen. That's that's right. We have to do it during the opening meeting. We've had four weeks to get this. I have asked for 15 to 20 more minutes, which the chair has allotted us here. Remove. The guiding mission. I'm not sure then how we fix on the basis of that. We just heard. I can't accept. You've got to make this super. Sorry, you can't. I can't hear you. That sentence that has to do with the basis of equity in regard to mobile populations. It's irrelevant to our business, which is trying to reduce our carbon. I want this. Explicitly state what the problem is that there's climate change with the city going to try and do that. I'm going to try and reduce the carbon footprint. That's simply what it's all about. Right. Any other either political or some other type of, you know, qualification of what it is just talking about climate change and what the city's responsibility is to its taxpayers, right, its residents on trying to reduce its carbon footprint and also probably reducing carbon footprint for the rest of the city as well through some actions that will happen in the future. I'm willing to have a great job. I would like to learn that we're guiding mission. Got to cleanse the reduction of child's going to carbon footprint or one of the lenses. I'm amenable to that as well. Burlington's carbon footprint to achieve a minimum of the greenhouse gas emission reduction. Well, there's a genius in gas emission reduction goals and data by the. Just act. I don't want any specific goal stated in this other than the fact that we are going to reduce it. I can be determined at a future date as to what our specific goals are. I think we don't want it. I don't think we should be putting in the specific targets of anything, just the fact that we recognize it and we will work towards reducing our carbon work towards helping the rest of the city understand and educate them about how to reduce their carbon. So one of the things that we do with the government view board is that we have a something that haven't ever seen. I would rather us discuss right now next what we are discussing. We see that we can see change. Please don't interrupt a very productive. You know, I understand what you said right now. We can't really see what we were all talking about the same time on a printed page. In the past, we've had somebody presenting on the screen and we were specific at the same time using the word. So we can't really do that here. I mean, the alternative is that we go back to our homes and reword what we think is is what we believe should be in that sense. I think you're you've helped that because you said you don't want any stated goals. So no, no, no, no, no, no, fine. OK, fine. When we get to the second result, is there a problem with using our advisory committee? What's the committee? For teams, prepare and about regulations or capital. Yeah, that is fine. But I don't want to create a new task force to study something. We already have all the people we need to do something. Well, the energy committee does a climate task force and we don't have to go. That's a capital. Yeah, that's OK. Because that sounds like that's doable. I mean, they already OK. Good. Good. The chair share her back. But you could use my back. Shall you scream? You know, I think. I don't know if we can get tonight in 15 minutes. I think our goal is to have this conversation about what are the points or what are the concepts? And then I think the five of us can look at language and go through and enforcement. I think. Is that acceptable? Tom, I love extra meetings. And if we want to have a working session, we're just dedicated to this. So we're not out here Monday night, you know, a special session where we can do exactly what Council voted and to bear the laptop on the screen. All of us will be who buys and move into that, too. I love extra meetings. The beauty of the short document is that we actually use the 15 minutes to get through the sticking point. Are there any so we've changed the third one to something about. Passing the Energy Committee with the mission to, you know, involve members of the community in creating an act of climate action. Plan. That makes good sense. I heard Councilor Cote say that makes good sense and some of the very two of them taken. This is your third. Yeah. The third result. The first result. The first result. Yeah. I think that's OK. And then the final one is that the city will report on the progress that we make in acting on climate action. I mean, maybe that's too strong, but we'll. Can we back up? You've got four resolutions. Yeah, the first one, the first one we're talking down to now therefore be resolved at the south. As one of the. Lenses, the reduction for cell phones to be curbs. Self-proclaimed carbon footprint period. How much is convinced to reduce the lens is a little bit fine. Well, when it's un-bogging, because we have to focus on it, that's what that's what the word mission is about, because it should not just be convinced because we've already committed. We've already done that. Then we find out to the character of the court. So we need to say, what are we going to do? Why do we need this? The action. The action would be that we want it to be as a lens or part of our mission, meaning that we see. Sounds like it already is. Well, we don't see it on our budget document. We don't. That's what we're getting to. You say later on in here that use this philosophy towards our budget preparation. That's in the second result. Just say now their purpose is all the same. Council commits to reducing Salter's carbon footprint, period, calm and then be a further result. OK, you made. Just, you know. And then. OK. And then the second one is he's agreed with that. And then the third one would be. Struck. Well, it was one of my things asking the energy. I think that's one energy without the energy. We work that into the second. Well, I thought you want these simple. I mean, I want a simple resolution that is separate and don't have a resolution that has five different problems. You say the help of advisory committees prepared to adopt regulations, prepare capital for the daily work programs and forms those committees as needed. First, like this vision. I mean, that succincts that succinctly says what it is that we need to do organizationally to try and, you know, all this of taking it a further step by saying that we will immediately ask for tasks of the energy committee to be our climate