 Hello and welcome to today's webcast, Networking for Success. My name is Sarah Gonzalez and I'm an employee of RedBat Conferencing. Today, we will be interviewing Sandra Woods on how to network and I'm sure we've all been there. We walk into a room, we don't know anyone, we feel a little bit lost and blank. What do we do next? Today, we're going to uncover it all. But before we get into that, just some housekeeping rules so we can make this event seamless, sorry, and also interactive. So if you wish to interact with us and ask a question, we encourage you to do so by clicking on the ask a question box which is located on the bottom right corner of your screen. And also, we also invite you to complete the feedback survey which is located in the tab next to the slides. So today, I would like to welcome Sandra Wood from Great Managers. How are you today, Sandra? I'm well, Sarah. How are you? Very well. Nice to have you back. Thank you. So we spoke a few months ago about a few other topics that you were mentioning in regards to Great Managers. And now we've got you back to talk about networking. But let's just refresh everyone out there and just give everyone a bit of an overview about who you are, what you do and what Great Managers actually does as well. All right. OK. I'll start with a little bit about my background. My first experience in business was when I was 25, I had a restaurant baptism by fire into the business world. And then I went into the corporate world and I've held senior HR and organizational development roles. I've had over 20 years in that space. And I started my leadership consulting business in 2001. So I've been in business now for 15 years. And two years ago, we launched Great Managers. And we are on a mission to fill the world with Great Managers. That's my absolute passion. And we do that in quite a unique way. So having been in business for over 15 years, I've had to do quite a lot of networking. The problem for me, though, was that I'm actually introverted and quite shy. So I've had to work quite hard at it. I feel like I started from a pretty low base. So I sort of wanted to work out, how does it work? How do I make it more comfortable, feel more confident, that sort of thing? So that's what I want to share with everyone today. Excellent. So if we just talk about what else we're going to go through today. So you have mentioned we're going to speak to those who are particularly introverted and how to deal with that. Also on the agenda, we're talking about the before, during, and after process. And you also mentioned something about a FOWLS model as well in the reminder email. Yeah, so that was part of my study, that sense of how can I put a little structure together, a little model that helps people know what to say after they've said hello. So we'll cover that. And I'll also cover some really simple strategies to help people feel more confident and also make people warm to you when you're networking. Excellent. Now I believe we're going to do a poll just to kick things off. So I'm going to ask Matt to actually launch the poll. And this poll is to really just get insights into your experiences with networking, how you feel when you actually attend these events. And then maybe we can talk to that once we get the responses and that will help guide what Sandra actually goes through. So the question you can see is how do you feel about attending networking events? So some of us love networking. We love, we crave for these events, don't we? And I think this time of year there's so many happenings, so you're set for the next few months. Some of us, you know, do feel a little bit anxious about it beforehand, but once they're there, they're usually OK. And I think that's a big part of it, isn't it? Getting the courage up to actually go. But then once you're there and you get to talk into people, you actually feel quite OK. That's right. Yeah, it's that early bit. It's sort of just arriving. Once you first arrive, that's the daunting bit. Yeah. And then you've got some people who would rather stick a needle in their eye than go to a network event, which I actually had one of my clients say that to me. So that's why we've used that direct quote from someone who said, I would rather stick a needle in my eye than go to a network event. Definitely. So if you can just select the response, which best relates to you, and then we'll actually close that poll and see what the responses are. So we've got a quite an even spread for people who love and hate it. Around 22% of people are saying they love it, but then 22% actually do want to stick the needle in their eye. Oh, yeah, yeah, OK. So hopefully we can help you today. But then we've got around the 50, just over 50% mark that are saying that they do feel a bit anxious. But once they get there, they're fine. So hopefully today's presentation will appeal to everyone within this group. Yeah. So even those people who love it, we can give you a few extra tips that will take your networking skills to the next level. And for those of you who are feeling a bit anxious, I'm sure you'll get a lot out of today. Yeah. And for the others, I'm going to I'm sure you get a lot out of it as well. It will really help you. OK, so thank you for your feedback. Let's get straight into it. And I think let's start off by just putting something in context now. So what are the benefits of networking? Why should I do it? Why am I forced to do it in some cases? And then why should I love it? Yeah, well, there's