 Yeah, um, I got no idea how long this is gonna take I think I said to rag like oh, you know It's a two-hour movie it should be and I was like no I shouldn't even I shouldn't even Look a joke, you know you you have a Host of a podcast going through movies sometimes you'll feel that you'll be like I'll I'll make sure I get some notes ready chronological ones to make sure Yeah, you have a through line And um through line Hmm. Yeah, huh. Yeah, wow imagine imagine having a through line a series of sequential events that occur and Drive the plot forward in a meaningful interesting way that you could follow reasonably. Yeah, great That's cool. We should have a podcast where that never happens All right, so let's go in public Beautiful oh I've seen plenty of people in the disco being partially excited for this because a lot of them are like I thought it was pretty good apparently. They don't like it. All right Yeah, if you like this you're wrong You have to say it's Right, but it's still because I think they're it doesn't surprise me at all. The twist is like smooth is really fun It's like yeah, I know why you saying that I know I know because That's because Twitter Film Twitter in particular. They don't actually care about writing Characters they don't they don't they say that they care, but they really don't deep down I mean, I think that they do Interesting question will be for as much praises film as getting how many people will be talking about it in two months to When thought you know when Thor comes out how many people are still gonna be talking about dr. Strange Well, I mean I guess I'm just I'm just putting that out there is like I can I can see them saying the fucking This is the only movie in the MCU the rest of them are just sludge this one had visuals I've already seen someone say this is the first one to have a visual style Since Guardians the galaxy and I was like So the faces of the directors of No It is funny though because you see some people who go to the point of watching the movies in the MCU And they're like what about all these shots from all of these movies literally every single one of them And they're like yeah, shut up Remember dr. Strange is a movie Where the visuals are kind of like mind-blowing at times like that I remember being talked about when it came out people like fuck did you see the visuals in When they're fighting In the mirror when they went in the mirror dimension in New York There were tons of cool visuals there lots of cool trickery and perspective shots like trick You know playing around with perspective, but everybody forgets that film exists and like I've seen those screenshots Eternals has got some gorgeous stuff in it, right? But like nobody cares about that move and nobody remembers that movie actually came out I think it's Well, I mean it's kind of the thing with Marvel films is the half-life in terms of their relevance and discussion is so short It's the full life at this point Nobody even mentions it's Well, that it's just it's kind of gone by the time the next project is out and the way that Marvel works now There's like a new thing out every month Yeah, and it's mentioned only now because everybody's using that as opposed to dr. Strange. They're going well dr. Strange is better than the Eternals Yes, it is The piece of in the Eternals. Yes It's not like a shark gary's get difficult to figure out what's on the bottom of the wrong now, okay? We've got too many people eating to get this They're all battling They are it's it has been an interesting little era right of face for because there has been very much a lot of battling for For that spot I was gonna say Bob mother barrels like it's more so under the barrel you move the barrel away, and you're like, what's what's down here? Hey, what's I got here the hell cockroaches that are living under the barrel when you yeah Horribly mangled corpse. Oh, I forgot about that one. Oops. Oh my god. It's yeah, I don't know even the current and it's like it's like Whenever I even think of the MC as a concept It's immediate like clown music in my head and then I'm just like what it used to be once Upon a time it really did used to be a position of like this will be really cool Great concepts for like a film series at least I think in terms of there's so much narrative potential You've got so long to work with you know, you're marrying long-form storytelling strengths with blockbusters. It's really cool But this is not a perfect word Yeah, the opposite. It's the shitty. This is the multiverse and it's the bad one We're throwing it away at the beginning of this but next week's e-fap will indeed be a moon night breakdown the finale Was hilarious It was it was legitimately Okay, so the issue was that I saw so the last three things I saw the moon night finale Fringies video on why endgame is shit and then dr. Strange triple trouble Wow, you're not including the two movies we watched yesterday. Oh Fucking hell For those who wish to get some porn Excitement. Yes myself and rise were invited to a watch together of a movie that is essentially porn with Jay Longbone It was an experience You will see them at some point on her channel presumably I Normally watch porn alone, but it was nice that Jay Longbone invited us in particular to watch it alongside We were really invested in the plot line. We were just waiting for the plot. We actually were getting annoyed. It's like stop showing boobs I don't see the plot There was so much sex and it was it was just it was excessive And I was very upset at that and it takes a lot of sex for me to go hold on Let's hold it right there. All right. Oh, yes, you you there. I oh But to answer your original question, which was the I don't think it was a question I think it was just just the topic of moon nights finale boy. What the fuck was that? That was terrible Yeah, we'll have plenty to discuss in the moon night Let me say when I was sold on the the premise of moon night and you know in terms of like a more Self-contained smaller steak story. I was not expecting a kaiju fight in the finale. All right. Oh Man, I'm looking forward to watching that. Oh Yes, oh, oh, yes, I I said There's like a really small chance that we wouldn't be able to get through all of Doc stranger than the time limit for a stream It's like I'm pretty sure we'll do it crack record shows pretty sure Moon night six episodes up an hour piece like whoo that that one could scared it close Yeah, I could but we did like To get you know, but we'll do it We'll do it for the following week is halo, which is nine episodes and on those like 15 minutes a piece So, um That one's gonna be tough. We might even end up having to split that in two. I don't even know love to see We can get our guests to come back the second time Hey, we did it for the arc with the with us the twitch reactor, isn't it? Well, I'm okay. I was so we lost one person per stream on our cane What's important we did we made it together we bonded in a deep emotional way It was a journey and we made it through but at the end of the arcane e-fabs. We were happy. That's the difference Yeah We talked about something we liked I Suppose we should start with a little blurb from everybody to give a give the audience a basic understanding of their Perspective of the movie as a whole I would like to go last No, therefore It's a it makes so much sense for me to go last considering where I am in the in our little cast here because Numerically, it just works so well So now we're thinking about who should go first and you know, what should we do this for the first time ever? Who would like to go first? I'd like to go first Wow So there we are rags. What did you think of doctor strange in the multiverse of madness? I got my ticket. I went to the theater 1030 poem I always like to go to the last showings because generally they're not as busy and Went in I could go home and just sleep or whatnot, but wow what a film what a film It it seems like a cliche when you say People might say what do you mean? It's the worst thing in the MCU. You say that all the time Well, the answer is because that keeps happening Something can be the worst thing and then something else can dethrone it You know and be the new worst thing and it can happen multiple times. So please believe me Dear viewers when I say that doctor strange in the multiverse of madness It is the worst thing in the MCU. I am pretty I think I'm fairly confident in this Now one advantage however is that this is like the fourth worst thing in the MCU So I'm kind of numb to it at this point and I don't know if I could feel angry anymore But I do think this is the worst movie in the MCU Shows and everything included. I guess me Yeah, I think so Loki is giving it a run for its money It's between those two. It's between Loki and this but I think I think it's argument can certainly be made It is a film the the only things that I liked about it where there were some neat visuals and some of the music was neat But apart from that, I didn't like anything I didn't like really any of the characters the plot was an absolute mess to the point where you might even Forget that there is a plot and you're just sitting there in your chair looking at a screen waiting for the next neat visual to happen Because that is all that this movie has to offer. I think there is no Dissernable at least maybe we'll explore it through the stream I could not discern a particular through line for arcs for any of these characters. I Could not discern a sort of theme or message it was a jumbled gargled mess of Just it's just a stew of awful mess And I and I hate it. I really do I do hate it But I just don't think I have the energy at this point to get super upset and angry at it And I just wanted someone said you guys are so miserable with your obsession with plot The fist thing rags criticized was characters just saying yes So the way that my I maybe I could maybe there's a way to change this I'm not sure I don't think there is But my brain isn't it's not full of just these binary switches that I can manually flick on and off Or I can start caring about things and stop caring about things. That's not quite how the psyche functions When I'm watching a movie like because I'm not going to call this a film when I'm watching a movie like this I I just I don't have anything my brain can't latch on to anything There's nothing for me to grab on to and care about caring imply some level of investment that I have in something and When it doesn't work at a fundamental level and I feel like the people who make it don't even care and when I feel like it's It's just broken at every level. There is nothing for my brain to latch on to and to care about and I wash my hands of that responsibility. I can't do it. It's there's nothing there for me to care about if all Of the character if like a nuclear bomb just went off and every character died. I'd just be like, okay Well, what happens next? Because I just don't care There enough who would like to go second I'll go second. Oh shit. All right, Gary. Let's do it. What do you think of the movie? well as As the person who is totally openly anti-woke and I am freely willing to be called a misogynist because I don't give a Wet Kevin Feige shart about anything this But I'm as dumb as I am I'm I'm smarter than this this I won't even call it can't be called a movie It's content or content. I don't fucking know I'm tired of sitting through these Marvel The these projects these products and it's like over processed Product that you can tell that there's a bunch of studio notes And I am a huge fan of Sam Raimi and I'm gonna forgive him for this I think this is at the end. I'm sure you guys noticed or maybe you walked out at the end of the film It was called a Kevin Feige production. Yeah, I was weird at the end I thought that was new ish. I didn't realize if that had been done before And now everything that's happened since I noticed it with Moon Knight and this and I was like I don't remember seeing this before but he's making sure we don't now Yeah, I think it's the first movie. Yeah, I didn't notice it in Hawkeye I noticed it in in Moon Knight and especially made me forget how to read so I didn't I didn't So I got tickets to the three o'clock show And it was pretty it was pretty empty. It was nice nice comfortable theater My wife was pissed. She's usually pretty happy to go to superhero film She was checking her phone and on eBay or whatever about ten minutes in couldn't stand the film It's it's a hot mess. We were talking you guys were talking about through line in the beginning And I'm not saying there was a through line in this film But if there was a perceived through line, it didn't go through the main character. It went through Wanda This was a follow-up to Wanda vision, which wasn't good And it wasn't a good follow-up to a not-good show and it was a follow-up to a show that I don't think the filmmakers watched And it was just things happening. It was just events happening there and I'm I'm like you guys I like characters first. I have to get invested into a character and You know having dr. Strange not being the sorcerer as a Marvel Comics fan having dr. Strange not be the sorcerer supreme When we get I guess when we get in the spoilers. There's one event that pissed me off the most Which I should piss off every Marvel Comics fan I don't know why it's like one of the dumbest creative decisions I've seen since not putting Han, Luke and Leia together in a scene. Joe's funny. You said that I was like Oh, it's probably this the river was like no, no, he's probably talking no way it could be one of these seven things Yeah, give you a hint spaghetti, right, right. Oh, I know So yeah, we'll get to that Yeah, yeah, it's it wasn't about dr. Strange America Chavez was the girl who was the key to everything her origin was I laughed out loud when they showed her origin And I was aware of it from the comics and by the way the comics have retconned that origin already So that origin doesn't exist in the comics anymore They decided to use it in the films and you know, that's what happens when there isn't a man around You know, you get stung by a bee and you lose your mom's I know and then It was and other people laughed in the theater too, it's so it is hot I think as an audience you just like wait what like you like you didn't just show me that did you but again There's way more than one instance of that reaction to be had about the things they choose to have happened in this movie Your power is lesbian Total mess you could tell like half of this thing or more no 80% was reshot you can tell And it was boring. It felt two hours America Chavez didn't add to the movie at all Wanda's whole story was illogical and retarded And they they even pointed out within the film and they have no answer for it whatsoever And I predicted the end of Wanda when I heard she was gonna be in the movie and I'm not the only one By the way, there was like for their guys I know of who predicted that Wanda would end up defeating herself at the end because we can't have Doctor Strange fighting a female villain. It was the same with Ragnarok So we're seeing just patterns repeat and plus I saw this movie like after I've watched like right after I watched the finale of Moon Knight So it was like Moon Knight working on my Moon Knight review go to Doctor Strange And I watched Picard and it's like it's all the same thing Yeah, I really wanted to bang my head against the wall and just give up man. You watched Picard too. Oh gosh You're just in a content heaven. You should be watching Halo show just to finish it all out Why not? Why not? Maybe that will end it all So safe to say nothing's very good there There's like a couple of scenes that like felt Raimi that I was like that's cool You know when she came out of the gong stuff and if you if you'd have done more of that Maybe I would have liked it, but other than that it didn't look like a Raimi film I you guys were talking like like this had a style. No, it didn't have a style as The Marvel shit style if that's a style there were parts in this where I felt the style there were there were parts I'm willing to say it's more visually interesting than Whatever the neutral is for MCU, but I don't know yeah, it was I could see like the Sam Raimi in it Yeah, you know when it popped up and I was like, oh, that's neat And then it would just go even some choices for events Like it's hard not to see an evil book and a zombie walking around and a guy hitting himself with his hands Like it's hard to see all that and not see a certain other movie Yeah, there was a lot of the ways the camera moved and a lot of the way it was edited It was very evil dead. So that was something I knew I didn't feel Raimi's writing in this though You write a lot more hot Was the guy who wrote Loki about this movie? Exactly. That's yeah, that's kind of where I was aiming I believe it. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Oh, that's right. I forgot and I said what are the two worst things in the MCU There you go. This and Loki. Yeah, congratulations to ever wrote both of those. You're doing great It's this and Loki a massive gap and then whatever is third Well, and so a lot of people saying yeah, he didn't write it I'm saying yeah, but I didn't feel it either And what I'm trying to imply with that is that when you're a director a lot of the time your Let's call it your influence will seep into the script just by nature of you being the ones filming But I don't know I didn't I didn't really get the sense that I was Seeing a script that even had his influence in it. Oh, we can go we can go through that Yeah, well, that's they don't really take notes from creatives No, I've got an absolute confirmation of that. They just don't Yes, Kevin's Kevin fight. He's highway and they're just on it. That's it All right, then who wishes to go third so you loved it great next I can I can go next if you want the third of course I I Give you these silver platters all the time without even noticing and just just works just works so yeah before I even Bought a ticket. It was like I'm having really low expectations for Well, that's just the norm now. I guess just having low expectations for everything media And I got my ticket and it's Wednesday. It's like yeah, it's nice weather outside You have a bicycle ride to the cinema. I mean, how bad can it be, right? I raise your bike to the cinema. Yeah, it's looking nice. Yeah, it's like a nice little puff Yeah, it's really really really chill some exercise always good. Hmm. There you go there and get something to drink Sit your ass down in the cinema and then you start watching your things like, okay. There's some colors there We're going to this thing. Oh, there's portals. Oh We're going here. Oh, there's like Other people. Oh one does he okay? Okay. It's over now. She killed herself or something And then I went out of the cinema. It's like I Feel nothing That's like this this this feeling of okay. I just watched something but I I did not gain anything from this And I wasn't even sure yet. It's like was it awful? Was it like? Was it just sludge and it is sludge is MCU sludge And then I wrote my bicycle bag do little thinkings like There's some tisms there and there and then I arrived here started making notes for the forge that I did the next day And I started writing and then I noticed more things and it gets worse and worse And worse then I do the forge the next day find even more things while talking about it Which we will probably all get into and I'm sure after that. This is over There's probably going to be 10 times more things that I didn't even notice because I Probably have the least context because I didn't watch a lot of shows like okay before this Only knew like oh neither did the people who made it. Don't worry. Yeah, you'll be yeah I heard about that. They watched like half the show apparently or something uh So yeah, it's it's it's pretty awful. It just gets worse the more you talk about it. So yeah That there you go. It's awful. All right Between springy and meme I'll go So so so I was already pretty concerned about this In the lead up when I saw who was writing it um, but you know my first Because I wasn't I was trying to avoid leaks for the most part. I like to go in fresh for these things um But uh, my first like solid like Uh-oh scoop moment With how this is going to turn out was um, you know, I occasionally look at like the more the trashier outlets I see what their reviews are like because I find sometimes When you look at the trashier outlets, you can actually kind of tell what you're in for just by their reaction So IGN's review of this. Um, the thing stood out to me was that they Said this is IGN. By the way, this is these are the people who pretty consistently have dog shit takes They said in their review, which was still overall positive, but they said I I just hope next time around the script is a bit tighter Such biting criticism from IGN. Damn. I can't believe it Yep, so I was just like, okay, gotta gotta put that through the translation machine. Oh Oh, no Oh, no You know, it just starts coming out say one of those old timey like teleprompter Oh, no Just piles of paper going up. So let's let's just talk about what I liked first because it's going to be very brief The There are visuals in here. I thought we're nifty. I think Sam, you know, a lot of there was a lot of evil dead in this and I like evil dead I like Sam Raimi in general. Uh, he's he's a pretty big inspiration for me Um creatively. So I saw I saw the DNA of Sam Raimi in here I saw some visuals in there that was just like, uh, I want to steal that at some point for something good, but What what we got was not good. Um, there were certain ideas certain themes that if you extract them If you wash them off If you just cleanse them, they might be neat elsewhere But uh That's about it because you see movies are not visual are not just visuals They're not just ideas in isolation. They're not just You know series they're just not they're not just a bunch of events stapled together. There's supposed to be a a story a series of events that are that have a through line and characters that are actually um coherently written and consistent and um The thing I just described as What a story is which is what is important for a film this film did not have and A lot of this is a lot of this film just felt like it was a film by The merit of it being in a theater. Otherwise, it was a series. It was a series of images flashed in my face a lot of them infuriating um and I kind of just left the theater completely apathetic just because I've It was just like oh, yep. Well, you know, here's another Marvel phase four product. What else could I expect at this point? So so that was my experience with the film Well, nothing but praise so far. I'm just curious if free will be the controversial or something seems very divisive Yeah, yeah a lot of yeah I will say because there's so many people in chat that I'm seeing it's like not only is this film not been out That long but a lot of people may not even see it because there's waiting for us to talk about it So we will be trying to engage this weird version of spoiler mode where We only talk about what we've covered in the in the movie up to that point This whole stream will spoil the entire thing Hopefully chronologically and hopefully in a way that when I summarize pieces as we go through that you will actually be Horrified by the events I describe much like drinker and drunk 3po were when I was telling them about some of the things that happened on Open bar. They didn't believe me. Uh, you can ask as he was there some of the answers I gave they were just like why the fuck would they do it that way? And it's like, yeah, that's a great question. Excellent question. Um, anyway Green, what did you think of the multiverse of dr. Strange madness and the madness? The madness is ours Dr. Strange in the multiverse of madness is nonsense. It's like pure abject nonsense Everybody and everything in that story comported to what scenes they wanted That seemed cool or like an idea that they wanted to follow through and and the consequence of that is that you just leaves everything in tatters I like the characters in this film I mean if we're talking about the main characters thoroughly obliterated, um like wander man And dr. Strange has like three or four arcs running all at once and none of them really tie together into something cohesive Some of them don't even really make a lot of sense Um, nobody's kind of behaving as they really ought to there's like a lack of acknowledgement persistently about what is really happening Uh, we have to just ignore Relevant questions that need to be asked of the characters because the answers are really obvious But the film isn't over yet. So we can't have those Um, I don't really know how it's possible to have any level of investment in the magic side of the marvel The mc anymore Because I don't know what anybody's capable of at any given time Like what their capacity to affect the world is what abilities they have access to um I And in terms of like world building I don't know. I don't know how in the world we're meant to move forward with like an understanding of the multiverse or how These universes interact with each other what like magical books or MacGuffins exist out there in the multiverse what they can do how these universes interact with each other um It's very much a film where I think the the things that I could praise about it are stemming from like cinematography interesting visuals um framing some parts of the soundtrack but I mean otherwise This is a pretty textbook example of and then and then like an and then story um Yeah, I I I don't like it Um, okay, well that just leaves me uh, I Uh went into the the old cinema, um Made it made a bit of a day out of it was going to go sort of shopping for some stuff do some different things um Before having seen it Uh, a parent of mine was asking, you know, oh, is excited. I was like, no Oh, no Yeah, they they're like, why would you what I was like? Well Thing is and you'd know this if you uh, you tune into the old real bbc weekly on as and gary's channel We've uh, we've had a few discussions here and there about potential spoilers through leaks here and there Some stuff that looking back. I can't believe it. I remember when I first talked to you guys about the potential for Let's call it the spaghetti stuff happening and um, I remember Being met with like a confusion and a sort of like no Like that's a lot of people in the audience were like, why the hell would they do that? um So, uh, yeah, I I told this parent I was like if the leaks are true then we're gonna be getting something terrible But it's okay because this is a movie and leaks could be wrong. I'll go in and I'll I'll do whatever I come out And they were like, uh, oh, how was it and I was like so much worse than I thought it could be I didn't even think we could get to these levels, but here we are. Um, I think I put a tweet out saying I've never seen something suffocate itself with such a hatred of the concept of continuity before this film cannot for a moment Like maintain anything it just shits on itself constantly It's a very strange thing to watch like every character has to keep forgetting the realities of everything they've set up Be it rules from other films that they're drawing from rules from the tv shows that they've drawn from rules they've made up for this film or Rules that we've always assumed to be true that are just suddenly like no, that's just not how that works We've definitely got a hyperspace kamikaze moment in this film possibly several we'll go over it um Yeah, and uh, I was about halfway. Oh, that's just the name for it now And uh, I don't think I was even halfway through the film before I was like So this is easily one of the worst things in the MCU already. This is uh catastrophic and you know I I we went over it on our little story e-fab I value continuity. I think is what I said at the core And I genuinely think this is one of the the biggest examples I've ever seen of a movie just being like, you know what continuity's lame I'm gonna do my own thing like okay. Let's see how that works didn't work That's a big spoiler I suppose so Yeah, it looks like our cast wasn't exactly happy with it However, I have seen a lot of praise for this movie a hell of a lot and for those who even agree Which there's there's not always that many for those who even agree that it is nonsense They will describe it as like a great charm of the movie Like that's fucking fun guys. Do you not have fun? I've already seen several people in chat be like, oh great So the funnest movie in the MCU and they they they hate it. I'm just saying you're like, yeah Fun in different ways Does everybody have fun with the spaghetti and all the screams as all of these I'm sure they're having fun with that. Yeah About the memories screen whatever the hell that was that was fun. That was dude It's non-stop this funny if someone was like, oh that part of the movie I'd be like all of it. It's we got so much to talk about all of it um I don't even know how this will go in terms of a pacing for an e-fax It's just it's gonna take a while to talk through fucking all of the things Um, I've also seen it was a very curious tweet Um From a creator that said one of the things he's seen some people say is that this film was like almost impossible to follow It was crazy nonsense It was a mess He said it's the weirdest criticism because the film is quite simple and easy to follow If anything it can't even be a mess like it's not got the potential to be a mess And it had like 5000 likes and I was like people really think that that's amazing That the film can be so simple that you can't screw it up Not even just that but this film is simple. It was like this one I mean this is the film that blows the doors open on like the marvel universe more so than any other film has Like we're talking about it definitely gives Loki a run for its money. Yeah I already worry about How we're going to explain this to people who've not even seen the film because like I said I had a taster of it on open bar and they were just like bewildered. It's like, okay You're gonna have to just take my word for it. This is what happens. I don't know Until you see it for yourself. You might not believe it. I don't I don't know um So, yeah, I mean there's no reason not to right you guys ready for us to just jump right into this movie No, let's do it. Okay. Oh, actually I can actually buy us just a little bit of time So kibikins sent me a message And it is this he said that the guests pay because for those of you don't know kibikins does the efap.me site Which is insanely good and you should all visit it often He said the guest page has been redesigned to give each person their own page And there's also a page to show people that have come on the podcast after their video was covered in these up to 21 now So we got uh, there there's aspects of those sites that have been added and you should take a Look arena Oh, that looks max cool battle commander 206 appearances. Wow, that's it 29 days. Oh my god, what's wrong with me? Yeah, that's looking sweet. Uh kibikins is a legend. Oh, that's great efap.me is continuously a source of Great information for any efap is out there who's curious about whatever it may be Um, I believe there's a link to it in every description for all these shows. So Go check it out absorb the lore if you wish Um Yeah, that's pretty cool Yeah, I love it. It's great. That's brilliant. It's like with links to the channels and stuff Amazing Uh good stuff So I think the plan is I'll I'll just do it the way we often do it I'll describe a scene and we will talk about it and well enough Um, I think I said this on either the discord or somewhere else or to someone but a lot of movies The mcu is a victim of this will eventually kick me out. You know, it's like it takes So much time and then I'm like, oh, you did the that sort of feeling Usually a good at least 20 minutes because like the opening scenes we've talked about this a lot But it's like the beginning of you setting up your continuity. You may just have a character talking Like you can't fuck that up. It'll be that you like who can fuck stuff like that up And they can usually get through quite a few scenes before it's like, oh no, here we go. We done the thing Um, yeah, I was done with this movie one minute in From the moment you see the film start to one minute. I was already frustrated. I was like, why the fuck is this happen? So, yeah, uh, I guess we'll talk about it. Um It's the multiverse of madness. So of course we see a uh, a multiversal strange running in this mysterious world with a girl That's that that's how this starts being chased by What's funny is you could call it a spaghetti monster actually but that might confuse people because we've been talking about spaghetti for a while And it refers to something very different. So I'll just say a big monster Tentacolly tendril. Yeah tendril That describes a tent. There's another one later on. Uh, this one kind of looks like it's made of paper. Maybe Papery Yeah Like they're running from it in this crazy world and um You get a benefit when you do this with movies as far as I'm concerned when you start in the middle of the action I guess you can't do the whole like wait, how are you here and it's here? How did this happen? Wasn't there ways to prevent that from and it's just like, no, no, no, no You kind of just have to go with it Uh, this will come up when we go to the other universes where certain things will have happened and it'll be like How did that happen that way though when we know bubble bun? It's like, that's what happened That's just what happened is that you got to think of whatever way you can imagine the thing happened That's how it happens. It's like, okay. I guess so Um, the first thing dr. Strange in this world does I I think we're gonna have to call him pony tail strange So people don't get confused. I think he's called defender strange. He's a stranger strange. Yeah Oh, well, I called him as strange because he talked Spanish. What does um defender strange refer to like is he Is defenders The defenders were a team originally there were a team Right after the avengers they were having my my favorite team growing up they and they would handle Like supernatural crazy shit like this and it would be a dr. Strange name or hulk silver surfer the real valkyrie And they did later Yeah, and they did a run later where he's in that costume So much later. So it's more of it's a more of a modern defender uh, they Basically, disney marvel has skipped all the good marvel comic stuff and they're just adapting stuff from when Either right before a right when they took over marvel. It was 2009 So, yeah, this the defender strange was after marvel. Uh, disney took over So they're just rushing to adapt all the disney stuff and there's rights issues behind that But yeah, this is defender strange and it looks like it looked accurate. It did well It's the interesting part of all of modern MCU it seems more than ever. They're really trying to get accurate costumes in from the comics But at the same time they don't care to adapt In any kind of like they'll adapt costumes accurately, but they won't adapt story lines Defender strange was actually in would have been much more interesting than this film um Yeah, because remember, um, electro got a that flash of his is like classic costume. Um And you know, you get lots of different. I mean this film's full of references. We'll get there. It's fine. Uh So, well, you know, uh, you know, I guess I could just describe the scene in full And then we'll