action task force with the mission to involve all members of the community to participate in climate action. Since this document in its original form was approved and endorsed by the energy committee, I imagine that they would be so what changes will immediately ask the energy committee to hold to I would say task. Thank you. OK, task the energy committee with the mission to involve all members of the community, which they did with the Georgetown energy man. They were fabulous. Amazing. Yeah, so I'm not against that phrasing at all. I just remember hearing Andrew Shalneck when you reported to us that we have so much capacity in the conversation about the south. I'm wondering if Kevin or Tom have any comments on south support to move this forward. For Gypsy, for that matter, should we handle it? Discussion. Maybe I think it depends on the magnitude of it depends on the magnitude of the project. I was under the impression that Paul was already taking the sound of a CCRPC in the find out where he stands for that project that came out of a discussion seven months ago. And so I don't know if this re-designs that work to the energy committee or if it greenlights all the committee to work with CCRPC on this or not. So I'd have to understand. No, it was said that Paul was working with CCRPC. That I completely understood. This is not biographical CCRPC or Paul. I'm challenged in the try to understand what's the purpose of this if we're working on it. It's to engage the community. It's to engage the community. Bi-expecting. To get involved in that plan. So once we have the plan that Paul is working on with the CCRPC, the tax work to be involved in the community and making that plan come to action. So they will create. With energy committee would become the task force for the specified unit time that we need them. It could evolve, of course, to change things. Or mission. I don't know. Well, maybe we can test the energy committee to take one of the action plans. Paul reports it's it had to work in the beginning. Transportation component is in the 20 to work. And we're reviewing the request for qualifications for insolvent. I guess my point is my expectations of council doesn't want to processes. No, it might be useful to hear back. CCRPC is in their process. To the way you want to. And instead of a meeting, they could be once we have a climate action. Right. That's what I was wondering. But I could probably get them. I mean, is that's not reasonable for us to take the action plan that's being developed? Just think we need to establish an act with the work that is happening. And all this is remarkable and it's extensive. And it's going to be the guy's document that we're going to follow 35 years. So I request that into the energy committee for all CCRPC and ensure this is an original part of that. Conjunction with the coordination with the work that is happening by the Vermont. That makes sense. We could probably spend all of those together so we can be ready to yield and have the energy committee with carrying out an action plan that's been, you know, really ready to develop. Yeah, I lost track of comments. So I know the terrible there are a lot of comments that I hope we can explore and share with the council. Not going to read everybody's comments, but I'll make sure the council sees them. OK, thank you. And then just the last one this is the report on the proper. Are you OK with that? Yeah. Do we want to change the factors? So you have the factors on it impacts into all that. OK. We can act. I mean, I guess it was kind of a report on what has happened up to the point. Yeah. Disfactors, you know, here's the equation, here's the formula factor to let the output stay a little better. Yeah, we'll hear. Sure. That was all. Who is who is doing that? It would be the city because we have. We have. I mean, we're kind of asking. All of the climate change in what there is a problem. There's no more. Paul Conner to be overloaded. So I know what we're doing with staffing wise, if he's getting more assistance and support. But I look forward to the continuing discussion and making sure Paul has a voice. As with all city government, we do what we can do with the powers that we have available in the energy. Well, I have a I think. I think we have a good sense where we all are sitting with this. Right. And I'll send it out ASAP. So then if I have gotten it wrong, you can remind me OK, and then we will happily read all of the. Coming by the public. It's on the screen. If you want to talk, you shall pop up and you want to wait. You shall pop up. I think it's I think at this point, it would probably be better to have more draft. Comfortable with to share with the public and then get feedback. OK. OK. Let's see. Now it's time for interviews. But then again, we don't have too many. What is it? There's seven. Well, OK, let's try to make our there are no names. There's very no name. Oh, now there are. Yeah. Is it applying to this camera just came off? That helps. OK, well, let's put it into the court. For you is interested in natural resources and he is an incumbent. So unless you've been doing a terrible job, I would suggest that we continue. But who would like to ask the questions of the court? They have been on the committee for just a year, but he has a graduate degree in biology and a new graduate degree in natural sciences and sounds like he has some of the background to be helpful and informative as the natural resources and conservation committee member. The question I ask, Gloria, everybody is, do you acknowledge that climate change is real? Hi, yes. Sorry, I didn't realize how the camera worked, but thank you for letting me speak in regards to climate change. So yes, climate change does occur. It depends on really what level you're kind of looking at. Climate change is kind of a broad topic to discuss. You usually want to narrow that subject down, whether it's more biology, geology, physics or chemistry related. So I know one thing that we always have to remember is that whether in climate change or not, climate change or not, climate change are different. So intertwining the two kind of gets difficult when you're discussing that topic as a broad system. But yes, to answer your question, I would say that climate change does exist, but it's to what level. That's what would be up for discussion. Any other questions? He's in cover, right? Right. So how was your time you spent so far on the National Courses