a whole lot of benefits. And I'll just take you through four benefits. But the first one is new connections. So often networking events, some of the networking events I go to, they actually have activities and things which actually make it easier to talk to strangers. So it's a way of making connections in a way that's a bit easier than it would be if we were left to our own devices. So that's one really good benefit. So making those new connections. The thing to think about here is that business is all about relationships. Yes. You know, so it's really thinking, I want to go to things where I can build new relationships. And if I can do them with ease, that's a great thing. So the other benefit is shared knowledge. So you'll learn a lot through going to a networking event. It could be from a speaker that's there. It could be just from talking to other people because you're learning about other businesses. You're getting to share your business. You're getting to share things you have in common, that sort of thing. So shared knowledge is another benefit. Networking can provide lots of opportunities. We actually met at a network event. We did, believe it or not. And we're not just making it up for this. That's right. We met at a networking event. So here we are. This is an opportunity. So you never know what will come from it. It might not come straight away, but it might come afterwards where you meet someone and then something comes from that. So that's a great benefit. And I'm not sure whether you know, but most people get their jobs, more people get jobs from their network than any other way. So you never know what happens from the people that you've met at networking. And the other benefit we've got there for you today is increased emotional intelligence or emotional quotient EQ stands for. Because when you're at a networking event, you're practicing your interpersonal skills. You're practicing going outside your comfort zone. It's really about building your confidence and taking that to the next level. Definitely. Now, when we talk about new connections and shared knowledge and we talk about these networking events, we're talking about events that are through either associations that we're part of. Is that the main reason people attend these events or is it just some people you find go to events where they actually don't know anyone and they put themselves really out there in their comfort? I find a mixture of things. I think people are looking to go to events for business reasons, but also for personal reasons. So they might want to be raising their profile in their industry, which is a great thing to do. It's that sense of getting known in your industry. A lot of people network within their organizations as well. So it's thinking about these skills as applying to external events, but also some of you are working in much larger organizations where there are opportunities to network within your business so that you get known within the business as well as externally in the industry. So lots of different reasons. So these skills are obviously something you can apply. So let's go into the system that you have developed and how this can help everyone out there with their networking skills. Okay, great. So I want to take you through this little system that I developed, and this was about building my own confidence and helping me overcome my shyness. So I developed this system around what to do before, during, and I'll talk to you today about the dos and don'ts during, and also what to do afterwards. Okay, so we'll go through those now. So before the event, my first suggestion is that you set a goal for yourself. So really starting to think, what would I like out of this event? Who might I like to meet? Because sometimes it even might be the speaker, and you think, I want to meet that speaker, you know, I'm going to go to that event because I want to meet them, or it might be, I just want to meet one or two other people like-minded business people. Yes. You know, it could be something as simple as that. But really it's about priming your brain with a goal. Then my next suggestion is working on your introduction. And the reason I suggest that is because just before we introduce ourselves is when our nerves are at their peak. So if we can rehearse our introduction, be very clear about what you want to say about yourself. It needs to be brief, but clear. So when you present yourself, introduce yourself to someone, you can do that confidently. So I always recommend to people that they do a little rehearsal, bit of mental rehearsal around that, so it comes out smoothly, and you're off to a good start then. So just on that, so you hear about an elevator pitch quite a fair bit. Should the introduction be about you personally? Because I tend to find at these events, when you ask someone a question its way as well, what do you do? Or who do you work for? Even if you just say hello, their response always seems to be about what they do, as opposed to who they are. What would you recommend at this stage? I usually start with who I am. So I would start with my name, and then my role, and then what I do after that. So it's that sense of what we're trying to do at a networking event is make connections. Connections come first. So often people go straight into the promote the business kind of thing, and that's a bit off-putting. So we want to remember that today, it's really about connections, we want to make the connection first, and then other doorways will