go back through it a little bit. So like they're running the creature, uh Stabs dr. Strange and he traps it in like a rock thing for a little bit and then realizes that they're not Could be able to get to their destination, which is a book and so he has to kill the girl he's with and he says like we can't let it get your power and uh He tries to And he gets Movie over. Well, I was actually gonna say this is what I mean about the fact that we're one minute in and I had So many issues. I was just like there's so many things wrong. That's not even that's not even all of it Yeah, honestly, but like yeah, uh, he gets stabbed before he can sap her of the power And then she tries to go for the book He gets captured and then she panics. Well, actually, I shouldn't say that all I should say is she opens a portal and uh The dr. Strange just before he's uh, he's dead. He manages to chop out the little tentacle grabby things So that she'll fall through the portal and he gets dragged in there as well because It's like sucks you in And then our dr. Strange wakes up from what I guess we are supposed to interpret. He was watching that like as a nightmare Me that is the scene So I I mean, I'm gonna have to do this a couple times. So I'm gonna have to stop myself from talking so much But like you know comments considerations. What are the first thing that I noticed? They started spanned started in Spanish for one line each and then I guess they gave up and just Did English again? Fuck it's one of my biggest Complaints about this film Random Spanish No, randomly let's swap languages in the middle of our conversations and sentences. Yeah It's it's a real big pet peeve that they'll start in one sentence And then the other person will answer in the sentence of the the corresponding language and they'll just like swap languages We're sorry in the middle of People who are bilingual will sometimes just oscillate between different languages But I know what you're talking about you're talking about how like you have two lines that are in that language And then it just goes back to English for the rest of it and it's like Yeah, it doesn't like it's not like it happens naturally It's just like a switch where all of a sudden we are now back in English mode and we continue on that point It's not like the words blend together or maybe Someone says a word in the language that they're more familiar with if they're not, you know, something like that It's it's just like they they hit a tripwire and now it's English Except yeah, yep Except if it's uh mandarin, which they'll just uh, just make up like they did moon night Of gibberish you remember that right? So yeah, I guess they didn't trust the audience to read subtitles for like a couple of minutes until that scene is over Because there was no reason for them to change to English because it's only those two of them talking to each other That comes up later comes up later. Well, yeah, they do reference it later. So you could say this But yeah, it's all for man that the comedy in this we'll go through it. It's okay Um, so I actually thought as well another point on the dialogue. I guess it's like they're running I think what she says in Spanish is the did you will that kill it? And then he says no And then he said look over there or whatever in points And we see a big book and then she goes the book of a shanty And I and I remember thinking at the time I was like you guys both know whatever that thing is So why are you saying that is it for me? It's like yeah Yeah, um, also, I mean, oh wait that might be jump from the gun a bit I was just what is this because we don't know what this place is yet that they're in like this place that they We've had this problem before there are so many things to say But if you try and remember it's like would you have said them yet if you have the continuity we have up to this point? So do your best everybody. I don't blame you if you jump ahead sometimes. It's all good now When I saw him throw two blue spells at this thing and it froze. I was like fucking hell. That's powerful and very It freezes it dead and it's tracks buys him a lot of time And it made a spell and kill it that would have been smart I just even asked did that kill it and he's like no, no, no, uh, but it clearly Like paused it. It's done it. Why can't you stop that throw another Is that are we supposed to believe they're his only ice bolts? Only gets one He's a level five sorcerer. He only has six spell slots of level three every day until he has to have a long rest And he has to use him spare That is that will become a very recurring theme throughout this film movie sorry About the magic and how people will not use things that are clearly very effective And then they swap to using something that is not only ineffective but counter effective I don't know what you mean. Um magicians in this movie are bad at being magicians. Oh, yeah, everybody's bad at being everyone Yeah, that's true. That is true. No one's good at even being themselves Which might seem like it's not possible, but somehow they found a way they found a way Um, so yeah, I guess I'll just start was in I don't believe he would have a limit on that Dr. Strange has never had any limits on any of the spells he ever fucking casts Even the time rewind he seemed to be able to do infinitely as long as he has the time stone Like I don't so I don't know Benefit the doubt you have to say he could only fire those two ice bolts. It's just like Yeah, okay Because all you obviously all you do is just keep firing them like why the fuck wouldn't you um He also throws slicey discs a little bit later. He did not throw them earlier. Why? Because they they just totally ripped the limbs off. Yeah, they're really effective against the past Diced something like that happens like 20 minutes later as well It does man. If if I'm a Now if I was a wizard, I'm not saying that I am but I'm not saying that I'm not Um, but if I was a wizard and I was in combat like this a lot There'd be like party four or so spells that I would always just like no I'd always keep them handy in in the front of my mind I've got these things that I always know that I could kind of resort to because they're so good And I can use them a lot And um, yeah, yeah, I could make some chains and pull them or I could do this that and the other things Sure, those are neat, but they're not necessarily always going to be effective But some of these spells are just so ubiquitously useful. I need to always be prepared to cast them They're just so great to have And um, I would I would not be a good wizard in this universe apparently Well, how about the fact that he can tie this thing up And and keep it concealed? Uh, which means the america could then go get the book That seems like a pretty small way to do this. I just mean from the get-go It's like, all right, you go get the fucking book. I'll just keep it tied up and then bring me the book That just seems like the 10 seconds later she almost gets to the book while the monster is like breaking free and actually has the capacity to stop her She does that while for some reason just ignores her For a little bit but then it grabs her so it's okay, but uh, I've I've got a I've got a question I Have to stop you there because I have a question and I feel it's important I've seen Dr. Strange once or twice before. Why doesn't he just use portals to get to the book? Oh, I can explain that right? He doesn't have any though this guy I can tell you why he doesn't have anything because we are Very good faith here and we would assume that he doesn't have it because if he did have it He would obviously use that because if Honestly, right credible the way you're saying this is like you think that he did have that and if he did It would ruin the entire scene. In fact, it would ruin the entire film. So why I don't even know my own name at this point. I have no idea what you're talking about I mean, I guess is an assumption that he just for whatever reason doesn't have access to a sling ring So the way that we do this is just assume alternative dimension Dr. Strange defend a strange as you guys mentioned. Uh, he Does not have a sling ring or cannot open portals that that's just the way it works in this particular universe is that He has Yes, freezy spells. He has like the dropy discs. He has like he even has little floaty ice feet Did you guys see that when he jumps over? He doesn't do them ever again. He uses them once once again really useful, but doesn't use them ever again Uh, great job. That's great. So we what a fool. I did say what a fool. Yeah What a fool It'll be really bad if um If they establish like doc strange like a smart guy or something because I was like obviously man, um How can you fuck up so badly not only do things we know a strange should have And we go super good faiths like oh, this is a different version They don't have sling rings But then they give them something that you can use that does the that is still useful and they don't It doesn't use that as well. It's like well, you just want to say just in case The kappa face isn't coming through strong enough a lot of people in chat are like he does have a sling ring No, no, he doesn't I Doesn't go through enough You guys are stupid you guys just completely stupid it would ruin the whole scene if he had a sling ring and no spoilers, right No spoilers. So yeah, the scene's pretty bad as we've gone over already, but let's get to the bigger floors The it gets in front of them and they're like, oh boy What do we do now and there's this little period of a couple of seconds We're this fucking sorcerer who's trying to save the world as we get to understand soon enough That's a fine jump forward. Um, yeah Actually, yeah, I like how your your correction is like come on three. I said the world. It's like all of the world So, uh, yes, yeah, he he just like kind of watches it Collect itself up and then stab him and I was just like man, you probably should have Done something about that but okay Um, yeah, that's the film. You probably should have done something probably should Oh much of that in this movie a lot of just spectators sitting around them. Oh, yeah A lot of wasting time Just I felt like I was more of an active participant as an audience member than some of these characters and so Somebody should step in and do something. Jeez. I mean, I know I've got a shield and projectile blast things, but I'm just gonna watch That could do anything So, uh Defender strange is realizing that he's not going to be able to keep it controlled So he's gonna have to take america. That's who she is since in america's office, whatever He's gonna have to take her power from her to prevent the big spooky demon from taking it itself In anyone spot the problem Um, if you if like if she dies the powers disappear, right? So So just kill it like gary mentioned. That's the uh, if so just to clarify for everyone listening, right? The drama here is the you can't if you take her power. She dies. It'll kill her as a side effect I don't know how anyone knows this because she is the only america chavez in the history of the universe Which is important to restate. She is the only america chavez in the history of the infinite universe Keep that in your she is literally the most special person in all of the mcu It's more so to highlight for stuff that's plot relevant if she is the only person in the multiverse who has these abilities How does anybody know What they are in terms of like that they even exist How they operate or spells that they can use to extract that power If it's if she is the only instance of those powers ever existing and how do you know it kills her to take them? Nobody's Yeah, literally it cannot be that nobody that's the funny thing, right? It's like no someone tried it before and I died It's like Oh, while that fits in with the logic of the film. I don't think that happens in the movie But this is what i'm getting at this scene Already we've got so many fucking issues But yeah, if it's a sad reality that she has to die if you to take her powers to prevent the demon's Getty thing from getting it just kill her not only is that way faster But it means the way faster and more definitive. Um, it means the demon doesn't get him So this is yeah, it's done We're out of play complete because even if he gets them he's still at risk. So that's trying to get them It's not like It's not like anybody's gonna miss her Well, nobody even knows her except this guy So The tier two issue is the as friggin kind of just said was that if he is successful saps the power out of her she dies and then Then one of you guys like well, you've got to defend a strange with a rotting leg that's on fire and got toxic It in it, uh, who is facing a monster. He cannot beat Who then hopefully I guess has to open a portal. He says he can use the power How the fuck does he know that he can use the power? She can't and she's like the origin of the power But okay By taking your power you make it so that creature has the chance to get it from you and destroy the whole universe. So Why why risk that do you want the power? Why not just kill it? Especially if what you do is gonna kill her anyway, you know exactly there is It's gonna die. It's but why take her power as well when if you like you can just eliminate the power's existence It's it's not gonna be a problem again to deal with We start off this movie with an incredibly intelligent character who has been established to make tough choices For the greater good of the universe and beyond making one of the dumbest Non-pragmatic decisions that has absolutely no rationale behind it that ultimately could in would lead to the We got to talk about stakes with this movie because it's really kind of important And dr. Strange multiverse of madness the stakes have never been higher and I don't think they could possibly get any higher going We've reached maximum now. We used to say this before but this is actually maximum Yes, this isn't just This isn't just the universe. This is every universe that exists and it's fate and the fate of all of its denizens There cannot be more That is contained within these stakes. This is all of the multiverse. It's all things that are were and Will be like it's the stakes are All of existence essentially in all of its forms So that means that the decisions that characters make knowing this Is going to be like they're being judged on a harsher curve Because the stakes are the highest they could ever possibly be Want to address so I said the idea is that he's better at magic so he can control the power. He's never had this power The only person with it ever can't control it. Why the fuck do you think that it's a better gamble to take it than kill it? Mid-battle, no less If he can't control it, then he's fucked And al the multiverse is fucked again the stakes the multiverse everything The rationale behind the choice that he makes which would have killed her anyway was in the grand scheme You know the grand calculus of the multiverse So that's the problem you run into this character has come to the conclusion that I need to do this to save the multiverse The decision he makes is going to kill her anyway, but by taking her power It just it just it you're kicking the can down the road. You haven't really fixed anything Also, also apparently taking the power seems to take a while. It's not like it takes a while while He's trying to contain this monster. He is having trouble with while being injured. It's like what are you doing? What a stupid video game animation too. Well, yeah Again to restate the point the fact that he can even do this confuses me What is the nature of america's powers? Are they like magical? I have we have to assume that they are right They're not like science-based or anything. They're magical Well, there's magic. There's witchcraft. I was gonna say we don't actually know what it is Because universe might call it whatever the fuck it was No, I would put it in the cosmic category, which is everything else basically Which is because remember remember there's witchcraft and sorcery Totally different. Yeah, there's different. Yeah, there's It's it's all just it's not just magic and science Yeah, and if sorcery has to come up with entirely new things Sorcery has to be learned or provided through like technology like the sticks or the whatever the things they have over there Then this is more likely to be Like she's more likely to be a witch, right? I have no idea. I I don't know. I have no clue either She's she's just in this universe by virtue of her being a woman. Is it witchcraft? Um, I I don't know that that's I don't I don't know because The way I've heard it described is that witches use runes while fucking, um Sorcerous spells That's bullshit though because wander didn't use runes to make the probability hacks. So Yeah, no Like it has to be more complicated than just having runes and you telling me there's not a single rune in anything sorcerers ever do I guess not all those fun little pictures They are there's cool little images in their rings remember Got even no runes in there. All right fine fine fine. No runes are not allowed And just to be clear the the the the video game animation comment I made it wasn't just aesthetic It's that apparently it's like when in a video game you channel a spell and then it only happens Once the once the bar is done at the end then it all happens She gets multiple times in this film She'll get the power like they start to suck it out of her But if they get interrupted all as well, I don't know what I was sucking out of you during all that time When all the blue flutes were coming out of your body and then to me But I guess you get them back if I get interrupted. They just go back into you So it's it seems pretty binary where it's just off and on not you have a power that I could siphon part of Someone mentioned by the way, there were plenty of runes in his spell with spider-man in no way home Those are like runic symbols Oh We just have no idea I don't know The people who made this don't know we don't know no one knows Um, look it it's worth saying that every time Magic appears in the MCU. I understand it progressively less like dr. Strange The first one was the closest I was to understanding the magic system in this universe and even that had a load of issues in that film Um Fuckin in this film like Uh, there's dr. Strange is Summoning beasts and all kinds of different things and I'm just And all I can think is I watched what if just the night before seeing this film and It established in that because that's supposed to be canonical, right? And they established that those beastial powers are only possible when you've absorbed like a bunch of beasts and stuff But now he's just pulling them out all over the place So I what what small tidbit I've gotten are just Contradicted and again, there's what is the difference between witchcraft and sorcery? What was the difference between this kind of magic neck? It's a big plot point in this the difference between those two. We just said you're like, oh fuck How did you yeah, what fun is witch? It's like not knowing what if it's like not knowing the difference between the dark side and the light side in a star wars movie Yeah, like this is important and I don't know why is like, okay, so the lightning is dark. Gotcha I got it No, right? Force choking seems to be pretty dark. Yeah, I got you. That's bad. Well There are problems with these films smaller There are problems. It used to be a more simple time Um, yeah for the disney little problems that quick dialogue could fix. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah Just that spell again. I can't I only get to use it once boom. It's over all my lines throw I have no more energy left There are just borg. They've adapted. Yeah, that'll be another good choice showing Exasperated show him at his wit's end Show him like I just I'm expended. Um, maybe he hasn't had any sleep because they've been relentlessly pursued He has all these crazy nightmares every night. He's exhausted Yep, and you know, oh those nightmares are a window into something but oh, yeah Well, we'll get to that. I was gonna say don't worry. That one's my own We're almost four minutes ish into the film. I think when Almost done. Nice is over. So, um Yeah, all I was gonna say was that he gets stabbed with a big fucking tentacles Like knife thing through directly through his heart to the point where it's likely severed it in half And this stuff not only like it burns you and it applies toxic or whatever the fuck it's doing Like it has like this black Like a talk to it. Yeah, it's like a uh, what's it called when in a game where it just like the modifier the long term like modifier Well, that you know So he's like dead three times over but when he is tossed to the ground Luckily on this very small platform in the middle of what's essentially space but like a fantasy whatever vision We'll find out what this place is He is thrown All right, if he was thrown off into the into the abyss He'd be fucked But instead he's thrown onto the little platform And luckily for her, I'm not gonna say it's impossible Okay, if you get stabbed to the point where your heart is cut in two I think you still have a couple seconds left at least or can have seconds left He manages to get a spell off that saves her Um Thing is like I said though if you'd been thrown into the abyss like a small little spaghetti monster Uh, we we she would have been fucked. I'll be it Um seems like everyone's dumb even the monsters. Yeah Oh, yeah, there's that happens a couple. There's a there's a nice bit of plot armor in this uh throughout but This point is just like what doesn't happen um Yeah, that that's that's all I got for the scene being shit But the whole thing is a fucking mess to start with Yeah, and The the opening scene generally is a scene where we're just sort of waiting to learn more They're setting up the they're setting up something that we're gonna visit later We are learning about the world. We're learning about a character This is the hook that you're pulling us in with I shouldn't have to be racking my brain to understand everything and questioning All of the decisions that every character is making be they human or other worldly At this stage, right? Like give me a break, right? I just sat down Yeah All bad all problem Very quickly So we're talking about video game stuff. Did you like the little video game section America got there? where like a whole Under the demon like Goes up and there's like two platforms she can jump onto and then swing on the little pipe I was gonna mention it, but I guess she gets caught any well actually, you know what no she probably wouldn't have The little fuck it. Yes, like three platforms appear for her and she even uses the monster to sort of The thing is stab doctor strange to the heart. Why isn't it grabbing her? He's done toss him off the fucking cliff side. Whatever this place is grab it. I guess you can just grab it With your hands The monster. Yeah. Yeah, you can just yeah, you can just touch it. It's not like Yeah, it's a horrific poisonous toxin creature from another universe and it fucked doctor strange up by Essentially by stabbing him was like I ain't touching that. Fuck that shit. Well, she's getting anywhere near it. She's wearing gloves. Maybe Maybe in the multiverse if I would have found like some sort of weapon to assist. I don't know I mean if I mean surely if food's free in most universes surely like a gun could be easily accessible in some of them No food is free and food is free in all in our universe It's not yours. How strange So next scene is doctor strange wakes up. What's on what is framed very specifically You mentioned that he woke up from like that as a nightmare. All that happened there. Yeah, we haven't obviously nothing to say There's a shot of his watch his broken watch that he's Kept with him for a long time. That'll be representative of what I assume the the arc Yeah, we'll get there Um or four depending on your interpreting maybe four maybe four. Yeah He's he's dressed himself up. He's going to a wedding It's like, oh, okay. Uh, we don't know who it is yet. Um He sits down and it's uh, michael still bark. I think that's who he pronounced his name from uh, well I really liked him in boardwalk empire. He was fucking awesome in that He's relatively A list actor I think to the point where he's in this movie for a minute and he got the with credit He got he did he got high billing on that film which was kind of surprising when he's in for so long so little It's uh, I was I was just like wow he because I was curious who would get it and I was just like fuck he got it okay, um So he's in the first doctor strange and he's like a competing surgeon Rather than he's kind of just like he's only there to kind of be like You're not as good as you think you are that sort of character. Um He talks to uh, to doctor strange about some stuff. Um, I don't know if anyone wants to Talk anything about how about this I think that's probably what I forgot what it was. So the conversation was uh, he essentially asked doctor. He says to doctor strange Yeah, I had a pretty bad time like I think he says his dogs and also like his one of his family members During the Yeah And um, this is a strange conversation that they have tonally Um, he he mentioned he says, yeah, I you know, I lost uh my cats, which is meant to be funny, which I don't think it is I don't think that is now I wasn't like because I'm changed from cat to dog and people would because yeah Um, and also his brother and he basically asked a pretty valid question, which is the only way really really Yeah, yeah. Yeah, it's unfortunate the doctor strange is still under the impression That was the only way but maybe just telling him that to make him feel better. I don't know Well, yeah, because he says it was the only way which if there's no way there's no way when if captain marvel when she I mean if we even follow through with the whole snap and then bring everybody back when captain marvel gets there Just fly that thing into outer space. Thanos can't stop you I think I assume he's referring to an alternate way. That means he doesn't have to lose his uh, oh Well, and also why why the snap doesn't happen, which would have been to not pay to quill out on um Yeah, there's this countless ways. Dr. Strange could have prevented it, but yeah Yeah, so that guy's kind of channeling the energy that pretty much everybody in the universe should have really like really Yeah, he says he says, uh, that's all I go really for that Uh, I I assume uh rags gonna go this don't worry. I I know the dialogue So I can I'll get it out. You go for it. Yeah, in fact, you do that. I'm gonna top off my drink and you All right, uh, yeah, this was I had tonal whiplash in the scene in the in theater. I was just like what the fuck um What are you trying to do with this? So like he sits down and when I saw him I was like, oh, it's the annoying guy from the first movie and this there's already in An assumption that this will be kind of like, oh god, what's he gonna say that kind of thing? It's like, okay um And then we start in line with that with with uh, dr. Strange saying he's like, you know, I haven't seen you in a while And he was like, yeah, I was busy being dead or gone for five years And I think he even has the face of like idiot like hello I've been blipped and then um, and then he goes so was I And and and dr. Strange was like, oh You know and and and by the way that kind of uh, cut for me in terms of a tonal change It's I quite like them. I'm just like, okay. Yeah, this isn't a joke. You know, you shouldn't joke about that It's like, okay. No. Yeah. Okay. I follow and then um, you know There's like a gap and then he goes I lost both my cats And then for some reason the film thinks that's really funny and dr. Strange rolls his eyes He's just like, oh fuck. Oh, I lost my cats like okay, um That's strange. We're moving back to it being funny I guess it was only for a moment there that you might have thought it was serious But actually it is just a joke and then there's a pause and then and my brother I know we're serious again. Yeah, I was like, okay. What the fuck is happening? Is this a joke or not? And he just goes like I'm I'm sorry like thank you Bizarre it was bizarre scene really bizarre Um, yeah, I it's not even about like trying to balance the juxtaposition at that point I was just like, what are you going for? What is what is going on? And do you think they're going to just move past and start forgetting the blip because there's no way It can deal with all the consequences from it. Oh, I mean, we've already kind of reached that stage We really don't care to talk about anymore because you're right It's it's something that's it's it's a difficult It's it is admittedly a very difficult world building thing to grapple with especially when endgame is largely responsible for establishing a lot of the world building during that period Um, but you can't ignore it. It is the most it's the most important thing that would have happened like ever And you can't get past that then the the Avengers failed Absolutely Yeah, they absolutely world is terrible Cap is gone. Iron man died for nothing Well, because I really didn't need to if everything none of them needed to do anything. Yeah, they did. Yeah Oh, of course. Yeah Uh For anybody who's just a little bit confused. We'll just give you an example. So like the cat's thing, right? Someone will be like how the how the fuck does that matter compared to a losing a like a family member? And it's like, okay Just just imagine though that someone's telling you their losses from the blip and they explain to you that they had pets That because they were blipped they couldn't be fed and just starve to death Like and you appear back in your room. Mostly everything's the same except you have two corpses, uh From your parents like that's not an experience bettering corpses Uh, just this is why like when he like laughed at him almost for it Maybe in the sense of a facial expression not like dialogue. I was just like that's strange Literally, uh, I was just like it's it's it's just a strange thing to write that way Important to highlight is that big choices and little choices that you have characters make can Inform their character. So something that you you think of it's just like, oh, that's like a little off-tanded thing It's like no, why would dr. Strange find that funny or amusing? You know, what does that say about him to some extent on like even if it's a minor thing You know, yeah, once the guy's like, oh, you know, I lost my brother too. Don't she's like, oh, shit Okay, I should take this seriously and I'm just like, I don't know man I feel like someone losing their pets can be taken seriously, but okay of course I got I got three cats myself, you know, if I disappeared and reappeared and they were all dead That would be deeply traumatic. You put a lot of time and love and care into your pets You know, they do a lot of research you do you if I can feed them you give them love They're basically your children only they don't leave you in the end Uh, they just die but now they've died faster much faster than they should have You know if that would be fucking traumatic So a whole would be traumatic It it's just it was such a dumb decision and then like to ramp stakes up even more And you're right in this movie like dealing with all of them. Well, I was the next one going to be You know, I have no idea Keep going higher Multiverse Um Well one thing I'm just gonna add then this is like that that conversation essentially ends with uh, dr West I think is his name. He says, um You know, yeah, you're uh, you know, you're the best surgeon. You're the best superhero, but you didn't get the girl And I was like, yeah, what why would why would you say that after you just had a conversation about like how what you guys have lost And how this was a tough thing for the for the world that you're like, you didn't get the girl though It just sounds like we went from like a serious adult conversation about like the nature of all the horrific events to like schoolyard shit. It's like, what? Yeah Okay And um, the reason why he said that Quickly that we're at Christine's wedding. Yeah. Yeah, that's the reveal This is something that's really important for steven in this film. I was gonna say that that's why he's saying it is it's on theme It's not about uh, like good dialogue. It's just he needs to say it because it's a reference for the theme Uh, one of them They're trying to go for because the one of them as well as like the choices they make right in terms of the pragmatism versus principle. Yeah Go for a gary Yeah, and I just made me think that would have been such a better concept that if you're popping through the universe, you know multiverse and you're seeing The decision aspect of it the the instead of like one, right? And I'll say the whole multiverse aspect of it was a fucking mess But that this is where it would establish a through line like there would be a payoff For that line later, which there isn't sorry spoilers. There isn't a payoff for that line. It's just didn't get the girl Fuck me. There's there's a lot of people in chat who are like dead pets. Don't matter. You guys uh Okay, that's fine. You guys you guys go right ahead with that perspective Yeah, that's legitimately bizarre. Yeah, I'm not following you on that one. Yeah, that's uh Uh, she arrives wedding happens And then uh, he's at the bar Um, and she walks over to get a drink And he says let me and he converts what I assume is her water into wine um, yeah Wow Show off I guess I don't know well like the film acknowledges it too. She says um He says like you don't think that's a bit much to you and then she's like At my wedding. No, like I I assume the film is acknowledging like he just turned water into wine, which is a very, uh This is there are connotations to turning water into wine. Yeah at a wedding a little bit A lot of people are saying she's in chat. What's that guy? Who's that? I don't know I don't yeah, I don't get it. I don't think it's Like it's it's just strange Like why I don't I just don't know why What if she's a recovering alcoholic? Oh, yeah, that yeah, that's no more or less in his in line with his character at this point Why not? Well, and I hate to say it, but like can you can you just convert any composition of like materials into anything else because Bro, that would be a great way to defeat a villain to just like turn I think I said to write turn this stomach acid into wine into normal acid That's a superpower. He turns people into wine What is I don't I'm not a scientist. So I don't know whatever the acid that you don't want to have in your stomach is turn into that Yeah What if you turn the water in like your brain into wine surely that'll kill you Yeah, let's turn someone into a pillar of salt or something, you know Like Yeah Strange converted into beer and Thor Ragnarok. Um, but he didn't convert tea into beer. He switched from the tea to a beer So it's not quite the same Like I I assume he poofs the tea out and then poofs the the beer in you know, because it's his own problem Yeah, I was actually gonna say to be fair. I'm actually hyper critical of that scene in Ragnarok 2 in terms of Doctor Strange is just teleporting people without even using the portals. It's like wait, what you can do that You know how useful that shit would be if you could do that Uh, we're talking about here in terms of power levels. I have no idea what magic allows someone to do at any point There doesn't seem to be any semblance Someone said he's a wizard so what oh my