Council? I've had a good time. I have. So I kind of spent more of my time listening, trying to make sure as it was my first year. I kind of want to see how the committee worked throughout the year. I did accept a task for the dog task force. It didn't work out too well as it seemed to be that there was a the dog task committee. Then there was the Friends of Dog Task Force. And then we had created another task force, but it wasn't quite working out well. I did help out in the East View Project, working on the draft for that. And I definitely would look forward to working on some other projects. I know there's the West View Project. And Ashley has some work that she's doing with what is it, Wheeler Park and Underhill. So those projects I look forward to working on. Okay. Great. Any other questions before? What would your project be that you would like to bring move forward, I guess, on the Natural Resources Committee, you know, a specific task that the committee accomplishes in the city or kind of structure-wise with regard to its work with other committees or perhaps you know, even writing bylaws are thinking about it and that. What would you see as necessary step forward? That's one of the ideas that I'm trying to come up with. I would like to see the community more involved with the parks that we have. It kind of seems like we have a particular you know, we have particular portions of land, but we don't really seem to be working too much on them. I'm not sure as if that's quite a like I also know that we are looking to acquire more land to conserve within the town and I think it would be good to focus more on what we currently have instead of trying to acquire more and then dealing with problems like invasives or when you have dogs interacting with these areas, it kind of puts a negative effect on those parks in which it makes it not quite as appealing. I would like to engage more on getting people into those parks and using them in addition to acquiring more land to conserve. Any other questions or comments? Thank you very much for your service and I appreciate your reply. I'm sort of yelling. Thank you. Thank you very much. Okay, next up, Libby Don Cleehan, is that how it's pronounced? Close, it's Libby Dallan. Oh, Dallan. Libby Dallan. Sure. There she is. Hi, Libby. Hi. I'm interested in one of two committees. Your first choice is Wrexham Park and your second choice is Wrexham School Housing. Is that correct? Yes, correct. All right. Have you been to either of those committees to listen in? No, I haven't. I'm relatively new to South Burlington in general. I'm from Vermont originally, but just moved, I was abroad for a number of years and moved back to Vermont in 2019 and just to South Burlington. I've been involved and learned more about the community and contribute some of my experience and skills. Okay, that's good. Both committees, do you know when they meet and you have the time to I mean, the affordable housing I think meets her in the middle of the day and Parks and Rec is late afternoon or early evening or late afternoon. I don't know. I don't know. Yeah, I mean, of course, I would need to find out what the exact times would be going forward, but I work from home, so I have a relatively flexible schedule as long as I know ahead of time when the meeting is, then I do have the time to commit. Okay. Any questions? I think, well, wherever people are needed the most, but I think both sounded interesting to me. I have a program and nonprofit background and I think Parks and Rec might be a good committee for me. I think it could bring together different intersections of issues I've been interested in and building community and also, you know, taking and bringing in the natural environment and health and also the equity lens and those are all issues that I've touched on in my career, most in the nonprofit sector. So that might be my preference. I was also interested in affordable housing just because I know firsthand how critical that issue is here and also the issue of equity and inclusion balanced with the environment. I know that's a tough line to walk sometimes and issues that I'm very interested in. I would like to know more about what you work with. Sure. So I work with a global nonprofit called Soledadad. It was started originally in the Netherlands, but now we have eight regional offices around the world and we are working to build more sustainable supply chains. So that's all along the supply chain doing direct training with smaller farmers and our artisanal minors all the way up to working with governments to build certification standards and better increase transparency and traceability in their supply chains. So I do business development and communications for Soledadad and a lot of coordinating with our global teams. Have you ever thought of working for the Energy Committee? The Netherlands are like the head of the United States. I just need to state that for the record. The Netherlands can't do it alone. It's a rhetorical question, but I just wanted to plan a meeting. Thanks. Let me kind of ask you a question. How did you get started in international development? So I went to UVM for my undergrad and I majored in anthropology. And I did a study abroad program in Ghana that was focused on international development. So that was really my first exposure. And when I graduated from UVM, I got a job with a nonprofit in Uganda for education and entrepreneurship. And that just kind of really started me on that pathway. I worked for a couple of different nonprofits in different sectors from women's health to a lot of sort of entrepreneurship programs that was a common thread throughout the mall. And then just moved back to Vermont a couple years ago and have been able to stay engaged in the international development sector. Thanks to remote work. Thank you. Thank you. Okay. Any other questions? Well, I appreciate your interest and your applications. And you'll be carefully considered. And we're meeting later tonight, I think, to figure out who will be named and you've applied for two of the committees. And I have two of the committees that have more applicants and there are openings. So I can't promise everything, but we might be able to think of another committee if you'd be. Sure. Yeah, I would really be interested. I just would love to learn more about your enthusiasm. Great. Thank you very much. I appreciate the time. Thank you very much. Thank you. John. John is