open once we have connected with someone. I think there's always that one person in the room that you can see go in person to person, just plug in their business, plug in their business, and it's just cringe-worthy, isn't it? Absolutely. Standing in front of them, I'm not the type of person that can hide my facial expressions quite often, so I'm just like, oh. So yeah, I definitely think that's one thing to remember. Focus on connections and your personal self, and bring that out before you even start talking business. So we talk about the trust-based economy these days, where people need to know you, like you, trust you before they'll do business with you. So that's about thinking about that your introduction is your first impression, so it's really being clear on that. And then get informed. One of my suggestions for you is to get informed. It could be about the event itself, the organization. It could be about the speaker. It could be about current affairs. It could be even about your own business, because I've had people sort of say that they've been to networking events where someone said to them, oh, I heard your business has been sold or something like that, and they didn't even know about it, you know? So it's a good idea to get informed. Obviously dress the part, you know, being professional, it's about first impressions. And another tip is I eat before I go, or I try to. Oh, see, I love the food. I know, but it's so hard to talk when you've got food in your mouth. And if you're starving, what you're gonna be doing is you're gonna be so distracted because you're gonna be looking for every weight that comes past, and you want to pounce on the waiter to get a morsel of food because you're starving, you know? So I've just found over the years that if I eat before I go, I sort of take that out of the equation and then I can just talk freely. You know, I'm not starving. So that's a good thing. Take business cards, obviously, that's a must do. And also be on time. And the reason I'm saying that is not just about being prompt, but it's much harder to break into groups if you arrive late. Makes sense. So when you're on time, that's where all the little groups start to get together. So that's what we do before. Now during, my first tip for you here during is to put your name tag on the right hand side. Why is that? Because when we shake hands and we do that right handedly, people's eyes will naturally go to the right hand side. They're much more likely to remember your name. Okay, so make it easy for people to remember your name. Put your name tag on the right hand side. Great tip. So I would suggest too that you do the introducing, introduce yourself, take the leads, because a lot of people are shy, like me. So it's that sense of we kind of tend to hang back a little bit, but if you think, no, I'm going to take the lead and introduce yourself, you're actually extending that trust right at the beginning. Talk to a number of people, obviously. Some people go to a networking event with a friend or a colleague and then they tend to huddle together. Remember to talk to a number of people. Think about your goal and why you're there. So the next bit it's about inviting people to join you. So what happens, there's a natural human dynamic where we get together in twos or threes. And often if we arrive and we're on our own, it's that sense of there are people who are standing looking a bit lonely. It's a really nice thing to say, would you like to join us and invite someone to join you? The other thing about that is then, if you want to move from the person that you started with, it gives you that opportunity to move away. Well, that's one thing I was going to ask you. So, and I feel like I'm always going to the negatives here, but when you're in a group of people and you just, the conversation doesn't suit you, you don't think you can form a connection or maybe you see someone over there that you've been wanting to talk to for a few times now. How do you get out of that circle and how do you sort of just walk away without making it awkward? Yeah, well, that's where having a group of three is easy to do that, but doing that in a pair is really hard. Because you leave someone stranded then. So the idea is if you're standing in a group of two, ask someone else to join you. And then drift away. And then sort of just get them. I've done this a number of times where I've sort of get them connected, oh, you two might have something in common and then I can go, excuse me for a minute and just move away. Oh, I'm going to remember that one. Yeah, so it works actually quite well if you're sort of doing it in a way where it can be quite seamless if you do it like that. Okay, good. So for me, networking really is about understanding human dynamics and the way we work best. So I'll bring in a few tips like that today as well. So the other thing there is looking for common interests. You know how we talk about six degrees of separation? I actually hear people say it's two degrees these days. So you never know who you'll have in common. So that looking out for common interests, you might know people in common, you might have similar interests in life, that sort of thing. When we go through the Fails Model, we'll work out how to do that. And also hand out your card to appropriate people. But remember Sarah said, it's not about spraying cards everywhere, that's really important. So let's have a look at the don'ts. Here are the don'ts. Okay, we've all come across some of