god How do you actually watch him fight somebody and not get frustrated when he can do all this shit and doesn't use it Also, he could solve world hunger like with that Exactly creating power Like you can't this is the whole thing that he faves about you can't just Establish crazy fucking shit and then pretend to ignore it when it doesn't benefit you for a comedy scene Like you're like look how funny it is that he's giving Thor the beer and you're like, yeah And then you're like so can he provide infinite beer to people? And you're like don't think about that that's not that's not what we're doing here We're doing a joke shut up. I can't help it my brain instantly goes to that because I'm a thinking creature who has thoughts And I I can't not think of that. I'm like you can create beer. Holy shit this whole time And is there a size limit? Could he have drowned Thanos in a giant? Maybe there's just a proof limit or something it's I can create a very small amount of strong alcohol or an ocean of miller light I would drown Thanos too. Yeah, just Any beer die and shitty beer you bastard so, uh Yeah, you know, I'm not spending much time on it. I just I was just like fuck. He just had water. It's a wide. Okay. Anyway, moving on. Uh, yeah, so Uh, he has a little chat with all old Christine when he remembers here. We haven't seen it since Dr. Strange one It's been a while Uh, at least I think so if we seen even flashes of her at any other point I don't know That's about all I can think of I watched most of that. So I watched two episodes of it and I was out. So Yeah, same um Yeah, so She says they never would have worked because he he always has to be holding the knife And that uh, I think she says he's scared. These these are important elements to understand All right, we got to make sure we flag these up so that you'll understand this as we progress And I and she's like we never would have worked for that for that reason. He's like, oh, well As long as you're happy and then she's like, are you happy? He's like that is, uh That is one of the the the arcs getting kicked into our kicked into and yeah Yeah, and there is even references from the first film that I will be Bringing in to support their attempt at doing something here But I'm mainly going to be referencing the first film to show how much they fucked up All right, naturally and that film is a film that fucks up a bunch not this much. Anyway, not this much Uh, legitimately, I was kind of actually sad about this So he's talking to her and I was like paying full attention because I was like this is all about his character This is a girl that he was super interested in and he can't be with because of everything that's happened I was like good old character for superhero And then a car crash sound happens and he looks over the window and I was like, oh Okay All of the years it honestly feels like in Marvel stuff We can't really have a conversation that lasts longer than three minutes It's yeah, it feels like Doesn't even uh and love before that doesn't she say oh my husband's big fan. He he he yeah Oh, yeah, you're right because yeah, that's setting up a joke Setting up a joke. Um, and not a particularly great one. Well, that's all the jokes. You're a grin The jokes are great in this That's the thing is just um, I it would be nicer if in marvel movies We could spend a little bit longer With characters just having a conversation Which is kind of funny, right? Because Loki there was like a 30 minute conversation with kang But like it's not really a conversation relaying information about world building that's in tatters I guess it's more like can we ever have a bottle episode? Sort of thing where we just have characters kind of explore how they feel about Each other in their place in the world for an extended period of time We just we just don't seem to be very willing to do that And especially not in the movies, especially when this movie is more two hours long You don't have the time with all of the crazy action scenes that we're gonna have um, but yeah Yeah, I don't know this is a hot take or not But um a lot of the time in superhero stories the moments I remember aren't usually the big bombastic action scenes at least not In isolation it's more the the conversations the interactions the character dynamics the things that imbue the action with meaning What may well be the best scene in all of like the I mean the the conversation between dad eval and punisher like that's often cited as like one of the best scenes I guess in the marvel and I agree. It's one of my favorite scenes like pertaining to superheroes Often say if a superman is him realizing he has so much power and yet he can't save his dad from His heart sort of thing. It's like yeah, that's not exactly an action scene. Is it? Yeah, um, and I mean like you even look at like the batman right a lot of uh A lot of the scenes that people talk about really enjoying all like the conversations between characters Yeah, um, like scene with alfred in the hospital It's it's just because what we're getting there is we're getting We're getting information on what we're what hopefully we're really here to see right, which is the cap I mean god damn like no way home right like one of the best scenes in that film is the three Peters having the conversation with each other about their history Came and ties in hardcore with them and I mean hell another one of the favorite scenes of everybody It's just the three spider-man talking in a very fun way about their past experiences like who they fought You know we're getting to the heart of what we're kind of here for which is not like You know, I can like a fight with a giant monster. It's like that's really you know, that's that's that's fun But I mean what's what's really going to be propelling us forward is the characters is um How they feel what they're going through how it ties into that arc and it's like we need time You know like we need to know who these people are that i'm spending so much time with And they're not giving me that we're going to be with this character for two hours Or and it's even worse than the shows when you're going to be with characters for whole seasons plural of television And here we are at the end of you know like season two of Mando or something like that and I'm just like I don't know what you are other than a contradictive loser I there's nothing here for me to latch. I don't know you and we've been with you so long Oh, we are you when we finished out moon night I was like was it episode one and five or the only ones about like him as a person Everything else was just like crazy nonsense Episode one made us interested and hopeful and episode five was depressing because there was legitimately great Stuff there that was like crap. Yeah, but I mean even in that right We couldn't spend time on that before we had to get we we had to get dragged back into a fight scene A shitty action which is crazy because you'd think like wait, you're complaining about that. You're like, yeah Yeah, yeah The action scenes are often really bad particularly in disney shows. The scenes are just always Disney's films and shows it's all the same shit because Yeah, we're about to start with this one and like I remember being like, all right new action scene Just because the first one was shit does not mean this one will be and it starts up and Literally the first action that is taken. I was like, what the fuck. I don't know if anyone else was With uh, which with what which one this one with the enneco monster So with yeah, his name apparently is Gargantos But it's because I think there's rights issues with Shimagura, which I think is like the one that people were really excited to see So he's just sort of throw away version. Oh, okay. Yeah Different name versus some character And I can't even remember what the rights issues are but it feels like an analytics thing Like we can't have the audience feeling anything And have them sad They need to be Excited throne action all the time or even like expensive or invested, you know, it's there's nothing There's just there's nothing of substance here. You're just your body's just sitting there in the chair waiting for the next weird visual to happen Yeah, um, well so Hope too. It's a freaking trope to like you have first movie Uh, you know hero gets girl and then they're broken up in the next one You know that happens. I mean not just in marvel movies It happens in a lot of sequels a lot of sequels and you know, it's it's to build that false drama There's always got to be some but usually they get back together but not Kind of pointless and yeah, there's no through line like you think well at this wedding We're setting up what dr. Strange's part in the story is and they don't his part is to to Protect the girls the key to everything. Well, here's his part is kind of getting dragged into it because he is in A location that puts him in close proximity to this conflicts Like imagine if the wedding was in Barbados or something, you know, like You know, like or in France, right? It's a good thing. He missed the sky being like turned backwards a couple of weeks ago No, notice that Fine So yeah, he's gonna go fight the big tentacle monster and um, you you can see this I'm not sure if this part of it is was released on youtube actually, but um Because I know that this a lot of this scene is on youtube like they put it out as like a promotional thing Um, so you can see a lot of this for yourself, but Yeah, he arrives and there's some crazy shit going on and and the first thing he sees is this car That's just barreling toward a lady with a baby. It's like because it's been thrown And so you you think to yourself, what is dr. Strange gonna do about this the car is like about to hit this lady What what what do you do? It's like well You do a portal portal to like the fucking Sahara desert or some ship a place You know is empty and then you just the car drops down in there. She's safe Or you portal her out to a safe area the car drops and hits nobody They're the two things that he always does um Instead and I don't know if you all remember this or not because I like I said it fucking threw me out of the film I was just like I couldn't believe what I fucking saw. He spawns a giant cat monster face That's like half the ghost to eat the car And it happens so quickly. It's insane Like I said, I think it's the car Well, so this is the thing I remember the cat thingy, but that's why Okay, go ahead. Sorry Even though it's it's literally two seconds. There's so much to explain giant Ed of a cat ghost thing to uh To to spawn out of a portal Jump up eat the car or rather bite it so that um It doesn't hit this lady, but it doesn't consume the car It mainly bites it and then disappears so the car just rolls in a different direction, right? It avoids the lady with the baby so Really bizarre fucking choice from dr. Strange, but the more important part Is the eagle eyed viewers will notice that um, there was a car heading towards The uh, the girl with the baby on the other street in which the car is now thrown as a result of the cat ghost head Basically dr. Strange as a result of this insane choice of magic just threw a car at someone else I was so like instantly I was just like the fuck did I just see why did you know that but it looked cool That's probably it. It didn't even It it made me confused like of all Of all the brain power you could expend to solve these issues on the fly why Why I would say that this is the first of many spells in this film where it feels like the only motive behind it was It looks cool rather than consideration for if it's the best choice to make in this situation But we'll get more of those later. Yeah, he's um, so that's this big point against him as a superhero You don't want to be endangering people the whole point is you're trying to save him Um, it was just like I don't like that. But luckily that totally doesn't happen again or anything in this Um, so we see uh the girl from from the opening scene She runs into a bus to try and I guess hide or protect herself from something that's chasing it From the way that we see it I really wonder why the hell she ran into a bus As opposed to anything else like well those universes buses are free So she just hops on and I hope it'll go some way. Yeah, it takes it. It's like uh, yeah, it takes her away to safety um And doctor strange like this is the kind of stuff Because this is how many movies we had with him now where you're just like man your powers He does a spell where it just reveals the invisible monster. It's like, yeah, that's just something you can do Okay, um, I have no idea if that like can you reveal anything that's invisible or I don't I don't know But yeah, I don't know what he did there. Did he just make it Seeable for everyone or did he well? I guess he did because they see the thing later on But he just does it which is okay. You can just do that. I guess the thing the thing about these As long as they don't contradict something Yeah, yeah, it's just that uh, yeah that so that's power. He just has like okay fine He then um, well, you know one thing I did like about it is when he reveals the creature it frowns at him I like that. Yeah, he's like, hey Oh, really? Yeah, no a detector unit. Yeah, the monster is pretty expressive actually It is it is the one thing I really did like about it But I feel like they took notes from Mike Wazowski in terms of how to emote with one eye So yeah starro from the suicide squad as well. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah uh dog strange then Opens up the bus as it's holding it like he splits it apart to its components I didn't even know he could do that outside of the mirror dimension. That's isn't that a rule in his film? Well, the only way you can do it is if you if you tap into the dark dimension I didn't know that you could like self can Self contain the mirror dimension like that, you know, like I didn't know that you could like Have it just be on one vehicle. I thought he just disassembled it It's something you can do in the mirror dimension I've never the idea is you can't quite do that as a sorcerer in the real world because that's a that's big boy powers Yeah, I figure but yeah, he splits it up And then we say that America's in there and like the monster's like i'ma get you But then he uses a part of the bus to chop off its limb and it just like cuts right through it It's like man. There's a piece of a bus Yeah, no, he doesn't know At high speed it does exactly what you'd expect which is like oh Not only is it super effective the lemmy cuts off dissolves into nothing So that's even useful for cleanup and it delays the creature and stops him from attacking America for a while So There's no reason to keep doing that and at all. No no because it wouldn't be as cool the second time. Yeah Well, yeah, because what happens instead is America falls he sends the cape to go grab a and then he like closes the bus on His his tentacles if I could just the bus at him I wanted to just really highlight if you can tear something apart into its component parts That's an incredible power of the monster What are the limits on that? Can you do it to anything? You're like a you're like a reverse james may Yeah Splits into all this. We'll get someone in chat. We'll get that reference. I got that. Hello. Yeah. Well, you're not in chat. Yeah, I'm Yeah, why do you think I'm not in chat? That's not racism. That's madness. This is a multiverse of madness. It really is Uh Yeah, because if you can tear anything into component parts like that and then convert it all into sharp weaponry to kill someone with It's just like, yeah, that's pretty good Uh, you should do that more more often. I guess but anyway, as uh, as free said, he splits it apart and then puts it back together on Um, it's tentacle After because she falls out he grabs her with his little cloak gets her to him and like those bits Especially because this is the thing the only way to challenge someone like dr. Strange is to make things happen quickly Um, you have to overwhelm them so that they just kind of keep up with it all like blink. Yes Uh, good good reference. Yes. Um, thank you. You you showed me that. Yeah, so the yeah, uh He's doing that and and unfortunately dr. Strange is a fucking idiot in this film. Um, so he grabs her puts the cloak on Uh drops the bus on tentacle creature and immediately just looks at her He's like, you know, do I know you? Yeah, well, what's what's what's what's going on and you might think to yourself like Oh, does he think he's dealt with the tentacle monster and it's like, well, he knows he hasn't so So he gets fucking yeeted I don't know and and you might be like well as long as there's no significant repercussions. It'll be fine. Um Well, it throws the bus at him Because of course it does and she has to warn dr. Strange that that's about to happen That's how distracted he got from just looking at her and you know It's like, well, wouldn't you be if it was a girl that you had a dream about and never seen before? It's like, I don't know man a giant tentacle monster in front of you. I feel like that's a more distracting element Yeah, like I I would like my brain would be like that's weird, but I'd also be like, oh shit a monster Yeah Both of these things can happen So, um, that was annoying because he throws it and you get the iconic incredible Visually stunning scene that everyone was wanking over on twitter for like fucking weeks for some reason Where he creates a soul and chops the bus in half so that the two pieces to narrowly avoid him in america Which without thin that saw is pretty sure they both should have hit you even with sewing in half They don't randomly just fly apart in different directions. They'll just keep going forward Well, I mean, it's I mean Maybe should have put like what if there were people running behind you, you know Well, so that's the big criticism. They slam into several cars in the background and he doesn't seem to give a fuck This fight he is not very responsible in this fight when it comes to stopping Here's the thing right a lateral. What else could he do? What else could he do with the big object heading toward him? He's not like A portal, I don't understand. No, that wasn't me. That's a stupid idea. Why would he use that? Yeah, I remember there was seen in infinity war Um, the the guy that was with Thanos he threw like a bunch of sharp things at him And then wong opened a portal and strange opened a portal to fling it all back at him Fling it all back. All right. Well, here's the problem with your idea there is the that portal That's the maximum size. They can do those the bus is too big. There you go Oh, except for that time in the endgame when the portal Oh, that that's not that uh, hmm, that's It was mud. There was multiple sorcerers. They had to do it with multiple people. There you go. It's a trick of the light. That's what that was Oh, yeah, hey guys really small But guys guys guys like in the grand calculus of the multiverse. It's his first day somewhere out there, right? Yeah, yeah, I'm not here his first day. That's true. Um Someone just highlighted why didn't he turn it into butterflies like shut up shut up. Yeah, you're ruining it You're ruining everything. Why can't you just enjoy the magic of cinema? Yeah, sir Oh So, um Yeah, he does the saw move And you're like well after having that moment of distraction It's good that he's now back in the game and he even does this little pose like two fists. He's like fuck you And then he looks at her and he's like, do I know you? um And doesn't look at the monster And and then he gets knocked out by it. Yep Wow, I mean, I probably should have killed him considering how far Sue's going but Definitely should have killed him and the cloak did nothing to help him by the way A lot of the characters in this survive things that uh, you have to remember the cloak is sentient It's it wants every it wants to help Dr. Strange in anything it does It has an awareness of its own it can move him away and out of danger. It just doesn't Yeah, oh well Which by the way makes a really cool payoffs when it does that. Um But never mind Yeah, so um a little bit frustrating He just keeps fucking getting distracted in the middle of a fight when the giant monster is right in front of him Uh, not doing good for his intelligence at all. Uh Nope. Yeah, he's knocked out Uh, what's what what can happen now? It's all over right? It's all over. Well, just in the nick of time Wong appears and I have no idea. Did someone call him? I don't know. He must have been in the new york sanctum, right? Because I would explain how he got there Well, it's just like if he's aware Could he not call in help? Well might as well, right? Just get you get your phone to come to us. Just like, hey, can you send like a few sorcerers? Yeah, we know they have plenty to spare Wow, we know the vector. Yeah Oh, yeah, he should be and you know what's so frustrating He arrives With a portal. They show it closing behind you. Yep And it's like, oh boy that might be useful. Why don't you portal the giant fucking monster into the desert? What is it gonna do? Or teleport in half just cut it in half with the teleporter Use your portal to chop off all of its little There you go two huge solutions because the funny thing is if you drop in like the center of the biggest desert ever it will probably die I don't be like what am I supposed to do here? Die, it'll just it'll dehydrate so fucking fast like assuming this thing has rules like that. I don't know if I know um So yeah, Wong, you know, you might be thinking as a listener right now. So what does Wong do? It's like well, he uses his um I don't even know the name for this weapon shadwood, but it's like a whip with a with a dagger on the end of it It's the scorpion thing. It's the scorpion. Yeah scorpion's kind of weapon. He he swings that around And you know what like to try and avoid sounding like I just fucking hate the world I like i'm really happy to see Wong I'm like there he is You do your shit And he's courageously running in there knowing he's just trying to help people It's just why the fuck you're using such shitty tools, man You're the sorcerer supreme Like Wong is hyper competent supposed to be Was Yet he uses these little dinky weapons against this giant monster instead of other spells that are available to him um So yeah, he he just like He's just pathetic He even tries to pull out a sword and come at it and then he just gets grabbed and he's like Oh, let me go and it's like man I forgot we were like just in a saturday morning cartoon with the hideous horrible monsters. Just grab you They don't kill you. They just pick you up and go Throw him like the what it should have done is just bash his head against the ground like with you Know grab the tentacle and just go bang bang. Yeah. Yeah, but it just holds on to him for like a minute And if anybody was curious like well, what you know, do we know the nature of this? You saw one of these things just kill defender strange outright Uh Turns out though, that's okay because defender strange isn't the main character. So Yeah, plot armor boy. Is it a problem? Yeah, uh, Wong has just held on for a while strange wakes back up and before american can get grabbed Uh, the cloak grabs it and takes her up. Um, which you might think like, well, that's a good idea Right get it out a range of the um tentacle monster. It's like well, if you just turn a corner You'd be out of range in height and you'd be out of range of it throwing anything at you You don't have to worry. Yeah, like if you get something thrown at you if you drop her and then she just plummets to her death You know, just like Maybe don't go really high up. Just like go somewhere else Um, and yeah, the cloak tries to fly her away the tentacle monster throws a motorcycle at them And it fucking nails the shot the tentacle monster is bullseye Oh, yeah, I guess something to note by the way, there are there are definitely civilians getting killed in the croc like It's crushing cars It's grabbing motorcycles that dudes were driving on like people are dying Just keep that in mind people are dying because of whoever Summoned this monster or whoever was responsible for this monster coming into After that, it's very yeah, it's very unrestrained Whoever summoned it would be responsible But also the fucking sorceress choosing not to use their weaponry that's actually effective against it I mean, you need to account for collateral damage, you know, that's something heroes are doing trying to save people It's funny to think that we have two Probably the two Best sorcerers most powerful sorcerers right there and they have so much trouble against this one random demon thing We're almost out the dumbest decision. We're almost there Look seconds away. All right, we're still number the same Um, yeah, I just wanted to mention someone might be listening to be like well Who cares if the motorcycle hit the the cloak if she can be picked back up by the cloak does it matter? It's like well, she lands high up on a building the cloak somehow Falls in such a way that it gets trapped underneath the motorbike Yeah, I still don't know how that happens. It is fucking insane. How did that even happen? Like if you watch it, you're just like what and it's like well because we need to keep the cloak out for a minute It's gonna it gets in the way if it stays in the fight. You're like, okay It's too useful. Yeah, it's too helpful that cloak. He's just working so hard Really is the whole movie. So, yeah, yeah, he's on a timer of he will be allowed back once they allow it Is the cloak the only character in this movie who gets out undamaged? No, I just said he didn't save strange earlier for no reason All right, okay Even the cloak who was just the happy cloak that helps people Happy I like to think I like the cloak. He's a very happy little character. Yeah, I like the cloak um So anyways Strange summons a fucking hatchet and chops off another limb to save wong and it's like, oh, wow, that's useful Keep doing that The best part of it is the monster doesn't notice It just is walking along and it doesn't notice at all that one of his limbs is gone and wong has dropped down Listen the monster is goal oriented as should we all be You can't be caught up on the details of the now you have to keep your eyes focused on the future and um Wong they even have a musical cue to let you know that you can calm down now We're not in the exciting part wong drops the ground. It's like Like like it plays little music while wong it's like, you're not in the presence of a sorcerer supreme It's supposed to bow and he's like, I know the customs and it's just like Guys guys It's killing people. This is not the time to discuss the decorum of your hierarchy. You have things to do Well, I think a good example of because there are jokes and avengers, right when they're like fighting in new york But the jokes are usually like tony stark is still flying towards things, right? Like he's he's going places while he makes a joke. Yeah, he's not joking around prevent him from saving um Yeah, while they're doing this a little back and forth and and you're like Oh, well, it's okay though because they're both doing a little hand movement. It's like, okay, they're setting up a big spell This this will be something that knocks this thing out. Okay. At least we got that they both decide to do Do you know what? Um, if I could rewind just a little bit Do you remember infinity war like there's a lot of things I really like in that film One of the things that pisses me off to no end is when dr. Strange is fighting uh squidwood um because I can't remember his name he's The whole doing a portal that sends his spikes back at him. It's like cool move good stuff and then Squidward activates like he hits the head off of a fire extinguisher which blasts long away It's like, okay. That's pretty clever and dark strange like in frustration and retaliation He fires like a whip crack like wrappy thing around him and pulls squidward into him And then he gets shocked that squidward is coming right into him and that fucks him up in the whole fight It's like, why did you do that? Why would you want to distance is incredibly important for you like you need it? You're it's also you need it because you are a gloss cannon So yeah, like I always hated that. He does it here. He tries to attach a chain made of magic to Gargantos and so does wong They don't choose to attack this thing. They choose to attach chains to it now guys to something that is clearly very strong They expect from their movements to be able to with their strength alone pull it off the building It's climbing This thing is huge It is big enough to be it's big. It's big. It's bigger than your mom You may be impossible. You may be terrified by this concept. Okay You may be so shocked by what I'm about to say, but what happens instead is they get pulled by it Whoa What? You're kidding and yeah, uh That was the decision that in this fight. I was fucking face palming. I was like, you serious This is like worse than the opening fight like why throw sharp metal bits at it you fools Open a portal. I beg you to open a portal No, you failed on the sand. It's like a It's like a tony hawks pro skater game if you do the same move multiple times you get less points So you have to vary. Oh, yeah less points for the audience You know like if you actually wanted an answer for why they do this that is it They have to keep doing new and different spells to keep the audience from from being like, oh, you just did that one in one That's boring. It's like That are competent just new things that are dumb like sure new things fine, whatever spectacle Fine, but do things that are new and effective Yeah, people do this all the time. They do the thing where they're like, oh, you don't want new force powers You guys are boring. It's like you can use the ones that are established in cool ways new ways. Yeah The funny thing about it is technically speaking, right if telekinesis is a thing Then you're like, okay. Yeah. Well, we've got telekinesis. We need something new and it's like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa You saw force choke and you said that was a new thing. That's just telekinesis Yes, it's squeezing someone's windpipe like why you know, you thought it was new Yeah, there are many powers that scale with creativity and telekinesis is among them It has very few limits. It just depends on how creative and interesting you are If you're a boring asshole, Spider-Man uses webs, how boring. Wow, he did that before Um So yeah, um Drunk it could just conjure a bunch of wine and beer and just got it drunk You know, that would be a cool scene thinking about it. Doc Strange having to battle something like this wild drunk And it spells a kind of flute Like he tries to spawn a sword and it's like all it's just you know It's a floppy sword Use it as a whip because it's all flimpy. That would be great because he could have gotten drunk at the wedding and then he He's depressed. Yeah, he just gets fucking hammered and he's got to go out and fight and that's how Like Wong's like, god, he's drunk. I gotta help him. He went to the wedding. He wasn't supposed to go And that yeah, you know, loads of jokes can take place like and by the way, that's I'm pretty sure they do That in Incredibles like he's like have you got a wedding? It's like, you know, like Frozone and Mr. Incredible have good chemistry because of the fact that Like they're familiar with each other while this is just bow to me. No Okay Remember taking advantage of this, huh Yeah, uh, I think America's about to get grabbed and so Dr. Strange is like, I know I will set the creature on fire And I was just thinking of myself like okay, first of all, if you think that's a you can set things on fire. Yeah, like Okay The powers just they just keep adding to the list. You're like, oh, you can do that. That's something you can do Okay. Um, luckily for him the technical monster had not yet grabbed her because if it did he would have set her on fire Uh, by the way, it trails up So there's no way he could have known that she wouldn't have been in the vicinity of the fucking fire It doesn't do anything. It goes out straight away And uh, it just pisses off the monster But before getting to what happens next which might be the dumbest part of the whole scene I don't know. It's really hard to tell at this point. It's so hard to choose Everyone has their favorite dumbest part. It cuts over to retard buffet It cuts to the the wedding building and uh christine and her husband come out And the husband sees this happening and he's like, oh Because he's like a fan of dark strange and she's like, yeah And I was like, wow, both of your reactions are bad Neither of you should be doing that. You should both be like Jesus fucking christ That monster's probably killed several people is currently destroying a building like I hope poor people. Yeah, I hope dr. Strange can stop it because This is already terrible. But no, they're like, cool, find a boy. She's like, oh you Yeah Um, yeah, she's annoying because These movies aren't strictly like that They oftentimes want you to take death seriously and take like consequences seriously It wasn't what like three minutes ago that we had someone be like, I lost my brother And it's like, I'm so sorry Yeah Loll now the big tentacle monsters destroyed a whole building That is pretty funny though. It's so funny Lollie lost his cat. It's a comment on the new york Uh housing and building situation It's like a monster swallowing up all the property Gone monster so deep ridiculous ordinance zoning and gentrification. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. He's being gentrified by another dimension So the tentacle man's like Fuck you sorcerers and he chops off both of their little chain things Now he grabs dr. Strange before he can fall so he's got him. But what happens to wong? Oh, let me tell you Wong very intelligent This is funny because like I would almost want to boot up portal to show. Yeah, how stupid wong is Like Wong is really dumb, which is unfortunate because I want to like wong. I want to like him too It's tough. It's tough So, uh, he's he's free falling. He's a terminal fucking velocity heading into concrete We can't have that because this film recognizes that if you have a lot of momentum you smash into something solid It'll kill you this film is knows this Okay So he opens up a portal and you're like, oh wow, how is he gonna solve this because he's got so much momentum I was well Me and rags had spoken about this I think yesterday and it's like everyone in chat Everyone here will be able to figure out if you put the portals Like you can in the game portal right next to each other on the floor It'll send you down and all the way back up like oh, that's that's a pretty cool Mechanic you could do that But then maybe you're thinking well, he wants to land on the ground Okay, and you're like, all right fine. If you want to do that go down one up the other once you reach the peak of the Momentum falling back up you open a pool right below you then onto the ground momentum done. You're safe. Great What does wong do? Does anybody want to tell the people? long as like I'm gonna open a portal on the ground here that like angles parallel To the to the ground and he flies into it. He flies into a taxi Yeah, really hard really really hard Fucking he's dead He killed himself because he's a fucking idiot But no, of course. He's fine because plot armor. It's it's so annoying because There's so many cool things you could have done and they haven't done with a lot of cool It's not not it's so because again, it's like kelp telekinesis portal scale with your creativity You there's so many cool elegant ways to Express that wong is the sorcerer supreme. He is very experienced. He's very powerful So when he uses portals, he's like the best of the best It's like fighting someone like is that like blink in a Age of future past or days of future days of future past where you are watching someone who clearly is very Experienced who has done this many times before They're like peak performing and they use portals. That's what you should expect But he chooses to do some like if you're falling and you have portal powers You're just like, oh, this is i'm not even phased by this I'm having fun. Fuck it because I know I could just put a portal here and there and then i'll be fine It'll be easy I mean an idea would be what if he used the portal he portaled like above the monster Summon something that he could impale its eye with and then using like his own force He like pulls it out that way So like he uses the throw and fall to get back into the fight straight away because he's that Yeah, and um, I just wanted to because like for people who don't know right in days of future pasts Opening and in the fight later on they have a character who i'm assuming is from the comics called blink who opens portals exactly the same way as dr strange cam with his uh His sling ring And one of the cool things that happens in the film is a couple of them Is that uh, she portals colossus really high up and then he just is You know free falling right down into the ground Then she opens up another portal on the ground and one next to a sentinel So he's like a missile going through Which is In a way in a perfect world would be one of the lemur things you do because it's so obvious But it's in actuality one of the coolest things you can see being done with this in one of these kinds of movies Because they never fucking use it for what it can be done They only ever open up a normal portal and someone steps through you're like, yeah, that's that's something you can do with it. Yeah Yeah This is like I this is like I just learned portals yesterday I'm just getting used to the concept of what they're doing So I just use it for like basic travel even as powerful as it is I use it for basic traveling, you know Some not yet begun to explore the creativity that comes along with portal power And it's so unfair because you're like instead of getting the cool use of a portal He just does something that's so fucking stupid. He should be dead and it's like great nice Moving on I guess Uh the cloak escapes Yeah, just just Got some more powers. We're lying there. You know move the Motorcycle out of the way for some reason. Yeah, it's just free now and um, which is perfect timing because dog strange Dog strange is grabbed by it and it doesn't kill him again But by the way, it saved him if he had dropped Well, then again, I don't know if he has a sling ring, but if he does why isn't using it? So I it's all uh It's so hard to Understand, but um the reason they had him get grabbed was because he didn't have his cloak And then they were just gonna have wong save himself by killing himself Obviously, they didn't want to deal with that with dog strange, but he doesn't have his arms free So we can't cast any spells But then the cloak gets on Uh gargantoss's eye Which gives him the time to get them arms free Along with I think America's Stepping on something to make rubble fall down Um, yeah, I think she even uses her powers to do that. Yeah, I was about to say she we get like this little star pattern Which is Not a thing she brings up to anybody ever and then they have the surprise reveal for her powers later in the film So that doesn't really line up does it? Yeah, I don't know. It's uh weird that we have that here anyway, uh Strange then grabs a lamppost and impales Gargantoss in the eye with it, which is just like why didn't you do that in the first place? Yeah Or use or use the giant saw blade that you cut the butt. Oh, yeah to just chop it in half. Yeah So um, yeah Conclusion several lives lost millions in property damage And incredibly incredible reckless endangerment of not only yourself but several other civilians for no reason at all Uh This is this kind of shit, man like Uh, and I was just like well, hopefully the next action scene will be good. I guess Because uh, he saved america Fuck yeah, and then she steals his sling ring somehow Right. Yeah Yeah, so he did have one then. Yeah, he just didn't use it. Okay, cool Um It's really weird that she steals it And so from that you're like, well, she must know what it is for why else she will she steal it Uh, which means she likely knows how to use it. Thanks to defender strange, but she doesn't use it She she don't know how to use it jumping ahead to the end. Yeah Yeah, that's what I meant exactly Because she can't use it because we see her all the way at the end that she's training to do magic stuff So she has no fucking clue about this world Which means she stole it without having any clue what to do with it and just yeah, oh, yeah, she's like, okay You do wonder if that was a reshoot or not because that doesn't seem congruent does it? It's like wait, but she doesn't know how to use it, but she did steal it to use it. It's like Okay Um, but anyway, they're like, all right talk with us And immediately the scene starts and they're in a cafe and I was like Why the fuck you in a cafe pizza time It doesn't make any sense. It's like you would take her to kamatage Or sanctum sanctorum. Why would you all discuss in public? People are saying she stole it so strange couldn't use it, but wong has one Also, what do you mean strange couldn't use? Why would that Why does that change anything? She's running away. You just run after her Yeah, but also wong has one. So like I don't really do anything for you at all I don't even like I said that that's a fair argument, but I don't understand So now you can't use portals so I can escape you with my legs. It's like I also have legs They're longer, I mean, what's the is that seriously what I think the logic of that was I thought it was she was stealing it for herself. It's even stupider if she was stealing it so that she can't be caught by him Wow, I can't believe moller's saying that minorities are pickpockets by default I'm pretty sure marvel was saying that I'm saying rags that america steals money It is it is the thought that I did have where I was like, oh, okay marvel I don't know each other. He's just see it. Yeah, he doesn't know who wong was He was clearly his ally like all Puerto Ricans are expert pickpockets. Okay. That's what I got Fighting with strength if you look at wong's hand you'd see the fucking sling rig That's like a that's like a saying that you would use if you wanted to display your pickpocketing prowess I was like, oh, yeah, I could pull the sling ring off dr. Strange and you're like That's ridiculous You're not fucking difficult that would be because it's two rings that go over to the bottom of both of his main fingers Like you wouldn't be able to get that off like that He's like a wizard master surgeon who'd probably Let's really think about this how many modes of transportation does dr. Strange have even if we take out portals in the cloak He can still use whips to go around. He still can do those magic platforms She would know this because she worked with a version of dr. Strange who was using these abilities That one could fly with little frosty boots. So boots, yeah, what the None of that makes sense Look, I think it's better to assume. She was gonna try and use it. That is the most sense you can make out of that But she can't use it, but she can't use it. So it's yeah Whatever these two people just spent ages trying to save her life And she's like copy-trustin you because you might try to take my power That's it's one of the most it's so frustrating. It makes me not like this character right off the bat Well, we'll see how that goes. This is the film for grasses, right? It was great. Um So, uh I think it's around here It might be a little bit later. Actually, we'll wait on that. So there's a great joke Um, I I'll I'll explain it In just as much a funny way as they do Uh, dr. Strange mentions Spider-man and she's like what? Spider-man That he's like ye She's like, is he like a spider? And he's like no like a man And she's like, okay, I think it climbs on wool shoots webs out of his butt No Well, maybe I don't know I haven't asked him that God, I wish I knew who it was and then I could ask them but I can't remember. Uh, I don't know if it seems too harsh But I was just like man that really feels like a 10-year-old wrote that and was really proud and it's like, yeah Mahler, that's the film No, I think today's can do better than this I guess that is true. Maybe maybe that 10-year-old could write better Um, because it does it not feel to you guys like it's it may be It's just one of those like, oh, that's the that's the joke you came up with It's like, well, if you work a bit harder on it, you might be able to find something funny between, you know Spider-man webbing and something and I guess it doesn't film No way home that did some joke about this that I feel landed decent bit better, but I wouldn't know Also, she's it should I guess it depends or I don't know Would she know about spider-man and all the multiverses and stuff? She's told We later find out that she's been through 72 universes. Yeah, she might have encountered spider-man, but who knows Yeah, if she's spending a very little time in a lot of these because she's getting chased across and I can understand They're not coming across a spider-man. I guess it's just um Strange In itself interesting I wanted I was curious. So I went back when we're going back just a little bit the motorcycle gets thrown I was like there was a dude on that motorcycle It was I just check he disappears. He literally disappears into a tentacle No Yeah, he disappears into a tentacle. I'm like I had to watch like three times to see like where did that guy go? So I think he just got absorbed into the monster or absorbed into Oblivion. I'm not really sure but he disappears Whatever the the nicest and cleanest way they can make it to get him the fuck out of there It's kind of funny actually because it's like, yeah, what about what's the monster going to throw? It's like provide him a motorcycle a guy will drive into the tentacle monster for no reason at all at the in iron man one when the guy got when when Monger grabbed the motorcycle the dude flew off it as one would do when you Stopped just while you're moving like 50 kilometers or 60 kilometers per hour. You keep going, you know The tentacle man looked at no as we find out like momentum doesn't exist in the mc Or just like conservation of it's wrong. He hits. It's like, yeah, no, you good No, he does it all when long hits the um, dude, that is so funny. The motorcycle guy is just heading straight into him Oh, yeah, I remember in the theater. He was just drive he drives down the road as this massive monster is Mayhem in destruction and he's just like, oh Really late for work Straight into him down the street Yeah, that's literally what happens. He's he's no he's got his own story. It's it's a movie that's going to be coming out That's the end of his movie where he just charges at the monster. He's like, it's my time. I'm gonna save the world The dawn he died to do it Maybe he was he was taking death like he was really depressed And he was just out for his last motorcycle drive before he kills himself because he's horrifically depressed and he's like Yes, I this is this is it. This is how I die. Yes. And so he like sped up towards it He's playing like bon jovi blaze of glory Someone said why does he remember peter parkour or whatever? It's like he doesn't remember peter parkour. You remember spider man Yeah, remember spider man. Yeah, it's kind of it's kind of weird. But yeah Yeah, that's actually what I wanted to Bring up because that's the first time we hear him talk about anyone talk about spider man after no way home, right? As far as I know it is So I guess spider man and himself is still in the avengers then Yeah, like technically. Yeah, this is part of what I'm curious about because if they all remember spider man That means he can show up as spider man and reveal himself to be peter parkour, couldn't he exactly? That's what I was about to say. It's like, oh, so that's obviously the relationship is unpaid But he can then reestablish his relationship with the avengers whenever he wants But also strange knows he cast the spell to do something apparently because he remembers the happenings in no way home, right? I have no idea what he remembers about the events of no way home Yeah, okay. Neither do any of the writers That will never be answered They would I think that's that's just an interesting line to keep in mind for future spider man movies Depending, yeah, because the impression I'm Yeah, the impression I'm getting from this is that he remembers His involvement in that film, but he doesn't remember who he did it for So he doesn't remember who is under the mask just remembered he did it for the person who is under the spider man costume But he doesn't remember who it was And long it's just kind of cool with it in general, but not really but sort of Yeah Being the sorcerer supreme Is like oh, you're gonna cast a spell that erases everyone in the universe's memory. Leave me out of it. We and it's kind It's interesting that the Loki writer didn't bring up any of the aspects of Loki At all in his in his damn movie and they only briefly mentioned No way home like twice That's a good point like Loki is kind of non-essential viewing for this show for all of them really nobody cares about Loki yet Where this shouldn't be considering what the fuck happened in that it may well be one of the most well It is it's definitely one of the most multi versus are new Right, they're new because they were just released from the sacred timeline So I can understand like they We who remain There is a reference to multi versus and dr. Strange so fucking awkward because it's before multi versus could even exist universe is one of an infinite Thing is what is correct because we see the dark dimension, which is a different universe, right? And he and he eats universes. That's his whole thing So how is there no multi verse When there's a guy out there eating universes Yeah Time king changed everything I have no idea. No idea So yeah part of why I was frustrated that they went to a fucking cafe is because people can Interrupt it and this information is going to be sensitive potentially That's just out in public and you're obviously your superheroes who just saved the city So people are gonna want to see you and literally someone walks up to them like can I take a photo and dr. Strange like no, it's like why are you here? Yeah You'll have a sanctum. She's clearly intact by an Otherworldly dimensional monster that you guys had a lot of trouble dealing with apparently So it's not it is not repeat repeat. It is not pizza time. It is not pizza time You're not um And then very casually we just establish Uh That book in that opening scene they were heading toward is called the book of ashanti and it can give a sorcerer any spell They require to defeat whatever enemy they're fighting at the time Wow, that is convenient. It is an automatic win button for anyone against anything Wow, that is Then strange says what? I thought you you go ahead and say them. That was like a lead in Oh, I think he's gonna say so well, yeah So he's like that's bullshit and then long as like it isn't and then strange like what? And long says something that's so fucking funny to me It's like He says nobody has ever like reached it or seen it But it is real How how why would you think the book is real? Oh Because you learn it when you become the sorcerer Yeah, but like if you read okay, so you're like you read ancient scrolls that like there is a book And it does this thing that nobody's ever seen it. It's like what? Yeah, so someone comes up to me and they say all right You're a sorcerer supreme you could read this scroll now and the scroll said the scroll says Yeah, there's this thing out there that exists No one seen it. No one knows where it is. I'm like, oh But I can tell you what it does. It's like how It doesn't Long say maybe I heard it wrong, but doesn't long say well, there's certain books you get when you're a sorcerer supreme and they kind of Yeah, it's uh Look, it's a real funny funny joke. Which doesn't make any sense at all This first movie where he's reading all the fucking books. Yeah, like that's what he's doing The thing about the first movie is they justify that he becomes very potent very quickly because he's like he excels at whatever He puts his mind to he's obsessed. He's focused. That's like what he was in his surgeon job When he becomes a sorcerer. He just reads every fucking book The idea the doctor strange Bailed to read something that was in the sorcerer supreme books No, yeah Not gonna happen. It's so weird because it shows such a dramatic misunderstanding of the character to have the right to be like Yeah, doctor strange. He's a cool guy. He doesn't read. It's like No, he does he would he was so obsessed with reading that he was reading while he was asleep Yeah, and he got in trouble for reading Like yeah, he remember he stuck he went into the library to steal books from under wong's nose to read to learn more Like if there's that's what he does So that anymore Yeah, like it's just like this is that none of that works and then Yeah, that's just the fact that like wong is very confident this thing exists even though Nobody's never seen a no reference or reason to know anything about it or to yeah But it's like okay, so that's the thing to keep in the back of your mind everybody There is a book out there that can make it so they can defeat any enemy. It's just like wow and it's real Okay, there's a lot to drop on us. It's a lot to drop on us Especially after infinity war. It's like man if you're telling me That if doctor strange has simply read this shit beforehand that would have been an option But uh, he just didn't read the book. I guess. Yep. Okay Well the scroll whatever it was on I just don't want to use the auto win button. I will be unfair towards than us Or something So, uh He then wants proof she's from a different dimension and so she shows him the corpse of Uh, defender strange Which luckily landed on the top of a building and not like in some street where anyone can see it At least would be cool Yeah, the fact that you even arrived in new york at all You know as opposed to any other place in the more because remember you're traveling different universes on a planet period On a planet period when like 99 percent of what the it's more than that even isn't it like 99 percent of the universe It's just space just empty space Well, there is an attempt at a sort of a justification for that later in the movie. We will get there Yeah, there is but we can talk now So you take some corpse and this is the scene where it's basically canonized that dreams Are windows into the lives of our multi-versal Yeah, boy Oh You don't know what you've done All of your dreams are canon all your dreams are canon now Um now this raises some questions. What does it mean to lucid dream if your dreams are actually other people In other universes. What does it mean to gain an awareness of your dreams? Which people absolutely do What does it mean if you have a dream? Let's say you're dr. Strange, but in another universe dr. Strange came into that role Before you did. How do you square away those dreams in retrospect? Man? It's weird that I had that dream where I was like a sorcerer and now I am a sorcerer Huh, how do you how do you square away dreams and like the paint universe which I guess we'll talk about later, right? Well, there's another question. Did nobody dream before Loki happened? That's a good point. Yeah Loki Loki The problem is I think what Loki wants is all time has already happened They want to have it be like that But the problem is that Loki the show is the consequence of endgame Which occurs at a certain point in time, which is after everything that happens before that Um, so yeah, did people have dreams before the multiverse? Surely they did, right? And think about how terrifying that would be if all of a sudden Yeah, all of a sudden randomly everyone when they sleep they start having these visions and they could be very lucid and Yeah, like how terrifying that would be for every creature to suddenly realize they think it would be a disease They they'd start checking people for shit in their brains and in their blood Here's something else to consider. That's a fun. That's a fun idea for a story You know, we you know, we ask of androids dream of electric sheep And I mean do sheep dream of other sheep in other universes? Do you have concepts? Well, I know amoebas don't sleep That's stupid example Let's go smaller ants sleep, right ants. Yeah ants go to sleep, right? Do ants have dreams about other ant colonies and stuff in other universes? Yes, just everything that is a live dream And do you view these dreams as though you're a camera watching the scenes? And if so Why why why is this the way that it works in this reality? Why is the universe recognize some level of I guess Specialness to like living beings to where the dreams connect them to other versions of themselves What does that mean? You know and to cap it off universal How fucking convenient that out of all the different multivisual people that dr. Strange could dream for It was the one that he was about to meet the companion of in five minutes. Yep. Yeah This is a one and one and I would like to yes highlight what the word infinite means Yeah And I thought a number it is what we used to express like an uncountable amount Mind bogglingly big incomprehensibly large and even further than that The whole infinite universe saying that gets brought up in stories. You don't know what you're committing to when you say that you really don't Okay, there was so many openings in this Uh content or I thought they were going to bring up Something changed in the multi like there's a multiverse. We didn't really we weren't aware of it until very recently Something happened, you know, just reference the fact that they released the sacred timeline Yeah Closed thing in Loki now Well, it's I mean Sam Raimi may well not have watched Loki Um, but then again the writer wrote Loki. So yeah, the writer wrote the show Yeah, fuck up. Don't worry about it. You don't have to watch the show. It's it's only like a sequel with your character So, yeah, it reminds me just to add onto what Wright's saying about infinite Across infinite earths when it's like they've destroyed all of the planets across the multiverse now one by one It's like, what do you mean? Now this is this is the first instance of many where guys infinite That's just a thought you have in this film. There's many more instances of this So, yeah, it's confirmed let's defend a strange strange believes you And uh, the first thing he says I think is like, you know Um Bad enough a little girl has this power with the damage you can do imagine it falls into the hands of an enemy And she gives him like a oh shit. You're gonna kill me look And he's like, um, and then one goes, um Little girl if you if you would come with us to kamatage. We can keep you safe But I was like, holy fuck. I would get out of there Just It's so suspicious a magic lad we're gonna be always safe. We're going to take care of you little girl. Don't you worry? Yes, we'll take you to a nice safe mountain castle. Yes with all of the other wizard friends Yes, no one else can get to you. Oh, no. No, we'll cast spells to get them away They'll never they'll never find you. I mean, they'll never uh, uh, uh, it's great there Please get into my cup and candy no windows rivers of chocolate Um Yeah, and then she's like, how do I know you won't betray me like he did and I've been over this with some of you in calls. Uh, that line really bothered me when I heard it And I finally figured out exactly why I You know what? I like defender strange more than I do our strange and I think he deserves better than that He does deserve remember his His final act the last thing that he did with his life was save her to cut the tentacles so that she could go through the portal if I can just explain The missing element of that free that enhances his heroism. He saved the multiverse by doing that He did save the multiverse because the plot doesn't happen without defender strange in his final act with his dying breath Nothing happens without him. He is the greatest hero that ever could have possibly existed in the film has our As america treat him like a villain that she hates The whole film treats him like an asshole. Yeah, the whole film doesn't give a fuck about this guy. Um And it's so fucking strange Hey Because because yeah, she says he betrayed me it's like he The action he commit. Hmm. I was too early to say so Yeah, uh, especially what happens at the end of the movie. Yeah, that's what I'm saying like, yeah Oh, it bothers me so but yes, okay fine. He betrayed me and you will won't you this new strange And uh, yeah, I just I was annoyed because I was like, I don't I don't think I described what he did as a betrayal But okay, and then I got more annoyed as the film went on It clearly didn't like that this was a choice that he felt he had to make Literally said he was sorry Something because I know all of you just don't understand this nobody does especially america chavez If he doesn't kill her and her powers are then taken by the big spooky monster That then kills her by doing that She's dead Oh And then yeah, that's so basically scenario one. He kills her boo-hoo scenario two He dies Because he didn't kill her Yeah Well, I was gonna say the thing about scenario two is the whole multiverse dies two So if you're gonna pick one of these Because I like a lot of people frame this as like, well, it's her or the multiverse like no No, no, it's her or her and the multiverse Oh, well, why do you think she'll survive when the whole multiverse is destroyed? Like she's like as if we as if we needed to sweeten the deal When we're weighing in her versus the universe, it's not even fair because she's part of the multiverse Yeah, uh, he describes it as calculus. It's like, I don't even know that it's just yeah It's the simplest form of and he's like because he's better to come back He's tearing up when he says that to her in the opening scene because he's he's He's passionate about trying to make sure that he can provide model with something to fucking use He's a good actor And I'm just and she's that's how she remembers that moment. I was like, okay, fine. Oh, thanks You're fucking ungrateful bitch, but all right It's fine. Well, look, all right I I guess it's a matter of um, what what is uh, what is her understanding and perspective on I guess like the nature of all of this Well, I guess is what we have to conclude. She's kind of super naive She has no idea why anything is happening because she's apparently she's just not enough to understand Which I think is lame as fuck. I'm surprised she couldn't figure out herself that I mean surely Surely the angle you'd go with with this character She had to grow up very fast because her life basically got uprooted At a very early age and she's had to take care of herself for a long time, right? So of anything that probably would have been the angle to go with that. She's like Pretty um, well, yeah, but the where of what's going on. Someone just like said like she's a kid. It's like Yeah, so the not this this isn't about whether like it's death or death. She surely knows this Yeah, she's not like an idiot There's no little bit. There's no there's no like variable of oh well She has a naive understanding of the situation. It's like well, but no, but it's death or death though. So what what? Yeah, and and she should know more than anyone else with her having these powers and visiting all these multiverses, right? She has more perspective than anybody in theory Just like female Loki who could teach herself at six-year-old. She was hiding in like, you know doomsdays Uh, but yeah, she's supposed to be a hero eventually too So like it's something they should have at least wrapped up later Because I didn't What I think would make more sense In the opening is when he starts to Do the big suck on it to get the powers It shouldn't be that she's like you've betrayed me. Why you do this with friend? It should be like she understands because this we've reached the end point This is the only other option we have now that sort of thing Like I didn't want to have to kill you. Yeah, I don't want all the multiverses to end That would be a bad thing for me to want But um, yeah, she like I said, she she sees it as betrayal even though he's he's already dying because of that leg thing What did have been better if she's like kill me Can we now and he's like no, I'm not gonna kill you You have to and then he starts it up and then he gets stabbed. Yeah, I would actually prefer that a lot Well, because you can immediately identify there the arc that you would do instead Um, because maybe there's jumping gun, but I mean she she doesn't have much of one in this film. Um So it's like try to find ways to Adjust the parameters of the story to give that character more You know and there's something maybe a little bit more interesting, right? That it's just like that that is her perspective is like, yeah in the grand calculus Yeah, I'm I'm okay with this and then maybe develop that further as time goes on Yeah You know and she can't kill herself because if she like tries to jump she'll portal Which will allow them out. Maybe yeah, maybe there is an awareness, right? That like anytime that she puts herself in a stressful situation that's going to come about anyway Um, imagine the last word he gave her when he got stabbed as well was like find me as in Like I'll always you know, I'll try and help you no matter what just find me or something like that Is you know, that would be kind of a neat sort of thing about He's not necessarily true though because in an infinite universe. You got some evil. Dr. Strage is out there Just one or two find a really nice me there there you go But yeah, I don't know I I would absolutely prefer that vision because they must have talked about the reality of the situation And that if she is because this is the weird thing we're almost there actually so I'll wait a second in terms of Because someone might it might in chat be like wait, how is it the end of the multiverse? Like we'll get there one sec. We're almost there actually playing how it would be that if the powers are taken um So, yeah, uh, he's convinced and they uh, they take her over to kamatage Bank, yeah, and then um Before they leave wong is like by the way, did you see there were runes on that on that monster? He's like they were in the dream too Like this isn't sorcery This is witchcraft That's bad. I just thought it was funny. It was like, oh, okay That is that is the thing we're going with now. All right It it was this isn't men. It's women Women are forbidden to show their chi and then uh Dr. Strange is like, oh man, I know someone who's dealt with witches And immediately I was like, wait a minute So he knows what I mean, you know someone Yeah But also like no, you know someone who is a witch Well, so this is the question I was gonna ask right because that's what wong says like do we know anybody who knows anything about Or has dealt with witches I think and he's like, yeah And I was like so either he knows this is bad either way by the way either he knows wand is a witch Or he knows that she's battled agatha and beaten her Which is it or is it both? Because she was just wander with the power from the infinity stone and some chaos anymore Am I Because this is the thing it's wonder was told she was a witch in wonder vision. Does that mean she didn't consider herself a witch before then Even though iron man refers to her as a witch like twice Nally when she's all I don't know anything about this and then she knows everything about it by the end of the show Well, I'm going to get us later. I think you'll find like not even that long uh Yeah, so So like I think we should assume then that he he's gotten Some kind of summarization of what happened in west view, right? So he'd know That she's a witch. He'd know that she fought a witch because that's gonna be the sword will know about all this And sort of good guys. It was just it was just an evil man who was currently there at the time, right? The sword is still good guys, right? Rambo works for them This is all I'm Rambo for letting her go in the first place. Oh Oh Responsibility for a dead person every universe. It's on her. This is the thing. We're we're almost because like, uh, yeah So I was just like, yeah, so dr. Strange Well, you know, we'll talk about that in a second. It cuts to her a good old wonder She's chilling out with their kids. Everything's great. Oh my god And she's like, you know what a family can never Be uh be taken away from each other. That's how that works That's meant to be a fame or not. I have no idea. Yeah Okay, um, but then she wakes up That wasn't that was just her dreaming. That was our wonder dreaming about a world Where she is with her her two boys now chat You might be thinking wait a minute the two boys the two boys she made up We'll get we'll get there. Okay. You shut up. You guys your haters Absolutely little haters can't believe it so, um Yeah, she's uh, she's tending to her Apple trees, I think Yeah, yeah, um It's a very it's picturesque. Everything's very chill. She's very calm. She's got a little farm animals running around It's all about the sheep. Yeah And uh, dr. Strange like oh my god, this is great. How are you doing? It's great. And then she's like, oh You probably want to talk about Westview, huh? Yeah, maybe the line the line Yeah Yeah, we go Here we go. Yeah, I guess I'll just say dr. Strange says Well, you put things right and that was never in doubt Man, why is this a problem? Well, it means that he's known about Westview for long enough That he has had time to try and arrest her or hold her responsible for what she's done and he chose not to Which means he thinks that she's not really got anything to answer for in Westview Oh Yep, she because if you kidnap people and torture them But then you let them go in the end eventually after significant pushback from the world You set things right and it's fine because it's not like those people are traumatized or anything It's not like there is a level of damage that can't be undone. No, I want to be what happened there I want to be clear about this There is an argument that I have seen batted around on twitter lots of people fighting over this scene People were not happy with my tweet about it either where they're like, don't you understand? He's trying to manipulate her in this scene. He wants her to help So of course he's not going to fucking arrest her for that and it's like, ah But my main issue is that he hasn't done it at all up to this point. He hasn't done anything This is the first he's talked to her about Westview. That's why she said what she said So clearly he didn't care that much Nope And if you want to argue with that point that he's too scared of her to do anything about it and just hope she's nice That's fucking pathetic That's not dr. Strange. That's someone different. It's not dr. Strange He's uh, he's very much like sort of tries to take on