a attorney for Natural Resources Committee. Hi, John. So, hi guys. And you're interested in continuing. No, your parks and rec. Yes. All right. And so how long? Approximately three years now. Okay, so you obviously know the crime commitment and the topics. Are there any things that you're learning to work on now? Sorry, the last part of the question learning to work on and what else? Oh, something that you would like to see the committee work on. Just empowering the committee members a little bit more. I feel like a lot of the talk and the discussion and the action lives with the more tenured people. So I pose that already to the president. They're very receptive as is Holly Reese, the director. But, you know, beyond the two hours of participation on the phone call on a monthly basis. You know, you know, you know, I posed it as tasking us to put some takeaways not necessarily homework, but action and just, you know, a little bit more involvement off the call. Okay, that sounds fair enough. That's certainly I think something that council and very briefly discussed. And once we have the new appointments made, you want to do and then seeing what are some of the areas. So so thank you. Any other questions? All right, well, thank you for your service and I appreciate you applying. Of course, thanks guys. Appreciate your efforts in your time as well. Next is Sydney, Justin Palmer. Sydney. Yeah, you're interested, Sydney and serving on the dog park committee. Is that right? Yes, I'm trying to get my camera going here. Have you served on that committee before? Is this a new brand new? Oh, good. Yeah. There we go. Yeah, and I just I mean, I guess I've been interested in serving in some capacity in the community for a while now, but we have a Husky puppy that desperately needs a dog park and the one at Farrell is and the one over in Burlington just really don't always fill it. And we've been waiting for, you know, a long time for the one to be developed. I guess at Wheeler over at the corner of Swift and Orson. And there was a sign up there. I went by to just see if there had been any progress made and there was a sign and says, you know, friends, the dog park call this. Go to this email site and so I went to that and that just put in an application for the committee just to see what happened. I'm just I'm interested in just helping get the thing built and get in whatever way I can to get things moving. I guess I have a few ideas about how that might happen. I'm not that familiar with the history. I understand it's a very long complicated history with the dog parks. I was very impressed with what he was saying about his experience with the dog parks and the issues about trying to build on what we have and maybe not so much focus on acquiring land. I don't know, I'm open to ideas, but I just want to see things get done. Okay. Okay. Any other questions people have? I don't think so. If there are any questions you had of me, you know. No, I think we're going to be back. Thank you. Thank you very much for applying and we'll get back to you. Yeah, thank you. Thanks for the iteration. I appreciate it. You're welcome. The next step is Peter Taylor and he is interested in continuing on the city charter committee. Thank you Peter. I've been on it for 30 years I think. You're that old? I think you all know me. I try to give you an easy way to move me on if you think it's time. Because I've done this a long time, but I'm more than happy to continue and help out if I can. Okay. Well I'm more than happy to have you continue. I think your historical perspective is needed and we keep talking about different changes that we think might be worth pursuing. So maybe we can give the charter committee some work. Good. That's worth something. Okay, well thank you for your years of public service and I look forward to having you continue on the charter committee. Thank you. Have a good evening. You too. And next up is Chuck Hackner. He wants to work with Peter. Yeah. That's why he's applying. The opportunity to serve on a committee with Peter Taylor. Chuck. You're out for being the charter committee. Excuse me. You're interested in serving on the charter committee. Is that right? Yes. This will be my, I think my third term. It's a good way to be public service. The time is not very taxing at all so far. I'm very much interested as you know in municipal government stuff. Do you have any questions? Tom has a question. Since Peter Taylor is still on an advocate, a lobbyist for cannabis sales reached out to me. I think Shane Lynn. So I think that relates to the charter vote. He's advocating for the city of South Carolina to weigh in on cannabis. I think that's under state law. The state law gives the city's opportunity to vote to approve sale of cannabis in a store in your town. That's it. It has to be a vote of the public to operate. So we would have to get it on the ballot in March or something. That's right. Well, we passed the economic development committee to look into that. They were, but I haven't seen a report. So I don't know what their discussion is. Yeah. The government finally appointed a passed early board that's going to create the regulations on how cannabis can be sold in communities. And they are yet to really begin their work. So when they get into that more deeply change them to come back to the economic development committee and work with them. So at least two years right now. But no, I don't think two years. I think this could be something that the council chooses to do. It could take for the voters in March in March, which is your next stage. Okay. All right. Next. Thank you very much. Charles Siegel and Charles is Charles Siegel. That's what it says. I don't have a sheet. I don't know. Is Charles Siegel on the call? Because we didn't in our packet yet. Well, it could be some mistake. That happens. Well, then when I move on to John Burton, he is he's an incumbent on the economic development committee and would like to continue. Hello. Hello. You can't see you, but we can hear you. Hi everybody. Hi there. My camera. You know what the job entails and you're interested in continuing. Does anyone have any questions or concerns about work so far? Please ask him about the update on the canvas. Well, yeah, what's the update on the canvas still? Well, yeah, we as a committee, we did discuss it in terms of it certainly could have some economic ramifications. But as Kevin was saying, a lot is yet to