 Senator Mark Kelly, thank you so much for spending some time with us today to discuss the role of the Congress and the future of national security. In the interest of time, let's just jump right into it, starting with a bit of a retrospective question. How did the Congress and Congress's role in national security change after 911 and now looking back with 20 years hindsight, you think those changes have been mostly positive or there some you wish we could take back. Well, Ryan, you know, like most people that were adults said, well, even my oldest daughter who was, you know, five or six around 911. I mean, she remembers where she was when she heard so like most of us I remember where I was I was I was training for what was going to be the next space shuttle flight which is launching in November along a board space shuttle endeavor. We were about two months from launch and I was training in a simulator, the Johnson Space Center. So let me, you know, first say that as a 25 year veteran of the Navy, and I flew in combat over Iraq during the first Gulf War. I'm grateful to all of the Americans, you know, who served our country in the wake of that horrible day in September of 2001. And there were, we're talking millions of individuals, right. I'm also been thinking a lot about the 13 US service members who recently were killed in a terrorist attack in Afghanistan, you know, helping, you know, our fellow Americans and our allies evacuate from the country and, you know, some of these service members were just little kids when 911 happened, and it's, it's really heartbreaking. And we owe them, and their, and their families a deep debt of gratitude. So the past 20 years that we've been at war, you know, first in Afghanistan and then you know shortly thereafter in Iraq. It's been, it's been a real trial, right. And as a new US Senator, it's hard for me, you know, to speak to the thoughts of somebody was in Congress 20 years ago. You know, however, I do know that the global war and terror has consumed much of the Congress's oversight role for the past couple of decades and a lot of the focus was, I'd say rightfully placed on ensuring that our troops that were in harms way were equipped to fight the battles they found themselves in. And much of the conversation around the defense budget was how do we equip their military for for those wars, also preparing for conflicts that might arise in the future. Those are difficult conversations to have but they're, they're definitely necessary and, you know, we're having similar conversations today about how do we prepare our armed forces for future threats. We've now put Afghanistan behind us, you know, 20 years is incredibly a long, long time to be in that conflict. But it's important now that we look towards the future of, you know, the conflicts that we would like to stay out of but could find ourselves in in the next couple of decades. Yeah, thank you and with that in mind, as we look forward to the next 20 years then in a new global security environment what are your legislative priorities for the national security agenda. Well, you know, it's, it's about what I talk about looking to the future I'm concerned mostly about maintaining our competitive edge that we currently have in most areas over near peer competitors, like China and Russia, my primary concern though is China. You know, China is increasing its new nuclear stockpile every year. It's also rapidly investing in a lot of emerging technologies in some areas more so than than we are. We also know that China is using a lot of soft power and using its economy to grow its sphere of influence across the globe and also current is concerned about the increased threat in in cyberspace and whether our military are critical infrastructure and our, you know, private sector are adequately prepared for what we might see in the future. You know, you know China represents a growing threat of cyber attacks against us and couple with Russia who recently compromised. I mean, over 10,000, you know customers of solar winds via hack. I mean we've got to do more to harden against this against the cyber attacks cyber attacks on our military and our government on businesses. I mean, you know these countries, they're eager to harm us and we need to be better prepared for it. You mentioned the the requirement during the 20 years of the global war on terror to try to maintain our high capabilities and be able to deter and potentially defeat a near peer adversary the popular narrative seems to be that we failed to do that to a to a large degree and that we fell behind and that our competitive role was eroded during those years so now the national strategy is to reorient toward high end competition. Is there a risk though that it goes the other way and that in focusing on those high end capabilities and the potential of a near peer fight we lose our irregular warfare capability and the ability to engage in hybrid or other types of warfare below the threshold of major conflict. There's a risk I mean, I'm the chairman of the emerging threats and capabilities subcommittee on armed services in the United States Senate, we're focused on these emerging threats capabilities that other countries have, or are obtaining and in some cases getting ahead of us on so we've got to address that. You know we've got to make sure that we can ensure that we have air superiority over our dear peer adversaries. We've got to make sure that we have a United States Navy that can outperform and outfight. You know the, the PLA Navy, or the Russian Navy. At the same time what you talk about is incredibly important as well, it can't always be about the high end fight. You know that's why I've been recently looking into and also focused on, you know how do we provide adequate close air support for special operations forces for army troops. The A10 as an example is an example of an airplane that does this job really well, a better than any other platform in the history of aviation. The A10 is the best at close air support. It's not in the high end fight. It's, it's there to support our ground troops in, you know, and in Afghanistan and Iraq very effectively, but we still need to maintain capabilities, you know like the A10. Because this can't always be about the first few days of any conflict. This has also got to be about if we wind up in a long term conflict, what is, what is month three, month six, what does year two look like. So I think it's important that we focus on both of these things, emerging