the role of I guess the police policing magic on earth I mean, damn when Loki just showed up role When Loki just showed up on earth in ragnarok. He's immediately on it, but this time around he just doesn't care Like if there is one consistent thing about dr. Strange is that he is very willing to take on people who are much more powerful than he is He is extremely proactive. Oh, yeah That would be the way to scribe him. Yeah Dude, his fight with Thanos is like one of my favorite things he's done I really liked that fight. Yeah But uh, no, he didn't do a mamu We're so I think um This might be uh Well, I I I feel like that line is Marvel saying look get over it like moving on it's over Like we're moving on don't keep talking about it. Don't keep bringing up west view like all right as far as we're concerned We're moving past it and to give everybody um, just like no idea A quick refresher. She did unconscionable horrors uh In west she what she already did Yeah, well, that's I mean Yeah, right because because they were kids who lived in that town and what they got locked away like and then the parents They couldn't move they were crapping themselves and just existential just remember existential dread of knowing that there was an entity in existence That can just strip you of your capacity to choose Like even at its own will to puppet you for its own needs Puppet you for its own and then she got away with it. You know, there was no there was no uh, there was no ramifications for it Like you have to lose with that We know the world had something to say about what she had done the police turned up right at that moment We know that the writers know that there's something to be said about it because they had to write a line to try and move past it Because they know that needs to be addressed. That is what all of these like. Oh, well, she didn't know Oh, well, it's because we all know that what she did was very bad But like nobody wants to admit it because they don't want to have to deal with these difficult questions about morality and these Marvel movies and shows It's like the film doesn't understand that going into this film wonder is a terrible villain who needs to be brought to justice She is already a villain. Yeah. Yes. Yeah. Um, but They were too afraid to do in the tv show. It was such an easy fix Like she wipes out sword Like she ends up releasing the town but like reluctantly because she gets defeated by maybe vision or uh, Whatever or there's a million ways you could have figured out have her Hey, dude, how about dr. Strange turns up and defeats strange and or the avengers. Yeah No, yeah, you're you're right. Uh, there was this closure We all desperately wanted from one division and this film fucking balked it completely Because uh, this film has its own problems to set up and pay off You see it can't be dealing with someone else's problems and I was going to mention too that uh he I don't even know how to how to quite quantify it exactly but there's almost infinite frustration that this is like Dr. Strange one is is a film that the question his big hero question is does he want to go back to being a pro surgeon man Or does he want to commit to being a defender of earth, which is a stressful fucking job? But someone's got to do it and he's like, hmm, and he commits to being heroes is standard stuff Uh ragnarok He establishes quite explicitly. I keep an eye on the most dangerous elements be they from this realm or another And uh, I keep an eye on them and it's just like yeah, I could see him doing that He's he's a guy who just wants to be on top of everything which leads really well into infinity wall with he and tony clash They're like both of earth's Yeah, that's far as tony's concerned He's the boss of earth and he's defending it But meanwhile this other guy has developed almost in exactly the same Manor as that that element where he's like he even shows the line, right? Unlike everybody else. I don't work for you. It's like yeah, he's his own Exactly, which writes super fun to clash them and I very much enjoyed their uh, they're back and forth in the movie To then have him here be like, oh that west view thing. Yeah Hey, you put it right you put it right Wow embarrassing just wow Uh, okay, and you know what's funny is like that's not even the worst thing in that in this scene. Uh, there's so much Um, it's funny as well because she says I made mistakes and people got hurt and he's like, that's fine Move it on That's fine. Did you see me with the bus thing a moment ago? Yeah, yeah Don't worry about it. They're just they're just pathetic little human mortal lives We don't concern ourselves with any of that. We're we're we're higher beings So, uh, he's damn sure it's like I need your help I want I want you to come and help us defend a girl who's got the power to travel through dimensions. He tells her a lot and immediately it's like Bro, you know, she's a witch and you know the person behind this is a witch and how many witches do you know? one You might want to entertain the idea that the person who just enslaved a town could be behind the evil thing that's happening But no He he thinks he does think she made it right so Well, some people some people theorized that he was aware. She was evil in this scene. No No, absolutely. No because it is it is identified later on again jumping ahead that telling her That america was a kamatage was a mistake. Yeah, he didn't he didn't want that to happen He just bluits out all the information because he's too stupid to realize the alternative scene is that you write one That is absolutely laden with subtext neither of them are telling each other the full truth about what's going on because they're both Working each other for information Because of course they are right like that makes sense leverage that's strange He's a super duper smart guy. He's gotten awareness of what's going on So he's trying to get as much information as possible without giving too much away and of course wonder is Well, she's got her own objectives here. So she should also be very careful Completely agree because the cool thing you can do here is that strange knows that if she is behind this He needs her not to know that he knows that Like yeah So he needs to speak to her in a way that gets him information that doesn't give away that he's put anything together Meanwhile, she needs to hide that she is behind this and make sure he doesn't find out so that she can best get access to america It's like that would be an interesting scene. Unfortunately. He just goes. Yeah, we got the girl. She travels through dimensions She's a kamatage. I want to help come help us out. And so it's on a platter for her It's all there everything she wants and then and then So what does she say? Well, so yeah, uh to clarify for anybody who's a little bit confused, right? So one does the bad guy. She's behind all of this. Um, we're about to find out her reasoning. It's just that All along that's the nature of this conversation. Um Unfortunately, she says why don't you bring america here? I can take care of her and then doc strange stops walking And then she goes, oh, you didn't tell me a name. Did you? It's like How do you fuck that up? You putting each other? And it's funny because they lampshaded. She's like, oh man lying, you know, I can do hexes but lying It's too tough. It's like you you didn't have to really lie. You just he gave you everything you just said Oh, so what's her name? Yeah And and yeah, so the ruse would have continued. She would have gotten direct access to america Uh, but no she fucked up Yep Because yeah, uh, she's a dumb ass and she couldn't keep anything straight. Like I said, he handed it to her and she still fucked it up It's two characters out stooping each other. Yeah, it's a dumb contest They're frustrating only the dumbest will survive And then she reveals the reality around them, which is not the happy little little trees with a happy little sheep Um, and can you just go to a nice looking place? She I just have to have to highlight this. She reveals a hellscape. It looks like tailored on steroids There is like Dark red mist everywhere. The soil is practically blood. The sun is red. It's like what the Where is this? Where's this even? I think the implication is that it was that forest at the end of wonder vision But the dark hold is just oh yeah, I understand what they're saying. The dark hold did it. It's hilarious like Instead of showing like trees that have rotted away, which I think is a way subtler and way more interesting thing to have done It's like a cartoon evil hell world. I was expecting shadow the head shock to be there. Just be like, yeah, man This is my house It's my house now Yeah, to be honest when I store it in the trailer, I thought it was a hell dimension. They were yeah Yeah, I thought it was really funny because it's just like wow you are evil This is like zahd showing superman the fucking mountains of skulls This isn't helping this makes you look a little evil, you know, you probably should have just kept the hex up actually Just while he's here because it yeah, because she reveals she has the dark hold to him and then he's like, oh, that's like an evil book and it makes people evil But you should have been able to figure that out yourself before you chose to read it because it is a Giant book made of ash With like all these embers flying off of it. It is clearly an evil book Wanda chose to read it well, so this is Yeah, do we wait to talk to talk about what what what they say about wander in the dark hold and What the dark hold is doing it's gonna be a very important discussion because it's gonna it's gonna Decide how a lot of people feel about a lot of things that happen in this movie. So we're almost we're almost on that I think I'm just making sure We're we're not missing anything the hellscape beautiful Um, but holding my tongue it's been this is the well, so let's let's tell people what their motivation is She says the dark hold has shown me I can get my kids back And you might immediately be like wow What the fuck does that have to do with sending tentacle monsters after an innocent little girl? And you're like well The first thing dr. Strange says is wonder you created those children with magic. They aren't real and her response Every mother does that every mother creates their children with magic I I so here's the thing I heard that in the theater and I was like out loud like that is not the same That is not Oh What it's it's literally the opposite of magic. It's not magical. It's very Biological really is the opposite is a purely well explored Biological process and we know so much about it. It is not magic It's frustrating because I feel like you're not respecting the spirit of what he said It's it's it's it's instead of addressing like the actual Demons that are happening. It's like making them blurrier. So the audience don't notice it's like what are you doing? What i'm highlighting is they are as fake as the fucking hex you just cast like they are equal Like there's no in fact you can just spawn them right now do it go ahead Yeah, if they are so fucking real to you and so important just spawn them right now In fact make the uh the west view dome in this little field Put it just put it in this little field. Yeah, don't bother anybody. We'll put a fence up We'll put a warning we'll deliver food to you by throwing apples through the fucking force field. You'll be fine Yeah, also make sure the hex doesn't expand like just keep it there. Yep Don't make it go bigger if they're so fucking real Make them up again and chill out with them. Don't kill people. Fuck This is like captain america going to tony starken saying you created ultron with science and tony says All fathers create children with science Yep, she's like excuse me. What? Just be here like try that right like you see a bunch of like graves or dead kids Like she was I tried and I just couldn't do it. You know something like that. Um, Does she also say in in that same? Sentencing whatever that she oh, she knows it's true because she dreamt about them or something So that's gonna be skipping ahead Let's get so this is the thing this argument. She's making it develops a little bit later. There's an additional portion to it. Um Yeah, I don't know what style We will we'll get to that then but right now the argument is the kids are no less real than any other fucking kids because Children are made by magic. It's like you're insane. You're actually crazy. I just We are so screwed Um, so, uh She then moves in to say like if you knew there was a universe where you were happy wouldn't you want to go there? And he's just like I am happy I swear Again, you're like, what the fuck are we doing right now? It's like it's on theme It's on theme the characters talk about the theme let him talk about the theme every once in a while. Okay Oh, okay Um Then he's like why the fuck you trying to kill like uh an innocent child and then she's like She's not a child. She's a supernatural being And I'm just like So like you the two children you're trying to get One of them can run at the speed of fucking sound and the other one Can use telekinesis. Are they not children because they have supernatural powers? Is that how you do this? Are you serious? What a weird thing to like throw back at him. I don't even Yeah, it's very strange. Like it's not even a matter of Uh, dare I say being out of character. It's a weird thing to say like I just Okay, um, yeah, and then she says The thing about america chavez is She's she's got a power that can wreak havoc in our universe and many others Uh, we should we should stop her before that happens. It's it's about calculus. You know, it's like, oh Get it. She's using the thing The he said in the other movie and this movie. Whoa, and then his response is um His response is that's the logic our enemies use And I I was already like, well, no, it's the logic you use sometimes Um specifically you the sayer of those words. Yeah, then what does like didn't you use it with thanos? And um I was a little bit confused because I thought the He was going to reference something else. I guess because with thanos. I was like, wait, is she talking about You're my iron man Think you're talking about the time stone vision Maybe And what we've just highlighted is the problem. It's like well, many people had to die to stop thanos Not just vision. Like, yeah, I know and she must know that She has to know there's no way nobody told you so I was just like that was And dr. Strange actually died Uh Himself he gave himself up To hope that this would work out. He left it in other people's hands Which by the way is another reason why i'm not a fan of one of the many themes in this We'll get there. Um So I yeah, I was just like that's strange, but also the you know Is she is she saying that It is the same for you to die to save the multiverse as it is for me to kill an innocent girl so that I can Hang out with my kids Yep, she's saying that pretty much So, yeah, uh This is where I mean like we're we're how it's something like 20 minutes ish into the movie and um It's just nothing but nonsense and we haven't even gotten to the big nonsense yet This is tiny nonsense. It's just the prelude. You can't like I think rise. You're saying something like this There's just nothing to grab on to every single thing you might have a grip on it Flicks away because it's like nope that was stupid Every diet every line of dialogue every character every event everything that's happening my brain can't Process that as a thing that would really happen I have nothing to hold on to there's nothing to grab. There's nothing to care about. I have no investment uh so much catastrophic And that is what when he says that's what our enemy's doing and she's like you did it And that's when she says the famous trailer line. I break the rules when I want my kids And that makes me the bad guy, but you break it when you want to save the fucking universe Every clear time that we have of like dr. Strange breaking the rules the first one was dormammu who used the time zone to save earth And morto got mad at him for that for some reason if I can highlight It was more than earth. That's the whole universe that one So he broke the rules to save the universe a rule that wouldn't have helped them It would have just cost them everything I'd love to talk to morto about that like you would have preferred it if he just the whole universe got destroyed But uh for whatever reason he's not in this movie. Not that release. Yeah, not that morto Um, and then of course with Thanos. I I mean again the only way really but still he was trying to save all of like existence Um, yeah, because you have to take his understanding of situation at that time Which apparently was he thinks the only way to do it is that way Yeah for whatever that's stupid, but whatever. Yeah But still it's all in pursuit of saving the universe and he dies in that trade So he's putting all of his faith in tony, you know, he doesn't know if he's actually going to come back from that But yeah, you break the rules because you just want personal vindication Like you just want things and it's like yeah, they're not comparable And yet some people actually think her line is like pretty effective a lot of people think that line is great I don't get it because they're dumb Yeah, he also he even says in the scene like we were at war and it's like yeah wartime Uh decisions can be really complicated, especially when it's a war of the universe is but uh, yeah You know, it's fine. You you got to see your kids I understand well, I mean after all right because we have an example wonder was not willing to trade vision Vision was willing to trade himself. Yeah in order to ensure that everything went fine But she didn't make that choice Steve didn't make that choice. These are the consequences Um, yeah, and so he says like so so what happens next and she's like hand over the girl at sundown Or you're gonna meet the scarlet witch and he's like oh And doesn't she say like is it in this scene or is it the scene after that? She says I was being reasonable or something That's later. Yeah So I mean it's so much shit It doesn't surprise me at all that we've taken nearly three hours to get through 20 minutes Rags might not be able to make it for this fully Either no, I've got it. I got another two hours and then I will have to leave because of family stuff How long have you got gary? I had a curiosity. I've got uh, 20 minutes. Oh I know Because the only thing I regret about that is just like what There's probably things you wanted to talk about we haven't got that yet I can picture there's a particular scene you would really like to talk about So much so there's well, there's a couple Um, it all happened at the Illuminati like that was Oh god Aside from like uh, I'll I'll use the phrase and she was Worst stuff was like what they did to marvel comics Like it's just like an unforgivable. Well, I was gonna say, um, I'd be curious because you use that like I'm assuming You're saying like there's there's no way this is the worst in the mcu, but like You know how far we've gone into the into the script and how many problems there are on top of the uh The way they treat so many characters that you know The fans would fucking love to see not have those things happen to them Do you think there's even a chance this could be the worst thing that's come out in the mcu? There's a chance I I have to think about it because we've had so much bad Yeah I mean like Eternals is just like shit, right? I don't know if any of you guys saw the Eternals, but it's just shit from beginning to end But it doesn't like you could forget the Eternals and it wouldn't affect the Marvel Cinematic Universe at all I disagree. Um all of the implications It's fucking dumb But you can just erase it from you because they're not gonna fucking bring that up again like they're nothing like Surely like a tunnels to whatever the fuck like that's where it'll be relevant again I can I know you mean like uh in the same way that Loki gets ignored and A bunch of other things will just get ignored until some of the writers like I'll use that Lim like it it would it wouldn't affect the greater hole because I I don't think these celestials are gonna get brought up again And the Eternals like the thing didn't make a ton of money So they're not going to be in a big hurry to get make another one I don't think unless they're totally fucking dumb, which I guess is a possibility But yeah, I have to I have to assess because like each each bad thing has done its own very unique bad thing Loki I would agree with all of you guys has done the most damage to well until this movie until the Fabric of the MCU Yeah, and and I've reviewed that which means I've seen it more than once a lot more than once So sorry Oh, it's bad. Oh, I'm reviewing dr. Strange now. I've only seen it once in the theater Once I see it again, I I'll be able to assess like if it's the worst or not But it's definitely in the bottom four for sure for sure Yeah, I can that's For me, I'm still thinking exactly what I think by the time we get to the end of summarizing the whole fucking film I'll have I'll have Got a solid enough position because I want to make sure because the one thing that can beat it out like Loki is the whole Taking free will from everybody Yeah, just being a reality for so long. It's like that's a tough one to beat there are This gets completely contradicted in this Like everything about this movie contradicts Loki Well, it contrasts everything and itself. It's it's incredible The doesn't give a fuck, but yeah, okay. Well, uh, uh with the time we have left with you I guess I'll just try and uh, just see how far we can Anything up did anyone else find the transition I seem funny as fuck where the camera pans up into like the red misty Sky and then Wong's face just appears in the middle of it, but he walks toward the camera Yeah, it was it was That was a very weird transition that I was like, is he is he just here? He's like the tally tubby's baby in the sun thing. He's just like watching That was a real I thought it might be because I was like, is that supposed to be funny because I thought it was funny That's definitely a ramey ism. There's there's quite a few strings out Oh, yeah, I just can't believe strange just left Well, yeah, I mean, I guess there's nothing else from to do. I don't know. He's she's she's She's insane. That's They're fuck off. I'm not the sorcerer supreme. Doot doot. Not my problem Well, that was funny Someone said there'd be no reason for him to have talked to her about Westview because he's no longer the sorcerer supreme He's like, he's here now. It's dr. Strange. He doesn't give a fuck if he's the sorcerer supreme or not He's gonna take care of this shit because that's what he's invested in not its job title. It's not as that lame Give him back the position already. Come on Oh, I will say I like Wong I just You know, it's like all the movies. I wish we haven't got a Wong movie. So, you know, I'm just saying Maybe they should be maybe it wouldn't be as terrible. Who knows Right, so yeah, this is the quote says if Wanda gets America's power she could enslave the multiverse Mm-hmm. And so those are the stakes. He believes That they have to keep power away from Wanda because if they don't there's a sizeable chance that the multiverse will either be enslaved or destroyed by trying to stop enslavement like oh, here's your reference to Wanda vision For those of you who watched it, which there's a bunch of people my theater confused as fuck about a lot of this stuff uh The scarlet witch Which by the way is like has nothing to do with the comics is prophesized to rule over the universe That's what the dark cold said that she was more powerful than the sorcerer supreme That's so she you don't want to give her the power So that that was actually a reference like the one I went That's kind of what I was missing actually because I completely forgot about that so that makes that make sense now. Thank you um, sorry, I guess the Now if this is what wong thinks maybe give captain marvel a call to be fair Dr. Strange said not even wong was the one that said it I'd call everybody like well. Well, I'm just I'm just highly going her as like the clearest example But get everybody this is the stakes. These are like an this is an infinity war level It's more than infinity war. It's all existence. This is the highest the stakes can get this is as high as it gets There's no higher than this. Yeah The entirety of the multiverse is at stake of being destroyed and ruled forever You've got to call in everybody The reason why of course they don't call everybody in is because it would be a lot harder to have people be sympathetic to wonder If she killed like I don't know if she killed Bucky or if she killed Spider-man or if she killed, you know the people who we've seen long term But if we put her up against people who are apparently, you know, like basically faceless Then it's a lot easier to square that away Um, that is why and also it's too expensive probably to get everybody in Yeah They should have called in everybody every single person the stakes are huge. Yes and We I think we also in this scene they they try to It's interesting because this film Is aware that wanderer is a villain now. It's aware that wanderer is this evil horrendous person But it doesn't seem to realize that this transition didn't happen in between films There's a line saying the dark hold corrupts everything that it touches and the implication or maybe even explicitly It's explained that it's the the dark reading the dark hold is what turned wander evil except She enslaved that town and kept them enslaved Before she even touched the fucking book before maybe even the book arrived in the town Any awareness of the existence And then agatha came golden arguments against this argument that uh One is not responsible for any of this because the dark hold is corrupt today. That is not true Um, you'd like to believe it because it would make the film better, but it's not unfortunately if uh As was just pointed out she did plenty of evil shit that relates to directly to enslavement well before she got the dark hold um if though The dark hold makes it so the like if you could help me out and be a little bit more explicit Like are we suggesting it it makes it so that she doesn't care about whether or not someone dies in order for her to Complete her goals. Is that what we could maybe conclude from the fact that she's like it's a grand calculus thing I'll kill chavez and then I can save the world like but she's not willing to um To to kill like dark strange for example. She wants to give him a chance first like oh That's nice of the dark hold to not corrupt her further than that But you know, maybe that's just because they're kind of friends Maybe maybe that's why and then like well she definitely commits to killing him soon after It's like really good after yeah, but that's because of the dark hold, you know making it. He's corrupting it. You're like, oh I'm really okay. Um then Maybe the fact that um She's saying that this was all about being merciful And she's she uses the word mercy and uh reasonable. She was being reasonable. Yeah Um I I feel like we're not quite at that scene yet But this conversation about whether or not it's corrupted her is we need those references. So I think for the sake of this we're gonna jump ahead just a little bit. She she describes uh So she she calls herself reasonable and dark strange is like reasonable you fucking send demons after this girl And then she's like that was reasonable. I didn't want to come for it myself It's like wow you're an idiot Do you understand that like by sending those things you killed way more people than you would have if you have no Goal to kill anybody like yeah, because the monsters didn't care about collateral damage And you're telling me that like she did that to be nice Maybe she's just lazy Well, I I just want to highlight again that like that is the ineffective way of doing it But it is a nicer way of doing it as far as she's concerned And yet she is fully corrupted to the point where she's willing to enslave and kill people I'm like so this dark old thing is pretty inconsistent, huh? Uh-huh not really corrupting her uh that much Maybe it's dumb too Or maybe she's just a fucking evil bitch and it has nothing to do with the book Yep because uh You know, this isn't really a spoiler. We'll get into the details of it when we get there But like this film is going to end with of course she will be defeated because she is the bad guy um And it is done so in this film as it is in some Some films the villain is outright killed some films the villain realizes what they're doing is wrong This is the last well, this is both but uh, she yeah, she realizes what she's doing is wrong It's like so the dark hole doesn't prevent that from happening character growth Like it corrupts you but you can still learn and grow and become a better person This sounds like bullshit to me. This sounds like a mechanic You're using to have an excuse to not judge it too harshly I guess a little bit also to jump the gun the book is out of play From her perspective for half the film Yeah, and he doesn't have a lingering effect at all. Yeah, does it have a lingering corrosive effect Like it takes a little while to recover from it Like it's you know, like you've got a cold or something It's like, oh well you got it now, but I mean it'll take you a couple days to get over that one You know like get over the dark hold corruption and also Oh, let's go for it inclusion is that she's uh, the the dark hold and that line exists to Try and stymie the criticism that she will get as a character Uh, that's it You ain't gonna work It doesn't work No, and like the only like I was racking my brain to find a way that they could have used the dark hold to Retroactively justify wonder vision from a writing perspective And the only thing I could think of is if they made it clear that agatha was using the dark hold to corrupt wonder over time to make her Gradually more okay with the evil actions that she was being manipulated to do and then takes complete control And that's when the full corruption happens Yeah, that's an idea because in wonder vision agatha didn't really do anything wonder was responsible for They didn't know what to do with her in that show. They were like I had no idea Oh No, and there's there's characters out there that corrupt people that could have been used that both of these characters have fought Uh nightmare Mephisto Yeah The card that they could play at any point to benefit them significantly Dude, how cool would it be if you had a series of phase four movies? And Mephisto was behind Several of the events like because he's being built up as the main guy. He's causing all of that. He corrupts her He uh, he makes the spell go wrong in spider-man. He you know does this he does that he does devil deals Like that would be really cool as a build up for him being the main villain Yeah, that's how you ramp it up. It's like you basically have him fighting satan, you know, it's So, uh, yeah, I don't buy it basically the uh, she's She's corrupted. Therefore, none of this is related to like she's not accountable for any of this Uh, I don't I don't see how this isn't just one does fucking decisions that she's making Someone highlighted as well. She says this isn't like this isn't corruption. I've been shown the truth Yeah But I mean, I guess this is probably worth noting If you want to hold on to the claim that it is the dark hold that's corrupting her How can you praise any aspect of like character in in the film if she is for 90% of it an automaton who is entirely At the whim of like another book Well, what what is the meaning of a choice that she makes at the end if for 90% of the film she wasn't making choices at all You know like you can't have it both ways No, and what was the argument for not putting dr. Strange from kevin feige's Own pie hole for not putting putting dr. Strange into wandavision. He would take uh away her agency What is Yeah, uh, um, yeah, uh molla was this what you were imagining? Yeah You got wong in the fucking tally-tally. So it's beautiful. Um So, uh, like I said, yeah, this this is to me More so, uh, the dark hold like will give you a little push That's the best I can gather from this movie without Just going by actions Because she does a lot of things in order to prevent herself from killing more people I don't see why she would have any limits You see a dr. Strange later in the movie Who's decided he's going to start killing people and the implication again is that it's the dark hold that did that to him I think that makes this even make even less sense Like all of this it's like does it just make you want to kill people because his logic was like I see lots of sad dr. Strange's out there. So I killed them Like it will gather it's important though for me to just figure out what the hell are the mechanics of the dark hold Was agatha harkness evil It didn't seem like it like because she was mainly she takes out of witches powers is is I guess what she does they weren't really clear on this case, you know, yeah Well in in that case, yeah, it was necessary because she's a fucking monster, but It's it's so it's so strange Uh It's just perfect. That's definitely the word of the day for many reasons um But yeah, she tries to reason with dark strange several times too. I'm just like, yeah, dark hold doesn't push you that far Then it makes sure you Basically, if there was no dark hold Um, all of her reasoning would line up as just as stupid as it was in wandavision Mm-hmm Which is why by the way like I actually think that this the wandavision did better for a character than this movie does because at least wandavision add her say when Basically the wandavision argues that she was in denial It's really badly done But they have that moment where they're like i'm suffering your nightmares or my dreams. It's horrible And then she goes no, no, no, you're happy. You're happy Like I tried they try to make you think that wandavision was under the Sorry, wander was under the impression that they were happy being enslaved, which doesn't solve the problem You're still a horrible person for doing that by the way. That's just how that works. You're idiot. Um But at least you have that even though there's been over examples of a forehand in that show that she should have picked up This film, however, you know, she's killing people She knows oh, yeah But she wants to be with the kids There you go, that never existed Yes, well So Yeah, uh, there's this line We mentioned it earlier as the line proves that strange was an idiot for letting the information out But it also proves that the film is a fucking idiot. So america chavez says So the woman you went to for help is the person that's trying to kill me for my powers and you told her where I am And doc strange is like Yeah, I did So the implication of that Is that foolishly he is a loud wander to now know the location of america chavez. It's like well First of all, first of all, you can teleport out. So you can leave. Yeah Very easily more importantly You've been chased across the multi-verse by this woman. Do you think she doesn't know where you are at all times? She has to know otherwise None of it would make sense otherwise and we see that she's chasing her through the dark hole She can just hone in on it wherever she wants to yeah So that how that doesn't I don't know. I don't know how So that doesn't even work. She's like wow, you told her where I am. It's like she always knows where you are What do you