be determined on how it would be administrated. A collection of the monies and all the other issues associated with it. So we need more data before we could make any final statements. Yes, there's potential tax revenue for the city. It's depending on how it occurs and how big a role South Burlington plays in the regional sales of marijuana. It could be a substantial amount of additional tax. Pardon me? What did you say? Okay. Do you have any questions for us John? Megan has a question for you. Yeah. Hi, John. It's Megan. Hi. I was curious to know your view on remote work or the telecommuting. Well, I think there's some potential for remote work to increase populations throughout Vermont, but even more so I think in South Burlington it may have some implications to how people situate themselves in terms of working from home. It may change some of the characteristics we've seen in traffic and other aspects of it. But I had somebody I talked to down south say, well, think of the pandemic like a hurricane. Nobody gets too excited about permanent changes after a hurricane until a couple of years have gone by and then they see who stayed, who moved out and what's the new reality. So that person cautioned that we'll know more about remote work in about three or four years and not to get too excited that there's a permanent change there yet. We will see and I agree with it. Okay. Do you see initiatives in this community here in South Burlington to offer child care to their employees? I have not seen a lot of movement in that area but I think there's a lot of interest in it. So I think that's picking up steam as the whole state and federal levels have a renewed interest in child care. And actually my daughter runs a child care center in Maine and they're very animated about opportunities to expand child care, particularly affordability of child care in certain rural communities in their state and I think Vermont's got the same thing going on. So whatever creates an impediment to a good working happy workforce that employer has to address and just like employers have had to address health care, I think increasingly they're going to have to really grapple with child care in a more dramatic way. Thank you. We were certainly discussing that in the legislature 30 years ago. It was a big deal. We're going after all the big corporations to require them to create day care. So I think it's coming back that people had to stay home and drive. It is a huge factor. There's a huge impact in the supply chain. There's been this huge impact in the labor works where they can't impact the work because day care is closed. And there weren't enough eggs to go around for the problem anyway because I think a lot of day care is closed when the state changed schools. Maybe this would be an interesting issue to ask the economic development to be at a local level not make national policy or statewide policy vote now. What can we do here? Is there anything we can do? Okay. Economic development. I thought I said economic development. Okay. Thank you very much, John, for your service and your interest in continuing. Thank you very much. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. This was also on the economic development committee and would like to continue. Oh, okay. Well, she's an incumbent. We sort of know. But she would like to continue. Okay. Well, that does it for interviewing our candidates so we can move on. We're not that much yet. But I'm hoping to see the staff and update with possible action on the self burlington storm water ordinances. I'm going to join us by Oh, yeah. Hey, and David's me look great. So who wants to start off with April. Yeah. Tom, are you going to Hi folks. Yeah. Good to see you all again. Yeah. So Dave is going to handle the kind of primary presentation, describing things tonight. And I'm just here to help answer questions, provide whatever historic perspective maybe needed to kind of flesh out the conversation. Welcome to my microphone. Can you hear me? Yeah, we can hear you Dave. I have to respond to something in the chat if I could into something about my document being alarmist which was Councillor Barrett's characterization of my resolution. I did not find it at all alarmist I simply stated quotations from local state, and you end documents. There was nothing that came from the other than the therefore clauses just want that to be clear. Thank you. Okay, David. All right. So can you see the screen that I'm saying. Yeah. Awesome. Can you take it a little bit bigger. And you might. Because it's a little hard. Yeah, that's good. Many people in a big map. So, yeah, I'm going to talk briefly about the three year rule and how that impacts our ordinance. So the three year rule went into effects December first of 2020. So it's still relatively new. And what it does is it requires folks with aside permits to finally take action. And this year shows all the states for monitor permits issued in South Burlington. The green ones are all valid permits and yellow ones are all expired permits. So we have about 68 remaining expired permits within South Burlington. So this state put some on a time frame to come into compliance. Additionally, people know this summer permit as the three acre rule. So on top of the existing permits, anybody with three years of impervious shown here in red. They're also on to putting some odd treatment on site. So combining the two of those. Yeah, this is what it looks like. In South Burlington. Definitely a lot of work ahead of us who've got 46 and the three acre sites, 68 of the expired permits, and there is overlap between those numbers. They're both expired and a three acre. And then just to make it one more level of confusing. So our so modern watershed shown in purple and some folks who are outside of that, and depending on if you're inside or outside you have different requirements. For example, they're both in and out of so modern watershed. And they have safe store modern permits as well. So things can get pretty complicated pretty quick with certain sites. Other sites are going to be very simple and so forth. You know, they're just having a cycle. So, you know, up until now, we've been working proactive with folks to put in some other team on their site or upgrade their storm water systems, and then provide them with valid permit covers to our MS for permit. And we have a process for that. It's the Sufa the storm water upgrade feasibility analysis