these. So don't talk to the same person or event. That's, you won't get what you want out of the event by doing that. And that can be very tempting if you find someone nice and you're a bit shy just to hang in there and this is comfortable. Yeah. But then you just don't get what you went there for. Yes. Now don't over promote or prospect. So networking is about connections. It's not about selling or prospecting. Now I met someone recently who was very proud of themselves that they actually won the world record for getting as many business cards as they could. And I was actually quite put off by her because it was really full on. It was right in your face. And the whole thing was, this was about her. And like it was more about what she could get out of the event rather than building a connection. And I think we're all a bit repelled by that. So there's something about that dynamic that doesn't work for most of us. Yes. And she's pretty much telling you that you're one of how many. Yeah, that's right. And it really was more about they're more focused on themselves. Yeah. So that's the message. So don't do all the talking. So those of you who are very outgoing and very confident, you might need to be aware of this. It takes a bit of self-awareness. Are you doing all the talking? And if you notice that you are, then you would kick in with a question, a good question to get the other person in. Now the next tip, don't get drunk. Why do you look at me when you say that? So it's very tempting sometimes when there's champagne flowing. Can I just refill them as you stand there? No. But I've seen people who've actually had just a few, too many and it's not a good look, okay? So I don't think any of you out there would do that. But it's not a good look. And don't be timid. What I've noticed a few times is people kind of hang with their phones and they're kind of being timid and turning away. And people will not come to you if you're doing that. And so energetically, that's not great. People won't invite you in if you're sort of hiding on your phone or anything. And don't try to break into pairs unless they invite you. So you can see if you can make eye contact. But if there is a pair that is having an in-depth conversation, don't try to break into that. I'm just picturing some very awkward moments here. We're trying to sneak into a circle or something. And then you're trying to block them. So what you'll notice is we talk in pairs or threes very easily. And then as soon as a fourth person joins, we break into two twos. Yes, I had to notice that. Have you noticed that? Yeah. So if there's five, it'll break into a three and a two. So that's an interesting thing about human dynamics. We're very comfortable with two or three, but then it will split, you know, and it's being aware of that. And don't be afraid to ask people questions. You know, ask good questions and we'll talk about that a bit more as well. So there are some of our tips for the before and during. Let's talk about after now. So make sure you, when you've collected a card from someone, you write something on it. I remember doing that with your card. What did you write? I wrote down, I'm very friendly, chatty. So I usually write something personal. I had read that you had brown hair, brown eyes, that sort of thing. And then I can get a picture of you. So that really helps me. Make sure you follow up with people. I know I sent you an email afterwards. So following up with people. Look for ways to add value. So another example, I was in an event recently and I met a woman who was great. And her business, I met someone two days later that I thought, oh, they're gonna be a good connection. So I hooked them up. You're the ultimate connector, aren't you? Well, I never used to be. I've had to learn this, had to learn it. But I just thought, right, this is about connections and it's about adding value. And she was very grateful for that. So, and you never know what comes from these things. I didn't expect anything in return, but who knows in the future? Well, you never know who knows who. And like you said, two degrees of separation, you'd be surprised who you're talking to, wouldn't you? Exactly, yeah. So keeping contact to build the relationship and it's so easy to do that these days with LinkedIn and that sort of thing. Great. Yeah, I think LinkedIn is a great tool. I do like that tip though about having something personal because I tend to find after these networking events, you go to LinkedIn and you find someone and you click to connect with them. And I just think the whole, I would like to add you to my professional network is a little bit stale sometimes, whereas if you can write a message, you know, great to meet you last night, something personal that you know about them or you know, best of luck with your kids' soccer game or something on the weekend, that's probably going to resonate with them all, isn't it? I agree, that's right. That's a great idea, yeah. So I just want to remind everyone, we're going to go on to the next section now, but please feel free to ask any questions. I've got the iPad here, so I'll be able to ask Sandra your questions and we can answer them before the session's over. So just moving on, so we've done the before, during and after. And I think you think of networking, you think of people, you think of events, you know, hello, and then what do I say? That's the hardest bit, isn't it? It is, like saying hello isn't necessarily hard, it's like, what do you do