mean? That's a little point. They probably should have explained like maybe she's got some spell tracker, you know It's a little pentagram on the back of her jacket, you know something There's like that concept gary. I think they should have explained like oh man I don't know. You're right. You're right I'm this old and naive and it's just there you go so, um Yeah, I guess to put us back on track of of what we almost started talking about So now they know the multi-versus the stake wand is coming here full power. This is terrifying All everyone basically Yeah, I think this was the point in the movie for me where I was just like 100 percent totally just checked out Where I was yeah, because it it feels so quick. It is quick. Oh, yeah We're moving very fast. I know it should be because at some point it was just sitting in my seat I was like just Watching things happen. It's like I don't care like what why are we here? I mean, I know why we're there but Just and then and then and then it was like yeah just in the stupidity of it Like we're just here now at the at the at the castle And she's coming now And there's no time to prepare or do anything and you guys aren't calling people. I'm just I'm done I'm checked out done. Yeah, just trouble the rest of the movie so I can go home Pretty much someone said um, did they forget that she can teleport as well. Does she have the power to teleport? No wonder I don't think she does But that's it. Oh, no, no ignore this movie. I mean if they established that she can teleport before this Oh, um, I don't think so. I don't recall. No, I don't remember being able to teleport So, I mean she flew from America I was gonna say is important That I know that she can or can't teleport with the thing Someone someone someone said yes, probably yes I'm not so to be fair. I'm not talking about the comic vision. She might be able to but She doesn't in one division No, she got she goes she goes invisible. I don't think she teleports remember when she's fighting agatha She like disappears, but I didn't think that was teleporting. I thought that was just her going invisible And she can't make portal. She needed wong for that. Well, we'll get to that, but you know She teleported from being a good character into a bad one. No That's true. That's true. She did Well, but she can't in this movie because you just brought that up She needed wong because I remember her doing the fast walk, but I don't think that counts I don't even know if the fast walk was a fast walk. Oh, you're right. Yes. She needed um She needed wong to teleport her to the place Yep Well, that's what I'm saying this whole film falls apart if she can teleport that that fucks a lot of things up But I'm pretty sure she can't I think Like she can do the dream walking thing which we'll get into but that's not teleporting. That's uh a bit more complicated I don't think it was turning invisible. I uh look Who knows what she can do I was gonna say like I don't fucking know If she can you'd think that would be a power she'd have Well, here's the thing if she if she can't uh, well if we're jumping it She flew to the illuminati headquarters. She didn't teleport there, which is really stupid by the way. We'll get that. So yeah, we'll get to that. Um All right. Yeah, okay so, uh You might be thinking yourself Did they address not calling in any superheroes? Well, you know what my favorite one was Let's go over the easier one first actually he says Oh, we're gonna do call in a bunch of bug themed superheroes It's like, I don't know. I was just sitting there like what are you? Spider-man you you are you joking like oh, he's a bug themed superhero. It's like Okay It's how yeah, it's how they disrespect their own character I mean they're disrespecting dr. Strange thought this entire fucking movie And then your biggest superhero ever the one that's carried your fucking company for decades. Yeah, he's just a bug superhero I don't understand It's funny. It's funny. Haha. He's bug themed. Bug is a funny word. Yeah, an end man This is what Bob turned into it's like It's fucking pop vinyls and and laughing at uh, yeah, it's you know You don't want to make it too serious, but like Jesus Christ What's spider-man gonna do against wander my friend. He is not talking about that when he says that line He's talking about fighting these monster things. He's talking to her about bringing in spider-man And he says why would I need to bring giant man versus tentacle boy pretty sure giant man would be able to help But no, he's a bug themed superhero. It's like Okay, I don't know And you realize like oh fuck that was supposed to make the audience laugh wasn't it? Yeah, damn But okay, so there was like no laughing in my theater by the way I didn't laugh ever but even my theater full of people who clearly liked a lot of parts It was on my theater. I was having a great great time Also, if I could just clarify by the way, even if you said there's no point in calling spider-man What's he gonna do against wander? I'd be like motherfucker. It's the end of the multiverse. You may as well Let's get it fucking off We need to stop her at all costs. You understand like we should bring in fucking postman pat He needs to be here too throwing mail at her like Not to mention all of just the militaries of the world with guns No guns Better things Like what's she gonna do? Have the reaction time to stop bullets Arrows are there comes a time where you just need to throw bodies at a problem no matter Honestly, we're getting there. That's what all this is leading to I basically say So why don't they bring in some other people? Well, he mentions hawkeye and he's like a fucking guy with a bow and arrow like Really? You literally have a whole army of archers Except hawkeye actually has a bit of a relationship with wander. So that might help I wanted to address it mechanically first like his abilities. He's the best archer in the fucking world He has the kind of technology that basically can apply to any enemy. He has crazy arrows He has super way better. They're better than magic arrows because the magic arrows are fucking shameless Don't do anything. They don't do anything So you got that already, but then you're like, yeah Do you know who the one person who might actually be able to stop her is on planet earth right now? Because nobody knows about vision because everyone nobody cares about that until they're gonna care about it Whatever is clint. He's the one you should probably bring in to talk her down to be like wonder Your your brother wouldn't want this Yeah, yeah, these kids. They wouldn't want that, you know because wonder in the snap I lost my kids in the snap and the way I handled that was not Yeah, yes Yes, and they don't use any of it. They don't they don't use any of it and well, they don't give him some like stuff Wow, you talked about some stuff The truth of it is that they didn't want her killing any mainline mcu heroes because then that'd be Because unfortunately for some reason this isn't the point of no return Um In sort of I guess a broad sort of perspective on the character But I mean if she killed spider-man like that would be there would that would be the end of like broad investment in this character So it's a lot safer to just put her a get a bunch of nameless people and then kill variants So that so that you can still have her be a hero in a subsequent story That's the reality of this choice and this kids is why You do indeed Uh create inconsistency It's like oh that laser shouldn't blow that up if it didn't blow that up and stuff But when you don't care about continuity you also miss opportunities You miss big chances to create emotional payoffs almost for free Because they're all set up previously and they're there for you But because you don't care about the stuff that came before You don't even know that that's a possibility and yet completely lost the potential because They didn't even recognize that was the situation instead. They have dr. Strange say What am I gonna do? Brigadier archer with a mohawk? No Okay, like they saved the world all together. It's like he has no respect for his teammates. Like what a piece of shit Fucking asshole. Fuck that guy. Fuck him It was annoying to say the least but of course. Yeah, you could be like well fine We're not gonna bring in the bugs or the archer because you're an idiot But what about captain marvel the most powerful I just want to go through one by one to make sure people understand how this is possible because I already know Someone out there is being like captain marvel. She's probably busy. It's like okay So dr. Strange has the capacity as proven in at least no way home But I think that there are other places that this is proven to open portals to wherever the person is By thinking about them We know in xiangxi because of the post credit scene that he has a direct line of communication with with a Because wang had it Well, so I was just clarifying that even without that Right, so yeah, he can get to nick fury and then nick fury will get him to everyone in the cosmic side of the universe And when you tell nick fury, we're dealing with a fight on earth right now that if we don't win the entire multi-verse is destroyed Essentially, I think that might mobilize some people to help you Yeah And then you might be like, well, how will they get there in time? Don't worry, baby. We got portals Look like you asked You see captain marvel can't go to kamatash because kamatash is like full of stone statues Oh Yeah, it's pretty scary You'll understand that reference in seven hours from now Um So, yeah, that's obviously um as as fringes just highlighted xiangxi is an easy fucking choice He's got yeah, those rings man That are like super powerful and we happen to know that wang and strange are very much aware of him And they have access to him. In fact, he's probably chilling in some restaurant right now with those rings He's probably available. Yeah, you're gonna want him too. And then well you you you sort of dot dot dot You're like, don't fuck it every single person every single person that has an investment in the multi-verse not being destroyed grab them I would take a fucking bucky grab him get him with a gun Him shuna here might actually kill her But no, um, you again in chat you might be wondering so who do they get? Uh, it's well, it's dr. Strange Wong yeah, and The sorcerers in kamatash All right, who else and and a few other sorcerers from the other, um Sanctums in hong kong and uh, london. Yeah, they make like a big deal of yeah, like six of them right Oh, look, there's those guys who nobody knows, but they're like powerful like they just fucking die Oh I'm the minotaur. Yeah, what's up with the green minotaur? He's just another movie that i missed. I don't know Because he gets an odd amount of screen time, which i'm fine with it's just weird It is weird because it's like well, he's not from then From a different I don't think so and let's I don't know already. I don't know. It just seems odd that you're just here Is like I see a random alien and mass effect or whatever. I'm like, okay. That's just normal But I look at you and you're like you are not comics. It's like I figure I just don't know Who he is or where he's from here, but just fine. It's just you know um And they all they all assemble to to well then there's the I think that's like an enormous issue There's already been several enormous issues, but the fact that they're about to defend the multiverse from destruction They don't give a shit to call anybody so dumb. Yeah, it's my checkout point. This was it in the theater in the moment Um, there are so many things to go through people in chat already highlight and so many things that are wrong with this scene It's it's tough to figure out how to because we'll talk about battle tactics We'll talk about the conversation that wander and strange have we'll talk about wander's Decisions when attacking we'll talk about their formation Like I just don't know which one to go first chronologically speaking We'll probably go with their conversation because that's what happens next. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, um Wanda's uh arrived Dr. Strange Go ahead. It's rent. It's rent. Sorry. I was distracted. Uh Big-time comic artists died today. I just found out George pres who drew a lot of scarlet witch Through a lot of Avengers a lot of this stuff. So rest in peace down Dude Teen Titans. Uh, he's a legend absolute fucking legend so head cancer We lost uh neil adams and george prez within a couple of weeks Damn left Yeah, what we're left with We'll never ever achieve what these guys did so Yeah But uh, he was absolutely Like third favorite artist second favorite artist and pretty much drew every comic book when I was a kid that I loved Oh, yeah, man, uh I'm Fucking cancer as well A cancer You can go on Yeah So, yeah, they they have a chat wong is like, you know, please be careful the you know, this this matters quite a bit and uh up he goes and She's uh, I think the first thing That he says is you are justifiably angry Nah, I was very annoyed to fucking hear him say very annoyed justifiably angry Huh, and what you discover is he's referring specifically to what she had to do to vision and it's like what does that have to do with this? Yeah, that was just an isolated bad thing that happened in our life She's over vision. She's well. I mean she doesn't she doesn't give a shit about me I'm glad you said that I was gonna bring it up in about a couple of sentences Isn't it interesting that her entire motivation has nothing to do with vision I think I should wheel out vision's corpse to try and justify her insanity I uh strange how little vision ever comes up in this movie. I I will go further. I will say it's uh abject assassination of her character that all of her perfect worlds don't have vision in it after you watch Wanda vision and yeah, well, I think that's all you need to prove that this isn't completely incongruous with what they've established One of those people you could have called was vision Yep, still alive. Well white vision. Yeah, nobody knows where he is gary. Nobody's spoken to him. He's in a fucking cave somewhere I don't know Because the cave spearing come all over the walls because other vision didn't tell anybody about him He just left that out in the air. There's no no one knows about that So yeah, um It's actually annoying that uh her perfect world is here with the kids No vision when she can just have vision would be a thing too. It's infinite universes There has got to be one where he didn't die and the kids are fine Oh, do you think they did that because it didn't want to? You would pull that? Sorry I presumably they didn't want to have to deal with pull that and he being in this No, they This and don't want to deal with the consequences of him possibly being there in the other multiverses When she's going apeshit and then oh, well, you're right actually Yeah, because that's another variable where he's around because if vision is alive and well in all these other universes Yeah, he's one of the people that could probably kill her. Yeah Yeah, so yeah, um Absolute fuck up that she doesn't even care about vision beyond saying he died and that pissed me off Now i'm gonna go to other universes in which people who are previously dead are now alive that I can hang out with It's like like vision and she's like, no All right, doesn't come up again Speaking he should have been in this film. Oh, yeah, it's like required Been in it at it's based on one division So i'm gonna go one step further and I think it's the they just didn't want another dude in the film That's it. You know they could look for him or Well, it could be the johnny dev stuff I could that could play into it I don't know because at that point if it was out that he had sent that message about the whole The thing with hamberhead was really funny, but if if in the right context can come across as very, um, aggressive Let's say maybe they were uh Because didn't fall about any at one point say that he thought like his career was over because of different controversies But then he got iron man To be the voice of javis and he was like holy shit um I think It'll be interesting to see if he gets to have more roles after what's been happening. I don't know What has happened and i'm not i'm out of the loop. Well, so he's gonna is he testifying at all? I don't know so He's he's tied up a little bit in the uh in the hamberhead johnny dev case because he had text back and forth With johnny dev about how much for horrible person she is. Um, oh I think that's a win. It's well, it should be a win at this point Like you think public opinion anyway But if you remember there was a time where it was kind of the reverse and the uh So, you know, and this is all planned ahead. So I don't know It could be a lot of reasons why vision is not allowed in this film uh that are meta But it's fucked the film up Then again, it was already fucked up. So Apparently he did not testify fair enough Yeah, I I I just believe it's an agency thing Like the producers who don't really give a shit about the plot are just like this will rob wanda of our agency Well, he said that about dr. Strange. So it's not impossible that it would have been this again I just uh, whatever the fucking decision was is dumb and you fucked everything up by doing it Yep Like he said he didn't want dr. Strange at the end of wanda vision because it would be just another white guy telling her what to do Which is uh, which everybody if you can't recognize it. That's some good old-fashioned racism and sexism right there Nice bundle them together package deal Yeah So to speak Have we gotten into how Wanda is quote-unquote unique in the multiverse in this um version of the uh In uh, you mean america? Oh, no, no, no, no. Well, well, there's that but then there's uh, i'm trying not to give it away, but um if we haven't already have it but uh Wanda's um How wonder looked into the multiverse and saw how she was different to every other wonder in the multiverse We are almost kind of vish able to talk about that. Yeah, it's gonna pop up the astronomical Yeah, you are not wrong. They're uh, yeah, i'm not even sure if he's talking about that one rags There's so much wrong with this film. It is insane the dimensions to which this is wrong which so, uh Yeah, so that's what he opens with you're justifiably angry fucking annoying and then he says you've had to make terrible sacrifices And she cuts him off angrily and says I blew a hole Through the head of the man that I loved and it meant nothing. Don't speak to me about sacrifices, steven He did dude literally died died he So it's worse than that not only did he allow himself to be fucking killed in order to try and save the universe He agrees with her. He said yeah, you've had to make terrible sacrifices and then she's like Actually, I have made loads of sacrifices like Yes, yeah Yeah, where are you are you okay as the the dark hold has clouded your mind Brought into your brain Is rotten it's your brain. Yes. I was so fucking confused. I was like, why are you angry at him? He just said that you did the thing and the only interpretation I can come up with that might make some sense in some distant universe Is the fact that he said you've had to make terrible sacrifices and she said I had to kill him and it didn't mean anything as if to imply It was a sacrifice that didn't have any payoff if you understand what i'm saying like I know yeah, I know what you mean So like don't speak to me about sacrifice, but that still doesn't really make sense. Does it like no Because it was a sacrifice. It's still a sacrifice you wanted. You just yeah, you just don't get what you want. That's all Yeah Which um, yeah, it sucks But I mean just cringe you fucking dialogue where he gives her everything she wants To start with which was annoying, but okay, and then she like spits it back. It's like Yeah, all right Um So Uh, there's one line. I actually like here though kind of and I don't know if it's I'm deciding whether or not It's the performance or if it's the the writing but performance when she says um, you know If you let me have a I can put you in a universe where you can be with uh, christine Which uh, is like, okay. That's that's kind of like that might tempt him he looks like he Kind of like like he he backs up and looks almost furious at it And I have a feeling what I gather from that is the fact that he knows that that's actually tempting Yeah, and that's why because his response to that is the full might of camotage stands against you Um, basically it's like him switching from being like, okay, can we solve this to hostile? The second she said that because I have a feeling that he sees it as like, oh, fuck She could totally mind control me might actually So I appreciate that I feel like a lot of that will probably stem from his performance more so than because Yeah, it definitely feels like he's working hard when you imbue a really bad script with as much character as he could Yeah, well the fact that he said he wasn't even sure of what the fuck was going on for his character in this Yeah, which whole thing's considered Dan, but we'll get to that. Um Yeah, it was that and then I don't remember everything that happens in that just like Oh, yeah, so she says, um, I've been being reasonable up to this point And he says the thing of like you just any monsters after all the fuck I was unreasonable and then she's like that was mercy to not have me come after her And again, it's like, okay. I want to think through this for five seconds Ga-gargantos is the example we'll go with because he's in this universe meaning she could have gone after her personally He's smashing and crashing through everything to very fumbly try and pick her up But then what I'm assuming he can't stop the power himself. He has to bring her to you Or you have to come to him to get the power, right? Is that how that works? Like do I need to explain how stupid that is as a strategy? Why don't you just fly over pick her up with telekinesis Stapid power and you don't have to destroy a building. You don't have to throw a motorcycle Doesn't doesn't draw any attention. No. Yeah, you could even drop down and be like you have great power I can sense it. Are you are you okay? You safe? I'm I'm the scarlet witch I am maybe even introduce yourself as just wander. I'm a fucking hero in this universe or whatever Because maybe she even says like I can tell from your signature You're not from this it basically end the conversation with like can I can I look after you can I take care of you? Especially because wander would know at that point that she's running away from monsters that she doesn't know the context for We're like, I'll look after you come to my come to my nice house Now just sit in this nice chair drink this nice tea It's made of candy. Yeah. Now you're asleep. Are you down? That you have a power kill you and you're in my dungeon. Nobody knows I've even done this Nobody even knows who america chavez is You can bury that corpse Nobody would know anything But no, I will send a giant tentacle monster after you in new york city Because I'm being merciful What That's what I mean like this is staggering levels of stupidity Hey, man, I said godzilla after you instead of detonating the nuke myself. I'm being fucking merciful. Yep Thank you insane Absolutely crazy, and yeah, uh That's her logic when in reality it's more so that they needed to have different villains to bait in the trailers like the creepy monsters And and they didn't want it to be overt that she was going to be the bad guy Because if they'd started with her as the bad guy like she's chasing them in that opening sequence And there's no monsters at all. You can't really use them in the trailers Do you just be like, yeah, so yeah, we've got to got it Got to keep the reveal that she's the villain up to about the half hour mark or something any way we can do it Oh But that's a justification it'll get worse by the way when you find out more about how she can use that dark holes Um Anyone else thinking of that conversation? I think that was mostly uh Is that where she says that she dreams of a dream dream about the children It's even later god damn it Uh She doesn't try to kill him once she ends the conversation with firing a blast directly at him But she's surprised to find there's a barrier So, you know like if you wanted overt, uh confirmation that she's willing to kill him. There it is Yeah, yeah, right there because she's already killed several doctor strangers at this point for all we know At least one Yeah, um and something that frustrated me immediately Because because i'm like this when i'm watching movies, I guess is he starts flying down I was like bro mirror divention mirror divention right now. What are you doing? I learned the mirror dimension Now what are you doing? It just flies down. He's like right everybody prepare the barriers. What are you doing? Mirror divention Orinals up something. Oh You know sometimes I like I think to myself like is there even a point in thinking about the portals because they just like Pretend they don't have them all the time That happens in the the new star trek a lot they forget they have transporters all the time they get in the way gary We wouldn't want that they get in the way of our story So, uh, yeah, no portals no mirror dimension Instead and this is the part where we talk about battle tactics. I guess they have Let's call it a third of their sorcerers trying to organize a barrier while the rest of them stand and watch Yep This includes strange and wong Strange and wong do not do any spells They're just looking so god's gonna be fine. I guess They're just watching. It's not there's no it's fine if things don't go our way It's really they have no investment in this happening before their eyes. It's all good Just I like this in chat you got back to back. They never did the mirror dimension They used the mirror dimension. All right, so both of you Just wait. Okay. First of all, oh, they didn't use it when they were supposed to but they do eventually use it But we'll get to that. We're gonna we're gonna. Oh boy. We both have pieces of the truth. Yes. You're both almost there so, uh yeah, um Beyond frustrating watching this like you guys have the most inept fucking defense ever if you have loads of sorcerers Who would organizing a barrier which is apparently is a tough thing to do because wong is like you got to hold it guys You got to hold it like why haven't you got more people doing it? Why why isn't there even two layers? Fuck it. You got loads of sorcerers and is this the plan? You're just gonna try and maintain the barrier until she just fucking leaves. Is that it? Yeah, yes It's like i'll fuck it and then it's like we're gonna go they have arches Why aren't they firing and if it's like well, they can't go through the barrier It's like wow you guys are just fucking stupid, huh with your plans like this is just what is this? Why you even have arches and Well, yeah, we're pretty chill about it until she starts firing some bolts Thing is they don't go through you see it's a magical barrier that prevents magic from getting through is like all right, okay Oh, thank goodness. We that's important. That's good. I think what's funny by the way Is when she fires a couple of blasts wong is like reinforce the barrier and a bunch of Sorcerers just come in and start activating the barrier powers. It's like why weren't you here already? Yeah, where are you with the fuck going on fuckers holding bows put those down and keep the shield up Exactly the bows if you have the shield up And so On the subject of the archers like and hawkeye not being there like if you want if they wanted their spectacle with the archers Why not have this really cool spectacle of hawkeye literally Guiding a group of archers to defend kamatage that would that that would that would put us in seats. Would it not? Probably He's gonna mohawk. No, we make fun of him. Where are the shang chi archers? Where's marvel's katie? She could have taken her marvel's katie could have done something here, but no So She's got to think outside the box How how is she think outside the dome if you will how does she get in here? What she do? um She decides to Mind influence one of the barrier people into being afraid and he runs away Now this was not satisfying to me Because that means her magic can get through the barrier Yep Which means a semi permeable barrier and if someone was like Well, yeah, she can get those powers through and be like so can she get telekinesis through That's not and it's like well Powers are just really different than the blasts that she was making Well, so if you throw a projectile That's fine with me that it can block that and it and but But it can't block a mine thing, but it's like but then surely it can't block telekinesis She should be able to pick people up from where she is And if she if her mind powers can get through you need to make all of your defenders aware of that Well, it seems that wong is aware of that. He says you have to why I bring it up. Yeah And so If if that's a reality I just yeah, we're we're fucked then aren't we because um, she can just make all of you afraid one by one until she just wins So um, I think it's incredibly unsatisfying that the way she defeats the magic barrier is using magic I think that I guess it's like well, how else are you gonna do it? It's like, I don't know fucking think for five seconds I know that that's like not something you guys like to do in writing these But come on like there's gotta be more things that you she could do you could even like in Get one of those fucking monsters Yeah, get a monster and just drop it down into the to have them have them punch away drill have a Have a dig. Yeah burrow underneath it sap that shit But um, yeah, do something clever or that you know, no that one of my suggestions weren't even clever. They were just like, yeah That's what I'm saying. I think though what you just said are all the five second suggestions Where you've got to think about it for five seconds And they're all more satisfying than her going. Hmm. My spells aren't working. Let me try my spells And then we can the ground under them and she doesn't even like say to herself I need a different kind of magic to imply that there's a legit difference like that would be something something I assume that's what we're supposed to believe. I just don't understand why that would mean Your telekinesis wouldn't work and in which case that's a way better. She starts using it once the barrier goes down But I'm like, well, why wouldn't you be able to use that anyway? It's it's at-range magical casting on a person. That's what the fucking mind control is So how is it that that would work? But the telekinesis wouldn't I don't understand That's the only reason she can't even do that is because no one else is attacking her Everyone is just standing there and just Well, yeah, so while she's doing you're right while she's doing the mind control That is the perfect time to drop literally an anvil on her. Why not just do that with a portal? Long and strange all right fucking here and just make them do magic things Is that One single barrier only. Oh, sorry. No, I was just you know brought up the portals again I can't let it go. Yeah, I shouldn't let it go. It's so dumb that they can never fucking use it Portals are such a cheating tool like just use it for everything It's so good. It's so useful Well, yeah, and to be honest with you at this point They should be portaling america out As the fight starts get her out of there just because she cannot be captured. You need to get her out Yeah, teleport her to titan Okay. Yeah, why not teleport scala. Wish the titan What the fuck is she gonna do the vacuum of space? Well, you see friggy. We're not allowed to editate that because yeah, we can't do that It's like superman can't just pick people up and carry them into space because that would genuinely People will say is like they've never done that before so what makes you think it's possible It's like, you know what they have done a portal to titan so we can do that do that Just tight teleport them to a place that doesn't have an atmosphere like the moon Yeah, we've never seen that happen before we don't know that they can do that Even though they teleported from titan to earth in endgame. Yeah, well, that's a different Spider-man was on titan. That's why So that magic barrier that they're putting up is that only protecting the entrance because if so She could just go around the back and just blast a hole in the back of gamutage and then get it that way I don't know if the implication was just that they're making a big dome around the whole place. Yeah, I assume so at least of our concerns Well, maybe you wonder like is how does it go down all the way? That would be cool if she had a creature trying to burrow and it starts digging down But it just like it hits the bottom side of the spell barrier and it's like, oh well, I mean I get all right, you know not unheard of but it was worth a shot Yeah, it's worth it's worth reminding everybody as well that the portals can be moved they can actively move seen him do this so You can even you don't have to you know, hope she falls into one You could just move it on to her her strategy should be to steal a sling ring Yeah, so she can portal inside to wherever to America and then Grab her that would have been the plot Oh, what if she gets a sling ring? No, uh, she'll instead just do one one by the way one mind trick. That's it I Okay, it's like one percent weaker now. Is that is that the threshold for you being able to get in? Oh, well rags. Don't you remember he runs? He runs into five people So there's like six down now and it's funny because wong and strange just look at the gap like oh, no It's like guys cast spells Yes, you can do that do something It's funny um A big bolt of light comes down from here and hits the ground right and explodes everything and then a bunch of Rocks are about to hit some people and dr. Strange makes a shield to stop that from happening And it's like bro. Yes, you could have made a shield to stop the bolt of light. You can't He could probably do a dome by himself He's super powerful. Well, yeah, uh, there was a huge shield made by wong and infinity ball. Yeah, exactly It's yeah, it's absolutely embarrassing and it's so quick too within like 30 seconds. She just kills everyone Yeah, and thus begins and and you get to hear all the sorcerers scream as they get like thrown off and arrows shot into them and blown up and disintegrated All of these people who are very nobily Putting their lives on the line to defend the multiverse essentially sages is what these guys are Like that's essentially what the sorcerers are. They're super balanced altruistic people dying horrible deaths It's yeah Yeah, I'm gonna say the bolts of that. Um, you get the standard disney deaths where she like throws a big red ball down They'll go whoa and fall over and you're like, oh, they're probably dead Then you get a more overt one where she grabs the arrows in midair and fires them all back and they impale all the people Who fired them so that's a grim Yeah But even then that's not like too bad because they're mad to the like red now and they're sticking in them And there's not like bloods flying everywhere. So it's like, oh, they got hit with arrows I'm not even getting for gore more so than just Is the weird grizzly is that what i'm looking for where it's just like something It's like throwing someone Throwing someone off a cliff, for example, it can you just feel like uh, it's like, oh, that's not pretty