to determine what they need to do. And now with the state's three-acre effect. They kind of set a different bar, just slightly different rules, you know, all kind of same concepts. But we seem to bring our policies in line with what the state is requiring so I have a memo that I included. And it outlines things like deadlines. And let's see, different, you know, storm water treatment standards. We had a lot of references to low impact development. And the city had developed previously, but we don't really need anymore because the updates to the storm water management manual kind of cover all of that. And then additionally, you may have heard that we got approved that loan that we applied for recently to work with a bunch of the three-acre sites was recently approved by the state. So we have some money to work with some of these three-acre properties on engineering design. And so we want to include in the ordinance a formal cost sharing policy, so that way when we work with these permit holders, you know, there's, there's a formal cost sharing policy that we prefer to, especially when we're working with a bunch of people at the same time. And additionally, you know, there's a couple more changes to the ordinance, some minor things. We're going to ask to roll a handful of permits that we've already worked with into MS4 permit without requiring them to go through the SUFA process, only because they've done it in due diligence and we've done a previous that's engineering feasibility analysis and they've done the work to update their systems. So that's kind of a broad overview. I don't know how you want to approach going through the actual edits. You can just focus on the really big edits. The corrections where there was a spacing missing or something, but just the really, there's a couple big issues and if you can run through that quickly and we need to have a public hearing on this anyway, where we'll get some. But tonight, you just need to walk us through briefly on what is the big issue and purpose for this. So yeah, minor things, you know, including other people as authorized personnel. Updating the definition of the service and actually states type of stuff for capitalization corrections changing time to city. Dave, if I might jump in for a minute. Council's benefit from a really big picture perspective here we haven't updated our ordinance since late 2016 and since then. The state's done a major update to their standards sort of in 2017 they wrote a or they revised the manual on how to build stormwater treatment. And then with the issuance of this new permit that Dave mentioned, we just got to get ourselves in line with what the state rules are. I think the vast majority of what we're proposing here is that, and then the other piece where you see the most markups as you scroll through is the cost sharing policy. We sort of an unwritten cost sharing policy that has worked well for the 16 years I've been here, but felt it was time to sort of write that down for folks everybody could see it in case there were questions we could refer to something written. I would say those are the two big things to focus on. Sure. So, I just want to make sure I said you're right on you said that the cost sharing just hasn't been caught by this is currently going with current practice. So, yeah, our current practice is, you know, we'll work with the property owner and I'm generalizing here because there's a lot of ins and outs but we'll split up costs on a pro-rata share of impervious surface so if there's a pressure for development in the city owns 30% of the roads will pitch in 30% of the cost. That's the beginning of the difference from what we've done historically and what this proposes is how grant is applied. And so typically. Sorry. What is applied. We get a lot of grants we apply for and receive quite a few. And the way we've applied that previously is we'll take you know if it's $100,000 project we get a $20,000 grant. We'll split that based on impervious surface. The big change here, what this does differently from how we've done in the past is the city gets a lot of these grants we do all the management. We're looking to apply those grant funds to the city's share of project costs first, and then the remaining dollars would go to our project partner, whether that be a home on association or in the case of the three acre site commercial or whatever it might be. So that is that is a shift a little bit from what we've done historically. Okay, so I mean, I'm having a little part time. The shift is that if the city receives a grant, it's used to fund our portion. And we don't sort of share that grant with the owner. So we're going to apply it to the city's portion first in what's proposed here. We have a $100,000 project, and we're on the hook for 30% of that 30,000, and we get a grant. We would first apply that grant money to our share. And, you know, that would go with the rest of the 20,000 that's left over in this example would be applied towards. But if we're only going to grant the 20,000, then would any money be shared with would that just go entirely to the city or we proportionally give any of it to the. That would first apply to the city's portion. So if it's, you know, less than our share, that would only go in that example. And again, in mind the idea for this is that we do a lot of work to change, manage, etc. You know it's the cost of free money as I say we do a lot of tracking. Grants are lengthy, as I recall, and take time to fill out so. 50% of the project. So, which usually enough, you know, to the property owner as well. Megan has a question. I saw a language about pesticides and I was curious. This might not be the place for it, but I still wanted to. Is there any latitude on the part of the city to say no pesticides in our store water. As opposed to it needs to be disposed of according to the instructions on the model or whatever. Megan, I think what you're referring to is sort of what can get discharged into the public stormwater system. Language edits are pulled straight from the permit issued to us by the state of Vermont, which is a federal permit that comes down and they administer. So that's why those changes are in there with Dave's that highlighted here. We simply say no pesticides. Is that something the city could do. I think it'd be a new enforcement issue at that point. How would we enforce something like that. And this might not be the ordinance for it, but