then? Yeah, yeah, and that was one of the things I found really hard. So with my in-depth knowledge of, you know, human beings, communication and human dynamics, that sort of thing, I started looking for the pattern, like what is it that we kind of do naturally? And what I did was I put together a little model. So this model is really what to say after you've said hello, it's going to give you a sequence that will help you master your conversations. And it's called the FALS model. Now I can remember this when I'm at a networking event, I can remember the sequence, and I'm hoping that you guys will too. It's a simple word, just get the image of the little chook there in your mind and then think about what are those letters stand for? So that's what I want to take you through now. And this is based on the way that we connect naturally. It's the sequence. So it really needs to be done in this sequence because if we want to build a connection, we need to do it in a way that flows and this model helps that flow. Okay, so let's start with F. Yeah. So F stands for food or something like the weather. Now, one of the things I hear a lot of people say is I can't stand small talk, but we actually all do small talk when we meet people for the first time. So say you're at a networking event, one of the first little things we tend to say is, oh, wow, the food's great here or something. Oh, I'm really enjoying the food or it wasn't at a nice day today. So it's something, the small talk, and I've used food there because it makes the word FALS much easier. So think about it's either food or weather. So as the small talk comes in, so don't resist the small talk. It is a very short part of the conversation and it's a natural way of connecting. As long as you don't talk about the weather for the next 20 minutes. No, no. So then the next bit of flow is that we've done that little chit chat, we've said hello kind of thing and then we can move to something like the occasion. So you might say, how often have you been to these events or what do you know about the speaker or something like that? Yeah. You know, you're actually connecting it around. We're both here at the same event. So, you know, like we're gonna connect now around this occasion. Well, you're sure to have something in common with them then aren't you? That's right. Yeah, so something flows from there. And then what can easily flow from occasion is work. So then we're ready to sort of say, oh, so what do you do for work? You know, cause often people will ask that as the first question. So it's that sense of we're just moving nicely through this sequence. What do you do for work? Where do you work? How long have you been there? That sort of thing. Now, when you're at this stage, this is where you need to be listening really carefully cause you're gonna pick up other little clues here. So you might have someone say, I work here, I work four days a week cause I want to spend a day with my daughter or something like that, okay? So you're listening for the little tips that then segue you into life. How old's your daughter, you know? So then you can start to talk about life, all right? But it's almost like the door has been opened now. Cause they're giving you permission almost. That's right. Yeah, that's right. So then we can flow into talking about life. Have you got any other children? That sort of thing. You know, what are your interests? We can start talking about their life a little bit more. And as we're doing this, you can get a sense that we're deepening the connection now. This is not just a superficial chat. This is now I'm actually getting to know who you are as a person. I'm getting to know some things about you. And then the S stands for something significant. Okay, so this is when we're actually going deeper and they might share something significant about their life, you know? I'll share an example with you if you like that where I was at a, I was actually at a conference where there was lots of speakers and that sort of thing came out at lunchtime. Lots of people standing around. I was standing there on my own and I thought, right, I'm going to put my fails model to the test. This is when I was still developing it. Yep. Saw a woman standing on her own and went up to talk with her. And we were both eating a salad. And I said, I wasn't it great that we have salads instead of just sandwiches and fruit platters. Don't you get sick of the sandwiches and fruit platters kind of thing. So we were eating our salads. And then it was like, have you been to one of these events before? It was like we started chatting a little bit about the event and that. And she said to me, oh, you know, I'm here because of my work. So that was a lovely permission. Oh, what do you do? You know, what do you do? And I was listening to her and as she was talking, I noticed she had a French accent. So I was able to sort of chat a little bit about work and then say, I've noticed you've got a French accent. Where are you from? And you know, she told me she was from France and which part of France she was from and how long she'd been in Australia and that sort of thing. So that started to come out of that life bit. And then as we talked a little bit more about her life, she talked about the fact that her mom was sick. It was that sense of being able to go, and then we could go there. It was like, oh, tell me more about that. And she was going home to spend some time with her mom and how much she missed her mom and all that sort of thing. But