Yeah, yeah But then we have like so for example when uh thanos is torturing nebula. It's kind of like, oh man She's like it when an actor does a really good scream It can make you really uncomfortable because you're just like yeah looks like it's fucking painful. Um So all those deaths, they're all over level. I think the impaling them with all the arrows was still kind of like wow All right. Yeah, okay But there's one And i'm pretty sure most if not all of you know what i'm gonna say next in terms of a kill she does Um, they all run inside because it's fucking over. She goes up the entire place Terrified now you might imagine as with how wall works A lot of people are dead. There's probably some injured on the battlefield She lands Edding inside and the camera like i don't i'm not sure if this was a good choice. Let's just put it that way There's a guy who is crawling toward the entrance screaming in pain and she fucking vaporizes it You know you're thinking different things There's not even a body left to bury for that guy who had a whole life Um and died because of wander's absurd motives. It's um like I I don't I like yeah, I don't like watching this, you know, like I don't like seeing this Yeah, it's like I get it It's it's like that's what she would do But it's really off-putting to see this happening especially in a marvel movie No, I I so this is what I would clarify when I see Thanos do bad things I can at least watch it with the knowledge Okay, the film and also broader society recognizes that he's the villain So I can just sit there and be chill with that Um, unfortunately because it's like oh, we all agree, right? He's like a monster. You know, he's a bad guy, right? He's doing yeah, we agree. This is bad. What's happening. It's supposed to be seen as a very bad thing. Alas Seems like there's a decent amount of people who are like, oh, yes queen sleigh and it's like dude Like I don't want to venture with like This dude is crawling. He is a hero dying to save the most diverse and he gets vaporized Not even a body left to bury now And I meant to feel like any level of sympathy for wonder like, oh, well, you know your life sucks You know what that guy you don't know what his life was but he's dead now because of your stupid goals Fringing you and I are kind of you're on the There's a different aspect one thing that I thought Mahler was going to highlight Which is that when she lands and there's that that little shockwave you can see the corp is rolling and tumbling Yeah, you're right over one another and I'm like, oh, this is Marvel it's this is getting that's kind of grim So is that so you're complaining about Marvel being dark now? It's like seems like he didn't pay attention to anything anyone said, but it's not about Well, so my main argument is um, I respect the ones that have been made already But like the one I went to first is why it made me uncomfortable was just um So you put all this effort into explaining that she's Invested in doing this the quickest easiest and painless way possible to get what she wants This guy is done. He's out of the fight. He's if anything. He's just trying to survive You don't need to do anything to him. Yeah. Yeah, this is good Because she felt like it because she's cruel Like yeah, it's not even like I'm evil and In the execution of my goal. It's like I'm going out of my way to unnecessarily Slay people who wanted to stop me understand because there's a there should it's like Thanos understood why people Yeah, that's right. Yeah, like there was that Yeah, yeah, like I know that you why you are I expect you to that's why I brought an army and um Wanda's just seems like he going out of the way to be cruel and just terrible And just to make sure you understand like they're she didn't check if everyone's dead and make sure like she kills This guy got that treatment that because later will discover that her lack of investment in making sure that this place is now safe for her costs a big time, but uh it's It's just it's just weird to watch that she just sees this guy screaming in pain. It's just like fuck you How dare you try and Stop me or your way back to life even though you are no threat to me anymore. Mm-hmm Um and just in regards to some of the content. Uh, this isn't really a criticism as much as it is just an observation like it does get It does get quite graphic Especially later in the film to the point where I wonder how the hell did this get a pg-13 rating? Yeah, that's one of the things I said to moller when I got back and we kind of just had a casual chat was like Wow, this was really testing in our rating And it's weird is that it's not like throughout it's specific things that are not Necessary that they went through to show and were really uncomfortable to watch That you would think oh this is we're really getting into our territory here Kind of I guess I guess an aspect that's probably annoying me as well as the knowledge that for for sure She will become a hero later on and it's like every time I watch that I'm just going to be like Oh, yeah, remember all those people you killed in kamata's like that dude was crawling away And then you just executed him. You know what I mean? Like I I guess I guess maybe my frustration does stem from the matter the knowledge that she will Absolutely become a hero again at some stage in the future And and then you kind of have to just pretend like none of this really happened You got to try and divorce it from your mind. It's like well, they're faceless I mean, they're not faceless, but like they have no names. They're just like sorcerers. They're not like named characters Um, I think it is the matter that annoys me here. It's just like a lack of Full recognition of the nature of what's going on here that really bugs me just kind of it rubs me the wrong way She walks past a flaming like half corpse, by the way, it's like Yeah The lady who stabs the book later and things like that where you're like, oh, wow, that's um, so I think that Some people are asking as well. Is it not possible? She's trying to put him out of his misery like no, watch the scene It's definitely not that it's it's the it's I will put you into more misery. It's like maybe you could have lived Even seem to know the nature of his position. She's too far away and this mist everywhere. She just gets rid of him She just sees movement and annihilates cruelly Is this okay for a 12 year old to watch? I mean me at 12 would have been fine with this But I could see a kid getting terrified by this Yeah, if I was 12 watching this I would not have been okay. It would bother me I liked uh a lot of crazy shit. I swear. Okay fun Um So anyway after all that death that carnage. Yeah all that they put her in the mirror dimension Yeah, that's like gone on. This is gone fucking hell young lady Absolutely crazy when I saw the she was in the mirror. I was like you now Like I don't know guys long and strange you are in part responsible for these people. They are your mentees They are your up to you for guidance Yeah along in particular Knows these people probably very personally Wong Wong seems to care a lot about the students like that's a big aspect of him is that he cares about me It used to be that moment where he's just like overcome with the the loss where he's like, holy fuck like Yeah, I think that's what I mean. Yeah Yeah, that's that's the thing that we're missing. We needed No acknowledgement Yes, there's no acknowledgement of this On does it like give a flying fuck about her colleagues. Yeah, I think yeah, I think that's I think that's what is needed is um Is like an in film sort of clear like through characters sort of you know, just like Looks or you know shots and stuff just like a clear recognition of like damn. This is awful What's happening? These are not just random background mooks being killed by a hero. No, these are very good people. Yeah He was writhing in pain. Yes. Wanda put him out of his misery I'm glad she's a doctor and knows that he's got no chance of living and thus needs to be executed and remember To integrate him, you know, there's nothing left. It's as though he never even existed. Yeah, don't give me that shit No, put it that's like shooting someone in the head Or like dropping something huge on them. So they're dead in an instant. They don't even know what happens That's that's putting something out of its misery Erasing And remember disintegrating him from the feet down from the feet up rather. Yeah, not even what they'll feel that So that's a fun ending to have. Yeah Yeah, that's someone just beautifully put it. It's a sacrifice. She was willing to make Yep And then in the next movie, they'll just say, oh, well, she put everything right in the end. So it's Well, I mean, I mean in the end of the film, they say she did the right thing and it's like This film is character vomit it makes you just sick Yeah, for those who um in chat who are following our our description of this story only You must be like wait, so the credits next then she's in the mirror Let's let's remind ourselves of what we were told about the mirror dimension by the ancient one One of the most powerful beings and wisest beings on earth Basically the mirror dimension is used to surveil earth It's used to contain threats And you do not want to be in the mirror verse mirror dimension rather without a sling ring because that means you're trapped And uh, this almost happens to kaecilius who's almost as powerful as she is if not the same Not a quick question speaking of the ancient one. Are there is there a multi-versus worth of ancient ones that they could talk to? I imagine Dude if if if you want to like talk about all the people that they could get to help them It's just it's infrared It's literally infinite I think the ancient one would be one of the number one people that you would want to seek out because of um, I guess in this version him or hers knowledge of the multi-verse and its Implications and their their understanding of it. So they would be one of the first people to go to In another if you ended up in another dimension if that was to happen Um, if you found yourself there, but potentially you'd want to explore and find the ancient one equivalent That should be one of the first questions that he asks definitely not morto later on in the movie But I guess you'll get there. Um someone said fuck. It's not over. We're not out of act one yet Yeah in One of the one of them is But what about all the other it's a multi-verse um So I was very happy to see her in the in the mirror dimension even though it was fucking late as hell I was just like thank fuck. She's done Even tries to like break it With her powers and it bounces around the room and almost hits her it makes funny cartoon noises and I was just like Yeah, so fuck you Stay in there forever you bitch and then um well, she just Gets out He just yeah, she just gets out. He just he just gets out And you're probably thinking like well, there must be some mechanic to it, right like well She can travel through reflections Yeah Yeah, and and so the way that we see this manifest is they're in this little room in the back Uh, and there are these two guys who are standing on puddles who get dragged in so their bodies will never be recovered They're gone forever. No funeral. No no burial for them. Like they're just standing on the puddles It's like man, you guys weren't standing on those puddles You'd still be alive. Can we can we rewind and just say why the fuck are there puddles in this room? Yeah, what's what's going on? Why is this the puddle room? Why are there puddles? Because even though this is the 21st fucking century This castle hasn't like a proper roof or windows they could close or I don't Something the most secure place that they could have brought her to America too is really leaky and open kind of Yeah, and lots of reflection Also, yeah to travel through reflections, right? It's like well what reflects in a significant imagey type of way It's like well a big puddle and it's like all right We get some big puddles in this room and I feel like I'm missing something Does anyone know why there are puddles in this room or is it just no reason at all? There were just puddles there Maybe they just watered the flowers today. I don't know It wasn't raining. It was a sunny day like yeah, but it was raining. No, no It was raining a previous day and then it piles up and it takes a while for it to evaporate. That's just that's training Water magic your buddies It probably would have made more sense to have done that She said she was coming at nightfall didn't she and then see if you had done it at nightfall And then had it rain and when she just damaged parts of the castle with her attacks You have it leak in and then you got your puddles You have yeah, you show you have that as your cutaway to a scene is characters walkoff But the shot lingers on the floor where slowly drips are starting to Create a puddle and then the audience thinks why oh why are you showing me this? And then you carry on and then it comes back later as a thing Which still doesn't explain how the fuck she got out of the mirrorverse But at least at least we got like some level of Set up an artist tree that went into this Yeah People is saying the soul for a wee wee maybe Hmm She could pop a squat and piss and Travel through So, uh, yeah, that's that just if anyone's just a little bit like way what it's like So she traveled out of the mirrorverse by just touching one of the walls of it and then coming out of a puddle In in in the real world So it's funny because I completely forgot about the whole mirror Verse mirror dimension thingy. So it's like well, that was a fancy, but shit trapped ahead there Even though I thought the whole point was that you cannot escape it if you're I suppose a funnier part of what the ancient one says about the mirror dimension Is that you cannot affect the real world in the mirror dimension? It's like well, she does the whole point in the mirror dimension No, she yeah, she uses puddles to affect the real world It's like man It's like this isn't the mirror dimension that you put her and you put her in something else Because none of this comports with what we've seen of the mirror dimension. Yeah, well, you know responses to that. She's really powerful Yeah, that's yeah, she is okay. I guess she is Um, they're all I don't know very There are reflections in many things your eye has reflections Yeah, you crawl out of your eye. Yes like what I yeah, I guess um, yeah I guess she crawls through the gong and that doesn't look like it's got a very good amount of clear reflection So I guess you can just crawl out of anything that reflects light, which is basically everything She can super do now as well because like all of her bones and stuff are broken, but they heal like she can She's so it's like man. So you're not a really a glass cannon anymore. You're like super duper strong um all right Oh, yeah, I forgot to mention that she got shot with a cannon and it didn't matter It didn't do anything Yeah, it's one of the interesting things about the character super powerful glass cannon. She's frail as any human So I guess that doesn't true anymore um By the way, uh gary if you if you have to run off that's no problems I have to run off. All right. Oh boy. Nice to have you four hours. That's good enough We got through so much of the movie so much of it. That's a lie Uh, yeah, we got through hang on. Okay. I'll get right there. We got through about 30 minutes of the movie Well, if there's anything burning you really wanted to say about the movie go ahead uh, the mcu was not the 616 and Fuck what they did to one of my favorite characters. You'll get there. I hated that I was I I had a little nerd rage in the theater Oh Yeah Fanboy rage there. I was uh, fuck. I could not believe it. Uh, I was just like that's how you're going to introduce them Just pop their heads off and Yeah, just how that whole thing played out was uh, it's really I'm glad we went over it because when I was going to review this I was just going to do like a Fucking eight-minute review. I didn't want to spend a ton of time on it But I'm like, oh, there is so much wrong with this movie. There is like way more wrong and I I would say Like it is worse than captain marvel, which I kind of has always been like the way. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah Movie I've seen this is way worse in so many ways. Oh, yes. I agree Yeah, and I don't like I don't relish saying this shit Uh, I think rags is opening was like can it really be true that we're saying once again This is like well, what do you want us to do? Look how much we this is taken This is probably the longest ratio we have ever had for time In media versus time taken to talk about the problems of it. Nothing like nothing works every line of dialogue every conversation Every plot development everything is wrong It's like someone hit a randomizer on a story and said fuck it ship it out Yeah Exactly Uh, what what did red letter media say about the Picard show? It was like they're playing a game of telephone It's like they were doing that here too. It's it's name damn thing and we just I just watched Moon night, which has probably my favorite line in any marvel thing. Are you an egyptian superhero? Uh, and she says I am uh, I was kind of I'm disappointed. We didn't get are you a Multi-dimensional Puerto Rican LGBTQIA superhero. Uh, we didn't get that him. Well, that's america, right? She's got the badge. Yeah, and she could have said I am and that would have inspired everyone everywhere shame But um, thank you so much for joining us carry Thanks, everyone. Yeah, see you around dude. See you on Bye. Catch you later on the flip side. Take care. Bye That's um, that's gary from neurotic. There's a lot of Media movies tv show he's recently done a lot of reviews of the Picard show If you have an interest in his channel the link is in the description Um, a lot of fun, especially if you're invested in the topics. It's uh I like the idea that we've we've inspired him to make a more scathing review of the film It's funny Um, I wasn't fucking kidding in terms of just non stop problems. You don't even get a second to breathe in this fucking film It's so fun. It's so funny or also sad because when I first wrote everything down it's like, oh, this got pretty bad Then I talked about it on Retro's watch. Oh, this is even worse and now we're like four hours soon It's like holy fucking shit. This is awful. What is happening? Oh, I didn't even really have a chance to process it all um in in the theater I was just kind of letting it all come my way and I wasn't Thinking too hard about it. But even in that kind of placid state. I was just like this is wrong. This is wrong This is contrived. This is wrong. This is wrong. This is contrived. What the fuck have you done to wonder what the fuck? The thing is is that we're real close to something that is like Substantial in terms of an issue that is persistent throughout the movie that we've kind of alluded to that um, yeah But for every one of those we will cover they will be one soon like it'll just Because it doesn't stop. It never ends. Um, but uh, yeah, she crawls out of the gong and and then and then she's like Oh, you say sacrificed all my life. You say that so casually Hey, oh, she crawls out of the gong. Well, what can we say? Yeah The gong according to the film has enough reflection in it that she can crawl out of it Yeah, that's that's all They were definitely trying to evoke like japanese horror when she comes out. Um, you know, yeah, definitely I'm sure people would say like, ah ramy getting his flavor in there once again. I just like, okay Okay, yeah, I don't know that it's just like how did we get here to have this happen as an yeah It's like it's cool and creepy. Sure. I just I had no fucking concept of this being a possibility And I never do with any fucking thing that here all dr. Strange do they just do things and it's like, yeah That's the thing now Oh, I completely forgot the the best part. So Uh, you for anyone listen, you might be like, well, wait, where is everybody? What is everyone doing right now? So they're in a room with wong doctor strange in america And she's coming into it and pretty much there were other guys. They got sucked through puddles. We don't care about them So, yeah, you might be like, well, what are they doing? Why why why are they there? Shouldn't they be gone by now? You you mentioned how you know, probably should have pulled them out ages ago But pulling out now is like well This was a a thing for the writers to solve and this is how I presented it on open bar because I kind of enjoy doing this so They've all got sling rings. She's coming They can portal away and get to safety How do you solve that as a writer as a writer? What do you do to prevent them from being able to portal out with scarlet? Which you know when she's in the mirror dimension, what can you possibly do because that's that's when this is quote unquote solved So, uh, I would Well, they they we could go and Because wonder knows about the fling rings first thing first thing she does when she gets into the barrier Just destroys all the fling rings instantly I wouldn't find that satisfying, but I guess you could do that That's like the first idea I came up with My solution is that in order to hold her in the mirror dimension They have to they have to be channeling some kind of a Something some magical force to help to keep her there Which means that as they are doing that they cannot use their sling rings if they if they loosen up For whatever reason she's going to be able to break out of the mirror trap Um, yeah, I think that's that's possible. Have you got anything for any out of curiosity? I don't really I am funnily enough. I don't really have anything. Um, this is a really difficult problem to solve yeah, because First of all to solve it in general is tough But like to do it in a way that I think would be satisfying with what we know about how rules work in this I think it's really tough because the sling ring is just something that doctor strange always has access to There's it's so not limited in terms of It's potential that it's really hard to do anything with it that reduces it And if he is successful if we argue, maybe he does use it. Maybe he does open it up Like how do we delay it's like maybe Uh, you know, maybe maybe maybe someone suggests they should stay behind There's a bit of drama about that to try and stop her. It's like no most people would just go through right like Exactly. So it's just like hmm. All right. Well You know what? Uh, maybe I'll concede this would have been a tough one in the writer's room to think about And maybe you have to rewind the film a bit more To to to you know change some of the mechanics to make this more justified However, this was the problem they faced in the writing room and so she's in the mirror of this She's she doesn't know how she's gonna get out of it. We cut to them and doctor strange says we got to get out of here He pulls up his hand. You can see the sling ring. He starts opening a portal and then it fails and then his sling ring disappears Ooh clever I wish to see chance reaction to this That that makes sense though because if his sling ring magically disappears for some reason he can't Portal away the total sense it all follows logically Why didn't it disappear? Well, so there was a little bit of red special effects on it when it disappeared. So she disappeared it Oh, but I thought she was in the mirror dimension Um, shut up And does you understand the writing process of this film if she can disintegrate the sling ring Why doesn't she just disintegrate doctor strange? We know that she we know she can Yeah, we saw that poor guy get disintegrated. So why doesn't she disintegrate kill him earlier? because of this is the the the inverse square law of What's it returns diminishing returns? But the magic version of it she going disintegrate them once and then Lose your power to do it again after that the audience has already seen that Blame said wong still has one. I'm sure he's got melted because he has to get given a different one layer So, yeah, she just it's it might be one of my like most hated Solutions a writer has come up to a problem ever It just disappears on his hand. It's like You kidding me because some people are saying like oh like the disappearing knife It's like to be fair That was like really shitty choreography that an editor had to deal with he was like what he's got a knife to it And then they're like just disappear it and he's like you really This was like the rise being like and then doctor strange tries to open a portal, but his sling ring evaporates It's like should have turned into a year. This was planned This was this went through several phases of production. You guys just decided fuck it. It disappears. We can't let him have that I'm sorry. It ruins the whole story. It was definitely an oh fuck it moment Yeah, they didn't give a fuck I was like, I don't know that happens and a lot of there's a lot of those in this film Yeah, and the sling ring is so powerful That it's like, yeah, of course you had to do that because you don't know how to control it You don't know what to do with it when you introduce that shit and doctor strange You should have been like goddamn this has to require an incredible amount of concentration and skill and prowess You need to be vulnerable as you charge it up and prepare that needs to be some limit On this see I can only go some place that I've been before or I It takes so long or there it changes you if you go through too many times too soon or something like that But it seems to be essentially limitless Well, someone did just mention It's like well, then could he get one off one of the corpses? It's like well, that does happen So yeah, she didn't destroy all of them in the area. I mean changing you have gotten one off of the corpses Oh, you know what? We just solved the problem. Maybe Maybe they do go through the portal, but she gets one of the sling rings or she gets someone who's alive and tells them to I I would probably prefer she doesn't know how to do it herself Maybe can we limit her in some way? But if she gets them to open it and then by surprise is there we find out that's mechanically maybe that's the solution That could be a ticking time bomb like that's your that's your ticking clock Right is she has a sling ring. She got it from a corpse. She's sort of aware of what they do She gets trapped in the mirror dimension and it takes her a while to figure it out how to make it work That's your ticking clock. How long is it gonna take for her? Yes, because you know you don't know could it be a day two three We we have no clue. Is she gonna starve or die of thirst? Well, you can have a scene where they've arrived for their portal They conclude she can easily use a sling ring herself or at least get someone else to use one A portal could open any second now with her at it. What do we do? What's the plan? It's like should we split up? A sense of urgency we've got a god forbid we have a sense of urgency in this film But there's your ticking clock boom right there. It's I feel like that's it We've solved a very very difficult problem. You got there We did it and it only took us 10 minutes off the top of our heads and we're doing it for free You then have the problem of wander obtaining teleport as a power I mean, I think the rest of the film should then have to deal with that We'll keep that as a constant Uh, this is the thing we just appreciate Can we just appreciate that they got the the sling ring to disappear and not lift it off the hand with telekinesis An ability that she's had since her first appearance I I feel like was free highlight is funnier. She disintegrates his ring, but not him like What are you doing? And if someone wants to argue it's like well, she likes him it's like fuck off No, she tries to kill him like three times in this scene Yeah But then when we're having a fight with dr. Strange, she just throws him around but we're jumping the gun a bit Well, you know what? It's fine. Yeah, the next thing that happens is. Oh, yeah, I guess you got a bit of a bit of talk first Well, because she said like basically you sacrifice all those lives to keep me from my children And then of course dr. Strange is like no you killed them Yeah, it's really awkward because it's just like why the hell would why would she say that like how does she not understand that she killed them Yep, what else do you say about that? She's like you are the one that killed them. It's like no, it was you We all knows you um So then this is where her argument develops He says wonder your children don't exist And then she's like oh, but they do in the other universes. It's like Oh, okay So this kind of goes against what you said earlier We were like your magical nonsense children are just as meaningful as any other children because mothers make their children this way all the time Now you're saying Yes, my ones are fake But there are other ones in other universes that are real Which is like I said very different from what she said earlier, but okay you're saying this now and then um Strange asks her the most obvious and basic question because If you want to argue I just want to see my kids and anyone who prevents me from doing so I will kill I am being reasonable. I just want to see my kids Like all right, but what about the woman that you're gonna have to deal with who is their their mother Like what is your justification you crazy son of a bitch that you can just kill her and this is enough it's just like um Moon night This is an obvious question He doesn't have a response and they fight Yeah Like this is not something that she's considered it's one of the I think it's one of the two big Of course things that they just don't ever address or talk about this the the one here being What about the Wanda in the world that you invade and the second one being you understand that people from different multiverses Are not the same person, right? Well, yeah, it's it's the thing that you can't the problem is if you acknowledge it The absurdity of the situation becomes impossible to square away. They've which is that of course They aren't your kids. They are another version of you's children A different version of you with a different life experience. We have to tell We have to tell people about this whenever they see Luke Skywalker in a mando show You're like, that's not that's not the Luke Skywalker That's that's some different version of him from a different universe that makes no sense It's not the same one and they're like, why don't they're like, no, no, no It is him and I'll watch every marvel film until I see him again So something I have I have an additional question that I would have asked Wanda, which is Why the fuck are you so intent on killing another version of yourself when you could just find a universe without where the mum yeah with it Yeah, you know correct prevent them ding ding ding ding nobody thinks about that whole movie or the vision thing or the vision or a lot of things now Um, you know what else It's kind of funny because if I were in the room, um, we nobody's going to kill each other and doc strange says like so You're going to kill her I'd be like, dude, look how many people she's killed already like this is getting you know The body counts huge and then Wanda could be like, well, they got in my way I'd be like, yeah, because you can't like send anyone to sleep or anything with mind control You can't you can't do anything that you can't put a big bubble around yourself and just fly to where you need to go You have to kill all these people. You have to disintegrate them. Don't you that's just something you have to do your bitch but He does she does kill a lot of people but She doesn't kill doc strange old wong. She just throws them No, she grows them because like Doctor strange is like here snakes coming to get you that was quite funny block them. Did you like it? What he went Yeah, it's part of the spell you have to become the snake make total sense. I just I was like, what the fuck You have to do that to do the spell. Yeah, that makes the most sense He blocks him and then and then just like throw strange across the room that cape doesn't help me Just he gets hit. Yeah, the cape once again. Give a fuck. Um, and what's probably With mentioning is uh, wong is doing nothing throughout all of this No, he's just standing there watching the snakes. I don't know what the hell he's doing Um, oh, yeah, that's what you were doing just watching the snakes Yeah, that's true. He's the audience in say, okay. Um, um, yeah Snakes dad tosses him then she grabs America and that's when wong decides to do something and then he gets thrown across the room as well. Yeah and then um That's when uh, because then she tries to absorb the powers and then America opens a portal behind her Which I feel is something londa should know By now. Well, she should know that right? Um Well, so this is the thing What is the nature of her sending monsters after people? Does she have a camera? Can she see it with the dark hold? Well, if wait, wait, sorry if she if she uh sends a monster after america and in another universe It has to be able to extract the powers, right? Otherwise, how can the powers be delivered to wander? I wanted to talk about this in the first scene, but I was like, I have to wait I feel like we waited long enough So the idea with these monsters is hopefully that they suck the power from america and they then teleport themselves to wander to be sucked Is that the idea? It has to be otherwise doesn't make any sense at all doesn't like They have to be able to travel the multiverse Because she can't travel the multiverse. So there's no means that she has to get those powers unless they can do it for her Like but how is that a power that they have? Yeah, well the first monster you suck out all powers that someone has This is so funny because it's like how do people know that you can even do this? And then how do people know that when they do it that they will have full control while america does all over that? Yeah Okay, what what if there is it what if it isn't an innate attribute of these powers? You kind of can't control them because the multiverse is so massive that the ability to Choose a location that you need to go to it's just beyond a human mind Yeah, your mind can't possible. No. Yeah. No mo no mind can process this Yeah, except for like some crazy super dude for godlike figure. Yeah Yeah, or if you didn't open the portal in the in the first scene Then we're supposed to assume that spaghetti monster would have yelled at her until A blue light came out of her and went into it He falls and dies and then it's like I have the power now and I know how to use it Open portal. Hey, there's wander walks in and then He goes And then it it falls over and dies and then she's got the power that that has to be her strategy And I have no idea how she knows that any of that would work There's really no reason to think it would right because again america is the only person in the multiverse with this power So there's it would be on it. There would be no evidence or information pertaining to it at all On how how it works that it can even it's a power that can even be transferred between people To be nothing Blaine just suggests it's like I think you'll dreamwalk to that world and take the powers while the demon holds america So all that highlights is that she should just be going personally every time. Why send these monsters if that's possible Well, it's not even about Exactly there's so many reasons why this is so much stupider