is it might not be you that I need to ask this question to why is it possible for the city to say no pesticides. So, you know, portion of the language here. Discharge on to the storm drain. I think the more appropriate action to play that the application to the law, in which case I don't think this would be the right ordinance for that. Thank you. There was another issue the way just like to dealt with about 30 years ago we focused on golf courses. I think we have a lot of attention to this section here. We previously had all sorts of different requirements for different folks, going back to this map, depending on where you're located, you had to do something or another. And we just kind of eliminated all those different options and streamline it. And now everybody has to go through the super process. And we would go to requirements to the student document and eliminate them from just the ordinance itself. So this is really the whole MS for coming into play. Right. I mean, we're talking about it for a long time and self growing to working on it right Tom, but now it's correct. Yeah, much of this is driven by our MS for permit. And again, for folks that may be newer to kind of the complicated world storm water that we have here in Vermont. The MS for permit contains a lot of other requirements like flow restoration plans, phosphorus control plan. So all that stuff is sort of under that big heading for us that's our big permit. And then we have to do, you know, these six minimum measures, then all these other large projects to reduce phosphorus to reduce flow stream flow during larger storm events and then things of that nature. I have a question. So what you need from us is back to the beginning. I need to set a date and time to set a date and time for a public hearing. And you would like it again. For our first regular meeting in July, the public comment possible approval. You will Tom you will not be here. So is that correct. Yeah, so we have our first hearing tonight if counselor any comments or questions, and then kind of the follow up the second reading. We'd like to get on the first regular meeting in July. And I think that there's the timing as required by the charter. Is that the national the federal holiday. So we'll have to be July 6, Tuesday. Okay, so I would entertain a motion that moves the amendment to ordinance regulation, regulating these public and private areas, sewerage and stormwater systems and the stormwater upgrade feasibility analysis be duly warned for a second hearing on July Tuesday, July. Okay, I'll make that motion. All in favor. Thank you very much. Good night. Social service funding is more fun. Okay, great. So, yeah, just it's really Helen a reminder that there's $15,000 in the council budget for social services for this clear 21. So actually, you have to take tonight, but I want to give you some some options in terms of how confused if you don't think action tonight or at the next meeting, then you just have to decide you want to approve the money or not spend it. We just have to know what you want to do with it. So, there's a couple of options there that I'm sure you've looked over and happy to help guide. I have a question for the council having spoken with Lisa furniture, many times about the lack of resources that the community justice center, you know, really struggled under for many, many years. Does it make sense for us to put these resources to the community justice center. Because it's in total in total. We know that the soft rolling to food shelf is doing quite well with the gifts from the trader Joe's and healthy living asking you just want to up to the full dollar and other other establishments. We are already supporting Howard mental health through our outreach. I mean clearly, you would love to perhaps consider common roots but we have been working with them up at the wheel or homestead where they're getting a certain portion of the people getting 20 they're getting that portion. Yes, many events. I started a fund for the steps to end domestic violence I should certainly follow up and do more education on that to get more money going into that but I did start that up. I think this is a strong intervention to a lot of things. United Way is a huge umbrella. I just need a very clear that their offices not have a lot of the it's really a shoestring budget. I would love to. I mean she supports aging well or age well she supports cost she supports all of these services through her through, I mean, who will replace her supporting. I just want to put that out there. Yeah, I think it's a great suggestion I'm just not sure how that would affect her grant funding. She's totally grant funded for everything that she does. We're really the fiduciary for the CJC there's no city money. Even, even, even though you see things on the warrant, it's all run through a special fund. So there's no taxpayer dollars that on the CJC staff and everything that she does is all through a state grant. I would also say that the succession plan is not fixed yet. We're not exactly sure what the next step is going to be at the CJC. There are state funding requirements that are in play here and they may push us towards some form of consolidation with other CJCs in the area. But ours has always taken the lead. I mean, it's not going to. Always. They're others. So, you know, we agree, but I agree. So saying any more about that, we're doing some research on what the obligation might be as it relates to grant. I think this funding is with this money may not be the right thing to do. Okay. Well, given what maybe suggested though, is there. Well, I guess there's two things on the table. We can just decide. This isn't the year to give any money to anybody through it for next year. Or just month's minute, right? Or you made some good cases, I think about some of the decisions that we made on it a year ago. Yeah, if you recall that several years ago, we went through this process, we had like 40 organizations. I know, I know. We went down to a very small number and gave them more money. Exactly. And I think that those organizations that didn't receive contributions were disappointed, but the ones that remain, we focused on health and human services that were specific to celebrate. And I think they really appreciate this help that we give them. And I think it would be a bad decision to not continue that this year. I would agree. Okay. Is it $15,500 or $15,000? We have a budget