it was interesting for me that we went from work, life and into something very significant for her quite quickly. And it was a really nice conversation. So what is the risk if you jump this model and you start going all over the place because we're not going to know it off my heart or if we're going to implement it. But, you know, if I walked up to you and I started talking about work, like you said, or start talking about life, how does that, how does someone react to that? It can be quite jarring because it's almost like this model is the natural sequencing where we do it little step by step and it can happen quite quickly. But it's like the little doors opening. So just with your example, I had someone, I was at an event recently and this guy who was a life coach came up to me and his first question to me was, what are your hobbies? And he went straight to life. You know, and I remember feeling quite, oh, I don't even know you. Like, I don't know anything about you. It sort of puts you on the spot because it's not a natural conversation. Is it? How it's fairly random? Yeah, it felt random to me and it did feel quite jarring. So, and I've practiced this fails model and used it a lot and for an introvert, someone who's a bit shy, like it really, really helps in terms of opening the doors and making a connection quite easily. Great. So I'm going to encourage you all to try this. Give it a try. Yeah, or even, you know, put up on your, I think once you see these letters and you look at them every day, whether it's in front of your desk or whatever, and then using this, you know, even when new people start at your office or something like that or, we do have a question from Sanjay though. So how about adding humor? Could this be good or do you think it can backfire? A bit risky. Yeah. Yeah, I think it's a little bit risky. But you really judge the person's situation, don't you? Yeah, you do. Use your discretion. Yeah, yeah, use your discretion, Sanjay, about that. It's that sense of it could go really bad if, you know, they don't have the same sense of humor. That's the thing. We have, you know, some, it could be, you know, we might think something's really funny and it's very sensitive point for someone else. So I'd be careful about humor. You know, yeah. Unless you're, you know, unless you're really good at that and, you know, you've had good feedback in the past about that, like I would be careful with that one. Yeah. So we've done the FOWLS model now and we know, you know, the natural progression on how the conversation flow should go. What other tips do we have for people out there? Well, I've got another great tip, which is a technique that I've used a lot and it's called the state of interest technique. So it's what we call adopting a state of interest. And this is a bit of neuro-linguistic programming in there understanding the way our brain works and that if we imagine when we're going to an event that we actually could meet a really interesting person or even when you're talking with someone, you're thinking to yourself, this person could be the most interesting person I've ever met. Your brain follows that thinking. So it's about priming your brain for success. Now what happens is our body language follows our thinking. So if we're using a state of interest, our emotional tone is curious and we have a curious or interested facial expression. So people will see that in us and they're much more likely to connect with us, with that as well. So it's really very powerful, this technique. So what an example of that be, she could be the most interesting person I've ever met. Yeah, and as soon as you start thinking like that, it's like you lighten up, you're a bit curious and our facial expression changes. So often when people are at a networking event, they're very self-conscious. So they're thinking, oh, I'm so nervous, I'd rather stick a needle in my eye and be here. They're thinking a lot about themselves, but what this technique does is actually make you think about the other person. So it takes you out of self-consciousness into other people consciousness. So it's that sense of you, it moves you out of yourself, which is really good for people who are a bit shy. It helps you move away from yourself and you focus on yourself. Great, some fabulous tips there. And once again, if anyone does have any further questions, please feel free to type them into the chat box below. So moving on, networking, great managers, how else can we be successful in this type of environment? One of the best tips I've got for success is asking the right questions. So often what happens when we're nervous is we default to close questions. So these are questions that are like, do you do this? Have you done that? So do you have you? Will you questions that end with a yes or no or a very little bit of information? So what they actually do is close a conversation down. And what I've noticed is when people are really nervous, they ask a lot of questions and then they think the other person's being difficult, but the other person's not being difficult. We're actually- They're answering you. Yeah, they're answering you. And we don't know that we're shutting down. So it's very important to ask effective questions which start with things like what and how. So what do you know about the speaker? How often do you come to these events? Those questions open a conversation up. And the other tip for success is listening. This is so important. So this is really about listening