than just going yourself And by the way, they do they have a throwaway line for that once they establish dreamwalking because I don't know that this film knew it was going to do dreamwalking in the first half when they were making this shit Because um, she does just sort of do it. This it's so awkward when morto explains it, which we're actually getting to soon He explains it and then dr. Strange. No, sorry america's like well, then why didn't she do that before and dr. Strange She goes because she was being reasonable It's like yeah, I'm sorry. That doesn't make any sense. Come on. Why why do you just saying a lie again? Doesn't make it true. It would be more reasonable more merciful and it would be faster Like there's no reason so it's oh so bad But um, yeah, also there you go fringy lucid dreaming in the mcu multiverse is just accidentally dreamwalking So even if you don't have magic and you make no conscious man, that's got to be terrifying. I think you had to have the dreamwalk to do that At any point you need the dark hold to do This is specific. You have to have the dark hold to do that Do you imagine how terrifying that knowledge would be that at any point in time you could lose control of yourself? Because some person is sleeping and they accidentally have no no springy There is an infinite amount of universes, which means that If there's an infinite amount of different versions of you, there's an infinite amount of them that are currently sleeping right now An infinite amount of dreams, which means that it would not be possible for someone to not be Lucid dreaming everything that you do you see this you you say the word infinite and you don't know what it means You're not ready for the implications of this Well, there's an infinite number There's an infinite a number of mcu universes, right? Like where there is this dr. Strange who has had this exact history and everything with Thanos Maybe that's what sleepwalking is but you know that that sleepwalking is where Someone goes into your dream while you are dreaming so it takes over your body and you kind of swap places This is this is going places this this analogy this this joke of mine And there's never like I don't think there's ever any understanding you can have multiverses, but you can say we don't know how many there are Yeah, we don't know if there's just another multiverse There's just another or if there's a hundred more or a million more or there's just an infinite amount It's just this uncountable expanse of multiverses that extends forever. We don't know all that we know is that there are other universes different from ours And then you don't have to worry about making such definitive non-definitive statements Well, there's a reason dc started to structure their multiverse after a while like for for a little bit There were only 52 earths in their multiverse. I think they've fucked it recently But for a while it was just like, okay, you've got a cap. There's 52 Maybe a couple of extras in there if we're feeling frisky, but otherwise 52. That's your lot. We're not going to deal with infinity. Fuck off um oh But this is uh the point when um, yeah the train tackles because as the portal opens he uh He tackles her into the portal But uh, then Wanda like hits his cape and presumably Makes it not be able to fly anymore because they just go uncontrollably tumbling through A whole bunch of multiverses. Best faith interpretation is she zaps it with a fireball and it it makes it so the cloak can no longer do fly Yeah, um now Oh, do you have something? so She's sapping the power from chavez and then sees dr. Strange is heading to tackle her so First obvious move is just pull america away from him. No, just pull america away from him. Let him pull whatever Um, if you're not gonna opt for that then obviously yeah, you just you hold him in place with telekinesis Just do that if you're not gonna opt for that you vaporize him You're not gonna opt for that use any of the countless spells to kill him Not what you did what you did was pretty much the worst thing you could do by nothing at all The it's the only thing I think she could do that makes it look like she's doing something But it doesn't really have much of an effect Yep Yeah, nice. Yeah now So remember she has no control over opening the portals like in terms of seemingly location or The universe itself like the properties of that universe So like man real lucky that none of those portals opened up to the vacuum of space That's one you've got to save until we get to nearly the the end of the film Uh, no, I don't think so because it's like the movie If you're not gonna bring in that reference then yeah, he's making all your criticisms inert Oh, yeah, right. Yeah, because that No, we can we can cycle back through all the examples of her using the portal after we're given the final Yeah, let's call it rule Yeah, we can see how well it actually makes any fucking sense or not because um, yeah Wow, they end up in a in a futuristic looking universe Basically after traveling through a whole bunch of them Yes, and it's through all of the universes. They have including one where they made a paint. Yeah They land in a place and in a Put in a universe that is comprehensible to them that is very similar to our own New York in New York a couple places that just the astronomical unfathomable Fortunetness Wow, I guess you can't talk about that. Yeah, I don't know why There will be people who listen to this would be like so rags didn't watch the film then It's like we got to wait until we get to that bit of information then we can uh, oh, yeah, that's right There's got to go away. We'll come back and talk about it later. Yeah for now Portals are opening and they're ending up in places that aren't death. So that's good. We'll talk about that later. Uh So strange is pretty angry. He's like my my Cloak is fucked. We got to go back open a portal And america's already explained this to him by the way. She does earlier in the film But she has to explain again. I have no control of that shit and he's like that's unacceptable. I have to save wong And she's like, well, I can't do anything so So good and then he he's sort of good does like well, I guess I couldn't really help him anyway Like and that oh an all sense of urgency pertaining to getting back to come attached to save one To save wong and the students is gone for the rest of the film Uh, really sad Yeah They are just chilling. Just can now maybe maybe maybe you're out there thinking well, he's right He really can't do anything to her and if anything it's bad if he gets to it in any way Capacity with america because you know if wander gets america, it's all over. It's like well Let's go through where they are exactly They they talk about how they've entered this this alternate new york city and that um, they need Get access to help of some kind Maybe they have to get that book of ashanti. She mentioned and he's like that book's bullshit And she's like it's not you from the alternate dimension the defender strange you knew about it And then he's like yeah, well, I don't know about it. And then they both realize well, wait What if this universe is strange knows about it? Oh, let's go find him now That book means that they can defeat wander As it's described it gives the sorcerer whatever spell they require to defeat whatever enemy they're uh dealing with So This book means she can he can save wong and the sorcerers You might think That alone then is enough to make him incredibly urgent, right? Because for every second you don't get to that book is a second more for them getting killed and tortured So, um, so you got to be running. You got to be running everywhere. Yeah Disappear when you can't see her It's not how They seem to think it that's another weird thing from what we can understand all the multiverses are running in real time at similar Timelines. I was about to ask if that was yeah are all the multiverses synchronized time wise I think we have to assume that the answer is yes Because of course we'll be open if you travel to a time where they you know Don't have a doctor strange yet because he's still a baby or something or in the future But it's like well no it does seem a relative it I think this movie would fall apart even more if it weren't that way. So I guess we're supposed to think it is that way Also, are we talking about have we talked about the portals that like all the glimpses of different universes? Um that uh, we saw are we going to do that later? Uh, what depends on what you want to say about it? Oh, well, I just wanted to kind of highlight that this film is called the multiverse of madness And we're teased with like universes with different geometry a cartoon universe a paint universe all of these different really creative concepts and Yet all we really do in this film is just dick around and maybe three universes including the mainstream one And I'm just I want to highlight that it's just a sheer lack of creativity Um on the part of the writers is that we have you have a you are you're advertising A movie called multiverse of madness implying this is going to be like a We're going to be going from one universe to another and we're going to be exploring all kinds of different creative things, but yep We we get like a little teaser reel for like 10 seconds And then we just stuck In that one other universe To jump in and bolster your point because I've seen a lot of people on the internet like wow So like people don't like this movie because they because it's not like marvel movies with teasers and stuff It's like it's not about teasers It's about leveraging the potential of different universes where things don't work quite the same way To do some really creative and clever stuff like I don't need references like spider-man 2099 or whatever Or like any of these universes that pull directly from the comics It could just be a matter of you end up in a universe that's still medieval times And you need to try and your existence in this universe like that's probably adventure Yeah to to actually because because that's something that America says later like the clearest example that we have of Leveraging that we're in universes where things don't quite work the same way Is that a stop sign and a go sign for a pedestrian is the colors are opposite Red means go and blue and green means stay like that's that's like the extensive leveraging. Yeah, like there's some of the universes There's some neat aesthetic stuff like the plants and stuff, but like I But that's but that's all you did. It's it's like I can't remember as euro meme said it. It's very comprehensible There's nothing here that's very All right, I would also Universe where it's so similar to ours that we could just oh, yeah, this is new york We just walked down the street And we can talk to everybody Yeah, there's just no issues I'm also not a fan of the red green thing because it it's not the kind of change I find Intriguing it doesn't seem intuitive at all. It's like Yeah, I mean especially you live in a universe you live in a universe where there are plants all over the buildings So if anything you guys should be hyper into green being the good color Exactly, that's one of the reasons why it's not impossible. I just it doesn't feel like it just seems like oh You did that just to be like red is green green is red lol Yeah, it's it's like a token. We're not on kansas anymore kind of thing You know, we're not actually meaningfully doing it because imagine if they went to an earth where there were a bunch of aliens on it You know, there's just aliens walking around like earth is very much integrated Leverage the multiverse not for the sake of cameos and teasers and stuff But more so just leveraging universes where things just aren't quite like where things are meaningfully different And it causes challenges beyond don't walk on green because green is bad in this universe like for stop signs you know It's weird. Uh, and it's yeah, absolutely right that they just don't take advantage of Uh, the situation we've got here, but the setting of the film. Yeah, it really feels squandered Yeah, and with what they do Absolutely terrible speaking of which like we just we cut the It's not even like a normal walk. It is a very slow walk Yeah, I think it's a troll He in uh america and they're gawking at the world. They're like he's looking around at the whole world like Whoa, look at this and i'm i'm just so like dude People are dying You're you know the all of this this world needs you Is if you need this motivation on top of the fact that all of his friends are dying We know that she can find america through the multiverse no matter what and she always sends monsters after the We know they know that that's the potential and yet we're strolling through a city Highly populated city knowing that a fucking gargantos could drop it on us at any point I'm not knowing if there are even any other heroes necessarily The problem is they don't behave as though that's the reality even though this film has told us that's the reality Well, yeah, this is one of those examples of you don't realize what you've done You are telling me something about these characters with every action that they take including A lack of urgency in a situation that demands urgency where other people are in trouble all that Like the only takeaway from that is dr. Strange doesn't care that much About all of the people who are getting killed and here's something that's worth thinking about as well I guess it might be jumping the gun a little bit might it be interesting to have america be like damn All of those people died like because of me and then dr. Strange is like no it's not because of you It's not because of you Like so that you can give her that element of her character to lead towards the art that they wanted to tell with her Which i guess we'll jump to like have a conversation, you know a meaningful conversation It was one of the it was one of the things that i was talking to moller about the other night After we were just sort of chatting about what we had just experienced um america shaves as a character seems There is never a moment. I almost said this is like the inverse infinity war, right? Where it talks about the Being willing to sacrifice things for a greater good being able to let go of what you love so you can stop So you know that that's an aspect of infinity war And this film Should be doing that to an even greater degree considering what the stakes are But there is in the stakes all revolve around One person's power which is connected to her life. So essentially one person's life There is never a recognition in this movie that This character understands the the the massive weight The the amount of lives the the uncountable amount of lives and universes that are at stake if a person gets her power She doesn't seem to grapple with this or deal with this she never Well, even then it's like there's never this yeah, I guess at the end, which is why it seems so weird How how what do you have to go through and see and witness until you say i need you to kill me I can't live Like it's not worth it. I need to You need to kill me right now because if they get me if Wanda gets me everything is over There's never that there's not even the thought of it There's not even that question that she asked to strange Or or well, they throw it in right at the end. So Yeah, but they don't even throw it in the way that you're talking about it. They just throw in exactly Yeah, it's she just sort of like we we skip all of these steps along the way because I think a lot of people if you told them that The so you have some innate ability that is tied to your life And if one person finds you who's constantly trying to get you who is very Very closely almost gotten you like twice three times now You were like we were on the brink of the destruction of the multiverse three times. Luckily we escaped Holy shit. Should you be thinking fuck me? What will we be so lucky the next time this happens? Is my life worth all of this and we never have that conversation No one even brings it up to discuss and if anything the film kind of says Like the the inverse is better That it's not virtuous to sacrifice yourself in a way I like the idea as well on top of The nature of their mission takes them through all these different worlds filled with so many different cultures and Living people and friendly people so that you just get to more and more understanding of how much is at stake And that maybe maybe that's her arc is just coming to but I mean That's what they think her arc is in part But it's like you really didn't have a lot of supporting material to prop it up But like that that's her arc is kind of understanding the gravity of like I guess life in general right and the the reality of like her status And maybe that's like if she does survive the film which of course She invariably does that like she becomes very dedicated to understanding her powers so well That she can continue to exist But use those powers for good and you know protect herself and then protect the multiverse That like that's the arc that she goes on Oh, and yeah, we we did move past it sort of the line being said. I just don't know what we can say about it He says why can't we just find you in this universe and have you use the power and then she says I am the only me in all of the multiverse Yeah, I guess we just we just accept that that's just that's how I guess we have to for now, right? Nothing else Makes sense That means that she just she's Well, where does she exist? Does she exist beyond time and space? No, let's put it this way right She she's in the world with with Loki and then he makes a decision to Bling off or not like so he's split the world into two directions in his Two individual america shaves is correct Yeah, like how yeah, I get what you mean like anyone else splitting it will duplicate her by necessity If that well, especially since that's loki establishes That's the nature of creating multiverses is choices people make The cause deviation so as long as she exists in the universe, right? It's always possible So I mean also if you travel to only 72 universes, I guess it's because she says she doesn't dream That's the dream. Yeah, that's what I was about to bring that up. That's her ever done How sad That's how michael jackson died. He was taking drugs that stopped him from dreaming Because you can actually suffer from dream deprivation because the brain needs to dream in order to just flush out That's kind of it's kind of the problem with like having dreams be a mechanic is like would dreams exist in reality and Like they are a biological process Um, of course, there's a lot we don't understand about dreams, but like, you know our brains cause them, right? So Yeah It is a yeah, I guess there was this not only how would she Let's say you went to 72 universes. How do you find one person who doesn't seem to be Institution or locations or correct like it's kind of funny actually that he's like Why don't we just find you in this universe just like have you actually asked her not before this? Why it is that she's getting chased and not any other one? Yeah, right? I guess that question Yeah, if there's another america Well, I was like well that america is just like she's got I I've blown my cover on that one essentially They got all those people trying to stop me. I'm just going to go pick up another america with the powers and Grabbed them that should be easy, but I'll go myself instead of the monster idea. I don't know what I was thinking Yeah, I guess wonder knows That she's the only one too and and strange didn't think to ask about that at any point nor did america think to bring it up Kind of weird It almost feels like it might have been something they wrote in later when they were making this you're like, wait a bit It they can't be more than one of there. Otherwise this wouldn't make any fucking sense Yeah, after that, um After that, uh, opening sequence, right? You know like well damn I guess you are the are you the only one because you look like the person or I don't know I don't know with the world building as it's set up here the Like the only way They could even do anything close to this and it would still have a bunch of problems would be If she was the only one who had these specific powers because at least you could have a be that it's I don't know some kind of mold her powers are like a multiversal energy that somehow found that specific version, but only but it You know what I you know what I mean is it's it it would be something a bit more mystical lore cosmic rather than just her specifically being um unique within the multiverse which I still don't really understand how that works Yeah, I don't know how she even it comes to be unique doesn't Count for all of her. I don't know. I guess universe where she comes from or something I guess we'll just have to like eventually find out I suppose the problem is that Like you can kick that down the road if you want, but I mean Like she is an incredibly important part of the plot of this story. It all hinges on on her and her abilities Like you kind of need to answer these questions for there to be a clearer understanding of what's going on And we don't even get into Why how did you come into existence? Have you always existed forever? Have did you just it's an interesting one She's always existed. How does that work when there were no other universes? Yeah After Loki like Loki happened and then she Existed but why and how and where and then how would it be that because like somebody in chat said like maybe that explains What there's only one of her it's like, well, no, that would just be there should be loads of her as soon as the multiverse is allowed, right? Is yeah, is there a natural aspect that's baked into the quote-unquote fabric of every universe that it Eventually produces some being that is capable of this or Is there an even greater power that I know it's done But they'll they'll they're willing to do that at whenever they want Is there some even greater entity that brings her into existence to serve Some purpose that for whatever other reason couldn't have been done a different way Is she a nexus being like wonder it's like well as it turns out. There's a lot of wonders Well, I don't know what that means to be a nexus being with you're the only one But I mean there's definitely more wonders and not only are there more wonders But the wonder that we see has the abilities like she has wonders abilities I guess she's not as powerful She's not the scarlet witch quote-unquote she hasn't gotten the fucking hat I guess I mean, but she still is right or like she at least has those powers so Presumably, you know what turns it from normal into scarlet witch in the bond division I I don't think anything does she like just always was and she just didn't understand it or something Right. Well, yeah, that means that she can't be a nexus be if that means the only one I don't understand how how would she be the only one? How do you have only ones of anything in this world in an infinity? Yeah, and infinite universe To further explain the thing I was mentioning about like Loki is just like that guy who goes to to work late We have the the the true timeline according to tva and then the the offshoot Now she has to exist in both of them because you can't pluck out everything She'd done in one of them to then move her to only being in one. Do you know what I mean? That doesn't that can't make any fucking sense because He's late to work and then he goes to work late and and they're like, oh god She can't exist in more than one universe So now she's only in the main timeline one and you're like, yeah, but the one where he just went to work late She has to be erased from all of it if she's done anything and then that just turns into a different timeline again Like telling me she's a nexus being there for she's only one of her is like that's not anything That's like saying she's immune to being killed because she's immune to being killed. He's like what? So the whole idea of this nexus Being can only really work in a finite multiverse where there's a set number and they're not just constantly spawning That would make more that would work more so but I imagine there'd still be a lot to think about, you know Perhaps a lot of people I'm ever you're comparing it against Loki and I'm like, well, but the person who wrote this wrote Well, the guy who wrote this wrote Loki and Loki is canon. So I have to you know Yep So yeah, that's well Before you go any further. I must go myself for it is six pum and I have things that I will have to do and um Maybe I might be back While you are still discussing things it's happened before And this might be oh, I mean, you know a long boy. So we are Quite literally Barely a third of the way through the film Um, I think you might stop with a halfway point Well, I mean, I think it's I was kind of joking, but I think this is a reasonable question We are near five hours rags has to go and that means rags is going to miss out on talking about The actual craziest shit in this film Yeah, because I I do kind of want to talk about this movie because it's so That's it insane. Um Well, so maybe you do a I don't know. I guess we can discuss later. Well, I was going to say this would for the chat This would be good news and bad news good news would be the Theoretically with this new plan rags would be around for uh The rest of the discussion, but the bad news would mean that we'll probably end the stream here Yeah What maybe well, what about super chats? Well, uh Again, like if we're gonna wait until rags comes back We may as well just Maybe do it on wednesday or as part of the next Lead them off on wednesday or something So, uh, we can come up with something we've got options Well, I'm thinking about the schedule and it's like if we do part two of doctor strange next week That means moon night will have to be moved after halo because Halo's Tell you what, um, I I I really actually do have to go right now So I will bid you farewell. Whatever you decide on doing I will see you later chat. Thanks for showing up and listening to us I will catch all of you at a later time or Maybe we could get a multiverse version of me And see how they fare and hopefully they're not better than me because that would be embarrassing But I will I will see you later on. Goodbye. Yeah, I got you dude. Goodbye We'll see you Um, because it means we can get gary back theoretically too Right That is true If we're only a third of the you know, like we still got a lot that we'll need to talk about because But the reality is to be clear as well chat I I think it might be lopsided towards the latter end because there's stuff that we're not talking about yet That become that we we need more of the film laid out So like I don't know that it's necessarily going to be shorter In terms of how we talk about the next I was gonna say the problem here is we could with rags gone go through until we hit the end Of the movie the only problem is without two of the people who are part of this conversation You're not going to get any of gary's thoughts or rags thoughts about a lot of it Um, yeah, it's four people bouncing off each other, which by the way, I'm sure we can entertain you I'm sure we can provide possibly some insights. Maybe but um, I just I just wonder if uh Why miss out on the potential um because we can only do this once really because you want to watch it now Yeah, like um, I mean this has been five hours. Hopefully those who are very invested in um In listening to this film being broken down have been quite satisfied with how we've gone over like the first 35 40 minutes in this level of detail. I hope that it's been as engaging as you would want it to be Um, and it gives more people more time to decide if they want it to be spoiled or not It gives more like and I think It seems like people are pretty engaged um So, you know, um, some people are still suggesting super chat. I would prefer uh, I I I'm Relatively okay with the idea that rags misses a couple of them And then we keep the ones that relevant to him But like an entire stream's worth of of of them I would rather just wait until he's available again than we do Because of course I could just do it as though I stream and answer them all and then I just grab the ones for Bringing rags, but we I do my best to try and have them in at the same time um Which means it seems like the best decision probably is to do part two next saturday Um Yeah It gives everybody a Nice a night in terms of being able to do life things too because uh Obviously we've been here for five hours. That is long for normal people You know just yeah, and um, and I mean hey if you guys uh If you're like men, but I still got some long in me I still got some long That I need to to get tonight. Um I made a video called adventures endgame is terrible. It's two hours long So, I mean that'll bring you up to like the average length of an e-fap episode And it's good to see that Because it leads right into this movie in a in a sense, you know in a in a weird in a weirdly poetic sense It does considering that it was entirely incidental that the the video was done by the time that um By the time that uh, this this movie came out Um But yeah, I think I think that works out the best and so I will say um Meme you want to tell people what you're up to real quick? What's what's happening with you if anything? Uh, sure. I don't have really much new to report. Um since last week just um, yeah keep it on keep it on um Got some idea. I'm just trying to figure out because I I am trying to figure out an entirely new routine Thanks to certain Recent life changes. So that's just throwing me through a bit of a loop, but I'm hoping um Very shortly. I'm going to be right back into the swing of uh working on things and uh Just giving you all content on both the moola channel and my own channel It's going to be going to be fun. So I kind of want to make I did uh Metals for john super members of the elite and that really made me appreciate how well written that film is and uh large part Yeah, so a large part of me wants to just make a video praising the writing in that film So we'll see what happens there. I already have a bunch of notes on it. So We'll see how we go Uh, what about you metal? Yeah Me well if you want the the the conclusion of my thoughts Of uh, I was at wonder vision of the madness tisms Uh, I covered it already on my own on my lonesome on metal sport a couple of days ago That's that's already out there. So if you want to watch that that's also only half as Long as the stream, uh, yeah Because this is going to be much more in depth. But yeah, I did that did that so you can go watch that There's going to there's many more metal sport just I did one on the north man. I did one on Another thing I just forgot the name off because I'm very stupid. Um Yeah, metal sports like right, sorry You did one on ex machina right with uh, right with ex machina with muesli That was yeah, I did like three and like five days or something because I was behind on one more Uh, so yeah, I can all watch those uh Actually meme is going to be on next week Under the red hood i'm going to check that out because I I remember that being pretty good But this time i'm going to look at it critically and evily And bad fate. No, i'm just kidding. Uh, but yeah, this is uh Yeah, metal sports like my my main My main thing right now. That's definitely what i'm doing. I'm still chopping away on that item run Super cut from my stream Um Yeah, not so just streams in general should be picking up a bit more now that not 17 movies come out that I wanted to watch so That's gonna come back as well. And I think that is all Go check it out. It's good tisms. I would say what about you fringy, but as was just mentioned um end game Yeah, that's that's out now. Uh, and also Thanks for all the kind words about it. That's that's very nice um When you work on a big project for a long time, it becomes difficult to uh You know, it kind of becomes difficult to gauge. I guess uh a general like how you think people are going to respond to it Whether people will find it worthwhile or interesting or entertaining Um, so it's definitely definitely happy with the response. It's been it's been very nice as for what's next I haven't decided yet. I got some ideas though um Yeah, that's all that's all I got right now. Anyway, I'd be working away on that same project I've been working on for a little while. Uh, as I said to you guys that'll be Not necessarily paused but delayed by kanobi coverage that comes out um, that's literally going to be the update for me for a while Takes a while same for me as well basically. Yeah, um Yeah, thank you so much for joining us and for watching. What we'll do is uh the coming Wednesday We'll read all of today's super chats with myself Rags and free and we'll cover the um The previous catch-ups Super chats will get those two done in that block. Um And if we managed to get a few offline ones done, we may very well get to the point where we fully caught up and then um The the the next Saturday we'll just do the second half of this Assuming we're not having an arcane situation here Hopefully not. I don't want to spend four weeks. I hope not. I'm I'm I'm not there for the third week I can't miss that one and then You'll get halo the following week I'll build guests. I shall not tell you what guests, but it should be an interesting stream And then the thing with we following that will do moon night Uh that show that totally everybody really loved and watched and definitely It will definitely be discussed in over a week's time I'm sure there will be a lot of discussion still on that show and in a week Even in a week People talking about you know how cool that moon night episode was Yeah, that was a really cool show. I have sure to expect it to dominate discourse for even a little while longer Uh thank you all so much for uh Chatting with us to donate and and for uh for checking out this stream If there's anybody who maybe is new I could always imagine that maybe a Topical topic if I dare say Might bring in some new people and they must be so horrified to listen to people talk about Like the decision to throw a magical ball at something for 10 hours. Well It matters, okay We also talk about all the other things so I assume it wasn't that painful If you're still here, I don't know regardless It'll get picked up Next week, uh with the last thing we talked about basically being that they um All the red green lights They're about to bump into um Uh cambell memory I have I have good and bad things to say about that moment We will have to wait until next week however And I'll um like I said, I'll hopefully try and get uh Gary back on if he's available No, that's all right too because it can be a bit trying to talk about a movie We usually do that as like a meme this one. It will happen like it will happen one movie. That's too much to talk about And um, yeah So if anybody's feeling like unconvinced that this could possibly be considered one of the worst in the mcu I would say we haven't even gone through the biggest arguments yet. Uh And yet we've gone through like a million arguments. So it's it's this it's in it's in trouble This we want this movie already, but hopefully I can pull it together in that last two thirds, right guys Oh, yeah, absolutely. It's gonna be super good. I swear Woo-hoo. Oh, yeah, we didn't even get to the free food line. We're yeah, it's all covered up All covered up. All right. Thank you. It's in ball form so much Watching and we I'll see you on uh on wednesday, bro Bye. Bye. Bye. I'll see you later