of $15,000. We spent $15,500 because we added some extra money into the net fund. So instead of the $2,000, we went $2,500. Two steps. Well, what is your pleasure? I certainly like everything on this list. Oh, I do too. We went through it. Yeah, do we send it this year? That's the other question. Okay. So where do we take the $500 out? I would take it out of the United States. I think I'm going to take it out of the good shelf just because I think they got doing the wrong brand from Jeff Reisos. Oh, that's. Oh, that went to the state. But the foundation for the child was going well. Very well. Well, and, you know, we just have $14,000 from helping living. And they continue to just round it up again the other day. So I assume they're continuing for self growing to. So, I mean, if we need to make it 15,000 even, I guess that's where I might take it just. Do we not have the extra $500? You can do it either way. Council wants to show. All right. So do what you need to take $500 away from the future. They have other means. That's fine. Well, I'm okay. Just letting me get over my property or not. There is money for that. If there's money for that, you know, didn't we tell these people what we were hearing them? They basically have been told because we have the budget for recent fall. So they never saw this. This isn't a public document. Will they start for F. Oh, the F. 20 allocation. Oh, I see. So this is for F. 21, we're just going to do the same. Okay. Well, I'm fully of the extra $500. I would go for it. Okay. Okay. So. You need a motion or. No. You've got our. Great. Thank you. Are there any reports from counselors on committees? Did you want me to talk about the. Environmental court. Where we are. Is there an update that would be, you know, just what. We wanted to make it really brief. So we can. Are there any other committee. It was just part of the deadline for it going to the action. Special order. The word for it. Something order. Anyway. Okay. It's late, but. Ella and I went. We wanted to make it really brief. So we can. Are there any other committee. You all receive. You all receive that we submitted. I forwarded to everybody. It was just part of the deadline for it going to the action. Special order. The word for it. Something order. Anyway. Okay. So. So. We met with our cargo and had a tour of the facility. I mean, early, you've got to see the presentation, but. There's some interesting stuff going on there. They are eating the crap out of electric motors to ensure their reliability, which is a part of the FAA. So they're refining that technology. We talked about availability of rare fruits. Magnets, you know, and supply chain props and they have semiconductors and circuit boards. And. They have their, they have to protect. One outside. Doesn't have the hover. Props on yet, but they also have a helipad. With they've taken ship containers and repurposed them into. Small apartments or rest areas for pilots. And we have a charging station for. Yeah. What is the charge of it? We all visit data because I didn't get an invitation to. Yeah. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry for this. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. To that end. My own. Was screwed up. So he never got it. I couldn't deliver it. So I was having trouble. Delivering things to people today. I have my phone. So I'm sure. back with my grandson's and a son-in-law this summer. We're going to simulate it. They were working on it, so or something. Can we bring guests? I think they want to focus on your role as a housewife. This was just an add-on. I said, oh, can I come back? Can I bring someone in there? Art said, yes. And you went earlier. Yes, yes. It's pretty phenomenal. OK. Just in case you record Nova, Nova had a segment a couple months ago about electric flight. And you could probably stream it to it. It gives you a great background in the most recent technological developments for that. The effort to try and move away from fossil fuels for air for flight, for a number of reasons. One, the reliability of the aircraft, and the second thing being the reduced maintenance cost. Because you have to tear down and rebuild gas engines and airplanes and turbines like for somebody 1,000 hours. And it's very, very costly. So it's quite a deal. And they moved into their new digs upstairs. I mean, it's just the whole concept. They've been trying to get a lot of extra time. Now it's snazzy, I would say. Kind of like a new place to work. And half the employees at work, which I thought. Nice. OK. Any other councilor, committee assignment visits? Report? OK. Say that I'm now officially on GMT's board. OK, great. They probably have snacks. OK, item 15, convene is a liquor commission to consider a higher ground annual license permit. So I'd like the motion to create or go into a liquor control board. All in favor? Aye. OK. We have one higher ground. I move to approve a higher ground application for its annual entertainment license permit. Any discussion? All in favor? Signify by saying aye. Aye. Move to come out of liquor control board. Second. All in favor? OK. Other business, we have the dog car. Can we just simply put that on a future? I thought we have an applicant tonight, which is wonderful. I don't know if the next meeting in June would be good. OK. We'll find a time. I want to make sure that we have time, because we'll be working on the global warming resolution. So that's good. Yeah, I don't know who you are. OK, so we will add that. Item 17 is going to executive session to consider the applicants for appointment to the self-promoting board's commission committees in a deliberative session. Yes, we did. Yeah, so I'll move that we go into executive session. All three of you. The city manager, Kevin Dorn, deputy city manager, Tom Hubbard, incoming city manager, and director of planning and zoning honor to discuss and consider applications for appointments to self-promoting board's commission committees. So I can hold it in a deliberative session. I mean, you could possibly come out to a appointment. Or do we need to have any to vote on that? Do we have to come back down here to the food you can order? Yeah, OK, we'll wait until we issue a vote. So the motion is to go into executive session. I'm seconded. We won't be coming back. Sue won't be here in accounting reports. All right, all in favor? Aye. Well, I think this first night was OK with this stuff. I don't want to get sore neck.