with the intention to understand. Most people are listening with the intention to reply. So there's a big difference between those two versions of listening. So it's really about being attentive, using eye contact, really listening in for what people are saying and being at a paraphrase back occasionally, not all the time, just occasionally what they've said. So you're demonstrating your understanding. And the interesting thing is that people love to talk about themselves. I, yeah, have found that. So when you're a good listener, you're actually getting them to reveal themselves and they're actually feeling a sense of trust. I've actually had people say to me, I feel like I've known you my whole life at a networking event. Wow. And all I did was listen. Yeah. That's all I did. Probably no one else listens to it. Yeah. And I just, because I was interested, I had that state of interest. I was listening, I was asking questions and I'm really in paraphrasing back and that sort of thing. And it was like amazing connection very quickly. So that's what effective questions and listening can do. They can really build that connection for you. And I think just going back to open-ended questions, it's one of those things we're taught so early on and especially people who have done any sort of basic sales training. It's always asked your open-ended questions. But I find, like you said, you get into a conversation and you might be a bit nervous or you're in a hurry or something. And you just automatically revert back to those close-ended questions. So would you recommend having a set of generic questions that you would ask and always at a networking event keep those front of mind depending on what the sort of event was? Yeah, I would. I would be recommending that you really start in getting into the habit of asking what and how questions in your life, not just at a networking event. So practice in your life, practice at work, practice in your life, practice with your kids. Kids are great to practice on. So be practicing them so they come more natural for you. So the thing to remember is that if we're nervous, it's our primitive brain that is activated. And when that happens, we kind of move into that more emotional place where we'll start to use those close questions. And we won't even know we're doing it. That's the interesting thing. We won't even know we're doing it and it just feels really hard. So the awareness is that sense of this conversation is not flowing, this conversation's hard. What am I doing to contribute to that? So it's that sense of how else could, like let's change gears, ask an open question and you'll be amazed at what can happen. Yeah, and just a question from Sarah as well. So what if the person is famous? What do you do then? Yeah, my advice around that is really be yourself and don't be intimidated by their fame. So often when someone's famous, we've kind of got them up on a pedestal and then we become really nervous talking with them. So last year I was at a conference where there was a guy called Marshall Goldsmith there who's really well known in the leadership space and the coaching space and I was really keen to meet him. And I thought this to myself, I thought, no, I'm not gonna be, and I went up and I just talked to him about his presentation, which was fantastic. So I could genuinely say I loved your presentation and it's a real privilege to meet you. And I could do that in a very grounded way. And we had a bit of a chat. He was like their people too. So he actually liked that we kind of opened up this conversation and it was really great. And then I did take the photo with him. Yeah, I had to do that. I was okay to take a photo. Yeah, it is, yeah, absolutely. But it is that sense of just really thinking about them being a human being and use the techniques that we've been talking about today because they work just as well on them and not being daunted by their fame. So that's great advice. And some great advice throughout the entire 30 minutes so far, which is great. So we're going to open it up for questions now. But before we move on, we're just going to do a bit of a summary on what we've spoken about today and finalize the tips. And then go in, I believe you've got a special treat for people online as well with your great managers program. So let's talk more about that. So the thing that I wanted you to get out of today really is that networking is about mutually beneficial relationships. So I really want you to think about connection comes first and then it really, you know, you don't know what's going to happen after that. But if people warm to you, if people have a positive first impression of you, it's more likely that something will come from it. Rather than doing the card spraying and collecting 20 cards and then thinking, I can't even remember these people. That's not valuable. So we'd rather have quality, not quantity and really thinking about connections, making sure the connections come first. And I want to encourage you today to really think about how could you apply these techniques. So our challenge for you today is to be brave and bold and go out there and make contact. Go and have a go. Use the FAO's model, practice your open questions. And I want you to be thinking to yourself, you are worth knowing. So really go out there into the world and practice these techniques. And if people are looking to attend more networking events, what would you suggest? What sort of groups do you go and attend? I go to