threats and capabilities, new technology innovation, at the same time maintain, you know the competitive advantage we have with what for lack of a better term below end fight that you know to make to make sure we still maintain those capabilities. In the role of Congress as elected representatives of the American people. How do you forge a coherent picture of the national interest when the country seems so divided on the most fundamental issues, including America's role in the world. Yeah, so it is a challenge. I mean right now our politics are very divisive. I'm somebody who is a strong believer in science and data and facts. And let's not let the politics, get in the way of us making the right decisions. Also, let's try to find opportunities to bring our country together and bring individuals, you know, together. You know, the thing I've, and I've always believed this, I mean, whether you're Republican Democrat or independent, it will have common goals. Right, we want our kids to get a great education we want people to have well paying jobs and be able to support their families. We want to make sure we have, you know, the best healthcare in the world. These are things we all agree upon. It's just, you know, how do we get there. So I think it's important that we all try to focus on, you know what, you know, where is the common ground, and try to not focus so much on those things that divide us. And that's going to working together as a team, and the team being, you know, all US citizens, you know, that's how we're going to face the threats that are out there and they're significant. I mean, the threats to our national security are substantial. And as we face them in the coming decades, the best way we can do this is to be united as a team. So I think we can all do a better job at working towards those goals. And what's really a related question, Senator, I know you've been very busy over the last several weeks responding to the situation in Afghanistan. Is it too soon to ask, what are the lessons we should take from our 20 year adventure there and especially the events of the last two weeks, or a few weeks and you know maybe what are the wrong lessons we could draw from this experience. Well, I think one of the biggest lessons is, you know, we make a decision to put ground troops in a foreign land. What's the exit strategy. I mean when you look throughout history, you typically deploy ground troops to take territory and to keep it. Obviously not the goal we had in Afghanistan. But when we achieve, we should have had a set of objectives and when we achieve those objectives, it should have been time to bring the folks on the ground home. There's, you know, there's only so much we can do through air power through, you know, a naval force, often you have to put the guy on the ground. But we also have a plan, we need to have a plan on when are we going to get them out and that should never be a plan, you know that would go for 20 years. You know, I think the second part of your question about, you know, what are the lessons I think you said that we really maybe shouldn't take away from this. You know, I think, well, let me start about one other lesson we should get from this is, is that our analysis of situations. We shouldn't, we shouldn't be drinking our own Kool-Aid and think we have everything figured out. I mean as we looked at the end game here in Afghanistan and pulling out the consensus among the intelligence community amongst really smart people that analyze these situations was that Kabul could fall in six to 12 months. Well it took about 12 days. So one lesson is that we're not as smart as we think we are. And I think it's important that we remind ourselves that I used to tell my, you know, shuttle crew members, you know, sometimes that none of us is as dumb as all of us. Sometimes you can come together as a team and you think because you've talked to everybody you got the right decision. Sometimes a team of people can make a really bad decision. The, you know, how we as a country, you know, exited Afghanistan, it could have been done much better. These things are highly dynamic and unpredictable. We certainly didn't expect the Afghan military to fold like it did in the Afghan Afghan government to just leave. Could we have been better prepared for the worst case scenario I think we could have been. To return just in closing to our topic which is about the role of Congress. You know there's as a veteran. All of us have been doing a lot of soul searching about the way things went in Afghanistan, you're relatively new to the Congress to the Senate. Do you think when you talk about the our collective ability to make bad decisions, do you think that the Congress could have asserted itself more or could it in the future to prevent those kinds of bad decisions. Yeah I mean, yeah sure I mean but I think Congress is also very capable of making bad decisions as well we've seen that, you know throughout history the future is hard to predict, and we don't have all the answers. You know I think consensus and I mean is is a positive thing but we also have to be very thoughtful and try to get as much data we can in the situation, try to make smart decisions. Congressional oversight of, you know the, the, you know of the executive branch of government is incredibly important to the functioning of our government or democracy. Congressional oversight of the Department of Defense is critical. I'm proud to be a member of the armed services committee, you know we're going to continue it well in my role in the United States Senate we're going to continue to do that. We all have to just strive to, you know, do a better job, and to realize that the world is a changing place it's a dangerous place we need to be prepared. And it is Congress's role to provide that that oversight and we need to work hard to do to do a good job at it. Senator Kelly. Thank you so much for sharing your insights with us. Thanks for your continued service. We look forward to seeing you here in Arizona when we can. I'm here in Arizona now would love to see you in person and maybe do this again. In person Ryan, we got to get through this pandemic. I mean this is a national security issue for us as well so for folks out there watching this where vaccinated yet. I just want to say it's safe. It's well tested it's effective. It's the only thing that's going to get us through this, and it is a national security issue for us. So, thank you everybody for listening today. Thanks.