business ones. So New South Wales Business Chamber for me and things like that and other networking events like that. I'll go to industry association. So I'm a member of the Australian Human Resources Institute, go to those sorts of things. I often go to courses and things like that. So often you'll find people like-minded people at courses. So anything where you sort of feel like that would be of benefit to me, plus I'll meet other people, I think they're a great way to get started with networking. What sort of ones do you go to? Well, I'm a member of the Chamber and a few other marketing associations as well. And then even some small business opportunity ones within the area, just like you said, finding like-minded people and so on. We also do our own ones here at RepBac. So occasionally, three times a year, we'll have customers and prospects and suppliers come in and we also get some great value out of that. And you know these people, but you may have not seen them for six months or something like that and I think even using that sort of environment to put your skills to use is great because it's almost like a practice as well. So yeah, it works really well. That's how I think about it now, rather than thinking, oh, I'm sure I'm not good at this. I actually think, no, this is another practice. It's almost like stretching yourself, putting yourself outside your comfort zone so that you can do that. And just before we go into the special offer for people, just from Sanjay, we mentioned earlier about the fact, if you can invite people into groups, if you want to make up that two or three or something like that. But when you don't know people, how do you break into those groups or do you suggest not breaking into a group at all and just waiting to be offered? How do you- No, I usually look for eye contact. That's right. So if I'm standing on my own and there's a pair there and I can't, everyone's sort of deep in conversation, I will usually try to make eye contact. And once you've got eye contact with someone else, you can then sort of move closer and say, do you mind if I join you? Yes, okay. All right, so, but the eye contact needs to come first. So it is that sense of once you've got the eye contact, you're much more likely to be able to flow in and say, would you mind if I joined you? And most people are not going to say no. Yes. They're not going to say that. But the eye contact is like the little, that's the little gate, you know, like little gates open, eye contact, smile and over we go. Yeah. Perfect. Yeah. Great. So ready to hear a little bit about- Yeah, yeah, let's do that. And also just while we're going through this, we really encourage you to complete the survey, which is located in the tab next to the slideshow, which you can see now. This is a second last business skills event for Redback for the years. So we're really, really, we really encourage you to complete your feedback. Tell us what you think. Tell us what you want to hear more about next year as well, because it does help us deliver these free educational sessions to you. So before we go, just a quick wrap up, and you're free to ask any further questions as we do this. So I was going to just tell you a little bit about our great managers program. At the beginning, I said I'm on a mission to fill the world with great managers. And what we're doing great managers is we run our program around the seven strategies of great managers. And these are tried and tested strategies that really work in terms of helping managers get the best out of their team. So it's all about increasing productivity, increasing employee engagement. And as I said, we do this in quite a unique way. Our program, we work with people over 12 months in what we call the Great Managers Academy. We do short lessons online with short one and a half hour face-to-face sessions every six weeks. And we also measure into your business. So we look at what is working, what's not, and we set a goal in the business that you can improve using leadership capability. So as I said, we've got a special offer for anyone on the webinar today. If you want to just send us an email, infoatgreatmanagers.com. Mention that you're on the webcast today. And we've got some very special offers for groups wanting to start next year with us in our Great Managers program, even if you just want to find out a little bit more about it if you're looking for leadership. And we're actually really looking for accounting firms who might want to increase their productivity and reduce their write-offs. That's one of our little projects for next year. We want to work with accounting firms. So if that's you, please get in contact with us. Excellent. Thank you so much, Sandra. It's been really, really insightful. And I think everyone who's joined today will at least walk away with three or four things that they can implement straight away. And I think, like I said, it's a perfect time of year as well. We've got so many networking events and everything coming up. So thank you so much. It's been great having you online. Oh, thank you, Sarah. I've really enjoyed it. Excellent. And thank you everyone else for joining out there. We do hope that you enjoyed today. If you have any further questions about Redback or how Sandra can help you and your organization, please feel free to contact us. And also keep a look out for the recording of this webcast, which will be sent in the next 24 hours. So thank you once again and enjoy the rest of your day. Bye for now.